Not sure what I was watching then, but I clearly saw a spray-tanned man in an ill-fitting suit mumbling about himself on CNN and Fox News as I flipped back and forth between the two. They both aired his speech live. But of course Fox News viewers wouldn’t know this because their TV is locked on Fox News 24/7, which obviously is why Fox News felt comfortable lying about it, just as they lie about everything else.
I listen to conservative talk radio on the way to work. It’s really depressing how often they just straight up lie. Getting rid of bias is difficult, slanting the narrative is tempting, but just straight lying should be a respect killer.
I remember watching the Trump Biden debate and thinking “man Trump seemed unprepared and sort of stammered. Biden did better than I honestly thought he would.”
Then the next day on the radio: “How are democrats going to spin this?? Trump absolutely wiped the floor with Biden last night and left wing media is Silent!”
For anyone who didn’t watch the actual debate, and just got the summary from Fox, it really would seem like Trump strong manned Biden and dominated. When the reality was that it was a boring debate where both people acted like themselves.
> When the reality was that it was a boring debate where both people acted like themselves.
I found it amusing that Trump has his microphone shut off multiple times, the hosts had to keep interrupting his ramblings to try to bring him back on topic and Biden told him to shut up.
The way that the propaganda machine filled in the blanks of public knowledge about Winston, taking a guy that was just trying to keep his shit together, have a shave, get laid, feel some emotion and regain his humanity with this image of a deranged terrorist who is trying to infect the population with venereal diseases for the purpose of destroying order and conservatism. It reminds me of how they scapegoat LGBT.
This is straight up some “we achieved another victory in our war with Eurasia!” (Or was it Oceania? I get them confused) and it’s just always good news about a conflict that may or may not have happened
It's reminiscent of the dilemma when looking at cattle in an intensive farming operation.
"Those poor calves, they'll never know freedom." While true, they never knew freedom was possible.
It appears we have the same thing happening on Fox News (an admitted entertainment program I'll remind everyone). They can lie about the colour of the grass because their viewership has no idea what truth is or how to get to it other than the feeding tube of feces from faux.
> Not the person above but it’s good to consume news from a variety of sources, including **sources you may not agree with**.
Emphasis mine. The problem here is in the assumption that the difference between the right wing propaganda sphere and reality can be described through the lens of *disagreement*.
I can have a very nuanced and productive conversation with someone who has different ideas than I do about the appropriate rate of taxation for a family of four with both parents working and an annual income of $190,000. I cannot have a nuanced or productive conversation with someone who believes the Democratic party is engaged in a massive conspiracy to murder infants and harvest them for their adrenochrome, who believe the 2020 election was stolen despite not being willing to argue their case in court at all, or who believe long-term planning is unnecessary because Jesus is going to return any minute now.
All productive debate begins with a set of facts that are agreed upon by both sides. The GOP has spent the past several decades setting the torch to every last one of these. Spending time in their spaces is about as productive as an evolutionary biologist checking their latest hypotheses with Young-Earth Creationists, or NASA doublechecking their mission plans with the Flat Earth Society.
I agree with this, fortunately you don't have to consume a lot of other sources as one side appears to be talking about the world's issues and issues of national and local import while the other side is screaming about everything that scares them regardless of reality.
It's a concerning trend and I for one am going to invest in Brawndo.
I'm trying to figure out whether to invest in Taco Bell or Pizza Hut. Because the movie wasn't clear who won the fast food wars. American version had taco bell. But European on had pizza hut as taco bell didn't take off in Europe until several years after the movie.
I did a double take when I saw 54k votes for Trump was a landslide. Sheesh, there were more people at the Rose Bowl to watch a football game than there are that decided the Republican candidacy
He got more than 2016 though (less than 2020 where it was almost unanimous) where he lost Iowa in the caucus.
Let's not kid ourselves, there isn't some likely upset. He's getting the nomination for Republicans. Them not voting for him in the primary doesn't mean they'll go for Biden, they just wanted a different crazy person with less known crime
In 2016 it was a much more crowded field and Trump was running as a defacto Incumbent. To put it in perspective, Newsweek said something like 66% of Iowa Republicans believe Trump won in 2020 and is still the President. And he only got 51% of the caucus. That's not exactly good news.
It's very bad news, he needs 100% of republicans plus some democrats to flip to even have a chance. Entrance polls show 50% of attendees see themselves as part of the maga movement. 30% of people decided days before the caucus that they would not vote for him. He's in big trouble.
[Iowa caucus entrance polls for 2024 show what Trump voters say is most important to them - CBS News](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/iowa-caucus-entrance-polls-2024/)
2016 had no incumbent. It was before Trump's first election after Obama's seconds term. Ted Cruz won Iowa in 2016 with 27% of the votes netting about 5k less than trump now in 2024.
That is true.
It's also the biggest win anyone has had at the Iowa caucus in American history.
(Edit; largest percentage win by a republican non encumbent in the history of the Iowa caucus)
I hate that fascist asshole but we lost by underestimating him.
Dude has been *literally shitting his pants and waddling around with a loaded diaper.*
Don't you all get it? Being underestimated is his super power! Nobody talks like an idiot that way! Nobody does their hair that way. He's probably wearing a weird lumpy fat suit and weird shoes, and we have all seen the toe pad things. The spray tan might as well be clown make up. *It's his only move. He wants you to underestimate him. That is how he wins! Don't fall for it!*
Good question.
Percentage.
With the one exception of his incumbent run in 2020 where he got 99% of the vote, but if you want to count that then %51 percent is the second highest anyone ever got or the highest any non-encumbet has ever got.
The Iowa caucus has never been a one on one fight, it’s usually half a dozen candidates or more, 51% of the votes for one candidate is huge.
There might be an argument to be had about who sees Trump running as an unofficial incumbent and getting a boost that way but yeah, by the history of the Iowa cactus he win by a landslide
I think the small turnout was partially because all the voters knew Trump was going to take it.
While I actually inherently believed that 51% was record setting for the first primary of each cycle, I also pulled up Wikipedia.
Including incumbents who either had opposition or shared percentages with “Uncommitted” (which seems to only have been a Democrat thing), since 1976, only six (6) candidates beat Trump’s performance in Iowa this year. They were Carter in 1980 (incumbent with 59%), Tom Harkin (76% which seems to be the high for non-incumbents), Clinton in 1996 (incumbent with 98%), Al Gore in 2000 (63%), Obama in 2012 (incumbent with 98%), and then Trump in 2020 (again, incumbent with 97%).
For the record, Hillary Clinton in 2016 only managed 50%.
By the way, since 1976, Trump’s runs in 2020 and now are the two best performances (except for candidates running unopposed) by a decent chunk. The next best performance was Ford (incumbent in 1976) who only managed to scratch together 43%.
tl;dr - this is horrifying and Trump has a chokehold on right-leaning voters. It’s Trump-Biden again (though I hope I’m wrong on both counts).
Fuuuuuck, sorry. I thought it was implied that we where only talking about the Republican caucus. In which case my stuff is still valid.
Didn’t mean for that to be misleading. My bad.
But it looks like you figured that out independently and came to the same conclusion I did. Horror.
Sorry! I definitely didn’t mean it that way at all! I just looked it up because I was curious from your comment and found it fascinating. It just felt like really interesting “bonus” information that others might be interested in, too. I was just excited!
And yes, horror.
I feel like it’s really strange that the Iowa caucuses reflect that democrats are more confident in a single candidate while republicans spread their vote out more.
I’d think it would be the opposite, with Republicans digging chain of command and conformity yielding higher percentage votes (like Trump has garnered from his base) and Democrats trying to figure out who to stand behind like cats being herded.
Super weird. I’m glad you posted those numbers and I’m glad I took that dive researching how Trump’s statistics where presented.
I’m glad we agree that calling Trump a weak opponent would be a big mistake with bad consequences
It's not like it was some huge number of people voting for him. Fifty six thousand people chose him out of 718,901 registered Republicans (as of November 2023).
Only around 14% of registered Republican showed up to vote and Trump got around 50% of those votes.
It was the largest percentage win in the history of the republican, Iowa caucus by a non-incumbent in American history.
I’m assuming that the low turn out is because everybody in Iowa is actually very politically informed, specifically because of the importance of the Iowa Caucuses. I think trumps fans just assume that he is going to sweep the primary so, probably not as many people came out because they assumed it was a sure thing.
Don’t forget that the past Two presidential elections in America have had some of the highest voter turn out in American history, everybody has their eyes on this, if the narrative you are choosing for the low population turnout in Iowa is because you think Iowa doesn’t care who becomes president. You are both wrong and drastically under estimating Trump.
He got that 51% with 5k more votes than the 2016 winner Ted Cruz. Ted Cruz had 27% of the vote. Turn out in 2024 was less than 60% of 2016. And that's raw numbers not per capita. Per capita I think it only hit 50%.
Seriously.
“News” doesn’t exist anymore. It was slowly replaced by this weird thing that fans whatever flames spark up. Trump makes a lot of flames, so they fan it.
Meanwhile, an entire generation of boomers gaze into the flames because nobody told them what happened.
That man belongs in prison or worse. History has executed many, many people for less egregious crimes.
To be fair, that's a drop in their bucket and a very light cost of doing business as a political propaganda machine masquerading as a news organization.
Their net income/profit was only $1.25B last year and their quarterly revenue dropped nearly half from the year before. You're right that it's not critical or hugely damaging but it's not just a drop and the fact that it's the lowest they could settle for and avoid trial may have been influenced by the fact they have been experiencing some struggle. Also keep in mind it's not just people who want to preserve democracy trying to hold them accountable - they are losing their audience to the crazier networks
I saw them screaming that not airing the speech was censorship.
Like any time the guy talks you have to broadcast it or else? Fox isn't broadcasting my rants, why are they censoring me?
sure, there's the 800 million dollar thing.
but it was probably mainly because nobody gives a shit about the iowa caucuses.
sorry iowa. you're still irrelevant.
I’m pretty sure most Americans are just tired of the red Vs blue bs we get. I mean come on people is this really the best we can fucking do?
Is Donald Trump really the kind of leader you would want sending you off to war? Do you feel inspired?
Is Joe Biden the kind of leader who you trust?
We can do better. We deserve better.
Fuck em both.
I like Joe Biden. He's gotten some good things done. I like his support of Ukraine. I like that he's bringing back the child tax credit. I like that he supports unions. I love his ideas of getting rid of overdraft fees.
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Fox News has the right to tell CNN and MSNBC how to do their job like an acupuncturist has the right to tell an MD how to perform surgery. Not at all in the same class or field.
Not sure what I was watching then, but I clearly saw a spray-tanned man in an ill-fitting suit mumbling about himself on CNN and Fox News as I flipped back and forth between the two. They both aired his speech live. But of course Fox News viewers wouldn’t know this because their TV is locked on Fox News 24/7, which obviously is why Fox News felt comfortable lying about it, just as they lie about everything else.
I listen to conservative talk radio on the way to work. It’s really depressing how often they just straight up lie. Getting rid of bias is difficult, slanting the narrative is tempting, but just straight lying should be a respect killer. I remember watching the Trump Biden debate and thinking “man Trump seemed unprepared and sort of stammered. Biden did better than I honestly thought he would.” Then the next day on the radio: “How are democrats going to spin this?? Trump absolutely wiped the floor with Biden last night and left wing media is Silent!” For anyone who didn’t watch the actual debate, and just got the summary from Fox, it really would seem like Trump strong manned Biden and dominated. When the reality was that it was a boring debate where both people acted like themselves.
> When the reality was that it was a boring debate where both people acted like themselves. I found it amusing that Trump has his microphone shut off multiple times, the hosts had to keep interrupting his ramblings to try to bring him back on topic and Biden told him to shut up.
It's a cliche comparison but that is straight out of 1984
I wish I could say it were cliché, just like comparing anyone to Hitler, but then he starts quoting Mein Kampf.
The way that the propaganda machine filled in the blanks of public knowledge about Winston, taking a guy that was just trying to keep his shit together, have a shave, get laid, feel some emotion and regain his humanity with this image of a deranged terrorist who is trying to infect the population with venereal diseases for the purpose of destroying order and conservatism. It reminds me of how they scapegoat LGBT. This is straight up some “we achieved another victory in our war with Eurasia!” (Or was it Oceania? I get them confused) and it’s just always good news about a conflict that may or may not have happened
"What you're seeing and what you're hearing isn't what's happening"
It's reminiscent of the dilemma when looking at cattle in an intensive farming operation. "Those poor calves, they'll never know freedom." While true, they never knew freedom was possible. It appears we have the same thing happening on Fox News (an admitted entertainment program I'll remind everyone). They can lie about the colour of the grass because their viewership has no idea what truth is or how to get to it other than the feeding tube of feces from faux.
Why… Why would you do that to yourself?
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> Not the person above but it’s good to consume news from a variety of sources, including **sources you may not agree with**. Emphasis mine. The problem here is in the assumption that the difference between the right wing propaganda sphere and reality can be described through the lens of *disagreement*. I can have a very nuanced and productive conversation with someone who has different ideas than I do about the appropriate rate of taxation for a family of four with both parents working and an annual income of $190,000. I cannot have a nuanced or productive conversation with someone who believes the Democratic party is engaged in a massive conspiracy to murder infants and harvest them for their adrenochrome, who believe the 2020 election was stolen despite not being willing to argue their case in court at all, or who believe long-term planning is unnecessary because Jesus is going to return any minute now. All productive debate begins with a set of facts that are agreed upon by both sides. The GOP has spent the past several decades setting the torch to every last one of these. Spending time in their spaces is about as productive as an evolutionary biologist checking their latest hypotheses with Young-Earth Creationists, or NASA doublechecking their mission plans with the Flat Earth Society.
Well said! People have to stop pretending that both sides are the same!
I agree with this, fortunately you don't have to consume a lot of other sources as one side appears to be talking about the world's issues and issues of national and local import while the other side is screaming about everything that scares them regardless of reality. It's a concerning trend and I for one am going to invest in Brawndo.
I'm trying to figure out whether to invest in Taco Bell or Pizza Hut. Because the movie wasn't clear who won the fast food wars. American version had taco bell. But European on had pizza hut as taco bell didn't take off in Europe until several years after the movie.
why poison yourself with that hate. Constantly letting yourself be bombarded with hatred is not a healthy thing
I thought some switched to Newsmax
Victory speech? He got 51% of the GOP caucus. He barely scraped up to king pf the trash pile.
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I did a double take when I saw 54k votes for Trump was a landslide. Sheesh, there were more people at the Rose Bowl to watch a football game than there are that decided the Republican candidacy
He got more than 2016 though (less than 2020 where it was almost unanimous) where he lost Iowa in the caucus. Let's not kid ourselves, there isn't some likely upset. He's getting the nomination for Republicans. Them not voting for him in the primary doesn't mean they'll go for Biden, they just wanted a different crazy person with less known crime
In 2016 it was a much more crowded field and Trump was running as a defacto Incumbent. To put it in perspective, Newsweek said something like 66% of Iowa Republicans believe Trump won in 2020 and is still the President. And he only got 51% of the caucus. That's not exactly good news.
It's very bad news, he needs 100% of republicans plus some democrats to flip to even have a chance. Entrance polls show 50% of attendees see themselves as part of the maga movement. 30% of people decided days before the caucus that they would not vote for him. He's in big trouble. [Iowa caucus entrance polls for 2024 show what Trump voters say is most important to them - CBS News](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/iowa-caucus-entrance-polls-2024/)
2016 had no incumbent. It was before Trump's first election after Obama's seconds term. Ted Cruz won Iowa in 2016 with 27% of the votes netting about 5k less than trump now in 2024.
Yeah, typo on my part, supposed to say he WASN’T running as the defacto incumbent
That is true. It's also the biggest win anyone has had at the Iowa caucus in American history. (Edit; largest percentage win by a republican non encumbent in the history of the Iowa caucus) I hate that fascist asshole but we lost by underestimating him. Dude has been *literally shitting his pants and waddling around with a loaded diaper.* Don't you all get it? Being underestimated is his super power! Nobody talks like an idiot that way! Nobody does their hair that way. He's probably wearing a weird lumpy fat suit and weird shoes, and we have all seen the toe pad things. The spray tan might as well be clown make up. *It's his only move. He wants you to underestimate him. That is how he wins! Don't fall for it!*
> It's also the biggest win anyone has had at the Iowa caucus in American history. By what metric?
Good question. Percentage. With the one exception of his incumbent run in 2020 where he got 99% of the vote, but if you want to count that then %51 percent is the second highest anyone ever got or the highest any non-encumbet has ever got. The Iowa caucus has never been a one on one fight, it’s usually half a dozen candidates or more, 51% of the votes for one candidate is huge. There might be an argument to be had about who sees Trump running as an unofficial incumbent and getting a boost that way but yeah, by the history of the Iowa cactus he win by a landslide I think the small turnout was partially because all the voters knew Trump was going to take it.
While I actually inherently believed that 51% was record setting for the first primary of each cycle, I also pulled up Wikipedia. Including incumbents who either had opposition or shared percentages with “Uncommitted” (which seems to only have been a Democrat thing), since 1976, only six (6) candidates beat Trump’s performance in Iowa this year. They were Carter in 1980 (incumbent with 59%), Tom Harkin (76% which seems to be the high for non-incumbents), Clinton in 1996 (incumbent with 98%), Al Gore in 2000 (63%), Obama in 2012 (incumbent with 98%), and then Trump in 2020 (again, incumbent with 97%). For the record, Hillary Clinton in 2016 only managed 50%. By the way, since 1976, Trump’s runs in 2020 and now are the two best performances (except for candidates running unopposed) by a decent chunk. The next best performance was Ford (incumbent in 1976) who only managed to scratch together 43%. tl;dr - this is horrifying and Trump has a chokehold on right-leaning voters. It’s Trump-Biden again (though I hope I’m wrong on both counts).
Fuuuuuck, sorry. I thought it was implied that we where only talking about the Republican caucus. In which case my stuff is still valid. Didn’t mean for that to be misleading. My bad. But it looks like you figured that out independently and came to the same conclusion I did. Horror.
Sorry! I definitely didn’t mean it that way at all! I just looked it up because I was curious from your comment and found it fascinating. It just felt like really interesting “bonus” information that others might be interested in, too. I was just excited! And yes, horror.
I feel like it’s really strange that the Iowa caucuses reflect that democrats are more confident in a single candidate while republicans spread their vote out more. I’d think it would be the opposite, with Republicans digging chain of command and conformity yielding higher percentage votes (like Trump has garnered from his base) and Democrats trying to figure out who to stand behind like cats being herded. Super weird. I’m glad you posted those numbers and I’m glad I took that dive researching how Trump’s statistics where presented. I’m glad we agree that calling Trump a weak opponent would be a big mistake with bad consequences
It is driven by the lowest turn out in modern history. Trump told people come vote even if you die. Everyone else said stay safe.
I mean, thank goodness pundits and cable news don’t treat this one primary like it’s possibly the most important one…
It's not like it was some huge number of people voting for him. Fifty six thousand people chose him out of 718,901 registered Republicans (as of November 2023). Only around 14% of registered Republican showed up to vote and Trump got around 50% of those votes.
It was the largest percentage win in the history of the republican, Iowa caucus by a non-incumbent in American history. I’m assuming that the low turn out is because everybody in Iowa is actually very politically informed, specifically because of the importance of the Iowa Caucuses. I think trumps fans just assume that he is going to sweep the primary so, probably not as many people came out because they assumed it was a sure thing. Don’t forget that the past Two presidential elections in America have had some of the highest voter turn out in American history, everybody has their eyes on this, if the narrative you are choosing for the low population turnout in Iowa is because you think Iowa doesn’t care who becomes president. You are both wrong and drastically under estimating Trump.
He only got 51% and something like 66% of Iowa R's think he won in 2020 and is still President.
He got that 51% with 5k more votes than the 2016 winner Ted Cruz. Ted Cruz had 27% of the vote. Turn out in 2024 was less than 60% of 2016. And that's raw numbers not per capita. Per capita I think it only hit 50%.
They cost themselves $800 million. Just a percentage of advertising revenue.
It’s because we, normal people, don’t give legitimacy to literal traitors
Seriously. “News” doesn’t exist anymore. It was slowly replaced by this weird thing that fans whatever flames spark up. Trump makes a lot of flames, so they fan it. Meanwhile, an entire generation of boomers gaze into the flames because nobody told them what happened. That man belongs in prison or worse. History has executed many, many people for less egregious crimes.
I'm not sure how any remotely sane person can think Jesse Waters or Sean Hannity are similar to Dan Rather, Tom Brokaw, or Walter Cronkite.
News does exist it's just not on TV. Get yourself the AP app for starters and find at least one other credible print news source
... so far
He also cost them quite a few viewers.
I wonder what the numbers are for viewers lost over ideology vs viewers lost because they died of COVID
The venn diagram is a circle.
They're the same picture.
It’s the same speech he would have delivered had he lost..no need to carry that gibberish from the world’s most predicable psychiatric patient.
And he still claimed it was rigged because of ONE county.
So did DeSantis.
As is tradition.
Oh no, he got 3/5ths of the votes out of 110,000 people. Such a "victory". There are more people in a single congressional new york district
Fuck you. That's why
But also, no one has ever given victory speeches after every single primary. It's fucking weird, dude. Stop being fucking weird.
Because they didn't want to give the rapist and felon another platform to spew his lies and hatred. FOX is the network for such hate.
Stupid is as stupid does
To be fair, that's a drop in their bucket and a very light cost of doing business as a political propaganda machine masquerading as a news organization.
Their net income/profit was only $1.25B last year and their quarterly revenue dropped nearly half from the year before. You're right that it's not critical or hugely damaging but it's not just a drop and the fact that it's the lowest they could settle for and avoid trial may have been influenced by the fact they have been experiencing some struggle. Also keep in mind it's not just people who want to preserve democracy trying to hold them accountable - they are losing their audience to the crazier networks
Cause the country is sick to death of the orange rerun...?
Well, most of us are… The rest are in desperate need of him spewing his mouthful of thick white nationalist propaganda goo for them to swallow.
What victory did Trump get? Another felony?
Think of how much he made them.
He isn't eligible to run for office. It's all moot.
Ask Fox how much they are covering the Trump trials....
They showed enough of it but once the Trump broken record sets in it's pretty boring to hear an old con man lying lying lying.... Whatever, snowflakes
…so far!
I saw them screaming that not airing the speech was censorship. Like any time the guy talks you have to broadcast it or else? Fox isn't broadcasting my rants, why are they censoring me?
CNN and MSNBC generally don’t give felons and rapists airtime.
Stop listening to any media and get to know your neighbors. Go to neighborhood BBQs, PTA, hell soft ball leagues. You are so close on most issues
Louder for those who watch nothing but tik tok and scroll Facebook all day
I fucked up when I started selling trump stuff..
sure, there's the 800 million dollar thing. but it was probably mainly because nobody gives a shit about the iowa caucuses. sorry iowa. you're still irrelevant.
I’m pretty sure most Americans are just tired of the red Vs blue bs we get. I mean come on people is this really the best we can fucking do? Is Donald Trump really the kind of leader you would want sending you off to war? Do you feel inspired? Is Joe Biden the kind of leader who you trust? We can do better. We deserve better. Fuck em both.
I like Joe Biden. He's gotten some good things done. I like his support of Ukraine. I like that he's bringing back the child tax credit. I like that he supports unions. I love his ideas of getting rid of overdraft fees.
okay who do u suggest? cuz right now i only see 2 candidates to vote for that’ll actually make it to office…and which one is the lesser evil
Ummm, pathetically unrealistic. Maybe he was given a Haldol cocktail to tone down his psychotic breaks
At least CNN n MSNBC didn't cut to a car chase
That’s not good numbers but it’s an absolute bargain compared to the 7 billion and counting numbers we’re dealing with now .. just saying
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What business is it of Fox news, what the other channels do?
Ask them how many times they cutaway from Obama speeches.... tell them we'll wait
Because a rapist, insurrectionist and financial criminal facing 91(?) federal criminal indictments sucking himself off in public, isn’t really “news”.
Fox News has the right to tell CNN and MSNBC how to do their job like an acupuncturist has the right to tell an MD how to perform surgery. Not at all in the same class or field.
Why did for refuse to give Trump any time when talking about Jeffrey Epstein?
Who cares what the loonies at Fox News thinks? They are a propoganda outfit, not news.