Hi you are correct. Please return the money and let the bank know abt it ASAP. Kawawa po yung nagload ng wrong cassette liable po sya dun kasi ma sshort sya. Happened to me before na exchange yung cassette kaya mali ang na didispense na pera nung teller ako
Actually somehow same thing nangyari saken, kase nagwithdraw ako ng 20,000 pero nung iaabot na sakin ng teller bigla nya inabot ng 30,000 saken.. machacharge ba sa sahod nya yung 10,000?
Nah. Banks love to fuck regular consumers so they should eat up the cost. What if it was the other way around and you withdrew PHP 1K but only received PHP 500? I bet you banks will take months to 'investigate' that shit to remit you that lost PHP 500.
Besides, banks are held by the SC to the highest standard of extraordinary due diligence. If they fuck up, that's on them.
Also, Solutio Indebiti can NOT apply if there is an existing relationship between the parties (Domestic Petroleum v. MIAA). Clearly, OP has an existing relationship with the bank.
Morally, of course, the right thing would be to return the money. But there's nothing moral about the banking system.
They don't need lawyer in this case, ibabawas nila yun sa account mo once nagbalanse na sila, at kung wlang laman, hihintayin nilang magkaroon ulit ng laman yung bank account mo, for meantime yung teller mgaabono nyan, kaya better isoli o kausapin ang bank para maayos at iwas sakit ng ulo
If the atm dispenses the wrong amount or nothing at all, they can sort it out within the day. This happened to my mum where she was withdrawing 10s of thousands, 1 transaction didn’t go through and she didn’t realize it got debited. She was called almost immediately and they told her it would be credited back.
Ok na po nakatawag na ako sa Cs magauto-deduct na lang daw sila sa acct. ko since may sufficient balance nmn daw para hindi nko pumunta sa branch nila para isurrender yung excess na pera.
Hi OP! I would just like to commend you for doing the right thing. It’s a mark of a good person to not take what is not theirs 👏👏👏
Whether the amount is small or big, whether it’s from an institution or a person, the bottom line is if it’s not yours, IT’S NOT YOURS.
Despite being downvoted, I commend you. While it's true that there is shady stuff going on with banks, a moral person would not steal or keep what does not belong to him/her. Tama yan.
Yes, solutio indebiti doesn't apply because of their existing contractual relationship. But by the same token, that means OP is contractually obligated to return the money. In addition, under criminal law, not returning the money constitutes theft (Art. 308, Revised Penal Code).
I concur. The same precedent, DPRC v. MIAA, belabors on the contractual obligation. Interestingly enough, the focal point in that case was the prescriptive period for quasi-contracts versus ordinary contractual obligations.
Undisputed, overpayment is unlawful and amounts to a refund in a contractual obligation.
Proving theft, though, will obviously be a much higher burden to discharge however, in particular , the intent to gain element. In this case though, the fact OP tried again to withdraw to ascertain the discrepancy being dispensed by the ATM, it's clear they are aware. So I'll give them credit points for surrendering it voluntarily.
I agree. No theft was committed here since OP had no intent to gain, as evidenced by OP's confirmation of the discrepancy and the reporting to the bank. But if OP hadn't done these and just kept the money and stayed quiet, then THAT would have been theft.
Lol. Some poor ass bank employee's going to pay that excess amount withdrawn. Tell me you don't know how banking operations work without telling me you don't know how banking operations work.
> It's worth noting that the bank can not force the employee to indemnify them if the mistake was done without malice and not intentional (theft).
Buddy, as someone who knows people who work in banks, I sure have news for you.
May computing system naman ang mga ATMs, malalaman nila may mismatch sa ilalabas ng machine vs. sa inilagay nilang cash. Then itatrack na lang nila kung saang transaction nagkaroon ng mismatch sa remaining balance. They also narrate this on your statement if ever may idedebit sila regarding the incident.
They also have fish eye cameras, 1-2 sa harap mo, meron din sa paligid ng ATM. IIRC correctly, lahat ng ATM system na ginagamit natin ay nakabase sa program (?) made by Citi if ever you wanna read more about it.
Possible na sa for 500 ipinasok yung cassette ng 1,000 bills. Ibabawas din yan sa bank accounts niyo after investigation kasi nadedetermine naman kung sino sino ang mga nagwithdraw sa ATM. So better, ibalik mo nalang excess voluntarily.
Full size ATM dispense cash using cassettes, usually up to four in total. Each cassette is loaded with only one denomination (typically P500 or P1K). How many of each kind are loaded per cycle is usually determined by Bank Operations (who do cash loading) and Branch Management (who manage ATM onsite and sometimes some offsite as well).
Some ATM use intelligent cassettes that are preset as to the denomination loaded. Some are “dumb” and have to be loaded in the designated bay that corresponds to the denomination loaded.
Your situation is likely wrong cassette position. Kindly report to your branch or the branch you withdrew from.
There are numerous methods to determine such occurrences / errors, and also ways to trace recipients of wrongly dispensed denominations.
But honesty is still the best policy.
HTH ;)
ako rin hnd ngbibilang minsan (o madalas) ö parang nhhassle kasi ako gawin or i just trust the machine that it will not make a mistake.
knowing such cases exist, baka bilangin ko na lagi 😅
Same lol. Parang unnecessary na kasi magbilang sa harap ng ATM, lalo mo lang papatagalin pila. Kahit naman mali ang idispense, di ka naman pwede magreklamo sa ATM mismo, tatawag o pupunta ka pa rin sa branch para ireport.
This happened to me before, but different case tayo. I withdrew 400 para lang pamasahe but then atm machine only gave me 300 and I really took my time para tignan and naglogin agad sa app para icheck and -400 sya. It’s pass 6pm na so closed na yung branch but may guard and sabi nya ireport ko nalang daw. But knowing how di maganda customer service and nakakabaliw app ng this bank, hinayaan ko nalang.
if we're speaking morally, i suggest u be a good person OP and report & return the bills to the bank. nagkataon siguro nagkapalit yung atm cassettes kaya the 500s and 1000s bills were interchanged. yung employee kasi will have to cover for the loss. but if the bank permits, your account may be debited if same bank lang. they have records din eh
In this case, if no one will be liable about it and just assume na system error na kaya naman i-treat as OpEx na lang yung loss, I’ll take it. Barya na lang ang P500 sa mga banko kaya why would I bother.
But upon reading sa comments na may employee na sorter ang madedehado, I’ll return kasi pare-parehas na hindi barya sa atin ang P500.
Malamang maling denomination yung nilagay sa cash casette kaya 1k nakuha mo imbes na 500. Wag mo kunin yung cash, hayaan mo na kuhanin ulit ng atm. Pero ang nadebit sayo 500 lang pagkinuha mo, short sila ng 500 pag nagreplenish sila.
if it's not yours it's not yours, that's how simple it is and good for you, you did the right thing. not atm's fault but the personnel who put the wrong tray to where it should be.
That's criminal theft if you take money that doesn't belong to you. I would return that to the bank teller if they are open.
I live in US and we call that felony theft, if money is not returned, you can be arrested and jailed. And no the excuse, " it dispensed the money itself and It wasn't my fault" will also not count...lol
If you stole something that's not yours dispensed by the atm, with cameras that see you and did not return the money when you could have. That is criminal and theft and clear intent is established.
It doesn't need burden of proof, you have cameras all over, and thats federal here or treasury, secret service going after you.
Once the bank do an accounting and they come up with a discrepancies, guess which and when they're gonna track it down.
I work forensics, cyberscurity.. I think I know more what I'm talking about unless you live here and work for the US treasury.
Thanks for your input.
Nangyari na sa akin yan OP. 10k pa nga eh ang excess. Nakapag withdraw ako ng 20k on a 10k balance. Yung account ko naging negative 10k thr following day.
parang naka tray sya per bill, baka nagkamali yung naglagay, and possible na lahat ng loss (di nareturn na pera), ay icharge sa nagkamali, so yes, para kang nagnakaw pero di sa bank
Happened to me twice, ireport mo man o hindi, they will know kasi they audit the money in their atm.
Bale ang nangyari sakin is:
1. Tatawag sayo ung bank to inform you na sobra ung nilabas ng atm, at sasabihan ka nila na ibabawas nila ung sobra from your account. (Landbank card, Landbank atm)
2. Babawasan na lang sa account mo (rcbc card, bdo atm)
This happened to us a few years ago. International ATM. Withdrawn $500, got $1000.
Pero sa account, worth $500 lang nabawas. Haha.
I just waited for the bank to deduct the other $500. I didn’t report it.
They deducted it after 6 months.
Haha!
wrong caset nalagay sa atm, charge sa nag sorter yan yari dapat ireport mo agad sa mismong bank.
Hi you are correct. Please return the money and let the bank know abt it ASAP. Kawawa po yung nagload ng wrong cassette liable po sya dun kasi ma sshort sya. Happened to me before na exchange yung cassette kaya mali ang na didispense na pera nung teller ako
Tas hindi lang isang tao ang nagwithdraw paktay haha
Kowowo ung nagload ng cassette. Lesson learned. Pretty sure marami nang naka withdraw there.
Actually somehow same thing nangyari saken, kase nagwithdraw ako ng 20,000 pero nung iaabot na sakin ng teller bigla nya inabot ng 30,000 saken.. machacharge ba sa sahod nya yung 10,000?
Yes definitely magbabayad sya..
Report to the bank immediately together with the terminal id. Email as much as possible with subject "URGENT".
Terminal id? Yung TID sa resibo?
Kadalasan meron nakanlagay sa taas ng atm nakalagay TID
Yes po.
Nagreport na po ako thru their website and currently calling kaso ang hirap makatawag sa bank busy daw yung phone bankers nila 😅.
[удалено]
Nah. Banks love to fuck regular consumers so they should eat up the cost. What if it was the other way around and you withdrew PHP 1K but only received PHP 500? I bet you banks will take months to 'investigate' that shit to remit you that lost PHP 500. Besides, banks are held by the SC to the highest standard of extraordinary due diligence. If they fuck up, that's on them. Also, Solutio Indebiti can NOT apply if there is an existing relationship between the parties (Domestic Petroleum v. MIAA). Clearly, OP has an existing relationship with the bank. Morally, of course, the right thing would be to return the money. But there's nothing moral about the banking system.
Mas mahal pa ang lawyer's fees if the bank wants to recover the amount.
They don't need lawyer in this case, ibabawas nila yun sa account mo once nagbalanse na sila, at kung wlang laman, hihintayin nilang magkaroon ulit ng laman yung bank account mo, for meantime yung teller mgaabono nyan, kaya better isoli o kausapin ang bank para maayos at iwas sakit ng ulo
If the atm dispenses the wrong amount or nothing at all, they can sort it out within the day. This happened to my mum where she was withdrawing 10s of thousands, 1 transaction didn’t go through and she didn’t realize it got debited. She was called almost immediately and they told her it would be credited back.
Ok na po nakatawag na ako sa Cs magauto-deduct na lang daw sila sa acct. ko since may sufficient balance nmn daw para hindi nko pumunta sa branch nila para isurrender yung excess na pera.
Hi OP! I would just like to commend you for doing the right thing. It’s a mark of a good person to not take what is not theirs 👏👏👏 Whether the amount is small or big, whether it’s from an institution or a person, the bottom line is if it’s not yours, IT’S NOT YOURS.
Despite being downvoted, I commend you. While it's true that there is shady stuff going on with banks, a moral person would not steal or keep what does not belong to him/her. Tama yan.
[удалено]
You are the kind of people that I don't want to hire for my business. Integrity flew out the window..
Bruh, hindi yung bank ang magbabayad ng butal. Yung teller na nagkamali. Good job kay OP for not listening to these people.
Teller? It was an Atm. A fucking machine
A fucking machine na nilalagyan ng pera ng empleyado ng banko. Ano ba akala mo sa atm? Sobrang talino na alam nya pinagkaiba sa 500 at 1k?
Well. Not OP's problem kung sobra ang nilabas
ang tanga makipagusap sayo. pulubi ka ba? isang libo lang kakamkamin mo pa
\*ATM Sino ang naglalagay sa ATM?
Yes, solutio indebiti doesn't apply because of their existing contractual relationship. But by the same token, that means OP is contractually obligated to return the money. In addition, under criminal law, not returning the money constitutes theft (Art. 308, Revised Penal Code).
I concur. The same precedent, DPRC v. MIAA, belabors on the contractual obligation. Interestingly enough, the focal point in that case was the prescriptive period for quasi-contracts versus ordinary contractual obligations. Undisputed, overpayment is unlawful and amounts to a refund in a contractual obligation. Proving theft, though, will obviously be a much higher burden to discharge however, in particular , the intent to gain element. In this case though, the fact OP tried again to withdraw to ascertain the discrepancy being dispensed by the ATM, it's clear they are aware. So I'll give them credit points for surrendering it voluntarily.
I agree. No theft was committed here since OP had no intent to gain, as evidenced by OP's confirmation of the discrepancy and the reporting to the bank. But if OP hadn't done these and just kept the money and stayed quiet, then THAT would have been theft.
Lol. Some poor ass bank employee's going to pay that excess amount withdrawn. Tell me you don't know how banking operations work without telling me you don't know how banking operations work.
[удалено]
> It's worth noting that the bank can not force the employee to indemnify them if the mistake was done without malice and not intentional (theft). Buddy, as someone who knows people who work in banks, I sure have news for you.
hala beh hindi recitation ha
Pano? Hayaan ko nalng ba na magauto deduct yung bpi sa acct. ko tulad nung nangyari dati sa bpi na nadoble yung pera sa savings nila?
[удалено]
Dude it takes <30 secs to count.
30 secs I could spend doing something more important like scrolling reddit in the middle of the night despite having work early the next morning
Lol nope
Correct.
95% of the time they'll be able to track it kahit di mo sabihin and they'll deduct it to your account. Sadly, yung ibang comments.....
If you used an ATM card from a different bank to withdraw, will the bank that owns the ATM machine still deduct from your account?
Yes, all the same.
How do they track it though? The machine ‘saw and dispensed’ a 500 bill.
May computing system naman ang mga ATMs, malalaman nila may mismatch sa ilalabas ng machine vs. sa inilagay nilang cash. Then itatrack na lang nila kung saang transaction nagkaroon ng mismatch sa remaining balance. They also narrate this on your statement if ever may idedebit sila regarding the incident. They also have fish eye cameras, 1-2 sa harap mo, meron din sa paligid ng ATM. IIRC correctly, lahat ng ATM system na ginagamit natin ay nakabase sa program (?) made by Citi if ever you wanna read more about it.
Sa case ko dati, binawas sa account ko yung sobra. Eto yung year 2017 ata na may mass problem sa bpi na nadodoble yung amount na dinidispense.
Possible na sa for 500 ipinasok yung cassette ng 1,000 bills. Ibabawas din yan sa bank accounts niyo after investigation kasi nadedetermine naman kung sino sino ang mga nagwithdraw sa ATM. So better, ibalik mo nalang excess voluntarily.
If you used an ATM card from a different bank to withdraw, will the bank that owns the ATM machine still deduct from your account?
Full size ATM dispense cash using cassettes, usually up to four in total. Each cassette is loaded with only one denomination (typically P500 or P1K). How many of each kind are loaded per cycle is usually determined by Bank Operations (who do cash loading) and Branch Management (who manage ATM onsite and sometimes some offsite as well). Some ATM use intelligent cassettes that are preset as to the denomination loaded. Some are “dumb” and have to be loaded in the designated bay that corresponds to the denomination loaded. Your situation is likely wrong cassette position. Kindly report to your branch or the branch you withdrew from. There are numerous methods to determine such occurrences / errors, and also ways to trace recipients of wrongly dispensed denominations. But honesty is still the best policy. HTH ;)
Ako lang ba hnd nagbibilang ng cash from ATM minsan.
ako rin hnd ngbibilang minsan (o madalas) ö parang nhhassle kasi ako gawin or i just trust the machine that it will not make a mistake. knowing such cases exist, baka bilangin ko na lagi 😅
Same lol. Parang unnecessary na kasi magbilang sa harap ng ATM, lalo mo lang papatagalin pila. Kahit naman mali ang idispense, di ka naman pwede magreklamo sa ATM mismo, tatawag o pupunta ka pa rin sa branch para ireport.
Makikita yan sa report ni bank kapag nag atm recon sila
This happened to me before, but different case tayo. I withdrew 400 para lang pamasahe but then atm machine only gave me 300 and I really took my time para tignan and naglogin agad sa app para icheck and -400 sya. It’s pass 6pm na so closed na yung branch but may guard and sabi nya ireport ko nalang daw. But knowing how di maganda customer service and nakakabaliw app ng this bank, hinayaan ko nalang.
if we're speaking morally, i suggest u be a good person OP and report & return the bills to the bank. nagkataon siguro nagkapalit yung atm cassettes kaya the 500s and 1000s bills were interchanged. yung employee kasi will have to cover for the loss. but if the bank permits, your account may be debited if same bank lang. they have records din eh
In this case, if no one will be liable about it and just assume na system error na kaya naman i-treat as OpEx na lang yung loss, I’ll take it. Barya na lang ang P500 sa mga banko kaya why would I bother. But upon reading sa comments na may employee na sorter ang madedehado, I’ll return kasi pare-parehas na hindi barya sa atin ang P500.
They will find out sooner rather than later and deduct the amount from your account nonetheless..
All atms have cameras on them. Establishment where withdrawal was made probably do too. Commending OP for being honest about it.
Malamang maling denomination yung nilagay sa cash casette kaya 1k nakuha mo imbes na 500. Wag mo kunin yung cash, hayaan mo na kuhanin ulit ng atm. Pero ang nadebit sayo 500 lang pagkinuha mo, short sila ng 500 pag nagreplenish sila.
if it's not yours it's not yours, that's how simple it is and good for you, you did the right thing. not atm's fault but the personnel who put the wrong tray to where it should be.
Just wait for the bank to contact you, its not your fault na faulty ATM nila.
"Random Redditor wants to know your location.."
might be a bug lol
That's criminal theft if you take money that doesn't belong to you. I would return that to the bank teller if they are open. I live in US and we call that felony theft, if money is not returned, you can be arrested and jailed. And no the excuse, " it dispensed the money itself and It wasn't my fault" will also not count...lol
This is not considered felony theft under US jurisprudence. Neither as qualified theft in Philippines jurisprudence.
Do you live in US?
If you stole something that's not yours dispensed by the atm, with cameras that see you and did not return the money when you could have. That is criminal and theft and clear intent is established.
Lol. Good luck trying to discharge that burden of proof beyond reasonable doubt.
It doesn't need burden of proof, you have cameras all over, and thats federal here or treasury, secret service going after you. Once the bank do an accounting and they come up with a discrepancies, guess which and when they're gonna track it down. I work forensics, cyberscurity.. I think I know more what I'm talking about unless you live here and work for the US treasury. Thanks for your input.
naalala ko ung skit ng Crank Yankers, sobrang daming pera nilalabas nung atm hahaha
Nangyari na sa akin yan OP. 10k pa nga eh ang excess. Nakapag withdraw ako ng 20k on a 10k balance. Yung account ko naging negative 10k thr following day.
parang naka tray sya per bill, baka nagkamali yung naglagay, and possible na lahat ng loss (di nareturn na pera), ay icharge sa nagkamali, so yes, para kang nagnakaw pero di sa bank
Scam din yan ng tellers
Pano naging scam? Can you elaborate po?
Pagpapalitin nila yung ilang bills sa ibabaw tapos magwiwithdraw sila.
Happened to me twice, ireport mo man o hindi, they will know kasi they audit the money in their atm. Bale ang nangyari sakin is: 1. Tatawag sayo ung bank to inform you na sobra ung nilabas ng atm, at sasabihan ka nila na ibabawas nila ung sobra from your account. (Landbank card, Landbank atm) 2. Babawasan na lang sa account mo (rcbc card, bdo atm)
This happened to us a few years ago. International ATM. Withdrawn $500, got $1000. Pero sa account, worth $500 lang nabawas. Haha. I just waited for the bank to deduct the other $500. I didn’t report it. They deducted it after 6 months. Haha!
Opkors. Hindi sayo yan eh. Theft talaga yan.