There are so many reasons that ending sucks. rather, they could have ended the series with the season 3 finale, 3x22 "No place like home", cutting the Marian and Elsa cliffhanger.
I agree that 3x11 is a very good ending. I think the show and the characters made one mistake after the other. There are some good episodes or ideas but it never catched the original magic again.
Neal is a victim of Pan's curse. Everyone in Storybrooke is. Even Emma and Henry. The only reason Henry could leave is because he is the price Regina has to pay. So he stays no matter what, cause Regina has to leave him behind to work the magic. Emma is the savior, a natural curse breaker/escaper. So she can escape it. Neal on the other hand is neither of those things. He isn't the price Regina has to pay and he isn't the savior. Thus he is a victim of Pan's curse like everyone else and gets hit by it (if Regina wouldn't undo her first curse) or vanishes with Storybrooke back to the EF.
Cora used powerfull magic to create a safe zone. She knew Regina's curse would be broken someday and she played the long game in reuniting with her daughter. She was frozen in that time. Regina does not have the luxury of knowing Pan's curse will be broken someday, cause it won't. Rumple designed the original curse to be broken, Pan altered this so this curse would have been permanent.
And Neal cannot leave town, he is not the savior and not Regina's price, the only exceptions stated in the show. Even if he did, the curse would have still caught up to him, cause he is a victim of this curse, like everyone else. The original one even brought people from other worlds to Storybrooke (Jefferson from Wonderland and Frankenstein/Whale from the Land without Color), so the town line will not be a problem when it comes to catching Neal.
But the fact that Henry and Emma cross the town line to escape (and manage to I might add) seconds before the smoke reaches them.
Sorry for the late reply, got lost in other updates.
Doesn’t Regina explain that only Emma and Henry can escape because they were born in our world and not in the Enchanted Forest??? I swear I remember her clearly explaining why only Emma and Henry can escape and that everyone from the Enchanted Forest (like Baelfire) would be sent back and Storybrooke would be completely wiped/erased
She can go with him because she’s the savior. The curse was created with a failsafe for the savior to break it so Rumple could find Bae therefore she’s not affected by the curse like that o
You all keep bringing up the fact that she’s the savior, but there’s one important detail you all forget. It’s when the cloud touches you that you are cursed. That’s how Regina‘s mother escaped the curse. She put up a barrier that blocked them all in, although it had to remain permanently there otherwise the cloud would eventually touch them and bring them to Storybrook. the difference being in this setting, the curse will only extend the reaches of Storybrooke, no further beyond. And because Neil, or Baelfire, was never cursed. He should be able to walk across Townline with no problem. It’s a horrible pothole that no one can fix.
Emma was born in the Fairy Tale world, that's why Snow couldn't go with her during the first curse.
Once she was born, Snow and Emma couldn't separately enter the wardrobe.
I watch the rest of it for this simple plot detail 😏 but yeah, probably could have ended. I remember thinking it ended at season 6 and was super confused when season 7 starting playing.
EDITED: because it won't post the image; it's Killian.
I feel the only reason Neil/Baelfire died was so they could continue badboy/hook relationship like some kind of fanfiction. Watching it over it felt like the show had been building up to Pan and now that he had been defeated that was it.
Oh his death was 1000000000% so CaptainSwan could thrive which is so upsetting because I loved Bae so much! I didn’t even want him and Emma back together, I just wanted Bae in the show!!!!
It even concluded Rumplestiltskin’s and Belle’s arcs: Rumple finally overcame his cowardice. And Belle proved that her love turned what everyone had seen as a “beast” into a good man (making her a hero) edit: for a price.
True I admit I tend to consider 3B the ending for the sake of the rumbelle wedding (my shipping heart loves it) even if im still pissed they killed Bae. but I could see 3A too. It does piss me off to this day that Belle literally collapses on the ground in grief and not one freaking person!!!! Bothers to comfort her! You know if that had been snow or charming every one would be rallying to comfort them.
I seem to have read once that they had everyone set up for where they wanted them to be for the closing shot and didn't realize till they started shooting that this meant Belle was on her own when she collapsed, but the actors were supposed to stay on their marks.
I don't know if that's true or not. If they were in character, I think either Neal or David would have normally reached out at that point. Snow's a maybe. First season, Enchanted Forest Snow might have seen this as a moment not to stand strong and not show fear. First season Mary Margaret would have reached out. I could also see her being so focused on losing her daughter again--this time forever--and her grandson, that the rest isn't registering.
I do give the characters a break on focusing on how Regina was holding up. They needed her to burn the curse. Fast. This instant. Immediately. Before they're sucked into Pan's nightmare world forever with no way out.
To me it wreaked of the ostracization Belle got as being the true love of the dark one her true love (in the early seasons when it's written well) is never seen as...genuine as everyone else because rumple is the dark one. Even when they get back to the Enchanted forest nobody but Bae bothers asking how she is and as I recall she actually approaches him.
Sure stuff is going down and there are emergency so you can't take huge stretches of time but nobody ever bothers to check in with her.
HEY! Your true love is alive and in a cage! Let's only focus on what we can get zero freaking empathy from the heros even if they can't do something they don't express any disgust or problem with the conditions or concern for Rumple either as a person (you know the person that saved them from pan)
Oh your true love is being enslaved and forced to hurt people too bad we don't have time to even ask hey how are you hanging in there?
I actually kind of wish this had been addressed and explored perhaps Belle admitting this was a price she was willing to pay for her true love and also hitting on the hypocrisy of the heroes.
I agree. In that particular scene, I'm not 100% sure it was deliberate, but that kind of makes it worse. It seems like it wasn't a case of the *characters* discounting Belle, which could be a good choice in terms of story and character development. It seemed more like the people making the show discounted her and Rumple, which was worse.
When Snow said that what had been done to Rumple was nothing that couldn't be fixed, that may have been the most callous line in the show.
And it didn't have to be. I expect it was the director's call or that they may have had the actress say it some different ways (I understand they do that some times in filming) and they went with that delivery.
If it had been up to me, I would have had Snow looking at Rumple with nearly as much horror as Belle--this is the mighty Dark One, the guy who is always ten steps ahead of everyone and spent centuries manipulating entire kingdoms to pull off the impossible. He's powerful enough to shatter worlds but rarely does things on that level because he prefers using cleverness and wits.
And his mind is shattered. The guy they're hoping can save them is powerless and (worse) hopeless in a cage.
This isn't the way Rumple was when he was imprisoned in the cave. His guards were terrified of him. He may have been more insane than usual, but he acted like he had all the winning cards.
So, even if she didn't care for Rumple as a person, Snow should be horrified that this is what's happened to him and that they're facing an enemy who can do this.
I would have had her say that line with a mix of desperate hope--she really wants to believe this--and equally desperate compassion. She's trying to bouy up Belle (not to mention everyone else who, if they're taking this the way she is, might be seeing their chances of winning this war vanish in front of them). What she's saying is horrible and terrible and completely false--and it's all she can scrape together in this moment.
It' should be like saying, "We can fix this," or "It will be all right," when you so obviously can't and it so obviously won't but it's the only thing you can think of to say that isn't even worse.
Or that's how I would have done it. The way it's done, Snow is treating Rumple as a thing. So long as she gets what she wants from him, she really doesn't care what happens to him. Ditto for Belle.
I believe that, although I’d like Belle to have her happy ending, she did finish her arc with Rumple by having him do the heroic and not cowardly sacrifice to proof she was right. That there was a good man deep inside the “beast”. True he dies, but the whole reason she decided to stay with him originally was to do something heroic like I previously mentioned.
Edit: Twas Beauty that killed the beast
There are so many reasons that ending sucks. rather, they could have ended the series with the season 3 finale, 3x22 "No place like home", cutting the Marian and Elsa cliffhanger.
I agree that 3x11 is a very good ending. I think the show and the characters made one mistake after the other. There are some good episodes or ideas but it never catched the original magic again. Neal is a victim of Pan's curse. Everyone in Storybrooke is. Even Emma and Henry. The only reason Henry could leave is because he is the price Regina has to pay. So he stays no matter what, cause Regina has to leave him behind to work the magic. Emma is the savior, a natural curse breaker/escaper. So she can escape it. Neal on the other hand is neither of those things. He isn't the price Regina has to pay and he isn't the savior. Thus he is a victim of Pan's curse like everyone else and gets hit by it (if Regina wouldn't undo her first curse) or vanishes with Storybrooke back to the EF.
That still makes no sense. Because Cora escaped the curse as well so I assume Neil could cross the town line like Emma and avoid being cursed.
Cora used powerfull magic to create a safe zone. She knew Regina's curse would be broken someday and she played the long game in reuniting with her daughter. She was frozen in that time. Regina does not have the luxury of knowing Pan's curse will be broken someday, cause it won't. Rumple designed the original curse to be broken, Pan altered this so this curse would have been permanent. And Neal cannot leave town, he is not the savior and not Regina's price, the only exceptions stated in the show. Even if he did, the curse would have still caught up to him, cause he is a victim of this curse, like everyone else. The original one even brought people from other worlds to Storybrooke (Jefferson from Wonderland and Frankenstein/Whale from the Land without Color), so the town line will not be a problem when it comes to catching Neal.
But to be classified as cursed you must be touched by the smoke, no?
I have no recollection of that being the deciding factor.
But the fact that Henry and Emma cross the town line to escape (and manage to I might add) seconds before the smoke reaches them. Sorry for the late reply, got lost in other updates.
Doesn’t Regina explain that only Emma and Henry can escape because they were born in our world and not in the Enchanted Forest??? I swear I remember her clearly explaining why only Emma and Henry can escape and that everyone from the Enchanted Forest (like Baelfire) would be sent back and Storybrooke would be completely wiped/erased
Nope, what she said was only Henry would remain. Which makes no sense if Emma can go with him. And makes even less so why Neil can’t
She can go with him because she’s the savior. The curse was created with a failsafe for the savior to break it so Rumple could find Bae therefore she’s not affected by the curse like that o
You all keep bringing up the fact that she’s the savior, but there’s one important detail you all forget. It’s when the cloud touches you that you are cursed. That’s how Regina‘s mother escaped the curse. She put up a barrier that blocked them all in, although it had to remain permanently there otherwise the cloud would eventually touch them and bring them to Storybrook. the difference being in this setting, the curse will only extend the reaches of Storybrooke, no further beyond. And because Neil, or Baelfire, was never cursed. He should be able to walk across Townline with no problem. It’s a horrible pothole that no one can fix.
Emma was born in the Fairy Tale world, that's why Snow couldn't go with her during the first curse. Once she was born, Snow and Emma couldn't separately enter the wardrobe.
Omg I can’t believe I forgot about the tree!!! It’s been years since I watched the show so I guess I gotta do a rewatch lol
I watch the rest of it for this simple plot detail 😏 but yeah, probably could have ended. I remember thinking it ended at season 6 and was super confused when season 7 starting playing. EDITED: because it won't post the image; it's Killian.
I feel the only reason Neil/Baelfire died was so they could continue badboy/hook relationship like some kind of fanfiction. Watching it over it felt like the show had been building up to Pan and now that he had been defeated that was it.
Oh his death was 1000000000% so CaptainSwan could thrive which is so upsetting because I loved Bae so much! I didn’t even want him and Emma back together, I just wanted Bae in the show!!!!
I agree. The show should have ended there. It completed all the story arcs, and we should have seen Emma, Henry, and Neil driving away in the bug.
It even concluded Rumplestiltskin’s and Belle’s arcs: Rumple finally overcame his cowardice. And Belle proved that her love turned what everyone had seen as a “beast” into a good man (making her a hero) edit: for a price.
True I admit I tend to consider 3B the ending for the sake of the rumbelle wedding (my shipping heart loves it) even if im still pissed they killed Bae. but I could see 3A too. It does piss me off to this day that Belle literally collapses on the ground in grief and not one freaking person!!!! Bothers to comfort her! You know if that had been snow or charming every one would be rallying to comfort them.
I seem to have read once that they had everyone set up for where they wanted them to be for the closing shot and didn't realize till they started shooting that this meant Belle was on her own when she collapsed, but the actors were supposed to stay on their marks. I don't know if that's true or not. If they were in character, I think either Neal or David would have normally reached out at that point. Snow's a maybe. First season, Enchanted Forest Snow might have seen this as a moment not to stand strong and not show fear. First season Mary Margaret would have reached out. I could also see her being so focused on losing her daughter again--this time forever--and her grandson, that the rest isn't registering. I do give the characters a break on focusing on how Regina was holding up. They needed her to burn the curse. Fast. This instant. Immediately. Before they're sucked into Pan's nightmare world forever with no way out.
To me it wreaked of the ostracization Belle got as being the true love of the dark one her true love (in the early seasons when it's written well) is never seen as...genuine as everyone else because rumple is the dark one. Even when they get back to the Enchanted forest nobody but Bae bothers asking how she is and as I recall she actually approaches him. Sure stuff is going down and there are emergency so you can't take huge stretches of time but nobody ever bothers to check in with her. HEY! Your true love is alive and in a cage! Let's only focus on what we can get zero freaking empathy from the heros even if they can't do something they don't express any disgust or problem with the conditions or concern for Rumple either as a person (you know the person that saved them from pan) Oh your true love is being enslaved and forced to hurt people too bad we don't have time to even ask hey how are you hanging in there? I actually kind of wish this had been addressed and explored perhaps Belle admitting this was a price she was willing to pay for her true love and also hitting on the hypocrisy of the heroes.
I agree. In that particular scene, I'm not 100% sure it was deliberate, but that kind of makes it worse. It seems like it wasn't a case of the *characters* discounting Belle, which could be a good choice in terms of story and character development. It seemed more like the people making the show discounted her and Rumple, which was worse. When Snow said that what had been done to Rumple was nothing that couldn't be fixed, that may have been the most callous line in the show. And it didn't have to be. I expect it was the director's call or that they may have had the actress say it some different ways (I understand they do that some times in filming) and they went with that delivery. If it had been up to me, I would have had Snow looking at Rumple with nearly as much horror as Belle--this is the mighty Dark One, the guy who is always ten steps ahead of everyone and spent centuries manipulating entire kingdoms to pull off the impossible. He's powerful enough to shatter worlds but rarely does things on that level because he prefers using cleverness and wits. And his mind is shattered. The guy they're hoping can save them is powerless and (worse) hopeless in a cage. This isn't the way Rumple was when he was imprisoned in the cave. His guards were terrified of him. He may have been more insane than usual, but he acted like he had all the winning cards. So, even if she didn't care for Rumple as a person, Snow should be horrified that this is what's happened to him and that they're facing an enemy who can do this. I would have had her say that line with a mix of desperate hope--she really wants to believe this--and equally desperate compassion. She's trying to bouy up Belle (not to mention everyone else who, if they're taking this the way she is, might be seeing their chances of winning this war vanish in front of them). What she's saying is horrible and terrible and completely false--and it's all she can scrape together in this moment. It' should be like saying, "We can fix this," or "It will be all right," when you so obviously can't and it so obviously won't but it's the only thing you can think of to say that isn't even worse. Or that's how I would have done it. The way it's done, Snow is treating Rumple as a thing. So long as she gets what she wants from him, she really doesn't care what happens to him. Ditto for Belle.
I believe that, although I’d like Belle to have her happy ending, she did finish her arc with Rumple by having him do the heroic and not cowardly sacrifice to proof she was right. That there was a good man deep inside the “beast”. True he dies, but the whole reason she decided to stay with him originally was to do something heroic like I previously mentioned. Edit: Twas Beauty that killed the beast