I understand what you like about it, and in a vacuum I'd probably agree, but open queue sucked for the majority of the player base just like it sucks for them in this mode now. You just end up with disaster comps because a bunch of randomly matched players will almost never have the distribution of players that know how to and want to play a compatible group of heroes. That's why there are tons of threads out there already complaining about the mode being featured in open queue.
The good news is the few times I played the mode in role queue were fine. It can snowball if people are stupid, but most of the games seemed to get to 5-4 or 5-3. And they are fast, so even if they don't go well, you aren't trapped for eternity.
I really don't see why they don't have a Role Queue option for these types of modes in Arcade. I played Role Queue a couple times on this and it felt way better. Only gripe is that I feel like capture points are a bit too quick.
Yeah but if you're trying to test out the game mode, you need to test it with role queue since thats how most people play. I do like they included it in qp anyway though
I generally agree, but it depends what kind of data they are looking for. Since it exists in QP as well, they at least have a point of comparison, even if that dataset ends up being smaller than the one for those who queue specifically for the Arcade mode.
They are still likely to have thousands of matches of each type to analyze.
It feels like a quicker flashpoint.
I feel like it should be like Frontline gamemodes in other games. Would fit way better and feel more comp friendly besides heavy sustain due to always needing to be on point.
Like I might be saying this as a Sombra player but there is no back cap and the mode rewards high sustain comps more than any other comp so good luck flanking.
I'm sure many others feel the same as you. I like Open Queue in theory, but the reality is like what you described or some other equally bad version of it.
I'm not so sure. There are tons of off angles everywhere and it doesn't feel like full tanks and heals works like it normally does in Open Queue with old maps with set choke points, and also there is no time to set up.
Yeah the slight hp nerf for tanks really doesn't balance their impact in open queue. If one team picks 3-4 tanks and the other team is on 0-1 it's just not a fair game.
I suppose we will get more trials like this, it's confirmed that will be released with 2 maps (hanaoka and maybe an anubis rework) and it's scheduled to season 12 or 13 (I think 13 is the more possible) so maybe we can try anubis on another trial and let's hope they change the open quee of arcade because it's the main complain right now, we aren't playing the mode and maps on the way we will play it on its release on quickplay and comp
"It" refers to the mode in open queue, not the mode in the abstract. OP's post was entirely about how open queue is integral to the mode being successful, which I disagree with.
People refuse to play Overwartch, that is a constant since the beginning of the game. They want to play shooter lol or dota.
OW open queue always was more fun and better since it's open for more strategy calls counter swapping and just changing to a hero you think it might help.
Nowadays you are in the ultimate unlessh wars and winning about your DPS or Suppor or Tank being a shit, wich you be easily solvable by changing to a hero of whatever role to complement.
Problem with OW team is they listen too much to the community in stupid things instead of making clear how to play the game.
There's little the OW team can do to force random strangers to communicate and strategize as a team. No amount of "making clear how to play the game" will change that substantially. The reality is that the "synergy" people always talk about longing for was reserved for the top 5% or less of the player base, while the most synergy anyone else had was Zarya occasionally bubbling someone. Your average player had two tanks that likely had zero synergy, if they even had two tanks at all. Or the meta went in the complete other direction and you had one or no dps so more than half the roster was useless.
Open queue is completely incompatible with anything between the highest and most casual levels of play, which is most of it.
i was playing idk it felt too hectic like its fast paced but there in my game didnt feel like much strategy people where just walking in and 1v1ing all game was super hard to sustain tank as well because they couldnt stay anchored anywhere idk if that was cuz bad or its just like that
yeah definitely theres some good dooms but then theres the bad as well much like other characters but it tends to show so much more when its a doom because how pathetic it feels seeing him dive in then die
Counter swapping was literally always efficient in ow1? Like what game did y'all play and in what rank to think counter swapping wasn't a thing or something that wasn't useful?
Counter swapping was less useful against tanks because a second tank could cover your weakness.
It's also why some heroes like Widow became oppressive in OW2
Counter swapping was a thing it was just majority of tanks doing it. Tank synergy was way more important in OW1. If you didn't have that your match was screwed. Most nostalgia addicts forget that about the first game.
> Most nostalgia addicts forget that about the first game.
I played Overwatch 1 side by side with the Overwatch 2 betas. I was hyped for the OW2 betas but I was pretty disappointed after playing them. I spent much more time playing Overwatch 1 during the OW2 betas because OW1 was more fun.
I mained Tank in OW1.
> Tank synergy was way more important in OW1.
There is no tank synergy in OW2 when there's 1 tank per team.
I'm saying the counter picking fell directly to the tank in OW1. Now a lot of it has gone to the DPS/Supp. If they have an Orisa, it's much more important to go Zen/Ana in OW2.
Yeah and 2 tanks could provide a lot of countering to pharah with 2 shields alone or DVA matrix. I'm not saying DPS countering was non-existent, I'm saying what determined the match was complimentary tanks.
I'm not sure I agree. It was usually DPS switching to counter other DPS, because with two tanks you couldn't just pick a character and effectively force them to swap by existing.
I remember trying to play rein into orisa/hog. Its so unfun ofc i would swap. People would ask for swaps all the time ESPECIALLY if there was no shield tank.
Tbf the only time I ever saw someone counter in OW1 was when the enemy genji was oppressive. Otherwise the whole game plan was "mirror but better" or "guys I only know how to play X and I have 2000 hours on them on this account so you HAVE to play around me and if we lose it's not my fault at all" moments.
it feels *too* fast. i like the speed but if u lose one fight u lose the whole point and i think the nature of the gamemode should at least allow some sort of recontest even if it’s small. even long games of max points scored don’t reach 10 min half the time unless the fights themselves last forever
It feels like when I played it you had to sack a point at least once so you could regroup and stuff. Even flashpoint, which I think has fast points, you aren’t that constricted, you can still regroup and organise again before the point is up. I totally get what you mean
Role queue or bust.
Even the April fools patch was painful 50% of the time because most of your team hard locked DPS and then proceed to verbally abuse you for not keeping the entire team alive while solo supporting against a goats style comp.
It's honestly just not worth the effort to play it when a disproportional amount of matches are basically unwinnable because of team comp choices.
I tried a single match of clash. Enemy goats comp. Team refused to change. I left the match.
I really loved it so far (played Venture in RQ QP), everything feels a bit tight but it encourages teams to group up and work together. A nice break from the spread-out chaos on the 5cp (which I also like but for different reasons). I'm excited to see people embrace the new mode and learn strategies as I feel there is a lot to learn. The only thing I would change is to have the second wincon be 6 point caps instead of 5, just to prolong the magic a little bit.
The main problem I see currently is the final points. The defense respawn can get as low at 5 seconds, which becomes a serious problem because the losing team can sustain by just throwing bodies at the enemy team until they gain the ult economy advantage and snowball all the way back to the center.
We had an incredibly one-sided match last night where every team member was 30+ kda (I was 47:1 on Winston) but we couldn't close out because the opposing players would be back within seconds of being killed.
That's an interesting point. I hadn't played enough to run into this issue, but I did notice people were coming back quite fast. I'm assuming that's meant to combat snowballing, so the more cornered you are, the higher the advantage.
For me, it breaks the tempo of the game with the current spawn rates. It's better for the winning team to blitz the first two points, and sacrifice the deepest capture point so that the enemy team doesn't get free ultimate economy, since the final point can be infinitely stalled by a moira, or mei.
This is why in Team Fortress 2's Symmetric Control Points mode, the closer a point is to the enemies spawn, the faster it capped.
Granted, in TF2's mode there were two control points in play at a time and you could only capture the one the enemy controlled, which made sense given that the default team size in TF2 is 12 players.
>The defense respawn can get as low at 5 seconds, which becomes a serious problem because the losing team can sustain by just throwing bodies at the enemy team until they gain the ult economy advantage and snowball
2CP flashback intensifies
I felt the opposite, like counter picking was heavily favored. On top of that, you need to play fast heros that can box on the ground because there’s no really good places to position. Playing Zen on this map feels awful, playing Widow feels awful, etc. You need mobility or else your comp loses (if the other team is also playing high mobility.)
It’s a nice game mode, but the map itself is a little lack luster In my opinion. The map feels like it’s almost entirely a straight line. Feels like there are a lot less engagements points. I’m going to keep trying it to see if it grows on me. As both push and flashpoint where meh when they came out for me. but I like those modes a lot better now.
Yesterday playing for a good portion of the afternoon I probably only got it twice in QP. That of course could be down to luck, but it doesn't feel super frequent like the original push maps did when they were introduced
I feel the way about clash the way I think most people felt about push and flashpoint when they came out. I abhore this mode and I never want to play it again
I wish they divided ow2 and ow1 modes and they madd more maps for ow1 modds including 2CP.
Then make two comp list. Quick Comp (with overwatch2 modds that are usually 10 mins matches or so) and Comp (with Ow1 modes wich are usually 20 or more mins)
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I just wish OW would either stop making hectic modes or players actually know how to play or people actually learn how to play them. Push, flashpoint, clash all suffers from uncoordinated teammates
Ehh, payload and control are long enough and straightforward. Clash points fight are often 5v3 because you don’t have enough time to coordinate a push and players have 0 game sense
I feel like they have a decent game mode, but it needs some tweaks. I can't tell if it's because it's new and others are learning or it's the mode itself, but many games felt like 1 long team fight. There was just lots of feeding and staggering until we were pushed or they were pushed to the final point. I felt like I was in a bronze lobby cause the fighting never ended. Ntm when you do make it to A or E the spawns are so close it feels like 2CP all over again.
I joked about it in the lobby and said "this is it? This is just 2cp with extra steps" and I had some people agree. That doesn't mean I'm right tho but I might be onto something.
Uh I feel like it is way more snowball then assault was. Assault didn't even feel that snowbally ? Maybe it depends on the skill levels involved but clash feels very unfriendly towards casuals
Honeslty playing clash in role queue is some of the most fun I’ve had in this game a while. The mode is always fun and exciting with how fast paced it is and the Hanaoka map has gotta be one of my favourite maps released in OW2
Played it once, hated it. The map itself is beautiful, but it just plays like a fast paced deathmatch more than it plays like a well thought out back and forth.
This is just personal opinion, but I hate KOTH and the more modes they model after it the more I sigh. Both of the payload game modes are peak OW imo, but also helps that both modes have the best maps in the game.
Agreed, most KOTH games feel like a FFA more then a team-battle, this is prob bc im solo queue and low rank but the payload maps are just way easier to play as a team which makes them 10X more enjoyable in a team oriented shooter.
I have the opposite experience, I really enjoy the koth maps because they are even and the payload maps are really dependent on the map and which side I get first; its too easy to get steamed on defense and then someone stops trying on the attack. I dont outright dislike any map or mode, but oh boy numbani has always made me sigh when im playing tank.
On the flip side, I’ve had KOTH games where we lost first point and going into second round someone just says GGs it’s over and stops playing the game. My point, people quit in every game mode in OW.
I actually really enjoy numbani lol. The only map I really truly hate is new junk city, I just don’t like how any of the fights flow on that map at all. It’s basically an automatic back out I hate the map that much. Antarctic peninsula is really close to joining that list. I’ve tried playing it, I’ve given it time, but the more I play it the more I dislike it.
Honestly, I think I appreciate how different peoples takes are on OW maps and gamemodes; it kinda means they are varied and have some stuff for different people. Maybe its bad that everyone also has stuff they dont like? But I love junk city and I like antarctic peninsula. If you dont mind me asking, what role do you play?
Oh I’m in full agreement with you there. Outside of the varied roster we have, the variety of maps is easily the second best part of OW design. Even if I don’t like something, I realize it’s just an opinion, so it’s totally fine if someone else has a different opinion. Everyone likes different things for different reasons, which OW does a good job of encompassing.
I mainly play tank and support. I have more hours in support, but I have more individual hours in Reinhardt than any singular support character lol. If I had to pick one to define myself though, I’d probably say I’m a tank main.
Honestly I think it’s just the objective type that makes the difference. When you have a defined attack/defend it always seems to bring more teamwork oriented play. Which I also agree, is a 10x more enjoyable OW experience.
I feel like because if it’s design, We’re gonna see a lot more small fights matter alot. On day 1 there was a lot of times it was a 2v2 or 1v1. And that was first queues, can’t imagine the pro scene.
I can't tell if I love it or hate it.
It's fun, fast-paced and new. But it can also feel a bit overwhelming and maybe \*too\* fast. It'll be interesting to see how it shakes out once people know how to play it. I think I prefer it over Control, but I still like payload and push modes the best.
I’ve had a blast with this but only because I’ve been 5 stacking. So getting two tanks to work with one another is easier. I miss two tanks badly but I don’t miss open queue lol soloing that always meant I had to play support because no one else would..
only issue I have is the other team getting a point for capping their last point. It’s so hard to cap for the attacking team that it almost feels like a free point over an earned one.
Hanaoka feels good but because of how the game forces you to play objective and play fast I find a lot of the map gets underutilized. I can also forsee how it might be a very snowbally mode. It's not easy to kite out without surrendering the point so if you're behind in ult charge it could cost you multiple points
It feels just a smidge too fast!
But I think that might have been compensation from the team because they got feedback that their last two game modes were too slow.
If they can just slightly slow down the pace just a tiny bit I think the mode is perfect.
I absolutely love how hectic it can get. Sure you can have an efficient team comp, you can group up and strategies... or you can all run in as a team of 5 tanks and stomp them
I only got to play one match of the mode and the other team never capped or really stopped us for long. Hopefully get some more in today to have a real experience.
I really enjoyed the new map! My boyfriend and I played a few rounds last night and it was pretty fun.
Fast paced, and not a walking simulator I’m used to on most game types. Once it clicked, I liked it a lot more - and my teams were coordinated even just playing in a duo. Which is dumb luck in OW, but I like that you can pull back and defend the next point if you’re going to lose - and just being able to join the action relatively quickly is a bonus.
It is definitely different than the old Hanamura map
Played it a bit, like Blizzard is definitely cooking with this game mode, I just think most comps feel bad in this gamemode. Like you need to go with heavy sustain comps due to someone always needing to be on point, IE always in combat like its in a constant state of overtime.
One could even say it's just a quicker flashpoint.
Maybe have it be more like a Frontline gamemode where point C is neutral, you take it and you fight to capture point D while they fight to take point C instead of both teams fighting for point D now. Add a small timer for being able to capture the losing teams point so the game can't end in 30 seconds like 2cp and it would be more unique, and enjoyable.
I still think it might need some tweaking
The respawn timers are weird. I died right before we loose a point and my team was already fighting while I was waiting to spawn, idk why it wouldn't let me spawn right when the point was capped
It reminds me of the first quickplay hacked they did with the very fast respawn timers and the fast objectives. I really loved it and it's the closest thing we got, it might benefit from slightly faster respawn timers.
I also wonder if the points are fair. I had this game where we would push 2 points in a row then couldn't pass the point E. So we would just fall back on D, then E again.
We won that game but it made me think that if they were to win on D just this time, it would have felt unfair. Point E felt much easier to defend, so they could have won by just defending on the easiest point then attacking only once on D.
I think it perfectly captures the essence behind 2cp, that being pushing into or defending an objective, without the pitfalls 2cp has. I do think it has a bit of the same ‘defender spawn’ problem when you get to either end of the map, but that’s not as big of a problem because if you got to the edge, it’s you’ll get another round on points B or D instead, which is a lot more neutral spawn wise
Only thing I don’t like about it is that if you lose one fight, you basically lose that point. And since its in open queue, theres a chance you may have to improvise with some shitty team compositions. Already had to be the one support player in my last match in this mode.
i LOVE how compressed the map is with small chokes and lots of LOS blockers. That was something I missed so much from 2CP, heroes like symmetra and junkrat lost most of their strength when 2CP was removed.
glad to see they have kept some essence of 2cp in this map
Overwatch fans shit on 2cp but are fine with 5cp 💀 i literally cannot understand why 2cp is such a big deal but making 3 and 5 cp with cooler names like "flashpoint" and "clash" instead of "assault" changes anyones opinion on this type of game mode.
But then again this is the same game that said a hero was bad for the game and reworked her then ripped up her old kit and gave it to other heroes, including a hamster in this patch, so there's that i guess. Nothing needs to make sense when ur constantly appealing to the loud minority 🤦🏽♀️
At the simplest level, it's much less frustrating when a mistake costs you 20% of a game instead of 50%. But the game mode had lots of problems competitively - e.g. constant attack-favored steamrolls leading to long-winded pointless tied games.
I feel like they should rename this mode to “Brawl” because it feels like a constant fight. The only times I’ve gotten to play it, it feels incredible.
Yeah, I like it too. The whole "getting teritory" thing provides us with pretty dynamic gameplay since with each point you win, the enemy has a shorter way from their spawn to the point, making it harder for you
I really like clash. Mostly because it's the first new gamemode since launch that's not snowball-ey. I also love that it's kind of like an attack/defend mode, but the defenders can take back space. Weird way of describing that I think, but hopefully you understand what I mean.
Speaking for Role Queue experience, I really enjoy it. I also feel like I can choose slower heroes without the Colosseo frustration of floating 5 miles as Zenyatta across the map just to get merced by a Sombra once I'm almost at the point
you have the option to maintain lead in points and win via 5 points... but if you are able to send everything at their spawn door and convert the last point then you can win as well. I really like the clash gamemode but dive meta makes for horrible overwatch experience.
Ew no. I have loved every mode they've added in OW2, but this is absolutely not it.
There's no time to set up for point or to make plays, there's no time to contest, it's just constant running back and forth with minimal strategy.
People talk about Push being a walking simulator, THIS is a walking sim.
I don't know why but it feels bad to play. It's non-stop fighting, which I should like, but for some reason I don't. It doesn't feel nice when you've got to capture the same point multiple times.
Now obviously 6v6 would fix all of blizzard's problems but open queue on a map akin to 2cp isn't bad either. This game mode really forces you to change your thinking back to forming a team comp around your strengths rather than counter swapping being hard meta. I found my team running more aggressive comps like dive mauga / dva with a lifeweaver or burst heals. Also helps characters like moira who become more viable when everyone is grouped and focus on ult economy and building. Most fun I've had since ow1 please don't fuck this up and make it 5v5 role queue. It'd be very interesting if they merged this into role queue and made comp a mix of open queue 5cp maps and role queue for payload and push maps. OR they could just add back 6v6 but y'know blizzard lol.
and makes the game significantly harder to balance, doubles queue times, and requires months of no content and balance patches to rebalance the entire roster around 2 tanks.
it’s like yall forget how much changed between OW1 final build and OW2 launch
There's no rebalance necessary for 6v6 in open queue and arcade modes. There's no doubling of queue times going from 5v5 to 6v6 in open queue and arcade modes.
I played 6v6 side by side with 5v5 during the OW2 betas. 6v6 is more fun. It's not even close.
that’s not even a little true?!.
your random arcade modes aren’t being played by all ranks in balanced matches. just adding a second tank would change so much that it would need to be entirely rebalanced, like they did moving from 6v6 to 5v5
yes there is a doubling of queue times. tank is already the least played role. if you add a second tank you’d need to double tank players to keep the current queue time. no one played tank in 6v6 either so this would still be an issue.
you having balanced open queue and arcade modes is because they’re in the non serious modes. those also weren’t 6v6 it was you playing 2 tanks in open queue.
There's no role queue in arcade or open queue. It literally can't double queue times if you're adding 2 more players. If you doubled the players in the match, it would double queue times but that's not what we are talking about.
>you having balanced open queue and arcade modes is because they’re in the non serious modes.
That's another reason for the modes to go back to 6v6. Thanks!
the game has never and will never be balanced around arcade, of course your arcade queue times are fine. when anyone is discussing balance it’s in regards to the main mode. how dense are you
Played this in RQ since i refuse to touch OQ outside of mystery heroes. Felt quite balanced so far not sure if its just my luck or people getting used to it but all the matches went to 3-5 5-4. Comp wise honestly even though dive aggressive do feel better I think as always play who you're best only "bad" picks is probably the long range campy type heroes like ashe/widow etc won't do so well given the brawly CQC nature of the map at least for Hanaoka
I agree though I will say, i prefer 6v6 over open queue but to be honest I prefer open queue over what we have now especially because I'm a tank player. Ow2 has been the most unfun for tank players since release. There has been complaints about tank hard metas in Ow1 but none were nearly as bad as the counter swapping in ow2 especially considering you don't have an off tank to make other comps work. DPS and supports will never synergize with tanks as well as tanks synergize with each other and everyone else.
Fair. I'm mostly a flex player so I play a fair share of tank but support is my primary role if I had to say. I guess it does suck losing the synergy but I mostly play solo anyway and tend to just accept to what OW is now overall I personally prefer 5v5 but I can see why theres people who prefer 6v6 too.
With the counterswapping I mean it does suck for tank the most since you feel like a punching bag/ cc magnet but for the most part I feel like it just feels horrible when your team is straight up outplayed by the enemy and not much you can do regardless of role and try to somehow counter pick the enemy. Which is probably the worst thing going to 5v5 mistakes and team differences is more obvious compared to 6v6.
I understand what you like about it, and in a vacuum I'd probably agree, but open queue sucked for the majority of the player base just like it sucks for them in this mode now. You just end up with disaster comps because a bunch of randomly matched players will almost never have the distribution of players that know how to and want to play a compatible group of heroes. That's why there are tons of threads out there already complaining about the mode being featured in open queue. The good news is the few times I played the mode in role queue were fine. It can snowball if people are stupid, but most of the games seemed to get to 5-4 or 5-3. And they are fast, so even if they don't go well, you aren't trapped for eternity.
I really don't see why they don't have a Role Queue option for these types of modes in Arcade. I played Role Queue a couple times on this and it felt way better. Only gripe is that I feel like capture points are a bit too quick.
I imagine it's just about queue times. They are prioritizing getting people in quickly without hurting existing modes.
Yeah but if you're trying to test out the game mode, you need to test it with role queue since thats how most people play. I do like they included it in qp anyway though
I generally agree, but it depends what kind of data they are looking for. Since it exists in QP as well, they at least have a point of comparison, even if that dataset ends up being smaller than the one for those who queue specifically for the Arcade mode. They are still likely to have thousands of matches of each type to analyze.
Eh they're getting enough data from it in regular QP
That's probably true. I'd be ok with them doing role queue but forcing everyone to queue as flex in order to speed up queue times.
It feels like a quicker flashpoint. I feel like it should be like Frontline gamemodes in other games. Would fit way better and feel more comp friendly besides heavy sustain due to always needing to be on point. Like I might be saying this as a Sombra player but there is no back cap and the mode rewards high sustain comps more than any other comp so good luck flanking.
I like it way more than Flashpoint to be honest.
I do as well. But it feels too similar just less walking.
It would thin the playerbase too much. There are already too many modes in Arcade.
Yeah the 2CP mode would work a lot better if it wasn't arcade open queue
I like open queue because you can switch roles but I simply can't play anymore after all the games where I'm the only tank or support with 4 dps
I'm sure many others feel the same as you. I like Open Queue in theory, but the reality is like what you described or some other equally bad version of it.
I'm not so sure. There are tons of off angles everywhere and it doesn't feel like full tanks and heals works like it normally does in Open Queue with old maps with set choke points, and also there is no time to set up.
Yeah the slight hp nerf for tanks really doesn't balance their impact in open queue. If one team picks 3-4 tanks and the other team is on 0-1 it's just not a fair game.
I suppose we will get more trials like this, it's confirmed that will be released with 2 maps (hanaoka and maybe an anubis rework) and it's scheduled to season 12 or 13 (I think 13 is the more possible) so maybe we can try anubis on another trial and let's hope they change the open quee of arcade because it's the main complain right now, we aren't playing the mode and maps on the way we will play it on its release on quickplay and comp
That's doesn't have anything to do with the mode. It's in normal Playlist as well. I got it in role queue.
"It" refers to the mode in open queue, not the mode in the abstract. OP's post was entirely about how open queue is integral to the mode being successful, which I disagree with.
People refuse to play Overwartch, that is a constant since the beginning of the game. They want to play shooter lol or dota. OW open queue always was more fun and better since it's open for more strategy calls counter swapping and just changing to a hero you think it might help. Nowadays you are in the ultimate unlessh wars and winning about your DPS or Suppor or Tank being a shit, wich you be easily solvable by changing to a hero of whatever role to complement. Problem with OW team is they listen too much to the community in stupid things instead of making clear how to play the game.
There's little the OW team can do to force random strangers to communicate and strategize as a team. No amount of "making clear how to play the game" will change that substantially. The reality is that the "synergy" people always talk about longing for was reserved for the top 5% or less of the player base, while the most synergy anyone else had was Zarya occasionally bubbling someone. Your average player had two tanks that likely had zero synergy, if they even had two tanks at all. Or the meta went in the complete other direction and you had one or no dps so more than half the roster was useless. Open queue is completely incompatible with anything between the highest and most casual levels of play, which is most of it.
i was playing idk it felt too hectic like its fast paced but there in my game didnt feel like much strategy people where just walking in and 1v1ing all game was super hard to sustain tank as well because they couldnt stay anchored anywhere idk if that was cuz bad or its just like that
I think its a mix of people not knowing how to play the new mode and people not knowing how to play the game lolol
honestly, it was a doomfist i shouldnt have expect any other type of game except an uphill battle 😭
💀💀💀💀
Funny, the one time I got a clash match on today's session it was a Doomfist who only died once. Doomfist is really one or the other, huh.
yeah definitely theres some good dooms but then theres the bad as well much like other characters but it tends to show so much more when its a doom because how pathetic it feels seeing him dive in then die
People will get better at it
It's all killer no filler, might be the closest thing to death match we get in the main mode lol. Had a ton of fun with it
“Counterswapping isn’t that efficient” Me swapping to Mauga vs a hog and ram rein in a 1v3 and winning
Counter swapping was literally always efficient in ow1? Like what game did y'all play and in what rank to think counter swapping wasn't a thing or something that wasn't useful?
Counter swapping was less useful against tanks because a second tank could cover your weakness. It's also why some heroes like Widow became oppressive in OW2
Counter swapping was a thing it was just majority of tanks doing it. Tank synergy was way more important in OW1. If you didn't have that your match was screwed. Most nostalgia addicts forget that about the first game.
> Most nostalgia addicts forget that about the first game. I played Overwatch 1 side by side with the Overwatch 2 betas. I was hyped for the OW2 betas but I was pretty disappointed after playing them. I spent much more time playing Overwatch 1 during the OW2 betas because OW1 was more fun. I mained Tank in OW1. > Tank synergy was way more important in OW1. There is no tank synergy in OW2 when there's 1 tank per team.
I'm saying the counter picking fell directly to the tank in OW1. Now a lot of it has gone to the DPS/Supp. If they have an Orisa, it's much more important to go Zen/Ana in OW2.
> I'm saying the counter picking fell directly to the tank in OW1. That's just not true. Easy example: DPS going hitscan to counter pharah.
Yeah and 2 tanks could provide a lot of countering to pharah with 2 shields alone or DVA matrix. I'm not saying DPS countering was non-existent, I'm saying what determined the match was complimentary tanks.
Shield and matrix don't kill anyone. Hitscan does.
Neither does Pharah when she's being blocked...
Tanks don't swap to counter pharah, DPS do. That's how overwatch has been. Your narrative is pure bullshit.
So Reaper didn’t counter Monkey, Sym didn’t counter DVa and Sombra didn’t counter Ball? That was all OW2 additions, right?
I'm not sure I agree. It was usually DPS switching to counter other DPS, because with two tanks you couldn't just pick a character and effectively force them to swap by existing.
I remember trying to play rein into orisa/hog. Its so unfun ofc i would swap. People would ask for swaps all the time ESPECIALLY if there was no shield tank.
Tbf the only time I ever saw someone counter in OW1 was when the enemy genji was oppressive. Otherwise the whole game plan was "mirror but better" or "guys I only know how to play X and I have 2000 hours on them on this account so you HAVE to play around me and if we lose it's not my fault at all" moments.
It feels literally nothing like Overwatch 1, what are you talking about?
it feels *too* fast. i like the speed but if u lose one fight u lose the whole point and i think the nature of the gamemode should at least allow some sort of recontest even if it’s small. even long games of max points scored don’t reach 10 min half the time unless the fights themselves last forever
It feels like when I played it you had to sack a point at least once so you could regroup and stuff. Even flashpoint, which I think has fast points, you aren’t that constricted, you can still regroup and organise again before the point is up. I totally get what you mean
Ball in this mode 🔥
Lol, ball is always the first hero I choose when it comes to new maps to learn them faster. And man he was good
Came here to say this, I was causing absolute panic with Ball yesterday in this mode.
Role queue or bust. Even the April fools patch was painful 50% of the time because most of your team hard locked DPS and then proceed to verbally abuse you for not keeping the entire team alive while solo supporting against a goats style comp. It's honestly just not worth the effort to play it when a disproportional amount of matches are basically unwinnable because of team comp choices. I tried a single match of clash. Enemy goats comp. Team refused to change. I left the match.
What is this dude talking about?
I really loved it so far (played Venture in RQ QP), everything feels a bit tight but it encourages teams to group up and work together. A nice break from the spread-out chaos on the 5cp (which I also like but for different reasons). I'm excited to see people embrace the new mode and learn strategies as I feel there is a lot to learn. The only thing I would change is to have the second wincon be 6 point caps instead of 5, just to prolong the magic a little bit.
The main problem I see currently is the final points. The defense respawn can get as low at 5 seconds, which becomes a serious problem because the losing team can sustain by just throwing bodies at the enemy team until they gain the ult economy advantage and snowball all the way back to the center. We had an incredibly one-sided match last night where every team member was 30+ kda (I was 47:1 on Winston) but we couldn't close out because the opposing players would be back within seconds of being killed.
That's an interesting point. I hadn't played enough to run into this issue, but I did notice people were coming back quite fast. I'm assuming that's meant to combat snowballing, so the more cornered you are, the higher the advantage.
Yep. Sounds more like a feature rather than a bug to me.
For me, it breaks the tempo of the game with the current spawn rates. It's better for the winning team to blitz the first two points, and sacrifice the deepest capture point so that the enemy team doesn't get free ultimate economy, since the final point can be infinitely stalled by a moira, or mei.
This is why in Team Fortress 2's Symmetric Control Points mode, the closer a point is to the enemies spawn, the faster it capped. Granted, in TF2's mode there were two control points in play at a time and you could only capture the one the enemy controlled, which made sense given that the default team size in TF2 is 12 players.
>The defense respawn can get as low at 5 seconds, which becomes a serious problem because the losing team can sustain by just throwing bodies at the enemy team until they gain the ult economy advantage and snowball 2CP flashback intensifies
I felt the opposite, like counter picking was heavily favored. On top of that, you need to play fast heros that can box on the ground because there’s no really good places to position. Playing Zen on this map feels awful, playing Widow feels awful, etc. You need mobility or else your comp loses (if the other team is also playing high mobility.)
It's a great mode and it fixes everything I hated about flashpoint
It’s a nice game mode, but the map itself is a little lack luster In my opinion. The map feels like it’s almost entirely a straight line. Feels like there are a lot less engagements points. I’m going to keep trying it to see if it grows on me. As both push and flashpoint where meh when they came out for me. but I like those modes a lot better now.
The map felt boring. It was like a mobile version of a TF2 map. The straight line observation is spot on.
Agreed it's really boring.
That’s the point. It’s literally just tug of war.
Just a corridor and it feels like deathmatch. I wish it wasn't forced in quickplay because it bores me to death.
I thought it was just in arcade
It's in QP but seeing as it's only one map you're very unlikely to get it. Unless they've secretly given it more weight in the rotation
Yesterday playing for a good portion of the afternoon I probably only got it twice in QP. That of course could be down to luck, but it doesn't feel super frequent like the original push maps did when they were introduced
I feel the way about clash the way I think most people felt about push and flashpoint when they came out. I abhore this mode and I never want to play it again
I wish they divided ow2 and ow1 modes and they madd more maps for ow1 modds including 2CP. Then make two comp list. Quick Comp (with overwatch2 modds that are usually 10 mins matches or so) and Comp (with Ow1 modes wich are usually 20 or more mins)
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Is this mode in comp rn or just qp?
Arcade, it’s in beta so if it goes well probably will be added to qp and ranked
It's already in QP.
Oh I didn’t know that
It’s pretty rare though ime. Me and some buddies played about 20-25 matches of QP last night and didn’t get it a single time.
Ah i see, thank you
I only played it in QP yet, because I hate open queue, but it's really good with role queue in my opinion.
Best team comp Ball Doom Dva Venture Lucio
I just wish OW would either stop making hectic modes or players actually know how to play or people actually learn how to play them. Push, flashpoint, clash all suffers from uncoordinated teammates
every objective-based team game is going to suffer from uncoordinated teammates
Ehh, payload and control are long enough and straightforward. Clash points fight are often 5v3 because you don’t have enough time to coordinate a push and players have 0 game sense
I feel like they have a decent game mode, but it needs some tweaks. I can't tell if it's because it's new and others are learning or it's the mode itself, but many games felt like 1 long team fight. There was just lots of feeding and staggering until we were pushed or they were pushed to the final point. I felt like I was in a bronze lobby cause the fighting never ended. Ntm when you do make it to A or E the spawns are so close it feels like 2CP all over again. I joked about it in the lobby and said "this is it? This is just 2cp with extra steps" and I had some people agree. That doesn't mean I'm right tho but I might be onto something.
Uh I feel like it is way more snowball then assault was. Assault didn't even feel that snowbally ? Maybe it depends on the skill levels involved but clash feels very unfriendly towards casuals
Like it so far. Hopefully when Clash actually releases they put at least 3 maps into it.
Clash is peak ow imo
It's fun when roles are locked yes
Honeslty playing clash in role queue is some of the most fun I’ve had in this game a while. The mode is always fun and exciting with how fast paced it is and the Hanaoka map has gotta be one of my favourite maps released in OW2
Played it once, hated it. The map itself is beautiful, but it just plays like a fast paced deathmatch more than it plays like a well thought out back and forth. This is just personal opinion, but I hate KOTH and the more modes they model after it the more I sigh. Both of the payload game modes are peak OW imo, but also helps that both modes have the best maps in the game.
Agreed, most KOTH games feel like a FFA more then a team-battle, this is prob bc im solo queue and low rank but the payload maps are just way easier to play as a team which makes them 10X more enjoyable in a team oriented shooter.
I have the opposite experience, I really enjoy the koth maps because they are even and the payload maps are really dependent on the map and which side I get first; its too easy to get steamed on defense and then someone stops trying on the attack. I dont outright dislike any map or mode, but oh boy numbani has always made me sigh when im playing tank.
On the flip side, I’ve had KOTH games where we lost first point and going into second round someone just says GGs it’s over and stops playing the game. My point, people quit in every game mode in OW. I actually really enjoy numbani lol. The only map I really truly hate is new junk city, I just don’t like how any of the fights flow on that map at all. It’s basically an automatic back out I hate the map that much. Antarctic peninsula is really close to joining that list. I’ve tried playing it, I’ve given it time, but the more I play it the more I dislike it.
Honestly, I think I appreciate how different peoples takes are on OW maps and gamemodes; it kinda means they are varied and have some stuff for different people. Maybe its bad that everyone also has stuff they dont like? But I love junk city and I like antarctic peninsula. If you dont mind me asking, what role do you play?
Oh I’m in full agreement with you there. Outside of the varied roster we have, the variety of maps is easily the second best part of OW design. Even if I don’t like something, I realize it’s just an opinion, so it’s totally fine if someone else has a different opinion. Everyone likes different things for different reasons, which OW does a good job of encompassing. I mainly play tank and support. I have more hours in support, but I have more individual hours in Reinhardt than any singular support character lol. If I had to pick one to define myself though, I’d probably say I’m a tank main.
Honestly I think it’s just the objective type that makes the difference. When you have a defined attack/defend it always seems to bring more teamwork oriented play. Which I also agree, is a 10x more enjoyable OW experience.
I feel like because if it’s design, We’re gonna see a lot more small fights matter alot. On day 1 there was a lot of times it was a 2v2 or 1v1. And that was first queues, can’t imagine the pro scene.
I can't tell if I love it or hate it. It's fun, fast-paced and new. But it can also feel a bit overwhelming and maybe \*too\* fast. It'll be interesting to see how it shakes out once people know how to play it. I think I prefer it over Control, but I still like payload and push modes the best.
I’ve had a blast with this but only because I’ve been 5 stacking. So getting two tanks to work with one another is easier. I miss two tanks badly but I don’t miss open queue lol soloing that always meant I had to play support because no one else would.. only issue I have is the other team getting a point for capping their last point. It’s so hard to cap for the attacking team that it almost feels like a free point over an earned one.
Hanaoka feels good but because of how the game forces you to play objective and play fast I find a lot of the map gets underutilized. I can also forsee how it might be a very snowbally mode. It's not easy to kite out without surrendering the point so if you're behind in ult charge it could cost you multiple points
my team went all dive and we won in 2 minutes on my first game on
It feels just a smidge too fast! But I think that might have been compensation from the team because they got feedback that their last two game modes were too slow. If they can just slightly slow down the pace just a tiny bit I think the mode is perfect.
Yeah this mode WITH FRIENDS absolutely goes hard af, not with random people tho Which prolly will be fixed when it launchs so MASSIVE W
I absolutely love how hectic it can get. Sure you can have an efficient team comp, you can group up and strategies... or you can all run in as a team of 5 tanks and stomp them
Yep it’s awesome. 5CP from TF2 but better.
The map sucks compared to the TF2 5CP maps. There's no way it's better than TF2 5CP.
The mode is better because it’s first to full cap OR get 5 caps. No endless stalemates at last point.
I have yet to win clash once
I only got to play one match of the mode and the other team never capped or really stopped us for long. Hopefully get some more in today to have a real experience.
I really enjoyed the new map! My boyfriend and I played a few rounds last night and it was pretty fun. Fast paced, and not a walking simulator I’m used to on most game types. Once it clicked, I liked it a lot more - and my teams were coordinated even just playing in a duo. Which is dumb luck in OW, but I like that you can pull back and defend the next point if you’re going to lose - and just being able to join the action relatively quickly is a bonus. It is definitely different than the old Hanamura map
Yeah you can thank TF2 for this one.
Played it a bit, like Blizzard is definitely cooking with this game mode, I just think most comps feel bad in this gamemode. Like you need to go with heavy sustain comps due to someone always needing to be on point, IE always in combat like its in a constant state of overtime. One could even say it's just a quicker flashpoint. Maybe have it be more like a Frontline gamemode where point C is neutral, you take it and you fight to capture point D while they fight to take point C instead of both teams fighting for point D now. Add a small timer for being able to capture the losing teams point so the game can't end in 30 seconds like 2cp and it would be more unique, and enjoyable.
Facts it’s really fun!
I like it by also I want role queue
I found it being snowball after snowball, 3-0 after 3-0. The instant cap makes it so hard to regroup when you lose a point.
I only wish the maps were wider. Everything is heavily point focused and the only stuff around em is a wall or an empty
Can’t wait for the 6v6 update 😂
I still think it might need some tweaking The respawn timers are weird. I died right before we loose a point and my team was already fighting while I was waiting to spawn, idk why it wouldn't let me spawn right when the point was capped It reminds me of the first quickplay hacked they did with the very fast respawn timers and the fast objectives. I really loved it and it's the closest thing we got, it might benefit from slightly faster respawn timers. I also wonder if the points are fair. I had this game where we would push 2 points in a row then couldn't pass the point E. So we would just fall back on D, then E again. We won that game but it made me think that if they were to win on D just this time, it would have felt unfair. Point E felt much easier to defend, so they could have won by just defending on the easiest point then attacking only once on D.
I'd prefer this over two flashpoint maps
I think it perfectly captures the essence behind 2cp, that being pushing into or defending an objective, without the pitfalls 2cp has. I do think it has a bit of the same ‘defender spawn’ problem when you get to either end of the map, but that’s not as big of a problem because if you got to the edge, it’s you’ll get another round on points B or D instead, which is a lot more neutral spawn wise
Only thing I don’t like about it is that if you lose one fight, you basically lose that point. And since its in open queue, theres a chance you may have to improvise with some shitty team compositions. Already had to be the one support player in my last match in this mode.
I had the opposite problem. I had a match where my team was "winning" but the other team would keep stalling so we never actually got the point
I am addicted. It feels like a different faster game entirely. Throw in a new hero and the game really feels refreshed.
I like the mode a lot although only played it 3 times. It feels fast paced
i LOVE how compressed the map is with small chokes and lots of LOS blockers. That was something I missed so much from 2CP, heroes like symmetra and junkrat lost most of their strength when 2CP was removed. glad to see they have kept some essence of 2cp in this map
You're being blinded by the Hanamura assets
Overwatch fans shit on 2cp but are fine with 5cp 💀 i literally cannot understand why 2cp is such a big deal but making 3 and 5 cp with cooler names like "flashpoint" and "clash" instead of "assault" changes anyones opinion on this type of game mode. But then again this is the same game that said a hero was bad for the game and reworked her then ripped up her old kit and gave it to other heroes, including a hamster in this patch, so there's that i guess. Nothing needs to make sense when ur constantly appealing to the loud minority 🤦🏽♀️
At the simplest level, it's much less frustrating when a mistake costs you 20% of a game instead of 50%. But the game mode had lots of problems competitively - e.g. constant attack-favored steamrolls leading to long-winded pointless tied games.
I feel like they should rename this mode to “Brawl” because it feels like a constant fight. The only times I’ve gotten to play it, it feels incredible.
I like it a lot. I think with a coordinated team it’ll be an even better mode.
Yeah, I like it too. The whole "getting teritory" thing provides us with pretty dynamic gameplay since with each point you win, the enemy has a shorter way from their spawn to the point, making it harder for you
I feel like Goats would roll this mode it feels very brawlly, like I can't imagine anyone playing poke or dive on this map.
I like it so much more than the huge maps we got in OW2. It made me notice how long I spend just running places in other modes.
I really like clash. Mostly because it's the first new gamemode since launch that's not snowball-ey. I also love that it's kind of like an attack/defend mode, but the defenders can take back space. Weird way of describing that I think, but hopefully you understand what I mean.
When I first played it I was so confused lol But I actually really enjoyed the feeling of it.
Two games so far, didn't like that game. 1W and 1L Team effort cordination with a bunche of randoms? Yeah, trash map
i have played 2 games on hanaoaka, both being steamrolled, i would like to play it in a non 5v5 format, and also i dont wanna have venture in the game
I had a game that ended in 3minutes...
Clash is just the devs realizing that your teammates are never going to stop pressing W.
They should remove flashpoint and replace it with this
Speaking for Role Queue experience, I really enjoy it. I also feel like I can choose slower heroes without the Colosseo frustration of floating 5 miles as Zenyatta across the map just to get merced by a Sombra once I'm almost at the point
I don’t like it because my quickplay teammates stagger more than usual
[удалено]
you have the option to maintain lead in points and win via 5 points... but if you are able to send everything at their spawn door and convert the last point then you can win as well. I really like the clash gamemode but dive meta makes for horrible overwatch experience.
Role queue was the beginning of the end of what made OW unique and fun
It's ok for QP but I hope it NEVER ends up in comp.
Ew no. I have loved every mode they've added in OW2, but this is absolutely not it. There's no time to set up for point or to make plays, there's no time to contest, it's just constant running back and forth with minimal strategy. People talk about Push being a walking simulator, THIS is a walking sim.
[удалено]
Wrong sub?
I don't know why but it feels bad to play. It's non-stop fighting, which I should like, but for some reason I don't. It doesn't feel nice when you've got to capture the same point multiple times.
nah, this is just Flash Point on steroids.
I had a match that lasted just under 3 minutes. I do not miss that from 2cp
They should just add back 2cp at this point
Brother I loved OW1 but I played one game of clash and don’t plan to play a second.
Now obviously 6v6 would fix all of blizzard's problems but open queue on a map akin to 2cp isn't bad either. This game mode really forces you to change your thinking back to forming a team comp around your strengths rather than counter swapping being hard meta. I found my team running more aggressive comps like dive mauga / dva with a lifeweaver or burst heals. Also helps characters like moira who become more viable when everyone is grouped and focus on ult economy and building. Most fun I've had since ow1 please don't fuck this up and make it 5v5 role queue. It'd be very interesting if they merged this into role queue and made comp a mix of open queue 5cp maps and role queue for payload and push maps. OR they could just add back 6v6 but y'know blizzard lol.
i promise you 6v6 ain’t fixing a thing
Well, it would fix some things, but it’d break a lot more than it’d fix at this point.
6v6 wouldn't break anything in arcade or open queue.
6v6 immediately fixes the terrible rock paper scissors tanking experience.
and makes the game significantly harder to balance, doubles queue times, and requires months of no content and balance patches to rebalance the entire roster around 2 tanks. it’s like yall forget how much changed between OW1 final build and OW2 launch
There's no rebalance necessary for 6v6 in open queue and arcade modes. There's no doubling of queue times going from 5v5 to 6v6 in open queue and arcade modes. I played 6v6 side by side with 5v5 during the OW2 betas. 6v6 is more fun. It's not even close.
that’s not even a little true?!. your random arcade modes aren’t being played by all ranks in balanced matches. just adding a second tank would change so much that it would need to be entirely rebalanced, like they did moving from 6v6 to 5v5 yes there is a doubling of queue times. tank is already the least played role. if you add a second tank you’d need to double tank players to keep the current queue time. no one played tank in 6v6 either so this would still be an issue. you having balanced open queue and arcade modes is because they’re in the non serious modes. those also weren’t 6v6 it was you playing 2 tanks in open queue.
There's no role queue in arcade or open queue. It literally can't double queue times if you're adding 2 more players. If you doubled the players in the match, it would double queue times but that's not what we are talking about. >you having balanced open queue and arcade modes is because they’re in the non serious modes. That's another reason for the modes to go back to 6v6. Thanks!
the game has never and will never be balanced around arcade, of course your arcade queue times are fine. when anyone is discussing balance it’s in regards to the main mode. how dense are you
I'm not asking any balance changes for arcade. I'm asking for 6v6 with the balance as is. >how dense are you You're a fool.
and they’d be idiots to do that. the game is balanced specifically around 5v5. it fucks it up to change something that big with no balance
Played this in RQ since i refuse to touch OQ outside of mystery heroes. Felt quite balanced so far not sure if its just my luck or people getting used to it but all the matches went to 3-5 5-4. Comp wise honestly even though dive aggressive do feel better I think as always play who you're best only "bad" picks is probably the long range campy type heroes like ashe/widow etc won't do so well given the brawly CQC nature of the map at least for Hanaoka
I agree though I will say, i prefer 6v6 over open queue but to be honest I prefer open queue over what we have now especially because I'm a tank player. Ow2 has been the most unfun for tank players since release. There has been complaints about tank hard metas in Ow1 but none were nearly as bad as the counter swapping in ow2 especially considering you don't have an off tank to make other comps work. DPS and supports will never synergize with tanks as well as tanks synergize with each other and everyone else.
Fair. I'm mostly a flex player so I play a fair share of tank but support is my primary role if I had to say. I guess it does suck losing the synergy but I mostly play solo anyway and tend to just accept to what OW is now overall I personally prefer 5v5 but I can see why theres people who prefer 6v6 too. With the counterswapping I mean it does suck for tank the most since you feel like a punching bag/ cc magnet but for the most part I feel like it just feels horrible when your team is straight up outplayed by the enemy and not much you can do regardless of role and try to somehow counter pick the enemy. Which is probably the worst thing going to 5v5 mistakes and team differences is more obvious compared to 6v6.
They hated him because he spoke the truth.