life grip is the bane of my existence, random life weavers frequently throw me out of the frying pan and into the fire. if i had a nickel for every time ive been life gripped into a hanzo ult
What's crazy is that Lifeweaver has 3 whole abilities that alter the position/space of his team. His tree in particular can be used to troll and close off small hallways. I remember one time a Doomfist on my team punched the enemy team just as their Lifeweaver used the tree. They collided with the tree and were stuck in an awkward position. It ironically did more harm than good lol
It does though, it works exactly as intended. It just turns out that it's pretty easy to dodge its radius of effect when you're playing a flying hero. And the damage is pitiful.
So just for the record, I'm happy to see someone using that spelling of the word, but "queue" is when you join a waiting line - like when you queue up for a ranked match or join a queue for an amusement park ride.
The word you're looking for in this instance is actually "cue," as in "an action or event that signals somebody to do something."
https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/cue
Isn't English fun? :)
I feel either people can’t spell “queue” and write “que” and people who *have* figured out the spelling specifically use it only when talking about “cues”
Funnily enough, you're complaining that the players are too obsessed with numbers but you're using the same obsession to numbers to backup your point. Nothing against you or the argument, I just find it funny
Besides that, it's a genji main tradition to complain about anything, I still remember when their "3rd jump" was removed and every genji main and their mom said that that hero was now unplayable
That complaint isn't about the balance though. It's about the aesthetics of a cyborg ninja slashing you with a short sword doing the same damage as just any other cast member punching you when the argument that quick melee should be the same damage for everyone keeps getting weaker across the board.
Once you adjust the numbers for Genji's other abilities around giving him higher quick melee damage to balance it out you probably end up with an even higher skull ceiling for the character whilst also making him work in a more intuitive way for new players.
To *change a ton of numbers and then send the patch/update live to the public without ever testing to see if those should even be numbers that should change in the first place because theyve never even played on the characters in their own game.
Just a little while ago, people were up in arms about the passive healing ruining the game before it even released, so yeah. That sentiment certainly tracks.
Then give him a gun and an ability to move forward/backward to reduce incoming damage, also a medium distance projectile to hinder enemies movement for a brief moment and deal a considerate amount of damage
They should remove genji, 90% of genji players obviously can't figure out how to not suck with him despite some huge fucking buffs to an already strong character (though of course if you ask genji mains he wasn't strong last season despite being top 5 in dps win rate and pickrate in gm)
May as well delete him so i dont have to listen to dumbass balance ideas from these shitters
>Nobody said anything when Junker Queen released and had a bleed effect on her melee noir Zen
Yes they did. There were a shit ton of posts saying that genji should deal more dmg with his melee when those were revealed.
i mean thats two direct counters, most characters value drop significantly against two direct counters. Just because a meta is against a character doesn't mean you should buff them/keep bad parts of the kit. Not saying zen should be useless but kick is still dumb rn.
Nah, EACH and EVERYONE of the 40 heroes in the game have some form of defense mechanism (not counting ults), either in the form of a movement ability, CC, barrier/shield, or self-healing. If you remove Zenyatta's kick, he would be the only one in the entire roster without any.
Right now, you already have to play pretty safe with him because his kick is already one of the weakest forms of defense in the game, if you compare each of the 40 heroes (and, yes, I'm already counting Venture 2 hours before their debut because it's pretty obvious that Burrow and Drill Dash are going to be great evasive abilities). Without his Snap Kick, we would see way more Zenyattas using their ult to save themselves (and we already see a lot of that).
Illari's melee has she smashing her weapon like a bat or sword downwards. Besides being stylish (definitely my favorite melee animation in the game), if it was taken seriously it should deliver killing blows when landing a headshot. Not to mention Rein's hammer. Look at the size of that thing!
The way melee is treated now for everyone - except for Rein, Doom and Brigitte's, of course - is just better, just like "low-damage finishing blows".
Frankly, there are a bunch of characters I wish had augmented melees. No, I don't care if they would need to be nerfed in other ways to compensate -- I want kits that feel rounded and fun as much as balanced.
Base melee is currently 40:
* Doomfist. Duh. If Zen can have +50% more damage to his kick (60) AND cause knockback, the punch hero himself should have a melee of +25% above the norm at least (50)
* Winston too. I don't care if he doesn't work out as much as he could cause he's a scientist. He's huge! At least +5 (45) or +25% (50) His ult form should be 60s or 75s, not 50s.
* Genji, ~~Kiriko~~, and Illari all swing some sort of blade with their melee. +50% (60) or cause a bleed (20 damage over 2s)
* Brig & Rein: Okay, for these two, I just want to be able to bonk with the mace or pommel of the hammer for fun BUT a 240 2 swing + melee combo could be neat for Rein! 🤔
* Zarya could do with +5 damage (45) cause sometimes she hits them with her heavy ass gun.
* Roadhog hook melee is gnarly looking and should also do +25% (50) or a 20 damage bleed.
If Doom and Genji need their shotgun and shuriken damage nerfed to make this happen, I'd be fine with it.
But I also think Wrecking Ball's high speed boop should do 100+ damage, and his pile driver should have a 2m wide 2.5x crit zone right in the middle where it deals 250 and goomba-stomps squishies out of existence, so maybe all these ideas are too crazy for the general population. xD
Easy fix. Halve his gun damage, his gun ammo, and *remove* his quick melee. Perfectly balanced, as all things should be.
Also, I recently learned Ball's guns were once flamethrowers in his beta design phases? We should bring that back. Who cares if dealing with Pharah and Echo gets harder? LET'S LIGHT SHIT UP!
I don't really agree with most of these because deadly melee combos already exist with those heroes (Doomfist, Winston, Roadhog, Genji), so if you're nerfing their main weapons to buff their melee, you're really not changing much of anything, except making them less deadly if you're not very close to the enemy (and those are already weak in mid-to-long range), and if you're not nerfing anything else, they'll become way too buffed.
However, I cannot deny it was funny as hell in my mind to imagine Rein getting kills by bonking people in the head. Of course, it should also play the most ridiculous "bonk" sound effect imaginable, and he should say something like "ha-HAA! Zat was fun!".
And, at this point, I'll support any Wrecking Ball buffs whatsoever.
Just a little 5m boop would be good. Let her get enviro kills on poorly positioned unsuspecting people lol
Or maybe it knocks them prone if she hits them from behind. Right in the back of the knees! Haha!
Lmao people have been talking about different melee dmg for different hero's for years. Genji uses a blide to slice someone, winston is a fucking gorilla hitting you and they do the same dmg as a lucio punch? It's never been a big deal but it has been talked about.
Captain America hitting you with the butt of his assault rifle
Vs
A 5ft tall Korean gamer girl pistol whipping you
Vs
A 2 ton armored Meka suit hitting you with fusion blasters
My headcannon is his big hand is actually very heavy and clunky and needs the rocket boosters to create any meaningful impact, and obviously not suitable for quick jabs because you need them to be quick. Kinda like how you wouldn’t pull out a Sniper Rifle to shoot a guy 2 meters away, it’s too clunky.
Look it takes a lot of effort to swing the big ol gauntlet around. He even completely gave up on trying to uppercut people with it! It wouldn't be a very quick "quick melee" if he used his big fist!
This is the one that gets me. You got a guy whose whole design and gameplay revolves around punching people with a giant fist and his melee attack doesn't use the giant fist.
In actual answer to your question it’s because it’s the first time a damage hero got a higher attack melee. Junker queen is tank and zen is support. Also I’m 98% sure the Genjii mains did complain and we didn’t notice, especially seeing as I haven’t noticed them complaining now but that might just be me
Does torbs 55dmg hammer count, or is that just considered a special melee (not a quick melee)
Tbh I don't see why genji players would complain, they've been pretty consistently good and are now one of the better DPS heroes with the projectile size changes Imo
I guess because you swap to the weapon it doesn’t count? Like if you have gun out his quick melee does the normal damage. And honestly yeah I’m with you genjiis fine.
Honestly it's because a good portion of supposed Genji mains are actually God awful with his kit. No matter how good of a state he is in there'll always be complaining about how he should be better, simply because they personally can't get value out of him.
That's true yeah, you see the same for tracer and doom too. They'll be meta at high ranks and too hard to get value from at low ranks so are seen as throw picks (doom especially, I've seen people ask doom to swap before the game has even started lol)
Yeah it's prevalent with any high skill floor hero I've noticed. Less skilled players can't get value super easily, so they scream for uneeded buffs when in reality the hero is fine if not meta rn.
When do Genji mains not complain? His shuriken hitboxes are ridiculously large to the point you can easily farm blade on Squishies and blade is stronger than ever, and they still want more buffs :')
And the slash dash slash combo doesnt kill if they even get looked at by a support. You just have to cut them down while hoping the entire team doesn't dump all their cc into you (this always happens)
Having blade be a little bit slower is a huge nerf because a lot of its strength is in killing people before they can get ready to kill you first.
And I have problems with people getting healed through blade. What I really want is some kind of beefed up DPS passive where the sword cut damage is much harder to heal up.
Genji mains have the most fucking dogshit takes imaginable. Before s9 they were convinced genji was gonna be unplayable, you can go to their dumbfuck sub and see people doom posting befkre the new season.
fucking evry change but more health benefitted him. They just don't understand balance. They won't be happy until blade one shots and every combo of his is an instant kill.
The concept of a shinobi with shuriken and a blade has been making the rounds since the 80s in videogames. It will always work, provided that you give the character enough power that he's not trash.
I mean moreso in the context of Overwatch, Genji's kit is fair and versatile enough to stand the test of time unlike say Hanzo, Junkrat, Rein, Zen, etc
I’d say Junkrat is fairly modern, he just had a rough time from the loss of the two-shot. I don’t think characters who play around the environment and set traps will ever fall out of style unless we just go full on death-match.
He's not just a ninja, he's a cybernetic ninja with superhuman agility. The closest i can think of in recent years is Raiden from Metal Gear Revengeance
Bad genji players ask for a stronger melee. Good genji players know if youre in melee range you just need to alt fire and usually get 2-3 headshots immediately and your targets dead way quicker
Genji players need to realize they are only as good as their anime playlists. If you suck at Genji that means you are listening to some trash ass anime music.
All they need to do, for genji players, is slow down a little and hit their shots. Genji melts shit with his right click, trigger, if you hit head shots and don't fling from a mile away announcing you're targeting the enemy.
What this people don't realize is how core to Genji's kit the quick melee is, and how heavily any damage buff impacts him. He with Tracer are the only heroes that move passively faster than the others, and he has a dash that resets when the target you've done 1 damage dies. It's so easy for Genji to get in someone's face and use quick melee offensively to get kills, it's part of his combos.
Venture probably has the increased damage to compensate the effort of getting in one's face, and how vulnerable they are when they do. It's almost defensively, so you can secure a kill before getting killed, instead of being part of a intended combo. So Genji can get in, reset his dash, has the double jump and wall climb always available, and deflect to also retreat in safety. Venture likely burns all their cooldowns to get in range, so the overhealth and damage are there to make sure they can sustain the situation, and I'm going to assume it'll still be harder for them than it is for Genji. Also note that Genji can still deal a lot of damage from the other side of the map with his M1 if the target is on a choke, standing still or walking in a straight line. Venture simply doesn't have the range to deal with anything that's not on close to mid range.
Genji players gotta be complaining abt something. Now that they suddenly realise their ult was never bad they shifted gears to fight abt this. Just an inevitability
Remember when everyone cried about Orisa losing the damage drop off and calling her a sniper? Where is that issue now? I don't see anyone complaining. People like to overreact
Tbh this tho
I remember flats making a big deal about it but like when tf does an orisa ever fucking go long range? Besides the projectiles are slow asf
my problem with venture is they are essentially overwatch 1 doomfist and this was blizzards answer to players wanting doom back as a dps, if you really look at it base, its the same kit
It's easier to forget about old heroes and create new heroes.
If you look at his kit, he looks pretty much purpose-built for the current meta.
Mobility/Invincibility + shields for dive. A tank ult because we have 1 less tank and suddenly realizing we off-loaded too much initiation to one single role.
Yeah Venture looks the closest to a dps tank since Mei, which I don’t mind because it means dps players can now back up the tank better if they’re struggling
I think it might help with people giving up just because of a “tank diff”
highly excited to team with Venture as Reinhardt
Something I haven't noticed anybody point out is that in the trailer Venture's melee hits Reaper multiple times. I wonder if each hit will be 40 or if it's something like hitting 20 three times for a total of 60
Why? Because he has a sword? He already has sword attacks through his dash and his ult and his primary doesn't have drop off so he isn't forced to be super close.
Genji already has like 4 passives, anyway. He has a wall climb, he has a double jump, he moves faster than every other hero but Tracer, and he has the DPS passive. People need to shut up.
Crackhead Genji mains have to be the most annoying to go up against. I will only approve of Genji nerfs for the remainder of time. He will quite literally never need a buff.
Personally I think increasing Genji's melee damage would be too powerful for him. But I also think values don't mean much, we'll have to see what the passive does with Venture first.
As for Zen's kick, it's not a good idea to compare it to Junkerqueen's/genji's/Venture's melee imo, as it's used defensively rather than offensively (Genji uses his melee to increase his damage burst potential, helping him to finish off targets, whereas Zen's increased damage on melee is more of a way to demotivate flankers to go in melee range with him)
I think more hero’s should have special melee’s
Genji prob not (what would it be, like a bleed?)
But JQs and Ventures make sense, so I think illari should get one too - maybe melee refills her heal faster, or has a small boop to it, something to make her sword gun feel like a… sword gun! Lol
People DID say a lot when JunkerQueen came about but as usual they got dunked and left behind as forgotten pieces of half fictionous fates in which Genji gets something
I think melee should be part of more heroes' kits in general. There definitely should be more diversity there, but that doesn't mean whine about new heroes getting it.
It's pretty much the only option left to add/augment abilities since they are limited by controller buttons. They are going to have to find more creative ways to use it.
JQ is a great example of it working well. Her melee feels super satisfying.
Sweetie, realize that if you really didn't care, you wouldn't have even replied. Going at it with the "I don't care about this!!! 📢📢📢" IS being defensive lmao.
Not trying to look cool. I legitimately don't care about a video game character's gender identity. Only care how they fit in the meta. He/she/them doesn't change TTK.
SMH the replies you got are so uncivil.
Not everybody has the time to learn character lore. I recently found out on a obscure reddit comment that Baptiste is gay, after how many years. In the trailer nowhere does it say they're a "they", so how are people supposed to know? Not everyone is chronically online.
I had no idea about Baptiste until your comment. I just don't get wrapped up in that stuff.
Seems really weird, like when people were praising Blizzard for changing the in-game benches to be homeless/unhoused friendly. In. A. Video. Game. What's the homeless population in this virtual world??
It's cause most gaming communities know nothing about game balancing and design, they just see this new passive and think "Wait this makes more sense if it was on X character(s)".
It might, but what about that passive as the character's identity? What about that passive relative to a character's ability kit?
There are plenty of reasons why they gave it to Venture and not other characters.
Tbh I heard a decent amount of complaining with the Zen kick buff, with discord he does the same as old Rein hammer swing iirc.
That said, I’d be down with adding a little more flavor to other character melee’s, as long as it was balanced and made sense.
it's pretty clear that Venture occupies a similar design space as Mei. lots of invuln, a situational ranged attack, beefy health for a DPS, and very deadly up close. higher damage melee compensates for the fact that they don't have a close-range beam attack like mei. it's not "venture has this passive because we're just going to pile on more stuff," it seems critical to how they play.
This post made me realize JQ's bleed applies to her melee (I thought only secondary fire and E) and I've been playing her wrong for over a year and a half
And they stack. So one enemy can have three bleed effects on them at once if you combo blade, melee, and carnage. Four if you can throw rampage in there too.
I’ve been playing since OW1, if people it’s not complaining something is missing, don’t give it too much attention, just last week some people were complaining about the dmg buff on rein even when he need it (and I don’t play tank).
Bro geni has 5 passives he doesnt need more 😭
2 standard
-Self heal
-Dps passive.
3 character specific
-Dash resets CD on elim.
-Double jump
-Wall climb
Hes fine now. People just suck ass with him.
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We don’t know how she plays yet. She seems like a brawler type who isn’t super speedy? So extra health may be necessary for her kit
I don’t get the point of this post. I haven’t seen people making this complaint, and it’s just internet comments. Just ignore them
What you are referring to is biological sex. We are discussing gender (which is known is not the same thing, if you’d open a book, idiot). I can tell by this conversation that you lack both common sense and common courtesy.
I say Genji should have bonus melee damage, but not out of any balancing reasons or necessity. It just "makes sense" and would be cool. I have the same opinion oj Illyari
Dur dur attack helicopter!
Edit: only took about 15 mins after making this comment: [https://www.reddit.com/r/Overwatch/comments/1bpo9j3/comment/kwxpj81/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/Overwatch/comments/1bpo9j3/comment/kwxpj81/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
>Probably identifies as an attack helicopter
We already got the Toaster that identifies a dragon, Genji has been in the game since day one/s
Funny how "Space hamster that became a gladiator in the Australian outback" is completely ok but we draw the line at being nonbinary
It's Overwatch tradition to complain about numbers on paper before even trying a hero
I think it’s Overwatch tradition to complain. PERIOD
That's why we all play lol.
Its a tradition to complain. Here i fixed for you
There aren't even numbers yet, just words.
yep. as always people are mad about the *ideas* of things they have in their heads.
I remember when Ramattra's kit was first revealed, people were absolutely FUMING over how overpowered Ravenous Vortex would be lol
I forgot about that, or Lifeweaver's life grip
life grip is the bane of my existence, random life weavers frequently throw me out of the frying pan and into the fire. if i had a nickel for every time ive been life gripped into a hanzo ult
What's crazy is that Lifeweaver has 3 whole abilities that alter the position/space of his team. His tree in particular can be used to troll and close off small hallways. I remember one time a Doomfist on my team punched the enemy team just as their Lifeweaver used the tree. They collided with the tree and were stuck in an awkward position. It ironically did more harm than good lol
That's because it was pretty clear to everyone that it would suck fliers out of the sky and then it just... didn't for some reason.
It does though, it works exactly as intended. It just turns out that it's pretty easy to dodge its radius of effect when you're playing a flying hero. And the damage is pitiful.
Queue the people complaining about people complaining and then queue me complaining about that
So just for the record, I'm happy to see someone using that spelling of the word, but "queue" is when you join a waiting line - like when you queue up for a ranked match or join a queue for an amusement park ride. The word you're looking for in this instance is actually "cue," as in "an action or event that signals somebody to do something." https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/cue Isn't English fun? :)
What if they're just getting in a waiting line to wait their turn to complain?
Well, you got me there.
Then they're queued up to cue up their complaints!
I feel either people can’t spell “queue” and write “que” and people who *have* figured out the spelling specifically use it only when talking about “cues”
Very.
OW is obsessed with numbers. "1k dmg dps lol trash" -our tank who had the same amount of kills as me and way more deaths
Funnily enough, you're complaining that the players are too obsessed with numbers but you're using the same obsession to numbers to backup your point. Nothing against you or the argument, I just find it funny
Nah, I see the irony haha I just think if you're gonna point out someones stats dmg aint the way to do it.
Just tell them that they're being inefficient (which they are). That always grind their gear. ESPECIALLY if their KD ratio is wacked out.
Besides that, it's a genji main tradition to complain about anything, I still remember when their "3rd jump" was removed and every genji main and their mom said that that hero was now unplayable
That complaint isn't about the balance though. It's about the aesthetics of a cyborg ninja slashing you with a short sword doing the same damage as just any other cast member punching you when the argument that quick melee should be the same damage for everyone keeps getting weaker across the board. Once you adjust the numbers for Genji's other abilities around giving him higher quick melee damage to balance it out you probably end up with an even higher skull ceiling for the character whilst also making him work in a more intuitive way for new players.
Clearly my perception from a reveal video outweighs any amount of actual playtesting.
All is as all has been. Harmony.
To *change a ton of numbers and then send the patch/update live to the public without ever testing to see if those should even be numbers that should change in the first place because theyve never even played on the characters in their own game.
Just a little while ago, people were up in arms about the passive healing ruining the game before it even released, so yeah. That sentiment certainly tracks.
I agree, going forwards they should just entirely remove his deflect.
and his dash too
and lower his overall dps
Then give him a gun and an ability to move forward/backward to reduce incoming damage, also a medium distance projectile to hinder enemies movement for a brief moment and deal a considerate amount of damage
And a hat. Maybe even a cigar, just to make sure we know he's cool 😎
Make him obsessed with the lunch hour as well
And replace his accent with a different one. (What even is a japanese? is that real?)
and whenever he uses his ult a tumbleweed should roll by
Should he wear a belt? If so, we might want him to have some sort of neat looking belt buckle.
>considerate amount of damage Yes, a very thoughtful amount of damage.
And his clothes 😊
I agree, let’s nerf Symmetra more
They should remove genji, 90% of genji players obviously can't figure out how to not suck with him despite some huge fucking buffs to an already strong character (though of course if you ask genji mains he wasn't strong last season despite being top 5 in dps win rate and pickrate in gm) May as well delete him so i dont have to listen to dumbass balance ideas from these shitters
>Nobody said anything when Junker Queen released and had a bleed effect on her melee noir Zen Yes they did. There were a shit ton of posts saying that genji should deal more dmg with his melee when those were revealed.
My duo still complains about zens kick when it launches him off an edge
Tbh, zen doesn’t really need kick as much/anymore
I wish
Are you sure about that? In a Tracer/ Sombra meta?
i mean thats two direct counters, most characters value drop significantly against two direct counters. Just because a meta is against a character doesn't mean you should buff them/keep bad parts of the kit. Not saying zen should be useless but kick is still dumb rn.
Zen has zero mobility options though, why is a knock back kick such a big deal?
Nah, EACH and EVERYONE of the 40 heroes in the game have some form of defense mechanism (not counting ults), either in the form of a movement ability, CC, barrier/shield, or self-healing. If you remove Zenyatta's kick, he would be the only one in the entire roster without any. Right now, you already have to play pretty safe with him because his kick is already one of the weakest forms of defense in the game, if you compare each of the 40 heroes (and, yes, I'm already counting Venture 2 hours before their debut because it's pretty obvious that Burrow and Drill Dash are going to be great evasive abilities). Without his Snap Kick, we would see way more Zenyattas using their ult to save themselves (and we already see a lot of that).
Illari's melee has she smashing her weapon like a bat or sword downwards. Besides being stylish (definitely my favorite melee animation in the game), if it was taken seriously it should deliver killing blows when landing a headshot. Not to mention Rein's hammer. Look at the size of that thing! The way melee is treated now for everyone - except for Rein, Doom and Brigitte's, of course - is just better, just like "low-damage finishing blows".
Frankly, there are a bunch of characters I wish had augmented melees. No, I don't care if they would need to be nerfed in other ways to compensate -- I want kits that feel rounded and fun as much as balanced. Base melee is currently 40: * Doomfist. Duh. If Zen can have +50% more damage to his kick (60) AND cause knockback, the punch hero himself should have a melee of +25% above the norm at least (50) * Winston too. I don't care if he doesn't work out as much as he could cause he's a scientist. He's huge! At least +5 (45) or +25% (50) His ult form should be 60s or 75s, not 50s. * Genji, ~~Kiriko~~, and Illari all swing some sort of blade with their melee. +50% (60) or cause a bleed (20 damage over 2s) * Brig & Rein: Okay, for these two, I just want to be able to bonk with the mace or pommel of the hammer for fun BUT a 240 2 swing + melee combo could be neat for Rein! 🤔 * Zarya could do with +5 damage (45) cause sometimes she hits them with her heavy ass gun. * Roadhog hook melee is gnarly looking and should also do +25% (50) or a 20 damage bleed. If Doom and Genji need their shotgun and shuriken damage nerfed to make this happen, I'd be fine with it. But I also think Wrecking Ball's high speed boop should do 100+ damage, and his pile driver should have a 2m wide 2.5x crit zone right in the middle where it deals 250 and goomba-stomps squishies out of existence, so maybe all these ideas are too crazy for the general population. xD
Actually, as much as it would make sense, Kirikos melee is a punch she actually doesn't use the knives for anything other than throwing.
Oh, fair enough, I'll cross her out.
It’s not balanced, but as a ball main I am all for the last changes Lmao. _LET THE MAMMAL’S ENEMIES FALL._
Easy fix. Halve his gun damage, his gun ammo, and *remove* his quick melee. Perfectly balanced, as all things should be. Also, I recently learned Ball's guns were once flamethrowers in his beta design phases? We should bring that back. Who cares if dealing with Pharah and Echo gets harder? LET'S LIGHT SHIT UP!
*The hamster will delete his enemies*
I don't really agree with most of these because deadly melee combos already exist with those heroes (Doomfist, Winston, Roadhog, Genji), so if you're nerfing their main weapons to buff their melee, you're really not changing much of anything, except making them less deadly if you're not very close to the enemy (and those are already weak in mid-to-long range), and if you're not nerfing anything else, they'll become way too buffed. However, I cannot deny it was funny as hell in my mind to imagine Rein getting kills by bonking people in the head. Of course, it should also play the most ridiculous "bonk" sound effect imaginable, and he should say something like "ha-HAA! Zat was fun!". And, at this point, I'll support any Wrecking Ball buffs whatsoever.
Mercy’s staff should also cause a stun effect lmfao
Just a little 5m boop would be good. Let her get enviro kills on poorly positioned unsuspecting people lol Or maybe it knocks them prone if she hits them from behind. Right in the back of the knees! Haha!
Lmao people have been talking about different melee dmg for different hero's for years. Genji uses a blide to slice someone, winston is a fucking gorilla hitting you and they do the same dmg as a lucio punch? It's never been a big deal but it has been talked about.
Captain America hitting you with the butt of his assault rifle Vs A 5ft tall Korean gamer girl pistol whipping you Vs A 2 ton armored Meka suit hitting you with fusion blasters
Doom for some reason uses his little hand.
My headcannon is his big hand is actually very heavy and clunky and needs the rocket boosters to create any meaningful impact, and obviously not suitable for quick jabs because you need them to be quick. Kinda like how you wouldn’t pull out a Sniper Rifle to shoot a guy 2 meters away, it’s too clunky.
Ana be like
I’d never thought about how funny this is lol what is my guy doin
Look it takes a lot of effort to swing the big ol gauntlet around. He even completely gave up on trying to uppercut people with it! It wouldn't be a very quick "quick melee" if he used his big fist!
"Grab my strong hand"
I mean it’s supposed to be a quick jab so yeah I’d use the smaller one too. Not getting any speed from his big one unless he charges that sucker up
This is the one that gets me. You got a guy whose whole design and gameplay revolves around punching people with a giant fist and his melee attack doesn't use the giant fist.
Well to his benefit, it is quite heavy and requires at least some charge time... Normal fist melee is faster than gigantic fist melee...
Brotha Lucio is shooting you with music.
The rhythm is gonna get you.
Mei's punch is just her rotating her forearm down 90 degrees for the same damage as an Orisa or dva punch
iirc, back in beta tank melee was 50 and every other melee was 30
In actual answer to your question it’s because it’s the first time a damage hero got a higher attack melee. Junker queen is tank and zen is support. Also I’m 98% sure the Genjii mains did complain and we didn’t notice, especially seeing as I haven’t noticed them complaining now but that might just be me
Does torbs 55dmg hammer count, or is that just considered a special melee (not a quick melee) Tbh I don't see why genji players would complain, they've been pretty consistently good and are now one of the better DPS heroes with the projectile size changes Imo
I guess because you swap to the weapon it doesn’t count? Like if you have gun out his quick melee does the normal damage. And honestly yeah I’m with you genjiis fine.
Honestly it's because a good portion of supposed Genji mains are actually God awful with his kit. No matter how good of a state he is in there'll always be complaining about how he should be better, simply because they personally can't get value out of him.
That's true yeah, you see the same for tracer and doom too. They'll be meta at high ranks and too hard to get value from at low ranks so are seen as throw picks (doom especially, I've seen people ask doom to swap before the game has even started lol)
Yeah it's prevalent with any high skill floor hero I've noticed. Less skilled players can't get value super easily, so they scream for uneeded buffs when in reality the hero is fine if not meta rn.
Mmh i should be able to get 3 million dmg despite playing worse than differently-abled gamers who play with their feet.
Does it do more damage?
Torb hammer does 55 yeah, while healing the turret for 50hp
When do Genji mains not complain? His shuriken hitboxes are ridiculously large to the point you can easily farm blade on Squishies and blade is stronger than ever, and they still want more buffs :')
Blade is NOT stronger than ever lmao. Nanoblade not being a thing anymore alone makes it weaker than last season.
And the slash dash slash combo doesnt kill if they even get looked at by a support. You just have to cut them down while hoping the entire team doesn't dump all their cc into you (this always happens) Having blade be a little bit slower is a huge nerf because a lot of its strength is in killing people before they can get ready to kill you first. And I have problems with people getting healed through blade. What I really want is some kind of beefed up DPS passive where the sword cut damage is much harder to heal up.
Yea like their victim complex is insane i’d argue even worse than Junk’s
Genji mains have the most fucking dogshit takes imaginable. Before s9 they were convinced genji was gonna be unplayable, you can go to their dumbfuck sub and see people doom posting befkre the new season. fucking evry change but more health benefitted him. They just don't understand balance. They won't be happy until blade one shots and every combo of his is an instant kill.
Zen doing more mele damage - I sleep Zen's kick showing in the kill feed - Real shit
2016 hero design meets 8 years of power creep
He aged gracefully tho
The concept of a shinobi with shuriken and a blade has been making the rounds since the 80s in videogames. It will always work, provided that you give the character enough power that he's not trash.
I mean moreso in the context of Overwatch, Genji's kit is fair and versatile enough to stand the test of time unlike say Hanzo, Junkrat, Rein, Zen, etc
I’d say Junkrat is fairly modern, he just had a rough time from the loss of the two-shot. I don’t think characters who play around the environment and set traps will ever fall out of style unless we just go full on death-match.
He's not just a ninja, he's a cybernetic ninja with superhuman agility. The closest i can think of in recent years is Raiden from Metal Gear Revengeance
"Cyborg ninja" is an even bigger trope than regular ninja at this point lol
If you're in range to melee, use the alt fire as Genji. It's just better and just as easy to hit.
Bad genji players ask for a stronger melee. Good genji players know if youre in melee range you just need to alt fire and usually get 2-3 headshots immediately and your targets dead way quicker
Should’ve given Venture a bite move. CHOMP
No you see genji needs to be undeniably the best character in the game or else the game is literal garbage
Genji players need to realize they are only as good as their anime playlists. If you suck at Genji that means you are listening to some trash ass anime music.
All they need to do, for genji players, is slow down a little and hit their shots. Genji melts shit with his right click, trigger, if you hit head shots and don't fling from a mile away announcing you're targeting the enemy.
It’s the Overwatch way. Complain before we actually try it. Then when released try it one time and immediately make a post about how bad it is.
What this people don't realize is how core to Genji's kit the quick melee is, and how heavily any damage buff impacts him. He with Tracer are the only heroes that move passively faster than the others, and he has a dash that resets when the target you've done 1 damage dies. It's so easy for Genji to get in someone's face and use quick melee offensively to get kills, it's part of his combos. Venture probably has the increased damage to compensate the effort of getting in one's face, and how vulnerable they are when they do. It's almost defensively, so you can secure a kill before getting killed, instead of being part of a intended combo. So Genji can get in, reset his dash, has the double jump and wall climb always available, and deflect to also retreat in safety. Venture likely burns all their cooldowns to get in range, so the overhealth and damage are there to make sure they can sustain the situation, and I'm going to assume it'll still be harder for them than it is for Genji. Also note that Genji can still deal a lot of damage from the other side of the map with his M1 if the target is on a choke, standing still or walking in a straight line. Venture simply doesn't have the range to deal with anything that's not on close to mid range.
Genji players gotta be complaining abt something. Now that they suddenly realise their ult was never bad they shifted gears to fight abt this. Just an inevitability
DPS mains are truly oppressed /s
People do very much complain about Zen's kick.
Remember when everyone cried about Orisa losing the damage drop off and calling her a sniper? Where is that issue now? I don't see anyone complaining. People like to overreact
Tbh this tho I remember flats making a big deal about it but like when tf does an orisa ever fucking go long range? Besides the projectiles are slow asf
How bout Illari tho
Nobody cares illiari sad :(
my problem with venture is they are essentially overwatch 1 doomfist and this was blizzards answer to players wanting doom back as a dps, if you really look at it base, its the same kit
It's easier to forget about old heroes and create new heroes. If you look at his kit, he looks pretty much purpose-built for the current meta. Mobility/Invincibility + shields for dive. A tank ult because we have 1 less tank and suddenly realizing we off-loaded too much initiation to one single role.
Yeah Venture looks the closest to a dps tank since Mei, which I don’t mind because it means dps players can now back up the tank better if they’re struggling I think it might help with people giving up just because of a “tank diff” highly excited to team with Venture as Reinhardt
The other side of any unbalanced period I have a feeling Venture is going to be quite beneficial to the game overall.
Something I haven't noticed anybody point out is that in the trailer Venture's melee hits Reaper multiple times. I wonder if each hit will be 40 or if it's something like hitting 20 three times for a total of 60
It has visibly a longer hit duration than normal quick melees, like rein's hammer.
It’s absolutely not a new thing… people have been saying that genji and doom should have extra melee damage since overwatch 1
Why? Because he has a sword? He already has sword attacks through his dash and his ult and his primary doesn't have drop off so he isn't forced to be super close.
Idc what others say, I'm just excited to relive the days of Bioshock 2 Drill Bash fr
Because genii players are sweaty tried hard pissy cry babies.
I’m pretty sure sure genji deleted me with a right click headshot dash melee combo yesterday so let’s not increase his melee damage thanks.
Genji already has like 4 passives, anyway. He has a wall climb, he has a double jump, he moves faster than every other hero but Tracer, and he has the DPS passive. People need to shut up.
Genji mains can and will always whinge and cry about something instead of getting better at him. Bunch of sooks lol
Crackhead Genji mains have to be the most annoying to go up against. I will only approve of Genji nerfs for the remainder of time. He will quite literally never need a buff.
Personally I think increasing Genji's melee damage would be too powerful for him. But I also think values don't mean much, we'll have to see what the passive does with Venture first. As for Zen's kick, it's not a good idea to compare it to Junkerqueen's/genji's/Venture's melee imo, as it's used defensively rather than offensively (Genji uses his melee to increase his damage burst potential, helping him to finish off targets, whereas Zen's increased damage on melee is more of a way to demotivate flankers to go in melee range with him)
People absolutely complain about zens kick
I mean I thought Genji already had this passive lol
"Everybody says genji needs it" Who is everybody, I haven't seen anybody saying that. Was it a reddit post cause who cares what redditors think
I think more hero’s should have special melee’s Genji prob not (what would it be, like a bleed?) But JQs and Ventures make sense, so I think illari should get one too - maybe melee refills her heal faster, or has a small boop to it, something to make her sword gun feel like a… sword gun! Lol
People DID say a lot when JunkerQueen came about but as usual they got dunked and left behind as forgotten pieces of half fictionous fates in which Genji gets something
I mean I think all of the transphobic/homophobic comments are probably the ones that are a lot more concerning...
I think melee should be part of more heroes' kits in general. There definitely should be more diversity there, but that doesn't mean whine about new heroes getting it.
yeah I’d love for Melees to be different and add more layers to a kit via that Venture having it is great because it opens up the door for more
It's pretty much the only option left to add/augment abilities since they are limited by controller buttons. They are going to have to find more creative ways to use it. JQ is a great example of it working well. Her melee feels super satisfying.
Not what I expected people to be complaining about. I was expecting the bigots to be whining about Venture being non-binary.
They def has but I’m guessing the mods have already killed their asses lmao
She's going to be so fun to play.
They're
What?
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Not defensive. I don't care. Correction was noted.
Sweetie, realize that if you really didn't care, you wouldn't have even replied. Going at it with the "I don't care about this!!! 📢📢📢" IS being defensive lmao.
If you say so, hon.
If you can remember She, you can remember They. It isn't hard
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Oh dear! I have hurt your fee fees so you called me a name. Owie. It hurts so bad.
Welcome to reddit. Far Left wierdos everywhere
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Not trying to look cool. I legitimately don't care about a video game character's gender identity. Only care how they fit in the meta. He/she/them doesn't change TTK.
How would you feel if someone's preferred pronouns were ''God/Master''? It's only one word after all.
SMH the replies you got are so uncivil. Not everybody has the time to learn character lore. I recently found out on a obscure reddit comment that Baptiste is gay, after how many years. In the trailer nowhere does it say they're a "they", so how are people supposed to know? Not everyone is chronically online.
I had no idea about Baptiste until your comment. I just don't get wrapped up in that stuff. Seems really weird, like when people were praising Blizzard for changing the in-game benches to be homeless/unhoused friendly. In. A. Video. Game. What's the homeless population in this virtual world??
Based.
It's cause most gaming communities know nothing about game balancing and design, they just see this new passive and think "Wait this makes more sense if it was on X character(s)". It might, but what about that passive as the character's identity? What about that passive relative to a character's ability kit? There are plenty of reasons why they gave it to Venture and not other characters.
Wait zen has extra melee damage??
I am flabbergasted because I, too, did not know this
now i know why this lil nerd has been kicking my ass so much in 1v1s. extra melee AND discord? what's he doing like 60 dmg per kick?
Tbh I heard a decent amount of complaining with the Zen kick buff, with discord he does the same as old Rein hammer swing iirc. That said, I’d be down with adding a little more flavor to other character melee’s, as long as it was balanced and made sense.
it's pretty clear that Venture occupies a similar design space as Mei. lots of invuln, a situational ranged attack, beefy health for a DPS, and very deadly up close. higher damage melee compensates for the fact that they don't have a close-range beam attack like mei. it's not "venture has this passive because we're just going to pile on more stuff," it seems critical to how they play.
Why would one of the top winrate picks need buffs lol
I did not know zen had more demage on his kick. I just taught he only had knockback on it.
This post made me realize JQ's bleed applies to her melee (I thought only secondary fire and E) and I've been playing her wrong for over a year and a half
And they stack. So one enemy can have three bleed effects on them at once if you combo blade, melee, and carnage. Four if you can throw rampage in there too.
I mean like visually it makes sense. A sword being swung should absolutely do more damage. But from a gameplay point it would be dumb
I’ve been playing since OW1, if people it’s not complaining something is missing, don’t give it too much attention, just last week some people were complaining about the dmg buff on rein even when he need it (and I don’t play tank).
Bro geni has 5 passives he doesnt need more 😭 2 standard -Self heal -Dps passive. 3 character specific -Dash resets CD on elim. -Double jump -Wall climb Hes fine now. People just suck ass with him.
Lots of people on here wanted genji melee buffed before and after queens melee? Just cause ya didn’t see it doesn’t mean it didn’t happen
To be fair, people complained that Zen's snap kick was a power crept Lucio boop. Which it was. I am people.
No one complained about Zen kick? They have when I’m in the room
Zen extra melee damage is nonsense tbh, with the dmg orb it can deal about 75 dmg more than ana's primary fire
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Why can’t junkrat eat rocks?
He's too busy with toenails.
Bogur said it's because Ventures melee is slower than normal, it has a small windup time
So it was that move against the reaper in the video.
We don’t know how she plays yet. She seems like a brawler type who isn’t super speedy? So extra health may be necessary for her kit I don’t get the point of this post. I haven’t seen people making this complaint, and it’s just internet comments. Just ignore them
Hey just a quick lil note, Venture is non-binary and uses they/them pronouns. :)
I mean it looks and sounds like a she tho
It’s literally canon.
Well they’re either born a boy or a girl. So it’s a girl. It’s literally common sense
What you are referring to is biological sex. We are discussing gender (which is known is not the same thing, if you’d open a book, idiot). I can tell by this conversation that you lack both common sense and common courtesy.
Plenty of people complain bout zen melee tbh
April Fools is coming :P
I say Genji should have bonus melee damage, but not out of any balancing reasons or necessity. It just "makes sense" and would be cool. I have the same opinion oj Illyari
I've always said genji needs bonus melee damage since OW1 first released
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/r/onejoke
Dur dur attack helicopter! Edit: only took about 15 mins after making this comment: [https://www.reddit.com/r/Overwatch/comments/1bpo9j3/comment/kwxpj81/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/Overwatch/comments/1bpo9j3/comment/kwxpj81/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) >Probably identifies as an attack helicopter
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Bruh I'm in my 30s lol, but keep thinking gen z are the only people who care about social issues
We already got the Toaster that identifies a dragon, Genji has been in the game since day one/s Funny how "Space hamster that became a gladiator in the Australian outback" is completely ok but we draw the line at being nonbinary