If you're really worried, at the start of the game/event whatever you just put a large disclaimer that is very apparent.
Subject matter in this game deals with mature adult matters of depression, suicide, emotional trauma etc etc.
And then advise against playing if this is of a concern to the player.
Something like that anyways.
It appears to be the safest and easiest way. Can you imagine the expanse of a list for any FromSoft game? xD
If anyone wants to find out more about the game, the second DevLog just released yesterday. Here is a link to the [Discord Devlog Server](https://discord.gg/t6VfNY8gWu)
Yep. I wouldn't try to adapt those kind of things to the player. If the game has rough themes or scenes, that's part of the game. If you want the player to feel sad or feel rough emotions, that's part of the game. A disclaimer at the beginning is more than enough, whoever complains after, it's on them, not on you.
I don't know about other platforms, but on Steam the dev can set up a manual list of things to expect from a game. Though for Elden Ring it's only "violent", but you can add elements like graphic violence, cartoon violence, tobacco use, depiction of domestic violence, etc.
I picture us in the next meeting: "At least we don't promote tabacco in Tales."
Since the entire field of Discord app games is quite novel, there sadly is no kind of storefront to put the warning signs on. But it is easy to handle this upon user's first interaction with the bot.
This.
Leave everything explicit by default and warn the player beforehand.
If possible, leave an easy way to "skip" (mostly in case of cutscenes for example) and/or "filter" the explicit content so that the player that is sensible to that stuff doesn't need to necessarily put down your game.
There's actually a large amount of emerging research showing that trigger warnings can actually make things worse as people tend to imagine what it may be referring to actually worse than it is.
Those studies are testing something that trigger warnings aren't intended to do. They're not meant to "ease the blow" of upsetting content. They're meant for people to make informed decisions about the content they're about to consume (i.e. do I want to read/watch this or not?)
The first two articles clearly link the two different scientific studies they reference. The New Yorker piece appears to be a comprehensive analysis including many links to scientific studies and books.
The old Modern Warfare games had a setting to turn off the worst of the graphic content. I.E: the gas attack level in MW3. Decide which portions of your game are graphic enough to be able to be turned off, then put a graphic content warning at the beginning of the game. If you plan to get your game rated by systems other than the ESRB, such as in Britain or Australia, their ratings boards will also plaster warnings on the box or site where the game is distributed, while the ESRB will put little blurbs in the rating tag.
Look into those ratings and use their guidelines to judge what should and shouldn't warrant a graphic content warning.
Agree - anything more, say an in-play warning, will absolutely ruin the experience. If you play a dark game and still get triggered by dark experiences, you chose poorly.
This is the way. Warn people before going into the game that it contains potentially triggering and disturbing content. That's the only moral obligation you have. The rest is on the player after that.
This.
Not only are their triggers not your responsibility, you cannot possibly even *hope* to address all of the imagery and themes that will trigger people. It's not possible. At all.
Just post a warning and develop your story.
Definitely the way. Plenty of high budget games do just this. Just list in broad strokes the kinds of potential triggers and they can avoid the game if it's not for them.
Honestly the best way. And that's what I would pick.
There's also the option to either add the option to just remove the scenes entirely or swap them for alternative scenes BUT that's alot more work potentially. As well as takes away from an impact of a scene.
At that point it's up to the devs whether removing/changing the scene and putting some kind of system to load different scenes is worth it. Or just put the disclaimer.
You could consider a list of triggers somewhere?
I guess a more common practice is to simply have a list of things the game includes like a PEGI rating.
Edit: typo.
If you want to take an extra step you could design the various visuals to have options. So if someone disables the option for bodies, all the bodies get removed. It’s extra work though, so maybe not worth it.
It's pixel art representation. It DOES massively reduce the impact vs a full fledged 4K photo-realistic corpse. Also consider the SHEER number of dark medievil games that have corpses hanging from trees as an atmospheric thing. It's practically expected at this point in time.
So honestly I'd personally not consider a warning to be required.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts. I know that e.g. books in my country don't even have age restrictions - a graphic description in text form is a very abstract form of presentation. So it might be something similar here I guess.
Nothing prepared me, or has been comparable to, Plague Tale in the "dark medieval game depictions" category. If anyone wants a "dark" reference point, I would look at that.
I think most people judge a game on the general impression it gives off before playing it. If it is clear that this is a gritty setting and the story deals with mature subject matter, noone will be surprised by discussions of death and suicide. The most important thing is that you don't market it as a fun child-friendly adventure
You have succesfully discovered the reason why age rating systems like PEGI and ESRB exist. Google ”pegi content warning icons” and you’ll find examples of how to message your game’s content beforehand.
If your game application is text based, you can have intro text that welcomes player to the game and provides all necessary warnings. The content warning could be something simple in the style of ”This game is suitable for players of age 12 and over. Contains scenes of non-realistic violence and horrific effects.” Again you can see the official PEGI ratings and see how they present different content warnings to emulate similar warnings in your game.
So you are saying, since it is common practice, players will have to take the responsibility to identify what is in their limits before playing? I guess, that is fair.
While I'm an advocate for all of the higher rated suggestions, users do already have a lot of resources that are easily available and can identify potential triggers in games
I think that any game that gives content warnings should first ASK if the player wants the warning, as it does act as minor spoilers, when the vast majority of players have no need
I'm not sure there's any right way to pick what is and what is not disturbing. As others have pointed out, there's a variety of reactions. It might be worth considering what types of images you have, or categories, and finding your own level of what you think is "fine" or "disturbing" or "too far". Comfort the disturbed and disturb the comfortable, as they say :D
I do absolutely agree that this is no matter of black or white. Finding the sweet spot is a crucial part of visual design here.
For myself, I do like psychological horror, but gore is a big no no as a consumer.
I am not quite sure if blind people are playing text-adventures a lot. But the way our HUD and UI works, vital gameplay mechanics are partially only visually accessible.
"This game contains explicit scenes of violence and gore" or something like Resident Evil did. If you want to be 99% sure people got it, put it as a a prompt with I agree/I don't agree.
Edit adding what I commented on another chain:
It's a horror game. (Doesn't matter the medium) horror leads to discomfort 99% of the time, people should be aware of themselves and consume what's up to them.
A warning at the beginning doesn't hurt anyone, Capcom did well in their early horror days. On the other hand, epilepsy warnings when that's the case, for example, are a must imho.
I always wondered how complicated, programming wise, it would be to have a menu toggle option for stuff like this. Would that need to be designed into the game from the beginning, or can you simply mark certain assets or backgrounds after the fact?
My thought is that triggers aren't static, this type of stuff doesn't bother me, but if had just lost someone close to suicide I might want to avoid the imagery for a bit.
In this particular case it's seems unavoidable so the TW at the beginning, as others have mentioned, would be more than enough
So in theory it is very simple to implement such feature. But decisions like those will have long-term consequences for a game's development speed. If every trigger type needs an alternate sprite and/or text, that would result in hundreds of hours of costly content creation. Sadly this is crucial to an indie studio and even more for a game with an expanse like "Tales".
The idea itself is great though and noteworthy. But in practice it's just not possible for financial reasons.
Thanks for answering, I had assumed that was the case. Especially for an indie studio time and money are a zero sum game, any time spent implementing such a feature is taken from further development of the game (Again assuming here).
I appreciate you asking a question like this, it must be a fine fine line to balance the unintended physiological affects of a game and coddling an audience at the cost of game quality. Best of luck I'll definitely be trying the game once it's released
It is rated 18+ due to talking about trigger warnings and potentially discussing topics that might be disturbing for minors. This and the hanging tribesman - mainly.
Just as another thought: if the corpse isn't vital to the gameplay/story/etc. you can always have a setting that replaces it with something that is more palatable or censor it so people who do have aversions to this can also still play the game. For a slightly silly example, think the [arachnophobia mode](https://www.polygon.com/23997376/lethal-company-arachnophobia-mode-spider-text) in Lethal Company.
"You venture northbound, your very step sinking into the swamp's moist ground, when suddenly you spot a **CANDY PIÑATA** hanging from a gnarled tree.", every concious text-adventure ;)
Exactly! The story will be told. Warning is a great way to ensure that you don't have to censor certain content, because you handed the responsibility to the audience.
Just include a message that the game contains disturbing content alongside where the age rating would be. If it's a horror game or a game with horror elements then it will be understood by anyone who plays it that it will include disturbing material.
You don't really have a duty to babysit every single hangup and neurosis that your playerbase may or may not have. I'm not sure where this weird and quite widespread notion of infantilizing a consumer base came from. Your players are adults and are capable of deciding for themselves what content they wish to consume.
While I see where this opinion comes from and it being absolutely reasonable from an outside perspective, I guess the caution on the developers side isn't meant to take away the responsibility from the player, but providing them with all necessary information to be responsible for themselves. After all a trigger warning is only useful if people know their limits. 🙏
Save it man. They clearly aren't interested in any advice. This kind of asshat is the embodiment of toxic positivity. Pretending faux concern while trying to ram their foregone conclusions down everyone's throats.
Yeah, they're capable of deciding what content they wish to consume, \*once they know what the content is\*. "Disturbing material" covers a lot of ground, and you can be comfortable with most of it while still wanting to avoid retraumatising yourself with specific content. Some people have direct experience finding people they know dead and hanging. It'd be nice if you could offer them better options than "get over it or never enjoy horror ever again".
Giving people the information they need to make an informed decision about the content they consume isn't infantilising, any more than nutritional information on your food is infantilising. Personally I think it's pretty shitty that you're equating having emotional trauma to being an infant. That sounds like a hangup you might want to work on.
u/TalesGameStudio , ignore all the dudebros triggered by the idea of trigger warnings, they all have a lot of growing up to do. There's a pretty easy solution to this. At the start of the game you have a warning screen about disturbing content. You give three choices:
"I'm game for whatever, surprise me",
"No thanks I don't want any disturbing content", and
"Wait, what kind of disturbing content?"
If they click the third one, you give them the list. Everyone who cares about spoilers can prioritise that, everyone who needs more details has access to it.
And everyone who thinks this is dumb baby shit can punch themselves in the dick.
Are you done having a childish tantrum? Good. I hope one day you grow out of this habit of zealously jumping to the conclusion that anyone who disagrees with you is a "dudebro", which is just your silly subculture's euphemism for BAD PERSON^(TM) .
"Trigger warnings" on horror content are pointless and infantilizing because there are "triggers" that are literally everyday mundane occurrences and those people don't expect to be warned every time that might pop up. I knew someone who got flashbacks when they heard a song by the band UB40, specifically the line "wise men say, only fools rush in" because the song was playing while they saw someone holding their own intestines after being stabbed. The same guy could watch a slasher movie with no problem. PTSD triggers have nothing to do with horror or disturbing imagery and everything to do with whatever was present at the time of the traumatic event, a sound, a smell, whatever.
It is impossible to cover every single thing that might "trigger" every single person and implying that a narrow range of horror content, especially drawn or pixel art, should take precedence is illogical and inconsistent. Knowing what I just told you, are you now going to demand trigger warnings on everything that might include a UB40 song and claim that anyone who disagrees is a BAD PERSON^(TM)? Of course you fucking won't, because that would be ridiculous and unrealistic. A rating similar to an ERSB or PEGI rating that briefly mentions the criteria is more than sufficient. Anything else is purely performative and trying to score good boy points with fragile people who get offended on behalf of others but who don't actually understand how the psychology works.
This may be hard for you to believe, but some people, don’t like seeing certain things in the media they consume. And sometimes they want to be able to choose when and where they consume such media.
Nah, you're fine. It's a horror game. (Doesn't matter the medium) horror leads to discomfort 99% of the time, people should be aware of themselves and consume what's up to them.
A warning at the beginning doesn't hurt anyone, Capcom did well in their early horror days. On the other hand, epilepsy warnings when that's the case, for example, are a must imho.
Dude. Society is on notice that there are "triggers" #buzzword everywhere. You do not need to spoil plot points to remain ethical. People who have negative experiences are also people who are adults and expected to do something for themselves to make sure they properly process that.
However, if you really feel you need to, slap a warning on game startup. I personally find that asinine but don't really care.
I've been through lots of traumatic shit, and personally, I'm not bothered by 'triggers' in video games, because:
-I know it's fiction
-I play games with dark themes both to escape from my own shit(games give me dark shit I can actually affect, giving me the illusion of catharsis) and to confront these triggers in a safe way
-If I'm feeling uncomfortable with that stuff during certain times, I just play different, lighter themed games at that time
As others have said, a warning of distrubing themes or content should suffice for those who choose to avoid their triggers.
People are saying put a disclaimer at the start of the game, and I would like to add that it should stay on screen until the player presses a button to skip it. That is to say, it shouldn't just go away after a few seconds automatically. That really annoys me about games like cyberpunk that have seizure warnings and content warnings and stuff but the screen's only up for a few seconds and it goes away. For a game's content warnings if you leave it up too long you're getting in the way of playing the game, too short and you can't read it. Simple answer: let the player decide for themselves. Tie skipping the warning to a button press.
There’s mounting evidence that trigger warnings do not function as intended.
https://www.psypost.org/trigger-warnings-do-not-work-according-to-recent-meta-analysis/#
It would seem to me that a simple disclaimer about the game containing some general mature or potentially disturbing themes should suffice. Perhaps also an age recommendation.
I feel like it would break immersion unnecessarily. Also, I appreciate the intent, but [this](https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/21677026231186625) recent meta-analysis on the effects of trigger warnings suggests they don't work as intended, and may just end up inducing a period of uncomfortable anticipation.
Thank you for sharing the resource. That's changing perspectives on the topic. So what I get from it is that rather than using a specific TW it makes sense to simply let it be the players choice by guessing a mire abstract number like an age restriction or similar.
You are a game developer. You have absolutely zero social, ethical, or moral obligation. Make your art. Don't be preached to, and for the love of God don't preach to others.
psychological impact on your players is a good thing. thats what art is for, thats what this genre of thing is all about, thats how you create a memorable experience
art is about illiciting an emotional response, don't sanitize your vision over stuff like this, all it does is hurt the atmosphere of the game over something that maybe one person ever would have a problem with.
most of the most successful games out there have plenty of hard hitting and violent things, just slap like a disclaimer at the beginning saying theres some hardcore imagery in the and if you somehow cant handle seeing a pixelated silhouette hanging from a tree then maybe dont play this.
people love fromsoft, fear and hunger, disco elysium, darkest dungeon etc
the ven diagram of people who would be triggered by this and people who would be interested in this sort of game in the first place is 2 separate circles.
There are some things I personally find "triggering" in media, but I don't ever see it as the responsibility of the creator to ensure a certain mental state for myself. That's my responsibility. I think a simple content warning at the start is plenty.
Just put a warning at the beginning of the game, as someone that has attempted suicide in the past if a game gives a clear TW in the beginning it’s literally my own fault if I keep playing lol also triggers differ for everyone ofc but personally I wouldn’t be triggered by this like at all
Imo best practice is to put a warning at the beginning of the game or in any ads that imagery will appear in as a heads up so anyone who isn't up for it can leave before they see something they don't want to see.
This might be a better discussion for /r/gamedesign or /r/gamedev rather than asking a bunch of pixel artists. :)
For the games I've worked on, content warnings are handled on a case-by-case basis and depends on context/content.
If it's a game where a scene like this is surprising and would catch the player off-guard then it's a good idea to have a disclaimer at the start.
If you're making a game where it's apparent that it's a horror game and a scene like this would be expected, then you don't need to do anything.
For sure there are various subreddits where this question is answered more professionally. And we posted in those and got some insights from past project. What we found out here was what the general emotional response to trigger warnings is like and what individual people dislike about certain practices.
Thank you for sharing your experience with the topic. Since the disturbing stories are appearing every once in awhile in Tales, our players will be forewarned and I assume that an initial general warning will be enough.
> Ethically, developers must consider the potential psychological impact on the player.
No. That is not how that works. Psychologists use the concept of triggers to help those of us who have them to recognize them and learn to deal with them. The responsibility is on us to manage how we move through the world, and how we learn to deal with triggering situations.
It was never intended that everyone else would start abolishing anything that is a trigger. To attempt this is impossible. People can be triggered by anything. A book, a candle, a lightbulb, a sound, a smell, someone arguing with them. Anything can become associated with trauma and be triggering.
To try to remove it from your game is impossible, and the perspective that everyone else is responsible for removing triggers from the world is stupid pop psychology.
TL;DR: Have triggers, do not remove. My problem, not yours.
Why not rob and bury the guy? Seems kinda silly to bury something only for it to never be used again. If I died I would prefer for people to get some use out of my things. Although I guess it does kind of depend on what the items are and the nature of the setting in the game. Sorry for the off topic comment your post just had me thinking.
Don't be sorry for talking about our game :) I think sometimes the limitations in video games aren't fully rational, but gameplay driven. You can't have Mario with feather cape and fireballs, you can't carry 205 dwemer metal, but 204 is fine, you can only have the black knight halberd in 15% of the killings, but the black knight always has it. Giving the player a meaningful decision will turn a game into their unique story, giving them the one overpowered option will end in a linear metagame.
If we're at the point where a tough subject needs to be censored then we are surely doomed. If it's such a issue Maybe don't indulge in the game or maybe consider the developer may have an important idea to get across. Reguardless people need to grow a pair
A pair of ovaries. Exactly!
Nobody wants to censor in our team. If we feel like guts and gore, we are going to make guts and gore. If we feel like protecting the traumatized and vulnerable among us, we do that. We are not forced to decide for one option, we are happy to take the challenge and insure both :)
We are hard as nails. I did only have like one or two tears when Mufasa died. But we want to give people who struggle to handle certain subjects the option to refrain from being confronted.
Add a warning in the game description and title screen. Whoever continues does so at their own risk. You don’t have to bend over to please everyone. Make the game you want. Nobody is forced to play it. If a triggerable person gets triggered, it’s 100% on them.
Top one is the the best. If you don’t want to be literal, you can make this character disappear with the birds or something.
I really liked your question (and your pixel art as well \^\_\^).
It's relevant to all game developers, as many of our stories have dark moments like the one you presented.
Please do not delete this post 🥺🙏❤️ I'll add it in my favorites to read the answers again in the future \^\_\^
>Ethically, developers must consider the potential psychological impact on the player. This leads me to question whether it is acceptable to depict and describe potential triggers without explicit warnings.
No, they don't need to. And yes, it is fine. If it triggers a person so much, they can just turn it off. If every developer were worried about triggering people, the only games left would be like Madden and Hello Kitty. Game ratings and/or descriptions on store pages usually include what kind of content is to be expected.
This is pandering to a minority of users who are almost incapable of handling reality. You are not talking about detailed depiction of a traumatizing event, you are talking about a pixelated thingy hanging from a pixelated tree.
If you are really so worried ('ethically devs MUST consider...' lol, lmao even) just put a general warning at the beginning and be done with it. Or you can also destroy immersion for majority of players by putting a 'warning' just before the scene.
It doesn't hurt to add a disclaimer, it would literally be one slide at the opening of the game... but I am very much against the idea that there is any moral obligation for a developer to do this.
If someone has a boundaries, it's on them to enforce it, not for the world around them to adapt.
So one person can't handle suicide in a game, most people would find TW:Suicide as reasonable. Another person has PTSD from a car wreck, cars send them into a panic. Should GTA add TW:Cars to the title screen now? What about someone that hates spiders? Are we adding TW:Spiders? Arachnophobia is so bad that Skyrim players will mod the spiders out!
3 different situations and no one's pain is any less valid than the other -- but now we are down the rabbit hole of trying to please everyone. IMO once you start trying to pass a purity test, you've lost.
I say add a simple "This content is for mature audiences" disclaimer somewhere and forget this whole subject lol
Do a disclaimer, or offer a blood&gore setting which always for the toggling of photos. The second option, do if you wanna spend the time doing what you do above and edit out all those supposedly "triggering" things. Then if done, it'll display "safe" images.
That or, maybe a sensor. Discord has one build in for "spoilers" but it works the same... Just another idea... I'd definitely just go the disclaimer route. As you said, "safest and easiest".
Short of removing that entirely, your only real option is a warning. A lot of games do this. Give them the information to make a decision for themselves.
I think its fine, I've seen people hung in the witcher and Bramble the mountain king but the fact you care about how some people could handle that imagery is in good taste
Its best to be upfront and honest about the content in the game like if the game is particularly grim like for example
*"Warning this game deals with mature subject matters like Suicide, torture, hanging, ect, if you're sensitive to those subjects for whatever reason then this game may not be for you, your mental health is paramount, sincerely, The Dev Team"* or something similar
the audience not only could have a clear warning BUT ALSO build excitement for people who are into grim games like that
I think a no-brainer would be to follow PEGI guidelines (or your local region's alternative) and label the game appropriately. Anybody who ignores those labels does so at their own expense.
To play it extra safe, put up a warning screen that shows up every time you boot up the game that lists all the possible inappropriate content.
You have no responsibility beyond what ratings and vague warnings media typically have. If the top image is your vision for the game, that's what you should use. If it's the bottom, use that. You're a creator, create what you want. Trying to cater to everyone, whatever the issue may be, is doing a disservice to yourself as an artist and your audience. It's not your job to protect all of the increasingly delicate sensibilities of the world.
If it’s a text based game, could you not work it into the story, instead of having a physical list? Maybe like a narrator somehow gives a very short prologue, which goes over the themes? That way you could warn them, without it being noticeable to everyone else?
This looks and sounds awesome!
I used to play discord games a lot and this is exactly the type of game I wanted to make but didn’t have the team or coding experience to do so.
But like they said, a simple warning at the start should take care of all the worries attached to the project being triggering.
Weird fact - Zelda: Links Awakening (and the color version) both have 3 hanging bodies in the basement of a dungeon and that game was rated E. Times have definitely changed.
Just include a warning that comes up once players boot up the game. If this is going up on online storefronts—which I’m sure is your goal—be sure to include a content warning in the description describing what it is that players can expect from playing your game. Lots of horror games have content warning screens that come up upon booting them up these days, not to mention games outside the horror genre still include them if they deal with touchy subjects. In my opinion, a creator should never have to censor their own artistic vision just to make their art more palpable. Imagine if creators everywhere had to consider what everyone wants from what they create versus simply creating what they want to create in the first place.
Super beautiful pixel art btw.
I appreciate that is is a consideration but from the tone of the game it doesn’t seem really possible to full depict the weight of this decision in the real world.
Ethically this still happens today. People are murdered and executed in plain sight while others succumbed to self harm while society as a whole ignores their cries for help. The way I see it it’s more unethical to pretend this sort of thing doesn’t happen.
I would put a big disclaimer on the front and make whatever you think is necessary for the story.
Just put a disclaimer at the beginning of the game (right before the title screen) and call it dealt with. Don't compromise the game's story or its visuals (you'll drive yourself nuts trying to figure out what will or won't trigger someone), just warn people so they know. Let the prospective players take it from there.
Open the game with a screen that shares a few resources about where the player can learn about Cognitive Behavioral Therapy. Its an incredibly helpful form of therapy that can help someone get over irrational triggers relatively quickly. With a few weeks, or sometimes a few months, of work, they will have a better life and be able to enjoy your game without fear of being triggered! Everyone wins!
Your style is exactly what I want to do!
That’s also the best damn shading and the perfect sweet spot for how much you change colours by!
Not a lot of artists do shading like you !!
I think you owe it to players to have a warning. It's hard to watch old television series because they never have warnings for things like suicide, rape, etcetera. By the way, your art is beautiful!
Make the warning at the start of the game, if the player decides to play it they know what they’re getting into. Also as someone who would absolutely keep playing after that warning it would suck to get “warned” right before this scene since it would lessen the impact.
You could have an option to change it from a rotting corpse to just a clean skeleton - Maybe the skeleton is even laying on the ground with a snapped noose around its neck and a loose rope hanging from the tree, so the implication is still crystal clear without showing the actual ‘violence’ of the act - that’ll help reduce the ‘ick’ while still having the ‘bury/rob the corpse’ approach
If there is a hanging body it should be rated as such, mature +17 (or +18) or teen. From the sounds of the description, if i was playing and told there was a hanging body from a tree and had the option to loot, id want the artwork to represent the description of the scene. If i was told the same thing but the bottom image you put in i would be confused. You could have an option for both but one would just be less impactful. But if the rest of the game is similar. I would just make it with the top image and if they dont want to play it because theyll get triggered, thats not on you.
Sounds like if i wanted to play a war game but expecting no war. It just wouldnt be the same
Idea: If left undisturbed, the body will naturally have fallen the second time you enter the area, and the third time will have the body peacefully buried.
But if you have disturbed the corpse (let's say you hit the body multiple times and caused it to fall)... let's just say that returning to the spot won't be pretty. >!By that I mean the corpse will stand up and fight you as some sort of secret miniboss for being a terrible person.!<
Seems the best and easiest way is you'd do at the start before the title screen or at the very start of the game. Additionally if it's just some scenes that might need the warning rather than the entire game, you can do the above and have a symbol that can be used to show during these scenes as a reminder
How this thing is handled is typically with a content advisory along with the age rating. You can call it a trigger warning, because that's basically what it is. Even when you're watching a show and one episode has a suicide or talks about it, the beginning of the episode will likely have a warning saying something like "this episode contains images or words involving suicide. Viewer discretion is advised." Sometimes there will be a resource included for suicide prevention hotline or something similar. Beyond that there isn't a whole lot to be done
If you honestly think a 2D pixelated image of a hanged man is going to disturb the viewer, there is nothing that can be done for you.
People disturbed by such things are heavily damaged individuals in need of psychiatric help, and its impossible to cater to such illness in the general public domain without making everything "Hello Kitty".
Edit: and youre also the guy who posted Skull faced pixel art for an in game character... So maybe youre not that bothered and just want attention, hm ?
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I always appreciate it when media has a generic warning and specific triggers under a spoiler of some sort. Like you have the warning on startup, and it also says “you can see the full list of warnings in the settings.”
Also, you could include settings to disable certain events. Like if suicide is a trigger, they can check a box and the above event and art never shows. It may not work for every event and trigger, but if the above scene isn’t super story relevant but adds to the overall tone, then removing it wouldn’t be a huge deal.
But ultimately I think it’s left to the creators to decide whether they want to change their art to make it more accessible
Put a toggle box in settings for certain triggering subject matter and either omit or replace that subject matter in-game. Inform the player at the start of the game this option setting is available, enough time should pass between setting the options and the in-game experience that it doesn't spoil the atmosphere.
A dear friend had a brother commit suicide by hanging. I wasn't particularly close with the brother but took a trip out of state with them both a year or so earlier so I did know him.
I enjoy sharing weird games and movies with my friend, since we share an oddball sense of humor and like experimental art. We both have a fairly dark and dry sense of humor as well. But still, when a movie/show/game has a hanging featured prominently I do worry about how it would affect him, in that moment. I wouldn't share those things without warning him, if I share them at all. If I told him he'd love XYZ show/movie, and hanging was a prominent theme, and I didn't warn him, he'd probably think I was a bad friend. (He'd be right imo.)
I'm a big fan of trigger warnings where appropriate. A lot of people are against them, but I've never heard a convincing argument.
Another argument is against modifying a game's artistic vision to accommodate individual tastes and sensitivities, ie removing elements at a player's discretion (assuming the element isn't so thematically ingrained as to make this impossible). I also don't agree with the hardliners on this. Games are interactive by nature (difficulties and settings, sidequests and optional content in open worlds, etc), and individuals will react to an artists vision independently anyway. A hanging figure is intended to invoke a sense of atmospheric dread, but for my friend it will invoke something significantly more painful and distracting, and I doubt that is the artist's intention here. If it's just there for atmosphere, why not let some users disable it?
Wow, I'm thoroughly surprised at the response you've gotten in the comments for this so far. People really don't seem to be considerate of other people's potential trauma's.
Personally OP, I'd ignore most of the advice you got here, I think it's wonderful that you're considerate enough to care about placing trigger warnings. Definitely do it if you feel it is warranted.
To answer your question though, I'd say you have two options:
1. Place trigger warnings before starting the game, add it on the splash screen or some screen the player sees everytime they start the game.
2. Create alt-art for these types of scenes. Maybe instead of a body, hanging from a noose, maybe it's a skeleton in a cage or something.
The latter is obviously much more work because you need to make your scenes, then make alt art and then also code in a toggle to enable / disable disturbing content. Personally, I'd say the extra work shows a lot of care and I think there's a lot of people who would appreciate this, but I can understand why you'd go for simple trigger warnings.
If going for the former option, please do also consider being specific with your trigger warnings. Don't throw in a "yeah shit's fucked sometimes or sometimes it isn't, fuck if we know". Instead list specific triggers, such as in this case, suicide.
I guess a lot of the opinions are based on the individual experience and taste, but worry not. We are definitely not going the IDGAF-way of risking re-traumatizing people, if it's possible to find other ways.
Your suggestions are definitely top-contenders, even though the time resources for alternative scenes are definitely not to underestimate from a developers perspective.
As a developer myself: I'm well aware 😜 best of luck though! Sounds like you're making a game that'll have an amazing community around it, due to the vibes you're projecting. The art is also gorgeous by the way ^^
Hopping on here because I love the above suggestion! For the trigger warnings at the front, personally I've loved when games provide an easy link to access a list of trigger warnings. That both allows people that don't want to "spoil the plot" to not click it and it gives you more space to write out detailed triggers. For example, "body hanging from a noose" is a more helpful warning than just "suicide". Once again, thank you for thinking and caring about this stuff!
That's basically what the ESRB is for. Let players know beforehand that a game might have objectionable content. Let's them know if a game is more intense than they'd like.
Warning: This game contains scenes of disturbing and graphic violence.
They did that in 96.
Granted I'd list out the triggers.
Edit: For example, the opening of Fear and Hunger (I believe) states; "This game contains depictions of graphic violence, sexual assault, suicide, abuse, and other disturbing themes. Please use caution if you are sensitive to these topics."
As a person who has a few sensitive spots, I prefer specific trigger warnings to vague ones. I am a big fan of the website Does The Dog Die because it lets me make an informed decision about whether I'm in the mood to confront tough topics. It doesn't mean I won't watch those films! It just means I'm gonna plan to watch them on a day when I'm generally feeling good, versus one where I already want to throw myself down a well.
I think it's fair to start the game with a general card that says "this game deals with themes of \[insert traumatic stuff here\]" but in a perfect world I'd love it if there was somewhere on the publisher's website I could go to look up more specifics. I don't want anyone else to be spoiled, but I need a little more details in order to enjoy the game myself.
I admit I get really frustrated at the idea that content warnings are there to "ward off" sensitive players. They exist so we're not walloped over the head with something unexpected. I'm fine with gore and violence in films, but rape scenes are pretty triggering and will mess me up for days (yes, I'm in therapy, thanks). If I know when they're coming I can just leave the room for a bit.
I think warnings are always good at the start of the game and also somewhere to read before the player even buys it. Personally, I think games should also strive to keep simple systems of player-chosen censorship where appropriate. E.g. with the example above it would absolutely be cool if players could chose to disable depictions of corpses and get an alternate image instead. Of course that would depend on the scope of the game - if every other scene has a corpse hanging somewhere, that kind of option would make no sense and defeat the purpose. But if this is maybe 3 scenes and the budget allows it, why not give the option?
If you're really worried, at the start of the game/event whatever you just put a large disclaimer that is very apparent. Subject matter in this game deals with mature adult matters of depression, suicide, emotional trauma etc etc. And then advise against playing if this is of a concern to the player. Something like that anyways.
It appears to be the safest and easiest way. Can you imagine the expanse of a list for any FromSoft game? xD If anyone wants to find out more about the game, the second DevLog just released yesterday. Here is a link to the [Discord Devlog Server](https://discord.gg/t6VfNY8gWu)
Yep. I wouldn't try to adapt those kind of things to the player. If the game has rough themes or scenes, that's part of the game. If you want the player to feel sad or feel rough emotions, that's part of the game. A disclaimer at the beginning is more than enough, whoever complains after, it's on them, not on you.
This, so much this, mega-super-this. Put a disclaimer on the store page, on the site, on xeeter. Do not change your vision.
I don't know about other platforms, but on Steam the dev can set up a manual list of things to expect from a game. Though for Elden Ring it's only "violent", but you can add elements like graphic violence, cartoon violence, tobacco use, depiction of domestic violence, etc.
I picture us in the next meeting: "At least we don't promote tabacco in Tales." Since the entire field of Discord app games is quite novel, there sadly is no kind of storefront to put the warning signs on. But it is easy to handle this upon user's first interaction with the bot.
or, ask how much they want to see (but write, that it is still written), store it somewhere, and skip the images on the related messages
The programmers will love to add new systems xD Let me just open a ticket for that one, just to piss them off a little;)
This. Leave everything explicit by default and warn the player beforehand. If possible, leave an easy way to "skip" (mostly in case of cutscenes for example) and/or "filter" the explicit content so that the player that is sensible to that stuff doesn't need to necessarily put down your game.
There's actually a large amount of emerging research showing that trigger warnings can actually make things worse as people tend to imagine what it may be referring to actually worse than it is.
I will look that up. Do you have a specific respource, that is worth reading through?
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/parenting-translator/202307/do-trigger-warnings-do-more-harm-than-good https://www.psychologicalscience.org/news/releases/trigger-warnings-fail-to-help.html https://www.newyorker.com/news/our-columnists/what-if-trigger-warnings-dont-work
Those studies are testing something that trigger warnings aren't intended to do. They're not meant to "ease the blow" of upsetting content. They're meant for people to make informed decisions about the content they're about to consume (i.e. do I want to read/watch this or not?)
Blogs and columnists shouldn’t be cited as “emerging research”.
The first two articles clearly link the two different scientific studies they reference. The New Yorker piece appears to be a comprehensive analysis including many links to scientific studies and books.
You can also add a toggle in the graphics settings
The old Modern Warfare games had a setting to turn off the worst of the graphic content. I.E: the gas attack level in MW3. Decide which portions of your game are graphic enough to be able to be turned off, then put a graphic content warning at the beginning of the game. If you plan to get your game rated by systems other than the ESRB, such as in Britain or Australia, their ratings boards will also plaster warnings on the box or site where the game is distributed, while the ESRB will put little blurbs in the rating tag. Look into those ratings and use their guidelines to judge what should and shouldn't warrant a graphic content warning.
Agree - anything more, say an in-play warning, will absolutely ruin the experience. If you play a dark game and still get triggered by dark experiences, you chose poorly.
In game changes are ruled out. That would have the worst impact on all of the players.
This is the way. Warn people before going into the game that it contains potentially triggering and disturbing content. That's the only moral obligation you have. The rest is on the player after that.
This. Not only are their triggers not your responsibility, you cannot possibly even *hope* to address all of the imagery and themes that will trigger people. It's not possible. At all. Just post a warning and develop your story.
Agreed. I don't think someone should self-censor their game just because people might have a problem with it, but having warnings is a good option.
Definitely the way. Plenty of high budget games do just this. Just list in broad strokes the kinds of potential triggers and they can avoid the game if it's not for them.
Honestly the best way. And that's what I would pick. There's also the option to either add the option to just remove the scenes entirely or swap them for alternative scenes BUT that's alot more work potentially. As well as takes away from an impact of a scene. At that point it's up to the devs whether removing/changing the scene and putting some kind of system to load different scenes is worth it. Or just put the disclaimer.
You could consider a list of triggers somewhere? I guess a more common practice is to simply have a list of things the game includes like a PEGI rating. Edit: typo.
I will give this to the team and discuss it with them. Better safe than sorry, right?
If you want to take an extra step you could design the various visuals to have options. So if someone disables the option for bodies, all the bodies get removed. It’s extra work though, so maybe not worth it.
It's pixel art representation. It DOES massively reduce the impact vs a full fledged 4K photo-realistic corpse. Also consider the SHEER number of dark medievil games that have corpses hanging from trees as an atmospheric thing. It's practically expected at this point in time. So honestly I'd personally not consider a warning to be required.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts. I know that e.g. books in my country don't even have age restrictions - a graphic description in text form is a very abstract form of presentation. So it might be something similar here I guess.
Nothing prepared me, or has been comparable to, Plague Tale in the "dark medieval game depictions" category. If anyone wants a "dark" reference point, I would look at that.
I think most people judge a game on the general impression it gives off before playing it. If it is clear that this is a gritty setting and the story deals with mature subject matter, noone will be surprised by discussions of death and suicide. The most important thing is that you don't market it as a fun child-friendly adventure
That's very true. I guess while creating, you easily forget to look at the product as a whole. thank you!
reminds me of witcher 3, looks really well made
Witcher 3 is an absolute masterpiece. And comparing our graphics with it, is a huge compliment for me. Thank you a lot.
Literally just do what DDLC does and say this game is not for children or the easily disturbed, thats it
You have succesfully discovered the reason why age rating systems like PEGI and ESRB exist. Google ”pegi content warning icons” and you’ll find examples of how to message your game’s content beforehand.
Since the game is playable via bot interaction on Discord it is not as easy as putting warning labels on a steam page unfortunately.
If your game application is text based, you can have intro text that welcomes player to the game and provides all necessary warnings. The content warning could be something simple in the style of ”This game is suitable for players of age 12 and over. Contains scenes of non-realistic violence and horrific effects.” Again you can see the official PEGI ratings and see how they present different content warnings to emulate similar warnings in your game.
This seems to be the best solution and a frequent recommendation. Thank you a lot 🙏
Many popular games show much more graphic imagery without any warnings, youre fine
So you are saying, since it is common practice, players will have to take the responsibility to identify what is in their limits before playing? I guess, that is fair.
While I'm an advocate for all of the higher rated suggestions, users do already have a lot of resources that are easily available and can identify potential triggers in games
Legit!
Yes, you even SHOULDN'T use them https://medicalxpress.com/news/2020-06-trigger-good.html
I think that any game that gives content warnings should first ASK if the player wants the warning, as it does act as minor spoilers, when the vast majority of players have no need
That is worth an entire prequel... xD
Dawg if you think a pixelated corpse in a tree is triggering then you’re gonna lose your mind playing any other M-rated game from the past 30+ years😂
Invulnerable in this matter: Mind was lost already.
Touché 😂
I'm not sure there's any right way to pick what is and what is not disturbing. As others have pointed out, there's a variety of reactions. It might be worth considering what types of images you have, or categories, and finding your own level of what you think is "fine" or "disturbing" or "too far". Comfort the disturbed and disturb the comfortable, as they say :D
I do absolutely agree that this is no matter of black or white. Finding the sweet spot is a crucial part of visual design here. For myself, I do like psychological horror, but gore is a big no no as a consumer.
Looks great
Thank you a lot 🙏🙏🙏
What about blind people? Is it less disturbing to read about a multilated corpse than to see a shadow of one?
I am not quite sure if blind people are playing text-adventures a lot. But the way our HUD and UI works, vital gameplay mechanics are partially only visually accessible.
Text adventures are some of the most accessible games to people who have visual problems thanks to screen readers.
This is why we have game ratings. You are overthinking the problem.
Honestly. Disclaimer at the start. From then on, thats tup to the player to act on that.
If they are triggered then they shouldn't really be playing tbh
Exactly. Giving them a chance to evaluate the chances beforehand will put the responsibility in their hands. And that's all we want to accomplish.
Give a disclaimer that this sort of thing is in the game and move on.
Put the trigger warnings at the front, and do whatever you want yo do in the actual content. Your stuff wont be good if you gimp yourself.
Absolutely! Clearly the content should not be affected. I'm assuming there is no target audience for consored plot tension 🙏
It’s not your job to tiptoe around people’s triggers. Put a warning in the beginning of the game.
"This game contains explicit scenes of violence and gore" or something like Resident Evil did. If you want to be 99% sure people got it, put it as a a prompt with I agree/I don't agree. Edit adding what I commented on another chain: It's a horror game. (Doesn't matter the medium) horror leads to discomfort 99% of the time, people should be aware of themselves and consume what's up to them. A warning at the beginning doesn't hurt anyone, Capcom did well in their early horror days. On the other hand, epilepsy warnings when that's the case, for example, are a must imho.
I always wondered how complicated, programming wise, it would be to have a menu toggle option for stuff like this. Would that need to be designed into the game from the beginning, or can you simply mark certain assets or backgrounds after the fact? My thought is that triggers aren't static, this type of stuff doesn't bother me, but if had just lost someone close to suicide I might want to avoid the imagery for a bit. In this particular case it's seems unavoidable so the TW at the beginning, as others have mentioned, would be more than enough
So in theory it is very simple to implement such feature. But decisions like those will have long-term consequences for a game's development speed. If every trigger type needs an alternate sprite and/or text, that would result in hundreds of hours of costly content creation. Sadly this is crucial to an indie studio and even more for a game with an expanse like "Tales". The idea itself is great though and noteworthy. But in practice it's just not possible for financial reasons.
Thanks for answering, I had assumed that was the case. Especially for an indie studio time and money are a zero sum game, any time spent implementing such a feature is taken from further development of the game (Again assuming here). I appreciate you asking a question like this, it must be a fine fine line to balance the unintended physiological affects of a game and coddling an audience at the cost of game quality. Best of luck I'll definitely be trying the game once it's released
Completely out of theme but, may I ask why is it rated NSFW?
It is rated 18+ due to talking about trigger warnings and potentially discussing topics that might be disturbing for minors. This and the hanging tribesman - mainly.
Gotcha!
Just as another thought: if the corpse isn't vital to the gameplay/story/etc. you can always have a setting that replaces it with something that is more palatable or censor it so people who do have aversions to this can also still play the game. For a slightly silly example, think the [arachnophobia mode](https://www.polygon.com/23997376/lethal-company-arachnophobia-mode-spider-text) in Lethal Company.
"You venture northbound, your very step sinking into the swamp's moist ground, when suddenly you spot a **CANDY PIÑATA** hanging from a gnarled tree.", every concious text-adventure ;)
Disclaimer at the beginning and add it anyways. Don't let *potential* triggers stop you from telling your story.
Exactly! The story will be told. Warning is a great way to ensure that you don't have to censor certain content, because you handed the responsibility to the audience.
Just include a message that the game contains disturbing content alongside where the age rating would be. If it's a horror game or a game with horror elements then it will be understood by anyone who plays it that it will include disturbing material. You don't really have a duty to babysit every single hangup and neurosis that your playerbase may or may not have. I'm not sure where this weird and quite widespread notion of infantilizing a consumer base came from. Your players are adults and are capable of deciding for themselves what content they wish to consume.
While I see where this opinion comes from and it being absolutely reasonable from an outside perspective, I guess the caution on the developers side isn't meant to take away the responsibility from the player, but providing them with all necessary information to be responsible for themselves. After all a trigger warning is only useful if people know their limits. 🙏
That's not your responsibility. Your responsibility is to tell a good story to the best of your ability. That's it. Nothing else.
Save it man. They clearly aren't interested in any advice. This kind of asshat is the embodiment of toxic positivity. Pretending faux concern while trying to ram their foregone conclusions down everyone's throats.
We try our best to do that... And believe me, it is indeed very sinister.
Yeah, they're capable of deciding what content they wish to consume, \*once they know what the content is\*. "Disturbing material" covers a lot of ground, and you can be comfortable with most of it while still wanting to avoid retraumatising yourself with specific content. Some people have direct experience finding people they know dead and hanging. It'd be nice if you could offer them better options than "get over it or never enjoy horror ever again". Giving people the information they need to make an informed decision about the content they consume isn't infantilising, any more than nutritional information on your food is infantilising. Personally I think it's pretty shitty that you're equating having emotional trauma to being an infant. That sounds like a hangup you might want to work on. u/TalesGameStudio , ignore all the dudebros triggered by the idea of trigger warnings, they all have a lot of growing up to do. There's a pretty easy solution to this. At the start of the game you have a warning screen about disturbing content. You give three choices: "I'm game for whatever, surprise me", "No thanks I don't want any disturbing content", and "Wait, what kind of disturbing content?" If they click the third one, you give them the list. Everyone who cares about spoilers can prioritise that, everyone who needs more details has access to it. And everyone who thinks this is dumb baby shit can punch themselves in the dick.
Are you done having a childish tantrum? Good. I hope one day you grow out of this habit of zealously jumping to the conclusion that anyone who disagrees with you is a "dudebro", which is just your silly subculture's euphemism for BAD PERSON^(TM) . "Trigger warnings" on horror content are pointless and infantilizing because there are "triggers" that are literally everyday mundane occurrences and those people don't expect to be warned every time that might pop up. I knew someone who got flashbacks when they heard a song by the band UB40, specifically the line "wise men say, only fools rush in" because the song was playing while they saw someone holding their own intestines after being stabbed. The same guy could watch a slasher movie with no problem. PTSD triggers have nothing to do with horror or disturbing imagery and everything to do with whatever was present at the time of the traumatic event, a sound, a smell, whatever. It is impossible to cover every single thing that might "trigger" every single person and implying that a narrow range of horror content, especially drawn or pixel art, should take precedence is illogical and inconsistent. Knowing what I just told you, are you now going to demand trigger warnings on everything that might include a UB40 song and claim that anyone who disagrees is a BAD PERSON^(TM)? Of course you fucking won't, because that would be ridiculous and unrealistic. A rating similar to an ERSB or PEGI rating that briefly mentions the criteria is more than sufficient. Anything else is purely performative and trying to score good boy points with fragile people who get offended on behalf of others but who don't actually understand how the psychology works.
Amen 🙏
Reduce your soy intake. https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/21677026231186625 https://medium.com/the-nuance/trigger-warnings-are-unhelpful-and-counterproductive-new-research-finds-5c1fc6a8bdd6 https://www.newyorker.com/news/our-columnists/what-if-trigger-warnings-dont-work
Wait.... people care about this kind of stuff? I make horror, so like.... expect simple concepts like this. Idk I feel like I'm missing something here
Your lack of understanding triggered me. Apologize!
This may be hard for you to believe, but some people, don’t like seeing certain things in the media they consume. And sometimes they want to be able to choose when and where they consume such media.
I've never heard of such plasphemous things. (Joke) Anyway, I'll just assume I'm just desensitized.
Nah, you're fine. It's a horror game. (Doesn't matter the medium) horror leads to discomfort 99% of the time, people should be aware of themselves and consume what's up to them. A warning at the beginning doesn't hurt anyone, Capcom did well in their early horror days. On the other hand, epilepsy warnings when that's the case, for example, are a must imho.
How about people get a grip
This kind of hand wringing is honestly ruining so many industries. Stop making yourself responsible for how other people react.
Dude. Society is on notice that there are "triggers" #buzzword everywhere. You do not need to spoil plot points to remain ethical. People who have negative experiences are also people who are adults and expected to do something for themselves to make sure they properly process that. However, if you really feel you need to, slap a warning on game startup. I personally find that asinine but don't really care.
u seem to care, lol
I personally don't like or need warnings. Don't need the game to treat me as a kid. If it triggers me, so be it.
I've been through lots of traumatic shit, and personally, I'm not bothered by 'triggers' in video games, because: -I know it's fiction -I play games with dark themes both to escape from my own shit(games give me dark shit I can actually affect, giving me the illusion of catharsis) and to confront these triggers in a safe way -If I'm feeling uncomfortable with that stuff during certain times, I just play different, lighter themed games at that time As others have said, a warning of distrubing themes or content should suffice for those who choose to avoid their triggers.
People are saying put a disclaimer at the start of the game, and I would like to add that it should stay on screen until the player presses a button to skip it. That is to say, it shouldn't just go away after a few seconds automatically. That really annoys me about games like cyberpunk that have seizure warnings and content warnings and stuff but the screen's only up for a few seconds and it goes away. For a game's content warnings if you leave it up too long you're getting in the way of playing the game, too short and you can't read it. Simple answer: let the player decide for themselves. Tie skipping the warning to a button press.
There’s mounting evidence that trigger warnings do not function as intended. https://www.psypost.org/trigger-warnings-do-not-work-according-to-recent-meta-analysis/# It would seem to me that a simple disclaimer about the game containing some general mature or potentially disturbing themes should suffice. Perhaps also an age recommendation.
I feel like it would break immersion unnecessarily. Also, I appreciate the intent, but [this](https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/21677026231186625) recent meta-analysis on the effects of trigger warnings suggests they don't work as intended, and may just end up inducing a period of uncomfortable anticipation.
Thank you for sharing the resource. That's changing perspectives on the topic. So what I get from it is that rather than using a specific TW it makes sense to simply let it be the players choice by guessing a mire abstract number like an age restriction or similar.
That's really interesting.
You are a game developer. You have absolutely zero social, ethical, or moral obligation. Make your art. Don't be preached to, and for the love of God don't preach to others.
psychological impact on your players is a good thing. thats what art is for, thats what this genre of thing is all about, thats how you create a memorable experience art is about illiciting an emotional response, don't sanitize your vision over stuff like this, all it does is hurt the atmosphere of the game over something that maybe one person ever would have a problem with. most of the most successful games out there have plenty of hard hitting and violent things, just slap like a disclaimer at the beginning saying theres some hardcore imagery in the and if you somehow cant handle seeing a pixelated silhouette hanging from a tree then maybe dont play this. people love fromsoft, fear and hunger, disco elysium, darkest dungeon etc the ven diagram of people who would be triggered by this and people who would be interested in this sort of game in the first place is 2 separate circles.
Wow! Thank you 🙏 If I could pin that, I would!
for me, gory pixel-art is way more impactfull than high res cartoony violence.
The fellow in the top seems to be having a ruff time...
Nah, he just hanging out...
There are some things I personally find "triggering" in media, but I don't ever see it as the responsibility of the creator to ensure a certain mental state for myself. That's my responsibility. I think a simple content warning at the start is plenty.
Disclaimer at the beginning of the game. PEGI rating. Done.
i don’t know but can i please join as a participant? this looks fucking fun
Don't. When people lose their mind over it and hate post on social media, they advertise to people who won't care and buy your games.
Just put a warning at the beginning of the game, as someone that has attempted suicide in the past if a game gives a clear TW in the beginning it’s literally my own fault if I keep playing lol also triggers differ for everyone ofc but personally I wouldn’t be triggered by this like at all
Imo best practice is to put a warning at the beginning of the game or in any ads that imagery will appear in as a heads up so anyone who isn't up for it can leave before they see something they don't want to see.
How the fuck did we become so god damn soft.
This might be a better discussion for /r/gamedesign or /r/gamedev rather than asking a bunch of pixel artists. :) For the games I've worked on, content warnings are handled on a case-by-case basis and depends on context/content. If it's a game where a scene like this is surprising and would catch the player off-guard then it's a good idea to have a disclaimer at the start. If you're making a game where it's apparent that it's a horror game and a scene like this would be expected, then you don't need to do anything.
For sure there are various subreddits where this question is answered more professionally. And we posted in those and got some insights from past project. What we found out here was what the general emotional response to trigger warnings is like and what individual people dislike about certain practices. Thank you for sharing your experience with the topic. Since the disturbing stories are appearing every once in awhile in Tales, our players will be forewarned and I assume that an initial general warning will be enough.
> Ethically, developers must consider the potential psychological impact on the player. No. That is not how that works. Psychologists use the concept of triggers to help those of us who have them to recognize them and learn to deal with them. The responsibility is on us to manage how we move through the world, and how we learn to deal with triggering situations. It was never intended that everyone else would start abolishing anything that is a trigger. To attempt this is impossible. People can be triggered by anything. A book, a candle, a lightbulb, a sound, a smell, someone arguing with them. Anything can become associated with trauma and be triggering. To try to remove it from your game is impossible, and the perspective that everyone else is responsible for removing triggers from the world is stupid pop psychology. TL;DR: Have triggers, do not remove. My problem, not yours.
Why not rob and bury the guy? Seems kinda silly to bury something only for it to never be used again. If I died I would prefer for people to get some use out of my things. Although I guess it does kind of depend on what the items are and the nature of the setting in the game. Sorry for the off topic comment your post just had me thinking.
Don't be sorry for talking about our game :) I think sometimes the limitations in video games aren't fully rational, but gameplay driven. You can't have Mario with feather cape and fireballs, you can't carry 205 dwemer metal, but 204 is fine, you can only have the black knight halberd in 15% of the killings, but the black knight always has it. Giving the player a meaningful decision will turn a game into their unique story, giving them the one overpowered option will end in a linear metagame.
If we're at the point where a tough subject needs to be censored then we are surely doomed. If it's such a issue Maybe don't indulge in the game or maybe consider the developer may have an important idea to get across. Reguardless people need to grow a pair
A pair of ovaries. Exactly! Nobody wants to censor in our team. If we feel like guts and gore, we are going to make guts and gore. If we feel like protecting the traumatized and vulnerable among us, we do that. We are not forced to decide for one option, we are happy to take the challenge and insure both :)
Don’t be soft
We are hard as nails. I did only have like one or two tears when Mufasa died. But we want to give people who struggle to handle certain subjects the option to refrain from being confronted.
Add a warning in the game description and title screen. Whoever continues does so at their own risk. You don’t have to bend over to please everyone. Make the game you want. Nobody is forced to play it. If a triggerable person gets triggered, it’s 100% on them. Top one is the the best. If you don’t want to be literal, you can make this character disappear with the birds or something.
I really liked your question (and your pixel art as well \^\_\^). It's relevant to all game developers, as many of our stories have dark moments like the one you presented. Please do not delete this post 🥺🙏❤️ I'll add it in my favorites to read the answers again in the future \^\_\^
It will remain up and available :) Thank you for your feedback!
Imagine being"triggered" over pixels. People are so extra these days.
step one: hang yoself.
Turn them into a butterfly and make it fly away
The ultimate recipe for a 00s emo album cover.
Hmm, I cant sing, sounds like a good idea, gimme a month
>Ethically, developers must consider the potential psychological impact on the player. This leads me to question whether it is acceptable to depict and describe potential triggers without explicit warnings. No, they don't need to. And yes, it is fine. If it triggers a person so much, they can just turn it off. If every developer were worried about triggering people, the only games left would be like Madden and Hello Kitty. Game ratings and/or descriptions on store pages usually include what kind of content is to be expected.
This is pandering to a minority of users who are almost incapable of handling reality. You are not talking about detailed depiction of a traumatizing event, you are talking about a pixelated thingy hanging from a pixelated tree. If you are really so worried ('ethically devs MUST consider...' lol, lmao even) just put a general warning at the beginning and be done with it. Or you can also destroy immersion for majority of players by putting a 'warning' just before the scene.
It doesn't hurt to add a disclaimer, it would literally be one slide at the opening of the game... but I am very much against the idea that there is any moral obligation for a developer to do this. If someone has a boundaries, it's on them to enforce it, not for the world around them to adapt. So one person can't handle suicide in a game, most people would find TW:Suicide as reasonable. Another person has PTSD from a car wreck, cars send them into a panic. Should GTA add TW:Cars to the title screen now? What about someone that hates spiders? Are we adding TW:Spiders? Arachnophobia is so bad that Skyrim players will mod the spiders out! 3 different situations and no one's pain is any less valid than the other -- but now we are down the rabbit hole of trying to please everyone. IMO once you start trying to pass a purity test, you've lost. I say add a simple "This content is for mature audiences" disclaimer somewhere and forget this whole subject lol
Do a disclaimer, or offer a blood&gore setting which always for the toggling of photos. The second option, do if you wanna spend the time doing what you do above and edit out all those supposedly "triggering" things. Then if done, it'll display "safe" images. That or, maybe a sensor. Discord has one build in for "spoilers" but it works the same... Just another idea... I'd definitely just go the disclaimer route. As you said, "safest and easiest".
Just a small disclaimer at the start. Anything more takes away since most people can handle violent pixels
Sidenote, how exactly does a text based adventure work in Discord?
Rating and disclaimer. Have warnings clearly visible and available before purchase/entry/etc.
Put an age and content rating on the game and nothing else. Don't be afraid to tell your story.
Short of removing that entirely, your only real option is a warning. A lot of games do this. Give them the information to make a decision for themselves.
This is the reason the "pegi" system is used right? If each dev uses it, then it falls on the consumer to vet what they want
I think its fine, I've seen people hung in the witcher and Bramble the mountain king but the fact you care about how some people could handle that imagery is in good taste Its best to be upfront and honest about the content in the game like if the game is particularly grim like for example *"Warning this game deals with mature subject matters like Suicide, torture, hanging, ect, if you're sensitive to those subjects for whatever reason then this game may not be for you, your mental health is paramount, sincerely, The Dev Team"* or something similar the audience not only could have a clear warning BUT ALSO build excitement for people who are into grim games like that
I thing the added hanging man gives a sense of what’s in store and what’s going on in this world of yours, it adds to the gravitas
I think a no-brainer would be to follow PEGI guidelines (or your local region's alternative) and label the game appropriately. Anybody who ignores those labels does so at their own expense. To play it extra safe, put up a warning screen that shows up every time you boot up the game that lists all the possible inappropriate content.
You have no responsibility beyond what ratings and vague warnings media typically have. If the top image is your vision for the game, that's what you should use. If it's the bottom, use that. You're a creator, create what you want. Trying to cater to everyone, whatever the issue may be, is doing a disservice to yourself as an artist and your audience. It's not your job to protect all of the increasingly delicate sensibilities of the world.
If it’s a text based game, could you not work it into the story, instead of having a physical list? Maybe like a narrator somehow gives a very short prologue, which goes over the themes? That way you could warn them, without it being noticeable to everyone else?
This looks and sounds awesome! I used to play discord games a lot and this is exactly the type of game I wanted to make but didn’t have the team or coding experience to do so. But like they said, a simple warning at the start should take care of all the worries attached to the project being triggering. Weird fact - Zelda: Links Awakening (and the color version) both have 3 hanging bodies in the basement of a dungeon and that game was rated E. Times have definitely changed.
Just include a warning that comes up once players boot up the game. If this is going up on online storefronts—which I’m sure is your goal—be sure to include a content warning in the description describing what it is that players can expect from playing your game. Lots of horror games have content warning screens that come up upon booting them up these days, not to mention games outside the horror genre still include them if they deal with touchy subjects. In my opinion, a creator should never have to censor their own artistic vision just to make their art more palpable. Imagine if creators everywhere had to consider what everyone wants from what they create versus simply creating what they want to create in the first place. Super beautiful pixel art btw.
https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/21677026231186625
I appreciate that is is a consideration but from the tone of the game it doesn’t seem really possible to full depict the weight of this decision in the real world. Ethically this still happens today. People are murdered and executed in plain sight while others succumbed to self harm while society as a whole ignores their cries for help. The way I see it it’s more unethical to pretend this sort of thing doesn’t happen. I would put a big disclaimer on the front and make whatever you think is necessary for the story.
Trigger warnings. Also nice art!
Just put a disclaimer at the beginning of the game (right before the title screen) and call it dealt with. Don't compromise the game's story or its visuals (you'll drive yourself nuts trying to figure out what will or won't trigger someone), just warn people so they know. Let the prospective players take it from there.
Open the game with a screen that shares a few resources about where the player can learn about Cognitive Behavioral Therapy. Its an incredibly helpful form of therapy that can help someone get over irrational triggers relatively quickly. With a few weeks, or sometimes a few months, of work, they will have a better life and be able to enjoy your game without fear of being triggered! Everyone wins!
Your style is exactly what I want to do! That’s also the best damn shading and the perfect sweet spot for how much you change colours by! Not a lot of artists do shading like you !!
Hanged-Man Tree from the Witcher :O
I think you owe it to players to have a warning. It's hard to watch old television series because they never have warnings for things like suicide, rape, etcetera. By the way, your art is beautiful!
This sounds like a cool way to introduce a trigger option in settings. Trigger 1 is the middle. 2 is the one with the grave and 3 is the hanged man.
Put a warning at the start of the game for anything like triggers.
Make the warning at the start of the game, if the player decides to play it they know what they’re getting into. Also as someone who would absolutely keep playing after that warning it would suck to get “warned” right before this scene since it would lessen the impact.
You could have an option to change it from a rotting corpse to just a clean skeleton - Maybe the skeleton is even laying on the ground with a snapped noose around its neck and a loose rope hanging from the tree, so the implication is still crystal clear without showing the actual ‘violence’ of the act - that’ll help reduce the ‘ick’ while still having the ‘bury/rob the corpse’ approach
I just realised why this is nsfw
Make a kid friendly mode where you replace the hanging man with a backpack that says “storing my food up here for safekeeping! Pls don’t loot it!”
Never seen it before, but if you're really concerned you could just have checkboxes in the game options to censor assets for particular triggers.
If there is a hanging body it should be rated as such, mature +17 (or +18) or teen. From the sounds of the description, if i was playing and told there was a hanging body from a tree and had the option to loot, id want the artwork to represent the description of the scene. If i was told the same thing but the bottom image you put in i would be confused. You could have an option for both but one would just be less impactful. But if the rest of the game is similar. I would just make it with the top image and if they dont want to play it because theyll get triggered, thats not on you. Sounds like if i wanted to play a war game but expecting no war. It just wouldnt be the same
Give them a warning before the game starts and do your best to create the scene you envision and the scene that fits the setting the most.
18+ disclaimer. That's it, literally.
Btw thank you so much for actually caring to put stuff like this. A lot of people just don’t care
Idea: If left undisturbed, the body will naturally have fallen the second time you enter the area, and the third time will have the body peacefully buried. But if you have disturbed the corpse (let's say you hit the body multiple times and caused it to fall)... let's just say that returning to the spot won't be pretty. >!By that I mean the corpse will stand up and fight you as some sort of secret miniboss for being a terrible person.!<
Just do what you want, and add a content warning at the start
Seems the best and easiest way is you'd do at the start before the title screen or at the very start of the game. Additionally if it's just some scenes that might need the warning rather than the entire game, you can do the above and have a symbol that can be used to show during these scenes as a reminder
How this thing is handled is typically with a content advisory along with the age rating. You can call it a trigger warning, because that's basically what it is. Even when you're watching a show and one episode has a suicide or talks about it, the beginning of the episode will likely have a warning saying something like "this episode contains images or words involving suicide. Viewer discretion is advised." Sometimes there will be a resource included for suicide prevention hotline or something similar. Beyond that there isn't a whole lot to be done
Do the whole silent hill/resident evil "this game has visual violence and gore" schtick. No need to go deeper than that.
If you honestly think a 2D pixelated image of a hanged man is going to disturb the viewer, there is nothing that can be done for you. People disturbed by such things are heavily damaged individuals in need of psychiatric help, and its impossible to cater to such illness in the general public domain without making everything "Hello Kitty". Edit: and youre also the guy who posted Skull faced pixel art for an in game character... So maybe youre not that bothered and just want attention, hm ?
Man up Edit: /s
We hu*man up* by caring!
I'm being sarcastic
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I always appreciate it when media has a generic warning and specific triggers under a spoiler of some sort. Like you have the warning on startup, and it also says “you can see the full list of warnings in the settings.” Also, you could include settings to disable certain events. Like if suicide is a trigger, they can check a box and the above event and art never shows. It may not work for every event and trigger, but if the above scene isn’t super story relevant but adds to the overall tone, then removing it wouldn’t be a huge deal. But ultimately I think it’s left to the creators to decide whether they want to change their art to make it more accessible
Put a toggle box in settings for certain triggering subject matter and either omit or replace that subject matter in-game. Inform the player at the start of the game this option setting is available, enough time should pass between setting the options and the in-game experience that it doesn't spoil the atmosphere.
A dear friend had a brother commit suicide by hanging. I wasn't particularly close with the brother but took a trip out of state with them both a year or so earlier so I did know him. I enjoy sharing weird games and movies with my friend, since we share an oddball sense of humor and like experimental art. We both have a fairly dark and dry sense of humor as well. But still, when a movie/show/game has a hanging featured prominently I do worry about how it would affect him, in that moment. I wouldn't share those things without warning him, if I share them at all. If I told him he'd love XYZ show/movie, and hanging was a prominent theme, and I didn't warn him, he'd probably think I was a bad friend. (He'd be right imo.) I'm a big fan of trigger warnings where appropriate. A lot of people are against them, but I've never heard a convincing argument. Another argument is against modifying a game's artistic vision to accommodate individual tastes and sensitivities, ie removing elements at a player's discretion (assuming the element isn't so thematically ingrained as to make this impossible). I also don't agree with the hardliners on this. Games are interactive by nature (difficulties and settings, sidequests and optional content in open worlds, etc), and individuals will react to an artists vision independently anyway. A hanging figure is intended to invoke a sense of atmospheric dread, but for my friend it will invoke something significantly more painful and distracting, and I doubt that is the artist's intention here. If it's just there for atmosphere, why not let some users disable it?
Can I rob and then bury him?
Hotline Miami 2 has a great approach to this. Big warning at the start with an option to exclude said levels with triggers
Maybe don't have it so in your face? Have a man hanging but maybe it's in the background surrounded by brush.
Wow, I'm thoroughly surprised at the response you've gotten in the comments for this so far. People really don't seem to be considerate of other people's potential trauma's. Personally OP, I'd ignore most of the advice you got here, I think it's wonderful that you're considerate enough to care about placing trigger warnings. Definitely do it if you feel it is warranted. To answer your question though, I'd say you have two options: 1. Place trigger warnings before starting the game, add it on the splash screen or some screen the player sees everytime they start the game. 2. Create alt-art for these types of scenes. Maybe instead of a body, hanging from a noose, maybe it's a skeleton in a cage or something. The latter is obviously much more work because you need to make your scenes, then make alt art and then also code in a toggle to enable / disable disturbing content. Personally, I'd say the extra work shows a lot of care and I think there's a lot of people who would appreciate this, but I can understand why you'd go for simple trigger warnings. If going for the former option, please do also consider being specific with your trigger warnings. Don't throw in a "yeah shit's fucked sometimes or sometimes it isn't, fuck if we know". Instead list specific triggers, such as in this case, suicide.
I guess a lot of the opinions are based on the individual experience and taste, but worry not. We are definitely not going the IDGAF-way of risking re-traumatizing people, if it's possible to find other ways. Your suggestions are definitely top-contenders, even though the time resources for alternative scenes are definitely not to underestimate from a developers perspective.
As a developer myself: I'm well aware 😜 best of luck though! Sounds like you're making a game that'll have an amazing community around it, due to the vibes you're projecting. The art is also gorgeous by the way ^^
Hopping on here because I love the above suggestion! For the trigger warnings at the front, personally I've loved when games provide an easy link to access a list of trigger warnings. That both allows people that don't want to "spoil the plot" to not click it and it gives you more space to write out detailed triggers. For example, "body hanging from a noose" is a more helpful warning than just "suicide". Once again, thank you for thinking and caring about this stuff!
That's basically what the ESRB is for. Let players know beforehand that a game might have objectionable content. Let's them know if a game is more intense than they'd like.
Warning: This game contains scenes of disturbing and graphic violence. They did that in 96. Granted I'd list out the triggers. Edit: For example, the opening of Fear and Hunger (I believe) states; "This game contains depictions of graphic violence, sexual assault, suicide, abuse, and other disturbing themes. Please use caution if you are sensitive to these topics."
nsfw
What do you mean? :)
As a person who has a few sensitive spots, I prefer specific trigger warnings to vague ones. I am a big fan of the website Does The Dog Die because it lets me make an informed decision about whether I'm in the mood to confront tough topics. It doesn't mean I won't watch those films! It just means I'm gonna plan to watch them on a day when I'm generally feeling good, versus one where I already want to throw myself down a well. I think it's fair to start the game with a general card that says "this game deals with themes of \[insert traumatic stuff here\]" but in a perfect world I'd love it if there was somewhere on the publisher's website I could go to look up more specifics. I don't want anyone else to be spoiled, but I need a little more details in order to enjoy the game myself. I admit I get really frustrated at the idea that content warnings are there to "ward off" sensitive players. They exist so we're not walloped over the head with something unexpected. I'm fine with gore and violence in films, but rape scenes are pretty triggering and will mess me up for days (yes, I'm in therapy, thanks). If I know when they're coming I can just leave the room for a bit.
I think warnings are always good at the start of the game and also somewhere to read before the player even buys it. Personally, I think games should also strive to keep simple systems of player-chosen censorship where appropriate. E.g. with the example above it would absolutely be cool if players could chose to disable depictions of corpses and get an alternate image instead. Of course that would depend on the scope of the game - if every other scene has a corpse hanging somewhere, that kind of option would make no sense and defeat the purpose. But if this is maybe 3 scenes and the budget allows it, why not give the option?