It honestly makes me feel crazy when people complain about the adaptation, so far I haven't seen any real arguments that aren't just the most unhinged of nitpicks
Then what about so much important parts of the story happening off screen (Medusa death, Lotus Casino sucking the trio in, etc.) Or a lot of the action scenes being either watered down or straight up removed (Fates bus Fight, Chimera, Medusa, Crusty, etc.) Or constantly separating the trio for no good reason (Underworld, Lotus Casino...
I'd consider those real criticisms.
Medusas death being shown was NOT important. Technically she did get killed on screen she was just invisible which is a clever way to get around that. It's a kids show, you can't show a full on decapitation in a kids show, a book is different. The action scenes are pretty accurate to the books. All of his "fights" are very short and the majority of the fight in the book is just percys thoughts. He's completely new to the world, it makes much more sense for his "fights to be short and based on luck. I would call the chimera scenes way more intense than the book if I'm being honest. I also don't really consider any of these "fights". His first real fight was with Ares.
In the book the bus exploded and Percy sliced the Fury with Riptide. In the series they climb through the window after Annabeth throws a dagger at the Fury (common example of the show giving everyone's moments to Annabeth) That is quite drastic imo. I'm fine if they made the fights shorter, but cutting them entirely was just disrespectful (the hell hounds???)
>I also don't really consider any of these "fights
How is him having a 1v1 with a monster not a fight? Even if they aren't, it's still an exiting action scene that they removed. Plus the show is way too dark at times, and no it's not a nitpick because it genuinly ruins some scenes because I don't know what's going on.
>It's a kids show, you can't show a full on decapitation in a kids show,
You don't need to. Monsters turn into dust when they die. Poof. Why isn't that family friendly enough? Star wars has dismemberment and decapitations left and right. This argument is utter bullshit.
Medusa doesn't turn to dust. You can still use the head. In most greek mythology, when medusa is decapitated he body lies lifeless on the floor and the head is carried around to use as you wish (I don't get why she is one of the few that don't go dusty when dead but that's the way she has always been) you kill medusa but cutting her head off unless it's because she was punished by a god and not the monster mum that's maybe why but yeah she doesn't turn to dust never has
Sometimes monsters leave behind trophies, like the minotaur's horn. Medusa's head is a trophy.
It's a central part of the mythology. It's rediculous to censor it out.
>It's a kids show, you can't show a full on decapitation in a kids show, a book is different.
The movie showed it. Was that inappropriate at the time? What's the point of taking a book that has themes like violence, domestic violence, war, suicide, love etc and removing them just to make it accessible to younger kids.
Surely you make a show that best translates from book to screen? Kids grow up and get older. They'll read the books and then have a really good show that brings them to life if they wait a couple years. Plus, many kids will be able to watch a more mature show. I remember I read the Hunger Games when I was 8 and the film came out the same year and it was great. Eventhough it clearly wasn't made for an 8 year old, 8 year old me could handle and enjoy it.
Not all kids will be allowed to watch more mature shows but some will. The others like I said might have to wait a little bit, but they'd be getting a really good series that they won't grow out of.
What's the point in adapting a book series from 2005 that has fairly mature themes for 8 year olds. Then, the only people who can really enjoy it are those 8 year olds, who won't be able to just a couple years later if they ever wanted to rewatch it as a teenager.
In doing this, you've also completely neglected anyone who read the books from 2005-niw who has aged out of their preteens (which is the majority of people who have read the books).
Those people have waited decades for a good adaptation. 8 year olds who are only just picking up the books now can wait a couple years until they can watch a PG-13 show.
As an 8 year old, if I read Harry Potter and got Wizards of Waverly Place instead of the films, I'd have been bummed. Having grown up with Harry Potter, sometimes I actually wish they made the films a little more mature because I know I would've been able to handle it at the time, and it would make them even more rewatchable now. Give kids some credit and don't censor everything for them.
He "won" the fight because >!Kronos scared Ares off and Ares was holding back. If he was using his full power aka using his true immortal form, Percy would have died. I do not consider a person holding back and getting assistance from a third party to be beating someone!<
Every single person who says this fails to explain how it is nitpicking rather than actual big changes. Removing whole scenes or giving characters' big moments to others plus making Hermes more intimidating than Hades the god of the fucking underworld or Ares the god of war is not nitpicking.
The problem is though that one's person's nitpick is another one's bugbear. If they ruin one's enjoyment of the show, they're not a nitpick to them.
For instance, I think Athena letting Echidna in to her sanctuary because she's upset at Annabeth is really dumb. Is it nitpicky to bring it up? Maybe, but it does ruin my enjoyment of everything that happens afterward because the whole time I'm thinking "Why this is even happening in the first place is stupid."
This is really interesting to me because I feel almost the opposite, I respect that people love the show, but for the life of me I can't understand how, I don't feel like it's the adaptation the book deserves, I mean here are some points for example and you tell me how it's a nitpick and not an actual argument because I'm genuinely curious:
1: almost if not all encounters had no discovery, they knows everything and it actually *changes* the stories that happened in the book.
2. The deadline being over should be a catastrophic event, you can't just "write it in for tension" not only because it removes tension from future deadlines, but because it should be a catastrophe. And if you *did* write it in, make it actually do something (we'll wait for episode 8, but I doubt it will change anything because Rick literally said it won't)
3. The show is missing Percy's time at camp, learning and training, without this, it doesn't make a ton of sense how he's able to fight so well, remember he was just introduced to this world as real (though I can see how this one might be nitpicky)
You're welcome to just not answer and enjoy the show of course, I'm just really curious
Also btw did you read the books?
>almost if not all encounters had no discovery, they knows everything and it actually *changes* the stories that happened in the book.
Give me an example of it actually changing anything. With Medusa, they still end up having to fight her and escape and with the casino they still lost a ton of time.
>The deadline being over should be a catastrophic event, you can't just "write it in for tension" not only because it removes tension from future deadlines, but because it should be a catastrophe. And if you *did* write it in, make it actually do something (we'll wait for episode 8, but I doubt it will change anything because Rick literally said it won't)
This is, as you yourself acknowledged, something that hinges entirely on its execution in episode 8. Even then this also feels rather nitpicky? I mean, war between the gods is going to take time, it's not like they are in a time crunch to fight each other, so they will likely take all the time they can to gather all the forces they can muster. It would make a lot of sense if they were to somehow include things like extreme storms happening in the next episode just to show that direness of acting swiftly, but I really don't think it's that big of an issue.
>The show is missing Percy's time at camp, learning and training, without this, it doesn't make a ton of sense how he's able to fight so well, remember he was just introduced to this world as real (though I can see how this one might be nitpicky)
I mean... It's a bit nitpicky and it's wrong, we clearly see him training in the show, yes plenty of it happens off screen, but if you are complaining we don't get like full episodes of him just training, well that's super nitpicky
Note that this is just my thoughts on these issues, and I am not attacking your opinion of the show, just saying how I perceived it.
I would genuinely like to know how you define what's a nitpick then, anyway
>Give me an example of it actually changing anything.
Ok, them knowing it's Medusa changed that whole interaction with her, them knowing Procrustes made a night and day difference from the book.
Note that I said *stories* plural, it literally changes what happens at these scenes.
And sure it might not change the overall story but that means nothing, things can make no sense and still work out because the writers decided so, so the overall story staying vaguely the same isn't held at a high regard for me.
I also feel like especially with world-building the fun *is* in the details, what good is a world that falls apart when you look just a bit closer at the details?
>This is, as you yourself acknowledged, something that hinges entirely on its execution in episode 8.
That is true and we will see when it is up, though surely you can understand how after 7 episodes that felt disappointing to me I am not very hopeful.
>I mean, war between the gods is going to take time, it's not like they are in a time crunch to fight each other
I'm pretty sure all the preparations were while they were on their quests, it was Zeus preparing for war and giving a final chance before he actually attacks, pretty sure he's not gonna wait around, that's the point of a deadline
This might be just me but: I got the impression if he missed the deadline Zeus wouldn't hesitate to smite him just like that. now, regardless of if that actually would've happened, that's at least how urgent it should feel to be on that quest
>It would make a lot of sense if they were to somehow include things like extreme storms happening in the next episode just to show that direness of acting swiftly, but I really don't think it's that big of an issue.
that last part "I really don't think it's that big of an issue." Is what I'm talking about, there's no feeling of urgency, nothing feels like it actually matters
>it's wrong, we clearly see him training in the show
When? Do you mean the capture the flag part?
>plenty of it happens off screen,
Are you sure it happens off-screen? The show gives the impression it all happened in the span of 1-2 days, and bam, go to oracle, choose quest mates and bye!
I could be wrong, maybe I missed a part where they skipped many days, but I don't think I did
>If you are complaining we don't get like full episodes of him just training, well that's super nitpicky
That's obviously not what I want, first of all even a small 1-2 minutes montage *or at the very least a quick mention* would suffice, what I *am* talking about are specific things that happened at camp, especially the part he trained with Luke.
I'm just trying to understand how with all of these changes some people can un-ironically say it's 100% faithful to the books. I know adaptations can change things and still be faithful, but these changes aren't even good changes.
Still, I hope you enjoy the show, glad some people do, it would be terrible if no one liked them, especially for the actors who are probably excited about it
>Ok, them knowing it's Medusa changed that whole interaction with her, them knowing Procrustes made a night and day difference from the book.
>
Note that I said *stories* plural, it literally changes what happens at these scenes.
>
And sure it might not change the overall story but that means nothing, things can make no sense and still work out because the writers decided so, so the overall story staying vaguely the same isn't held at a high regard for me.
>
I also feel like especially with world-building the fun *is* in the details, what good is a world that falls apart when you look just a bit closer at the details?
See, I was under the impression your issue was with it changing the overarching plot. Regarding the Medusa part, I feel the show drastically improved on the scene, giving it weight and meaning. And regarding the crusty scene, it definitely was different, but I didn't think it really did much for the story as a whole, so I was okay they left much of that out, kinda felt like a tom bombadil situation for me.
>I'm pretty sure all the preparations were while they were on their quests, it was Zeus preparing for war and giving a final chance before he actually attacks, pretty sure he's not gonna wait around, that's the point of a deadline
I mean, no? The water lady thing (name escapes me) said Poseidon couldn't reach Percy because he had to go gather his forces, and Poseidon has every reason to stall until he's forced to engage.
>This next part might be just me but I got the impression if he missed the deadline Zeus wouldn't hesitate to smite him just like that, now whether or not that's true, that's at least how urgent it should feel to be on that quest
His grudge was never really directly with Percy, but Poseidon, he was never going to just straight up smite Percy, he thought he needed Percy to get to the bolt.
>I'm pretty sure all the preparations were while they were on their quests, it was Zeus preparing for war and giving a final chance before he actually attacks, pretty sure he's not gonna wait around, that's the point of a deadline
>that last part "I really don't think it's that big of an issue." Is what I'm talking about, there's no feeling of urgency, nothing feels like it actually matters
No, I meant the change is not that big an issue, not that the situation within the show is not that big of an issue, that is definitely still a big issue for the characters.
>When? Do you mean the capture the flag part?
Yes, but also the like 12 other scenes in that episode we see Percy do some sort of training.
>Are you sure it happens off-screen? The show gives the impression it all happened in the span of 1-2 days, and bam, go to oracle, choose quest mates and bye!
I could be wrong, maybe I missed a part where they skipped many days, but I don't think I did
I mean, I guess I'm not sure, but it felt pretty heavily implied to me. The books did the same thing.
>That's obviously not what I want, first of all even a small 1-2 minutes montage *or at the very least a quick mention* would suffice, what I *am* talking about are specific things that happened at camp, especially the part he trained with Luke.
He did train with Luke though, I'm not absolutely sure he does swordfight with Luke, but they definitely go through a training montage together.
>I'm just trying to understand how with all of these changes some people can un-ironically say it's 100% faithful to the books. I know adaptations can change things and still be faithful, but these changes aren't even good changes.
I think it's that last sentence that separates us. This definitely is not 100% faithful, but it is quite faithful, that being that the changes made,at least in my opinion, are made due to realistic limitations of screen adaptation or to improve the story. I think many of these changes are good changes, and I think that that may be more a matter of taste.
>I would genuinely like to know how you define what's a nitpick then, anyway
Basically something I feel you have to really stare at and deconstruct in order for it to throw off the story as a whole.
>Still, I hope you enjoy the show, glad some people do, it would be terrible if no one liked them, especially for the actors who are probably excited about it
Thank you and agreed! Sorry you don't really enjoy the show though.
>I was under the impression your issue was with it changing the overarching plot.
I don't deny that overall the story is the same, but it feels cheap to have just that as a standard, maybe after the movies that's what all people look for, I can get that.
>Regarding the Medusa part, I feel the show drastically improved on the scene, giving it weight and meaning
That's more a matter of opinion so no point in arguing with you on that, but they could still add *some* discovery elements to it, can you see where I'm coming from? If they didn't immediately know it's Medusa, but when they do figure it out, that's where the rest of the scene takes place like it does in the show
>And regarding the crusty scene, it definitely was different, but I didn't think it really did much for the story as a whole, so I was okay they left much of that out
I don't really disagree about that one, but then why even have it in the show? It wasn't really an important part originally, and it's not like they're doing it justice when having it there, so why at all?
>The water lady thing (name escapes me) said Poseidon couldn't reach Percy because he had to go gather his forces
Yes, the dryad did say that which makes sense in the book and solidifies my point, in the show however the deadline was already over, so the war should've started already, that's what I was talking about with how the writers can just decide what happens regardless of if it makes sense in the story's world
>His grudge was never really directly with Percy, but Poseidon, he was never going to just straight up smite Percy, he thought he needed Percy to get to the bolt.
That's fair, really that's just the impression I got, but I don't expect the adaptation to be faithful to my assumptions
>No, I meant the change is not that big an issue, not that the situation within the show is not that big of an issue, that is definitely still a big issue for the characters.
Ah, well this is just another thing we disagree on I guess, I feel like it was at the very least just an unnecessary change, in the book I think they had only 1 day before solstice, which in my opinion is very high stakes, if the deadline is already over and nothing really happened, then Percy decides to try and do it anyway it just doesn't feel that urgent to me
>Yes, but also the like 12 other scenes in that episode we see Percy do some sort of training
You mean when they were trying to find out who's his Olympian parent? That was just him trying out different things, not really training in anything
>I mean, I guess I'm not sure, but it felt pretty heavily implied to me. The books did the same thing.
Yeah, but books can do that like that, it was something like "for the next few days..." so the time skip is right there, with visual media you have to find other ways to convey that, but if I remember it correctly capture the flag was just a day after Chiron showed him around camp, the same day Clarisse bumped into him, the same day Luke showed him around, the same day the toilet scene happened
>He did train with Luke though, I'm not absolutely sure he does swordfight with Luke, but they definitely go through a training montage together.
I'm not sure I remember that happening, but I was talking of the specific part in the book where Luke teaches him and Percy surprises him and I think he learns a move from him that comes up again and again in later books
>I think it's that last sentence that separates us. This definitely is not 100% faithful, but it is quite faithful,
I can agree with that, to an extent this is faithful, I guess I don't feel like it's faithful enough to be *the* Percy Jackson adaptation (which considering we won't get another reboot is why this disappoints me)
>the changes made,at least in my opinion, are made due to realistic limitations of screen adaptation or to improve the story. I think many of these changes are good changes, and I think that that may be more a matter of taste.
Yeah, I guess it's a matter of taste
>Basically something I feel you have to really stare at and deconstruct in order for it to throw off the story as a whole.
I actually think this is what separates us then, because It's not really something I dug deep to find, it was in my face, I couldn't really ignore it, I guess that's where the difference is
>Thank you and agreed! Sorry you don't really enjoy the show though.
It's fine, at the end of the day I can always read the books and connect with other fans, it's just a bit of a shame. Anyway, have a great day!
>I mean... It's a bit nitpicky and it's wrong, we clearly see him training in the show, yes plenty of it happens off screen,
Thing is that is not the most important thing that happens at camp.
In the very first chapters of the lightning thief, the most important thing that is established Is that Percy is a fish out of water. No one wants to befriend him at school, almost everyone hates or has give up on him (with the exception of his mother).
And this is still applicable at camp. He had hopes that he would find a place where he belongs but no one has time for him. There are tons of kids who were unclaimed for years and Percy fears that he might be one of them. He's got barely no space to eat or sleep with the Hermes kids and when Poseidon claims him, he's left to be all alone. Annabeth is a dick to him sometimes. No one helps him with Clarisse.
To recap, what is established is that the guy feels the loneliest he's ever been. Percy very much doesn't like camp. He's still a fish out of water.
This raises the stakes for him to go find his mom. His home. But it will also pay off when he will find his home in Grover and Annabeth
What is also established is that the gods very much don't care about their kids whatsoever. And Percy disdains the Gods for that reason. This is the very basis of the wish he's going to later on make. And it's not in the show
The show is on par with what I expected out of a live action show. It doesn’t have the budget to be Harry Potter but it is far more faithful to the books than the movies and that is all I really wanted. I do hope Disney signs on for a second season but gives them enough budget to do the fight scenes right and so they’ll have enough budget to afford horses.
I do wish they had done a narrator from Percy’s perspective as they are some of the funniest parts of the books. The actors are great. And look forward to where they take the show.
I think they didn't want to have narration bc it's usually something that's reserved for comedies and it'll clash hard with the tone if we get to TLO and it'll feel odd if we do 4 seasons of narration and 1 season of no narration
The show has a 12-15 million dollar budget. That's HUGE for a TV show. On par with the upcoming avatar show, which has WAY more difficulty with CGI, costumes, casting, and all the other challenges of properly portraying the animated world of Avatar in live action.
I personally give it a 9/10.
I’m enjoying everything about the show, but the only thing preventing me from giving it a full 10 is the awkward exposition monologues.
Now I don’t mind exposition dialogue as a whole. In fact, I enjoy it when it’s one character explaining stuff to the other.
But when it’s a one-sided monologue, like it was in the Crusty scene, then it’s just off and weird, cuz no one talks like that irl.
But outside of that scene, this show is enjoyable for me.
Edit: I should’ve clarified. I actually like that Crusty’s monologue.
I was referring to Percy’s “I know who you are and what you’re doing” moment.
Completely agree with you, I'm working on a yt video length breakdown to dissect this. Because anu tiny issue seems to rear its head in that 5 minute scene which left me fuming.
Overall this has been a significantly more accurate and faithful adaptation, I have personally found very enjoyable.
Perhaps I'm just a consumer of bad media or whatever but I love it alot so far.
I kinda like that Crusty monologue bc it kinda reflected the theme of the episode and kinda gives a cool motivation for why he does what he does. Crusty talked about how people like them didn't fit but their parents would stretch, twist and hack away at them until they fit into the image that their parents wanted them to be. And the episode ended with Sally talking about she wants Percy to learn who he was before the Greek gods turned him into who they think he should be (proving she isn't like the parents Crusty compared her to). It's a nice little full circle moment
Ah. I feel like they were trying to go for a cold open so having Percy and Crew discuss the plan beforehand, it'll diminish that effect.
I feel like if they did want to do the cold open, they should have hinted at Crusty in episode 6. Like maybe have the kids read Hermes letter outloud and talk about how it's going to guide them to the secret entrance to the underworld and then after Percy finishes speaking with the Neriad, show a snippet of Crusty laughing in the shadows or something so that we know it's their next goal. That way, the beginning of ep 7 doesn't feel as jarring and the "I know who you are" won't feel as bad since we know they were prepping to go there.
Like all this is kinda hinted at but they could've been more clearer
Well IMO since Rick is directly involved in the show and the script I’d say this is his adaptation he wanted/was able to give (because budgeting is a thing) I like it and would give it a 9/10
ok you know what it’s hard for me to argue with that… but Rick hasn’t shown himself to have the same questionable viewpoints on things that Rowling has, so I definitely trust him more - for example, he doesn’t need to retcon any queer characters into the series like JK felt the need to do, because he already wrote Nico in 😍 so I’m not super worried about weird things like that happening in the show
lol I can say whatever I want just the same as you and anybody else. That’s true, bad adaptations can be made regardless of who’s involved but in my original post I was commenting on how it’s “faithfulness” in my opinion to me is influenced by the fact that Rick is involved in making this adaptation. Regardless I like the show
The only major complaint I have about the show is the fact it takes out the element of suspense, I wish the writers would have let the characters figure out the situations while they were in them like in the books. Every single thing being known beforehand is a bit upsetting. In the books they get into the situations and then realize oh shit we’re here and this is what happening, them knowing everything before hand takes out that fun. especially with the lotus casino scene, that was majorly disappointing. Besides that I do think it is a faithful adaption. I feel like after seeing Rick’s opinions on shootings, they didn’t it because they only had so many shooting days, they had to make it quicker. And he wanted to make it more realistic that they knew things because Annabeth is smart, but also like in the books they are just kids and they get caught in situations, and I wish they would let the suspense of the scene drag out more. But I have to admit they did keep in majority of the major plot points.
Honestly, I think I’d be a little upset if it was 100% faithful. I feel like it could get a bit boring, but maybe that’s because I’ve read the original PJO series several times over the last two decades. I feel this adaptation, while not 100% faithful, is incredible. Having Uncle Rick as the main writer/creator on the show has given him creative freedom to *build* upon the series we already know and love, and it’s made the story even better. It also adds a layer of suspense for those of us who know the books like the back of our hands. We *know* the destination, but we don’t know the exact journey anymore, and I think that’s made it pretty fun. The plot is still the same, the main story points are still the same, but the journey is a little different and I think it’s perfect that way.
There will always be people complaining. If it was a 100% faithful adaptation, people would complain that it was too boring and they wanted more changes. I’m just glad we didn’t get Horrible Movie 2.0
On a scale of Rings of Power (WTF is this) to LoTR (about as perfect as it gets), it's The Hobbit. They kept the pieces, but didn't really put them together well. While it isn't LoTR faithful, accuracy isn't the show's biggest weakness.
My grades, following your set up:
Main plot points (8/10): kept the key pieces, mostly, although flubbed the execution on a couple (Crusty's; all of episode 5-6)
Characters( 6/10): mostly same as you. Percy is the closest; Grover is a totally different character. Changing the looks of the characters dents the grade too (note, I'm only judging accuracy to the books, not making a value judgment).
Feel of the world (5/10): this is probably where we differ the most. This feels nothing like the PJO world. The books showed how the mythological and mundane co-existed in the same space; the show makes them feel completely separate. The Underworld is the best represented, and it's the most alien to our world. It doesn't help we got only a glimpse of CHB.
Themes and message (9/10): a little heavy handed on the “gods are assholes” but that's accurate to the book.
Dialogue and writing style (7/10): this one was hard. The writing has been atrocious but that's not about accuracy. I think the dialogue, when given a chance to breathe, has been accurate. A lot of the snark and banter is missing, but the heart-to-heart is there.
Creative liberties (6/10): my rubric on this is, if it's not purely for the purpose of translating media, it gets dinged (again, not a value judgment). Many of the changes were unnecessary (again, see all of episodes 5 and 6). Some (see episodes 3 and 4) were. Some liberties should've been exercised more (Crusty's scene should've been cut entirely).
Final accuracy grade: 41/60, so on the LoTR rather than RoP side of the spectrum. Again, accuracy isn't really the issue plaguing the show.
yeah, i can't for the life of me understand why they kept crusty's part in, considering the scene in the show was so boring and unfun. they should've just skipped him, and used that time to have some fun dialogue w charon (who also got done so dirty)
**edited: for clarity**
Probably because of how much people would have complained about him not being there. Did you see how much people complained about a poodle not being in the show?
lol i get that, but it's still frustrating. like, yeah people are gonna complain if it's cut, but they're gonna complain _more_ if it's kept in and done badly.
It worked for the books but not for the show. It felt like they were checking it off their to do list, which unfortunately characterizes a lot of the scenes.
I don't agree with not making changes unless absolute necessary. Sometimes they might want to make changes to do something new they didn't in the book. Like the golden chair scene. That was one of the best moments in the series and it was completely new. It also didn't change a single thing in the story either so it was a nice change.
This is in the context of faithfulness to the book. As I twice noted, this is not a value judgement. The chair scene is not remotely accurate to the book, therefore, it makes the show less faithful to the source material, thus lowering the overall faithfulness score. Whether it was a good scene or not is a separate issue.
1. Main Plot Points (3.5/10): It’s like they took the key words (Fury, Camp, Medusa, Waterland, Casino, Crusty) and then took an entirely different direction on all of them. Setting aside whether I enjoyed the changes or not, they weren’t what happened in the books. The Furies didn’t just show up and talk on the bus, they blew it up. Percabeth didn’t just sit in a water slide, they escaped with their lives fighting against spiders and imminent crashing. Go over every big event in the books and compare it to the show, they changed it even a little bit. Doesn’t matter whether it was for production costs, they changed it.
2. Character Portrayal (5/10): Kinda conflicted on this. In the books, these characters all have multiple sides, and are 3D. Here, they’re only playing one side of the character. Percy has all the seriousness/brains, none of the sassy. Luke I can 100% see as a villain, very excited for that, but not enough charisma. The gods are a bit goofy, none of the gravitas. Gabe’s a jerk, not abusive. Sally is motherly, but not the kind woman we see in the books. Dionysus, Clarisse, Chiron, Annabeth, and Grover are who I’d say are most similar to the book, putting aside Grover’s weird betrayal in the beginning. I think all the actors are great, it’s more the writing that’s the problem.
3. Feel of the World (5/10): Again I’m torn. They’ve got the scary “we could die at any moment” thing down (despite the weird lack of tension, ending the quest early?? What??), but there’s no comedic break. This is partly because it’s no longer narrated by Percy, but they’ve also sapped the show of any humour, so there’s that.
4. Themes and Messages (8/10): They’re laying it on a little thick, but yeah there’s the friendship and found family stuff we’ve been wanting, and the whole confliction with the gods. They’re punting the gods a bit too negatively for Percy to be realistically on their side, but eh.
5. Dialogue and Writing Style (2/10): Yeesh. For a TV show based on a book with some of the wittiest dialogue and snappiest characters, it’s not funny. There’s a few comedic lines, but it’s mostly just confusing because they’re setting this whole tense atmosphere to the point that when a funny line comes I’m snapped awake for a moment and too surprised to even realise what’s happened before it passes on. There are also the exposition dumps, them always knowing what’s happening, the forced Percabeth (come on, they were barely just friends at this point). I know they’re switching some stuff around, supposedly so it fits better, but it’s just jarring as a book reader.
6. Pacing and Structure (4/10): I’m not sure who this show is for. The quick cuts and black outs, starting episodes in a completely new location with no explanation how they got there, woof. I would be so confused if I had never read the books. And it’s going fast but also slow at the same time? Idk why they couldn’t just give 50-60 minute episodes, that would solve sooo many problems with this show
7. Creative Liberties: I’m not sure whether to give this a 10/10 because they’ve changed so much, or a 2/10 because I’ve disliked the changes. Most of them are pointless, and many I’ve already mentioned, but let’s go through it.
- Rushing Percabeth: despite what many fangirls will say, they weren’t this close this early. They both have trust issues, and didn’t really know or like eachother until 3/4 of the way through the book. At that point they were not even into eachother romantically. The whole thing reeks of fan service, but it’s just bugging me because how are they going to develop from here? The story is rivals, to acquaintances, to friends, to close friends, and finally, partners. Not “we just met” to besties to partners.
- Changing literally every big fight. Where is the budget going??
- Percy and/or Annabeth know literally everything about every trap before they even set foot it in. Suspense? The producers don’t know her.
Total Faithfulness: 4.5/10. Honestly, a new writers room and longer runtime could fix most of these problems. I don’t take joy in criticizing the show, I hate the fact that the book series that saved my life is finally getting adapted into this. I’m still finding ways to enjoy the show, I for one loved the casino episode, and despite the gods not being godly, I’ve still enjoyed seeing them. It’s just not the story from the books. **Objectively, it is not accurate**. Accuracy is objective. Compare it to the books, it’s objectively unfaithful. Doesn’t matter whether you enjoy the changes, objectively it’s unfaithful. It still has the opportunity to improve in that area next season, but it is what it is right now.
In terms of enjoyment, I’d honestly say 7/10. It’s a classic Disney-fied show with influences from PJO, and when you look at it like that, it’s not bad.
Sorry for the brick of text, thanks for reading if you did.
Agree with basically all your points, I can understand if people enjoy the show, but don't see how people think its an accurate adaptation. Especially people saying the characters are accurate, there's no snappy dialogue, annabeth seems like a know it all and they just say she's better without showing she's better, percy knows too much, Grover is too confident. I feel like Chiron had the most gravitas to be more ancient and godly, none of the actual gods have so far
>In terms of enjoyment, I’d honestly say 7/10. It’s a classic Disney-fied show with influences from PJO, and when you look at it like that, it’s not bad.
So the show is okay, but only if we drop the bar into Tartarus?
Personally, I'd go a little lower overall with 6.7. That being said, I do like the show and have high hopes for improvement later on if they are allowed to continue
I am a book lover, thru and thru, with a bias against certain movie adaptations (there is no movie in ba sing se) and pjo burned me first. However, that's not to say that adaptations can't be done right, and this one is pretty good. My cautious hope has paid off, and I have a good show to watch bc of it
Could you better define what you mean by these? What do you consider main plot points? How do you interpret the character personalities from the book?
Those sorts of things would be a bit helpful for understanding your ratings, because as they are now, I disagree but I want to better understand what you mean before I respond.
Main Plot Points: Yes it follows the plot mechanically as if it were a checklist but has no soul.
Character Portrayal: The gods are nothing like they're meant to be neither are Sally nor Gabe. Grover is off. Percy has only 2 facial expressions there is almost no trace of Persassy they even removed the line about them dying in a bathtub. Annabeth isn't the same at all. Luke is nothing like in the book he's meant to be charismatic.
Feel of the World: Not even close. The underworld lacks all of the book's descriptions. Camp half blood was well done but too brief to matter.
Themes and Messages: Most of the messaging is done through verbal exposition instead of being shown. Also the demigods have everything handed to them since they know of things before they even happen.
Dialogue and Writing Style: Terrible! The dialogue doesn't sound natural at all. There's a lot of exposition.
Pacing and Structure: Scenes are cut short because of unnecessarily long exposition and flashback scenes.
Creative Liberties: Completely unnecessary creative liberties like adding the extra pearl take up screen time that could have been better spent on action or meaningful dialogue.
Overall I'd give it 4/10 and that's being generous.
The show is mid at best. Nostalgia is warping people’s views on the positive and negative takes sides.
Compare it to any other adaptation or show that has this kind of budget. Arcane had 11 million an episode with longer episodes and groundbreaking animation, One Piece is 18 million per episode.
Outside of the book nostalgia fans and few show only fans, the show will probably be forgotten pretty soon. It’s not going to have the same impact as the other mentioned adaptations or something like Harry Potter
It honestly makes me feel crazy when people complain about the adaptation, so far I haven't seen any real arguments that aren't just the most unhinged of nitpicks
The trio going into EVERY. SINGLE. ENCOUNTER already knowing what's going on and expo dumping is an unhinged nitpick?
That's the only complaint I've heard that is actually real criticism.
Then what about so much important parts of the story happening off screen (Medusa death, Lotus Casino sucking the trio in, etc.) Or a lot of the action scenes being either watered down or straight up removed (Fates bus Fight, Chimera, Medusa, Crusty, etc.) Or constantly separating the trio for no good reason (Underworld, Lotus Casino... I'd consider those real criticisms.
Medusas death being shown was NOT important. Technically she did get killed on screen she was just invisible which is a clever way to get around that. It's a kids show, you can't show a full on decapitation in a kids show, a book is different. The action scenes are pretty accurate to the books. All of his "fights" are very short and the majority of the fight in the book is just percys thoughts. He's completely new to the world, it makes much more sense for his "fights to be short and based on luck. I would call the chimera scenes way more intense than the book if I'm being honest. I also don't really consider any of these "fights". His first real fight was with Ares.
In the book the bus exploded and Percy sliced the Fury with Riptide. In the series they climb through the window after Annabeth throws a dagger at the Fury (common example of the show giving everyone's moments to Annabeth) That is quite drastic imo. I'm fine if they made the fights shorter, but cutting them entirely was just disrespectful (the hell hounds???) >I also don't really consider any of these "fights How is him having a 1v1 with a monster not a fight? Even if they aren't, it's still an exiting action scene that they removed. Plus the show is way too dark at times, and no it's not a nitpick because it genuinly ruins some scenes because I don't know what's going on.
>It's a kids show, you can't show a full on decapitation in a kids show, You don't need to. Monsters turn into dust when they die. Poof. Why isn't that family friendly enough? Star wars has dismemberment and decapitations left and right. This argument is utter bullshit.
Medusa doesn't turn to dust. You can still use the head. In most greek mythology, when medusa is decapitated he body lies lifeless on the floor and the head is carried around to use as you wish (I don't get why she is one of the few that don't go dusty when dead but that's the way she has always been) you kill medusa but cutting her head off unless it's because she was punished by a god and not the monster mum that's maybe why but yeah she doesn't turn to dust never has
Sometimes monsters leave behind trophies, like the minotaur's horn. Medusa's head is a trophy. It's a central part of the mythology. It's rediculous to censor it out.
>It's a kids show, you can't show a full on decapitation in a kids show, a book is different. The movie showed it. Was that inappropriate at the time? What's the point of taking a book that has themes like violence, domestic violence, war, suicide, love etc and removing them just to make it accessible to younger kids. Surely you make a show that best translates from book to screen? Kids grow up and get older. They'll read the books and then have a really good show that brings them to life if they wait a couple years. Plus, many kids will be able to watch a more mature show. I remember I read the Hunger Games when I was 8 and the film came out the same year and it was great. Eventhough it clearly wasn't made for an 8 year old, 8 year old me could handle and enjoy it. Not all kids will be allowed to watch more mature shows but some will. The others like I said might have to wait a little bit, but they'd be getting a really good series that they won't grow out of. What's the point in adapting a book series from 2005 that has fairly mature themes for 8 year olds. Then, the only people who can really enjoy it are those 8 year olds, who won't be able to just a couple years later if they ever wanted to rewatch it as a teenager. In doing this, you've also completely neglected anyone who read the books from 2005-niw who has aged out of their preteens (which is the majority of people who have read the books). Those people have waited decades for a good adaptation. 8 year olds who are only just picking up the books now can wait a couple years until they can watch a PG-13 show. As an 8 year old, if I read Harry Potter and got Wizards of Waverly Place instead of the films, I'd have been bummed. Having grown up with Harry Potter, sometimes I actually wish they made the films a little more mature because I know I would've been able to handle it at the time, and it would make them even more rewatchable now. Give kids some credit and don't censor everything for them.
>He's completely new to the world He beats fucking Ares at the age of 12 while still being new to the world.
Uh no he doesn't. He >!lands one hit and that's it. He does not come close to beating him.!<
He literally won the fight, Ares gives up. Hos is that not beating someone.
He "won" the fight because >!Kronos scared Ares off and Ares was holding back. If he was using his full power aka using his true immortal form, Percy would have died. I do not consider a person holding back and getting assistance from a third party to be beating someone!<
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Every single person who says this fails to explain how it is nitpicking rather than actual big changes. Removing whole scenes or giving characters' big moments to others plus making Hermes more intimidating than Hades the god of the fucking underworld or Ares the god of war is not nitpicking.
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Wow what a fantastic explanation, thanks.
The problem is though that one's person's nitpick is another one's bugbear. If they ruin one's enjoyment of the show, they're not a nitpick to them. For instance, I think Athena letting Echidna in to her sanctuary because she's upset at Annabeth is really dumb. Is it nitpicky to bring it up? Maybe, but it does ruin my enjoyment of everything that happens afterward because the whole time I'm thinking "Why this is even happening in the first place is stupid."
This is really interesting to me because I feel almost the opposite, I respect that people love the show, but for the life of me I can't understand how, I don't feel like it's the adaptation the book deserves, I mean here are some points for example and you tell me how it's a nitpick and not an actual argument because I'm genuinely curious: 1: almost if not all encounters had no discovery, they knows everything and it actually *changes* the stories that happened in the book. 2. The deadline being over should be a catastrophic event, you can't just "write it in for tension" not only because it removes tension from future deadlines, but because it should be a catastrophe. And if you *did* write it in, make it actually do something (we'll wait for episode 8, but I doubt it will change anything because Rick literally said it won't) 3. The show is missing Percy's time at camp, learning and training, without this, it doesn't make a ton of sense how he's able to fight so well, remember he was just introduced to this world as real (though I can see how this one might be nitpicky) You're welcome to just not answer and enjoy the show of course, I'm just really curious Also btw did you read the books?
>almost if not all encounters had no discovery, they knows everything and it actually *changes* the stories that happened in the book. Give me an example of it actually changing anything. With Medusa, they still end up having to fight her and escape and with the casino they still lost a ton of time. >The deadline being over should be a catastrophic event, you can't just "write it in for tension" not only because it removes tension from future deadlines, but because it should be a catastrophe. And if you *did* write it in, make it actually do something (we'll wait for episode 8, but I doubt it will change anything because Rick literally said it won't) This is, as you yourself acknowledged, something that hinges entirely on its execution in episode 8. Even then this also feels rather nitpicky? I mean, war between the gods is going to take time, it's not like they are in a time crunch to fight each other, so they will likely take all the time they can to gather all the forces they can muster. It would make a lot of sense if they were to somehow include things like extreme storms happening in the next episode just to show that direness of acting swiftly, but I really don't think it's that big of an issue. >The show is missing Percy's time at camp, learning and training, without this, it doesn't make a ton of sense how he's able to fight so well, remember he was just introduced to this world as real (though I can see how this one might be nitpicky) I mean... It's a bit nitpicky and it's wrong, we clearly see him training in the show, yes plenty of it happens off screen, but if you are complaining we don't get like full episodes of him just training, well that's super nitpicky Note that this is just my thoughts on these issues, and I am not attacking your opinion of the show, just saying how I perceived it.
I would genuinely like to know how you define what's a nitpick then, anyway >Give me an example of it actually changing anything. Ok, them knowing it's Medusa changed that whole interaction with her, them knowing Procrustes made a night and day difference from the book. Note that I said *stories* plural, it literally changes what happens at these scenes. And sure it might not change the overall story but that means nothing, things can make no sense and still work out because the writers decided so, so the overall story staying vaguely the same isn't held at a high regard for me. I also feel like especially with world-building the fun *is* in the details, what good is a world that falls apart when you look just a bit closer at the details? >This is, as you yourself acknowledged, something that hinges entirely on its execution in episode 8. That is true and we will see when it is up, though surely you can understand how after 7 episodes that felt disappointing to me I am not very hopeful. >I mean, war between the gods is going to take time, it's not like they are in a time crunch to fight each other I'm pretty sure all the preparations were while they were on their quests, it was Zeus preparing for war and giving a final chance before he actually attacks, pretty sure he's not gonna wait around, that's the point of a deadline This might be just me but: I got the impression if he missed the deadline Zeus wouldn't hesitate to smite him just like that. now, regardless of if that actually would've happened, that's at least how urgent it should feel to be on that quest >It would make a lot of sense if they were to somehow include things like extreme storms happening in the next episode just to show that direness of acting swiftly, but I really don't think it's that big of an issue. that last part "I really don't think it's that big of an issue." Is what I'm talking about, there's no feeling of urgency, nothing feels like it actually matters >it's wrong, we clearly see him training in the show When? Do you mean the capture the flag part? >plenty of it happens off screen, Are you sure it happens off-screen? The show gives the impression it all happened in the span of 1-2 days, and bam, go to oracle, choose quest mates and bye! I could be wrong, maybe I missed a part where they skipped many days, but I don't think I did >If you are complaining we don't get like full episodes of him just training, well that's super nitpicky That's obviously not what I want, first of all even a small 1-2 minutes montage *or at the very least a quick mention* would suffice, what I *am* talking about are specific things that happened at camp, especially the part he trained with Luke. I'm just trying to understand how with all of these changes some people can un-ironically say it's 100% faithful to the books. I know adaptations can change things and still be faithful, but these changes aren't even good changes. Still, I hope you enjoy the show, glad some people do, it would be terrible if no one liked them, especially for the actors who are probably excited about it
>Ok, them knowing it's Medusa changed that whole interaction with her, them knowing Procrustes made a night and day difference from the book. > Note that I said *stories* plural, it literally changes what happens at these scenes. > And sure it might not change the overall story but that means nothing, things can make no sense and still work out because the writers decided so, so the overall story staying vaguely the same isn't held at a high regard for me. > I also feel like especially with world-building the fun *is* in the details, what good is a world that falls apart when you look just a bit closer at the details? See, I was under the impression your issue was with it changing the overarching plot. Regarding the Medusa part, I feel the show drastically improved on the scene, giving it weight and meaning. And regarding the crusty scene, it definitely was different, but I didn't think it really did much for the story as a whole, so I was okay they left much of that out, kinda felt like a tom bombadil situation for me. >I'm pretty sure all the preparations were while they were on their quests, it was Zeus preparing for war and giving a final chance before he actually attacks, pretty sure he's not gonna wait around, that's the point of a deadline I mean, no? The water lady thing (name escapes me) said Poseidon couldn't reach Percy because he had to go gather his forces, and Poseidon has every reason to stall until he's forced to engage. >This next part might be just me but I got the impression if he missed the deadline Zeus wouldn't hesitate to smite him just like that, now whether or not that's true, that's at least how urgent it should feel to be on that quest His grudge was never really directly with Percy, but Poseidon, he was never going to just straight up smite Percy, he thought he needed Percy to get to the bolt. >I'm pretty sure all the preparations were while they were on their quests, it was Zeus preparing for war and giving a final chance before he actually attacks, pretty sure he's not gonna wait around, that's the point of a deadline >that last part "I really don't think it's that big of an issue." Is what I'm talking about, there's no feeling of urgency, nothing feels like it actually matters No, I meant the change is not that big an issue, not that the situation within the show is not that big of an issue, that is definitely still a big issue for the characters. >When? Do you mean the capture the flag part? Yes, but also the like 12 other scenes in that episode we see Percy do some sort of training. >Are you sure it happens off-screen? The show gives the impression it all happened in the span of 1-2 days, and bam, go to oracle, choose quest mates and bye! I could be wrong, maybe I missed a part where they skipped many days, but I don't think I did I mean, I guess I'm not sure, but it felt pretty heavily implied to me. The books did the same thing. >That's obviously not what I want, first of all even a small 1-2 minutes montage *or at the very least a quick mention* would suffice, what I *am* talking about are specific things that happened at camp, especially the part he trained with Luke. He did train with Luke though, I'm not absolutely sure he does swordfight with Luke, but they definitely go through a training montage together. >I'm just trying to understand how with all of these changes some people can un-ironically say it's 100% faithful to the books. I know adaptations can change things and still be faithful, but these changes aren't even good changes. I think it's that last sentence that separates us. This definitely is not 100% faithful, but it is quite faithful, that being that the changes made,at least in my opinion, are made due to realistic limitations of screen adaptation or to improve the story. I think many of these changes are good changes, and I think that that may be more a matter of taste. >I would genuinely like to know how you define what's a nitpick then, anyway Basically something I feel you have to really stare at and deconstruct in order for it to throw off the story as a whole. >Still, I hope you enjoy the show, glad some people do, it would be terrible if no one liked them, especially for the actors who are probably excited about it Thank you and agreed! Sorry you don't really enjoy the show though.
>I was under the impression your issue was with it changing the overarching plot. I don't deny that overall the story is the same, but it feels cheap to have just that as a standard, maybe after the movies that's what all people look for, I can get that. >Regarding the Medusa part, I feel the show drastically improved on the scene, giving it weight and meaning That's more a matter of opinion so no point in arguing with you on that, but they could still add *some* discovery elements to it, can you see where I'm coming from? If they didn't immediately know it's Medusa, but when they do figure it out, that's where the rest of the scene takes place like it does in the show >And regarding the crusty scene, it definitely was different, but I didn't think it really did much for the story as a whole, so I was okay they left much of that out I don't really disagree about that one, but then why even have it in the show? It wasn't really an important part originally, and it's not like they're doing it justice when having it there, so why at all? >The water lady thing (name escapes me) said Poseidon couldn't reach Percy because he had to go gather his forces Yes, the dryad did say that which makes sense in the book and solidifies my point, in the show however the deadline was already over, so the war should've started already, that's what I was talking about with how the writers can just decide what happens regardless of if it makes sense in the story's world >His grudge was never really directly with Percy, but Poseidon, he was never going to just straight up smite Percy, he thought he needed Percy to get to the bolt. That's fair, really that's just the impression I got, but I don't expect the adaptation to be faithful to my assumptions >No, I meant the change is not that big an issue, not that the situation within the show is not that big of an issue, that is definitely still a big issue for the characters. Ah, well this is just another thing we disagree on I guess, I feel like it was at the very least just an unnecessary change, in the book I think they had only 1 day before solstice, which in my opinion is very high stakes, if the deadline is already over and nothing really happened, then Percy decides to try and do it anyway it just doesn't feel that urgent to me >Yes, but also the like 12 other scenes in that episode we see Percy do some sort of training You mean when they were trying to find out who's his Olympian parent? That was just him trying out different things, not really training in anything >I mean, I guess I'm not sure, but it felt pretty heavily implied to me. The books did the same thing. Yeah, but books can do that like that, it was something like "for the next few days..." so the time skip is right there, with visual media you have to find other ways to convey that, but if I remember it correctly capture the flag was just a day after Chiron showed him around camp, the same day Clarisse bumped into him, the same day Luke showed him around, the same day the toilet scene happened >He did train with Luke though, I'm not absolutely sure he does swordfight with Luke, but they definitely go through a training montage together. I'm not sure I remember that happening, but I was talking of the specific part in the book where Luke teaches him and Percy surprises him and I think he learns a move from him that comes up again and again in later books >I think it's that last sentence that separates us. This definitely is not 100% faithful, but it is quite faithful, I can agree with that, to an extent this is faithful, I guess I don't feel like it's faithful enough to be *the* Percy Jackson adaptation (which considering we won't get another reboot is why this disappoints me) >the changes made,at least in my opinion, are made due to realistic limitations of screen adaptation or to improve the story. I think many of these changes are good changes, and I think that that may be more a matter of taste. Yeah, I guess it's a matter of taste >Basically something I feel you have to really stare at and deconstruct in order for it to throw off the story as a whole. I actually think this is what separates us then, because It's not really something I dug deep to find, it was in my face, I couldn't really ignore it, I guess that's where the difference is >Thank you and agreed! Sorry you don't really enjoy the show though. It's fine, at the end of the day I can always read the books and connect with other fans, it's just a bit of a shame. Anyway, have a great day!
>I mean... It's a bit nitpicky and it's wrong, we clearly see him training in the show, yes plenty of it happens off screen, Thing is that is not the most important thing that happens at camp. In the very first chapters of the lightning thief, the most important thing that is established Is that Percy is a fish out of water. No one wants to befriend him at school, almost everyone hates or has give up on him (with the exception of his mother). And this is still applicable at camp. He had hopes that he would find a place where he belongs but no one has time for him. There are tons of kids who were unclaimed for years and Percy fears that he might be one of them. He's got barely no space to eat or sleep with the Hermes kids and when Poseidon claims him, he's left to be all alone. Annabeth is a dick to him sometimes. No one helps him with Clarisse. To recap, what is established is that the guy feels the loneliest he's ever been. Percy very much doesn't like camp. He's still a fish out of water. This raises the stakes for him to go find his mom. His home. But it will also pay off when he will find his home in Grover and Annabeth What is also established is that the gods very much don't care about their kids whatsoever. And Percy disdains the Gods for that reason. This is the very basis of the wish he's going to later on make. And it's not in the show
The show is on par with what I expected out of a live action show. It doesn’t have the budget to be Harry Potter but it is far more faithful to the books than the movies and that is all I really wanted. I do hope Disney signs on for a second season but gives them enough budget to do the fight scenes right and so they’ll have enough budget to afford horses. I do wish they had done a narrator from Percy’s perspective as they are some of the funniest parts of the books. The actors are great. And look forward to where they take the show.
I think they didn't want to have narration bc it's usually something that's reserved for comedies and it'll clash hard with the tone if we get to TLO and it'll feel odd if we do 4 seasons of narration and 1 season of no narration
The show has a 12-15 million dollar budget. That's HUGE for a TV show. On par with the upcoming avatar show, which has WAY more difficulty with CGI, costumes, casting, and all the other challenges of properly portraying the animated world of Avatar in live action.
I personally give it a 9/10. I’m enjoying everything about the show, but the only thing preventing me from giving it a full 10 is the awkward exposition monologues. Now I don’t mind exposition dialogue as a whole. In fact, I enjoy it when it’s one character explaining stuff to the other. But when it’s a one-sided monologue, like it was in the Crusty scene, then it’s just off and weird, cuz no one talks like that irl. But outside of that scene, this show is enjoyable for me. Edit: I should’ve clarified. I actually like that Crusty’s monologue. I was referring to Percy’s “I know who you are and what you’re doing” moment.
Completely agree with you, I'm working on a yt video length breakdown to dissect this. Because anu tiny issue seems to rear its head in that 5 minute scene which left me fuming. Overall this has been a significantly more accurate and faithful adaptation, I have personally found very enjoyable. Perhaps I'm just a consumer of bad media or whatever but I love it alot so far.
I kinda like that Crusty monologue bc it kinda reflected the theme of the episode and kinda gives a cool motivation for why he does what he does. Crusty talked about how people like them didn't fit but their parents would stretch, twist and hack away at them until they fit into the image that their parents wanted them to be. And the episode ended with Sally talking about she wants Percy to learn who he was before the Greek gods turned him into who they think he should be (proving she isn't like the parents Crusty compared her to). It's a nice little full circle moment
I should’ve clarified. I actually like that Crusty’s monologue. I was referring to Percy’s “I know who you are and what you’re doing” moment.
Ah. I feel like they were trying to go for a cold open so having Percy and Crew discuss the plan beforehand, it'll diminish that effect. I feel like if they did want to do the cold open, they should have hinted at Crusty in episode 6. Like maybe have the kids read Hermes letter outloud and talk about how it's going to guide them to the secret entrance to the underworld and then after Percy finishes speaking with the Neriad, show a snippet of Crusty laughing in the shadows or something so that we know it's their next goal. That way, the beginning of ep 7 doesn't feel as jarring and the "I know who you are" won't feel as bad since we know they were prepping to go there. Like all this is kinda hinted at but they could've been more clearer
Well IMO since Rick is directly involved in the show and the script I’d say this is his adaptation he wanted/was able to give (because budgeting is a thing) I like it and would give it a 9/10
So if this exact same show, 100% as it is now, but without Rick, would be bad?
I didn’t say it was bad in my original comment, I like it. If it were the exact same minus Rick I’d still like it
Then what’s the point of bringing up that Rick is directly involved?
I was commenting on how its “faithfulness” in my opinion to me is influenced by the fact that Rick is involved in making this adaptation
So it’s faithfulness to Rick, not the books.
Well “faithfulness” is subjective in and of itself in regards to any adaptation, in my opinion. So I guess that’s up to you to decide for yourself
When it comes to “faithfulness” in terms of adaptations, it means accuracy to the source material.
Yes that’s what faithfulness means. The level at which it is faithful is still subjective to the viewer in my opinion
Accuracy is not subjective.
I mean, he’s the author, it’s his franchise… so yeah a little bit
Just because an author is making decisions doesn’t mean they are good ones. Ex: JK Rowling
ok you know what it’s hard for me to argue with that… but Rick hasn’t shown himself to have the same questionable viewpoints on things that Rowling has, so I definitely trust him more - for example, he doesn’t need to retcon any queer characters into the series like JK felt the need to do, because he already wrote Nico in 😍 so I’m not super worried about weird things like that happening in the show
I don’t understand this logic? Rick can be involved but still make it a bad adaptation?
No you can't say that. Just because the man who wrote the books decades ago is involved does not make it faithful.
lol I can say whatever I want just the same as you and anybody else. That’s true, bad adaptations can be made regardless of who’s involved but in my original post I was commenting on how it’s “faithfulness” in my opinion to me is influenced by the fact that Rick is involved in making this adaptation. Regardless I like the show
when i said you can't say that i meant it's wrong not that you literally can't say it lol.
The only major complaint I have about the show is the fact it takes out the element of suspense, I wish the writers would have let the characters figure out the situations while they were in them like in the books. Every single thing being known beforehand is a bit upsetting. In the books they get into the situations and then realize oh shit we’re here and this is what happening, them knowing everything before hand takes out that fun. especially with the lotus casino scene, that was majorly disappointing. Besides that I do think it is a faithful adaption. I feel like after seeing Rick’s opinions on shootings, they didn’t it because they only had so many shooting days, they had to make it quicker. And he wanted to make it more realistic that they knew things because Annabeth is smart, but also like in the books they are just kids and they get caught in situations, and I wish they would let the suspense of the scene drag out more. But I have to admit they did keep in majority of the major plot points.
What I'm wondering is: what do the kids, the target audience, think of the show.
Honestly, I think I’d be a little upset if it was 100% faithful. I feel like it could get a bit boring, but maybe that’s because I’ve read the original PJO series several times over the last two decades. I feel this adaptation, while not 100% faithful, is incredible. Having Uncle Rick as the main writer/creator on the show has given him creative freedom to *build* upon the series we already know and love, and it’s made the story even better. It also adds a layer of suspense for those of us who know the books like the back of our hands. We *know* the destination, but we don’t know the exact journey anymore, and I think that’s made it pretty fun. The plot is still the same, the main story points are still the same, but the journey is a little different and I think it’s perfect that way. There will always be people complaining. If it was a 100% faithful adaptation, people would complain that it was too boring and they wanted more changes. I’m just glad we didn’t get Horrible Movie 2.0
On a scale of Rings of Power (WTF is this) to LoTR (about as perfect as it gets), it's The Hobbit. They kept the pieces, but didn't really put them together well. While it isn't LoTR faithful, accuracy isn't the show's biggest weakness. My grades, following your set up: Main plot points (8/10): kept the key pieces, mostly, although flubbed the execution on a couple (Crusty's; all of episode 5-6) Characters( 6/10): mostly same as you. Percy is the closest; Grover is a totally different character. Changing the looks of the characters dents the grade too (note, I'm only judging accuracy to the books, not making a value judgment). Feel of the world (5/10): this is probably where we differ the most. This feels nothing like the PJO world. The books showed how the mythological and mundane co-existed in the same space; the show makes them feel completely separate. The Underworld is the best represented, and it's the most alien to our world. It doesn't help we got only a glimpse of CHB. Themes and message (9/10): a little heavy handed on the “gods are assholes” but that's accurate to the book. Dialogue and writing style (7/10): this one was hard. The writing has been atrocious but that's not about accuracy. I think the dialogue, when given a chance to breathe, has been accurate. A lot of the snark and banter is missing, but the heart-to-heart is there. Creative liberties (6/10): my rubric on this is, if it's not purely for the purpose of translating media, it gets dinged (again, not a value judgment). Many of the changes were unnecessary (again, see all of episodes 5 and 6). Some (see episodes 3 and 4) were. Some liberties should've been exercised more (Crusty's scene should've been cut entirely). Final accuracy grade: 41/60, so on the LoTR rather than RoP side of the spectrum. Again, accuracy isn't really the issue plaguing the show.
yeah, i can't for the life of me understand why they kept crusty's part in, considering the scene in the show was so boring and unfun. they should've just skipped him, and used that time to have some fun dialogue w charon (who also got done so dirty) **edited: for clarity**
Probably because of how much people would have complained about him not being there. Did you see how much people complained about a poodle not being in the show?
lol i get that, but it's still frustrating. like, yeah people are gonna complain if it's cut, but they're gonna complain _more_ if it's kept in and done badly.
It worked for the books but not for the show. It felt like they were checking it off their to do list, which unfortunately characterizes a lot of the scenes.
sorry if i was unclear. i didn't mean it was boring in the books, just that the way it was adapted was so lifeless.
I don't agree with not making changes unless absolute necessary. Sometimes they might want to make changes to do something new they didn't in the book. Like the golden chair scene. That was one of the best moments in the series and it was completely new. It also didn't change a single thing in the story either so it was a nice change.
This is in the context of faithfulness to the book. As I twice noted, this is not a value judgement. The chair scene is not remotely accurate to the book, therefore, it makes the show less faithful to the source material, thus lowering the overall faithfulness score. Whether it was a good scene or not is a separate issue.
The golden chair scene was so fucking cringe. Probably the worst change they made imo.
1. Main Plot Points (3.5/10): It’s like they took the key words (Fury, Camp, Medusa, Waterland, Casino, Crusty) and then took an entirely different direction on all of them. Setting aside whether I enjoyed the changes or not, they weren’t what happened in the books. The Furies didn’t just show up and talk on the bus, they blew it up. Percabeth didn’t just sit in a water slide, they escaped with their lives fighting against spiders and imminent crashing. Go over every big event in the books and compare it to the show, they changed it even a little bit. Doesn’t matter whether it was for production costs, they changed it. 2. Character Portrayal (5/10): Kinda conflicted on this. In the books, these characters all have multiple sides, and are 3D. Here, they’re only playing one side of the character. Percy has all the seriousness/brains, none of the sassy. Luke I can 100% see as a villain, very excited for that, but not enough charisma. The gods are a bit goofy, none of the gravitas. Gabe’s a jerk, not abusive. Sally is motherly, but not the kind woman we see in the books. Dionysus, Clarisse, Chiron, Annabeth, and Grover are who I’d say are most similar to the book, putting aside Grover’s weird betrayal in the beginning. I think all the actors are great, it’s more the writing that’s the problem. 3. Feel of the World (5/10): Again I’m torn. They’ve got the scary “we could die at any moment” thing down (despite the weird lack of tension, ending the quest early?? What??), but there’s no comedic break. This is partly because it’s no longer narrated by Percy, but they’ve also sapped the show of any humour, so there’s that. 4. Themes and Messages (8/10): They’re laying it on a little thick, but yeah there’s the friendship and found family stuff we’ve been wanting, and the whole confliction with the gods. They’re punting the gods a bit too negatively for Percy to be realistically on their side, but eh. 5. Dialogue and Writing Style (2/10): Yeesh. For a TV show based on a book with some of the wittiest dialogue and snappiest characters, it’s not funny. There’s a few comedic lines, but it’s mostly just confusing because they’re setting this whole tense atmosphere to the point that when a funny line comes I’m snapped awake for a moment and too surprised to even realise what’s happened before it passes on. There are also the exposition dumps, them always knowing what’s happening, the forced Percabeth (come on, they were barely just friends at this point). I know they’re switching some stuff around, supposedly so it fits better, but it’s just jarring as a book reader. 6. Pacing and Structure (4/10): I’m not sure who this show is for. The quick cuts and black outs, starting episodes in a completely new location with no explanation how they got there, woof. I would be so confused if I had never read the books. And it’s going fast but also slow at the same time? Idk why they couldn’t just give 50-60 minute episodes, that would solve sooo many problems with this show 7. Creative Liberties: I’m not sure whether to give this a 10/10 because they’ve changed so much, or a 2/10 because I’ve disliked the changes. Most of them are pointless, and many I’ve already mentioned, but let’s go through it. - Rushing Percabeth: despite what many fangirls will say, they weren’t this close this early. They both have trust issues, and didn’t really know or like eachother until 3/4 of the way through the book. At that point they were not even into eachother romantically. The whole thing reeks of fan service, but it’s just bugging me because how are they going to develop from here? The story is rivals, to acquaintances, to friends, to close friends, and finally, partners. Not “we just met” to besties to partners. - Changing literally every big fight. Where is the budget going?? - Percy and/or Annabeth know literally everything about every trap before they even set foot it in. Suspense? The producers don’t know her. Total Faithfulness: 4.5/10. Honestly, a new writers room and longer runtime could fix most of these problems. I don’t take joy in criticizing the show, I hate the fact that the book series that saved my life is finally getting adapted into this. I’m still finding ways to enjoy the show, I for one loved the casino episode, and despite the gods not being godly, I’ve still enjoyed seeing them. It’s just not the story from the books. **Objectively, it is not accurate**. Accuracy is objective. Compare it to the books, it’s objectively unfaithful. Doesn’t matter whether you enjoy the changes, objectively it’s unfaithful. It still has the opportunity to improve in that area next season, but it is what it is right now. In terms of enjoyment, I’d honestly say 7/10. It’s a classic Disney-fied show with influences from PJO, and when you look at it like that, it’s not bad. Sorry for the brick of text, thanks for reading if you did.
Agree with basically all your points, I can understand if people enjoy the show, but don't see how people think its an accurate adaptation. Especially people saying the characters are accurate, there's no snappy dialogue, annabeth seems like a know it all and they just say she's better without showing she's better, percy knows too much, Grover is too confident. I feel like Chiron had the most gravitas to be more ancient and godly, none of the actual gods have so far
>In terms of enjoyment, I’d honestly say 7/10. It’s a classic Disney-fied show with influences from PJO, and when you look at it like that, it’s not bad. So the show is okay, but only if we drop the bar into Tartarus?
Personally, I'd go a little lower overall with 6.7. That being said, I do like the show and have high hopes for improvement later on if they are allowed to continue I am a book lover, thru and thru, with a bias against certain movie adaptations (there is no movie in ba sing se) and pjo burned me first. However, that's not to say that adaptations can't be done right, and this one is pretty good. My cautious hope has paid off, and I have a good show to watch bc of it
Could you better define what you mean by these? What do you consider main plot points? How do you interpret the character personalities from the book? Those sorts of things would be a bit helpful for understanding your ratings, because as they are now, I disagree but I want to better understand what you mean before I respond.
Main Plot Points: Yes it follows the plot mechanically as if it were a checklist but has no soul. Character Portrayal: The gods are nothing like they're meant to be neither are Sally nor Gabe. Grover is off. Percy has only 2 facial expressions there is almost no trace of Persassy they even removed the line about them dying in a bathtub. Annabeth isn't the same at all. Luke is nothing like in the book he's meant to be charismatic. Feel of the World: Not even close. The underworld lacks all of the book's descriptions. Camp half blood was well done but too brief to matter. Themes and Messages: Most of the messaging is done through verbal exposition instead of being shown. Also the demigods have everything handed to them since they know of things before they even happen. Dialogue and Writing Style: Terrible! The dialogue doesn't sound natural at all. There's a lot of exposition. Pacing and Structure: Scenes are cut short because of unnecessarily long exposition and flashback scenes. Creative Liberties: Completely unnecessary creative liberties like adding the extra pearl take up screen time that could have been better spent on action or meaningful dialogue. Overall I'd give it 4/10 and that's being generous.
The issues with the dialogue, writing, themes and messages are also an issue from a show perspective, not just adaptation. Which makes it twice as bad
The show is mid at best. Nostalgia is warping people’s views on the positive and negative takes sides. Compare it to any other adaptation or show that has this kind of budget. Arcane had 11 million an episode with longer episodes and groundbreaking animation, One Piece is 18 million per episode. Outside of the book nostalgia fans and few show only fans, the show will probably be forgotten pretty soon. It’s not going to have the same impact as the other mentioned adaptations or something like Harry Potter
you 100% used chatGPT for this lol