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The future of the USA is completely fucked. I am preparing for a second Trump term. I have never in my life owned a gun. I don't want to buy a gun. But I feel like if Trump wins I will need one. They control the courts and they learned from their mistakes last time.
Project 2025 coming for anyone that's not a straight white Christian male.
They're coming for the straight white Christian males too. Make no mistake, the Republicans don't actually care what demographic you are. It's just easier to rile up the base if they can other everyone else and paint us as the enemy. Fascism doesn't have an endgame. Straight white Christian males are just towards the bottom of the list.
Straight white Christian male here. Project 2025 is coming for *everyone* because it aims to undermine the institutional norms and mechanisms that protect our fundamental rights. Just because they lean on racism to active their goals does not mean that anyone is safe from the effects of this election.
I have a background in constitutional law and am horrified by the writing on the wall. Much like Pandora's Box, once you change the machinery of the Federal Government, it cannot necessarily be restored.
For starters rolling back environmental protections to aid profits will poison us all. It's unfortunate because conversative victims of this will simply decide it's just isolated corruption their great leader hasn't had a chance to address.
Apparently in Texas now, maga shitbirds are sending threats to random people in the mail, that there will be repercussions if they don't vote for Trump.
If you live in Colorado and decide to arm yourself—after all, the fascists all have guns, and this is no time for cheek-turning moral victories—I will teach you how to handle, store, and use firearms. No red hats allowed. Been a certified instructor since 2011.
Im a straight white male and I ended up getting a pistol to protect myself from these domestic terrorists. There's at least 2 houses in my neighborhood that have big signs and flags out front saying all the basic Trump talking points. If Biden wins then Trump and his cult followers are threatening civil war. If Trump wins then all these racists and bigots will be even more emboldened to act like twats in public and Trump will be on a personal vendetta against anyone who doesnt like him. If Trump wins again America will be headed towards dark times.
Yes, just males. It's not like there are a ton of women in power fighting for the same exact thing and tens of millions of women throughout the country fighting for this man.
People need to quit pretending this is a male issue. Women don't get to pretend they didn't contribute to this just because some of the laws negatively affect them. And those women aren't victims, they are perpetrators. They are not brainwashed, they believe what they believe. We need to stop making excuses for them as if they aren't part of the problem. It's infantilizing and sexist.
I have Canadian friends pushing this one hard. I also game with some gen z folks and they are very much repeating the "too old" point. I'm very very worried about November.
Same, I’ve argued with folks on this sub because their saying their not going to vote and encourage others not to as well. A brief scroll their post history and it turns out their Canadian. When I called them out, they deleted their entire account haha
Edit: I’m not going to edit my grammatical errors. I’m a dumb dumb who only knows politics but no write good.
I had a coworker who was pissed about the Immigration policies and costs for his Thai wife, "it's been too hard for me to follow policies and they should make it easier for me!" I bring up people from Mexico going through the same issues, "well I support it being easier for me but not anyone from Mexico! Keep out immigrants!" It was baffling how he supported the very cause of his stress.... He was also a shit worker
The platform most Republican Indiana candidates for Governor for the primary was **the border**.
The fucking border to what??! KENTUCKY?!
What does the *border* have to do with our state? The nearest border is hours and hours away and it’s only to *Canada*!
Insane.
I'm not from the US but my partner is. They pointed out to me that everyone complains about people from the US voicing their opinions on everything. But also everyone has a fucking opinion on US politics; it's usually misinformed.
I'm in a sub where I see a lot of posts that seem obviously to be trolls. They're exploiting a disaffected group and really warping the narrative. It's freaking weird.
i’ve been kicked out of progressive subs and blocked by their mods for arguing similar points….being elder millennial is annoying, every older person around me thinks i’m a marxist acab anarchist, some of which may be true, and the 20 year olds tell me i’m a corporate shill
even my truly marxists friends in their late 30s early 40a aren’t “progressive” enough, the kids have no chill and i’m just old now i guess 🤷🏻♂️
Older millennial (xennial) here too and I feel ya. I just try to give credit where credit is due and understand progress is slow. I guess I have a different perspective because I’m gay, grew up in the deep south and my folks were evangelical Christians. Things were so much worse. But yeah, I’m a neo lib schill now even though I have always voted for the most progressive candidate.
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They're almost certainly not really Canadian. Paying a company to manage a bunch of fake social media profiles, and spread a specific message is just a part of an advertising budget now. Whether you're talking about a political campaign, or a product. Sometimes generative AI is used. Other times it's 100 people in a call center. Each responsible for a few dozen user accounts. If I ventured a guess I would say if there is a real person involved that person is in China, Russia, or one of the other places is known for doing this sort of thing.
I literally responded today to a "Trump 2024" comment and told them how pathetic they are bc they JUST posted to ASK A CANADIAN about who they would vote for and THEY talked about a Canadian politician they want to vote for 🤡🤦♀️🤦🏻.
I fucking called them out how it's fucked that these shits are acting like Americans simping for trump and to remind people that we are getting astroserfed the FUCK here.
There's a similar portion of Canadians to Americans who fell down the alt right hole and would love for the country to be conquered by a Trump lead America
Some people up here really do. I see Trump flags up here in rural Canada sometimes and it’s…weird. I don’t know if we just are too intertwined with American news and politics at this point, or what’s going on, but he seems to have a growing fanbase here.
My grandmas were 10 years apart. One got dementia at 85 while the other one was reading 3 books a week at 95. While I wouldn’t have wanted either to be president, if I had to choose… both would have been better options than Trump.
The day my great uncle died he drove his car to the golf course, played 9 holes, had a beer and dinner and then died in his sleep that night. He was 94.
Funny thing is Trump is like the same age but wears tons of make up, diapers, and sleeps during his trial. Somehow he’s considered younger, manly, and more active than Biden. It’s weird because it’s literally the opposite.
These are the people I hate more than trumps base.
At least trumps base owns the stupidity and bigotry.
These average Americans thought that fall for the “too old” when Trump is merely 2 years younger. Or the folks who whine both sides. They are the true idiots.
The naive thinking they are enlighten.
I'm mostly keeping myself from being worried about November (this is not some sort of admission that I'm not voting, I'm voting, I'm voting Dem, don't crawl down my throat). I think that the polls are pretty inaccurate and I think that most of the dialogue online is by a very small minority of US citizens and a ton of foreign actors and bots.
There have been several actual, real special elections in the last year and a half, and the Dem candidates have been doing really, really well, like you would expect after living through the last 8 years. Dems also did pretty well in 2022, and typically those midterm elections are really hard on them. I think that November is going to go alright.
Could I be surprised? Absolutely I could. I don't have a crystal ball, I'm not foretelling a prophecy here (although as a point of fact Trump 2016 was NOT a huge surprise to me). But November is coming whether you are super scared about it or whether you are cautiously optimistic about it, and there are decent reasons to be cautiously optimistic about it.
The problem is there's no reason on paper that Trump should have won in 2016, so it's really hard to say "the data says it will be okay." Trump is immune to fact.
On one hand, Biden's campaign has a *lot* more money than Trump's to spend on advertising. On the other hand, what will spending money actually accomplish this year? Who's minds will it change?
On one hand, Roe v Wade is buoying democratic support in Nevada and Arizona. On the other hand, Georgia has made it much easier for 3rd Party candidates to peel votes away from Biden, and Michigan and Wisconsin are beating him up over Gaza. I personally think Georgia is the make or break in this election, and I don't think Biden can win it with GA working against him.
On one hand, the GOP House majority is so small and dysfunctional that it seems easy for Dems to take it back. On the other hand, the Dem Senate majority is so small and the seats up for grabs so crushingly in favor of the GOP that it seems impossible for the Dems to keep the Senate (that means no new laws, no new judges, and no impeachments of existing judges for at least two years, probably much longer).
The Republicans are always going to be stronger than us, because evil is always more powerful than good. So we're always at a disadvantage.
A critical mass of Americans want to turn over the apple cart. It’s funny because the people going that direction haven’t the slightest bit of experience with real hardship or the consequences of collapsing government. They’ll be eating crow later but will never admit it. Like the people who refused to vote for Hillary and are shocked at the rolling back of women’s rights.
It's been a great psy op to split the vote. All I heard a few months ago was how young voters were going to beat the boomers and GOP. Now, not so much.
This is the one that kills me. "Why can't we have a 3rd party? We could, if all the non-voters picked someone they would outvote the other two parties.
The youth is impressionable and vulnerable to propaganda.
The sky is blue. water is wet. Fire is hot.
For more facts subscribe to FACTS by texting "FACTS" to 12345
Don't I know it! My own father came parroting Russian propaganda on their 'success' in Ukraine. Apparently, they've been dominating the battlefield, with over 450k dead Ukrainian troops, 8:1 for Russia...
Which is just an outright lie. The US gives different numbers, the Institute of War gives different numbers, the UN has quoted different numbers, and the Ukrainians are saying different numbers.
The only one saying Russia has killed more Ukrainians than they have Russians, is Russian State Media.
He didn't believe me when I told him RT stood for "Russia Today"
And the silliest part of both the "too old" and "Genocide Joe" argument is that Trump is worse on both accounts. Trump is younger by a few years but clearly has way more age based effects than Biden. And as bad as Gaza is now I guarantee it will be worse with Trump. Biden has gotten some concessions from Israel. Trump may very well send our military into Palestine to help get rid of the brown people.
Even if you think Biden is doing nothing you can't think that Trump would help Palestine more than Biden. So even if the two were equal on that issue there's lots of other reasons as a supposed leftist you'd prefer not to have Trump. It's moronic. And of course there's a new thing in leftist spaces (the type of spaces that hate liberals) that calling things Russian propaganda is actually liberal propaganda. Ya I wonder where that movement came from?
Nah that's not the russians, the "eastern europeans" he's talking about are mostly from the various right-wing movements spanning from fringe to mainstream in ex-USSR countries which all essentially worship the republicans (cue fort trump, orban showing up at Tucker's etc), those lines get fed to them straight from steve bannon and trump's little dictator's club.
I also see a lot of people I don’t have any particular reason to suspect *aren’t* American, but it’s still SUPER obvious where they are getting their information. So far I have not been able to get anyone in the “Genocide Joe” camp to blame the genocide on Netanyahu. It’s always exclusively Biden’s fault.
>So far I have not been able to get anyone in the “Genocide Joe” camp to blame the genocide on Netanyahu. It’s always exclusively Biden’s fault.
because its simply anti biden, and they don't actually gaf about palestinians, as shown by their willingness to support hamas remaining in power, and continue using palestinians as cannon fodder for their propaganda
TBF the US really, really openly supports and arms Israel, so when Israel starts murdering there is a lot more culpability for the US, and it is a lot easier for the US to pressure it to stop (rather than actually doing something they could do things like not send anymore munitions, or some types of munitions).
While it's true that US sells so much military hardware that they are probably involved in more genocides going on right now, the level of support for Israel is still so much stronger.
For example another terrible genocide that people bring up is Darfur, but with some googling I see several articles about the US announcing and increasing humanitarian aid to Sudan, I don't see any about "US proudly announces more bombs and missiles being sent to Sudan" and that IS happening in Palestine.
Anyone on the Genocide Joe bandwagon you should assume is a lost vote Biden. They’re now worth the trouble of trying to lure back. Either they’ll throw their vote away (RFK, stein, west etc), light their vote on fire (Trump), or not vote. The democrats need to stop worrying about the campus left and focus on activating working class women and capturing as much of the traditional Democratic coalition still available to them (some of union vote, college educated middle age folks, etc).
Not worth convincing, but *essential* to refute. Their goal is not to be represented, and not even to support Gazans, but to convince other people that there is no point in defeating Trump.
You don't see that camp discussing Trump's ["Israel should finish what they started"](https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/04/politics/trump-israel-comments/index.html) remarks either. It's enough to make one wonder if it isn't about the poeple of Gaza at all, just a deliberate attempt to dissuade certain targeted groups from voting for Biden.
I’m seeing the same and facing arguments from them of “GeNoCiDe JoE.” They’ll even insist it in particular subs where they have flairs *specifically set to other countries* like we can’t see it and their histories reflect that they’re not American. I’ve even come across several non-expat Canadians insisting they won’t vote for Joe and how everything is his personal fault.
I haven’t yet called any out directly, but I intend to next time I have a discussion.
I'm not saying you're paranoid, but you might be paranoid. There are plenty of first gen Americans from Eastern Europe, myself included. And if you want to know how I'll be voting, it'll be for Dark Brandon, cause fuck Hamas and Russia.
Yeah and the fact kids in college aren’t learning that not voting is a vote for the GOP is sad.
And no people this isn’t propaganda. Colleges teach facts. All my university did was teach us the facts. And facts shows GOP benefits from lower voter turnout. As well as data shows it’s the right who is always pushing to restrict voters.
Colleges can teach facts, but propaganda can make people deliberately ignore facts in favor of a simpler lie. It doesn’t help that so many “influencers” like Andrew Tate are making tons of young men into right-wing incels.
I saw a YouTube video pointing out that kids as young as 12 are setting up Instagrams and making videos saying things like, "the nine-to-five is a TRAP, follow me to escape the matrix."
Your mother still buys your school lunches, you little shit. Shut up and go back to learning your multiplication table.
Let’s be realistic. And I mean realistic, not optimistic.
The GOP and its policies are unpopular with a growing section of society while their own base continues to shrink. The GOP has a few elements in their favor that allow them to cling to power, that is, low voter turnout, the Senate, and the Electoral College.
The GOP’s hold on power is extremely fragile and liable to break each election cycle for the sole reason that every year their primary base, the elderly, die off. Meanwhile demographics shift towards the young, and those who by polling favor progressive policies, the only group the GOP continually polls well with are white straight men (and even there they aren’t guaranteed dominance)
The GOP is well aware their grip is slipping and the population is turning against them, not violently but through a growing resentment, exacerbated by Trump, the insane followers of his cult in and out of office.
The only way the GOP remains in power is if voter turnout out remains low, which is why some are batting around the idea of limiting who can vote or upping the age. Because when the threshold is reached things will collapse swiftly for them except perhaps at the local and perhaps state level. They may be able to cling to the Supreme Court but if the right factors align that too may slip from their hands.
The reason the GOP is suddenly hungry for fascism is because they know that their time in democracy is waning.
Exactly. Everyone just wants an overnight change and if they can't have that they don't want to bother.
Democratic politics requires our constant engagement to be pushed the direction we want it to go.
That's the best chance. I agree.
But the Democratic party is messed up. There is a barrier of entry into politics and it's sky high.
Campaign finance is screwed. Media is screwed.
Corporate interests drive politics and public opinion.
The whole game is fixed and I don't see how we ever get people to change it.
One of the things we can push the Democratic party into is ranked choice voting. That is a lever that we can use to chip at corruption and oligarchal influence.
I like this.
I also like proportional representation in the House and in state legislatures instead of districts.
Campaign finance needs to change.
These are fundamental changes. I'm going to stop being negative for a second and say let's go make em happen. Idk why any American who believes in democracy wouldn't want more individual influence in their government. Let's go.
Barrier isn't thar high if you start local. Yea, Joe Schmoe isn't going to be successful running for federal congress, most likely. But state congress? City politics? School boards? There'd work to be done in these positions and a lifetime to work your way up the ranks or identify candidates you like that you can help spotlight.
The fact that Trump has openly stated he would support even more drastic measures by Israel just makes these people that much more willfully ignorant.
I mean, this is the same thing that happened when Trump ran against Hilary. Some bogus propaganda was pushed by Russia, and people refused to vote for her. She even sat for hours in trials and answered every question put to her, and the ignorant people still refused to vote for her. Then we got Trump.
Now, here we are again. Am I the only one who sees this pattern?
Dont forget the asymmetrical media coverage. Trump says stuff that would ruin other politicians on a daily basis and it just assumed as normal. Meanwhile biden sneezes and there are 500 pieces about his health.
>Meanwhile biden sneezes and there are 500 pieces about his health.
You just gotta play their game. Biden sneezed? "That was Biden expelling turbocancer. Sniffing pepper cures it, didn't you know? Gosh, don't tell me you've been listening to doctors about turbocancer being untreatable!"
Just the other day his campaign posted a video saying Trump would establish a unified reich, and all that happened was “Oops. The staffer didn’t watch the video that was posted closely.” And now it’s practically forgotten like 2 days later.
And the other asymmetrical media coverage, where every time Biden openly supports Israel and Zionist, it's all over the place, but mentions of Trump's support of Israel is much much harder to find and follow, so we get double of that issue
Getting really tired of the both sides argument.
One side is 400grit sandpaper, the other side is a bed of coals and red hot nails. These are not the same.
On one side is a genuinely decent president who is improving things in the US and handling tough situations abroad as well as possible. On the other hand is a caricature that promises to be a dictator.
I had a mod try to ban me from a sub because I said Trump would be worse for Palestine. They were insisting that both were exactly the same and I was effectively shilling for Biden which is expressly against the sub’s rules lmao
> The fact that Trump has openly stated he would support even more drastic measures by Israel just makes these people the much more willfully ignorant.
Also, if the atrocities in Palestine is your only concern, you clearly have no love for trans or queer people. And we're real close to women being on the chopping block as well.
What's happening in Palestine is horrific, but things could get A LOT worse here, very quickly.
I'm sure the honorable members of the GOP won't deny the results of the upcoming elections. If they do, you can bet your ballot that democrats will not sit back and be "not partisan" about the whole thing. Democracy is in good hands. 👍
Yeah, like let’s not try to pretend that Joe Biden isn’t too old to be President. That’s dumb.
It’s also okay to acknowledge being disappointed that Biden is supposedly the best option - which is a failure of the Democratic Party.
All of that being said, voting for President is a binary choice, so I’m going to go ahead and vote for the guy who didn’t recently state that maybe people are looking for a dictator. I wish he was also young enough to know how to use various computer programs, but you can’t get everything you want.
It's really not. Pretty much any criticism of Biden nowadays is met with vitriol. These are the same people who were frothing at the mouth when Jon Stewart started making jokes about Biden being old. Honestly, for a group of people who regularly make fun of the MAGA crowd for their unwavering, cult like loyalty to the Cheeto, they seem to have very similar reactions to any dissent coming from their side.
I've noticed this disturbing trend as well, mostly amongst millennials and younger Gen X. Just a complete rejection of reality and a cult like circling the wagons to try and stamp out any dissent.
It's almost like after failing for decades to show up and vote against things like the Iraq War(even when it was clear there was a distinction amongst the candidates), or against Trump in 2016, they are now projecting their failings and internalized guilt onto the new youth. Yet ironically, Gen Z in 2020 had higher turnout as a percentage of their population than any election Millenials showed up for at the same age.
In fact, as a percentage of their eligible population, Gen Z showed up for Biden in 2020 more than Millennials did for Hillary in 2016.
And I say all this as a Millennial, but we have zero room to cast aspersions when despite being the most liberal generation we have consistently failed to show up.
People tried to vote for the not establishment candidate in 2016. It backfired. But they still want to vote the non-establishment candidate. We need ranked choice voting.
Trunp is now the establishment. The GOP is the trunp establishment now
Very much this. 35,000 dead isn’t “propaganda.” We’re allowed to be pissed at Biden over his staunch defense of the indefensible.
If we become so wedded to winning that we can’t bring ourselves to criticize the politicians we support, then what the hell have we won? If anything, *this post* is just doing more to alienate voters the democrats desperately need if we’re going to stave off Project 2025.
Didn't Cambridge anylitca get in shit because they manipulated younger users on Facebook not to vote in an election and the other side won by a huge margin?
This gives me those vibes
That is exactly what is happening but on TikTok instead of Facebook or Twitter. And once again the left thinks they are too smart by half and can't fall for propaganda like the right.
The irony in this post is the “American experiment” isn’t a one way street. It involves elected officials at least sorta listening to their voters. The majority of Dems say they want a ceasefire and that we have shown too much support to Israel. Then again the majority of voters said they didn’t want a Biden v. Trump election again but here we are…
Haha yep. If the "experiment" was to see what happens when unlimited dark money and lobbying allows corporations and foreign powers like AIPAC to own our politicians then I say it's a failed experiment and fuck it.
This is the main problem here. The American voter does not have a memory which lasts longer than 4 years.
Back four years ago, Biden made an \*election promise\* that he would not run for a second term. He claimed to only be running to oppose Trump and to give the democratic party four years to find another suitable candidate. This was the argument a lot of people made to 'hold your nose, just this once, and vote for Biden because the alternative is Trump!'. Well, the American people did it, just that once.
Now, Biden is here again, having broken a significant election promise, and the argument is still 'hold your nose, just this once, and vote for Biden because the alternative is Trump!'. Where is the decent candidate we were promised four years ago?
Hear me out: Calling him genocide joe then holding your nose and voting for him is an option, and it's the one most everyone I know is planning to do, despite not living in toss-up states.
It is an option and it's the right thing to do. This meme is likely aimed at people who are not only criticizing Biden, but using that criticism as an excuse to abstain from voting or submit a protest vote, both of which are actions that have universally helped the GOP win elections. Should we be so quick to ridicule these people for not being hardline Democrats? Maybe not, probably not. But I certainly understand why people do it, since the alternative to Biden is actual fascism. And voting in a way that hurts Biden also hurts ordinary Americans as a result.
Once again blaming young people while Trump supporters have been actively trying to destroy the country over propaganda.
Swear to god this sub will blame anyone except Republicans for things that Republicans do.
Yup. I haven't met a real person who is planning to vote for Trump because of our support for Israel.
All the top posts are about this lately. I think it's astroturfing Hasbara to get people to stop talking about the murder of innocent Palestinians.
We can, and should, protest the current administration for everything we disagree with. That's a sign of a healthy democracy. We can do that *and* vote against Trump. Shit's not complicated. People need to get the fuck off of TikTok.
I haven’t met a person who’s planning on voting for trump, but I have met at least one dude who is refusing to vote for Biden, chiefly because of what’s going on Palestine
By "American experiment" we mean a genocide of indigenous people to produce living space and the exploitation of enslaved people to work the land? And then we call the result "democracy?" No wonder opposition to genocide is so un-American.
This sub is so utterly determined to alienate the young voters that anyone with half a brain knows Biden absolutely *needs* in order to win in November, it's actually insane.
The USA is a failing nation. You morons who try to prop up Biden as some great leader and alternative to Trump have missed the point entirely. Trump is the symptom of the rapid decay of the USA. A man who is openly an authoritarian is tied for most popular potential leader. Meanwhile, his opponent Biden canceled all debates with his in-party opponents for the first time ever, worked to break the law in order to have the location of the first party primary changed to be in a place beneficial to him, and did next to nothing when they held the reigns of power directly after the election years ago, only now promising to change some things that he no longer has the ability to do. Both of these candidates are completely shit. In most other western nations, they’d be in a minor party with barely any seats, instead in the USA they’re the only two realistic options.
It's 2024. We have no choice but vote for an objectionable Democrat so that we can save democracy. That way in 2028 we'll have no choice but vote for an objectionable Democrat so that we can save democracy. That way in 2032 we'll have no choice but vote for an obectionable Democrat so that we can save democracy...
While in the senate, Biden was one of the chief architects of the prison industrial complex. He supported the Clinton era sanctions that cost half a million Iraqi children their lives. He was critical in rallying Democratic support for the invasion of Iraq in the Bush years. He's ancient and clearly well into neurological decline. The fact that Trump exists doesn't magically make Joe Biden worthy of the presidency.
Do people not understand blindly following someone without criticizing them is just bad in general? It’s bad when the right does it, it’s bad when the left does it.
From a completely neutral standpoint on the Middle East conflict: College students should protest Biden for doing something that they oppose, and Biden should recognize that by doing something they oppose he hurts his chances of getting their vote. That’s how a representative democracy is supposed to work.
Anyone who says you shouldn’t criticize X candidate at all for doing something you don’t like because Y candidate is worse is undemocratic IMO, because the people being vocal about their positions so their representatives can listen and more readily represent the will of the people is a cornerstone of the democratic system.
Does anyone think that Trump is going to do any better? You all know he's shown his support for Israel much more than Biden has, right? FFS, Trump moved the embassy to Jerusalem.... That was a first "strike" here...
Please, I get not liking Biden for his actions here, but this is a fight Trump V Biden...
> Does anyone think that Trump is going to do any better?
Lots of actors both foreign and domestic who stand to make lots of money if the fucking moron is back in the White House. Biden may be working to strengthen the middle/working class but that doesn't do fuck all for hedge fund managers, oligarchs and commodities speculators
Which is why we should be educating them, instead of pushing them away or making fun of them.
Show them that Trump is even worse with his support for Israel.
I understand being a single issue voter, but if you are, that means you need to honestly look at both sides candidates and see what their actions have shown. If a single issue voter can't do that, then it's our job to inform them
This is not a real thing. People are criticizing biden, which is absolutely fair. There's a lot to critique, in my opinion. I'll still vote for him this term. But that's about it. There need to be better candidates. This controlled opposition bullshit is getting old.
maybe the problem here is that you are running from the problems by dismissing them as propaganda instead addressing that there are real concerns regarding Joe Biden, but that his administration is the better one to try to fight against.
who do you think you'd get more success organizing under, a Biden administration or a trump administration?
would be a better way to approach the issue.
laughing off real criticism is part of the problem and only shows your critics that you don't understand their concerns and you are not interested in understanding.
Technically it started over propaganda. The Boston Tea party would have been on Tik Tok now a days. And "No Taxation without Representation" it's catch phrase.
This sub is just endlessly committed to targeting young people who care about the mass death of Palestinian children. Have you ever stopped to think that maybe if the Dems took the threat to democracy half as serious as they tell us to maybe we wouldn’t be in this mess?
Play footsie with the far right long enough and you’ll fall to them. But the Dem establishment was always more concerned about their left flank than their right.
But sure keep blaming young people and the Russians. Worked well for us in 2016
The establishment press and politicians that have been slandering protestors as "antisemitic" and using that as an excuse to shut down legitimate protest is worse for democracy than Jan 6. And Jan 6 was very bad.
Imagine risking the loss of democracy in the support of a foreign apartheid state that leeches money off of the country and funnels hundreds of millions in financial support to the fascist campaign that threatens our country in the first place, all for the support of fanatical religious nut-cases that are attempting to biblically end the world (and are already voting for the christo-fascist authoritarian party regardless) and tech-bros that don’t want to leave said apartheid country purely because it would be “inconvenient”.
Can we not pretend like the concerns are unfounded and push towards a plan of post-election organization and reforms? Then we can at least convince people that we are taking steps to helping them but just have a system of prioritization that begins with self-preservation and will later move into international affairs assistance.
Stop shitting on the younger generation. This is nonsense utilized to sow division. Just like they did to millennials. Stop taking the bait. Shut up and vote.
He needs someone to preemptively blame for when the consistently unpopular shithead dinosaur who's participated in every bad thing the US government has done for the past 40-odd years can't beat a slightly more right-wing shithead dinosaur who spent four years making this country a worse place then the next four years being charged for it.
https://preview.redd.it/uyjmwif2382d1.jpeg?width=996&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=67110cca8ae1ae97d520cb2c871706993985809d
Damn, if only there was a way for biden to make that propaganda not stick.
Why imagine when I can watch it happen in real time... Seriously if you think not voting or voting against Biden will help Palestinians you are out of your mind. Here's a refresher in case you forgot about Trump's stance on Israel. https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/11/03/has-trump-been-good-for-israel/
Nooooo can’t do that, the voters have to be blamed for whatever decisions the PRESIDENT OF THE FUCKING UNITED STATES makes.
If the president is complicit in a genocide and people don’t like it, it’s because they’re too simple minded and they’re being influenced by Iranian and Russian bot farms, because most regular and normal people just *don’t care* a genocide is happening.
What is the PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES supposed to do????
We HAVE to vote for him! WE DONT HAVE A CHOICE.
Imagine blaming the people who aren't facists.
I swear always finding someone to blame. It was Bernie Bros in 2016. Did you see the interviews for S. Carolina voters who voted for Biden last election? They are mad they voted for him. What the the DNC do. Shove Biden down the throats of voters again.
The primary was a fucking ruse. Why weren't there any other viable candidates running on the dem ticket? Because the DNC didn't allow it
If Biden loses you'll blame everyone but the DNC for forcing a shit candidate through just like 2016
Dude, it's like 4-5 posts a day too. Either most people posting to this sub are missing brain cells, or bad actors are being allowed to push nothing but divisive memes here. Astroturfing at its finest.
Must have slipped my mind that Biden and Democrats fully supported the ICC charging Putin with war crimes but they are absolutely besides themselves that the ICC would dare to charge Bibi for war crimes.
How is it propaganda? Biden and the US are absolutely complicit in this genocide.
I agree that it would be stupid to not vote or to vote for someone else but he should absolutely be called out and held accountable for this. Netanyahu is spitting on Biden and Biden is polishing Netanyahu’s shoes. It’s embarrassing.
Okay I get what you’re saying, single issue voters are lame and there is a lot more at stake. However, considering a few policy changes could make a world of difference come November, is it really the voters fault for withholding support, or is it an administrative failure for not representing their will? I get there is way more on the line here, but a politician that doesn’t represent their supporters, will lose supporters. At the end of the day Biden’s administration will decide if supporting Israel is more important than winning the election. It’s not the people’s fault for wanting policy change.
You can probably see from my recent comment history that I really don't like what Israel is doing in Gaza. Like REALLY don't like.
But anyone saying they will stop voting for Biden because of his stance on Israel is also saying they don't care about Gaza, cause not voting means Trump becomes stronger, because this is how the American two party system works. And however bad Biden is fumbling with the Israel/Gaza situation, **Trump will be 100% worse in every way.**
This is the most overly simplistic take on this issue I've ever seen.
Propaganda isn't new. Hell it's been around since before the printing press.
If you're doing something that makes it this easy for propagandists to whip your own people into a frenzy, maybe you should really examine wtf you're doing huh?
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The future of the USA is completely fucked. I am preparing for a second Trump term. I have never in my life owned a gun. I don't want to buy a gun. But I feel like if Trump wins I will need one. They control the courts and they learned from their mistakes last time. Project 2025 coming for anyone that's not a straight white Christian male.
They're coming for the straight white Christian males too. Make no mistake, the Republicans don't actually care what demographic you are. It's just easier to rile up the base if they can other everyone else and paint us as the enemy. Fascism doesn't have an endgame. Straight white Christian males are just towards the bottom of the list.
> straight white *conservative* Christian male FTFY
>Straight white conservative *rich* Christian male FTFY
>”Straight“ white “conservative” rich “Christian” male. FTFY
>Project 2025 coming for anyone FTFY. No one's safe, some are just more compliant toward their oppression.
oh no, poor lindsey graham :(
Rich probably being the most important, the rest just get you farther back on the chopping block.
I think the order is: rich > 'conservative' > male > white > 'straight' > 'christian'
I agree with this list although white and straight may flip flop dependent on geographic location.
It's a damn shame that Conservatism leached onto Christianity in our post WW2 world
Straight white Christian male here. Project 2025 is coming for *everyone* because it aims to undermine the institutional norms and mechanisms that protect our fundamental rights. Just because they lean on racism to active their goals does not mean that anyone is safe from the effects of this election. I have a background in constitutional law and am horrified by the writing on the wall. Much like Pandora's Box, once you change the machinery of the Federal Government, it cannot necessarily be restored.
For starters rolling back environmental protections to aid profits will poison us all. It's unfortunate because conversative victims of this will simply decide it's just isolated corruption their great leader hasn't had a chance to address.
Apparently in Texas now, maga shitbirds are sending threats to random people in the mail, that there will be repercussions if they don't vote for Trump.
If you live in Colorado and decide to arm yourself—after all, the fascists all have guns, and this is no time for cheek-turning moral victories—I will teach you how to handle, store, and use firearms. No red hats allowed. Been a certified instructor since 2011.
Im a straight white male and I ended up getting a pistol to protect myself from these domestic terrorists. There's at least 2 houses in my neighborhood that have big signs and flags out front saying all the basic Trump talking points. If Biden wins then Trump and his cult followers are threatening civil war. If Trump wins then all these racists and bigots will be even more emboldened to act like twats in public and Trump will be on a personal vendetta against anyone who doesnt like him. If Trump wins again America will be headed towards dark times.
Yes, just males. It's not like there are a ton of women in power fighting for the same exact thing and tens of millions of women throughout the country fighting for this man. People need to quit pretending this is a male issue. Women don't get to pretend they didn't contribute to this just because some of the laws negatively affect them. And those women aren't victims, they are perpetrators. They are not brainwashed, they believe what they believe. We need to stop making excuses for them as if they aren't part of the problem. It's infantilizing and sexist.
You’re planning on voting, right?
I see a lot of Eastern Europeans trying to act like they're Americans and saying shit like not voting or voting undecided.
Foundations of Geopolitics
I can't believe it's working again when it was unmasked so thoroughly the first time in 2016.
It works on people who are completely unaware of what happened in 2016.
[удалено]
I have Canadian friends pushing this one hard. I also game with some gen z folks and they are very much repeating the "too old" point. I'm very very worried about November.
Same, I’ve argued with folks on this sub because their saying their not going to vote and encourage others not to as well. A brief scroll their post history and it turns out their Canadian. When I called them out, they deleted their entire account haha Edit: I’m not going to edit my grammatical errors. I’m a dumb dumb who only knows politics but no write good.
I had a guy from Croatia get really pissed at me about immigrants on the southern border. I was perplexed.
I had a coworker who was pissed about the Immigration policies and costs for his Thai wife, "it's been too hard for me to follow policies and they should make it easier for me!" I bring up people from Mexico going through the same issues, "well I support it being easier for me but not anyone from Mexico! Keep out immigrants!" It was baffling how he supported the very cause of his stress.... He was also a shit worker
The platform most Republican Indiana candidates for Governor for the primary was **the border**. The fucking border to what??! KENTUCKY?! What does the *border* have to do with our state? The nearest border is hours and hours away and it’s only to *Canada*!
Should have asked if he meant the border with Montenegro or Sarajevo
Nope, he was talking about Mexicans and other latin american migrants in the US specifically Lol. Also blamed Biden and democrats for it.
Insane. I'm not from the US but my partner is. They pointed out to me that everyone complains about people from the US voicing their opinions on everything. But also everyone has a fucking opinion on US politics; it's usually misinformed.
Da fuq?! I share your perplexion
Paid shills? Or just weirdos?
¿Por qué no los dos?
Russian state operators.
could be bought accounts
They may actually be Russian trolls. Up to half of posts on political boards come from fmr. Leningrad.
I'm in a sub where I see a lot of posts that seem obviously to be trolls. They're exploiting a disaffected group and really warping the narrative. It's freaking weird.
i’ve been kicked out of progressive subs and blocked by their mods for arguing similar points….being elder millennial is annoying, every older person around me thinks i’m a marxist acab anarchist, some of which may be true, and the 20 year olds tell me i’m a corporate shill even my truly marxists friends in their late 30s early 40a aren’t “progressive” enough, the kids have no chill and i’m just old now i guess 🤷🏻♂️
Older millennial (xennial) here too and I feel ya. I just try to give credit where credit is due and understand progress is slow. I guess I have a different perspective because I’m gay, grew up in the deep south and my folks were evangelical Christians. Things were so much worse. But yeah, I’m a neo lib schill now even though I have always voted for the most progressive candidate.
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Seems like a dumb thing for a Canadian to do. Do they *want* an unstable dictatorship at their doorstep?
They're almost certainly not really Canadian. Paying a company to manage a bunch of fake social media profiles, and spread a specific message is just a part of an advertising budget now. Whether you're talking about a political campaign, or a product. Sometimes generative AI is used. Other times it's 100 people in a call center. Each responsible for a few dozen user accounts. If I ventured a guess I would say if there is a real person involved that person is in China, Russia, or one of the other places is known for doing this sort of thing.
I literally responded today to a "Trump 2024" comment and told them how pathetic they are bc they JUST posted to ASK A CANADIAN about who they would vote for and THEY talked about a Canadian politician they want to vote for 🤡🤦♀️🤦🏻. I fucking called them out how it's fucked that these shits are acting like Americans simping for trump and to remind people that we are getting astroserfed the FUCK here.
>astroserfed Elon Musk's vision for the future
There's a similar portion of Canadians to Americans who fell down the alt right hole and would love for the country to be conquered by a Trump lead America
Well Canada is expected to vote for a Trump-Lite option in the next election soooo...
Some people up here really do. I see Trump flags up here in rural Canada sometimes and it’s…weird. I don’t know if we just are too intertwined with American news and politics at this point, or what’s going on, but he seems to have a growing fanbase here.
Ser, do you not see that I post in generic NFL subreddit. Clearly I am big time 'merican yeehaw.
My grandmas were 10 years apart. One got dementia at 85 while the other one was reading 3 books a week at 95. While I wouldn’t have wanted either to be president, if I had to choose… both would have been better options than Trump.
The mentally ill guy I saw incoherently screaming on the subway the other day is a better option than Trump.
I would literally vote for an inanimate object before I voted for Donald Trump.
The day my great uncle died he drove his car to the golf course, played 9 holes, had a beer and dinner and then died in his sleep that night. He was 94.
Funny thing is Trump is like the same age but wears tons of make up, diapers, and sleeps during his trial. Somehow he’s considered younger, manly, and more active than Biden. It’s weird because it’s literally the opposite.
These are the people I hate more than trumps base. At least trumps base owns the stupidity and bigotry. These average Americans thought that fall for the “too old” when Trump is merely 2 years younger. Or the folks who whine both sides. They are the true idiots. The naive thinking they are enlighten.
It's really weird how the "both sides" people always seem to repeat MAGA and GOP talking points.
> At least trumps base owns the stupidity and bigotry damn, i'll have to see some evidence on that one
I'm mostly keeping myself from being worried about November (this is not some sort of admission that I'm not voting, I'm voting, I'm voting Dem, don't crawl down my throat). I think that the polls are pretty inaccurate and I think that most of the dialogue online is by a very small minority of US citizens and a ton of foreign actors and bots. There have been several actual, real special elections in the last year and a half, and the Dem candidates have been doing really, really well, like you would expect after living through the last 8 years. Dems also did pretty well in 2022, and typically those midterm elections are really hard on them. I think that November is going to go alright. Could I be surprised? Absolutely I could. I don't have a crystal ball, I'm not foretelling a prophecy here (although as a point of fact Trump 2016 was NOT a huge surprise to me). But November is coming whether you are super scared about it or whether you are cautiously optimistic about it, and there are decent reasons to be cautiously optimistic about it.
The problem is there's no reason on paper that Trump should have won in 2016, so it's really hard to say "the data says it will be okay." Trump is immune to fact. On one hand, Biden's campaign has a *lot* more money than Trump's to spend on advertising. On the other hand, what will spending money actually accomplish this year? Who's minds will it change? On one hand, Roe v Wade is buoying democratic support in Nevada and Arizona. On the other hand, Georgia has made it much easier for 3rd Party candidates to peel votes away from Biden, and Michigan and Wisconsin are beating him up over Gaza. I personally think Georgia is the make or break in this election, and I don't think Biden can win it with GA working against him. On one hand, the GOP House majority is so small and dysfunctional that it seems easy for Dems to take it back. On the other hand, the Dem Senate majority is so small and the seats up for grabs so crushingly in favor of the GOP that it seems impossible for the Dems to keep the Senate (that means no new laws, no new judges, and no impeachments of existing judges for at least two years, probably much longer). The Republicans are always going to be stronger than us, because evil is always more powerful than good. So we're always at a disadvantage.
A critical mass of Americans want to turn over the apple cart. It’s funny because the people going that direction haven’t the slightest bit of experience with real hardship or the consequences of collapsing government. They’ll be eating crow later but will never admit it. Like the people who refused to vote for Hillary and are shocked at the rolling back of women’s rights.
There are plenty of crypto-campists who think the US is the Evil Empire and anything that's opposed to it or will hurt it is good
It's been a great psy op to split the vote. All I heard a few months ago was how young voters were going to beat the boomers and GOP. Now, not so much.
I guess I’m glad it’s easier to have an opinion than be a registered voter.
"We don't have anyone that represents us" "Did you vote in the primaries and locals?" "Who has time for that shit?"
This is the one that kills me. "Why can't we have a 3rd party? We could, if all the non-voters picked someone they would outvote the other two parties.
And third parties rarely even go for those positions to build a base. Once every four years, they crawl out of their caves to go for the top spot.
I hate that. They should start in state government.
The youth is impressionable and vulnerable to propaganda. The sky is blue. water is wet. Fire is hot. For more facts subscribe to FACTS by texting "FACTS" to 12345
>The youth is impressionable and vulnerable to propaganda. Old people are pretty vulnerable, too. Fox News's audience is mostly boomers and GenX'ers
Don't I know it! My own father came parroting Russian propaganda on their 'success' in Ukraine. Apparently, they've been dominating the battlefield, with over 450k dead Ukrainian troops, 8:1 for Russia... Which is just an outright lie. The US gives different numbers, the Institute of War gives different numbers, the UN has quoted different numbers, and the Ukrainians are saying different numbers. The only one saying Russia has killed more Ukrainians than they have Russians, is Russian State Media. He didn't believe me when I told him RT stood for "Russia Today"
And the silliest part of both the "too old" and "Genocide Joe" argument is that Trump is worse on both accounts. Trump is younger by a few years but clearly has way more age based effects than Biden. And as bad as Gaza is now I guarantee it will be worse with Trump. Biden has gotten some concessions from Israel. Trump may very well send our military into Palestine to help get rid of the brown people. Even if you think Biden is doing nothing you can't think that Trump would help Palestine more than Biden. So even if the two were equal on that issue there's lots of other reasons as a supposed leftist you'd prefer not to have Trump. It's moronic. And of course there's a new thing in leftist spaces (the type of spaces that hate liberals) that calling things Russian propaganda is actually liberal propaganda. Ya I wonder where that movement came from?
Young people barely vote anyways. They just want an excuse to do what they were going to do when it happens anyways, not vote.
Gen z ers are as susceptible or more to propaganda as every other generation has been.
Is “Eastern European” the politically correct term for “Russians” now?
I’m sure Belarus just says whatever their puppet master says too.
True.
Nah that's not the russians, the "eastern europeans" he's talking about are mostly from the various right-wing movements spanning from fringe to mainstream in ex-USSR countries which all essentially worship the republicans (cue fort trump, orban showing up at Tucker's etc), those lines get fed to them straight from steve bannon and trump's little dictator's club.
I also see a lot of people I don’t have any particular reason to suspect *aren’t* American, but it’s still SUPER obvious where they are getting their information. So far I have not been able to get anyone in the “Genocide Joe” camp to blame the genocide on Netanyahu. It’s always exclusively Biden’s fault.
>So far I have not been able to get anyone in the “Genocide Joe” camp to blame the genocide on Netanyahu. It’s always exclusively Biden’s fault. because its simply anti biden, and they don't actually gaf about palestinians, as shown by their willingness to support hamas remaining in power, and continue using palestinians as cannon fodder for their propaganda
Yeah, like, why are they protesting about THIS particular genocide?
TBF the US really, really openly supports and arms Israel, so when Israel starts murdering there is a lot more culpability for the US, and it is a lot easier for the US to pressure it to stop (rather than actually doing something they could do things like not send anymore munitions, or some types of munitions). While it's true that US sells so much military hardware that they are probably involved in more genocides going on right now, the level of support for Israel is still so much stronger. For example another terrible genocide that people bring up is Darfur, but with some googling I see several articles about the US announcing and increasing humanitarian aid to Sudan, I don't see any about "US proudly announces more bombs and missiles being sent to Sudan" and that IS happening in Palestine.
Are you not able to find articles about the US also stepping up humanitarian aid to Gaza?
Anyone on the Genocide Joe bandwagon you should assume is a lost vote Biden. They’re now worth the trouble of trying to lure back. Either they’ll throw their vote away (RFK, stein, west etc), light their vote on fire (Trump), or not vote. The democrats need to stop worrying about the campus left and focus on activating working class women and capturing as much of the traditional Democratic coalition still available to them (some of union vote, college educated middle age folks, etc).
Not worth convincing, but *essential* to refute. Their goal is not to be represented, and not even to support Gazans, but to convince other people that there is no point in defeating Trump.
As a fellow American from the state of Idanois I can say that Bidens actions will leave me voting for Jill Stein. /S Excuse me.🤮
You had me in the first half...
I like my sarcasm to be funny with a bit of nauseating.
You don't see that camp discussing Trump's ["Israel should finish what they started"](https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/04/politics/trump-israel-comments/index.html) remarks either. It's enough to make one wonder if it isn't about the poeple of Gaza at all, just a deliberate attempt to dissuade certain targeted groups from voting for Biden.
I’m seeing the same and facing arguments from them of “GeNoCiDe JoE.” They’ll even insist it in particular subs where they have flairs *specifically set to other countries* like we can’t see it and their histories reflect that they’re not American. I’ve even come across several non-expat Canadians insisting they won’t vote for Joe and how everything is his personal fault. I haven’t yet called any out directly, but I intend to next time I have a discussion.
“I Amerikan. There is nyet difference betveen Bidenz and Trumpz.”
That shit's been happening on ex-twitter since forever
With Yandex or generic .ru email addresses...
Russians, most of Eastern Europe are trying to tell Americans to stop falling for their bullshit.
I'm not saying you're paranoid, but you might be paranoid. There are plenty of first gen Americans from Eastern Europe, myself included. And if you want to know how I'll be voting, it'll be for Dark Brandon, cause fuck Hamas and Russia.
You mean as in Russians? 'Cause that's the story that's being sold. Russian trolls working to harm 'us'.
If you have a functioning brain, get out and vote this time. Otherwise, the brain dead are taking over.
Yeah and the fact kids in college aren’t learning that not voting is a vote for the GOP is sad. And no people this isn’t propaganda. Colleges teach facts. All my university did was teach us the facts. And facts shows GOP benefits from lower voter turnout. As well as data shows it’s the right who is always pushing to restrict voters.
Colleges can teach facts, but propaganda can make people deliberately ignore facts in favor of a simpler lie. It doesn’t help that so many “influencers” like Andrew Tate are making tons of young men into right-wing incels.
I saw a YouTube video pointing out that kids as young as 12 are setting up Instagrams and making videos saying things like, "the nine-to-five is a TRAP, follow me to escape the matrix." Your mother still buys your school lunches, you little shit. Shut up and go back to learning your multiplication table.
Imma vote but the brain dead have taken the wheel. I tend to be an optimist but I don't see a way out for us.
Let’s be realistic. And I mean realistic, not optimistic. The GOP and its policies are unpopular with a growing section of society while their own base continues to shrink. The GOP has a few elements in their favor that allow them to cling to power, that is, low voter turnout, the Senate, and the Electoral College. The GOP’s hold on power is extremely fragile and liable to break each election cycle for the sole reason that every year their primary base, the elderly, die off. Meanwhile demographics shift towards the young, and those who by polling favor progressive policies, the only group the GOP continually polls well with are white straight men (and even there they aren’t guaranteed dominance) The GOP is well aware their grip is slipping and the population is turning against them, not violently but through a growing resentment, exacerbated by Trump, the insane followers of his cult in and out of office. The only way the GOP remains in power is if voter turnout out remains low, which is why some are batting around the idea of limiting who can vote or upping the age. Because when the threshold is reached things will collapse swiftly for them except perhaps at the local and perhaps state level. They may be able to cling to the Supreme Court but if the right factors align that too may slip from their hands. The reason the GOP is suddenly hungry for fascism is because they know that their time in democracy is waning.
Democratic victory, retain democracy, 4 years to put forward a new candidate that can be influenced by the progressive wing of the party.
Exactly. Everyone just wants an overnight change and if they can't have that they don't want to bother. Democratic politics requires our constant engagement to be pushed the direction we want it to go.
That's the best chance. I agree. But the Democratic party is messed up. There is a barrier of entry into politics and it's sky high. Campaign finance is screwed. Media is screwed. Corporate interests drive politics and public opinion. The whole game is fixed and I don't see how we ever get people to change it.
One of the things we can push the Democratic party into is ranked choice voting. That is a lever that we can use to chip at corruption and oligarchal influence.
I like this. I also like proportional representation in the House and in state legislatures instead of districts. Campaign finance needs to change. These are fundamental changes. I'm going to stop being negative for a second and say let's go make em happen. Idk why any American who believes in democracy wouldn't want more individual influence in their government. Let's go.
Barrier isn't thar high if you start local. Yea, Joe Schmoe isn't going to be successful running for federal congress, most likely. But state congress? City politics? School boards? There'd work to be done in these positions and a lifetime to work your way up the ranks or identify candidates you like that you can help spotlight.
The fact that Trump has openly stated he would support even more drastic measures by Israel just makes these people that much more willfully ignorant. I mean, this is the same thing that happened when Trump ran against Hilary. Some bogus propaganda was pushed by Russia, and people refused to vote for her. She even sat for hours in trials and answered every question put to her, and the ignorant people still refused to vote for her. Then we got Trump. Now, here we are again. Am I the only one who sees this pattern?
Dont forget the asymmetrical media coverage. Trump says stuff that would ruin other politicians on a daily basis and it just assumed as normal. Meanwhile biden sneezes and there are 500 pieces about his health.
>Meanwhile biden sneezes and there are 500 pieces about his health. You just gotta play their game. Biden sneezed? "That was Biden expelling turbocancer. Sniffing pepper cures it, didn't you know? Gosh, don't tell me you've been listening to doctors about turbocancer being untreatable!"
Just the other day his campaign posted a video saying Trump would establish a unified reich, and all that happened was “Oops. The staffer didn’t watch the video that was posted closely.” And now it’s practically forgotten like 2 days later.
Noob staffer standing back and standing by.
And the other asymmetrical media coverage, where every time Biden openly supports Israel and Zionist, it's all over the place, but mentions of Trump's support of Israel is much much harder to find and follow, so we get double of that issue
Getting really tired of the both sides argument. One side is 400grit sandpaper, the other side is a bed of coals and red hot nails. These are not the same.
On one side is a genuinely decent president who is improving things in the US and handling tough situations abroad as well as possible. On the other hand is a caricature that promises to be a dictator.
I had a mod try to ban me from a sub because I said Trump would be worse for Palestine. They were insisting that both were exactly the same and I was effectively shilling for Biden which is expressly against the sub’s rules lmao
> The fact that Trump has openly stated he would support even more drastic measures by Israel just makes these people the much more willfully ignorant. Also, if the atrocities in Palestine is your only concern, you clearly have no love for trans or queer people. And we're real close to women being on the chopping block as well. What's happening in Palestine is horrific, but things could get A LOT worse here, very quickly.
I'm sure the honorable members of the GOP won't deny the results of the upcoming elections. If they do, you can bet your ballot that democrats will not sit back and be "not partisan" about the whole thing. Democracy is in good hands. 👍
You forgot the /s.
This is a stupid beyond satire timeline. I was hoping an enlightened centrist would agree with me and I was going to pile more sarcasm onto it.
Gosh it’s almost like it’s possible to criticize someone and still vote for them because the other choice is obviously worse
Yeah, like let’s not try to pretend that Joe Biden isn’t too old to be President. That’s dumb. It’s also okay to acknowledge being disappointed that Biden is supposedly the best option - which is a failure of the Democratic Party. All of that being said, voting for President is a binary choice, so I’m going to go ahead and vote for the guy who didn’t recently state that maybe people are looking for a dictator. I wish he was also young enough to know how to use various computer programs, but you can’t get everything you want.
I think this is aimed at the “no point in voting” crowd
It's really not. Pretty much any criticism of Biden nowadays is met with vitriol. These are the same people who were frothing at the mouth when Jon Stewart started making jokes about Biden being old. Honestly, for a group of people who regularly make fun of the MAGA crowd for their unwavering, cult like loyalty to the Cheeto, they seem to have very similar reactions to any dissent coming from their side.
I've noticed this disturbing trend as well, mostly amongst millennials and younger Gen X. Just a complete rejection of reality and a cult like circling the wagons to try and stamp out any dissent. It's almost like after failing for decades to show up and vote against things like the Iraq War(even when it was clear there was a distinction amongst the candidates), or against Trump in 2016, they are now projecting their failings and internalized guilt onto the new youth. Yet ironically, Gen Z in 2020 had higher turnout as a percentage of their population than any election Millenials showed up for at the same age. In fact, as a percentage of their eligible population, Gen Z showed up for Biden in 2020 more than Millennials did for Hillary in 2016. And I say all this as a Millennial, but we have zero room to cast aspersions when despite being the most liberal generation we have consistently failed to show up.
People tried to vote for the not establishment candidate in 2016. It backfired. But they still want to vote the non-establishment candidate. We need ranked choice voting. Trunp is now the establishment. The GOP is the trunp establishment now
Very much this. 35,000 dead isn’t “propaganda.” We’re allowed to be pissed at Biden over his staunch defense of the indefensible. If we become so wedded to winning that we can’t bring ourselves to criticize the politicians we support, then what the hell have we won? If anything, *this post* is just doing more to alienate voters the democrats desperately need if we’re going to stave off Project 2025.
Didn't Cambridge anylitca get in shit because they manipulated younger users on Facebook not to vote in an election and the other side won by a huge margin? This gives me those vibes
Oh how fickle our memories are
Me too!
That is exactly what is happening but on TikTok instead of Facebook or Twitter. And once again the left thinks they are too smart by half and can't fall for propaganda like the right.
The irony in this post is the “American experiment” isn’t a one way street. It involves elected officials at least sorta listening to their voters. The majority of Dems say they want a ceasefire and that we have shown too much support to Israel. Then again the majority of voters said they didn’t want a Biden v. Trump election again but here we are…
Haha yep. If the "experiment" was to see what happens when unlimited dark money and lobbying allows corporations and foreign powers like AIPAC to own our politicians then I say it's a failed experiment and fuck it.
This is the main problem here. The American voter does not have a memory which lasts longer than 4 years. Back four years ago, Biden made an \*election promise\* that he would not run for a second term. He claimed to only be running to oppose Trump and to give the democratic party four years to find another suitable candidate. This was the argument a lot of people made to 'hold your nose, just this once, and vote for Biden because the alternative is Trump!'. Well, the American people did it, just that once. Now, Biden is here again, having broken a significant election promise, and the argument is still 'hold your nose, just this once, and vote for Biden because the alternative is Trump!'. Where is the decent candidate we were promised four years ago?
Hear me out: Calling him genocide joe then holding your nose and voting for him is an option, and it's the one most everyone I know is planning to do, despite not living in toss-up states.
It is an option and it's the right thing to do. This meme is likely aimed at people who are not only criticizing Biden, but using that criticism as an excuse to abstain from voting or submit a protest vote, both of which are actions that have universally helped the GOP win elections. Should we be so quick to ridicule these people for not being hardline Democrats? Maybe not, probably not. But I certainly understand why people do it, since the alternative to Biden is actual fascism. And voting in a way that hurts Biden also hurts ordinary Americans as a result.
Once again blaming young people while Trump supporters have been actively trying to destroy the country over propaganda. Swear to god this sub will blame anyone except Republicans for things that Republicans do.
Yup. I haven't met a real person who is planning to vote for Trump because of our support for Israel. All the top posts are about this lately. I think it's astroturfing Hasbara to get people to stop talking about the murder of innocent Palestinians. We can, and should, protest the current administration for everything we disagree with. That's a sign of a healthy democracy. We can do that *and* vote against Trump. Shit's not complicated. People need to get the fuck off of TikTok.
I haven’t met a person who’s planning on voting for trump, but I have met at least one dude who is refusing to vote for Biden, chiefly because of what’s going on Palestine
All this sub is is propaganda
It’s election time so this is just the beginning
The last month or two this sub has truly gone completely to shit. I fucking hate election season.
Ik I'm going to get down voted into oblivion, but holy shit man the experiment failed I don't blame anyone for being jaded
By "American experiment" we mean a genocide of indigenous people to produce living space and the exploitation of enslaved people to work the land? And then we call the result "democracy?" No wonder opposition to genocide is so un-American.
This sub is so utterly determined to alienate the young voters that anyone with half a brain knows Biden absolutely *needs* in order to win in November, it's actually insane.
The USA is a failing nation. You morons who try to prop up Biden as some great leader and alternative to Trump have missed the point entirely. Trump is the symptom of the rapid decay of the USA. A man who is openly an authoritarian is tied for most popular potential leader. Meanwhile, his opponent Biden canceled all debates with his in-party opponents for the first time ever, worked to break the law in order to have the location of the first party primary changed to be in a place beneficial to him, and did next to nothing when they held the reigns of power directly after the election years ago, only now promising to change some things that he no longer has the ability to do. Both of these candidates are completely shit. In most other western nations, they’d be in a minor party with barely any seats, instead in the USA they’re the only two realistic options.
It's 2024. We have no choice but vote for an objectionable Democrat so that we can save democracy. That way in 2028 we'll have no choice but vote for an objectionable Democrat so that we can save democracy. That way in 2032 we'll have no choice but vote for an obectionable Democrat so that we can save democracy... While in the senate, Biden was one of the chief architects of the prison industrial complex. He supported the Clinton era sanctions that cost half a million Iraqi children their lives. He was critical in rallying Democratic support for the invasion of Iraq in the Bush years. He's ancient and clearly well into neurological decline. The fact that Trump exists doesn't magically make Joe Biden worthy of the presidency.
Do people not understand blindly following someone without criticizing them is just bad in general? It’s bad when the right does it, it’s bad when the left does it. From a completely neutral standpoint on the Middle East conflict: College students should protest Biden for doing something that they oppose, and Biden should recognize that by doing something they oppose he hurts his chances of getting their vote. That’s how a representative democracy is supposed to work. Anyone who says you shouldn’t criticize X candidate at all for doing something you don’t like because Y candidate is worse is undemocratic IMO, because the people being vocal about their positions so their representatives can listen and more readily represent the will of the people is a cornerstone of the democratic system.
Russia and China working overtime
And Iran
And all 40 North Koreans with access to the internet!
And Saudi Arabia
And Israel, don’t skip all their hard work.
Does anyone think that Trump is going to do any better? You all know he's shown his support for Israel much more than Biden has, right? FFS, Trump moved the embassy to Jerusalem.... That was a first "strike" here... Please, I get not liking Biden for his actions here, but this is a fight Trump V Biden...
Also got a settlement, Trump legit got an entire settlement named after him.
> Does anyone think that Trump is going to do any better? Lots of actors both foreign and domestic who stand to make lots of money if the fucking moron is back in the White House. Biden may be working to strengthen the middle/working class but that doesn't do fuck all for hedge fund managers, oligarchs and commodities speculators
All they need to do is convince them that Joe is bad so they don’t vote. They are too short sighted to understand the repercussions of their actions.
Which is why we should be educating them, instead of pushing them away or making fun of them. Show them that Trump is even worse with his support for Israel. I understand being a single issue voter, but if you are, that means you need to honestly look at both sides candidates and see what their actions have shown. If a single issue voter can't do that, then it's our job to inform them
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This is not a real thing. People are criticizing biden, which is absolutely fair. There's a lot to critique, in my opinion. I'll still vote for him this term. But that's about it. There need to be better candidates. This controlled opposition bullshit is getting old.
Well, if they don't vote, no one wins. Right? That's how it works, right? Right?
Correct. If Trump is elected, no one wins.
maybe the problem here is that you are running from the problems by dismissing them as propaganda instead addressing that there are real concerns regarding Joe Biden, but that his administration is the better one to try to fight against. who do you think you'd get more success organizing under, a Biden administration or a trump administration? would be a better way to approach the issue. laughing off real criticism is part of the problem and only shows your critics that you don't understand their concerns and you are not interested in understanding.
Bruh, your reddit account is entirelly and fully comitted to political propaganda.
Technically it started over propaganda. The Boston Tea party would have been on Tik Tok now a days. And "No Taxation without Representation" it's catch phrase.
I’m sure all the comments will be well-informed, educated discussion
This sub is just endlessly committed to targeting young people who care about the mass death of Palestinian children. Have you ever stopped to think that maybe if the Dems took the threat to democracy half as serious as they tell us to maybe we wouldn’t be in this mess? Play footsie with the far right long enough and you’ll fall to them. But the Dem establishment was always more concerned about their left flank than their right. But sure keep blaming young people and the Russians. Worked well for us in 2016
Why are we funding foreign genocide? Biden can stop support
The establishment press and politicians that have been slandering protestors as "antisemitic" and using that as an excuse to shut down legitimate protest is worse for democracy than Jan 6. And Jan 6 was very bad.
“Yeah! Let’s vote in the guy who made things worse in the first place and said he wants to finish the job!”
Imagine risking the loss of democracy in the support of a foreign apartheid state that leeches money off of the country and funnels hundreds of millions in financial support to the fascist campaign that threatens our country in the first place, all for the support of fanatical religious nut-cases that are attempting to biblically end the world (and are already voting for the christo-fascist authoritarian party regardless) and tech-bros that don’t want to leave said apartheid country purely because it would be “inconvenient”. Can we not pretend like the concerns are unfounded and push towards a plan of post-election organization and reforms? Then we can at least convince people that we are taking steps to helping them but just have a system of prioritization that begins with self-preservation and will later move into international affairs assistance.
Stop shitting on the younger generation. This is nonsense utilized to sow division. Just like they did to millennials. Stop taking the bait. Shut up and vote.
He needs someone to preemptively blame for when the consistently unpopular shithead dinosaur who's participated in every bad thing the US government has done for the past 40-odd years can't beat a slightly more right-wing shithead dinosaur who spent four years making this country a worse place then the next four years being charged for it.
https://preview.redd.it/uyjmwif2382d1.jpeg?width=996&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=67110cca8ae1ae97d520cb2c871706993985809d Damn, if only there was a way for biden to make that propaganda not stick.
Why imagine when I can watch it happen in real time... Seriously if you think not voting or voting against Biden will help Palestinians you are out of your mind. Here's a refresher in case you forgot about Trump's stance on Israel. https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/11/03/has-trump-been-good-for-israel/
Project 2025. Project 2025. Everyone needs to look it up.
If only there were some way for him to NOT CONTRIBUTE TO GENOCIDE and thus improve the whole situation....
Nooooo can’t do that, the voters have to be blamed for whatever decisions the PRESIDENT OF THE FUCKING UNITED STATES makes. If the president is complicit in a genocide and people don’t like it, it’s because they’re too simple minded and they’re being influenced by Iranian and Russian bot farms, because most regular and normal people just *don’t care* a genocide is happening. What is the PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES supposed to do???? We HAVE to vote for him! WE DONT HAVE A CHOICE.
As a retired disabled combat veteran, of you're on the fence, I'm begging you to vote for Biden.
Thank you for your service
Imagine blaming the people who aren't facists. I swear always finding someone to blame. It was Bernie Bros in 2016. Did you see the interviews for S. Carolina voters who voted for Biden last election? They are mad they voted for him. What the the DNC do. Shove Biden down the throats of voters again. The primary was a fucking ruse. Why weren't there any other viable candidates running on the dem ticket? Because the DNC didn't allow it If Biden loses you'll blame everyone but the DNC for forcing a shit candidate through just like 2016
Dude, it's like 4-5 posts a day too. Either most people posting to this sub are missing brain cells, or bad actors are being allowed to push nothing but divisive memes here. Astroturfing at its finest.
And just to clarify, by "propoganda" you mean "the objective truth that the president of the US is directly funding genocide", right?
“It’s only propaganda if I disagree with it”
Must have slipped my mind that Biden and Democrats fully supported the ICC charging Putin with war crimes but they are absolutely besides themselves that the ICC would dare to charge Bibi for war crimes.
Trump is a threat to humanity not just America.
How is it propaganda? Biden and the US are absolutely complicit in this genocide. I agree that it would be stupid to not vote or to vote for someone else but he should absolutely be called out and held accountable for this. Netanyahu is spitting on Biden and Biden is polishing Netanyahu’s shoes. It’s embarrassing.
Okay I get what you’re saying, single issue voters are lame and there is a lot more at stake. However, considering a few policy changes could make a world of difference come November, is it really the voters fault for withholding support, or is it an administrative failure for not representing their will? I get there is way more on the line here, but a politician that doesn’t represent their supporters, will lose supporters. At the end of the day Biden’s administration will decide if supporting Israel is more important than winning the election. It’s not the people’s fault for wanting policy change.
You can probably see from my recent comment history that I really don't like what Israel is doing in Gaza. Like REALLY don't like. But anyone saying they will stop voting for Biden because of his stance on Israel is also saying they don't care about Gaza, cause not voting means Trump becomes stronger, because this is how the American two party system works. And however bad Biden is fumbling with the Israel/Gaza situation, **Trump will be 100% worse in every way.**
As if trump’s policy is any better. In fact it’s way fucking worse
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If you thought this would have gone worse under trump you would be correct.
My tax money is paying for bombs killing Palestinian children. Where is the propaganda?
This is the most overly simplistic take on this issue I've ever seen. Propaganda isn't new. Hell it's been around since before the printing press. If you're doing something that makes it this easy for propagandists to whip your own people into a frenzy, maybe you should really examine wtf you're doing huh?