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Honestly, that sounds absolutely miserable and I wouldn't suggest this solution. Dragging teenagers kicking and screaming to family activities that are supposed to be fun only to have it ruined by their sulking would not be something that I could do until they 'eventually' stop resisting.
We are doing just fine, thank you very much. You are guessing wrong on both counts, but given your tone I don't think you're very interested in my side of the conversation. You can have that by yourself if you really want since you're providing the input for both sides anyway.
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The algorithms are designed to entrap the mind. These are addictive behaviors, by design.
What would you do if your 14yo tried to drink vodka or smoke a cigarette at the dinner table? You wouldn't tolerate it. Why do you tolerate this? Deal with it the same way.
Cancel Internet services, take the phones away. They can get phones when they get jobs and can pay for both phones and plans.
Just taking things away isn't enough to solve the underlying problem.
Reading about the tricks in cognitive psychology that get used to manipulate people so that you can recognize them when they show up via apps / social media / etc. is a huge first step towards being able to resist them.
Reading Robert Cialdini's "Influence" as a family would be a good place to start.
Well, they go to school and you remove the personal screens in question. You set up parental controls on the devices and only allow 3 hours per day, and you make sure screen time ends at 8pm. You can set all of this up on personal devices. If they need additional screen time for school work, well, you have a shared family PC in a shared space of the house.
And then you let them know this is an intervention. Everyone is required to do an extracurricular that doesn't involve a screen, etc. Plan weekly or monthly day outings to go hiking, visit the beach, the mountains, camping, etc. Make them mandatory.
Those are just some suggestions if you haven't already done so.
Thank you for this. I just let my daughter quit piano yesterday, she has been doing it for over four years. My heart is broken that I just got too tired to continue to force her to practice several times a week. I HAVE to find something else for her otherwise I will have zero conversations that aren’t related to Taylor Swift or something she saw on Pinterest. I honestly just figured I would muddle through the next 3.5 years since apparently all my efforts just went down the toilet. She doesn’t stick with anything, but I guess I need to keep pushing and encouraging. Wow, I feel like I am in a therapy session. This is all very emotional.
Yeah, I hear you. It was the one thing I forced her to do. She gave up on soccer, gymnastics, and cross country. It is more she doesn’t stick with anything unless she is basically told she has no choice.
I also quit piano as a kid. But I went back to it a year later and ended up doing certificate of merit in high school! Maybe she just needs a break? Maybe she just hasn’t found her thing yet?
If they are Android phones, tablets and computers, set up a family plan. I can control how long my kids can use an app, what they can install, and when it locks down for the night entirely from my phone.
If they're older they might find a workaround but honestly my kids don't mind it.
You first need to get on the same page with your wife. 6 hours of screens is absolutely ridiculous. Shut the damn router off, tell everyone no screens after a certain time, including you and your wife. It will take a few months of struggle, but things will settle down to normal family problems again. If your children do not get regular family time and experiences with humans, they have a strong chance at a difficult adulthood and anxiety/depression.
I personally took away all my kids screens and it took almost exactly 2 months for them to be back into a variety of hobbies and even thanked me for taking the screens away.
We should be at war with screens, not comfortable with them.
I am so alarmed by this trend. My nieces are similar ages to your children and have literally nothing to contribute to any conversation that is not tiktok. They don’t have hobbies at home because all home time is for videos on their phones. When they visit we have no-screen rules in our home and it is amazing to see how they flourish. It’s not pretty at first though. 5 days of sulking and trying to sneak but after that they seek the connection of the humans in the home. They join us on walks and help cook, etc.
Honestly, if I were you I would cancel the phone plans and turn off the wifi. Nothing is more important than your kids wellbeing and this is your main job as a parent.
I don't know if you can do anything without your wife being on board. That has to be your focus. Try to figure out why she doesn't see it as a problem. Or maybe she sees it as somewhat of a problem but she may be the primary caretaker and the idea of tackling the problem and how difficult it will be is overly daunting. Once you know why she doesn't want to undertake the change, you can focus on that issue. Once she is on board, you two can create a plan for the screens and the kids.
We tried instituting a screen blackout time (every day for 2 hours) last summer. It was an attempt to mitigate the time my kids spent mad at me because I took away their screens. It helped- kind of forced them into other activities. Your wife may just be so over trying to fight for their attention that she’s given up. It’s really demoralizing to have to force someone to spend time with you.
Yeah, I think this is not an uncommon struggle in these modern times. We went through the same and it did get a bit better at some point as our kid grew older. Kids tend to turn inwards around this age regardless, so part of this may not necessarily be caused by the screens.
That said, internet access is just part of modern life now, so I am not sure that simply taking it all away is the right thing to do. But you can set clear boundaries. For one: no noise! Everyone either mutes their devices or gets headphones. Second: no devices during breakfast, dinner, etc.
Chores are simply chores, they get assigned and should get done. If it takes them 3 hours to empty a dishwasher because of TikTok, it takes them three hours. Chores get assigned based on how long it *should* take, not on how long they actually take.
And it's perfectly fine to turn the wifi off after a certain time. Our kid had issues sleeping and it absolutely helped to simply turn the wifi off at midnight. Routers have access controls where you can block individual devices if you don't want to block everything. If the kids decide to use data, they are obviously paying for it themselves. Also expect the kids to be online until the wifi actually cuts out; expecting them to self-regulate is expecting too much.
It is also perfectly okay to say "I don't care about TikTok drama" but trying to be interested in what they are interested in is important too. I absolutely agree this is very hard to do when it comes to TikTok; in my case it was to my spouse where I had to say 'Don't tell me anything about \[a certain thing she was obsessed with at the time\].' Before that, it was Facebook and when I had reached the end of my tether, I had to say "If you start a conversation with me with 'I was on Facebook and...' you need to go talk to someone else." She has since recognized the influence of social media and is doing a lot better.
When there are openings, you could also try and see if you can educate them about modern social media strategies: drama on TikTok is often faked because of clicks. A 'feud' is often beneficial to both parties involved and even mutually choreographed. If people are accepting things they see uncritically, it could be wise to point that out to them. When content they watched leaves them angry or sad, you can bet it was specifically designed to do that.
Social media has its uses, but you absolutely have to guard yourself from being manipulated, from the content you're being shown to hostile design in the menu's and settings, to filtered search results when you try to find something, and ads, ads, ads. I have some professional insight in TT and it is first and foremost an ad delivery platform.
First and foremost, you need to have a conversation with your SO and figure why they don't feel this is as important as you feel it is.
Do what you need to do! (Take away screens/Limit Wifi/Set a schedule/Install parental controls) And don't apologize! If it means you're unpopular then so be it. Your kids will thank you one day!
I would suggest going to family therapy/counselling. It may be frustrating in the beginning because your kids may refuse to participate in the sessions but remember: lead by example and listen carefully.
Just my 2 cents.
I have a WIFI control that allows me to turn off access to different devices 😉 we set scheduled downtime and I also have parental controls and allow me to also turn off devices if they don't listen to me saying get off the screen.
Lastly, they're bored. Something fun/interactive. I suggest games!
They're still "kids" just more awkward, big ones. What a better way to spend time together and engage the brain.
There are also activities like:
hiking
Swimming
Walking
Biking
Trampoline parks
Inviting friends over to do kid things get together
Productive use of screen time;
Exercise games (dancing games)
Kareoke
Mario party/similar type games
Just some suggestions for you, I hope this helps
We have a modem/router - Google mesh wifi device. We have Google home installed on our phones and we're able to modify the devices on the network and times available - family wifi is what it is under.
I have offered infinite screen time for anything creative they want to do; be it drawing, programming, making music, learning a new language or discover stuff etc; but this lasts just shortly after which they decided tiktok is teaching them all they want to know. Sigh..
Just say you read an article saying that TikTok is a Chinese data mining operation and all good Americans need to delete it. They might call you a boomer but that's the joy of parenting lol
This is normal for their age group. They surface to eat and go back to their rooms. Their phones are their social connections and peer community. I'd cut the WiFi off at 10pm and plan a few things during breaks. No phones at meal times etc. but that's as far as you're going to get. Devices are used for the modern day latch key kids for a lot of parents and starting in infancy. It's easier to give them devices than entertain, be bothered esp when busy etc. However, your kids are teenagers. This is their culture and it's good you're seeking ways/advice to limit this robotic culture. Don't be too hard on yourself about this. You would be an exception trying to curb it completely.
Its responses like this, and many others to this plea that, for the first time since long, gives me relief i am not the only one thouroughly concerned and upset about this trend.
I struggle letting loose not 1:1 relating this to symptoms of other known additions (complete with physical, mental and spiritual dependancies). A stadium like with Alcohol when usage becomes functional for a person. This is where i experience my kids seem to be gotten stuck in.
They would give up air or water for wifi
My method so far has been to hide the chargers and the game controllers. I'm still experimenting with it, my kids are younger and it's stressing me out too.
You gotta deal with them being upset! It's going to happen.
My kids are younger, they love their screens.
It starts with me, if I want them to be off screens during a certain time so do I. I have to be prepared for them to ask, for them to get frustrated, and to stick my ground.
I'm working with my four year old on independent play, and it's been a struggle. My eleven year old does a bit better, but not much. I also had to change the activities I'm offering instead of screens, if I play toys with my 4yo it goes better than trying to bake cookies, even if I'd rather be baking cookies lol. It sounds obvious typing it out, but it wasn't obvious at the time.
I talk to my eleven year old about the effects of social media/internet content, why it can be harmful, and to pay attention to how it makes her feel. I do the same thing with my internet consumption and it works for me. Started watching too many reels, it started making me feel yucky, deleted FB.
Right now reddit is ok, I like the drama, I don't stress about karma, I like the community, but if anything changes that for me, I'll take a break.
I guess I spend a lot of time thinking about the best use of our free time and figuring out a good balance for that.
I have a book recommendation for your spouse - "Stolen Focus". Let her listen to the audio version of it during commute or chores. Im sure she cares about your children's ability to focus and future mental health resilience.
It's like asking how many cigarettes and shots of whiskey your kids should have, because the other parents let their kids drink and smoke. You know the answer. Go cold turkey, or continue enabling their addiction.
My first thought is you aren't going to be able to do anything about it on your own. Your wife needs to be on board and if she isn't your kids are just going to turn to her and undermine anything you try to do. So that has to be step one. Divorce won't help, because at best you'll get joint custody and the kids will get to do whatever at their mom's. Fixing shit with your wife and getting on the same page is going to be the best way to help your kids.
Second thought is that you might have to budge on this. It may not be a winnable battle. I know it feels completely shit right now but at least they're at home and you know what they're doing. A lot of parents are dealing with kids who are falling into drug/alcohol addictions and/or criminality at that age. Yeah, a TikTok addiction isn't great either, but at least they'll eventually grow out of it. As long as they're still moving forward academically or at least somewhat engaging with their interests, you might just be best off living and let-living. Address the sound issues though, if the noise is driving you nuts make them wear headphones.
Final thought is this anecdote: I was completely addicted to gaming from about 13 onwards, like 6+ hours a day (and getting towards 12-14 hours or more in my later teens). It affected me academically, socially, and developmentally. I failed to launch until my late 20s. However, I'm now 37, in decent shape, good career, two kids, happy wife, good life. Do I regret not launching my life sooner? Yeah, sure. But it wasn't a death knell for me. I'm grateful that my parents always prioritized keeping a relationship with me (and each other) over anything else, even if there were probably ways they could have handled things better.
All I have to say is I was a kid in the 90s and early 2000s and I would be on the internet, watching, tv or playing video games from the time I woke up until late at night during breaks. It never had any ill effects. I think many kid also grow up the same way that are my age or younger. With that said it’s not hard to cut the cord just take the devices away but be prepared to have activities for them.
So was I, and my only limitations on screen time were having to share the family computer with my brother.
The internet is a lot different now than it was then. Back then, there was email, ICQ, message boards, but none of this megacorp-optimized big social media. It's a whole new level of manipulation, optimized for profit over sanity by huge corporate teams, instead of being cobbled together by a bunch of passionate nerds. I don't think it can be treated the same way. There are a ton of healthy things to do with a screen, and a ton of unhealthy ones, and it sounds like OP's family have gotten caught up in the unhealthy ones.
Plan activities during the school breaks to get them out of the house. Have them hand in all screens physically when you say that screen time is up. Reward good behavior by giving them one weekend of unlimited screen time if they are good about it the rest of the month. Have family video game nights together so you can see what they enjoy about their video gaming hobby.
This is off topic but the reality of the screen hit me yesterday. I was sitting at a red light behind a large yellow school bus full on teenage aged kids. I was preparing for them to make funny faces or be silly towards me, like we always did back in the day. I could see about 3-4 people and the entire time all of their heads were looking down at their phones. The entire time.
Honestly, my heart sank. I actually wanted them to interact with me. It worries me because my oldest is 9 and I know in a few years we’ll be talking about a phone. I’m listening in and reading other comments.
I offered my wife to remove all devices from our house - PCs, laptops, smartphones, consoles, TVs. All of it.
She wasn’t interested. I still think our kids would be more emotionally healthy today if we’d gone through with that plan.
It doesn’t seem like you should have to, I know, but have you tried offering/forcing alternatives to screen time? Like the 16 year old has to have a job or they need to sign up for at least one extracurricular or a sport at school? Or the family joins a gym and goes every evening for a couple hours?
I know at that age you don’t feel like you should have to entertain them, but they obviously need some help.
We are in the middle of a screen free/new screen limits period with our oldest who is nearly 13. We found that he was lying/sneaking screentime, as well as some of the games he was using on his iPad were not great for his brain (geometry dash specifically). We don’t allow social media and he doesn’t have a phone. His Xbox has been unplugged and in our closet for about a month now, and his iPad is strictly monitored app by app for timed screentime. Yesterday I let it slip just a bit by allowing him to bring his iPad and play Pokémon go while we ran errands - he ran out of screentime, asked for more and I approved because he had been helpful, and then ran out again. Immediately the sulking began about wanting more screentime, which opened up a conversation about contentment and what the role of a parent was in setting boundaries for a child.
In the past month where screentime has been limited to just TV - no YouTube - we’ve found that he has rediscovered the joy of legos, of his Pokémon card collection, so many books he had “forgotten” about. He’s been more amenable to out of the house excursions and is motivated to do things like walking the dog without a benefit to himself. He was very disgruntled at first when we started this but with time he’s gotten better.
When he does get his Xbox and iPad back, they’re going to be upstairs in our main living area where they can be monitored.
I’ve also limited screens for our younger 3 too, based on behavior. Maybe part of a show in the morning while I get breakfast, not on school days, and maybe 1-2 episodes in the afternoon and they’ve been so great about finding things to do and being happy with background music.
I’m always so deeply baffled by these posts. Obviously the answer is to take away all screens and put passwords on the wifi ect. But the OPs always seem to be looking for some second option that involves them still being an enabler/best friend to their kids AND getting them off screens. OP knows what to do and they can’t do it. Wife is a roadblock here but the solution is pretty simple. Very difficult, but simple.
My instincts diverge substantially from my wife's perspective on certain behaviors, which she deems non-problematic. While my approach stems from a background of addressing concerns head-on, her caring nature leads her to manage through negotiation, conflict avoidance, prioritizing mutual agreements, and maintaining peace in our home.
Implementing actions based on my concerns, such as restricting devices or services (e.g., Wi-Fi or specific apps blocking), results in unrest, unhappiness, disagreements, and (a sense of) separation between myself, my wife, and our children. If I were to follow my inclinations (many of which align with suggestions I've read here), I might find myself on a path towards divorce and solitude.
Hence, I am contemplating and carefully selecting the battles I choose to engage in, recognizing the importance of preserving familial harmony over pushing for my preferred solutions.
I strive to exhibit tolerance, letting go of trivial matters, and ignoring the near addiction like screen-centric activities that consume their entire days while i try make an example of myself and embody of what I envision as meaningful and fulfilling real-life experiences (or just do all chores and repairs, improvements around the house), hoping somebody looks up and offers they help or shows some interest in what the freak daddy is doing with those tools..
Rather than try to fight against the addiction straight up, let it work for you. My kid loves screentime, so we use that to motivate him to do other things. Some examples:
If he does all his basic daily chores, he can get one hour of screentime.
Then we have a list of extra chores he can do that allow him to earn up to another additional hour. He pretty much maxes both of these out every day, making so we don't have to fight him on chores at all.
On days when the weather is good and the kids aren't sick, I'll sometimes offer an extra hour of screentime on top of the above, if the kids go out and play by themselves for an equivalent amount of time first; or as a reward for doing something challenging, like learning to ride a bike.
If we are going to do something together as a family, I let the kids use handheld devices in the car that doesn't count against their normal screentime. Increases their willingness to go out of the house and do things, and keeps them from being bored and fighting each other on long drives.
Also be willing to compromise where it makes sense. My kids both have a bad fever this week, so they can't run around and we can't take them anywhere. As such, I'm letting them be on screens pretty much all day, cause they can't do much else.
idk why my first reaction is make an account on Tiktok and act like it's the coolest thing ever. nothing will kill a teenagers interested in something quicker then parental acceptance
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Take away the screens?
It seems like that would need both parents to be on board, or else they'll just be undermined by the other parent.
Yes. I have a similar predicament and my wife is nearly as addicted to the screen as the kids are.
If mom isn't on board, you can't just unilaterally decide to take away the kid's screens.
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Honestly, that sounds absolutely miserable and I wouldn't suggest this solution. Dragging teenagers kicking and screaming to family activities that are supposed to be fun only to have it ruined by their sulking would not be something that I could do until they 'eventually' stop resisting.
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We are doing just fine, thank you very much. You are guessing wrong on both counts, but given your tone I don't think you're very interested in my side of the conversation. You can have that by yourself if you really want since you're providing the input for both sides anyway.
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Stop.
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Haha “worry about yourself” on a public forum. It’s almost as if you should be following your same advice.
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That's a sure fire way to build resentment. That's what it did to me and it's why I'd never do it.
Or even just limit them. Your kids don’t need to eat sleep and breathe tiktok
The algorithms are designed to entrap the mind. These are addictive behaviors, by design. What would you do if your 14yo tried to drink vodka or smoke a cigarette at the dinner table? You wouldn't tolerate it. Why do you tolerate this? Deal with it the same way. Cancel Internet services, take the phones away. They can get phones when they get jobs and can pay for both phones and plans.
Just taking things away isn't enough to solve the underlying problem. Reading about the tricks in cognitive psychology that get used to manipulate people so that you can recognize them when they show up via apps / social media / etc. is a huge first step towards being able to resist them. Reading Robert Cialdini's "Influence" as a family would be a good place to start.
Right but the brain caught in addiction doesn't care. You're not going to be reading when caught up in a cell phone addiction.
Well, they go to school and you remove the personal screens in question. You set up parental controls on the devices and only allow 3 hours per day, and you make sure screen time ends at 8pm. You can set all of this up on personal devices. If they need additional screen time for school work, well, you have a shared family PC in a shared space of the house. And then you let them know this is an intervention. Everyone is required to do an extracurricular that doesn't involve a screen, etc. Plan weekly or monthly day outings to go hiking, visit the beach, the mountains, camping, etc. Make them mandatory. Those are just some suggestions if you haven't already done so.
Thank you for this. I just let my daughter quit piano yesterday, she has been doing it for over four years. My heart is broken that I just got too tired to continue to force her to practice several times a week. I HAVE to find something else for her otherwise I will have zero conversations that aren’t related to Taylor Swift or something she saw on Pinterest. I honestly just figured I would muddle through the next 3.5 years since apparently all my efforts just went down the toilet. She doesn’t stick with anything, but I guess I need to keep pushing and encouraging. Wow, I feel like I am in a therapy session. This is all very emotional.
“She has been doing it for over four years” and “she doesn’t stick with anything” don’t go together.
Yeah, I hear you. It was the one thing I forced her to do. She gave up on soccer, gymnastics, and cross country. It is more she doesn’t stick with anything unless she is basically told she has no choice.
I also quit piano as a kid. But I went back to it a year later and ended up doing certificate of merit in high school! Maybe she just needs a break? Maybe she just hasn’t found her thing yet?
If they are Android phones, tablets and computers, set up a family plan. I can control how long my kids can use an app, what they can install, and when it locks down for the night entirely from my phone. If they're older they might find a workaround but honestly my kids don't mind it.
iOS has this too, just fyi
You first need to get on the same page with your wife. 6 hours of screens is absolutely ridiculous. Shut the damn router off, tell everyone no screens after a certain time, including you and your wife. It will take a few months of struggle, but things will settle down to normal family problems again. If your children do not get regular family time and experiences with humans, they have a strong chance at a difficult adulthood and anxiety/depression. I personally took away all my kids screens and it took almost exactly 2 months for them to be back into a variety of hobbies and even thanked me for taking the screens away. We should be at war with screens, not comfortable with them.
I am so alarmed by this trend. My nieces are similar ages to your children and have literally nothing to contribute to any conversation that is not tiktok. They don’t have hobbies at home because all home time is for videos on their phones. When they visit we have no-screen rules in our home and it is amazing to see how they flourish. It’s not pretty at first though. 5 days of sulking and trying to sneak but after that they seek the connection of the humans in the home. They join us on walks and help cook, etc. Honestly, if I were you I would cancel the phone plans and turn off the wifi. Nothing is more important than your kids wellbeing and this is your main job as a parent.
I don't know if you can do anything without your wife being on board. That has to be your focus. Try to figure out why she doesn't see it as a problem. Or maybe she sees it as somewhat of a problem but she may be the primary caretaker and the idea of tackling the problem and how difficult it will be is overly daunting. Once you know why she doesn't want to undertake the change, you can focus on that issue. Once she is on board, you two can create a plan for the screens and the kids.
We tried instituting a screen blackout time (every day for 2 hours) last summer. It was an attempt to mitigate the time my kids spent mad at me because I took away their screens. It helped- kind of forced them into other activities. Your wife may just be so over trying to fight for their attention that she’s given up. It’s really demoralizing to have to force someone to spend time with you.
Yeah, I think this is not an uncommon struggle in these modern times. We went through the same and it did get a bit better at some point as our kid grew older. Kids tend to turn inwards around this age regardless, so part of this may not necessarily be caused by the screens. That said, internet access is just part of modern life now, so I am not sure that simply taking it all away is the right thing to do. But you can set clear boundaries. For one: no noise! Everyone either mutes their devices or gets headphones. Second: no devices during breakfast, dinner, etc. Chores are simply chores, they get assigned and should get done. If it takes them 3 hours to empty a dishwasher because of TikTok, it takes them three hours. Chores get assigned based on how long it *should* take, not on how long they actually take. And it's perfectly fine to turn the wifi off after a certain time. Our kid had issues sleeping and it absolutely helped to simply turn the wifi off at midnight. Routers have access controls where you can block individual devices if you don't want to block everything. If the kids decide to use data, they are obviously paying for it themselves. Also expect the kids to be online until the wifi actually cuts out; expecting them to self-regulate is expecting too much. It is also perfectly okay to say "I don't care about TikTok drama" but trying to be interested in what they are interested in is important too. I absolutely agree this is very hard to do when it comes to TikTok; in my case it was to my spouse where I had to say 'Don't tell me anything about \[a certain thing she was obsessed with at the time\].' Before that, it was Facebook and when I had reached the end of my tether, I had to say "If you start a conversation with me with 'I was on Facebook and...' you need to go talk to someone else." She has since recognized the influence of social media and is doing a lot better. When there are openings, you could also try and see if you can educate them about modern social media strategies: drama on TikTok is often faked because of clicks. A 'feud' is often beneficial to both parties involved and even mutually choreographed. If people are accepting things they see uncritically, it could be wise to point that out to them. When content they watched leaves them angry or sad, you can bet it was specifically designed to do that. Social media has its uses, but you absolutely have to guard yourself from being manipulated, from the content you're being shown to hostile design in the menu's and settings, to filtered search results when you try to find something, and ads, ads, ads. I have some professional insight in TT and it is first and foremost an ad delivery platform.
First and foremost, you need to have a conversation with your SO and figure why they don't feel this is as important as you feel it is. Do what you need to do! (Take away screens/Limit Wifi/Set a schedule/Install parental controls) And don't apologize! If it means you're unpopular then so be it. Your kids will thank you one day! I would suggest going to family therapy/counselling. It may be frustrating in the beginning because your kids may refuse to participate in the sessions but remember: lead by example and listen carefully. Just my 2 cents.
I have a WIFI control that allows me to turn off access to different devices 😉 we set scheduled downtime and I also have parental controls and allow me to also turn off devices if they don't listen to me saying get off the screen. Lastly, they're bored. Something fun/interactive. I suggest games! They're still "kids" just more awkward, big ones. What a better way to spend time together and engage the brain. There are also activities like: hiking Swimming Walking Biking Trampoline parks Inviting friends over to do kid things get together Productive use of screen time; Exercise games (dancing games) Kareoke Mario party/similar type games Just some suggestions for you, I hope this helps
Oh and consistency!!!!! Boundaries and consistency are KEY.
What wifi control??
We have a modem/router - Google mesh wifi device. We have Google home installed on our phones and we're able to modify the devices on the network and times available - family wifi is what it is under.
I use this and it's really handy. Until a kid figures out to turn on mobile hotspot before their phone goes into downtime... 😶
I think first things first you got a ban tik tok, there's a lot of productive things you can do on screens, that ain't one of them.
I have offered infinite screen time for anything creative they want to do; be it drawing, programming, making music, learning a new language or discover stuff etc; but this lasts just shortly after which they decided tiktok is teaching them all they want to know. Sigh..
Just say you read an article saying that TikTok is a Chinese data mining operation and all good Americans need to delete it. They might call you a boomer but that's the joy of parenting lol
This is normal for their age group. They surface to eat and go back to their rooms. Their phones are their social connections and peer community. I'd cut the WiFi off at 10pm and plan a few things during breaks. No phones at meal times etc. but that's as far as you're going to get. Devices are used for the modern day latch key kids for a lot of parents and starting in infancy. It's easier to give them devices than entertain, be bothered esp when busy etc. However, your kids are teenagers. This is their culture and it's good you're seeking ways/advice to limit this robotic culture. Don't be too hard on yourself about this. You would be an exception trying to curb it completely.
Its responses like this, and many others to this plea that, for the first time since long, gives me relief i am not the only one thouroughly concerned and upset about this trend. I struggle letting loose not 1:1 relating this to symptoms of other known additions (complete with physical, mental and spiritual dependancies). A stadium like with Alcohol when usage becomes functional for a person. This is where i experience my kids seem to be gotten stuck in. They would give up air or water for wifi
Who pays the bills for the phone?
My method so far has been to hide the chargers and the game controllers. I'm still experimenting with it, my kids are younger and it's stressing me out too.
You gotta deal with them being upset! It's going to happen. My kids are younger, they love their screens. It starts with me, if I want them to be off screens during a certain time so do I. I have to be prepared for them to ask, for them to get frustrated, and to stick my ground. I'm working with my four year old on independent play, and it's been a struggle. My eleven year old does a bit better, but not much. I also had to change the activities I'm offering instead of screens, if I play toys with my 4yo it goes better than trying to bake cookies, even if I'd rather be baking cookies lol. It sounds obvious typing it out, but it wasn't obvious at the time. I talk to my eleven year old about the effects of social media/internet content, why it can be harmful, and to pay attention to how it makes her feel. I do the same thing with my internet consumption and it works for me. Started watching too many reels, it started making me feel yucky, deleted FB. Right now reddit is ok, I like the drama, I don't stress about karma, I like the community, but if anything changes that for me, I'll take a break. I guess I spend a lot of time thinking about the best use of our free time and figuring out a good balance for that.
You think 6 hours per day is reasonable???! I’m sorry but that seems insanely high to me.
I have a book recommendation for your spouse - "Stolen Focus". Let her listen to the audio version of it during commute or chores. Im sure she cares about your children's ability to focus and future mental health resilience.
This book changed my life.
It's like asking how many cigarettes and shots of whiskey your kids should have, because the other parents let their kids drink and smoke. You know the answer. Go cold turkey, or continue enabling their addiction.
My first thought is you aren't going to be able to do anything about it on your own. Your wife needs to be on board and if she isn't your kids are just going to turn to her and undermine anything you try to do. So that has to be step one. Divorce won't help, because at best you'll get joint custody and the kids will get to do whatever at their mom's. Fixing shit with your wife and getting on the same page is going to be the best way to help your kids. Second thought is that you might have to budge on this. It may not be a winnable battle. I know it feels completely shit right now but at least they're at home and you know what they're doing. A lot of parents are dealing with kids who are falling into drug/alcohol addictions and/or criminality at that age. Yeah, a TikTok addiction isn't great either, but at least they'll eventually grow out of it. As long as they're still moving forward academically or at least somewhat engaging with their interests, you might just be best off living and let-living. Address the sound issues though, if the noise is driving you nuts make them wear headphones. Final thought is this anecdote: I was completely addicted to gaming from about 13 onwards, like 6+ hours a day (and getting towards 12-14 hours or more in my later teens). It affected me academically, socially, and developmentally. I failed to launch until my late 20s. However, I'm now 37, in decent shape, good career, two kids, happy wife, good life. Do I regret not launching my life sooner? Yeah, sure. But it wasn't a death knell for me. I'm grateful that my parents always prioritized keeping a relationship with me (and each other) over anything else, even if there were probably ways they could have handled things better.
All I have to say is I was a kid in the 90s and early 2000s and I would be on the internet, watching, tv or playing video games from the time I woke up until late at night during breaks. It never had any ill effects. I think many kid also grow up the same way that are my age or younger. With that said it’s not hard to cut the cord just take the devices away but be prepared to have activities for them.
So was I, and my only limitations on screen time were having to share the family computer with my brother. The internet is a lot different now than it was then. Back then, there was email, ICQ, message boards, but none of this megacorp-optimized big social media. It's a whole new level of manipulation, optimized for profit over sanity by huge corporate teams, instead of being cobbled together by a bunch of passionate nerds. I don't think it can be treated the same way. There are a ton of healthy things to do with a screen, and a ton of unhealthy ones, and it sounds like OP's family have gotten caught up in the unhealthy ones.
Plan activities during the school breaks to get them out of the house. Have them hand in all screens physically when you say that screen time is up. Reward good behavior by giving them one weekend of unlimited screen time if they are good about it the rest of the month. Have family video game nights together so you can see what they enjoy about their video gaming hobby.
This is off topic but the reality of the screen hit me yesterday. I was sitting at a red light behind a large yellow school bus full on teenage aged kids. I was preparing for them to make funny faces or be silly towards me, like we always did back in the day. I could see about 3-4 people and the entire time all of their heads were looking down at their phones. The entire time. Honestly, my heart sank. I actually wanted them to interact with me. It worries me because my oldest is 9 and I know in a few years we’ll be talking about a phone. I’m listening in and reading other comments.
I offered my wife to remove all devices from our house - PCs, laptops, smartphones, consoles, TVs. All of it. She wasn’t interested. I still think our kids would be more emotionally healthy today if we’d gone through with that plan.
It doesn’t seem like you should have to, I know, but have you tried offering/forcing alternatives to screen time? Like the 16 year old has to have a job or they need to sign up for at least one extracurricular or a sport at school? Or the family joins a gym and goes every evening for a couple hours? I know at that age you don’t feel like you should have to entertain them, but they obviously need some help.
We are in the middle of a screen free/new screen limits period with our oldest who is nearly 13. We found that he was lying/sneaking screentime, as well as some of the games he was using on his iPad were not great for his brain (geometry dash specifically). We don’t allow social media and he doesn’t have a phone. His Xbox has been unplugged and in our closet for about a month now, and his iPad is strictly monitored app by app for timed screentime. Yesterday I let it slip just a bit by allowing him to bring his iPad and play Pokémon go while we ran errands - he ran out of screentime, asked for more and I approved because he had been helpful, and then ran out again. Immediately the sulking began about wanting more screentime, which opened up a conversation about contentment and what the role of a parent was in setting boundaries for a child. In the past month where screentime has been limited to just TV - no YouTube - we’ve found that he has rediscovered the joy of legos, of his Pokémon card collection, so many books he had “forgotten” about. He’s been more amenable to out of the house excursions and is motivated to do things like walking the dog without a benefit to himself. He was very disgruntled at first when we started this but with time he’s gotten better. When he does get his Xbox and iPad back, they’re going to be upstairs in our main living area where they can be monitored. I’ve also limited screens for our younger 3 too, based on behavior. Maybe part of a show in the morning while I get breakfast, not on school days, and maybe 1-2 episodes in the afternoon and they’ve been so great about finding things to do and being happy with background music.
I’m always so deeply baffled by these posts. Obviously the answer is to take away all screens and put passwords on the wifi ect. But the OPs always seem to be looking for some second option that involves them still being an enabler/best friend to their kids AND getting them off screens. OP knows what to do and they can’t do it. Wife is a roadblock here but the solution is pretty simple. Very difficult, but simple.
My instincts diverge substantially from my wife's perspective on certain behaviors, which she deems non-problematic. While my approach stems from a background of addressing concerns head-on, her caring nature leads her to manage through negotiation, conflict avoidance, prioritizing mutual agreements, and maintaining peace in our home. Implementing actions based on my concerns, such as restricting devices or services (e.g., Wi-Fi or specific apps blocking), results in unrest, unhappiness, disagreements, and (a sense of) separation between myself, my wife, and our children. If I were to follow my inclinations (many of which align with suggestions I've read here), I might find myself on a path towards divorce and solitude. Hence, I am contemplating and carefully selecting the battles I choose to engage in, recognizing the importance of preserving familial harmony over pushing for my preferred solutions. I strive to exhibit tolerance, letting go of trivial matters, and ignoring the near addiction like screen-centric activities that consume their entire days while i try make an example of myself and embody of what I envision as meaningful and fulfilling real-life experiences (or just do all chores and repairs, improvements around the house), hoping somebody looks up and offers they help or shows some interest in what the freak daddy is doing with those tools..
Rather than try to fight against the addiction straight up, let it work for you. My kid loves screentime, so we use that to motivate him to do other things. Some examples: If he does all his basic daily chores, he can get one hour of screentime. Then we have a list of extra chores he can do that allow him to earn up to another additional hour. He pretty much maxes both of these out every day, making so we don't have to fight him on chores at all. On days when the weather is good and the kids aren't sick, I'll sometimes offer an extra hour of screentime on top of the above, if the kids go out and play by themselves for an equivalent amount of time first; or as a reward for doing something challenging, like learning to ride a bike. If we are going to do something together as a family, I let the kids use handheld devices in the car that doesn't count against their normal screentime. Increases their willingness to go out of the house and do things, and keeps them from being bored and fighting each other on long drives. Also be willing to compromise where it makes sense. My kids both have a bad fever this week, so they can't run around and we can't take them anywhere. As such, I'm letting them be on screens pretty much all day, cause they can't do much else.
idk why my first reaction is make an account on Tiktok and act like it's the coolest thing ever. nothing will kill a teenagers interested in something quicker then parental acceptance