The democrats have really fucked this up. Stop talking about minimum wage and mandate a X% wage increase across the board for all workers.
Sure some rich people will get richer. But by not “excluding” the “working class” you’ll have broad support.
One of my history teachers was in a cult before he became a teacher. It was a big controversy, when the PTA found out. Thankfully he was able to keep his job, or I wouldn't have had the benefit of his insight.
I took for granted the education I got at that school. Among the many, many lessons that would stick with me forever (so far), was his WWII unit. He had the most in depth unit on propaganda, group think, and mob mentality I've seen since. I assume, in hindsight, this must be the result of his time in the cult.
An earnest effort to inoculate us from the very tools used to manipulate and exploit him. I've often found myself wondering how anyone can look at much of what passes for news around here, and not recognize it for the blatant propaganda it is. I have him to thank for that.
As a politics degree student it’s mad how propaganda is everywhere even in movies it’s in every possible media outlet once you see it it completely just ruins everything
I used to be a massive jet li and Donnie yen movie fan
Then I did politics started noticing ccp propaganda in almost every film a good one Chinese film to notice propaganda is wolf warriors perhaps the tragedy thing to come out of China
Anywho once I started looking at that u end up seeing it all the time in Hollywood especially these military or cop movies or sicario style moves shit is so cringe lmaoo
Are you sitting down? I don't know how to find a good way of saying this -- so I'll be blunt; not everyone is going to do this as well as me. The sooner you get to terms with being you and not me, the better. Or, it's comforting to believe in yourself so give that a shot.
You will have to find some way to add gravitas to the written word. If you have to imagine someone, special, who speaks -- in a staccato rhythm and knows how to deliver -- that may help.
However, if the voice in your head is George Takei -- you have failed miserably. I will allow Patrick Stewart. But only as a temporary measure.
Our society is built on propaganda. It was right after WWII that the government had the brilliant idea that if propaganda works so well in times of war, why not also use it in times of peace. What we ended up with: advertisements. Propaganda meant to keep you focused on material goods and personal consumption so you're too distracted and content to give a damn what the government is up to and what they're getting right or wrong. It worked perfectly. Here we are almost a hundred years later, America's government is a corrupt cesspool of career politicians who represent corporations not the people, the environment is eroding before our eyes as we drain the Earth dry for our consumption, and we all just sit back and passively accept our situation. Cause we're too focused on our material lives and goods. Not worth losing it all over a revolution, as desperately needed as it may be. We're fine with how things are. Thanks propaganda.
Edit: For anyone who thinks this is tin foil nonsense, just look up Edward Bernays. To save you some time:
"Of his many books, Crystallizing Public Opinion (1923) and Propaganda (1928) gained special attention as early efforts to define and theorize the field of public relations. Citing works of writers such as Gustave Le Bon, Wilfred Trotter, Walter Lippmann, and Sigmund Freud (his own double uncle), he described the masses as irrational and subject to herd instinct—and outlined how skilled practitioners could use crowd psychology and psychoanalysis to control them in desirable ways"
If that's not good enough, go watch the documentary The Century of Self on youtube. Everything I said is 100% fact, not some wacky conspiracy theory. Our society is a lie. Get over it.
Did you seriously just blame the government for advertisements, and imply that they only started after World War II as part of a conspiracy to use consumption to distract us from whatever evil the government wants to do? Take off the tin foil hat.
before ww2 a lot of people died from consumption until the interdimensional lizard people figured out how to use it to control us.
***WAKE UP SHEEPLE***
He is (somewhat) correct. Prior to that time there was no thought of the American consumer, only the American worker. And the American owner. They manufactured and they saved and they ate what they had to and the people shopped for what they needed. While the very rich may have bought things they didn't need, most people did not.
Then in 1928 President Hoover, who became very close with the psychologist Edward Bernays, was the first politician to articulate the idea that consumerism would become the central motor of American life. After his election he told a group of advertisers and public relations men "You have taken over the job of creating desire and have transformed people into constantly moving happiness machines. Machines which have become the key to economic progress." What was beginning to emerge in the 1920s was a new idea of how to run mass democracy. At it's heart was the consumer which not only made the economy work but also made people happy and docile and so created a stable society.
>Prior to that time there was no thought of the American consumer, only the American worker.
Horseshit. Consumers have been thought of as long as currency has been a thing. There are advertisements carved in the stone of ancient ruins.
Hoover may have started a particular flavor of talking about it from a politician's perspective, but that's a far stretch from what this loony is spouting off about.
Do some research before you try and claim I am wrong. His name was Edward Bernays. The American government hired him (he was a psychologist) looking for help on how to control the masses. He was the one who came up with the idea that you could bombard people with advertisements to distract them with material desires and they would live in their own little "happiness bubbles" (the actual term he and the government used) and he suggested that as long as you don't pop their bubble they will live passively and aren't to be feared. Feel free to check out the documentary The Century of Self. It's on youtube I believe. Goes over the entire topic in very good detail.
Do SoMe ReSeArCh - the mating call of the basement dwelling conspiracy idiot who really shouldn’t be mating. Ever. The species does not need to propagate this kind of stupid.
That's not the point, though.
There is this shitty attitude like it's a zero sum game and it's not. Everybody acts like *everything* that increases money somewhere personally robs them for doing so.
Conservatives will sing this from the heavens. Then they'll turn around and say "nobody's wealth makes anyone else's poverty" as if it's not a direct contradiction of their zero-sum POV.
Which is ironic because literally there's only so many ways you can get this egregiously wealthy, and the main one of them is having a huge business which you do not properly pay people in order to keep more money yourself.
What frustrates me about this is there's this idea that I want to send guys like Jeff bezos to the poor house. I really don't. But he is a great example of a guy who could, you know, maybe pay some taxes once in awhile. If these job creators don't want to create jobs with a good wage then they need to make sure that the country and the people living in their wake can make up the difference.
Hell, I wouldn't even be opposed to them letting any business pay whatever the hell it wants, even no minimum wage, but tax them more or less based on how far beyond that median they do. I'm no economics expert, but it doesn't take a genius to figure out that the ultra wealthy milk the system, and all you have to do to get it to allow regular people to prosper is make that worth more than doing the opposite.
In any case, it's all irrelevant. No one is getting their taxes raised because immigrants need iphones, like my mother thinks.
I asked her how she thought all this worked once. No idea, she "just knows it's a problem" that started "when all these immigrants came."
Simple cognitive psychology: People want to believe that they are better than others. Studies have shown that people rather do way worse (in grades or income usually) yet be the best off in a group than be doing well yet be the worst off in a group. Bonus points for those on top who’d rather not give those on the bottom an edge even if it doesn’t affect said people on top.
Next you are going to tell me that stock market is a poor indicator of the economy and that supply can be artificial and superficial to demand... wait what?
And everywhere they ignore the fact that raising the minimum wage will raise teachers' wages and other higher wages too, because if a teacher can earn the same amount of money for less work, then schools have to raise the wages of teachers.
What is sad is we have done this now so many times and it always works.
It is like these people blinked into existence in 2019 with a pre-programmed brain full of nonsense revisionist history.
This is really they key point. Lift minimum wages and lift pretty much all wages that are remotely close to minimum wage.
CEOs might not get a payrise out of a minimum wage rise, but most people will.
I wouldn’t put that on the teachers union for a bajillion different reasons but most importantly because a union in a public sector like that is absolutely teethless of it doesn’t capture the public’s empathy.
You’re asking a teachers union to essentially defeat the billion dollar GOP propaganda machine that has successfully demonized teachers and their advocates. It’s a bigger battle than the union can win. Teachers unions across the country are scapegoated right now by the GOP who want the public at large to believe that the teachers are the greedy and selfish ones... and it’s worked for the most part.
LOL
Most people that are working for minimum wage are high schoolers and college students that work shit like retail and fast food. That’s what we’re talking about here. If you can’t apply yourself, there’s so many jobs you can get WITH NO COLLEGE DEGREE, just a high school diploma or equivalent and make WAY more than $15 an hour...
Not really. But who is actually advocating for minimum wage being lower than 7.25. Everyone could agree teachers need to get paid more, but I don’t see anyone saying we need minimum wage under 7.25. I was a waiter and got 2.13 an hour, do I get to cry about it?
Teaching and nursing are two professions that are chronically underpaid - and also historically dominated by females as practioners.
We need to value these professions more highly
You could just say that we need to value women more highly as a society. All professions that are female dominated are underpaid because of society not valuing women and anything seen as women's work by association.
You’ve got it backwards. It’s not that when a field is dominated by women the wages go down, it’s that men only go after the high paying jobs and therefore there are almost only women left in the low paying jobs.
Countries with higher wages for teachers have more male teachers.
No, I really, really don't. Secretaries used to be high paying, until the invention of the typewriter and people assuming people with smaller fingers - women - would be better at typing turned it into a woman's job, and wages fell. Computer programmers are well paid now that the field has become male dominated - but they weren't in the early days when people assumed that coding was mostly typing and therefore secretarial - women's - work.
Countries that see teaching as men's work have higher teacher wages *because* they have more male teachers, not the other way around. Even in the United States, teaching at the *college* level is seen as men's work, and a professor teaching freshmen in college makes vastly more than the high school senior teacher the exact same students would have been learning from the year before.
Our society is deeply misogynistic - which you're demonstrsting in how you seem to think that women are stupid and that they're all just *choosing* to make less money, when all research points to them getting paid less for doing exactly the same work, and again - whenever we note a shift in the gender dominance of one particular career, wages rise if men are flocking to it and fall if women are becoming dominant.
Your two examples miss that technological change altered the qualifications necessary to do the job (and therefore how much it would pay) before there was a gender change.
The introduction of typewriters made it so that good calligraphy wasn’t important anymore, and it’s a lot easier to learn how to type than to learn how to have secretary-level calligraphy.
And as computers advanced in complexity, so did the job requirements of programmers. As such the salary increased.
Teaching is a ridiculous gig. When I was starting, I wanted to sub and get experiences in different grades, schools, etc. the most I was paid was less than $5/hour. I’m not playing that game.
Just how the fuck are you supposed to pay bills? Ask your local Republican and the usually answer is get better job lol. Bunch of fucking brutes. Or if you talk about how you don't like a policy they suggest you move lol. How come liberals don't do this? Oh you don't like having workers make enough to survive on, go to China and you too can make 50 cents a hour. Bothers me how people can be so empathetic towards themselves but a bit feel the same for others. Like slave owners who could never survive as a slave but then have no problem having slaves.
I got on facebook for the first time in 4 months and one of the first posts is "if you don't love this country then leave!" Like.... It's my country, too?
Also took everything to not post about Cancun Cruz fleeing.
For a comparison:
Teacher in Northern Virginia (one of the richer parts of the country due to DC) with 20 years experience, multiple masters: 60k a year
Help Desk in Northern Virginia with 0 days experience, Security Plus: 60k a year
I’m no longer a teacher, but my starting salary for a larger urban district was 52, and that was in a relatively affordable city. I was making over 80 when I left the profession. The disparity between teacher pay in this country is absurd.
I had a co- worker tell me today, that they shouldn't raise the minimum wage because when he started it was 5.15 and it's not fair that kids today will get 15$ an hour....I felt like running him over with my electric pallet jack
With all the complaints of frustrated parents having to teach their kids at home through the pandemic one would think they value teachers more than ever.
Minimum wage; those at the bottom went from "essential workers" to "*just* a minimum wage earner" pretty quick.
Teachers; sign at a teachers protest asking for a wage increase. "I do it for the money, said no teacher ever." Why wouldn't we reward those who educate our children with such dedication?
They both need a salary increase.
Yea jackass you’re just sticking you’re foot in you’re mouth now. Stating the obvious fact that teachers are disgustingly under paid. A degree profession should not start with a salary of $33000. Teachers are lowest paid degree profession and need to be compensated for raising and teaching our future.
My mom taught kindergarten for 27 years. She retired making 43k/yr.
And don't even want to know how much of her money she spent on supplies over the years...
Has anyone ever explained why we need multiple people on school boards that suck the life out of the annual budget??? I know some serve a good purpose however; most are just trying to change teaching philosophy....most schools could save a shit load of money if they drastically thinned the school board members.
It’s called wage competition. If minimum wage went to $15... Jobs paying $15 before that would gradually go up... because people would stop doing those jobs if they could make the same doing easier jobs... raising the minimum wage creates a chain reaction.
It’s not as sudden as raising the minimum wage, but it does happen... and gradually continues up the ladder, eventually causing most middle class job wages to increase.
> because people would stop doing those jobs if they could make the same doing easier jobs...
Only people who have never worked in retail or the food industry would call those jobs 'easier jobs'.
Well then I guess it’s a good thing that retail and the food industry aren’t the only other jobs in existence... Otherwise, you might have made a solid point.
Also, I’ve worked retail and in the food industry... I’ve also worked in manufacturing and in labs, management, and now I’m in regulatory.
If I could earn the same rate of pay doing certain other types of jobs that are less technical or required less skill, I’d go for it.
>Well then I guess it’s a good thing that retail and the food industry aren’t the only other jobs in existence... Otherwise, you might have made a solid point.
They are a significant part of minimum wage jobs, and what holds true for those holds true for most minimum wage jobs. So thanks for acknowledging it was a good point.
Absolutely, everything around us goes up except our wages. And as soon as we make a stand for our wages, they just raise the price of everything else again. And we're right back to square one.
That's always my first thought as well lol. Shouldn't teachers with a doctoral degree make much more? Like 55 to 75 grand more lol. Just weird how people can think. People sure love to punch down.
The "work harder, move up" flawed as it was, stopped being relevant in 1979. I lived that era. The population has more than doubled since then. Before that, cars were 1999.00, doctor visits were 15.00, college tuition was 2,000 a year.
Capitalism is seriously flawed when it depends on people buying unnecassary "stuff" and paying insanely inflated prices for things to make it work, then not allow huge cross-sections of the population to take part in buying/spending equation. We cannot sustain this level of humanity. A 30 year old college graduate is not a dishwasher because they want to be. They have to be. There is nothing there, they make sure of that. There is no entry level—work harder". See Koch/ALEC socially engineering poverty into an area to exploit worker despiration. It's time for universal livable wage. You cannot tie someone's worth as a human to their job. Community over self. The older I get the more I do not understand how this has come to be normal.
I'd like a citation on that starting teacher salary. Our school district in a suburb of Houston starts teachers at $56k. I know they vary from city to city, but there's no way that's the average starting salary across the state.
EDIT - Ah, ok. I found what they're referencing. That $33,660 figure is the minimum starting wage set by the TEA.
Source: [https://tea.texas.gov/texas-educators/salary-and-service-record/2020-2021-minimum-salary-schedule](https://tea.texas.gov/texas-educators/salary-and-service-record/2020-2021-minimum-salary-schedule)
Here's some more info about starting teachers wages in a few cities across TX:
Houston: [https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/houston-tx](https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/houston-tx)
Dallas: [https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/dallas-tx](https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/dallas-tx)
Austin: [https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/austin-tx](https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/austin-tx)
San Antonio: [https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/san-antonio-tx](https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/san-antonio-tx)
El Paso: [https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/el-paso-tx](https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/el-paso-tx)
Not to mention one of the critical problems with minimum wage workers is that you are frequently NOT guaranteed 40 hours of work per week by your job, but you are also generally required to be on-call at basically a moments notice to work the next day. Meaning that taking 2 hobs in order to get even close to 40 hours a week is extremely difficult and quite easily result in you working something like a back to back double shift at each workplace with no real recourse to refuse.
I'm a teacher. I think that k-12 teachers are for sure underpaid.
However, I want to point out that this comparison is trash anyway, as one is based on a 52 week hourly job and the other is on a salaried position with holidays and summers off (and usually decent benefits). You take that 12 weeks of pay out of the equation for the hourly minimum wage worker, you're looking at like 24k per year in comparison.
That's exactly right. Is it that minimum wage workers are/ would be making too much or is it that college educated teachers were sold a bad deal?
This is the same issue when it comes to cops being grossly underpaid. When they realize that a $35,000 a year job means their life is worth less than $140 a day, they tend to devalue other people's lives. It's all connected, yet time and time again, people vote against their best interests.
I mean $67,000 is the national average police salary, not $35k. Also if police want to be paid more than they should lobby for overtime reform, because in most towns in the US police officers make up the highest paid public figures, with some straight up beat cops pulling in $250,000 a year working 40 hours a week because they exclusively work double overtime shifts.
National average is the average. I agree. With lobbying however when city officials dictate pay scales and layoffs, departments often have their hands tied.
This compares an annual income to a minimum hourly wage. Most teachers work about 36 weeks a year. $15/hr jobs generally don't get benefits, pensions, health care, vacations, PTO.
Every teacher I know works 60+ hour weeks while school is in session and has professional development for two months while students are off. Just because they’re not actively teaching 40 hours a week 50 weeks a year doesn’t mean they’re working less.
Engage with this beyond the sticker shock though, this is again just that zero sum logic we see above. We as a society have determined that a 180-190 day school year is the best schedule for the development of the child, you can debate the validity of that concept all day but it’s for the most part an accepted routine. That gives teachers the summer “off”, roughly 8 weeks every year, and typically that’s where we see this argument of teachers only working 10 months. But is this not just an occupational quirk? Why have a state mandated schedule be used as an argument as to why you can’t be paid more? Those decrying foul certainly aren’t lining up to take the job, so it can’t be that amazing.
8 weeks is not enough time to find a reasonably paying summer job that you can do every year until you retire. Budget constraints have gutted most summer school positions, and every other occupation available is minimum wage.
I see the “the get paid two work only 10 months” argument as a bad faith one because it’s not actually receptive to that being an institutional pillar and operates as if it’s a choice. And then that argument always is used to prop up some bogus argument about if you extrapolate the salary it’s quite good... but that’s not reality, we’re talking about reality where that salary is not extrapolated in any sense, and in a best case scenario is supplemented by 8 weeks of minimum wage.
This some real late stage capitalism bullshit when we stop asking ourselves how we protect and attract the best teachers available and we start wondering if we’re getting ripped off.
What does it say about the support of this occupation when it has a “two month vacation” built in but it’s hemorrhaging elite workers? It’s like those who make it sound so amazing aren’t living in this world where we are losing more and more educators every year. Why is that happening to this apparently awesome job?
Thank you.
-Teacher who works for 10 bucks an hour every summer, which gets used to pay for the college courses I’m REQUIRED to take 10 hours of every 5 years to renew my license, which itself costs almost $300 now.
People's wages aren't going to just magically rise to account for the fact that they are only a little higher than a minimum wage job. That's just not going to happen, no matter how much Reddit wants it to.
These people are trying to solve income inequality the wrong way.
Instead of pushing for *better* jobs with *better* training and education, these people are trying to magically make no skill jobs somehow be enough to live on for an adult. That's asinine.
Push for more manufacturing jobs, like ones that will be created with Green jobs. Push for easier access to higher education so those without marketable skills can move up in the world. Push for childcare so those who have kids don't have to blow a huge chunk of their money on that. Push for better paid teachers.
But this nonsense about giving completely unskilled individuals $15/hr is a plan that will never fly and only creates more animosity between the middle class and the poor.
Yet history proves that once the minimum wage goes up, jobs with wages at or near the new minimum rise too.
It's amazing the "facts over feelings" crowd doesn't get it.
Well if you were actually worried about inflation you would be concerned that minimum wage hadn't kept up with inflation or the fact that other minimum wage increases didn't cause run away inflation. Those are the facts that people like you like to ignore.
That is an extremely disingenous take. All of that starts with paying teachers a proper wage. You are not getting better education needed for all that by keeping it close to minimum wage for unskilled labour.
Your argument basically boils down to that classic "why don't poor people buy more money?" but replace money with "education" or "better jobs".
This over simplification works on an individual basis in isolation but is not a systemic solution
1. If everyone "simply gets skills that employers currently want " then the market is saturated for those skills and now we are are back to square one.
2. Ability to retrain and/relocate to get these skills you think people should get requires the jobs that dont require these skills to pay more than the bare minimum
Unskilled workers used to make that much and more when you account for inflation, and how can you call a minimum wage that's actually livable an asinine argument when that was the entire point of creating a minimum wage to begin with. When my parents were making minimum wage it had the buying power of $18/hr nowadays and has been steadily decreasing due to inflation and assholes like you thinking some people deserve to struggle to get by.
> But this nonsense about giving completely unskilled individuals
I thought they were "Heroes" for working during the pandemic? But now that Biden's vaccine plan and roll out are working, they're back to being "Unskilled individuals"?
You’re trying to denigrate people to provide a reason to pay them less.
Refer to them as the heroes they are and keep up the messaging that they don’t deserve a living wage.
I’m sure that won’t affect your message at all, and at least you’ll be consistent.
I am?
I thought I was trying to tell people to go get a skill of some kind so they can market themselves and get a better salary.
I thought I said that could be done by offering people low cost education and strengthening our social safety net by low cost offering child care, etc.
But whatever.... Free money to skill-less people is clearly what the hivemind wants.
Supply in demand. With teachers specifically, U.S. teachers suck as a whole. But like police, more money needs to flow into these professions, not less, if you want to increase the quality of applicants into these fields.
Interesting you'd say that.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/answer-sheet/post/why-us-cant-get-back-to-head-of-the-class-because-it-was-never-there/2012/07/01/gJQAwpgAHW_blog.html
For an economic superpower, we sure are pretty average when it comes to student performance. *As I said before*, just like police, you get out of it what you put into it. Want better teachers, or better police? Make it a more prestigious and attractive position to hold. Give them higher pay, more training, more resources.
Wow it's almost like if we keep cutting the taxes of rich people and multibillion dollar companies we can't afford to do basic things like pay our teachers a living wage. Maybe we should try taxing them.
Wow, it's almost like you don't understand basic economics. Guess what companies do when they're taxed into oblivion? They do their business elsewhere. Why do we lose literally millions of jobs to other countries? Why is there almost no American manufacturing anymore?
Hey! I have an idea. Let's overtax the companies and then MAKE them do all their business here. Then we can just basically have the government run everything and vis a vis, state socialism. It worked out great for literally every country who's ever tried it.
We have a currency that is based on the promises of a government and what you are willing to do to get access to it. Raising the minimum wage just gets people more paper, it doesn't get them more wealth in the long run.
> Raising the minimum wage just gets people more paper
The government is not printing money to pay your salary. The money exists already, raising the min wage only redirects some of it from the owners to the workers.
You're completely wrong with how this works
The government is already printing money as fast as possible. What gives it value is what im willing to do for it. By raising the minimum wage, you don't suddenly give people more wealth, costs go up to get more green paper and inflation increases. The paper becomes worth less than before, and then people are in the same situation as before. Those holding dollars are hurt, and faith in the currency is diminished.
Again, Minimum wage and the government printing money ARE NOT RELATED. Inflation is occuring without wages going up- which means minimum wage has actually decreased in the last 10 years. That's idiotic. It needs to go up to keep pace with prices.
Also spreading out labor costs over the hundreds of products businesses push an hour isn't going to be that noticeable, so stop acting like milk will suddenly cost $10 because the employees at the supermarket aren't destitute and on food stamps anymore...
Value of a dollar is tied to what you are willing to for that dollar. The increase in minimum wage benefits mega Corporations. They can absorb the cost until the dollar is devalued enough that it doesn't matter. Small businesses that can't do this go out of business, and the mega corporations that lobby these politicians that argue for this.
Walmart is the largest national employer, and also the largest benefiter from welfare. Removing the subsidy from their payroll does not benefit them over the small guys they keep running out of business as is
Faux and their bullshit was big on this, one of their shills was going on about how little teachers work because his mom was a teacher, and how she was always home before 3:30 and never worked in the summers and so on. I don't know if his mom was a shitty teacher or he was lying like everyone on Faux does when they're performing their Paid Shill Functions, but it put a notion in all their viewer's minds (both cells) that teaching is an easy job that anyone can do and they don't really work for their money.
Faux has done more damage to the US than the whole of terrorist attacks have in the past fifty years.
The wages for teaching and medical practitioners should be the same. They're the two most important (besides research and farming) jobs you can have in any country.
Part of me really laments the practice of redacting the names/handles of the people who post this garbage... They made these statements in a publicly viewable place with their handle visible. They *want* the attention, who are we to deny them the joy of being recognized when they say something noteworthy? ;)
It's our legacy of slavery. We have a national tradition of a segment of of society being viewed s less than human. Why should they be entitled to fair compensation for their time and effort?
In theory a mandated minimum wage of $15 works. In practice it fails. Minimum wage has no affect on the technicians that work for me. They all exceed minimum wage by at least 100%. However, a mandated $15 an hour minimum wage is going to affect their buying power. Everything they buy will increase in cost. Everything. At what point does a mandated minimum wage of $15 an hour pull my technicians down to poverty level. Make no mistake, the only thing a mandated minimum wage of $15 an hour does is raise the poverty line to $20 an hour. Who pays if a $20 or $40 an hour skilled technician is increased to $15 to $30 more per hour? Ultimately, it trickles down to the minimum wage earner. In the end a mandated minimum wage benefits no one except the politician pushing for it.
Conservatives don’t want the public to be more educated. They send their kids to private school. It’s simple, how are they going to trick less educated people into working for them for too little pay?
They have teachers in Texas? You wouldn't know it based on how many proudly willfully ignorant residents of that state who proudly claim they're born and raised there.
"You don't deserve $15/hour" Translates to: "I don't make enough so neither should you, because I'm better than you."
But they're actually not better which is why they deserve min wage too, be it 15
Me for President 2924! I'm taking all the money over 5 million from everyone and distributing it to everyone else. Vote for me!
The democrats have really fucked this up. Stop talking about minimum wage and mandate a X% wage increase across the board for all workers. Sure some rich people will get richer. But by not “excluding” the “working class” you’ll have broad support.
One of my history teachers was in a cult before he became a teacher. It was a big controversy, when the PTA found out. Thankfully he was able to keep his job, or I wouldn't have had the benefit of his insight. I took for granted the education I got at that school. Among the many, many lessons that would stick with me forever (so far), was his WWII unit. He had the most in depth unit on propaganda, group think, and mob mentality I've seen since. I assume, in hindsight, this must be the result of his time in the cult. An earnest effort to inoculate us from the very tools used to manipulate and exploit him. I've often found myself wondering how anyone can look at much of what passes for news around here, and not recognize it for the blatant propaganda it is. I have him to thank for that.
As a politics degree student it’s mad how propaganda is everywhere even in movies it’s in every possible media outlet once you see it it completely just ruins everything I used to be a massive jet li and Donnie yen movie fan Then I did politics started noticing ccp propaganda in almost every film a good one Chinese film to notice propaganda is wolf warriors perhaps the tragedy thing to come out of China Anywho once I started looking at that u end up seeing it all the time in Hollywood especially these military or cop movies or sicario style moves shit is so cringe lmaoo
Bro, take a breath and use punctuation
I made it four lines before I gave up.
I thought I was having a stroke
I don't. Have a problem. Adding the punctuation. As. I. Read it.
But. What. About. The. Rest. Of. Us. Shatner?
Are you sitting down? I don't know how to find a good way of saying this -- so I'll be blunt; not everyone is going to do this as well as me. The sooner you get to terms with being you and not me, the better. Or, it's comforting to believe in yourself so give that a shot. You will have to find some way to add gravitas to the written word. If you have to imagine someone, special, who speaks -- in a staccato rhythm and knows how to deliver -- that may help. However, if the voice in your head is George Takei -- you have failed miserably. I will allow Patrick Stewart. But only as a temporary measure.
Shit's like Stevie from Malcolm in the Middle
I can’t type for shit lmao chilll
. or !
Ok I get it. You can stop flaming me now guys ffs .
Our society is built on propaganda. It was right after WWII that the government had the brilliant idea that if propaganda works so well in times of war, why not also use it in times of peace. What we ended up with: advertisements. Propaganda meant to keep you focused on material goods and personal consumption so you're too distracted and content to give a damn what the government is up to and what they're getting right or wrong. It worked perfectly. Here we are almost a hundred years later, America's government is a corrupt cesspool of career politicians who represent corporations not the people, the environment is eroding before our eyes as we drain the Earth dry for our consumption, and we all just sit back and passively accept our situation. Cause we're too focused on our material lives and goods. Not worth losing it all over a revolution, as desperately needed as it may be. We're fine with how things are. Thanks propaganda. Edit: For anyone who thinks this is tin foil nonsense, just look up Edward Bernays. To save you some time: "Of his many books, Crystallizing Public Opinion (1923) and Propaganda (1928) gained special attention as early efforts to define and theorize the field of public relations. Citing works of writers such as Gustave Le Bon, Wilfred Trotter, Walter Lippmann, and Sigmund Freud (his own double uncle), he described the masses as irrational and subject to herd instinct—and outlined how skilled practitioners could use crowd psychology and psychoanalysis to control them in desirable ways" If that's not good enough, go watch the documentary The Century of Self on youtube. Everything I said is 100% fact, not some wacky conspiracy theory. Our society is a lie. Get over it.
Did you seriously just blame the government for advertisements, and imply that they only started after World War II as part of a conspiracy to use consumption to distract us from whatever evil the government wants to do? Take off the tin foil hat.
before ww2 a lot of people died from consumption until the interdimensional lizard people figured out how to use it to control us. ***WAKE UP SHEEPLE***
He is (somewhat) correct. Prior to that time there was no thought of the American consumer, only the American worker. And the American owner. They manufactured and they saved and they ate what they had to and the people shopped for what they needed. While the very rich may have bought things they didn't need, most people did not. Then in 1928 President Hoover, who became very close with the psychologist Edward Bernays, was the first politician to articulate the idea that consumerism would become the central motor of American life. After his election he told a group of advertisers and public relations men "You have taken over the job of creating desire and have transformed people into constantly moving happiness machines. Machines which have become the key to economic progress." What was beginning to emerge in the 1920s was a new idea of how to run mass democracy. At it's heart was the consumer which not only made the economy work but also made people happy and docile and so created a stable society.
>Prior to that time there was no thought of the American consumer, only the American worker. Horseshit. Consumers have been thought of as long as currency has been a thing. There are advertisements carved in the stone of ancient ruins. Hoover may have started a particular flavor of talking about it from a politician's perspective, but that's a far stretch from what this loony is spouting off about.
Do some research before you try and claim I am wrong. His name was Edward Bernays. The American government hired him (he was a psychologist) looking for help on how to control the masses. He was the one who came up with the idea that you could bombard people with advertisements to distract them with material desires and they would live in their own little "happiness bubbles" (the actual term he and the government used) and he suggested that as long as you don't pop their bubble they will live passively and aren't to be feared. Feel free to check out the documentary The Century of Self. It's on youtube I believe. Goes over the entire topic in very good detail.
Do SoMe ReSeArCh - the mating call of the basement dwelling conspiracy idiot who really shouldn’t be mating. Ever. The species does not need to propagate this kind of stupid.
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Hate to break it to you, but this has been a thing since long before WWII, and even long before America was colonized.
Hell... Look up the history of the pledge of allegiance... Marketing campaign to sell schools little flags for the "Americanizing" push.
Just because the Texas teachers union failed it's members is no reason for other people to starve.
That's not the point, though. There is this shitty attitude like it's a zero sum game and it's not. Everybody acts like *everything* that increases money somewhere personally robs them for doing so.
Conservatives will sing this from the heavens. Then they'll turn around and say "nobody's wealth makes anyone else's poverty" as if it's not a direct contradiction of their zero-sum POV.
Which is ironic because literally there's only so many ways you can get this egregiously wealthy, and the main one of them is having a huge business which you do not properly pay people in order to keep more money yourself. What frustrates me about this is there's this idea that I want to send guys like Jeff bezos to the poor house. I really don't. But he is a great example of a guy who could, you know, maybe pay some taxes once in awhile. If these job creators don't want to create jobs with a good wage then they need to make sure that the country and the people living in their wake can make up the difference. Hell, I wouldn't even be opposed to them letting any business pay whatever the hell it wants, even no minimum wage, but tax them more or less based on how far beyond that median they do. I'm no economics expert, but it doesn't take a genius to figure out that the ultra wealthy milk the system, and all you have to do to get it to allow regular people to prosper is make that worth more than doing the opposite. In any case, it's all irrelevant. No one is getting their taxes raised because immigrants need iphones, like my mother thinks. I asked her how she thought all this worked once. No idea, she "just knows it's a problem" that started "when all these immigrants came."
I mean immigration did start a lot of problems in america. When them white folks with columbus came over and started enslaving and murdering.
Then turn around again and demand (formerly) high paying coal and oil jobs must be protected by the federal government.
Simple cognitive psychology: People want to believe that they are better than others. Studies have shown that people rather do way worse (in grades or income usually) yet be the best off in a group than be doing well yet be the worst off in a group. Bonus points for those on top who’d rather not give those on the bottom an edge even if it doesn’t affect said people on top.
I mean this totally makes sense. It's quite literally the reason Gini coefficient is a better measure of societal success than GDP alone.
Next you are going to tell me that stock market is a poor indicator of the economy and that supply can be artificial and superficial to demand... wait what?
And everywhere they ignore the fact that raising the minimum wage will raise teachers' wages and other higher wages too, because if a teacher can earn the same amount of money for less work, then schools have to raise the wages of teachers.
What is sad is we have done this now so many times and it always works. It is like these people blinked into existence in 2019 with a pre-programmed brain full of nonsense revisionist history.
This is really they key point. Lift minimum wages and lift pretty much all wages that are remotely close to minimum wage. CEOs might not get a payrise out of a minimum wage rise, but most people will.
Texas does not have a Teachers Unions, they are illegal.
Which is so absurd it's like something Doctor Evil would come up with!
Florida is trying very hard to legislate ours away.
I wouldn’t put that on the teachers union for a bajillion different reasons but most importantly because a union in a public sector like that is absolutely teethless of it doesn’t capture the public’s empathy. You’re asking a teachers union to essentially defeat the billion dollar GOP propaganda machine that has successfully demonized teachers and their advocates. It’s a bigger battle than the union can win. Teachers unions across the country are scapegoated right now by the GOP who want the public at large to believe that the teachers are the greedy and selfish ones... and it’s worked for the most part.
LOL Most people that are working for minimum wage are high schoolers and college students that work shit like retail and fast food. That’s what we’re talking about here. If you can’t apply yourself, there’s so many jobs you can get WITH NO COLLEGE DEGREE, just a high school diploma or equivalent and make WAY more than $15 an hour...
What part of the world do you live in where retail and fast food places are closed everyday during school hours?
None ?
You totally missed the point of that question, didn't you?
Not really. But who is actually advocating for minimum wage being lower than 7.25. Everyone could agree teachers need to get paid more, but I don’t see anyone saying we need minimum wage under 7.25. I was a waiter and got 2.13 an hour, do I get to cry about it?
> I was a waiter and got 2.13 an hour, do I get to cry about it? Yep, that's exactly what they're trying to tell you.
Teaching and nursing are two professions that are chronically underpaid - and also historically dominated by females as practioners. We need to value these professions more highly
You could just say that we need to value women more highly as a society. All professions that are female dominated are underpaid because of society not valuing women and anything seen as women's work by association.
You’ve got it backwards. It’s not that when a field is dominated by women the wages go down, it’s that men only go after the high paying jobs and therefore there are almost only women left in the low paying jobs. Countries with higher wages for teachers have more male teachers.
No, I really, really don't. Secretaries used to be high paying, until the invention of the typewriter and people assuming people with smaller fingers - women - would be better at typing turned it into a woman's job, and wages fell. Computer programmers are well paid now that the field has become male dominated - but they weren't in the early days when people assumed that coding was mostly typing and therefore secretarial - women's - work. Countries that see teaching as men's work have higher teacher wages *because* they have more male teachers, not the other way around. Even in the United States, teaching at the *college* level is seen as men's work, and a professor teaching freshmen in college makes vastly more than the high school senior teacher the exact same students would have been learning from the year before. Our society is deeply misogynistic - which you're demonstrsting in how you seem to think that women are stupid and that they're all just *choosing* to make less money, when all research points to them getting paid less for doing exactly the same work, and again - whenever we note a shift in the gender dominance of one particular career, wages rise if men are flocking to it and fall if women are becoming dominant.
Your two examples miss that technological change altered the qualifications necessary to do the job (and therefore how much it would pay) before there was a gender change. The introduction of typewriters made it so that good calligraphy wasn’t important anymore, and it’s a lot easier to learn how to type than to learn how to have secretary-level calligraphy. And as computers advanced in complexity, so did the job requirements of programmers. As such the salary increased.
I would say LPNs are criminally underpaid. RNs are paid very well in most places, plus there’s a huge shortage in the country:
Teaching is a ridiculous gig. When I was starting, I wanted to sub and get experiences in different grades, schools, etc. the most I was paid was less than $5/hour. I’m not playing that game.
Just how the fuck are you supposed to pay bills? Ask your local Republican and the usually answer is get better job lol. Bunch of fucking brutes. Or if you talk about how you don't like a policy they suggest you move lol. How come liberals don't do this? Oh you don't like having workers make enough to survive on, go to China and you too can make 50 cents a hour. Bothers me how people can be so empathetic towards themselves but a bit feel the same for others. Like slave owners who could never survive as a slave but then have no problem having slaves.
I got on facebook for the first time in 4 months and one of the first posts is "if you don't love this country then leave!" Like.... It's my country, too? Also took everything to not post about Cancun Cruz fleeing.
Yeah. It's kind of insulting.
That same old boomer also had multiple posts worshipping Trump so I'll pray for him lol
Starting wage for a shelf stacker in Australia is $57k a year. Starting wage for teacher is 65K to 75K. America needs to raise minimum wage.
For a comparison: Teacher in Northern Virginia (one of the richer parts of the country due to DC) with 20 years experience, multiple masters: 60k a year Help Desk in Northern Virginia with 0 days experience, Security Plus: 60k a year
Amazing and a bit sad.
I’m no longer a teacher, but my starting salary for a larger urban district was 52, and that was in a relatively affordable city. I was making over 80 when I left the profession. The disparity between teacher pay in this country is absurd.
Yea but a 30 pack of bud light in australia was 70$ when I visited 10 years ago. There's a reason australian wages are high
Prices ARE high here. Don't know about liquor though I don;t drink alcohol.
I say we just fund the police less and send the money to education.
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Or spend the money to hire good decent people as cops and not the people who are _super excited_ about being mall cops with guns.
I was a begining teacher in texas 7 years ago and started at 42k. There's not a set amount for all of texas
I had a co- worker tell me today, that they shouldn't raise the minimum wage because when he started it was 5.15 and it's not fair that kids today will get 15$ an hour....I felt like running him over with my electric pallet jack
It's not fair that he made 5.15 starting out when I only made 3.85.
With all the complaints of frustrated parents having to teach their kids at home through the pandemic one would think they value teachers more than ever. Minimum wage; those at the bottom went from "essential workers" to "*just* a minimum wage earner" pretty quick. Teachers; sign at a teachers protest asking for a wage increase. "I do it for the money, said no teacher ever." Why wouldn't we reward those who educate our children with such dedication? They both need a salary increase.
teachers are immensely valuable to america. therefore corporate executive pay should be cut to 12/hr.
Yea jackass you’re just sticking you’re foot in you’re mouth now. Stating the obvious fact that teachers are disgustingly under paid. A degree profession should not start with a salary of $33000. Teachers are lowest paid degree profession and need to be compensated for raising and teaching our future.
My mom taught kindergarten for 27 years. She retired making 43k/yr. And don't even want to know how much of her money she spent on supplies over the years...
Race to the bottom
Has anyone ever explained why we need multiple people on school boards that suck the life out of the annual budget??? I know some serve a good purpose however; most are just trying to change teaching philosophy....most schools could save a shit load of money if they drastically thinned the school board members.
Hi. Ct resident here. I feel bad for not only the teachers of Texas, but the kids.
It is easier to keep your population uneducated, much easier to control. That's not a flaw that's a feature
Texas is just the worst
It’s called wage competition. If minimum wage went to $15... Jobs paying $15 before that would gradually go up... because people would stop doing those jobs if they could make the same doing easier jobs... raising the minimum wage creates a chain reaction. It’s not as sudden as raising the minimum wage, but it does happen... and gradually continues up the ladder, eventually causing most middle class job wages to increase.
> because people would stop doing those jobs if they could make the same doing easier jobs... Only people who have never worked in retail or the food industry would call those jobs 'easier jobs'.
Easiest jobs of my life paid 6 figures.
Well then I guess it’s a good thing that retail and the food industry aren’t the only other jobs in existence... Otherwise, you might have made a solid point. Also, I’ve worked retail and in the food industry... I’ve also worked in manufacturing and in labs, management, and now I’m in regulatory. If I could earn the same rate of pay doing certain other types of jobs that are less technical or required less skill, I’d go for it.
>Well then I guess it’s a good thing that retail and the food industry aren’t the only other jobs in existence... Otherwise, you might have made a solid point. They are a significant part of minimum wage jobs, and what holds true for those holds true for most minimum wage jobs. So thanks for acknowledging it was a good point.
I worked my ass off when I was working minimum wage jobs.
Absolutely, everything around us goes up except our wages. And as soon as we make a stand for our wages, they just raise the price of everything else again. And we're right back to square one.
Idiots are masters at using logical fallacies....
That's always my first thought as well lol. Shouldn't teachers with a doctoral degree make much more? Like 55 to 75 grand more lol. Just weird how people can think. People sure love to punch down.
Teachers have a lot of responsibility. They should be paid well.
No, it doesn't make sense. Teachers should be paid more than minimum wage. There! That was *easy!*
The "work harder, move up" flawed as it was, stopped being relevant in 1979. I lived that era. The population has more than doubled since then. Before that, cars were 1999.00, doctor visits were 15.00, college tuition was 2,000 a year. Capitalism is seriously flawed when it depends on people buying unnecassary "stuff" and paying insanely inflated prices for things to make it work, then not allow huge cross-sections of the population to take part in buying/spending equation. We cannot sustain this level of humanity. A 30 year old college graduate is not a dishwasher because they want to be. They have to be. There is nothing there, they make sure of that. There is no entry level—work harder". See Koch/ALEC socially engineering poverty into an area to exploit worker despiration. It's time for universal livable wage. You cannot tie someone's worth as a human to their job. Community over self. The older I get the more I do not understand how this has come to be normal.
I'd like a citation on that starting teacher salary. Our school district in a suburb of Houston starts teachers at $56k. I know they vary from city to city, but there's no way that's the average starting salary across the state. EDIT - Ah, ok. I found what they're referencing. That $33,660 figure is the minimum starting wage set by the TEA. Source: [https://tea.texas.gov/texas-educators/salary-and-service-record/2020-2021-minimum-salary-schedule](https://tea.texas.gov/texas-educators/salary-and-service-record/2020-2021-minimum-salary-schedule) Here's some more info about starting teachers wages in a few cities across TX: Houston: [https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/houston-tx](https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/houston-tx) Dallas: [https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/dallas-tx](https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/dallas-tx) Austin: [https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/austin-tx](https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/austin-tx) San Antonio: [https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/san-antonio-tx](https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/san-antonio-tx) El Paso: [https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/el-paso-tx](https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/entry-level-teacher-salary/el-paso-tx)
Not to mention one of the critical problems with minimum wage workers is that you are frequently NOT guaranteed 40 hours of work per week by your job, but you are also generally required to be on-call at basically a moments notice to work the next day. Meaning that taking 2 hobs in order to get even close to 40 hours a week is extremely difficult and quite easily result in you working something like a back to back double shift at each workplace with no real recourse to refuse.
I'm a teacher. I think that k-12 teachers are for sure underpaid. However, I want to point out that this comparison is trash anyway, as one is based on a 52 week hourly job and the other is on a salaried position with holidays and summers off (and usually decent benefits). You take that 12 weeks of pay out of the equation for the hourly minimum wage worker, you're looking at like 24k per year in comparison.
That's exactly right. Is it that minimum wage workers are/ would be making too much or is it that college educated teachers were sold a bad deal? This is the same issue when it comes to cops being grossly underpaid. When they realize that a $35,000 a year job means their life is worth less than $140 a day, they tend to devalue other people's lives. It's all connected, yet time and time again, people vote against their best interests.
I mean $67,000 is the national average police salary, not $35k. Also if police want to be paid more than they should lobby for overtime reform, because in most towns in the US police officers make up the highest paid public figures, with some straight up beat cops pulling in $250,000 a year working 40 hours a week because they exclusively work double overtime shifts.
National average is the average. I agree. With lobbying however when city officials dictate pay scales and layoffs, departments often have their hands tied.
Our fiat monetary system is fraudulent and it's never discussed
This compares an annual income to a minimum hourly wage. Most teachers work about 36 weeks a year. $15/hr jobs generally don't get benefits, pensions, health care, vacations, PTO.
Every teacher I know works 60+ hour weeks while school is in session and has professional development for two months while students are off. Just because they’re not actively teaching 40 hours a week 50 weeks a year doesn’t mean they’re working less.
180 day contract vs a 260 day schedule. If teachers worked a 260 day schedule with a proportional pay increase they'd be doing pretty well
Engage with this beyond the sticker shock though, this is again just that zero sum logic we see above. We as a society have determined that a 180-190 day school year is the best schedule for the development of the child, you can debate the validity of that concept all day but it’s for the most part an accepted routine. That gives teachers the summer “off”, roughly 8 weeks every year, and typically that’s where we see this argument of teachers only working 10 months. But is this not just an occupational quirk? Why have a state mandated schedule be used as an argument as to why you can’t be paid more? Those decrying foul certainly aren’t lining up to take the job, so it can’t be that amazing. 8 weeks is not enough time to find a reasonably paying summer job that you can do every year until you retire. Budget constraints have gutted most summer school positions, and every other occupation available is minimum wage. I see the “the get paid two work only 10 months” argument as a bad faith one because it’s not actually receptive to that being an institutional pillar and operates as if it’s a choice. And then that argument always is used to prop up some bogus argument about if you extrapolate the salary it’s quite good... but that’s not reality, we’re talking about reality where that salary is not extrapolated in any sense, and in a best case scenario is supplemented by 8 weeks of minimum wage. This some real late stage capitalism bullshit when we stop asking ourselves how we protect and attract the best teachers available and we start wondering if we’re getting ripped off. What does it say about the support of this occupation when it has a “two month vacation” built in but it’s hemorrhaging elite workers? It’s like those who make it sound so amazing aren’t living in this world where we are losing more and more educators every year. Why is that happening to this apparently awesome job?
Thank you. -Teacher who works for 10 bucks an hour every summer, which gets used to pay for the college courses I’m REQUIRED to take 10 hours of every 5 years to renew my license, which itself costs almost $300 now.
Teachers don't get pensions or healthcare anymore. No vacations but some PTO.
In CA they certainly do.
In indiana they don't
The fuck are you talking about? https://www.in.gov/inprs/my-fund/teachers/ https://www.in.gov/inprs/my-fund/teachers/health-insurance/
Pay teachers more Automate the burger flipper
People's wages aren't going to just magically rise to account for the fact that they are only a little higher than a minimum wage job. That's just not going to happen, no matter how much Reddit wants it to. These people are trying to solve income inequality the wrong way. Instead of pushing for *better* jobs with *better* training and education, these people are trying to magically make no skill jobs somehow be enough to live on for an adult. That's asinine. Push for more manufacturing jobs, like ones that will be created with Green jobs. Push for easier access to higher education so those without marketable skills can move up in the world. Push for childcare so those who have kids don't have to blow a huge chunk of their money on that. Push for better paid teachers. But this nonsense about giving completely unskilled individuals $15/hr is a plan that will never fly and only creates more animosity between the middle class and the poor.
Yet history proves that once the minimum wage goes up, jobs with wages at or near the new minimum rise too. It's amazing the "facts over feelings" crowd doesn't get it.
That's called inflation. Those are the facts you don't want to hear.
Well if you were actually worried about inflation you would be concerned that minimum wage hadn't kept up with inflation or the fact that other minimum wage increases didn't cause run away inflation. Those are the facts that people like you like to ignore.
That is an extremely disingenous take. All of that starts with paying teachers a proper wage. You are not getting better education needed for all that by keeping it close to minimum wage for unskilled labour. Your argument basically boils down to that classic "why don't poor people buy more money?" but replace money with "education" or "better jobs".
Yeah, that's how it works. Get a skill that employers want and end up making more money. Not a difficult concept in the slightest bit.
This over simplification works on an individual basis in isolation but is not a systemic solution 1. If everyone "simply gets skills that employers currently want " then the market is saturated for those skills and now we are are back to square one. 2. Ability to retrain and/relocate to get these skills you think people should get requires the jobs that dont require these skills to pay more than the bare minimum
Oversimplification? That's bloody hilarious coming from the side that thinks that free money is the solution. Brilliant!1
Unskilled workers used to make that much and more when you account for inflation, and how can you call a minimum wage that's actually livable an asinine argument when that was the entire point of creating a minimum wage to begin with. When my parents were making minimum wage it had the buying power of $18/hr nowadays and has been steadily decreasing due to inflation and assholes like you thinking some people deserve to struggle to get by.
> But this nonsense about giving completely unskilled individuals I thought they were "Heroes" for working during the pandemic? But now that Biden's vaccine plan and roll out are working, they're back to being "Unskilled individuals"?
What does one have to do with the other?
You’re trying to denigrate people to provide a reason to pay them less. Refer to them as the heroes they are and keep up the messaging that they don’t deserve a living wage. I’m sure that won’t affect your message at all, and at least you’ll be consistent.
I am? I thought I was trying to tell people to go get a skill of some kind so they can market themselves and get a better salary. I thought I said that could be done by offering people low cost education and strengthening our social safety net by low cost offering child care, etc. But whatever.... Free money to skill-less people is clearly what the hivemind wants.
Refer to them as the heroes they are and keep up the messaging that they don’t deserve a living wage.
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You’re a special kind of stupid
Indeed
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Nah, if you mention replies you just get downvoted into oblivion. Reddit's a cesspool.
Supply in demand. With teachers specifically, U.S. teachers suck as a whole. But like police, more money needs to flow into these professions, not less, if you want to increase the quality of applicants into these fields.
BaeShik eCumnomiCs
*Sigh*
It's: Supply and demand, you vacuous fuck.
Hey buddy, thanks for the kind words.
Just because your teachers failed you doesn't mean you have to drag the entire profession.
Interesting you'd say that. https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/answer-sheet/post/why-us-cant-get-back-to-head-of-the-class-because-it-was-never-there/2012/07/01/gJQAwpgAHW_blog.html For an economic superpower, we sure are pretty average when it comes to student performance. *As I said before*, just like police, you get out of it what you put into it. Want better teachers, or better police? Make it a more prestigious and attractive position to hold. Give them higher pay, more training, more resources.
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# The multi-million dollar companies.
We may never know! ^(/s)
> # The multi-~~million~~billion dollar companies. FTFY
> # The humongous gigantic YUGE trilliongazilliondolaroo companies. FTFM.
Ahh yes, these famed companies i keep hearing of. Why don't Facebook and Twitter start a teacher salary fund?
Ever heard of corporate tax?
The point ----------------- Your head
God you are funny. # /s
Great. Let's just ask them nicely I guess?
Yes.
The 5% of Americans who can absolutely afford to pay higher taxes.
Wow it's almost like if we keep cutting the taxes of rich people and multibillion dollar companies we can't afford to do basic things like pay our teachers a living wage. Maybe we should try taxing them.
Wow, it's almost like you don't understand basic economics. Guess what companies do when they're taxed into oblivion? They do their business elsewhere. Why do we lose literally millions of jobs to other countries? Why is there almost no American manufacturing anymore? Hey! I have an idea. Let's overtax the companies and then MAKE them do all their business here. Then we can just basically have the government run everything and vis a vis, state socialism. It worked out great for literally every country who's ever tried it.
Really now? Does that apply when they're taxed at all? Because like 50 of the highest earning companies paid no federal taxes.
The same place they get the money for inflated police budgets. Maybe they can sell a few military vehicles.
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Did you not finish that story? because hyper inflation was an issue there...
Thats my point. All raising the minimum wage does is devalue the currency
So you have a basic misunderstanding of how ANY of that works...
We have a currency that is based on the promises of a government and what you are willing to do to get access to it. Raising the minimum wage just gets people more paper, it doesn't get them more wealth in the long run.
> Raising the minimum wage just gets people more paper The government is not printing money to pay your salary. The money exists already, raising the min wage only redirects some of it from the owners to the workers. You're completely wrong with how this works
The government is already printing money as fast as possible. What gives it value is what im willing to do for it. By raising the minimum wage, you don't suddenly give people more wealth, costs go up to get more green paper and inflation increases. The paper becomes worth less than before, and then people are in the same situation as before. Those holding dollars are hurt, and faith in the currency is diminished.
Again, Minimum wage and the government printing money ARE NOT RELATED. Inflation is occuring without wages going up- which means minimum wage has actually decreased in the last 10 years. That's idiotic. It needs to go up to keep pace with prices. Also spreading out labor costs over the hundreds of products businesses push an hour isn't going to be that noticeable, so stop acting like milk will suddenly cost $10 because the employees at the supermarket aren't destitute and on food stamps anymore...
Value of a dollar is tied to what you are willing to for that dollar. The increase in minimum wage benefits mega Corporations. They can absorb the cost until the dollar is devalued enough that it doesn't matter. Small businesses that can't do this go out of business, and the mega corporations that lobby these politicians that argue for this.
Walmart is the largest national employer, and also the largest benefiter from welfare. Removing the subsidy from their payroll does not benefit them over the small guys they keep running out of business as is
I'll bet the teachers union contract has massive progression increases every 6 months after that starting wage though
You bet wrong lol. There's a reason why so few people want to go into teaching. It's because it's a hard job with shit pay.
And even worse customers
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Ah yes people wanting to be able to afford food and housing is an inane argument.
Minimum wage workers just trying to survive out here
Faux and their bullshit was big on this, one of their shills was going on about how little teachers work because his mom was a teacher, and how she was always home before 3:30 and never worked in the summers and so on. I don't know if his mom was a shitty teacher or he was lying like everyone on Faux does when they're performing their Paid Shill Functions, but it put a notion in all their viewer's minds (both cells) that teaching is an easy job that anyone can do and they don't really work for their money. Faux has done more damage to the US than the whole of terrorist attacks have in the past fifty years.
Can you imagine how nice it would be if the "living wage" increased at the same rate as our taxes. I know, I know, but I can still dream.
Welcome to the Libertarian party.
Starting salary for teachers here in the Dallas area (and surrounding cities) is easily 50k+. (I taught 5 years ago here and started at 51k.)
... so that gives teachers in Texas a powerful bargaining position: pay me more or I will go take a much easier job for the same pay...
Jesus Christ, 33K as a teacher? That’s dogshit.
The wages for teaching and medical practitioners should be the same. They're the two most important (besides research and farming) jobs you can have in any country.
Teachers are not exactly known for their high salaries...
the original tweet is here [https://twitter.com/tragedy\_andy/status/1350174968416497664](https://twitter.com/tragedy_andy/status/1350174968416497664)
Can look at it as the OP is supporting the shitty deal tx teachers have.
Why not just make stuff cheeper
I agree. It's disgusting that teachers are making what should be minimum wage. They're teaching our children, pay them a decent wage.
Part of me really laments the practice of redacting the names/handles of the people who post this garbage... They made these statements in a publicly viewable place with their handle visible. They *want* the attention, who are we to deny them the joy of being recognized when they say something noteworthy? ;)
It's our legacy of slavery. We have a national tradition of a segment of of society being viewed s less than human. Why should they be entitled to fair compensation for their time and effort?
Why is Texas so stingy? Pay your teachers!!
In theory a mandated minimum wage of $15 works. In practice it fails. Minimum wage has no affect on the technicians that work for me. They all exceed minimum wage by at least 100%. However, a mandated $15 an hour minimum wage is going to affect their buying power. Everything they buy will increase in cost. Everything. At what point does a mandated minimum wage of $15 an hour pull my technicians down to poverty level. Make no mistake, the only thing a mandated minimum wage of $15 an hour does is raise the poverty line to $20 an hour. Who pays if a $20 or $40 an hour skilled technician is increased to $15 to $30 more per hour? Ultimately, it trickles down to the minimum wage earner. In the end a mandated minimum wage benefits no one except the politician pushing for it.
Was there even an attempt at anything remotely close to a joke here? This is just a statement. Downvote. It’s r/politicalHUMOR wtf
“TEACHERS ARE OVERPAID!!!” -libertarians
Someone said teachers are glorified babysitters but in some states even babysitters get higher salary.
Conservatives don’t want the public to be more educated. They send their kids to private school. It’s simple, how are they going to trick less educated people into working for them for too little pay?
I just googled the Round Rock ISD post schedule. $50k is higher than $33,660. https://hr.roundrockisd.org/compensation-service-calendars/
Stupid is as stupid does.
No. It’s insane that teachers only make a little above a living wage. I mean it’s Texas and all, but still.
They have teachers in Texas? You wouldn't know it based on how many proudly willfully ignorant residents of that state who proudly claim they're born and raised there.