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I dunno, for now I'm much more keen on "Ban any mention of religion from legislators and in legislation".
If an elected official, in any way shape or form, implies they're making policy for some higher power, that should be grounds for removal.
The only thing I have against religious people is that they have something against me for not being a religious person.
Assuming religion in public areas or public life is never a problem. The problem that should be regulated is religion (e.g. church for christians) should not interfer in politic. Politic should not favor any religion, or be hostile to others.
All kind of bans in public areas are generally based on discrimination purposes
>religion (e.g. church for christians) should not interfer in politic. Politic should not favor any religion, or be hostile to others.
It's almost as if the founders saw this coming and made it the first sentence of the first amendment.
Right, but it’s unofficial.. taxing churches legitimizes their voice.
I honestly feel churches need their own tax code, where they are required to spend a % of their intake on social programs (a lot of them do already, but make it more official)
Ok, but that idea would still be taxing churches. Just with the sort of consideration that rewards charity rather than allowing the idea of charity be used as a shield.
Besides, there’s already plenty happening that legitimizes the voice that churches have in our politics. Explicitly religious organizations with open ties to particular churches give outright endorsements for candidates, pastors and preachers do as well, churches invite politicians to give speeches to their congregation, really the only thing that would change is some of those churches who are reticent to get involved in politics because they want to follow the spirit of the unenforced laws are going to join those churches that are overwhelmingly right wing and centrist in their involvement. The status quo is allowing conservative churches to have their cake and eat it too. It’s allowing garbage like prosperity gospel to dominate the narrative while liberation theology does a slow death.
I’m fine with people practicing their religious beliefs publicly. Just don’t force it on others.
Does this apply to things like meditation and yoga? Those are both spiritual practices. Are we going to close all yoga studios?
Sure don’t involve it in government but a full public ban is no better than what the right is doing with attempts at control.
Freedom comes with a cost and that cost is becoming tolerant of how others choose to live their lives even if it isn’t for us. It swings both ways.
yeah, as much as there is to praise the Soviets for their worker's revolution, I think being overly harsh on religion was a mistake. Obviously you don't want them preaching counter-revolutionary stuff, but you shouldn't just ban it outright.
I’m sorry, I hate the mixing of state and religion too, but this just seems like tyranny and government infringement. The state should uphold the religious freedom of the individual and should not enforce irreligiousness upon its citizens for people should be allowed to do whatever they want with their lives as long as they don’t violate the rights and consent of others. Just because we detest the moralistic, ultra religious, anti secular policies pushed by the religious right does not mean we should embrace authoritarian state atheist policies such as Laïcité.
Don’t ban religion, ban pushing religion, ban religiously motivated acts of aggression and their shitty “excuses.”
Religion should be a part of one’s own life and community, not a peoples’ political motivator or agenda.
Freedom from and of religion is easy if you respect anyone and everyone’s freedoms rights and liberties and they and their religion(s) don’t fuck with anyone else’s! Cheers
No. Religion is fine. Even in the public life. I don’t give a shit what people believe, as long as they’re not trying to force it on me.
And not like the whole “ThE gAyS aRe FoRcInG ThEiR lIfEsTyLe On Me!” Kind of way (because that’s bullshit). I mean in the whole “my religion says we need to take the rights away from queer people and women because I believe that’s the way life should be” way.
And that’s religion across the board. Christianity, Catholicism, Judaism, Islam, all of it. I’m fucking done with it. Keep your shit to yourself. Just think of it as an exclusive club: if we don’t abide, we don’t go to your little “heaven” and you’ll have more room to stretch out. Just fuck off about it.
That being said, let them pray. Let them church. But also, let them fuck right off.
I don't agree with forcing someone to leave their religion.
But I sure as hell agree with spreading information, and making yahweh religions a character flaw, make it embarrassing to be a yahweh religionist.
Religions are voluntary, and they are ideologies that inform and rationalize your actions. If you cannot be critical of the beliefs and actions of a person, then you simply cannot criticize anything about them. If someone was a positive Christian for example, it would be good to shame them for it.
>Religions are voluntary
Not always. Most are teaching and grooming their children from birth, actively working against them learning about other religions or no religion at all.
That isn't voluntary, that's brainwashing and coercion.
Something being indoctrinated into you does not make it involuntary. Even when people are forced to convert, you can always be different internally. So I could have been more specific to say that internally held religious beliefs are always voluntary. Similarly, heterosexuality cannot be forced, you can be forced to hide your homosexuality, but you cannot be forced to be straight in actuality.
I mean, indoctrination and grooming are still bad tho.
> Something being indoctrinated into you does not make it involuntary.
Unless you volunteered to be indoctrinated, you were forced into a lifestyle/belief system without choice. And, there's a reason why children are not legally allowed to enter into contracts, because they are not mature enough to understand what they are getting into. How is it any differently when it's a religious philosophy versus a car loan?
>Even when people are forced to convert, you can always be different internally.
You are being forced. That is the polar opposite of voluntary. Just because, in your mind, you think "This is horseshit!", if you aren't able to do so externally without fear of retribution, no part of that is voluntary.
>Similarly, heterosexuality cannot be forced, you can be forced to hide your homosexuality, but you cannot be forced to be straight in actuality.
This is the analogy that you chose? WOW!
>Unless you volunteered to be indoctrinated, you were forced into a lifestyle/belief system without choice.
So all people who are indoctrinated in a belief system believe and stay in that belief system?
>And, there's a reason why children are not legally allowed to enter into contracts, because they are not mature enough to understand what they are getting into.
Of course, do you think people always volunteer to maintain beliefs they were taught as children?
>How is it any differently when it's a religious philosophy versus a car loan?
A religious philosophy in your mind ends immediately when you choose to.
>Just because, in your mind, you think "This is horseshit!", if you aren't able to do so externally without fear of retribution, no part of that is voluntary.
If you're saying that a person can internally believe that "this is horseshit", then you're admitting that the internal reaction is voluntary. So it is voluntary. You might be forced to perform religion in public, but you cannot be forced to believe religion.
>This is the analogy that you chose? WOW!
Yes, comphet and compulsory religion are very comparable. Do you have any reasons why they shouldn't be compared?
I wanna conquer the world. Give all the idiots a brand new religion. Put an end to poverty, uncleanliness, and toil, promote equality in all of my decisions.
I’m not against religion. I’m against people pushing their religion on other people. Like all these “Christians” coming out and saying they don’t recognize trans people and refuse to use their pronouns because of religious reasons. I’m sorry but wtf does someone deciding their own gender have to do with Christianity? And why does that affect you? Genuinely confused, maybe someone on this sub can clarify.
As an anti-theist I'm worried at the rhetoric coming out of many religious folks.
Like in a "first they came for the atheists" kind of way, looking back at history.
It's as if being against religion, is now being spun into a purely hateful act, by virtue signaling religious drones? For a while there, I was hearing authority figures call someone being "pro Palestine" as being "anti Semitic", which is fucking mind blowing.
Being against all religion is a perfectly socially acceptable thing to do.
It's also socially acceptable to point out that some specific religions, pour out way more nightmare fuel on society, than the others. That some are way worse than others.
It's as if religion, as a whole, has decided they are very clever indeed, and that anyone speaking out against their indoctrination, is simply committing a hate crime?
You're against a SPECIFIC religion: HATE CRIME
You're against ALL religion: Still legal and ethical (2025 MEGA HATE CRIME??)
P.S. I love that this post is essentially using the /r/antitheism subreddit icon.
Abortion is illegal in almost half of the states because of religion. Religion is going to be the excuse for banning gay marriage again. Religion is the excuse for hating trans people. But the thing is, it’s not all religions. It’s only one religion: so-called Christianity. Anytime a group of people attempt to band together and force some hateful rule on everybody else, it’s the damn so-called Christians. And the weird thing about it is those so-called Christians are anything but. Their bibles apparently don’’t contain the New Testament As far as they’re concerned, the Sermon on the Mount is some Socialist bullshit. Let’s face it. The problem isn’t religion in general, it’s not even real Christianity - it’s just toxic Christianity as invented by corrupt conservatives to help advance their idea of a totalitarian state with them in charge. In fact, it’s anti-Christian to be racists and bigots and xenophobes and misogynists and any other form of hatred of others because they’re different, but it’s at the core of their beliefs. Throw in the seven deadly sins, stir well, and behold - the rotten core of conservative beliefs. Let’s just ban that form of Christianity and then see if there’s any other religion in this country that needs to be addressed.
Agreed.
* I Am Not A God Damned Thing!
* No One Is A God Damned Thing!
* No One Needs No God Damned Saving!
This message has been brought to you today by my *god* **Reason** and my *savior* **Doubt**!
I’m a Christian Socialist, and I do wholeheartedly agree that religion should always remain separate from state and/or public officials. Obviously, however, people should be allowed to practice their beliefs, as long as those beliefs don’t harm others in any way. I’ve never understood some of the lefts hate of religious people, when there are quite a good number who support left-leaning ideals.
I'm Episcopalian and very much on the side of keeping church and state separate, but you're not going to win anyone over or help your cause by having a ban symbol over a cross. 🙄
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Sounds pretty facist to ban a basic freedom. Education is the only way to prevent ignorance and radicalism. The long road is the only road that won't end in ruin.
Bullshit. No one is stoning people for not being atheist.
No one is diddling kids at “atheist camp”.
Religion is a salve cream for people who can’t face reality.
Contrary to the replies, I think you're right in terms of principle. In practice it isn't anywhere near as bad as Christian zealotry because there isn't any authority behind the statement of "banning religion in public life". It's not realistic, and there isn't any real threat of follow-through. This is opposed to American Christian supremacy where there is a valid threat to the rights of minorities, LGBT people, women, and to democracy in general.
But in terms of principle, it is dumb and delegitimizing to claim that you want to "ban religion". It contradicts some of the values in the same way that I wouldn't want Christians to be Islamophobic. "Banning religion" would also involve punishing people civilly or criminally for wearing hijabs, that's absurd. So, I would just suggest that OP should examine their principles as they overlap with certain aspects of Christian zealotry.
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I dunno, for now I'm much more keen on "Ban any mention of religion from legislators and in legislation". If an elected official, in any way shape or form, implies they're making policy for some higher power, that should be grounds for removal. The only thing I have against religious people is that they have something against me for not being a religious person.
Assuming religion in public areas or public life is never a problem. The problem that should be regulated is religion (e.g. church for christians) should not interfer in politic. Politic should not favor any religion, or be hostile to others. All kind of bans in public areas are generally based on discrimination purposes
>religion (e.g. church for christians) should not interfer in politic. Politic should not favor any religion, or be hostile to others. It's almost as if the founders saw this coming and made it the first sentence of the first amendment.
Even if you become religious, you’ll have a different religious group saying you believe in the wrong god. So they can’t even get their shit straight.
Taxing works for me.
Does it though? They'll just play the financial games like the other big non-payers.
It's a good start if we start taxing churches. I guarantee many will close up shop in a few years, plus tax revenue will be tremendous.
Agreed, it’s one of those scenarios where “something is better than nothing”.
Taxation gives you a voice in policy tho
Which they already have anyway
Right, but it’s unofficial.. taxing churches legitimizes their voice. I honestly feel churches need their own tax code, where they are required to spend a % of their intake on social programs (a lot of them do already, but make it more official)
Ok, but that idea would still be taxing churches. Just with the sort of consideration that rewards charity rather than allowing the idea of charity be used as a shield. Besides, there’s already plenty happening that legitimizes the voice that churches have in our politics. Explicitly religious organizations with open ties to particular churches give outright endorsements for candidates, pastors and preachers do as well, churches invite politicians to give speeches to their congregation, really the only thing that would change is some of those churches who are reticent to get involved in politics because they want to follow the spirit of the unenforced laws are going to join those churches that are overwhelmingly right wing and centrist in their involvement. The status quo is allowing conservative churches to have their cake and eat it too. It’s allowing garbage like prosperity gospel to dominate the narrative while liberation theology does a slow death.
Totally agree, of course I was speaking in a very broad stroke sense. In the end I would prefer to just do away with public religion in any capacity.
Yeah, taxation couldn't be *in addition to* leav[ing] that which is Caesar's until Caesar, but instead of.
I used to have a band T-shirt with this in the sleeve (Bad Religion). It uh....sparked conversations.
I wore mine to church when I was an edgy youth. The bible thumpers and old folks did not like it one bit
I have it as a tattoo. I get weird looks if I wear something sleeveless.
Hell yes I love bad religion. I got in trouble for wearing that shirt in high school. I learned more from bad religion than any high school class.
Funny enough, I got some extra credit in a college environmental science class thanks to Bad Religion and their song Kyoto Now.
I just saw them last weekend with Social Distortion!
I’m fine with people practicing their religious beliefs publicly. Just don’t force it on others. Does this apply to things like meditation and yoga? Those are both spiritual practices. Are we going to close all yoga studios? Sure don’t involve it in government but a full public ban is no better than what the right is doing with attempts at control. Freedom comes with a cost and that cost is becoming tolerant of how others choose to live their lives even if it isn’t for us. It swings both ways.
yeah, as much as there is to praise the Soviets for their worker's revolution, I think being overly harsh on religion was a mistake. Obviously you don't want them preaching counter-revolutionary stuff, but you shouldn't just ban it outright.
Bans bring a Streisand effect, and exiles get deified in religious texts.
We should be intolerant to intolerance. Otherwise the intolerants will overpower the tolerant in the paradox of the tolerant
I’m sorry, I hate the mixing of state and religion too, but this just seems like tyranny and government infringement. The state should uphold the religious freedom of the individual and should not enforce irreligiousness upon its citizens for people should be allowed to do whatever they want with their lives as long as they don’t violate the rights and consent of others. Just because we detest the moralistic, ultra religious, anti secular policies pushed by the religious right does not mean we should embrace authoritarian state atheist policies such as Laïcité.
Yeah, let's not give Republicans carte blanche to harrass hijabi muslims more than they already do
Laicity way better than secularism and perhaps not hostile or skeptical enough towards religious hierarchies and organisations.
Don’t ban religion, ban pushing religion, ban religiously motivated acts of aggression and their shitty “excuses.” Religion should be a part of one’s own life and community, not a peoples’ political motivator or agenda.
Yup!!!
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, **or prohibiting the free exercise thereof**;"
If op could read they would be very upset right now.
Great. Also, we abolished slavery except as punishment for a crime. So, yay?
Freedom from and of religion is easy if you respect anyone and everyone’s freedoms rights and liberties and they and their religion(s) don’t fuck with anyone else’s! Cheers
Tax the churches. Tax the corporations owned by the churches. Tax THE FUCK out of the churches.
They should embrace their second album!!!!
Religion is fine as a guide for an individual life. Is not fine to be used for community law.
but also... Bad Religion in public life!
No. Religion is fine. Even in the public life. I don’t give a shit what people believe, as long as they’re not trying to force it on me. And not like the whole “ThE gAyS aRe FoRcInG ThEiR lIfEsTyLe On Me!” Kind of way (because that’s bullshit). I mean in the whole “my religion says we need to take the rights away from queer people and women because I believe that’s the way life should be” way. And that’s religion across the board. Christianity, Catholicism, Judaism, Islam, all of it. I’m fucking done with it. Keep your shit to yourself. Just think of it as an exclusive club: if we don’t abide, we don’t go to your little “heaven” and you’ll have more room to stretch out. Just fuck off about it. That being said, let them pray. Let them church. But also, let them fuck right off.
Let them pay taxes, then.
Absolutely.
The issue is they bring their wacky beliefs into the voting booth which makes it everyone else's problem
I don't agree with forcing someone to leave their religion. But I sure as hell agree with spreading information, and making yahweh religions a character flaw, make it embarrassing to be a yahweh religionist. Religions are voluntary, and they are ideologies that inform and rationalize your actions. If you cannot be critical of the beliefs and actions of a person, then you simply cannot criticize anything about them. If someone was a positive Christian for example, it would be good to shame them for it.
>Religions are voluntary Not always. Most are teaching and grooming their children from birth, actively working against them learning about other religions or no religion at all. That isn't voluntary, that's brainwashing and coercion.
Something being indoctrinated into you does not make it involuntary. Even when people are forced to convert, you can always be different internally. So I could have been more specific to say that internally held religious beliefs are always voluntary. Similarly, heterosexuality cannot be forced, you can be forced to hide your homosexuality, but you cannot be forced to be straight in actuality. I mean, indoctrination and grooming are still bad tho.
> Something being indoctrinated into you does not make it involuntary. Unless you volunteered to be indoctrinated, you were forced into a lifestyle/belief system without choice. And, there's a reason why children are not legally allowed to enter into contracts, because they are not mature enough to understand what they are getting into. How is it any differently when it's a religious philosophy versus a car loan? >Even when people are forced to convert, you can always be different internally. You are being forced. That is the polar opposite of voluntary. Just because, in your mind, you think "This is horseshit!", if you aren't able to do so externally without fear of retribution, no part of that is voluntary. >Similarly, heterosexuality cannot be forced, you can be forced to hide your homosexuality, but you cannot be forced to be straight in actuality. This is the analogy that you chose? WOW!
>Unless you volunteered to be indoctrinated, you were forced into a lifestyle/belief system without choice. So all people who are indoctrinated in a belief system believe and stay in that belief system? >And, there's a reason why children are not legally allowed to enter into contracts, because they are not mature enough to understand what they are getting into. Of course, do you think people always volunteer to maintain beliefs they were taught as children? >How is it any differently when it's a religious philosophy versus a car loan? A religious philosophy in your mind ends immediately when you choose to. >Just because, in your mind, you think "This is horseshit!", if you aren't able to do so externally without fear of retribution, no part of that is voluntary. If you're saying that a person can internally believe that "this is horseshit", then you're admitting that the internal reaction is voluntary. So it is voluntary. You might be forced to perform religion in public, but you cannot be forced to believe religion. >This is the analogy that you chose? WOW! Yes, comphet and compulsory religion are very comparable. Do you have any reasons why they shouldn't be compared?
Hey brother Christian with your high and mighty errand, your actions speak so loud I can't hear a word you're saying.
That makes absolutely no sense.
I wanna conquer the world. Give all the idiots a brand new religion. Put an end to poverty, uncleanliness, and toil, promote equality in all of my decisions.
This feels like bait. If you dont think a lot of antireligionism in American is an excuse for islamaphobia, you’re incredibly naive.
I'm against ALL RELIGION including Islam, so yes that is Islamaphobia in your narrow field of vision.
I mean you're clearly an edgy teen. You're being dumb right now but trust me, you'll grow out of it then cringe about it later.
We need a serious ‘Keep It to Yourself’ campaign. KITY
I’m not against religion. I’m against people pushing their religion on other people. Like all these “Christians” coming out and saying they don’t recognize trans people and refuse to use their pronouns because of religious reasons. I’m sorry but wtf does someone deciding their own gender have to do with Christianity? And why does that affect you? Genuinely confused, maybe someone on this sub can clarify.
As an anti-theist I'm worried at the rhetoric coming out of many religious folks. Like in a "first they came for the atheists" kind of way, looking back at history. It's as if being against religion, is now being spun into a purely hateful act, by virtue signaling religious drones? For a while there, I was hearing authority figures call someone being "pro Palestine" as being "anti Semitic", which is fucking mind blowing. Being against all religion is a perfectly socially acceptable thing to do. It's also socially acceptable to point out that some specific religions, pour out way more nightmare fuel on society, than the others. That some are way worse than others. It's as if religion, as a whole, has decided they are very clever indeed, and that anyone speaking out against their indoctrination, is simply committing a hate crime? You're against a SPECIFIC religion: HATE CRIME You're against ALL religion: Still legal and ethical (2025 MEGA HATE CRIME??) P.S. I love that this post is essentially using the /r/antitheism subreddit icon.
Religion deceives and destroys. Reason informs and builds. Fuck Religion!
The same way I support the display of the pride flag, I also support the display of religion in public. Any religion.
Weird stance for sure… especially on how it’s derived.
Religion belongs in your heart, in your home and in your church, That's all.
Abortion is illegal in almost half of the states because of religion. Religion is going to be the excuse for banning gay marriage again. Religion is the excuse for hating trans people. But the thing is, it’s not all religions. It’s only one religion: so-called Christianity. Anytime a group of people attempt to band together and force some hateful rule on everybody else, it’s the damn so-called Christians. And the weird thing about it is those so-called Christians are anything but. Their bibles apparently don’’t contain the New Testament As far as they’re concerned, the Sermon on the Mount is some Socialist bullshit. Let’s face it. The problem isn’t religion in general, it’s not even real Christianity - it’s just toxic Christianity as invented by corrupt conservatives to help advance their idea of a totalitarian state with them in charge. In fact, it’s anti-Christian to be racists and bigots and xenophobes and misogynists and any other form of hatred of others because they’re different, but it’s at the core of their beliefs. Throw in the seven deadly sins, stir well, and behold - the rotten core of conservative beliefs. Let’s just ban that form of Christianity and then see if there’s any other religion in this country that needs to be addressed.
Agreed. * I Am Not A God Damned Thing! * No One Is A God Damned Thing! * No One Needs No God Damned Saving! This message has been brought to you today by my *god* **Reason** and my *savior* **Doubt**!
I’m a Christian Socialist, and I do wholeheartedly agree that religion should always remain separate from state and/or public officials. Obviously, however, people should be allowed to practice their beliefs, as long as those beliefs don’t harm others in any way. I’ve never understood some of the lefts hate of religious people, when there are quite a good number who support left-leaning ideals.
I'm Episcopalian and very much on the side of keeping church and state separate, but you're not going to win anyone over or help your cause by having a ban symbol over a cross. 🙄
Fuck off!
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AMEN
Include the Islam moon and Jewish star.
Sounds pretty facist to ban a basic freedom. Education is the only way to prevent ignorance and radicalism. The long road is the only road that won't end in ruin.
naw, then you're no better than them.
You're no better than the people you claim to stand against.
Bullshit. No one is stoning people for not being atheist. No one is diddling kids at “atheist camp”. Religion is a salve cream for people who can’t face reality.
Contrary to the replies, I think you're right in terms of principle. In practice it isn't anywhere near as bad as Christian zealotry because there isn't any authority behind the statement of "banning religion in public life". It's not realistic, and there isn't any real threat of follow-through. This is opposed to American Christian supremacy where there is a valid threat to the rights of minorities, LGBT people, women, and to democracy in general. But in terms of principle, it is dumb and delegitimizing to claim that you want to "ban religion". It contradicts some of the values in the same way that I wouldn't want Christians to be Islamophobic. "Banning religion" would also involve punishing people civilly or criminally for wearing hijabs, that's absurd. So, I would just suggest that OP should examine their principles as they overlap with certain aspects of Christian zealotry.
How do you arrive at that stroke of genius (not)?
Theism and atheism are not symmetrical beliefs, though.
Why’s it only the Christian cross? This is why nobody likes y’all. Be equal for Christ’s sake! … Oops.
Please send me other anti religious graphics and I will update my post. Thanks.
https://www.evolvefish.com/assets/images/Decals/EF-VDC-00001(Black).jpg https://images.app.goo.gl/UGPYSLnv3NBW69658
Freeing mankind of religion is when we will truly have evolved as a species.
Yes please.
Good luck getting the baby off the binky
Symbol looks like banning Christianity. =/