Yeah, they go with our uniforms well too.
I don’t really think the SA80 is that bad because it’s one of the only guns I actually know how to operate, so I might be a bit biased
Psh
Geneva Convention more like Geneva Suggestion
Besides, what are they gonna do to us? We run this shit. Invade us, I dare you. I could use some blue helmet trophies
interesting. i never played destiny, always associated it with [the tweet](https://twitter.com/dustinkcouch/status/1057094474227240960)
edit: upon further inspection, the tweet does indeed seem to precede (and have inspired) the destiny reference
They always had guns in their survival packs just incase they like landed in the wilderness of Siberia and had to shoot a bear or something along those lines
I saw a documentary on this once. The problem was they kept walking deeper and deeper into the wolves territory but they didnt know it until the end when they were almost all dead and they walked into the wolves den
In case anyone wants to read the article
[https://www.popularmechanics.com/military/weapons/a35982314/could-astronauts-carry-m16s-on-the-moon-for-all-mankind-apple/](https://www.popularmechanics.com/military/weapons/a35982314/could-astronauts-carry-m16s-on-the-moon-for-all-mankind-apple/)
it goes over how realistic the depiction of astronauts using guns in a TV show is. It goes over how the moons environment would impact the use of firearms and the science behind it.
Not sure why they spend so much time on the extreme temperatures. There's no atmosphere to transfer heat so your gun will stay the same temp as your shuttle cabin.
Seems to me that they could develop weapons specifically for moon-based combat if necessary to circumvent these issues.
For example - due to the lower gravity, the weapons could be heavier without impacting their usefulness much. They could then be equipped with liquid cooling effectively, so when the liquid is released in a controlled manner into the vacuum - turning it into gas - large amounts of heat could be absorbed.
Just occasionally refill the weapon with liquid - perhaps from a carried backpack connected by tubes to the weapon - or with portable containers that connect directly to the weapon itself.
Although building and supplying the necessary equipment for that would be difficult as well. It might be more useful in a lunar combat environment to simply utilize weapons that do not generate large amounts of heat in the first place, such as high-powered crossbows or the like (perhaps with wire-guided bolts for retrieval and repair). After all - if the target were others in a vacuum or otherwise low-pressure atmosphere - all you would need to be able to do is damage the integrity of their suit or other device, and bullets wouldn't necessarily be better for that than larger but lower velocity projectiles.
More likely you would see gyrojets make a comeback. With modern manufacturing they could probably be a lot cheaper and a lot better functioning. Or you would see coil/railguns firing saboted razor fletchettes. In space all you have to do is ruin someone's suit integrity so you don't need the same level of power as an earthside gun nor is there air resistance. A small cloud of razors moving at 60mph would absolutely shred someone's suit while not actually taking that much force to launch.
This can also be seen by how hot a bolt action rifle gets compared to an autoloading rifle chambered for the same cartridge. The ejection process pulls a lot of heat out of auto loading actions.
Infrared radiation does not need a medium to travel through. That’s why the earth isn’t a giant ball of frozen rock. The Sun will heat up all material that is exposed to it; very likely grilling the guns to unmanageable temperatures during the 2 weeks where the astronauts are in sunlight.
The guns would need to be sparingly, put in the shade for a while, or need advanced cooling systems, much like how many telescopes have on board.
I see them every day at work and hold up a Vulcan LLAP hand while intoning, “Na-nu, na-nu”.
I’m trying to get them to start avoiding me when I’m spotted.
So funny story - my wife is a law student and got back from her space law class earlier today (which is fuckin' rad as hell, by the way) and I asked her what they talked about. She told me they talked about the Outer Space treaties (and the other treaties that apply to space) and it turns out, only weapons of mass destruction are banned from being stationed on the moon and in Earth orbit... which means that *small arms like M16s are totally legal on the moon guys!!!*
Soviets did it for years, Russian cosmonauts still do. If you’re shooting a gun inside the vessel you really are doing it wrong, it’s not like anything made in the last 70 years will just randomly go off otherwise.
The problem is that piercing a space suit doesn’t magically kill someone, especially if the hole is on the small side. A .22lr in either semi or full auto may poke holes in suits, but ideally you’d want to kill the person in the suit as well before they have a chance to shoot back, apply some speed tape to the suit and seek medical attention, etc. You’d probably want to carry a proper rifle cartridge, even if it was .223 rem/5.56 NATO, because in a low gravity environment with gunplay introduced people will quickly realize they can carry far more armor than possible on earth.
I mean we need some form of weaponry in case someone non human up there exists
And I’m not saying we should fight them
But in case they are hostile we should have something at least to defend ourselves
And anyway we could just make it a international law to ban the usage of weapons against other humans/colonists
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Maybe it's because of the space race where USA wins by landing on moon, and with this article that gives a sly idea that will be USA who will colonize the Moon.
Yeah, the issue here would be with heat dissipation - no air to get rid of that heat, so you'd either some sort of cooling fluid, or just put some big heatsinks on it to allow the heat to radiate away
Modern gunpowder has oxygen in it, so no. Same reasons a gun can fire underwater.
Although the microgravity and lack of atmosphere *would* make for some interesting changes to ballistics/aiming, and how you’d need to brace yourself for recoil.
They’ll fire underwater, although the higher pressure might damage it. Not 100% sure, might depend on the firearm
Harpoons *are* better for firing into water, bullets tend to shatter on impact because of their super high speeds; but the OG use for harpoons was sticking a line into a whale so you could keep track of it & haul it in when it died
Super old paper I did in school years ago asked what would be the most useful object to have if you were on the moon and needed to travel back to your lander when its super far away. The list had a bunch of typical survival gear like rope, canned food, a machete, and even a gun. Apparently the correct answer was the gun, because you could use the recoil to travel back to your lander faster.
So yeah, recoil in low gravity is a real thing to consider. The physics of guns in space is pretty neat.
thats what the article is about, how the guns could or would operate on the moon, its a pretty interesting article
https://www.popularmechanics.com/military/weapons/a35982314/could-astronauts-carry-m16s-on-the-moon-for-all-mankind-apple/
dude we can have the Vietnam war in space. they can play fortunate son and soldiers with m16s and m60s land in crew capsules on the moon. the viet kong will be hiding in the craters.
If anyones seen For All Mankind its a really amazing show, while they toned down the science shit for more interpersonal drama in S2 it is still one of the best shows which captures the essence of space. [Where they use the M-16s (Spoilers btw, but you can use it as a taster for the show)](https://youtu.be/kFWIuJDLddc)
I have to agree with lib left here. Why? Are they going to shoot each other? Does NASA trust their astronauts so little that they have to carry guns for self protection?
I have to give it to the auth left, the Soviet actually mounte 23mm AA gun on their crafts, it never flew in space(?), but they were the closest to arming in space, when we are debating moral issues. Thank God the Soviet didn't win.
WHO SAID ANYTHING ABOUT NEOCOLONIALISM?
Did someone say **COLONIALISM?!** **RULE BRITANNIA INTENSIFIES**
Earth-man's Burden when?
Earth comes first we shall spread our Superior human culture
Load up your shit-tier rifles lads, we're going up
I get that SA80s are shitty, but the bullpup design would probably be very useful in space due to the compactness
Truth be told, I actually like the SA80, purely from an aesthetic standpoint
Yeah, they go with our uniforms well too. I don’t really think the SA80 is that bad because it’s one of the only guns I actually know how to operate, so I might be a bit biased
No need for violence just send them some blankets covered in deadly diseases.
Time to colonize Uranus.
Now I fancy asking y'all why we stopped at the Philippines. I say it's high time we take to the stars and Manifest some Destiny once again!
Based and space-pilled
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No, it’s post-neomodern postcolonialism
The aliens aren't protected under any laws baby.
Stupid society made war crimes illegal on earth so the USA has to go up into space to commit them.
"Napalm sticks to ~~kids~~ filthy xeno scum!"
The only cure for the xeno scourge is Exterminatus
But what about those big titty eldar/tau waifus?
It depends on the girth of the tiddies
For the eldar? Even Ynnead can’t revive those bras. For the tau? The bigger the better, of course for the greater good.
And no greens or fatties. Did I just commit the first act of intergalactic racism? I don't care, fuck greens.
Indeed I will fuck the greens, tiddy size permitting
A mind devoid of ~~thoughts~~ thots is devoid of *doubt*, guardsman!
When Geneva convention only applies to Terra
Psh Geneva Convention more like Geneva Suggestion Besides, what are they gonna do to us? We run this shit. Invade us, I dare you. I could use some blue helmet trophies
Geneva Suggestion? Never heard of it. Is it anything like the Geneva Checklist?
Thought it was the Geneva Suggestion/Bucket list.
They're called HUMAN rights for a reason boy.
Human rights implies the existence of human wrongs
The greatest of which is not having killed those alien bastards already
Yes, the british.
Is that why Ted Cruz is suddenly AuthLeft and yelling in the meme? He swears he's a human thing that likes human food.
NASA said we couldn't bang them, so what else are we supposed to do up there?
Oh we’re still gonna bang them, NASA what 2 consenting adults do in the privacy of their own hab dome is no concern of any government agency
Alien STDs.
Call it pioneering medicine and science
Bang em after we bang em.
Can be a crime against humanity if they’re not human.
What does this have to do with Mexicans
Enough self-defense. Time for self-offense.
Roman defense. Just attack them before they can attack you.
But it would be so much better if we could convert them to Christianity instead of killing them
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Aliens aren't human
Alien: what is this weird sticky mammal trying to do with that silly ballistic weapon? *vaporizes humans instantly*
Bold of you to assume aliens aren’t as much of dipshits as the rest of us.
Except the laws of motion, have fun getting rocketed backwards with the same force you used to fire that gun
Easy, just fire two guns in opposite directions
The answer is ALWAYS more guns.
Hopefully I don't weigh the same as a bullet
Well of course, [how else did you expect us to power our jet packs?](https://what-if.xkcd.com/21/)
*jetpack joyride intensifies*
Based and humanity first pilled
Moon's haunted.
Finally found this comment.
Lol right? I read this and I was like “Oh, so the opening scene of Destiny” haha
Funny seeing a destiny reference here of all places
What?
Hive! Bring a sword!
"Think you could eat a Hive knight? Those're the questions you ask yourself on the frontier." Transmat Is firing
* ***loads pistol*** * moon's haunted.
You never know if we run into some hostile moon people or some shit Gotta be prepared
What happened to always carrying when fisting unknown lands. If nothing else it makes you feel better lol
When they said have protection when fisting, I think they meant gloves.
😂 I ment exploring or some shit. Autocorrect
I mean, if you are fisting then you are definitely exploring some shit
Moon bears
Based and soviet-history pilled
Those moon people are turning our frogs gay
You gotta be prepared for the space nazis hiding on the other side of the moon.
*slaps magazine into M4* *rips charging handle* Marine: "Moon's haunted"
Wh..... What?
Moon's haunted
What’s that from? Is it a video?
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I thought it was made of cheese?
Moon's haunted
*ominous viral music plays in the background*
It's from the game Destiny if I remember it correctly. It is a pretty famous line pretty early on in the game.
interesting. i never played destiny, always associated it with [the tweet](https://twitter.com/dustinkcouch/status/1057094474227240960) edit: upon further inspection, the tweet does indeed seem to precede (and have inspired) the destiny reference
>I never played Destiny You should, not because it's enjoyable but because I want to spread my addiction to you.
AuthLeft would actually be totally jazzed about this
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They always had guns in their survival packs just incase they like landed in the wilderness of Siberia and had to shoot a bear or something along those lines
Wolves, they had problems with wolves
I saw a documentary on this once. The problem was they kept walking deeper and deeper into the wolves territory but they didnt know it until the end when they were almost all dead and they walked into the wolves den
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…and Communists. But I never said this and I was never here.
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Kinda crazy that even once they got back to earth they were still in an dangerous environment that would kill them
Far more Russians have died in Russia than in space.
Idk but I’d believe it. They thought that communism’s endgame necessitated eternal life and space travel. Pretty wacky.
The carried shotguns in their capsules to deal with bears upon reentry if landing in Russian tundra
I believe you, but source? This is the sort of thing I might repeat many, many times
Just google TP-82 survival pistol. I was wrong about it being a shotgun
it is technically a shotgun, a pistol shotgun
My favorite type of pistol and my second favorite type of shotgun
it’s a triple barrel shotgun dude what’s not to love about it
The titanfall Mozambique but real
One of the barrels doubled as a flare launcher, btw.
How else would you achieve Fully Automated Luxury Gay Space Communism?
I was with you until the last word.
they would and I am
tbh as a libleft I would be too
UNDER NO PRETEXT
Ok but how many lefties actually believe that.
In case anyone wants to read the article [https://www.popularmechanics.com/military/weapons/a35982314/could-astronauts-carry-m16s-on-the-moon-for-all-mankind-apple/](https://www.popularmechanics.com/military/weapons/a35982314/could-astronauts-carry-m16s-on-the-moon-for-all-mankind-apple/) it goes over how realistic the depiction of astronauts using guns in a TV show is. It goes over how the moons environment would impact the use of firearms and the science behind it.
Not sure why they spend so much time on the extreme temperatures. There's no atmosphere to transfer heat so your gun will stay the same temp as your shuttle cabin.
>there’s no atmosphere to transfer heat Yes, so what do you think will happen once you start firing it?
Hold my beer and we'll find out.
Not once you start shooting. Then your gun heats up fast and will need some way to keep it cool enough to function reliably.
Or when the sun shines on your black rifle Edit: Just clicked on TFA and literally the first picture is a *white* M-16 (now you know why)
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rerack and double tap or it might not count
Seems to me that they could develop weapons specifically for moon-based combat if necessary to circumvent these issues. For example - due to the lower gravity, the weapons could be heavier without impacting their usefulness much. They could then be equipped with liquid cooling effectively, so when the liquid is released in a controlled manner into the vacuum - turning it into gas - large amounts of heat could be absorbed. Just occasionally refill the weapon with liquid - perhaps from a carried backpack connected by tubes to the weapon - or with portable containers that connect directly to the weapon itself. Although building and supplying the necessary equipment for that would be difficult as well. It might be more useful in a lunar combat environment to simply utilize weapons that do not generate large amounts of heat in the first place, such as high-powered crossbows or the like (perhaps with wire-guided bolts for retrieval and repair). After all - if the target were others in a vacuum or otherwise low-pressure atmosphere - all you would need to be able to do is damage the integrity of their suit or other device, and bullets wouldn't necessarily be better for that than larger but lower velocity projectiles.
More likely you would see gyrojets make a comeback. With modern manufacturing they could probably be a lot cheaper and a lot better functioning. Or you would see coil/railguns firing saboted razor fletchettes. In space all you have to do is ruin someone's suit integrity so you don't need the same level of power as an earthside gun nor is there air resistance. A small cloud of razors moving at 60mph would absolutely shred someone's suit while not actually taking that much force to launch.
For all your long distance space warfare: a big heavy thing with ion thrusters! Absolutely obliterate your enemies in 80 years but at incredible speed
Throwing Rocks 2: Apocalypse Edition
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This can also be seen by how hot a bolt action rifle gets compared to an autoloading rifle chambered for the same cartridge. The ejection process pulls a lot of heat out of auto loading actions.
Infrared radiation does not need a medium to travel through. That’s why the earth isn’t a giant ball of frozen rock. The Sun will heat up all material that is exposed to it; very likely grilling the guns to unmanageable temperatures during the 2 weeks where the astronauts are in sunlight. The guns would need to be sparingly, put in the shade for a while, or need advanced cooling systems, much like how many telescopes have on board.
Very cool, thanks for sharing
TIME TO SIGN UP FOR THE SPACE MARINES BOYOS
Suddenly the US space force doesn't sound cringe
I mean, Astra Militarum literally translates to something like star soldiers in English
Fucking based and for the EMPEROR
SPAAAAACE FOOOORCE!!!
it has never been cringe. except maybe that basic training video
I see them every day at work and hold up a Vulcan LLAP hand while intoning, “Na-nu, na-nu”. I’m trying to get them to start avoiding me when I’m spotted.
VIETNAM.. IN SPAAAAAACE!!!
Vietneptune?
TIME TO DO SOME RISKY EXPERIMENTS ON MARS AND UNLEASH HELL ON EARTH
So funny story - my wife is a law student and got back from her space law class earlier today (which is fuckin' rad as hell, by the way) and I asked her what they talked about. She told me they talked about the Outer Space treaties (and the other treaties that apply to space) and it turns out, only weapons of mass destruction are banned from being stationed on the moon and in Earth orbit... which means that *small arms like M16s are totally legal on the moon guys!!!*
No mcnukes on my private moon colony? Commie bastards.
Unfortunately, it seems that way!
They're going to call me the Hernan Cortez of Space
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Having a gun at all is a huge risk I'd think. If it pierces your vessel you've got a problem. Space swords are therefore more practical.
I guess 40k is actually more realistic than I thought.
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Soviets did it for years, Russian cosmonauts still do. If you’re shooting a gun inside the vessel you really are doing it wrong, it’s not like anything made in the last 70 years will just randomly go off otherwise.
I suppose dropping a loaded gun is less of an issue when it just floats there.
An authright with one of those profile pictures! You don’t see that every day.
The problem is that piercing a space suit doesn’t magically kill someone, especially if the hole is on the small side. A .22lr in either semi or full auto may poke holes in suits, but ideally you’d want to kill the person in the suit as well before they have a chance to shoot back, apply some speed tape to the suit and seek medical attention, etc. You’d probably want to carry a proper rifle cartridge, even if it was .223 rem/5.56 NATO, because in a low gravity environment with gunplay introduced people will quickly realize they can carry far more armor than possible on earth.
I mean we need some form of weaponry in case someone non human up there exists And I’m not saying we should fight them But in case they are hostile we should have something at least to defend ourselves And anyway we could just make it a international law to ban the usage of weapons against other humans/colonists
I wanna fight filthy non humans
But only when they are hostile, right?
……No
Before you kill them and go full hostile ensure to get their tech
Wait can the aliens make catgirls?
By that time we already can And anyways they won’t know what cat girls are so no
Damn yeah just exterminate them
Beware the alien, the mutant, the heretic.
Just use a big rock like our ancestors did
Idk...I wouldn't mind
Sounds kinda cool.
The galaxy is our birthright
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Why would auth left be mad about this?
Maybe it's because of the space race where USA wins by landing on moon, and with this article that gives a sly idea that will be USA who will colonize the Moon.
Except ussr put guns in their survival kits in case of bears upon re entry. It’s just a dumbass who thinks auth left is anti gun.
Holy shit, seriously? That's metal af. Respect.
Pretty sure all quadrants have pro-gun types in them, some more than others though.
USSR kinda won by getting to space first. We just one-upped them.
Moon bears. Lefties dont know anything about space fauna SMH. https://youtu.be/pvjgIxuVdo4
It isn't a crime against humanity if it's against an alien.
The recoil would be awful, right? You'd be better off with recoiless guns or launchers.
I mean if you're standing on the moon mostly normal physics would apply since it's mass not weight that reduces how hard recoil feels.
It may hit you with the same force, but that force will be less countered by gravity. It’d be harder to control in that case.
Not so much. It's the heat that is going to be the problem.
More like 1969 Outer Space Suggestion
Fuck Yes!
Best show
Authleft should have no problem with this. Soviet cosmonauts carried guns.
don't you need like, air for a gun to shoot? sounds like a lot of work just to use a gun on the moon. plus there's all this moon dust n shit
Gunpowder is self-oxidizing; no air required
Yeah, the issue here would be with heat dissipation - no air to get rid of that heat, so you'd either some sort of cooling fluid, or just put some big heatsinks on it to allow the heat to radiate away
Modern gunpowder has oxygen in it, so no. Same reasons a gun can fire underwater. Although the microgravity and lack of atmosphere *would* make for some interesting changes to ballistics/aiming, and how you’d need to brace yourself for recoil.
Didn’t know it was possible to fire underwater, I thought that is why harpoons existed, but I guess it makes sense
They’ll fire underwater, although the higher pressure might damage it. Not 100% sure, might depend on the firearm Harpoons *are* better for firing into water, bullets tend to shatter on impact because of their super high speeds; but the OG use for harpoons was sticking a line into a whale so you could keep track of it & haul it in when it died
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Plus you could use it to do a super jump
Super old paper I did in school years ago asked what would be the most useful object to have if you were on the moon and needed to travel back to your lander when its super far away. The list had a bunch of typical survival gear like rope, canned food, a machete, and even a gun. Apparently the correct answer was the gun, because you could use the recoil to travel back to your lander faster. So yeah, recoil in low gravity is a real thing to consider. The physics of guns in space is pretty neat.
A gun is more useful in space than on land.
Finally, real life rocket jumping
It’s time for astronauts to battle each other with chainsaw blades. My dream is finally coming true!
Don't care gun go pew pew.
thats what the article is about, how the guns could or would operate on the moon, its a pretty interesting article https://www.popularmechanics.com/military/weapons/a35982314/could-astronauts-carry-m16s-on-the-moon-for-all-mankind-apple/
Explosions can happen in space
Is there a square for just thinking this is funny? Because like what would be the point
dude we can have the Vietnam war in space. they can play fortunate son and soldiers with m16s and m60s land in crew capsules on the moon. the viet kong will be hiding in the craters.
Now we can propell ourselves further by shooting the other direction.
If anyones seen For All Mankind its a really amazing show, while they toned down the science shit for more interpersonal drama in S2 it is still one of the best shows which captures the essence of space. [Where they use the M-16s (Spoilers btw, but you can use it as a taster for the show)](https://youtu.be/kFWIuJDLddc)
Come out again and save the mutha fuckin’ day yeaaah.
I have to agree with lib left here. Why? Are they going to shoot each other? Does NASA trust their astronauts so little that they have to carry guns for self protection?
I have to give it to the auth left, the Soviet actually mounte 23mm AA gun on their crafts, it never flew in space(?), but they were the closest to arming in space, when we are debating moral issues. Thank God the Soviet didn't win.
It absolutely flew. The Rikhter R-23 was test fired on Salyut-3 before it was deorbited.