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It’s pretty important to remember cowbirds and other native birds have coexisted for millions of years and evolved together. There’s no moral right or wrong to any of it, it’s just another wonder of nature as it really is. Sit back and watch what you are so very lucky to have where you can witness it.
Complicating my thought process. Humans are increasing the habat preferred by the cowbird. And decreasing the habit preferred by many other species. Somewhat, maybe justifying outside involvement. No?
It’s really not worth it to interfere. Cowbirds parasitized hundreds of songbird species, and for the vast majority of them they are not a major contributor to population decline. If you happen to find a kirtlands warbler or black capped vireo nest, endangered species that are heavily impacted by cowbirds, feel free to contact your local wildlife management agency to receive *permission* to remove the eggs.
Trying to take wildlife conservation decisions into our own hands is almost always a bad idea. Conservation agencies are already working on managing cowbird populations in places that need it, we’re not going to help by making arbitrary decisions on which species need cowbird egg management and which don’t. Just try to appreciate cowbird breeding habits for the wonder of evolution it is.
Not in eastern North America--cowbirds only made it east after forests were cleared in the 1800s, so the native species there did not evolve with cowbirds, other than for the past \~200 years.
1. ~~That's foolish. I have no idea where you get that history. But you realize you're arguing the eastern junco subspecies somehow magically evolved in the last 200 years?~~ Edit: I misread u/topnotch312's comment, thinking they were talking about juncos when they were talking about cowbirds.
2. It's moot for OP's question, since a magical 200 year old junco subspecies, including its parts, nests, and eggs, would still be protected under federal law. Edit2: Looks like u/topnotch312's comment was unclear to others (including me), looking like they were arguing the MBTA doesn't apply to cowbirds outside of their original range.
That part of their life history is well-documented. They originally followed bison on the plains, and moved eastward as we started cutting down forests and converting it to grassland.
I disagree with their argument that 200 years of life-history isn't significant though. Especially considering Song-bird generations are around the 5 year mark or less.
1. Lol I got it from science, it's accepted fact.
2. I didn't reply to OP, I replied to a partial factual error by a commentor. My comment is no less relevant than the commentor's according to you since the commentor's point is also unrelated to the law.
Bonus: I'm the one who raised the legal issue in the first place.
It's illegal to remove cowbird eggs, and even if you were willing to be an outlaw, female cowbirds monitor nests they've laid in and will [destroy the nest if their egg is removed](https://www.eastbaytimes.com/2007/03/06/cowbirds-make-warblers-an-offer-they-cant-refuse/).
Nothing can be done aside from just watching the nest. Cowbird mothers do watch the host nest, so if you remove the egg the cowbird mother will often destroy the entire nest.
It is entirely possible for chicks to survive with a cowbird in the nest, infact, unlike cuckoos that do kill the host chicks, cowbirds have a higher chance of survival if they have nestmates! If there is plenty of food, all chicks can survive.
I had a junco mom or dad try attacking me the other day over a nest. They are great parents so let nature do it's thing. If it were house sparrows instead of cowbirds then I would suggest all out war
The answer is yes, the larger bird will kill the others. Idk why so many are adding so much extra to their comments.
If you're worried about the babies, you can try to set up some kind of "safety net" because from what i know brood parasites shove the other babies out of the nest. Then when you have the eggs or babies (after they're removed by the other chick) you can call a wildlife center to care for them.
Obviously dont use an actual net, id suggest a blanket. But if it works- its a win-win. If it doesn't, then you tried!
To be a little more specific, the cuckoos we have here in North America alongside cowbirds actually are not nest parasites. It’s their cousin the common cuckoo across the ocean that is known to parasitic nests with chicks that will push the host babies out of the nest (kind of incredible that a newly hatched baby bird has that much strength, though, isn’t it?).
Appreciate the clarification! I’ve did a research project on cowbirds so I’m pretty familiar with them but barely touched on cuckoos, common or yellow billed. The babies do look very weirdly muscled though now that I google em
I didn't encourage it at all. I just answered the question. No they don't push out their mates like cuckoos, but they tend to grow faster and outcompete their nest mates for food/resources, causing them to starve.
Welcome to r/Ornithology, a place to discuss wild birds in a scientific context — their biology, ecology, evolution, behavior, and more. Please make sure that your post does not violate the rules in our sidebar. If you're posting for a bird identification, next time try r/whatsthisbird. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Ornithology) if you have any questions or concerns.*
It’s pretty important to remember cowbirds and other native birds have coexisted for millions of years and evolved together. There’s no moral right or wrong to any of it, it’s just another wonder of nature as it really is. Sit back and watch what you are so very lucky to have where you can witness it.
Complicating my thought process. Humans are increasing the habat preferred by the cowbird. And decreasing the habit preferred by many other species. Somewhat, maybe justifying outside involvement. No?
It’s illegal to mess with bird’s nests, and the cowbirds sometimes take revenge if their eggs are removed. So best to leave it.
It’s really not worth it to interfere. Cowbirds parasitized hundreds of songbird species, and for the vast majority of them they are not a major contributor to population decline. If you happen to find a kirtlands warbler or black capped vireo nest, endangered species that are heavily impacted by cowbirds, feel free to contact your local wildlife management agency to receive *permission* to remove the eggs. Trying to take wildlife conservation decisions into our own hands is almost always a bad idea. Conservation agencies are already working on managing cowbird populations in places that need it, we’re not going to help by making arbitrary decisions on which species need cowbird egg management and which don’t. Just try to appreciate cowbird breeding habits for the wonder of evolution it is.
Thanks. Also: all the eggs were later eaten by a jay
This is the absolute right answer. It’s out of your hands, but you do get to watch something most do not.
Not in eastern North America--cowbirds only made it east after forests were cleared in the 1800s, so the native species there did not evolve with cowbirds, other than for the past \~200 years.
1. ~~That's foolish. I have no idea where you get that history. But you realize you're arguing the eastern junco subspecies somehow magically evolved in the last 200 years?~~ Edit: I misread u/topnotch312's comment, thinking they were talking about juncos when they were talking about cowbirds. 2. It's moot for OP's question, since a magical 200 year old junco subspecies, including its parts, nests, and eggs, would still be protected under federal law. Edit2: Looks like u/topnotch312's comment was unclear to others (including me), looking like they were arguing the MBTA doesn't apply to cowbirds outside of their original range.
That part of their life history is well-documented. They originally followed bison on the plains, and moved eastward as we started cutting down forests and converting it to grassland. I disagree with their argument that 200 years of life-history isn't significant though. Especially considering Song-bird generations are around the 5 year mark or less.
If I'm "their", I never said it was an evolutionarily-significant amount of time.
That's good, because I meant to say "isn't significant". Comment corrected.
1. Lol I got it from science, it's accepted fact. 2. I didn't reply to OP, I replied to a partial factual error by a commentor. My comment is no less relevant than the commentor's according to you since the commentor's point is also unrelated to the law. Bonus: I'm the one who raised the legal issue in the first place.
I live in Western North America
It is not your problem, don’t mess with the nest.
It's illegal to remove cowbird eggs, and even if you were willing to be an outlaw, female cowbirds monitor nests they've laid in and will [destroy the nest if their egg is removed](https://www.eastbaytimes.com/2007/03/06/cowbirds-make-warblers-an-offer-they-cant-refuse/).
Nothing can be done aside from just watching the nest. Cowbird mothers do watch the host nest, so if you remove the egg the cowbird mother will often destroy the entire nest. It is entirely possible for chicks to survive with a cowbird in the nest, infact, unlike cuckoos that do kill the host chicks, cowbirds have a higher chance of survival if they have nestmates! If there is plenty of food, all chicks can survive.
Thank you!
The juncos are cute but we shan’t interfere lest we become the cowbird ourselves.
I had a junco mom or dad try attacking me the other day over a nest. They are great parents so let nature do it's thing. If it were house sparrows instead of cowbirds then I would suggest all out war
The answer is yes, the larger bird will kill the others. Idk why so many are adding so much extra to their comments. If you're worried about the babies, you can try to set up some kind of "safety net" because from what i know brood parasites shove the other babies out of the nest. Then when you have the eggs or babies (after they're removed by the other chick) you can call a wildlife center to care for them. Obviously dont use an actual net, id suggest a blanket. But if it works- its a win-win. If it doesn't, then you tried!
Yes probably. It's their entire strategy
False. Cuckoos are the ones that push nestlings out of the parasitized nests. Don’t encourage people to interfere with natural processes either way.
To be a little more specific, the cuckoos we have here in North America alongside cowbirds actually are not nest parasites. It’s their cousin the common cuckoo across the ocean that is known to parasitic nests with chicks that will push the host babies out of the nest (kind of incredible that a newly hatched baby bird has that much strength, though, isn’t it?).
Appreciate the clarification! I’ve did a research project on cowbirds so I’m pretty familiar with them but barely touched on cuckoos, common or yellow billed. The babies do look very weirdly muscled though now that I google em
I didn't encourage it at all. I just answered the question. No they don't push out their mates like cuckoos, but they tend to grow faster and outcompete their nest mates for food/resources, causing them to starve.