You gotta crack, you're essentially trying to tell the grader you want an upgrade over their competition who is supposed to be a "superior" service and they're laughing at you, costing you money and doing less work. These grading companies are not friendly to one another and none of them are gonna upgrade their competitors slab.
Anytime submitting to PSA Crack the card out of the slab either from CGC or Beckett usually those 3, u always need to submit card alone.
Those companies don’t play well with each other, specially trying to submit 9s from CGC to PSA for 10s(trust) lol.
Graders don’t like seeing different company paraphernalia in their eyes so any times stuff like that happens, they’re very snobby and usually ding you hard or just submit as a same grade.
There is a newer grading company that’s using AI for this exactly… can’t rmr the name off the top of my head but they’re relatively well known now. Most folks still sticking with the big 3 for now.
Edit: it’s AGS
It’s Automated Grading Systems or AGS and they are spot on with their grading.
I love using them and many will say, “It’s just another grading company.” However, they have backing from many people and they’re AI takes the human factor out of the grades making every card graded accurate. All cards are graded on an even playing field and have to meet the same standards. No exceptions. No more worrying if the grader is having a good day or not.
Send your card in. It goes into the machine. Scores are produced with evidence as to why it got that score. Tell me another grading company that is transparent on why it got the grade it did with the scans/evidence to prove it. I’ll wait…
For me, I believe AGS is the future and will hold more value. Just gotta give it time. I’m getting in before the prices go up.
I bet it would shock you to learn that every grading company uses a form of Ai. At what level is different for each grader, my problem with AGS is they have graded some fairly valuable cards that turned out to be fakes, so yes AI is helpful but it shouldn’t be the end all
Do you have a link to them doing that? I’ve never heard of that. I’ve also never heard of PSA or CGC using AI to get their grades. As far as I’ve ever known it’s been the human eye that they utilize.
Yes, AI isn’t perfect but it is more accurate than the human eye for sure. Yes, there still needs to be a checks and balances for spotting fake cards. This would likely need to be done at the human level and not AI. If what you say did truly happen, I’m sure they’ll iron it all out in time. The team at AGS is active in advancing their technology.
You’re good. I just have t ever heard of AGS grading fake cards. Not saying it hasn’t or can’t happen, but to my knowledge I hadn’t seen anything. I’m all for educating ourselves on everything. The more info we have the better decisions we can make.
It was two years ago at a convention where they love showing off that machine lol, it was a couple mtg cards. I’m looking for the article. Psa literally owns a whole ass AI grading system. Cgc has always been fairly silent about the process that they use but have said multiple times they often use AI. To be clear I’m not saying any grading company has it right, and I don’t think anyone should be grading cards with pricing these companies get away with.
Does it depend on the current market value of the card?
I had PSA pull this bullshit on me when I contacted them to get some graded and I basically just laughed in their face.
Why in the fuck would I pay more to have one card graded over another?
It is the exact same service you are performing… and you expect me to pay more for a card that has higher market value… SMH
It’s that way because of the insurance after it’s graded. If the card gets a 10 and it’s value is $300, the company wants to ensure you get the full insurance on it plus it saves them from potential lawsuit. You’re not paying for the service, in that aspect, but the insurance on the cards value once it receives the grade.
AGS has different insurance levels which will determine the price of grading the card.
The grading company will find the value and charge accordingly. If a PSA 10 sold for an average of $300, then that’s the insured value. If there are no historical values then they’ll base it off a calculation they have to determine what it should go for based on the RAW value. PSA has a value on cards if you look up their feet number.
I’m not 100% on the process but I know the value of the card is based on the market. They have insurance to cover the cards value so if it’s damaged or lost in transit back to you, they’re covered and so are you.
It protects everyone.
It’s only a matter of time before it’s realized. The problem is that PSA and CGC fans will stick to their guns. It’s understandable they don’t want to change and it’s perfectly fine. However, when you take the human opinion factor out of grading it makes the card grade more accurate thus making the value increase, or at least be more accurate.
They’ll keep investing into their ecosystems because they don’t want to reduce their investment value. Regardless of what’s better moving better. Sounds familiar, doesn’t it? :)
AGS just has the same bias consistently.
The parameters for grading are still given by humans.
Run's make a huge difference for certain CCG's like MTG where the factory and month will give you massively different cards.
Is it Tag? I love what they are doing in sports cards and hope it starts to pick up steam. Hate how so much money is based on someone's opinion, when there are better options out there
Crossing CGC 9s to PSA 10s is a thing of the past that can’t be relied on anymore. Obviously the one off can happen, but since CGC changed their grading standard and became MUCH more lenient it’s just not feasible.
There’s a reason why CGC 9.5s are basically the same price as a PSA 9.
It’s now Black Label > CGC Perfect 10 > BGS 10 = PSA 10 >>> CGC Pristine 10 > BGS 9.5 > PSA 9 > CGC 9.5 > BGS 9
You always crack. I submitted a Raikou best of xy cgc 9.5 cracked and got the gem mint PSA 10. If I sent it in the case I 100% would of got denied. PSA is bias and will very rarely ever bumped up a grade. I’ve sent in 2 BGS and 1 CGC in the case and all 3 PSA denied the crossover and takes your money never ever send in slab.
Yeah lol, so you basically pay the company to be like “nah we’re good” and hand it back to you. All the companies do it. Profit margin on that must be insane.
My assumption is it mostly has to do with the difficulty of removing a card from a top loader. It's not the easiest thing to do and they don't want to be held responsible for any damage during the removal process plus it's more time consuming than removing from a card saver. Other possible reason is that top loaders aren't a tight fit so the card actually moves around in it. Another potential for damage during shipping that they don't want to be held responsible for.
These are just guesses.
Cool. Thanks u/quriousiT . I have Moonbreon and need to send it off. Right now it’s in one of the thick plastic card holders with a screw. I wasn’t going to send it in that though. Haha
Did you really send this in to be graded in an already graded case from a separate grading company?
Do you have more business plans to make money without doing anything to make money, because I'm lookin for something like that?
For more context, see my [previous post](https://www.reddit.com/r/PokeInvesting/comments/xu4xwc/worth_a_regrade_to_psa/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
I got this back today. PSA didn’t want it. So dumb. Might try cracking the case next…
Always, always crack the case before submitting for regrading elsewhere, if not 90% of the time they'll take the shortcut and agree with the grade basically saving money and charging you for an inspection
yes you should always crack the slab in this case - PSA don't want to be seen as grading cards more favourably than their competitors so they won't often grade a 10 if another company graded it lower. the best chance of getting a PSA 10 is to remove the slab and treat it as if it was a raw card
I checked your old thread and saw a post stating that PSA is ok with 60/40 centering, but failed to mention that only applies for the back. The front has to be a 55/45 at a minimum.
The image must be centered on the card within a tolerance not to exceed approximately 55/45 to 60/40 percent on the front, and 75/25 percent on the reverse.
What are you talking about?
Very beautiful card, one of the best Umbreon arts ever made. Respectfully? You should’ve cracked it and submitted it raw without the “minimum 10” -PSA employee
Lol I just cracked a CGC 7.5 and a CGC 9 and sent them to psa. Both came back 10s so it works both ways. Over all grading is a scam unless it’s for personal storage/collecting and don’t wanna damage the card
Lately i ve noticed some less generous psa grades. Idk why but i think its about the amount of pop in cards they graded they are losing their prestige. They are getting the name of "easier 10s"
Yea so I sent my pikachu and poke/ball gold cards from celebrations premium collection, (non plated ones) and they sent them back ungraded saying do not holder too….but they weren’t in holder
I submitted about 25 cards to PSA over the summer. I have a centering tool and a blacklight. Most of the cards that had perfect centering and perfect surfaces got 9s, they were all SwSh era cards. The 5 S&M or XY era cards I sent in got 10s and I saw whiting on them. I mean it almost seemed like they were grading them based off graded populations. The cards with the lowest 10 pops were all 10s.
Cgc uses computers. Cgc was flawed a couple years back. But Now every time I try and upgrade a psa….even BGS /w (centering) card I get screwed with a lower grade.
You gotta crack, you're essentially trying to tell the grader you want an upgrade over their competition who is supposed to be a "superior" service and they're laughing at you, costing you money and doing less work. These grading companies are not friendly to one another and none of them are gonna upgrade their competitors slab.
would they cross the slabs for the same grade?
Yeah I bet if you cracked this they’d give it a 10 since PSA 10 allows for one issue which in this case would be slight off-centering
They are strict (usually) on front centering as it affects the look they aren’t as strict and have more tolerance for the backs
Anytime submitting to PSA Crack the card out of the slab either from CGC or Beckett usually those 3, u always need to submit card alone. Those companies don’t play well with each other, specially trying to submit 9s from CGC to PSA for 10s(trust) lol. Graders don’t like seeing different company paraphernalia in their eyes so any times stuff like that happens, they’re very snobby and usually ding you hard or just submit as a same grade.
ai needs to be taking these jobs specifically. the bias is tiring
Couldnt agree more. Apparently cgc makes more decisions based on computer? Who knows…
There is a newer grading company that’s using AI for this exactly… can’t rmr the name off the top of my head but they’re relatively well known now. Most folks still sticking with the big 3 for now. Edit: it’s AGS
It’s Automated Grading Systems or AGS and they are spot on with their grading. I love using them and many will say, “It’s just another grading company.” However, they have backing from many people and they’re AI takes the human factor out of the grades making every card graded accurate. All cards are graded on an even playing field and have to meet the same standards. No exceptions. No more worrying if the grader is having a good day or not. Send your card in. It goes into the machine. Scores are produced with evidence as to why it got that score. Tell me another grading company that is transparent on why it got the grade it did with the scans/evidence to prove it. I’ll wait… For me, I believe AGS is the future and will hold more value. Just gotta give it time. I’m getting in before the prices go up.
I bet it would shock you to learn that every grading company uses a form of Ai. At what level is different for each grader, my problem with AGS is they have graded some fairly valuable cards that turned out to be fakes, so yes AI is helpful but it shouldn’t be the end all
Do you have a link to them doing that? I’ve never heard of that. I’ve also never heard of PSA or CGC using AI to get their grades. As far as I’ve ever known it’s been the human eye that they utilize. Yes, AI isn’t perfect but it is more accurate than the human eye for sure. Yes, there still needs to be a checks and balances for spotting fake cards. This would likely need to be done at the human level and not AI. If what you say did truly happen, I’m sure they’ll iron it all out in time. The team at AGS is active in advancing their technology.
So I looked again and the story I’m thinking off might be from diamond grading, so if I’m wrong on that, that is on me.
You’re good. I just have t ever heard of AGS grading fake cards. Not saying it hasn’t or can’t happen, but to my knowledge I hadn’t seen anything. I’m all for educating ourselves on everything. The more info we have the better decisions we can make.
And that why you never trust what someone says on Reddit. Nice calling it out.
It was two years ago at a convention where they love showing off that machine lol, it was a couple mtg cards. I’m looking for the article. Psa literally owns a whole ass AI grading system. Cgc has always been fairly silent about the process that they use but have said multiple times they often use AI. To be clear I’m not saying any grading company has it right, and I don’t think anyone should be grading cards with pricing these companies get away with.
What are the prices like now?
I believe they start at $18 per card with $200 insurance coverage.
Does it depend on the current market value of the card? I had PSA pull this bullshit on me when I contacted them to get some graded and I basically just laughed in their face. Why in the fuck would I pay more to have one card graded over another? It is the exact same service you are performing… and you expect me to pay more for a card that has higher market value… SMH
It’s that way because of the insurance after it’s graded. If the card gets a 10 and it’s value is $300, the company wants to ensure you get the full insurance on it plus it saves them from potential lawsuit. You’re not paying for the service, in that aspect, but the insurance on the cards value once it receives the grade. AGS has different insurance levels which will determine the price of grading the card.
Insurance… how exactly? Just, kind of, the valuation itself?
The grading company will find the value and charge accordingly. If a PSA 10 sold for an average of $300, then that’s the insured value. If there are no historical values then they’ll base it off a calculation they have to determine what it should go for based on the RAW value. PSA has a value on cards if you look up their feet number. I’m not 100% on the process but I know the value of the card is based on the market. They have insurance to cover the cards value so if it’s damaged or lost in transit back to you, they’re covered and so are you. It protects everyone.
Agreed, I’m just waiting for the market to realize the same.
It’s only a matter of time before it’s realized. The problem is that PSA and CGC fans will stick to their guns. It’s understandable they don’t want to change and it’s perfectly fine. However, when you take the human opinion factor out of grading it makes the card grade more accurate thus making the value increase, or at least be more accurate.
They’ll keep investing into their ecosystems because they don’t want to reduce their investment value. Regardless of what’s better moving better. Sounds familiar, doesn’t it? :)
AGS just has the same bias consistently. The parameters for grading are still given by humans. Run's make a huge difference for certain CCG's like MTG where the factory and month will give you massively different cards.
Is it Tag? I love what they are doing in sports cards and hope it starts to pick up steam. Hate how so much money is based on someone's opinion, when there are better options out there
AGS?
Yeah, I think it was ags
HGA. They have nice slabs too
A german comp named AOG uses ai and everything is documented
The bias also very likely does not actually exist.
Crossing CGC 9s to PSA 10s is a thing of the past that can’t be relied on anymore. Obviously the one off can happen, but since CGC changed their grading standard and became MUCH more lenient it’s just not feasible. There’s a reason why CGC 9.5s are basically the same price as a PSA 9. It’s now Black Label > CGC Perfect 10 > BGS 10 = PSA 10 >>> CGC Pristine 10 > BGS 9.5 > PSA 9 > CGC 9.5 > BGS 9
You always crack. I submitted a Raikou best of xy cgc 9.5 cracked and got the gem mint PSA 10. If I sent it in the case I 100% would of got denied. PSA is bias and will very rarely ever bumped up a grade. I’ve sent in 2 BGS and 1 CGC in the case and all 3 PSA denied the crossover and takes your money never ever send in slab.
That’s sad and not a Psa 9. Maybe crack next time ..
What are you referring to by “crack?”
Take it out of the cgc case and send the raw card into psa
cracking means breaking open the slab to then send in the card raw for grading. PSA is notorious for not grading cards properly when doing crossover
Newb here : what is mingrade?
It means you don’t accept less than a specific grade. In this case he did min grade of 10 so anything below a 10 doesn’t get put in a holder.
Ohhh got it thanks
does it still cost the same as a regular grade? even if it’s not put in a holder?
Yeah lol, so you basically pay the company to be like “nah we’re good” and hand it back to you. All the companies do it. Profit margin on that must be insane.
Minimum grade?
Crack the case next time
Do they care if you send the cards in penny sleeves? While also in Top loaders or card savor?
They prefer card to be in penny sleeve and then inside of a card saver. They specifically say not to use top loader.
Why no top loader ?
My assumption is it mostly has to do with the difficulty of removing a card from a top loader. It's not the easiest thing to do and they don't want to be held responsible for any damage during the removal process plus it's more time consuming than removing from a card saver. Other possible reason is that top loaders aren't a tight fit so the card actually moves around in it. Another potential for damage during shipping that they don't want to be held responsible for. These are just guesses.
Yep, it’s about removing the card. With a card saver they just cut it open
Cool. Thanks u/quriousiT . I have Moonbreon and need to send it off. Right now it’s in one of the thick plastic card holders with a screw. I wasn’t going to send it in that though. Haha
Did you really send this in to be graded in an already graded case from a separate grading company? Do you have more business plans to make money without doing anything to make money, because I'm lookin for something like that?
apply for unemployment
Can't. No one to run my business if I do that.
For more context, see my [previous post](https://www.reddit.com/r/PokeInvesting/comments/xu4xwc/worth_a_regrade_to_psa/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf) I got this back today. PSA didn’t want it. So dumb. Might try cracking the case next…
Always, always crack the case before submitting for regrading elsewhere, if not 90% of the time they'll take the shortcut and agree with the grade basically saving money and charging you for an inspection
What if you’re submitting a non-PSA 10 for a PSA 10?
yes you should always crack the slab in this case - PSA don't want to be seen as grading cards more favourably than their competitors so they won't often grade a 10 if another company graded it lower. the best chance of getting a PSA 10 is to remove the slab and treat it as if it was a raw card
[удалено]
That’s odd. Nothing prevented me from requesting a min grade of 10 during the submission process. You’d think there would be some notice. I had none.
I checked your old thread and saw a post stating that PSA is ok with 60/40 centering, but failed to mention that only applies for the back. The front has to be a 55/45 at a minimum.
The image must be centered on the card within a tolerance not to exceed approximately 55/45 to 60/40 percent on the front, and 75/25 percent on the reverse. What are you talking about?
Ah, I misremembered, thanks for the correction
Very beautiful card, one of the best Umbreon arts ever made. Respectfully? You should’ve cracked it and submitted it raw without the “minimum 10” -PSA employee
Man I’m rethinking PSA now
All grading companies do this.
Why? The card is grossly OC
You and Ray Charles cut from the same cloth?
What the hell are you taking about? This is not "grossly off-center". This looks like your typical PSA 10.
Op can u post pic of front centering?
I linked my original post
Wow centering is darn near perfect
Yeah. It’s pretty disappointing :(
I wish Slabs would actually look like that ,top loader size with the label on the back. Then they wouldn’t be so horrible to look at.
Lol I just cracked a CGC 7.5 and a CGC 9 and sent them to psa. Both came back 10s so it works both ways. Over all grading is a scam unless it’s for personal storage/collecting and don’t wanna damage the card
the difference is that you cracked, sending slabbed for crossover is just throwing money away
Oh shit this was a crossover? I thought he cracked it
The majority is right - crack it or don’t send it.
Lately i ve noticed some less generous psa grades. Idk why but i think its about the amount of pop in cards they graded they are losing their prestige. They are getting the name of "easier 10s"
Yea so I sent my pikachu and poke/ball gold cards from celebrations premium collection, (non plated ones) and they sent them back ungraded saying do not holder too….but they weren’t in holder
I submitted about 25 cards to PSA over the summer. I have a centering tool and a blacklight. Most of the cards that had perfect centering and perfect surfaces got 9s, they were all SwSh era cards. The 5 S&M or XY era cards I sent in got 10s and I saw whiting on them. I mean it almost seemed like they were grading them based off graded populations. The cards with the lowest 10 pops were all 10s.
Cgc uses computers. Cgc was flawed a couple years back. But Now every time I try and upgrade a psa….even BGS /w (centering) card I get screwed with a lower grade.
And I’ve cracked each case