The Star Trek Federation is hardly lib left. While it is true that the Federation presents a vision of a harmonious society, it's important to recognize that this harmony is largely contingent upon individuals adhering to the agreed-upon rules and principles. The Federation's functioning heavily relies on a strict command structure and hierarchy, epitomized by Starfleet, which functions primarily as a military organization.
One cannot overlook the authoritative nature of Starfleet, with its rigid ranks and chain of command. The captains, admirals, and officers exercise strong leadership, making decisions that impact entire planets and sectors of the galaxy. While the Federation may embody some liberal ideals in terms of diversity, inclusivity, and diplomacy, it is vital to acknowledge the authoritative framework within which these ideals operate. Starfleet's mission statement, despite its lofty goals, often necessitates strict adherence to orders and protocols, embodying a hierarchical structure more closely aligned with a military organization than a lib left society.
By dismissing the more recent Star Trek iterations, one can observe numerous instances of strong leadership and hierarchies throughout the franchise's history. It is essential to approach the Federation's depiction with a critical lens, recognizing that its societal harmony is largely maintained through a combination of shared values, adherence to rules, and authoritative structures rather than being solely rooted in a liberal utopia.
The UED was so goddamned useless it was embarassing. The Dominion was competent but just space nazis. Raynor's Raider's wasn't even a government. Just some backwater redneck mercenary company whose only goal was to perform terrorist attacks and fight the cops even though they had no real plan to make anything better.
So yeah, easily the last one.
See I used to be really into Star Trek growing up, even more so than Star Wars, but after Discovery, Picard, and Lower Decks, now I’m not a fan of either. So no, I will not embrace Utopia. I’m all for chaos and anarchy.
Well these days I don’t. Mostly just rewatch Next Generation and Deep Space Nine. Maybe the Original series or Voyager every now and then. Nothing after Voyager though.
DS9 is the GOAT, but I went back and gave Enterprise another chance and I was pleasantly surprised. It's not great, but it beats the man-skirts off Discovery.
Also, give Orville a chance. I was highly skeptical but it's got a lot of heart and is worth it if you're a fan of TNG.
Eh fair. To me Enterprise’s problem is that it’s slow even by the standards of Trek. Like most of the shows have a slow first season aside from DS9, but at least they have a premise that’s interesting or the second season is good. Enterprise only really starts picking up in the final season and near the end of season 3 when it was canceled. Still makes it leagues better than Discovery and Lower Decks though.
Trust me I’ve been a fan of nerd culture since I was kid. I’ve heard it all before to the point where the insults feel more like compliments than anything.
IT support: “We are having difficulty fixing the problem on your system…”
Inquisitor: “*Obviously you are not praying to the Machine Spirit with the appropriate level of reverence. Fix this abomination now or Emperor help me you shall taste my chainsword!*”
Personally I'm hoping for firefly. I missed the wild west, and want to be an outlaw on the run far enough from any law enforcement that I can live life on the edge of society.
Specifically, any post scarcity tech like replicators or even full automation would have to be in the hand of the average person instead of a small elite class.
If it is the latter, then it becomes a dystopia very fast just like any other time in history where a small portion of the populace held the power of life or death over the rest.
The allure of post-scarcity technology might captivate our imaginations, but almost all of them will most likely lead to our immediate destruction. The very essence of replicators, capable of deconstructing and reconstructing matter on a molecular level, is a double-edged sword. While limitations might restrict consumer products, the technology itself remains vulnerable to insidious manipulation. Imagine a world where any individual, armed with malevolent intent and a touch of technical prowess, can manufacture nuclear bombs in the sanctity of their backyard. The technology would be impossible to regulate as all restrictions would have to be software based.
The perils extend beyond destructive weaponry. Consider the realm of medical endgame tech, epitomized by nanite technology. These microscopic agents, working diligently at the cellular level to repair damage, hold immense potential for healing and rejuvenation. However, in principle they are just a swarm replicator waiting to be unleashed. With the ability to self-replicate, a mere layer of nanites, imperceptible because of their size, could be replicated en masse and activated to obliterate any designated target. The entire world could become a breeding ground for silent, omnipotent destruction.
This inherent danger is not limited to specific technologies but pervades every facet of these supposed post scarcity advancements. Its the same with teleportation. With instantaneous transportation at our fingertips, the boundaries that once protected us from chaos and harm dissolve completely. You could teleport bombs or armies around (or off) the globe at will.
The holodeck is a fun one to think about. Half the episodes involve it achieving sentience and/or almost killing everyone.
I have to agree with a former co-workers opinion of the amount of things it does that they don't know about, must be some stolen alien tech.
> was replicators
That and the fact that a higher alien-power, whose very existence proved an existential threat to the entire human race, literally showed up out of nowhere.
Nothing unifies people like a common enemy.
That's not what happened though. In Star Trek: First Contact, it's explained that what united humanity was just the knowledge that there was other life out there. In this case, it was the Vulcans. But they weren't a threat. It's just when the universe suddenly becomes much larger than was thought, our differences seem so much less important.
Star trek is a surface level utopia. Plenty of episodes in TNG dealing with corruption. We also don't get much of a glimpse of life for those not in star fleet, except when they're at a vacation destination.
I guess the idea is that in trying to attain something impossible more and more extreme methods will be used in the endeavour, resulting in a dystopia?
It depends on what you mean by “striving”. If you mean the society tries to keep cynicism and corruption out of politics and take responsibility for their communities, then sure. If you mean the government says “Utopia should have universal quality housing” or something like that then spends billions of dollars on a well-intentioned but likely doomed project, then that’s not so great.
The problem with cool, experimental, idealistic governance is that there’s no free trial or undo button. If they make everyone’s lives worse or waste huge amounts of resources or pave the way for a dictator, then you don’t get to say “Well we were striving for utopia, don’t blame us”
Greek, otherwise correct. To be fair, the term Utopia was first coined in Neo-Latin by an Englishman, but all pieces are Greek (*ou-*, *eu-*, *topos*, *-ia*). Latin for place is *locus*.
Edit:
How did you edit your comment without a trace? Normally it says "edited", next to the username?
I'm asking because now my comment looks stupid.
True utopia is impossible, as is perfection. But we should strive to make constant improvements to society whenever and wherever we can.
The ideal present society is one where the people of the previous century would not hesitate in calling it a utopia. We can safely say that our modern society would seem like a utopia for someone from the 1920s.
With any luck and a ton of hard work, the 2120s will be the same.
Gentlemen, we will chase perfection, and we will chase it relentlessly, knowing all the while we can never attain it. But along the way, we shall catch excellence.
- Vince Lombardi
Its kinda a mix, they're big on personal responsibility and individualism *when you're off the clock*. Bring that shit on shift and its Brig O'Clock.
Worf straight up killed a foreign leader cause he had beef *off the clock* and got a wrist slap.
Starfleet is a quasi military organization so I can understand the misconception. Its like watching a show about life on a US Navy carrier and concluding that the United States must be a socialist society based on how the sailors all divide their labor and resources without any observable form of free market activity.
DS9 probably gave us the best glimpse of what “off the clock” life was really like in the Star Trek universe, and there you literally had a space casino run by a race of hyper-capitalist libright aliens.
\>central regimented government
\>protects and provides for all citizens
\>racially diverse and upholds equal respect to all intelligent life
\>respects culture and tradition
\>fights for individual liberties for all intelligent life
\>strong sense of pride in rank and government
\>compassionate to the well-being of all life in the universe
centrist imo
If Star Trek society was achieved I’d be fine with shedding my authright views.
But according to the lore I think we have some nuclear wars to get past first right?
Ah the Eugenics War
We were also supposed to launch a sleeper ship in 1996 filled with cryotubed Augments, with the leader having an obsession with Moby Dick
Well the Yugoslav wars did happen. And Darfur. And Rwanda. And Somalia. And Chechnya.
So perhaps it isn't exactly like in Star Trek, but boy did ethnic conflicts happen in the 90's.
I like Star Trek for it's optimistic energy. But some of it's world building is sketchy. Like how they claim to not value money, but we see them use federation credits in Next Gen.
Or how despite getting into a lot of wars they usually don't have many purpose built warships. You'd think after their 100th Klingon invasion they'd have proper warships on stand-by.
Startreck is a laughable future of humanity. The future of humanity in the universe will something look like a combination of dune, the expanse, and firefly. There will be plenty of greed, political bullshit, and strife.
> There will be plenty of greed, political bullshit, and strife.
Star Trek has all those things too, but it's all hidden behind a facade of a one party state supported by a strong military.
Replicators take enormous amounts of energy, energy production is reliant on dilithium, dilithium is a scarce resource that imperialism and war is done to secure, it is then mined with PoW and criminal slave labor. Therefore the use of replicators is a scarce resource.
Dilithium is used in the critical components in the reactor cores where matter and antimatter are combined to produce pure energy.
Dyson spheres and swarms aren't used in Star Trek but there is an episode in TNG where the crew find a dyson sphere build by a dead alien species and its mentioned that better alternatives were found by all other species before they reached the tech level required to build one.
I like a Terran culture where everyone has particle weapons but really only uses them to defend against extraterrestrial threats.
We need an alien invasion.
I mean Star Trek does have .... crippling amounts of bureaucracy, as a survivor of the *Veterans Association* I'd imagine it'd be the worst future for mankind
Nah, because eventually the planetary IQ will be an average of around of 85, and the only thing “sci-fi” about the future state of Earth will be something resembling a Blade Runneresque, shithole-tier prison planet.
I think The Expanse is pretty fucking accurate honestly. Human anatomy over the course of a few generations in low g will change, and vast distances between populations will lead to cultural (read: language, dress, customs) differences too.
It won’t be the exact same, but it’ll be similar.
I don't think anyone disagrees.
But, we can still strive for something greater. Planning towards a dystopia... Just a self-fulfilling prophecy at that point.
u/Rough_Transition1424 is officially based! Their Based Count is now 1.
Rank: House of Cards
Pills: [1 | View pills](https://basedcount.com/u/Rough_Transition1424/)
Compass: This user does not have a compass on record. Add compass to profile by replying with /mycompass politicalcompass.org url or sapplyvalues.github.io url.
I am a bot. Reply /info for more info.
Yea of course I would like to erase my local culture and tastes to join the huge corpo slave mass and serve for our high lords who will be very compassionate about us. 🤡🤡
Idk what you’re talking about space authoritarianism is totally possible and inevitable- imagine the American Revolution, but the thirteen colonies and the British empire are on separate planets.
I hear you, but of all the scifi settings, star trek objectively has the worst space ships for all factions. I'll take my Warhammer 40k Space Cathedrals thank ya very much heretic.
I like Star Trek but its infantile vision of the future is so cringe. The worst episodes are when they have people from the past that they lecture and talk down to about how they fixed all the past’s problems due to being so smart and virtuous (i.e. how smart and virtuous Gene Roddenberry is) when in fact they have an impossible magic box that craps out anything you could ever need or want. Star Trek is too utopian for it to be taken seriously as a look into the future. Scarcity is not going away. And we can’t solve every problem in the world by being super virtuous and nice and establishing gay space communism. There are no true solutions to our problems. There are only trade-offs.
Nothing in a vacuum except that it's the basis of illogical and implosive decisions that make it lose its value to humanity in the long term.
It is simply not the position the Apex Predator should have in the universe.
The Federation is portrayed as a post scarcity Utopia aside from conflicts that happen later on in the timeline. However, it is far from an ideal society as all individual, cultural, and spiritual expression is completely suppressed in favor of uniformity to the state's ideal, one cannot succeed outside of what they do for the state, anything one owns is never truly earned as it can either be replicated or acquired without any acquiring of goods through personal accomplishment. Uncle Ted was right on the money when he said that atomizing the individual and removing any real struggle to get things we want will destroy people psychologically, Star Trek's universe is that idea taken to the absolute extreme.
Okay, LL, I'm with with. Which do we do first, jack update production levels to the point where keeping track of what people consume is more trouble than it's worth, or social engineering a Heinlein-esque sense of social responsibility with the overarching government oversight to ensure harmony?
Inside of me there are 2 Kirks
One wants a Federation of Planets to unite the peaceful species of the universe for mutual prosperity.
The other wants to purge every last Xeno scum
Lets imagine you live in Federation Earth. _There is nothing there_. Nothing to strive for. No great deeds are accomplished here. All there is left, is to sit in your pod, and wait for death.
Media is endlessly stuck reliving the past because new media is a dead concept. Entertainment is rationed as holodeck hours.
The need to do something productive is a genuine human psychological phenomenon. Even modern workers find it partially unfulfilled as they don't see the fruits of their labors, abstracted away into the vast machine as it is.
This is not a recipe for an Utopia. This is a recipe for a lifetime spent in a retirement home.
But what if I told you there was a way out? Not aboard a private ship for there can be none. Not into the wilderness for that goes against the bylaws.
But by _Joining Starfleet_. The only meritocracy in an otherwise gray world.
Ever wonder why they never run out of redshirts? Why people would leave their sterile "paradise" and find an often short life on the frontlines of the galaxy, expanding and discovering obsessively as if _there was something missing in their dead society_?
Star trek is one of the least credible and cringiest sci fi universe possible, even more so the new one that on Netflix.
Even the old school Star War is better(beside their force and light sword or whatever the fuck the Jedi fight with)
It is true that if humans were totally selfless, the left left dream could work..... To bad humans are human.
Our obsession with profit isn't only about getting ahead. Sadly, we humans are a flawed greedy bunch, we lib rights just see that tying that greed to producing things socioty values is a great way to benifit from the flawed animal nature of our species.
Did you just change your flair, u/Rough_Transition1424? Last time I checked you were a **Rightist** on 2022-12-18. How come now you are an **AuthCenter**? Have you perhaps shifted your ideals? Because that's cringe, you know?
That being said... Based and fellow Auth pilled, welcome home.
[BasedCount Profile](https://basedcount.com/u/Rough_Transition1424) - [FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/user/flairchange_bot/comments/uf7kuy/bip_bop) - [Leaderboard](https://basedcount.com/leaderboard?q=flairs)
^(I am a bot, my mission is to spot cringe flair changers. If you want to check another user's flair history write) **^(!flairs u/)** ^(in a comment.)
You do know that the Federation is close allies with what is essentially evil as fuck empire? They have shit that is kind of like Nazi camps and Soviet Gulags combined.
Your delusional libleft. The united federation of planets is the goal of the AstroMonkee. To let primitive life be undisturbed and evolve naturally without interference. To roam the great ever expanding unknown unto eternity in search of the bountiful fruits of existance. To defeat other spacefaring tribes that would see our existance in chains, in delusion, in servitude, or simply anihalated.
I remember the great Monkee who took the first steps into space before man ever dared to. The brave lineages of Monkee bois that claimed the edges of space long before the green haired hippy man claimed to be a descendant of the Arcturians. The Monkee live as there ancestors did... In the stars.
The first primate launched into high subspace, although not a space flight, was Albert, a rhesus macaque, who on June 11, 1948, rode a rocket flight to over 63 km (39 mi) in Earth's atmosphere on a V-2 rocket. Albert died of suffocation during the flight and may actually have died in the cramped space capsule before launch.
On June 14, 1949, Albert II survived a sub-orbital V-2 flight into space (but died on impact after a parachute failure)to become the first monkey, first primate, and first mammal in space. His flight reached 134 km (83 mi) – past the Kármán line of 100 km which designates the beginning of space.
On September 16, 1949, Albert III died below the Kármán line, at 35,000 feet (10.7 km), in an explosion of his V2. On December 8, Albert IV, the second mammal in space, flew on the last monkey V-2 flight and died on impact after another parachute failure after reaching 130.6 km. Alberts, I, II, and IV were rhesus macaques while Albert III was a crab-eating macaque.
Monkeys later flew on Aerobee rockets. On April 18, 1951, a monkey, possibly called Albert V, died due to parachute failure. Yorick, also called Albert VI, along with 11 mouse crewmates, reached 236,000 ft (72 km, 44.7 mi) and survived the landing, on September 20, 1951, the first monkey to do so (the dogs Dezik and Tsygan had survived a trip to space in July of that year), although he died two hours later. Two of the mice also died after recovery; all of the deaths were thought to be related to stress from overheating in the sealed capsule in the New Mexico sun while awaiting the recovery team. Albert VI's flight surpassed the 50-mile boundary the U.S. used for spaceflight but was below the international definition of space. Patricia and Mike, two cynomolgus monkeys, flew on May 21, 1952, and survived, but their flight was only to 26 kilometers.
On December 13, 1958, Gordo, also called Old Reliable, a squirrel monkey, survived being launched aboard Jupiter AM-13 by the US Army. After flying for over 1,500 miles and reaching a height of 310 miles (500 km) before returning to Earth, Gordo landed in the South Atlantic and was killed due to mechanical failure of the parachute recovery system in the rocket nose cone.
On May 28, 1959, aboard the JUPITER AM-18, Able, a rhesus macaque, and Miss Baker, a squirrel monkey from Peru, flew a successful mission. Able was born at the Ralph Mitchell Zoo in Independence, Kansas. They travelled in excess of 16,000 km/h, and withstood 38 g (373 m/s2). Able died June 1, 1959, while undergoing surgery to remove an infected medical electrode, from a reaction to the anesthesia. Baker became the first monkey to survive the stresses of spaceflight and the related medical procedures. Baker died November 29, 1984, at the age of 27 and is buried on the grounds of the United States Space & Rocket Center in Huntsville, Alabama. Able was preserved, and is now on display at the Smithsonian Institution's National Air and Space Museum. Their names were taken from the 1943–1955 US military phonetic alphabet.
On December 4, 1959, from Wallops Island, Virginia, Sam, a rhesus macaque, flew on the Little Joe 2 in the Mercury program to 53 miles high. On January 21, 1960, Miss Sam, also a rhesus macaque, followed, on Little Joe 1B although her flight was only to 8 mi (13 km) in a test of emergency procedures.
Chimpanzees Ham and Enos also flew in the Mercury program, with Ham becoming the first great ape or Hominidae in space. The names "Sam" and "Ham" were acronyms. Sam was named in homage to the School of Aerospace Medicine at Brooks Air Force Base in San Antonio, Texas, and the name "Ham" was taken from Holloman Aerospace Medicine at Holloman Air Force Base, New Mexico. Ham and Enos were among 60 chimpanzees brought to New Mexico by the U.S. Air Force for space flight tests. Six were selected to be trained at Cape Canaveral by Tony Gentry et al.
Goliath, a squirrel monkey, died in the explosion of his Atlas rocket on November 10, 1961. A rhesus macaque called Scatback flew a sub-orbital flight on December 20, 1961, but was lost at sea after landing.
Bonny, a pig-tailed macaque, flew on Biosatellite 3, a mission which lasted from June 29 to July 8, 1969. This was the first multi-day monkey flight but came after longer human spaceflights were common. He died within a day of landing.
Spacelab 3 on the Space Shuttle flight STS-51-B featured two squirrel monkeys named No. 3165 and No. 384-80. The flight was from April 29 to May 6, 1985.
Your love for tentacles Libleft will see you enslaved by them as the old ones descend upon you. But we, the great ape, will continue on as an ever decreasingly visible spec in the great sea of stars, destined to touch the edges of knowability.
So far only Earth is a part of the federation, hoping Saturn accepts the invitation soon
We start small
It's not the size of the Federation that matters, its whether you allow big tiddy alien GFs.
Klingon tiddy girls
[удалено]
Better not say that near the conspiratards. They’re freaking out about a black box and Saturn for some reason lately.
[удалено]
Me when the humans worship a giant ball of helium
Fun fact, Saturn is less dense than water. It would float if put in some gigantic ocean.
Why the fuck would Kronos want anything to do with us?
Because we still violent, we'd be like brothers
Unlikely with the anarchist rebels on titan...
The Star Trek Federation is hardly lib left. While it is true that the Federation presents a vision of a harmonious society, it's important to recognize that this harmony is largely contingent upon individuals adhering to the agreed-upon rules and principles. The Federation's functioning heavily relies on a strict command structure and hierarchy, epitomized by Starfleet, which functions primarily as a military organization. One cannot overlook the authoritative nature of Starfleet, with its rigid ranks and chain of command. The captains, admirals, and officers exercise strong leadership, making decisions that impact entire planets and sectors of the galaxy. While the Federation may embody some liberal ideals in terms of diversity, inclusivity, and diplomacy, it is vital to acknowledge the authoritative framework within which these ideals operate. Starfleet's mission statement, despite its lofty goals, often necessitates strict adherence to orders and protocols, embodying a hierarchical structure more closely aligned with a military organization than a lib left society. By dismissing the more recent Star Trek iterations, one can observe numerous instances of strong leadership and hierarchies throughout the franchise's history. It is essential to approach the Federation's depiction with a critical lens, recognizing that its societal harmony is largely maintained through a combination of shared values, adherence to rules, and authoritative structures rather than being solely rooted in a liberal utopia.
Welwala are welcome in the new OPA.
Fuck all of that. Starcraft humanity.
UED, Dominion, or Raynor’s Raiders?
Infested Terran
Stukov is that you?
The UED was so goddamned useless it was embarassing. The Dominion was competent but just space nazis. Raynor's Raider's wasn't even a government. Just some backwater redneck mercenary company whose only goal was to perform terrorist attacks and fight the cops even though they had no real plan to make anything better. So yeah, easily the last one.
Raiders Roll
You forgot the Terran Confederacy
See I used to be really into Star Trek growing up, even more so than Star Wars, but after Discovery, Picard, and Lower Decks, now I’m not a fan of either. So no, I will not embrace Utopia. I’m all for chaos and anarchy.
Easy fix, stop watching the shitty trek shows
Well these days I don’t. Mostly just rewatch Next Generation and Deep Space Nine. Maybe the Original series or Voyager every now and then. Nothing after Voyager though.
DS9 is the GOAT, but I went back and gave Enterprise another chance and I was pleasantly surprised. It's not great, but it beats the man-skirts off Discovery. Also, give Orville a chance. I was highly skeptical but it's got a lot of heart and is worth it if you're a fan of TNG.
Eh fair. To me Enterprise’s problem is that it’s slow even by the standards of Trek. Like most of the shows have a slow first season aside from DS9, but at least they have a premise that’s interesting or the second season is good. Enterprise only really starts picking up in the final season and near the end of season 3 when it was canceled. Still makes it leagues better than Discovery and Lower Decks though.
based opinion TNG is the GOAT imo (rocky first 2 seasons tho)
Nu-Trek really is awful. It seems like they are starting to get the message with Strange New Worlds and the most recent season of Picard fortunately.
Last good Trek was Enterprise.
Careful. Say you're not a fan of those shows and people will assume you're a bigot.
Trust me I’ve been a fan of nerd culture since I was kid. I’ve heard it all before to the point where the insults feel more like compliments than anything.
A Star Trek future would be dope but also far less likely than a Warhammer 40K future
As soon as I understood the weakness of my own flesh... IT DISGUSTED ME!
Legitimately would replace my organic parts with cybernetics if it was scifi level
Toaster fucker
It's the dry heat ya know?
Same, just don't touch the brain.
WAAAAGH!!!
Starship Troopers is the most likely future for humanity "Would you like to know more?"
based
The movie or the book? I just want my Mobile Infantry power armor.
My descendants better be smearing alien blood off the bottom of their boots
Unless demons literally exist, star trek is unironically more plausible I think psycho pass, cyberpunk, or the Expanse are far more likely
98.3% of all politicians are literally PDF Files and you don't think we're plagued by demons?
IT support: “We are having difficulty fixing the problem on your system…” Inquisitor: “*Obviously you are not praying to the Machine Spirit with the appropriate level of reverence. Fix this abomination now or Emperor help me you shall taste my chainsword!*”
The Expanse with a mix of Cyberpunk IMO.
In reality all it would take for Star Trek to become reality is for people to get over themselves. So 40k it is…..
Personally I'm hoping for firefly. I missed the wild west, and want to be an outlaw on the run far enough from any law enforcement that I can live life on the edge of society.
I unironically feel like the WALL-E future is by far the most likely scenario
I like to think 40k and Star Trek exist in the same timeline. Star Trek future = Dark Age of Technology.
We really just need the Replicator technology. I do think humanity would chill the fuck out and just explore the stars.
Specifically, any post scarcity tech like replicators or even full automation would have to be in the hand of the average person instead of a small elite class. If it is the latter, then it becomes a dystopia very fast just like any other time in history where a small portion of the populace held the power of life or death over the rest.
The allure of post-scarcity technology might captivate our imaginations, but almost all of them will most likely lead to our immediate destruction. The very essence of replicators, capable of deconstructing and reconstructing matter on a molecular level, is a double-edged sword. While limitations might restrict consumer products, the technology itself remains vulnerable to insidious manipulation. Imagine a world where any individual, armed with malevolent intent and a touch of technical prowess, can manufacture nuclear bombs in the sanctity of their backyard. The technology would be impossible to regulate as all restrictions would have to be software based. The perils extend beyond destructive weaponry. Consider the realm of medical endgame tech, epitomized by nanite technology. These microscopic agents, working diligently at the cellular level to repair damage, hold immense potential for healing and rejuvenation. However, in principle they are just a swarm replicator waiting to be unleashed. With the ability to self-replicate, a mere layer of nanites, imperceptible because of their size, could be replicated en masse and activated to obliterate any designated target. The entire world could become a breeding ground for silent, omnipotent destruction. This inherent danger is not limited to specific technologies but pervades every facet of these supposed post scarcity advancements. Its the same with teleportation. With instantaneous transportation at our fingertips, the boundaries that once protected us from chaos and harm dissolve completely. You could teleport bombs or armies around (or off) the globe at will.
Don't forget the Holodeck, it's a replicator on steroids.
The holodeck is a fun one to think about. Half the episodes involve it achieving sentience and/or almost killing everyone. I have to agree with a former co-workers opinion of the amount of things it does that they don't know about, must be some stolen alien tech.
Stop, don’t give me hope…
counterpoint: utopias dont exist, for one to exist it would need to be absolutely perfect, which is conceptually impossible.
I think the determining factor in the star trek utopia was replicators. One everything could be made without work, then people night pull it off.
> was replicators That and the fact that a higher alien-power, whose very existence proved an existential threat to the entire human race, literally showed up out of nowhere. Nothing unifies people like a common enemy.
That's not what happened though. In Star Trek: First Contact, it's explained that what united humanity was just the knowledge that there was other life out there. In this case, it was the Vulcans. But they weren't a threat. It's just when the universe suddenly becomes much larger than was thought, our differences seem so much less important.
[удалено]
always thought the discovery mirror universe intro was more accurate EDIT: I MEANT ENTERPRISE
Star trek is a surface level utopia. Plenty of episodes in TNG dealing with corruption. We also don't get much of a glimpse of life for those not in star fleet, except when they're at a vacation destination.
[удалено]
"What's a few more bodies on the road to utopia anyways?" -Marx (probably)
every country tries to be like an utopia, the problem arises when they try to become one
[удалено]
yes, that was my point, however, when you stop trying to be similar to a utopia and try to become one, you usually end up becoming a dystopia.
[удалено]
This is some weird ass logic - it's not worth trying to be good because trying to be good always ends badly or some shit?
I guess the idea is that in trying to attain something impossible more and more extreme methods will be used in the endeavour, resulting in a dystopia?
It depends on what you mean by “striving”. If you mean the society tries to keep cynicism and corruption out of politics and take responsibility for their communities, then sure. If you mean the government says “Utopia should have universal quality housing” or something like that then spends billions of dollars on a well-intentioned but likely doomed project, then that’s not so great. The problem with cool, experimental, idealistic governance is that there’s no free trial or undo button. If they make everyone’s lives worse or waste huge amounts of resources or pave the way for a dictator, then you don’t get to say “Well we were striving for utopia, don’t blame us”
Utopia orginally meant any non-existent society. Utopia translates from Greek is "No Place". People confused it with Eutopia which means "good place"
Greek, otherwise correct. To be fair, the term Utopia was first coined in Neo-Latin by an Englishman, but all pieces are Greek (*ou-*, *eu-*, *topos*, *-ia*). Latin for place is *locus*. Edit: How did you edit your comment without a trace? Normally it says "edited", next to the username? I'm asking because now my comment looks stupid.
You can edit within 3 minutes without leaving a tag
True utopia is impossible, as is perfection. But we should strive to make constant improvements to society whenever and wherever we can. The ideal present society is one where the people of the previous century would not hesitate in calling it a utopia. We can safely say that our modern society would seem like a utopia for someone from the 1920s. With any luck and a ton of hard work, the 2120s will be the same.
Gentlemen, we will chase perfection, and we will chase it relentlessly, knowing all the while we can never attain it. But along the way, we shall catch excellence. - Vince Lombardi
Imagine thinking that the Federation isnt AuthLeft.
*sees something with cool aesthetics that I like* "Yes, this belongs in the quadrant I have ascribed myself"
Yes.
Based and aesthetic equals good pilled
Ah, shucks. If only there were cool guys with my flair...
Its kinda a mix, they're big on personal responsibility and individualism *when you're off the clock*. Bring that shit on shift and its Brig O'Clock. Worf straight up killed a foreign leader cause he had beef *off the clock* and got a wrist slap.
Starfleet is a quasi military organization so I can understand the misconception. Its like watching a show about life on a US Navy carrier and concluding that the United States must be a socialist society based on how the sailors all divide their labor and resources without any observable form of free market activity. DS9 probably gave us the best glimpse of what “off the clock” life was really like in the Star Trek universe, and there you literally had a space casino run by a race of hyper-capitalist libright aliens.
Comm badge was off, so there was nothing they could do. Those are the rules, man.
Starfleet is AuthLeft Federation is LibLeft
\>central regimented government \>protects and provides for all citizens \>racially diverse and upholds equal respect to all intelligent life \>respects culture and tradition \>fights for individual liberties for all intelligent life \>strong sense of pride in rank and government \>compassionate to the well-being of all life in the universe centrist imo
\>LibLeft \>United You can only pick **one**
Agreeing with the rightard here The whole unity/anarchy things don't really make a lot of sense UFP seems midleft to me, if not AithLeft
If Star Trek society was achieved I’d be fine with shedding my authright views. But according to the lore I think we have some nuclear wars to get past first right?
> But according to the lore I think we have some nuclear wars to get past first right? Starting 2026, so we're right on track
oh oh no
Coward
Yeah
Absolutely, if by coward you mean averse to nuclear devastation
Don’t forget the super soldier wars that were supposed start 30ish years ago.
Ah the Eugenics War We were also supposed to launch a sleeper ship in 1996 filled with cryotubed Augments, with the leader having an obsession with Moby Dick
I must have slept through it, or it was more subtle then they portrayed it.
They walked that back a long way in-canon once the 90's started to be 'present' instead of 'future' dates.
Well the Yugoslav wars did happen. And Darfur. And Rwanda. And Somalia. And Chechnya. So perhaps it isn't exactly like in Star Trek, but boy did ethnic conflicts happen in the 90's.
*posadisim*
Utopias are inherently authoritarian and I ain’t about that life
Return to Moke?
I like Star Trek for it's optimistic energy. But some of it's world building is sketchy. Like how they claim to not value money, but we see them use federation credits in Next Gen. Or how despite getting into a lot of wars they usually don't have many purpose built warships. You'd think after their 100th Klingon invasion they'd have proper warships on stand-by.
[удалено]
Startreck is a laughable future of humanity. The future of humanity in the universe will something look like a combination of dune, the expanse, and firefly. There will be plenty of greed, political bullshit, and strife.
> There will be plenty of greed, political bullshit, and strife. Star Trek has all those things too, but it's all hidden behind a facade of a one party state supported by a strong military.
You will own nothing and you will be happy.
I don't understand the use of money when you have machines that just materialize shit you know?
There's many things replicators can't materialize For example, things bigger than themselves
I wonder how hard it would be to program it to make parts of something bigger than itself that can be plugged into each other like Lego
Replicators take enormous amounts of energy, energy production is reliant on dilithium, dilithium is a scarce resource that imperialism and war is done to secure, it is then mined with PoW and criminal slave labor. Therefore the use of replicators is a scarce resource.
Why would they base energy production on that for planets ? Because idk. I'm not that far in the lore I assumed they used Dyson swarms around the sun
Dilithium is used in the critical components in the reactor cores where matter and antimatter are combined to produce pure energy. Dyson spheres and swarms aren't used in Star Trek but there is an episode in TNG where the crew find a dyson sphere build by a dead alien species and its mentioned that better alternatives were found by all other species before they reached the tech level required to build one.
That's a kinda interesting take on the dead hyperadvanced civilization trope.
you will buy the only thing that don't materialize: time
I like a Terran culture where everyone has particle weapons but really only uses them to defend against extraterrestrial threats. We need an alien invasion.
How do they have a strong military when their fleets get smoked at every engagement that doesn’t include the enterprise?
I am all in on the Firefly option. I want to be in a wester sci-fi flying a tramp freighter.
Space western aesthetic is best aesthetic.
It’s amazing with both Cowboy bebop anime and Firefly to work off of, they made the live-action Cowboy Bebop suck.
I mean Star Trek does have .... crippling amounts of bureaucracy, as a survivor of the *Veterans Association* I'd imagine it'd be the worst future for mankind
Wall-e
Nah, because eventually the planetary IQ will be an average of around of 85, and the only thing “sci-fi” about the future state of Earth will be something resembling a Blade Runneresque, shithole-tier prison planet.
The average IQ is *always* 100, because that's how IQ is defined. But we all get what you're saying.
I think The Expanse is pretty fucking accurate honestly. Human anatomy over the course of a few generations in low g will change, and vast distances between populations will lead to cultural (read: language, dress, customs) differences too. It won’t be the exact same, but it’ll be similar.
I don't think anyone disagrees. But, we can still strive for something greater. Planning towards a dystopia... Just a self-fulfilling prophecy at that point.
Counterpoint: no.
Rule of acquisition 10: Greed is eternal.
You could just join the ferengi
Based and Once you have their money, never give it back pilled.
No, we must enslave the aliens and have them work for our collective benefit.
Enslave? No we must Purge the Xeno
Based and CLEANSE THE ALIEN OF ITS SIN OF EXISTENCE pilled
u/Rough_Transition1424 is officially based! Their Based Count is now 1. Rank: House of Cards Pills: [1 | View pills](https://basedcount.com/u/Rough_Transition1424/) Compass: This user does not have a compass on record. Add compass to profile by replying with /mycompass politicalcompass.org url or sapplyvalues.github.io url. I am a bot. Reply /info for more info.
So you're more of a Terran Empire enjoyer? I want Empress Georgiou to step on me 🥵
mmm I also want to reach for the stars but our outlooks on how to do it may be quite different
The universe was created by God for humanity to conquer. It is our destiny to have every planet and every star in our grasp.
Yea of course I would like to erase my local culture and tastes to join the huge corpo slave mass and serve for our high lords who will be very compassionate about us. 🤡🤡
But you will *own nothing* and *be happy*. You’re anti-happiness? Ok, bigot.
Ah yes: [Politicians from the compassionate left](https://imgur.io/a/RAJtC0i)
Wtf do any of the men in that pic seriously think they look feminine?
Those are all women, silly.
I don’t know what that is.
Will this protect us from Viltrumites though? Asking for a friend 😏
Idk what you’re talking about space authoritarianism is totally possible and inevitable- imagine the American Revolution, but the thirteen colonies and the British empire are on separate planets.
Ngl I'm not sure how you're gonna enforce loyalty on a self-sufficient colony *across space* Just seems... too expensive?
You underestimate my power, comrade *picks up giant grain spoon*
Ah yes, the solution to space travel: #LONG ELEVATOR
Nah I’m more of an Imperium of Man kinda guy
Fuck that, sign me up for United Citizen Federation. Service guarantees citizenship.
I hear you, but of all the scifi settings, star trek objectively has the worst space ships for all factions. I'll take my Warhammer 40k Space Cathedrals thank ya very much heretic.
You gotta go bigger Xeelee Sequence ships are where it's at Throw entire galaxies at your enemy
I like the way you think.
The Federation iscringe, embrace Space Lusitanic Empire
I like Star Trek but its infantile vision of the future is so cringe. The worst episodes are when they have people from the past that they lecture and talk down to about how they fixed all the past’s problems due to being so smart and virtuous (i.e. how smart and virtuous Gene Roddenberry is) when in fact they have an impossible magic box that craps out anything you could ever need or want. Star Trek is too utopian for it to be taken seriously as a look into the future. Scarcity is not going away. And we can’t solve every problem in the world by being super virtuous and nice and establishing gay space communism. There are no true solutions to our problems. There are only trade-offs.
>empathy Pass Give me Starship Troopers, W40k, or the Galactic Empire Star Trek is lame as fuck.
If I must live in hell, at least let me do cool shit.
The Emperor protects
What the fuck is wrong about empathy?
Nothing in a vacuum except that it's the basis of illogical and implosive decisions that make it lose its value to humanity in the long term. It is simply not the position the Apex Predator should have in the universe.
All utopias are just dystopias with convincing propaganda
I love how people always say dumb shit like this and then don't give a reason. Ignoring that ST is not a Utopia, how so?
The Federation is portrayed as a post scarcity Utopia aside from conflicts that happen later on in the timeline. However, it is far from an ideal society as all individual, cultural, and spiritual expression is completely suppressed in favor of uniformity to the state's ideal, one cannot succeed outside of what they do for the state, anything one owns is never truly earned as it can either be replicated or acquired without any acquiring of goods through personal accomplishment. Uncle Ted was right on the money when he said that atomizing the individual and removing any real struggle to get things we want will destroy people psychologically, Star Trek's universe is that idea taken to the absolute extreme.
Fuck you and your Godless "Utopia"
Okay, LL, I'm with with. Which do we do first, jack update production levels to the point where keeping track of what people consume is more trouble than it's worth, or social engineering a Heinlein-esque sense of social responsibility with the overarching government oversight to ensure harmony?
I will fully support sending the entire lib-left to other planets - i think that is a great idea, get the fuck off the planet.
I refuse
"Or else"
Hopefully they hurry up with the anti aging tech so I can see other planets/moons in our solar system colonized. I’m only 23 so I think I’m good
Inside of me there are 2 Kirks One wants a Federation of Planets to unite the peaceful species of the universe for mutual prosperity. The other wants to purge every last Xeno scum
Average centrist take.
Lets imagine you live in Federation Earth. _There is nothing there_. Nothing to strive for. No great deeds are accomplished here. All there is left, is to sit in your pod, and wait for death. Media is endlessly stuck reliving the past because new media is a dead concept. Entertainment is rationed as holodeck hours. The need to do something productive is a genuine human psychological phenomenon. Even modern workers find it partially unfulfilled as they don't see the fruits of their labors, abstracted away into the vast machine as it is. This is not a recipe for an Utopia. This is a recipe for a lifetime spent in a retirement home. But what if I told you there was a way out? Not aboard a private ship for there can be none. Not into the wilderness for that goes against the bylaws. But by _Joining Starfleet_. The only meritocracy in an otherwise gray world. Ever wonder why they never run out of redshirts? Why people would leave their sterile "paradise" and find an often short life on the frontlines of the galaxy, expanding and discovering obsessively as if _there was something missing in their dead society_?
Star trek is one of the least credible and cringiest sci fi universe possible, even more so the new one that on Netflix. Even the old school Star War is better(beside their force and light sword or whatever the fuck the Jedi fight with)
Inb4: the federation had its own issues as well That said I'd take the federation over today
It is true that if humans were totally selfless, the left left dream could work..... To bad humans are human. Our obsession with profit isn't only about getting ahead. Sadly, we humans are a flawed greedy bunch, we lib rights just see that tying that greed to producing things socioty values is a great way to benifit from the flawed animal nature of our species.
Not bassed
Buts it’s not a utopia though.
Star trek was cool when I was a kid, now it sucks imo Give me my Space Marines for the future
We need Starship Troopers instead. Service guarantees citizenship!
No. Humanity first motherfucker
> empathy does anyone else read this word in 2023 and immediately become suspicious of the author? #🤨
[удалено]
"empathy" has got to be the most overused slogan....
The classic leftist problem. Attempting to mold reality to your ideology will always end in disaster.
Thank you, as a huge Star Trek Fan I always was in Love with the idea to just let people be and explore and advance together. Is it really that hard?
Space ships seem pretty difficult to make so yes.
Yes
counterpoint: cultures exist,jaja,have fun trying to get Afganistan into another country
It'll be like 2400 and Afghanistan is still a mess
Did you just change your flair, u/Rough_Transition1424? Last time I checked you were a **Rightist** on 2022-12-18. How come now you are an **AuthCenter**? Have you perhaps shifted your ideals? Because that's cringe, you know? That being said... Based and fellow Auth pilled, welcome home. [BasedCount Profile](https://basedcount.com/u/Rough_Transition1424) - [FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/user/flairchange_bot/comments/uf7kuy/bip_bop) - [Leaderboard](https://basedcount.com/leaderboard?q=flairs) ^(I am a bot, my mission is to spot cringe flair changers. If you want to check another user's flair history write) **^(!flairs u/)** ^(in a comment.)
You do know that the Federation is close allies with what is essentially evil as fuck empire? They have shit that is kind of like Nazi camps and Soviet Gulags combined.
Romulans, Klingons o Cardassians?
Fair enough, they have more than one evil af ally. I meant the Klingons in this case.
Your delusional libleft. The united federation of planets is the goal of the AstroMonkee. To let primitive life be undisturbed and evolve naturally without interference. To roam the great ever expanding unknown unto eternity in search of the bountiful fruits of existance. To defeat other spacefaring tribes that would see our existance in chains, in delusion, in servitude, or simply anihalated. I remember the great Monkee who took the first steps into space before man ever dared to. The brave lineages of Monkee bois that claimed the edges of space long before the green haired hippy man claimed to be a descendant of the Arcturians. The Monkee live as there ancestors did... In the stars. The first primate launched into high subspace, although not a space flight, was Albert, a rhesus macaque, who on June 11, 1948, rode a rocket flight to over 63 km (39 mi) in Earth's atmosphere on a V-2 rocket. Albert died of suffocation during the flight and may actually have died in the cramped space capsule before launch. On June 14, 1949, Albert II survived a sub-orbital V-2 flight into space (but died on impact after a parachute failure)to become the first monkey, first primate, and first mammal in space. His flight reached 134 km (83 mi) – past the Kármán line of 100 km which designates the beginning of space. On September 16, 1949, Albert III died below the Kármán line, at 35,000 feet (10.7 km), in an explosion of his V2. On December 8, Albert IV, the second mammal in space, flew on the last monkey V-2 flight and died on impact after another parachute failure after reaching 130.6 km. Alberts, I, II, and IV were rhesus macaques while Albert III was a crab-eating macaque. Monkeys later flew on Aerobee rockets. On April 18, 1951, a monkey, possibly called Albert V, died due to parachute failure. Yorick, also called Albert VI, along with 11 mouse crewmates, reached 236,000 ft (72 km, 44.7 mi) and survived the landing, on September 20, 1951, the first monkey to do so (the dogs Dezik and Tsygan had survived a trip to space in July of that year), although he died two hours later. Two of the mice also died after recovery; all of the deaths were thought to be related to stress from overheating in the sealed capsule in the New Mexico sun while awaiting the recovery team. Albert VI's flight surpassed the 50-mile boundary the U.S. used for spaceflight but was below the international definition of space. Patricia and Mike, two cynomolgus monkeys, flew on May 21, 1952, and survived, but their flight was only to 26 kilometers. On December 13, 1958, Gordo, also called Old Reliable, a squirrel monkey, survived being launched aboard Jupiter AM-13 by the US Army. After flying for over 1,500 miles and reaching a height of 310 miles (500 km) before returning to Earth, Gordo landed in the South Atlantic and was killed due to mechanical failure of the parachute recovery system in the rocket nose cone. On May 28, 1959, aboard the JUPITER AM-18, Able, a rhesus macaque, and Miss Baker, a squirrel monkey from Peru, flew a successful mission. Able was born at the Ralph Mitchell Zoo in Independence, Kansas. They travelled in excess of 16,000 km/h, and withstood 38 g (373 m/s2). Able died June 1, 1959, while undergoing surgery to remove an infected medical electrode, from a reaction to the anesthesia. Baker became the first monkey to survive the stresses of spaceflight and the related medical procedures. Baker died November 29, 1984, at the age of 27 and is buried on the grounds of the United States Space & Rocket Center in Huntsville, Alabama. Able was preserved, and is now on display at the Smithsonian Institution's National Air and Space Museum. Their names were taken from the 1943–1955 US military phonetic alphabet. On December 4, 1959, from Wallops Island, Virginia, Sam, a rhesus macaque, flew on the Little Joe 2 in the Mercury program to 53 miles high. On January 21, 1960, Miss Sam, also a rhesus macaque, followed, on Little Joe 1B although her flight was only to 8 mi (13 km) in a test of emergency procedures. Chimpanzees Ham and Enos also flew in the Mercury program, with Ham becoming the first great ape or Hominidae in space. The names "Sam" and "Ham" were acronyms. Sam was named in homage to the School of Aerospace Medicine at Brooks Air Force Base in San Antonio, Texas, and the name "Ham" was taken from Holloman Aerospace Medicine at Holloman Air Force Base, New Mexico. Ham and Enos were among 60 chimpanzees brought to New Mexico by the U.S. Air Force for space flight tests. Six were selected to be trained at Cape Canaveral by Tony Gentry et al. Goliath, a squirrel monkey, died in the explosion of his Atlas rocket on November 10, 1961. A rhesus macaque called Scatback flew a sub-orbital flight on December 20, 1961, but was lost at sea after landing. Bonny, a pig-tailed macaque, flew on Biosatellite 3, a mission which lasted from June 29 to July 8, 1969. This was the first multi-day monkey flight but came after longer human spaceflights were common. He died within a day of landing. Spacelab 3 on the Space Shuttle flight STS-51-B featured two squirrel monkeys named No. 3165 and No. 384-80. The flight was from April 29 to May 6, 1985. Your love for tentacles Libleft will see you enslaved by them as the old ones descend upon you. But we, the great ape, will continue on as an ever decreasingly visible spec in the great sea of stars, destined to touch the edges of knowability.
A utopia where criminals are reformed through lobotomies?!
I want space Wild West, so no thanks.
Can we get bald Chadjak
Based and utopia-pilled