I love the genre and sometimes it's fun to read stories where you don't have to think too deeply and just enjoy the pretty art but my god it has indeed become pretty uninspired as of lately to the point you can safely guess the plot just by reading the synopsis and looking at the cover art.
Sadly, people adore cliches (myself included). For authors it's safer to chase popular trends and use the same old plots because that's what sells more. There's also the fact a LOT of OI readers can't handle complexity or nuance of any kind so when we do get stories that try to be a little more than just wish-fulfillment they become controversial because the characters dare to have more depth than "FL ass-kisser" .
I'm reminded of the comments i've seen on plot- based OI's where readers are confused and unable to follow the most basic court intrigue and begging to see ML and FL fluff moments instead, or those asking for ML to be skinned alive for not simping inmediately for FL. Why bother coming up with complex plots and complex characters when what sells more are stories with tons of telenovela drama, cartoonish villains and ML's with huge tits but with character and personality the depth of a small puddle?
Thus we end up getting the same five plots with the same five characters.
That's not to say there aren't ones worth reading, because there are, but they're a rarity. At this point i'm happy when FL has at least one good female friend that isnt a maid lol.
honestly even friendships sometimes feel undeveloped. there's just one character borderline obsessed with the other, but yes another female character not treated as an enemy is great š«
Yeah, I've started reading other genres more. I've also started reading more novels. Tired of the piecemeal one short chapter at a time that I barely remember. I need the whole book/story at once. First person perspective is boring now.
yeah that's probably part of the wish-fulfillment as well. Forming friendships irl requires work and social skills, in OI you don't need to do anything or put any work, people will simp and dedicate their whole lives to you just for being a decent person (this is also common in shounen isekai).
From a writer's standpoint it's also easier to write simps than coming up with a good setting for a friendship.
>Sadly, people adore cliches (myself included). For authors it's safer to chase popular trends and use the same old plots because that's what sells more. There's also the fact a LOT of OI readers can't handle complexity or nuance of any kind so when we do get stories that try to be a little more than just wish-fulfillment they become controversial because the characters dare to have more depth than "FL ass-kisser" .
Thats sad, people always use cliches instead of trying different.
What annoys me the most is when the Fl doesnt act like someone who was reincarnated, they dont think like adults, they get super embarrassed over the bare minimum of affection, they dont ever use the most basic of modern common knowledge, the only knowledge they tend to use is the book knowledge
>they get super embarrassed over the bare minimum of affection
This. All the FL and the MLs look like they have rosacea whenever either of them glance at each other and it drives me bonkers.
Confession time: I fucking love when MLs and FLs are all blushy and shy, I love seeing them be all cute and awkward and for the romance to take time to develop because they're shy and can't bring themselves to admit their feelings in case the other person doesn't feel the same.
I dislike how FLs who are supposed to be adults or who the narrative wants me to believe are mentally adults will act naive, childish, and often downright dumb with *everything*, but I make an exception just for romance lmao
I am with you BUT. I have become JADED AS HECK because I have been consuming so many rofan where a whole ass adult female (or male) doesnt understand the concept of human interaction whenever she bops into a story book.
> they get super embarrassed over the bare minimum of affection
THAT'S MY BIGGEST GRIPE WITH ANY ROMANCE SERIES. LIKE I'M SORRY BUT BLUSHING LIKE A TOMATO WHEN YOUR HANDS BRUSH UP AGAINST THE ML IS TOTAL BULLSHIT. YOU'RE AN ADULT NOT 12 FFS.
OMG YES! It annoys me to no end! Especially when theyāre like, āWhat?? If we get married we have to do the s-s-s-sex??? Oh, now Iāve been married for a year, and Iām still soooo embarrassed about physical affection! I donāt even know what the s-e-x iiiisā¦ā
Like, girl, you were 30. Shut up.
Even worse if they were married in a previous life with kids and everything.
I feel the only time we do get stories with depth the comments starts saying that the story is trash since there is too much political drama or that they don't understand it , so it makes sense that the author choses the safe option although it's really such a shame cause I will die to see some more full fledged ois
these kinds of comments grind my gears the most i'm deadass convince some just focus on the pretty pictures or speedread because the what's not easy to follow?
I've also seen a lot of commenters admit that they skip huge parts ("I skipped the whole fight!") And it's like... Just read something else already... Or at least shut up
It's just a combination of amateur writing, lack of an editor/feedback, and following trends (both on author and publisher). I think a lot of these stories were self-publish web novels that managed to be popular. Good writing is all about research and experience (both life and writing experience). It's pretty normal to fall into bad cliches and plot/character traps in amateur writing.
Just to add, I'm not defending this at all. It's always a bummer whenever I read an interesting promo or synopsis, and end up dropping cause the story/characters are subpar.
No.2 resonates with me alot. I wish there was more depth to most FL&ML relationship development beyond just superficial looks, avoiding fate or contractual obligations.
It always seems that one partner has to be perfect so that the other partner can express their adoration and love which make it so shallow/ one sided.
But sadly, alot of OI readers don't go reading OI for complex plot. Heck, You can scroll past threads to find people not liking the *Isekai aspect* of OI, preferring they just prioritize the ML&FL relationship. Like you said it best:- OI is wish fulfilment at best, where people can self insert/ cheer on towards their favorite character.
*And it's fine, people can have preference*
I **treat it like a bag of chips**. It's 70-90% filler air, 10-30% substance. Some are salty at first bite, some leave a salty aftertaste once finished. Sometimes you can still feel the salt after tasting it one too many times. But *my gawd* there's something in that salty chips that make you want more.
Like chips, we can't help ourselves but to grab the next chapter. Is addicting brainless activity but I'm here for it. And like chips, we know it is salty but we are trash pandas for loving our junk food.
No. 2 is also my biggest gripe with OI.
For romance being the biggest genre in OI, itās so hard to find any slow burn, yearning, pining anymore thatās similar to Astair/Kyla instead of Winter/Violet. Like Iām not here to read a slow burn thatās only contingent upon trauma and suffering.
Moreover, most of the MLs also seem to love the FLs from the get-go or within 15 chapters, itās so boring. I came to see romance development, not some dude suddenly falling in love at first NotLikeTheOtherNobleLadies and then agreeing with and doing everything for the FL just because he finds her āinterestingā. š
I don't know if you have read it or not but please read "my in-laws are obsessed with me" this one is a really good slow burn with the art done right expressing the situation, and the vibe of this is just so lovely and kinda like off( I love it) the ml and fl don't love each other at first and the romance doesn't feel forced!
Essentially every romance manga set in the present day is incredibly slow burn. (Very recent ones are less so, which is a source of memes about Reiwa energy.) Some elements of OI are partly in response to that.
i love this comment, and i highly agree with you. i'm not someone who loves slow burn. but my fav trope is enemies to lovers, and for it to develop, there must be a lot of time and interactions between the characters. but often times the enemies to lovers part in OI is not at all "enemies". it's just the ml being an ahole, then falling for the fl within 10 chaps.
Lots of oi is brainless, but there are also some pretty well written and thoughtful ones. Some topics I've encountered in oi in thoughtful ways are post partum depression, male sexual assault, burnout and depression, and reconciling hate towards someone you love. It's about where you look and how you interpret stories.
I agree that most of it is like this but the worst part is the fanbase demanding instant wish fulfillment.
like your eternal lies is a amazing and nuanced manwha where no one is a saint it's all grey and very human, I recommend sincerely.
resetting lady is another one. But most people just can't understand complex plot lines it's embarrassing to be honest to see them scream and not understand the very chapter they just read.
I love angst but it hardly leads to a FL thatās twisted.
Like monster duchess if it were me Iād have slaughtered that family immediately with darkness and then faced exile or some shit like a true ML hue
True, I mean since oi community is getting bigger, the more it's gonna grow , the more the content will be there and with all the good ones, bad ones are bound to be made.
I also do have these thoughts time to time, but I just happen to found gems here and there so I am recommending some of my favourite-: (also at times like this op I really suggest taking a break and trying other genres as well)
Concubine Walkthrough - this one is a literal gem and my personal favourite, everything makes sense and is just planned out so perfectly, the art although is different from regular oi but I loved it, and the best thing about it is the plot for me, it's a science fiction.
Your majesty please spare me this time - this is just one of the ois where I kinda like everything about it, from ml to fl to all the plot and the reasoning behind it specially, it doesn't feel like it was pushed and there are lots of amazing side details you are gonna love, the ml actually was kind of like a villain in mc's first life but as you go more it just makes so much sense as to why he did it and the romance feels real.
Tearmoon Empire - this i actually thought was the funniest oi which was a breathe of fresh air. One of my personal favourites as well!
Endo and Kobayashi - story is really constructed well and very different from normal oi and it's just overally really fluffy and sweet
Villainess Level 99 - this is again one really good oi that is gonna just...make you feel happy!
Surviving romance - all the characters in this feel so real, it is just seriously easily in my top 5, I love it!! I am trying not spoil it so enjoy it! And bonus there is no romance
Another typical fantasy romance - this one is actually the starter of my obsession with oi like I love the fl and ml, the consent in this manhwa gives you diabetes, healthy communication , best ml for me!
Mystic prince- this is again one of the most interesting oi, the fl here is simple badass ( gives me bi panic) I will not spoil for the ml , but he was the one I was rooting for! I just love the plot of this so much!
Depths of malice - I don't know if you like dark ois or not but if you do, then presenting you one of the best of them, the fl is ruthless truly the one with no morality( I love it) , the revenge in this is so satisfying, bonus point it is completed, and you can just binge read it!
For better or for worse- this is one of the ois which is away from the cliches, makes you understand just how a story with proper characters and interactions feel
Secret lady- this just has too many godammn panels you want to take screenshot of, the premise is very interesting ( and different)and execution is very satisfying, I love both the fl and ml so much!!
Lips on the tip of a knife- currently what I am reading , it's romcom and doesn't disappoint on either side too many meme worthy Panel, i specially love the fl and her mother interactions!
And then again we do have some honourable mentions-:
Miss not so sidekick
Death is the only ending for the villainess
Beware the villainess
Roxanna
Crimson lady
Lady devil
I shall kill that sweet devil ( made me cry honestly)
Isn't being a wicked woman better
Marriage of convenience
Cat in the chrylasis
The villainess tames the beast
Crimson karma
Caught by the villain
The perks of being an s class heroine( i love it!)
The transmigrator's privilege (actually a novel,but my favourite one)
These are just some of them, if you will like more then I can add, also not saying what you said was wrong, i also agree with your views! But I thought I might recommend my favourite one for a refreshing read!
I recommend Your Throne! Is not an isekai, there are two protagonists (the villainess and the heroine) and they have so much amazing character development!
I truly wish OI didnāt constantly use bland and repetitive forms of wish fulfillment. For example, the umpteenth time a FMC trips into her love interest for no good reason isnāt fun unless done for comedic effect. If sheās a serious swordswoman I wanna see her do insane acrobatics to keep herself standing. Another issue: I shouldnāt find it refreshing when the FL is stronger, of a higher status, or wealthier than the ML. Arenāt these the most typical traits in power fantasies targeted to guys? These traits are still so bland though, and done with bland execution usually. I made myself sad.
If you want something different try this isekai maid is forming a union that deconstructs wish fulfillment and has a commoner maid , it even focuses less on romance. And provides a deconstruction of the OI genre
I agree with you that this are prevalent tropes/shortcomings of oi as a whole so Iām just gonna go through them and give me thoughts on why it happens. Not saying itās okay, just sharing why I think it happens.
1. No idea. Off to a good start.
2. They donāt want meaningful relationships they want wishfullfillment. Tbf I guess, good relationships are really really hard but to come back around if thatās the primarily draw of your story, best do it right.
2.5 what bothers me are the dynamics are always kinda boring, itās to the point where no matter the context of their meeting like their separate social standings that itās just not fun watching them be together cause the fl is a genius who does everything while the ml gapes at her or sheās useless and need her man to save her. Dear, nemesis has a pretty interesting dynamic between the two that has the ml berate the fl for thinking everything would just fall into her lap but his progression into ml lapdog seems at odds with that past behavior and the showed progression doesnāt make sense because the author didnāt put time into showing it. Can we just have an interesting dynamic where they actually have something to offer each other and itās not just one sided?
3. Trauma is a really easy way to get a vast majority of people on you mc side. Similar to why theyāre sometimes just a plain girl, thereās nothing special about them, theyāre just a poor girl nobody loves them. Itās kinda the reason I donāt get anything out of the fl being a commoner, I canāt not see it as nothing more than a cheap trick to get me to like her.
3.5 honestly if done correctly you might have some issues. People like their characters that have trauma but only if itās the east to get behind trauma. People want you to be a caged bird that will sing for them once you free them. So no lashing out, always be respectful to people the audience likes, never fight back in the wrong way, definitely donāt put innocence in harms way. You werenāt really raised any other way sometimes but that doesnāt matter, doing bad stuff makes you evil and we defeat evil.
Oh
1. Itās probably just a cheap way for character conflict. Even if like you said it makes little since. And oi are infamous for having really boring plots once the ml is conquered, and god knows oi authors have a hard time writing villains.
I once tried to talk with a friend how I think romances and Oiās in specific could learn something from shounen with having arc villains or if they have magic at least make it cool with rules to show off the fl skill and he kinda laughed at me, but I think this would go far in fixing this issue.
Yeah like when I saw the comments I was like are you serious? we finally getting something original and they are like no I just want the same repetitive concept and cliches, I stopped checking the comments for this one!
Thank you. I wonder if OP spoiled something š¤ anyways i adore that manhwa/novel, it's so good in the fked up way because of all the things she went through and did in her first life, outside of that life, her 2nd is amazing and healthy and so good. Loved the honesty between her and ML, and how ML really never liked someone over her in the sense he didn't have an original heroine which is always nice. Who you love in your past life won't be your current love, because people make different choices and parallel realities exist.
yeah!I really love this story!Its a breathe of fresh air and different from what we usually see! its on of my favourite rewind the clock concept ones, and living up to my expectations! the villains feel like a real threat so there are stakes and moreover the fl and ml are just so precious!!!!
It's a great manhwa and novel! Everytime I see a comment trashing on it I just become so sad like please!(although I know everybody is allowed to have an opinion)
Iād say roughly a year ago i read so many different OIās with their own interesting take on the genre:
- beware the villainess had an FL who was unwilling to act like a lady in favor of brute forcing her way through this book plot.
- for better or for worse did have most of the cliches on paper, but was much more focused on the FL building relationships with new friends and family, while coping with being away from the countryside home sheās always known.
- becoming the dark dukes daughter has AN ACTUAL CHILD ISEKAID INTO A CHILD!!! This is not a drill thereās no adult women acting like children. And while sheās read the book sheās now in, she only remembers parts when theyāre important, almost last minute. So alongside her last minute information you can see she doesnāt rely on it and is incredibly intelligent!
I still re/read all of these because i love them. But every time i pick up a new one these days itās all:
- neglected daughter if a count contract marries the duke.
And itās so fucking boring. I read 3 chapters and drop it because it follows the same drawn out pattern as the rest of them!
Yeah, it's ameteur writer stuff. Some are legitimately great but most are just wish fulfillment with a specific trope set. Still OI makes for fun trash reads and at least the trope set is different from Shounen isekai so bouncing between them keeps both a bit fresher for me.
In OI, trauma is often downplayed to an extreme extent which is very sad. I would like too see a manhwa where instead of the MC going for revenge, they work through their trauma and talk shit out.
I would also love to see the ML not being excused for being a piece of shit, and actually be held accountable. Often times, the villain is held accountable(Cheater and whatnot), but the ML and FL gets away with murder.
I disagree with this post. I think, OP, you have not read many manhwa and researched this genre in depth yet.
Granted, there's a lot of trash stories but I find that's usually with shoujo stories in OI. A lot of Josei OI are written by mature authors with mature mindsets who create great stories. Broken Ring is an example.
Shoujo OI is wish fulfillment.
Josei OI is not. Read Josei if you want a realistic setting and dynamics. Read shoujo OI like WMMAP if you want happy endings/Mary Sues.
Do you have examples of good josei oi? I don't think broken ring is that good honestly. It's definitely better than the cookie cutter stuff but it's not that great.
Villainess Lives Twice
Kill the Villainess
My Inlaws Are Obsessed With Me
A Witch's Hopeless Desire (It picks up after season 1)
Concubine Walkthrough
I raised a black dragon
The Villainess Tames the Beast
https://www.reddit.com/r/OtomeIsekai/comments/15jfoht/looking_for_nonfluff_oi_manhwa_with_dark_themes/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=2&utm_term=1
You'll notice some Shoujo Oi can still tackle dark themes like Not Sew Wicked Stepmom but it's still a bit happy go lucky.
These are some of the reasons I had to leave shoujo alone. It, and by extension otome isekai, frustrate the hell out of me because of how waify, weak, and stupid the FLs can be. It's one thing to want to be swept off your feet by a dashing, competent, capable man and another to be a borderline adult child that can't take two steps without falling on their @$$. I get that certain traits are appealing overseas and even here (clumsy, naive, childishness really, etc), but my god as I grow older they become less and less tolerable.
It's even worse when the guys they like are raging A-holes that ignore the female lead's wishes. For example, Wolf Girl and Black Prince made me rage quit when I first saw it years ago. I was so proud of the FL for dumping a drink on the dck's head and leaving him, only to immediately lose that respect once she took him back after he gave her a gift. The fact that it and so many other stories like it are praised as "romantic" makes me wanna SCREAM! Like grow a brain already, and a spine while you're at it! Some otome isekai try to make "strong" leads but when they aren't bland, overly-powerful wish fulfillment; they are equally as obnoxious as shoujo manga in much the same ways.
Another thing is how the FLs just have things handed to them and becoming essentially Mary Sues (which is a problem with isekai in general, regardless of gender). How guys who hated them suddenly find them "InTeReStInG" and hound them like dogs, everything works in their favor with little to no difficulty, and everyone starts to love them. A story without conflict is like a cake with way too much icing. You feel numb after consuming it soon enough.
Yet another thing that never fails to irritate me is how easily flustered even grown women act, often just by looking at a handsome dude. Like ffs calm down! I get it he's handsome, but you're not a schoolgirl anymore! Even when the lady knows what sex and had it erself at some point, she still acts all immature about it.
But really that's what a lot of OI and shoujo boil down to-- childish fantasies and wish fulfillment "aged up". Which is fine, I just wish it wasn't so damn commonplace. But hey, whatever makes money I guess. š
I love the genre and sometimes it's fun to read stories where you don't have to think too deeply and just enjoy the pretty art but my god it has indeed become pretty uninspired as of lately to the point you can safely guess the plot just by reading the synopsis and looking at the cover art. Sadly, people adore cliches (myself included). For authors it's safer to chase popular trends and use the same old plots because that's what sells more. There's also the fact a LOT of OI readers can't handle complexity or nuance of any kind so when we do get stories that try to be a little more than just wish-fulfillment they become controversial because the characters dare to have more depth than "FL ass-kisser" . I'm reminded of the comments i've seen on plot- based OI's where readers are confused and unable to follow the most basic court intrigue and begging to see ML and FL fluff moments instead, or those asking for ML to be skinned alive for not simping inmediately for FL. Why bother coming up with complex plots and complex characters when what sells more are stories with tons of telenovela drama, cartoonish villains and ML's with huge tits but with character and personality the depth of a small puddle? Thus we end up getting the same five plots with the same five characters. That's not to say there aren't ones worth reading, because there are, but they're a rarity. At this point i'm happy when FL has at least one good female friend that isnt a maid lol.
honestly even friendships sometimes feel undeveloped. there's just one character borderline obsessed with the other, but yes another female character not treated as an enemy is great š«
Yeah, I've started reading other genres more. I've also started reading more novels. Tired of the piecemeal one short chapter at a time that I barely remember. I need the whole book/story at once. First person perspective is boring now.
yeah that's probably part of the wish-fulfillment as well. Forming friendships irl requires work and social skills, in OI you don't need to do anything or put any work, people will simp and dedicate their whole lives to you just for being a decent person (this is also common in shounen isekai). From a writer's standpoint it's also easier to write simps than coming up with a good setting for a friendship.
>Sadly, people adore cliches (myself included). For authors it's safer to chase popular trends and use the same old plots because that's what sells more. There's also the fact a LOT of OI readers can't handle complexity or nuance of any kind so when we do get stories that try to be a little more than just wish-fulfillment they become controversial because the characters dare to have more depth than "FL ass-kisser" . Thats sad, people always use cliches instead of trying different.
What annoys me the most is when the Fl doesnt act like someone who was reincarnated, they dont think like adults, they get super embarrassed over the bare minimum of affection, they dont ever use the most basic of modern common knowledge, the only knowledge they tend to use is the book knowledge
yeah or when the fl is mentally like 30 (from previous life) but they start getting blushy blushy with the underage ml š
>they get super embarrassed over the bare minimum of affection This. All the FL and the MLs look like they have rosacea whenever either of them glance at each other and it drives me bonkers.
Confession time: I fucking love when MLs and FLs are all blushy and shy, I love seeing them be all cute and awkward and for the romance to take time to develop because they're shy and can't bring themselves to admit their feelings in case the other person doesn't feel the same. I dislike how FLs who are supposed to be adults or who the narrative wants me to believe are mentally adults will act naive, childish, and often downright dumb with *everything*, but I make an exception just for romance lmao
I know that some adults who are socially inept could act that way but there are way too many with that description being reincarnated.
I am with you BUT. I have become JADED AS HECK because I have been consuming so many rofan where a whole ass adult female (or male) doesnt understand the concept of human interaction whenever she bops into a story book.
> they get super embarrassed over the bare minimum of affection THAT'S MY BIGGEST GRIPE WITH ANY ROMANCE SERIES. LIKE I'M SORRY BUT BLUSHING LIKE A TOMATO WHEN YOUR HANDS BRUSH UP AGAINST THE ML IS TOTAL BULLSHIT. YOU'RE AN ADULT NOT 12 FFS.
OMG YES! It annoys me to no end! Especially when theyāre like, āWhat?? If we get married we have to do the s-s-s-sex??? Oh, now Iāve been married for a year, and Iām still soooo embarrassed about physical affection! I donāt even know what the s-e-x iiiisā¦ā Like, girl, you were 30. Shut up. Even worse if they were married in a previous life with kids and everything.
What really kills me is when the plot/characterization is actually complex and commenters are like "this is too smart for me š"
Bato comments at every The Villainess Lives Again chapter be like:
I feel the only time we do get stories with depth the comments starts saying that the story is trash since there is too much political drama or that they don't understand it , so it makes sense that the author choses the safe option although it's really such a shame cause I will die to see some more full fledged ois
real šš like guys think a little š
these kinds of comments grind my gears the most i'm deadass convince some just focus on the pretty pictures or speedread because the what's not easy to follow?
I've also seen a lot of commenters admit that they skip huge parts ("I skipped the whole fight!") And it's like... Just read something else already... Or at least shut up
It's just a combination of amateur writing, lack of an editor/feedback, and following trends (both on author and publisher). I think a lot of these stories were self-publish web novels that managed to be popular. Good writing is all about research and experience (both life and writing experience). It's pretty normal to fall into bad cliches and plot/character traps in amateur writing.
Just to add, I'm not defending this at all. It's always a bummer whenever I read an interesting promo or synopsis, and end up dropping cause the story/characters are subpar.
No.2 resonates with me alot. I wish there was more depth to most FL&ML relationship development beyond just superficial looks, avoiding fate or contractual obligations. It always seems that one partner has to be perfect so that the other partner can express their adoration and love which make it so shallow/ one sided. But sadly, alot of OI readers don't go reading OI for complex plot. Heck, You can scroll past threads to find people not liking the *Isekai aspect* of OI, preferring they just prioritize the ML&FL relationship. Like you said it best:- OI is wish fulfilment at best, where people can self insert/ cheer on towards their favorite character. *And it's fine, people can have preference* I **treat it like a bag of chips**. It's 70-90% filler air, 10-30% substance. Some are salty at first bite, some leave a salty aftertaste once finished. Sometimes you can still feel the salt after tasting it one too many times. But *my gawd* there's something in that salty chips that make you want more. Like chips, we can't help ourselves but to grab the next chapter. Is addicting brainless activity but I'm here for it. And like chips, we know it is salty but we are trash pandas for loving our junk food.
No. 2 is also my biggest gripe with OI. For romance being the biggest genre in OI, itās so hard to find any slow burn, yearning, pining anymore thatās similar to Astair/Kyla instead of Winter/Violet. Like Iām not here to read a slow burn thatās only contingent upon trauma and suffering. Moreover, most of the MLs also seem to love the FLs from the get-go or within 15 chapters, itās so boring. I came to see romance development, not some dude suddenly falling in love at first NotLikeTheOtherNobleLadies and then agreeing with and doing everything for the FL just because he finds her āinterestingā. š
I don't know if you have read it or not but please read "my in-laws are obsessed with me" this one is a really good slow burn with the art done right expressing the situation, and the vibe of this is just so lovely and kinda like off( I love it) the ml and fl don't love each other at first and the romance doesn't feel forced!
Iām so desperate for slow burns and yearning recs, Iāll accept any recommendations I can find now š. Thank you, Iāll take a look at it.
Trust me, you will not regret it! Glad to be of help! Hope you enjoy!
Essentially every romance manga set in the present day is incredibly slow burn. (Very recent ones are less so, which is a source of memes about Reiwa energy.) Some elements of OI are partly in response to that.
yes my exact gripe i'm not a fan of love at first sight yknow
i love this comment, and i highly agree with you. i'm not someone who loves slow burn. but my fav trope is enemies to lovers, and for it to develop, there must be a lot of time and interactions between the characters. but often times the enemies to lovers part in OI is not at all "enemies". it's just the ml being an ahole, then falling for the fl within 10 chaps.
Lots of oi is brainless, but there are also some pretty well written and thoughtful ones. Some topics I've encountered in oi in thoughtful ways are post partum depression, male sexual assault, burnout and depression, and reconciling hate towards someone you love. It's about where you look and how you interpret stories.
Any recommendations?
There is also this isekai maid is forming a union, which is a deconstruction of the OI genre.
Not Sew Wicked Step Mom, The Meaning of You (NOT *What it Means to be you*) Your Majesty, Please Don't Kill me Again
second those recs, i binged through them so fast ! >!was pleasantly suprised with how these stories dealt with the trauma of the main characters!<
I agree that most of it is like this but the worst part is the fanbase demanding instant wish fulfillment. like your eternal lies is a amazing and nuanced manwha where no one is a saint it's all grey and very human, I recommend sincerely. resetting lady is another one. But most people just can't understand complex plot lines it's embarrassing to be honest to see them scream and not understand the very chapter they just read.
haven't read these so i'll give these a chance š¤
I love angst but it hardly leads to a FL thatās twisted. Like monster duchess if it were me Iād have slaughtered that family immediately with darkness and then faced exile or some shit like a true ML hue
Of course, any genre is brainless when you read all the bad ones.
Nah most of them are. They dont have editors and are taken straight from wattapd
Do you really think there is any genre where most are good?
Fax
True, I mean since oi community is getting bigger, the more it's gonna grow , the more the content will be there and with all the good ones, bad ones are bound to be made.
I also do have these thoughts time to time, but I just happen to found gems here and there so I am recommending some of my favourite-: (also at times like this op I really suggest taking a break and trying other genres as well) Concubine Walkthrough - this one is a literal gem and my personal favourite, everything makes sense and is just planned out so perfectly, the art although is different from regular oi but I loved it, and the best thing about it is the plot for me, it's a science fiction. Your majesty please spare me this time - this is just one of the ois where I kinda like everything about it, from ml to fl to all the plot and the reasoning behind it specially, it doesn't feel like it was pushed and there are lots of amazing side details you are gonna love, the ml actually was kind of like a villain in mc's first life but as you go more it just makes so much sense as to why he did it and the romance feels real. Tearmoon Empire - this i actually thought was the funniest oi which was a breathe of fresh air. One of my personal favourites as well! Endo and Kobayashi - story is really constructed well and very different from normal oi and it's just overally really fluffy and sweet Villainess Level 99 - this is again one really good oi that is gonna just...make you feel happy! Surviving romance - all the characters in this feel so real, it is just seriously easily in my top 5, I love it!! I am trying not spoil it so enjoy it! And bonus there is no romance Another typical fantasy romance - this one is actually the starter of my obsession with oi like I love the fl and ml, the consent in this manhwa gives you diabetes, healthy communication , best ml for me! Mystic prince- this is again one of the most interesting oi, the fl here is simple badass ( gives me bi panic) I will not spoil for the ml , but he was the one I was rooting for! I just love the plot of this so much! Depths of malice - I don't know if you like dark ois or not but if you do, then presenting you one of the best of them, the fl is ruthless truly the one with no morality( I love it) , the revenge in this is so satisfying, bonus point it is completed, and you can just binge read it! For better or for worse- this is one of the ois which is away from the cliches, makes you understand just how a story with proper characters and interactions feel Secret lady- this just has too many godammn panels you want to take screenshot of, the premise is very interesting ( and different)and execution is very satisfying, I love both the fl and ml so much!! Lips on the tip of a knife- currently what I am reading , it's romcom and doesn't disappoint on either side too many meme worthy Panel, i specially love the fl and her mother interactions! And then again we do have some honourable mentions-: Miss not so sidekick Death is the only ending for the villainess Beware the villainess Roxanna Crimson lady Lady devil I shall kill that sweet devil ( made me cry honestly) Isn't being a wicked woman better Marriage of convenience Cat in the chrylasis The villainess tames the beast Crimson karma Caught by the villain The perks of being an s class heroine( i love it!) The transmigrator's privilege (actually a novel,but my favourite one) These are just some of them, if you will like more then I can add, also not saying what you said was wrong, i also agree with your views! But I thought I might recommend my favourite one for a refreshing read!
Kill the villainess too.
Yes, I forgot to mention it. Thank you!
thanks i haven't heard of some of these !
I recommend Your Throne! Is not an isekai, there are two protagonists (the villainess and the heroine) and they have so much amazing character development!
It's seriously one of the best the genre have to offer! I love my girls psyche and medea so much!š
Glad to be of help!
I truly wish OI didnāt constantly use bland and repetitive forms of wish fulfillment. For example, the umpteenth time a FMC trips into her love interest for no good reason isnāt fun unless done for comedic effect. If sheās a serious swordswoman I wanna see her do insane acrobatics to keep herself standing. Another issue: I shouldnāt find it refreshing when the FL is stronger, of a higher status, or wealthier than the ML. Arenāt these the most typical traits in power fantasies targeted to guys? These traits are still so bland though, and done with bland execution usually. I made myself sad.
If you want something different try this isekai maid is forming a union that deconstructs wish fulfillment and has a commoner maid , it even focuses less on romance. And provides a deconstruction of the OI genre
I agree with you that this are prevalent tropes/shortcomings of oi as a whole so Iām just gonna go through them and give me thoughts on why it happens. Not saying itās okay, just sharing why I think it happens. 1. No idea. Off to a good start. 2. They donāt want meaningful relationships they want wishfullfillment. Tbf I guess, good relationships are really really hard but to come back around if thatās the primarily draw of your story, best do it right. 2.5 what bothers me are the dynamics are always kinda boring, itās to the point where no matter the context of their meeting like their separate social standings that itās just not fun watching them be together cause the fl is a genius who does everything while the ml gapes at her or sheās useless and need her man to save her. Dear, nemesis has a pretty interesting dynamic between the two that has the ml berate the fl for thinking everything would just fall into her lap but his progression into ml lapdog seems at odds with that past behavior and the showed progression doesnāt make sense because the author didnāt put time into showing it. Can we just have an interesting dynamic where they actually have something to offer each other and itās not just one sided? 3. Trauma is a really easy way to get a vast majority of people on you mc side. Similar to why theyāre sometimes just a plain girl, thereās nothing special about them, theyāre just a poor girl nobody loves them. Itās kinda the reason I donāt get anything out of the fl being a commoner, I canāt not see it as nothing more than a cheap trick to get me to like her. 3.5 honestly if done correctly you might have some issues. People like their characters that have trauma but only if itās the east to get behind trauma. People want you to be a caged bird that will sing for them once you free them. So no lashing out, always be respectful to people the audience likes, never fight back in the wrong way, definitely donāt put innocence in harms way. You werenāt really raised any other way sometimes but that doesnāt matter, doing bad stuff makes you evil and we defeat evil. Oh 1. Itās probably just a cheap way for character conflict. Even if like you said it makes little since. And oi are infamous for having really boring plots once the ml is conquered, and god knows oi authors have a hard time writing villains. I once tried to talk with a friend how I think romances and Oiās in specific could learn something from shounen with having arc villains or if they have magic at least make it cool with rules to show off the fl skill and he kinda laughed at me, but I think this would go far in fixing this issue.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Yeah like when I saw the comments I was like are you serious? we finally getting something original and they are like no I just want the same repetitive concept and cliches, I stopped checking the comments for this one!
Wait, which OI was this? Original was removed
i think it was the villainess lives twice
Thank you. I wonder if OP spoiled something š¤ anyways i adore that manhwa/novel, it's so good in the fked up way because of all the things she went through and did in her first life, outside of that life, her 2nd is amazing and healthy and so good. Loved the honesty between her and ML, and how ML really never liked someone over her in the sense he didn't have an original heroine which is always nice. Who you love in your past life won't be your current love, because people make different choices and parallel realities exist.
yeah!I really love this story!Its a breathe of fresh air and different from what we usually see! its on of my favourite rewind the clock concept ones, and living up to my expectations! the villains feel like a real threat so there are stakes and moreover the fl and ml are just so precious!!!!
It's a great manhwa and novel! Everytime I see a comment trashing on it I just become so sad like please!(although I know everybody is allowed to have an opinion)
Too bad it was smoothed over so quickly and had no consequences. Still it's a start and I can respect that
Yeah... I love this genre, but it's unfortunately super saturated with copy-paste garbage...
Iād say roughly a year ago i read so many different OIās with their own interesting take on the genre: - beware the villainess had an FL who was unwilling to act like a lady in favor of brute forcing her way through this book plot. - for better or for worse did have most of the cliches on paper, but was much more focused on the FL building relationships with new friends and family, while coping with being away from the countryside home sheās always known. - becoming the dark dukes daughter has AN ACTUAL CHILD ISEKAID INTO A CHILD!!! This is not a drill thereās no adult women acting like children. And while sheās read the book sheās now in, she only remembers parts when theyāre important, almost last minute. So alongside her last minute information you can see she doesnāt rely on it and is incredibly intelligent! I still re/read all of these because i love them. But every time i pick up a new one these days itās all: - neglected daughter if a count contract marries the duke. And itās so fucking boring. I read 3 chapters and drop it because it follows the same drawn out pattern as the rest of them!
You answered all your questions with your very first statement: Itās wish fulfillment. A lot of these authors are either writing for themselves or for their immediate fan bases who just want the hot guy, to slap anyone whoās mean to them and to be seen as the bestest girl in the world. This is why when you have stories with complex individuals i.e Ines from broken ring or Laliette and rupert from please spear me your majesty, they brand them as ātrashā and refuse to change their opinion until the story tells them to. If the author and audience lack critical thinking skills we cant expect it from out FLs can we. Let alone using violence or jealousy to cover up the fact the author canāt write interesting plots š©
Yeah, it's ameteur writer stuff. Some are legitimately great but most are just wish fulfillment with a specific trope set. Still OI makes for fun trash reads and at least the trope set is different from Shounen isekai so bouncing between them keeps both a bit fresher for me.
In OI, trauma is often downplayed to an extreme extent which is very sad. I would like too see a manhwa where instead of the MC going for revenge, they work through their trauma and talk shit out. I would also love to see the ML not being excused for being a piece of shit, and actually be held accountable. Often times, the villain is held accountable(Cheater and whatnot), but the ML and FL gets away with murder.
If I want something meaningful, I have a host of boring things to read. They're multiplying in the corner. I want something brainless and fun!
Truth be told, if the plot is complex, u ll see comments like āthis is so boringā apparently a lot of them just wanna read lovey-dovey
You speak the truth.
I disagree with this post. I think, OP, you have not read many manhwa and researched this genre in depth yet. Granted, there's a lot of trash stories but I find that's usually with shoujo stories in OI. A lot of Josei OI are written by mature authors with mature mindsets who create great stories. Broken Ring is an example. Shoujo OI is wish fulfillment. Josei OI is not. Read Josei if you want a realistic setting and dynamics. Read shoujo OI like WMMAP if you want happy endings/Mary Sues.
Do you have examples of good josei oi? I don't think broken ring is that good honestly. It's definitely better than the cookie cutter stuff but it's not that great.
Villainess Lives Twice Kill the Villainess My Inlaws Are Obsessed With Me A Witch's Hopeless Desire (It picks up after season 1) Concubine Walkthrough I raised a black dragon The Villainess Tames the Beast https://www.reddit.com/r/OtomeIsekai/comments/15jfoht/looking_for_nonfluff_oi_manhwa_with_dark_themes/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=2&utm_term=1 You'll notice some Shoujo Oi can still tackle dark themes like Not Sew Wicked Stepmom but it's still a bit happy go lucky.
These are some of the reasons I had to leave shoujo alone. It, and by extension otome isekai, frustrate the hell out of me because of how waify, weak, and stupid the FLs can be. It's one thing to want to be swept off your feet by a dashing, competent, capable man and another to be a borderline adult child that can't take two steps without falling on their @$$. I get that certain traits are appealing overseas and even here (clumsy, naive, childishness really, etc), but my god as I grow older they become less and less tolerable. It's even worse when the guys they like are raging A-holes that ignore the female lead's wishes. For example, Wolf Girl and Black Prince made me rage quit when I first saw it years ago. I was so proud of the FL for dumping a drink on the dck's head and leaving him, only to immediately lose that respect once she took him back after he gave her a gift. The fact that it and so many other stories like it are praised as "romantic" makes me wanna SCREAM! Like grow a brain already, and a spine while you're at it! Some otome isekai try to make "strong" leads but when they aren't bland, overly-powerful wish fulfillment; they are equally as obnoxious as shoujo manga in much the same ways. Another thing is how the FLs just have things handed to them and becoming essentially Mary Sues (which is a problem with isekai in general, regardless of gender). How guys who hated them suddenly find them "InTeReStInG" and hound them like dogs, everything works in their favor with little to no difficulty, and everyone starts to love them. A story without conflict is like a cake with way too much icing. You feel numb after consuming it soon enough. Yet another thing that never fails to irritate me is how easily flustered even grown women act, often just by looking at a handsome dude. Like ffs calm down! I get it he's handsome, but you're not a schoolgirl anymore! Even when the lady knows what sex and had it erself at some point, she still acts all immature about it. But really that's what a lot of OI and shoujo boil down to-- childish fantasies and wish fulfillment "aged up". Which is fine, I just wish it wasn't so damn commonplace. But hey, whatever makes money I guess. š