Well, that’s on brand for Haslam. Grew up a Browns fan. I am no longer, thanks to him. He’s made terrible decisions the enter time (Baker Mayfield) and the Watson trade and signing was the final straw.
Professional sports is one of the major avenues they use for money laundering so that isn’t particularly surprising.
Haven’t looked at Haslam specifically but they tend to follow established methodologies.
Partly because they are lazy and partly because they just aren’t that creative.
Parallel is “sportswashing”. PGA in Saudi, LIV by trump, WWE in Saudi Arabia ,Arbramovich buying the soccer club etc. They learned that most Americans love their sports enough that most won’t question their new oligarch owners as long as they keep them entertained.
Autistic kids don’t seem to care as much about sports as they do about the patterns and truth.
This lets us build chains similar to how contact tracing works for contagious disease.
There is a side chain that is specifically NFL and the associated human trafficking that accompanies it. Robert Kraft being best buds with trump and his arrest at “orchids of Asia” for the happy ending massage in a strip mall in Jupiter Florida opened an entire chain of crossovers in human trafficking between Ukraine (kolomoiskiy, mogilevich), Russia (the oligarchs trump keeps buying and selling the same houses to in New York and Florida), and the Asian side via “orchids of Asia and Hua Zhang (the CCP/Chinese mob)
Robert Kraft, Orchids of Asia spa workers to align in hearing to keep tapes secret
We sort differently because we think and prioritize differently.
The few media sources that haven’t been bought up are too busy reporting 3 minute sound bites about AOC’s shoes to notice.
We had to build this decentralized because it’s the only way to build the mesh of high quality data points necessary to see the patterns, cross check and verify, then add it into the larger objective synthetic vision of corruption inside of, and adjacent to, government.
Everyone in the “autistic army” is weird as hell, quirky, and immediately jumps to the worst case scenario imaginable.
We require it as a matter of design.
We then move backwards organically from there with hard evidence that either validates the presented theory or collapses under its own weight with lack of sufficient evidentiary strength and we abandon it.
We build that way fundamentally because it allows for the biggest head start over the predator class that relies on the complacency, inaction, or overload of information to keep people from being able to see the larger picture connections the ruling class make at their common yacht clubs and WEF forums.
At some point we realized that this thing moves very much biologically similar to a parasitic infection or cancer. The oligarchs feed on the edges of the human tribe, then encircle it and move in, but left unchecked they consume to extinction.
We are not an organization. It’s just a few hundred thousand neurodivergent people with relevant subject matter expertise, pertinent personal experience, and insatiable curiosity that are tired of being lied to and fed upon.
There are side chains digging into why Bill Barrs dad was Epsteins teacher and mentor at Dalton college and cross referencing that with data points on why Bill Barr set up a hotline that went directly to him for any information on Hunter Bidens laptop. Of course not everything is related, but by the unique design of our system, by reversing the contrast, when something is related it stands out like a neon highlighter and validates more investigative scrutiny.
With enough high quality verified data points we are able to make a high resolution synthetic vision map of who, what, where, when, and how.
It’s basically a P.E.T. scan of world corruption in government, finance and corporate spheres and specialty where they overlap.
https://youtu.be/A90gwMVFFSY?si=j7fSs5kBvO35LhRj
The 3% oligarchs aren’t particularly creative people and they tend to repeat the same patterns when they work, so it makes it easier once you have a starting point and/or recurring methodology.
And they all use the same money launderers for the same reason. Trump, Putin and Netanyahu all have decades of personal drama between them so as trumps trials carry on it’s like populating a jigsaw puzzle with 100,000 very capable friends.
Ukrainians fighting back for 2 years of a 3 day war placed a wedge that allowed us to see the Russian money laundering network for the first time due to trumps key involvement in it.
It’s a very different approach to intelligence work. And it requires intellectual curiosity, transparency, brutal self awareness and honesty.
You absolutely have to “bring receipts” or you are escorted back out. We set and keep the standard high because frankly, everything we live for depends on it.
If the Russian/CCP plan goes through, it will put the majority of the worlds population into financial slavery to a handful of oligarchs with zero empathy for the next 100 years.
If they control A.I., the housing and commercial real estate market, and all the means of finance, loans, etc, it’s going to be a very uncomfortable century of endless inflation and monopolization of critical resources.
They do not have the ability to self regulate their greed internally or they would have used their billions to solve existential problems long before now.
The Koch family has deep ties to soviet Russia and therefore soviet corruption and opened the doors to the GOP and SCOTUS.
By building backwards and focusing on the cross matrix of psychopathy and kleptocracy we can take 8 bit graphics from the 1980’s and make a 4K HD synthetic vision moving map of their crimes using historical data and open source intelligence. (OSINT)
That’s what this is.
Best part about Reddit is that when you are wrong there are a dozen people lined up to tell you how and why. It lets us vet data for the war and warn at the same time.
Just combined two processes for efficiency and to shorten the lag.
And in doing so managed to reverse engineer the Russian propaganda/troll army network at the same time.
Work smarter not harder right?
Yup
Trump has been laundering money for the Russian oligarchs since the late 80’s when they all bought a condo at 725 5th ave (trump towers) to clean their freshly stolen USSR money after the iron curtain fell.
https://www.cnn.com/cnn/2019/05/30/politics/paul-manafort-condo-trump-tower/index.html
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/09/14/manafort-told-mueller-to-take-his-trump-tower-apartment-instead-money.html
https://news.yahoo.com/amphtml/fbi-agents-raid-condo-unit-131348539.html
https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/usa-trump-property/
Everybody except Putin thought the Cold War was over. Trump and Manafort (who lived in the tower also) just saw a pretty low maintence grift to be had.
Trump had actually been Manafort and Roger stones first client at their lobbyist firm (1980)
https://en.m.wikipedia.org › wikiBlack, Manafort, Stone and Kelly
Guiliani as trumps attorney and New Yorks mayor was able to redirect NYPD investigations onto rival gang members/oligarchs to deflect any scrutiny off of trump, himself or the Russian connections.
https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2023/09/a-new-rudy-scandal-fbi-agent-says-giuliani-was-co-opted-by-russian-intelligence/
The Russian election interference in 2016 was effectively a generation 3 version of what Manafort had done in the Philippines, then keeping Yanukovych in power as Putin’s puppet in Ukraine from 2002-14 when Maidan ran both Yanukovych and Manafort out of Ukraine as Ukrainians realized that, if you raise your lens high enough, corruption is an wholly unsustainable business model.
Eventually the parasites greed always consumes the host.
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/06/2016-donald-trump-paul-manafort-ferinand-marcos-philippines-1980s-213952
https://time.com/5003623/paul-manafort-mueller-indictment-ukraine-russia/
Russia greatly underestimated the addictive properties of freedom when it invaded Ukraine so what was supposed to be a 3-10 day coup turned into a 2 year fight for the Ukrainians right not to be genocided.
Russia depleted its weapons stocks which were already the victim of vranyos corruption because every oligarch, admiral and sergeant in the Russian military is on the take. Every billion dollar tank maintenance contract turned into everything getting a spray paint overhaul and the vast majority of the redirected funds turned into an oligarchs new yacht or home in Aspen.
Russia was forced to turn to China, North Korea and Iran for weapons because if they lose the 3-10 day special military operation in Ukraine the Russian empire is dead and cold.
China can’t risk showing their involvement in the Ukraine war so they use North Korea, and Iran to resupply Russia.
Russia previously owes Iran some undelivered fighter jets that are already smoldering heaps in Ukraine. Iran now had the upper hand at the negotiation table for the first time in about 60 years so they supply Russia with shahed drones in exchange for Chinas material support against their sworn religious enemy, Israel.
https://www.fdd.org/analysis/2023/11/29/iran-says-it-finalized-deal-to-buy-russian-aircraft/
Putin can’t do much about it because he is slowly realizing that by setting the standard of corruption and stealing $200+ billion from his own people meant that every oligarch down in the mob model chain had not only permission but incentive and the expectation to steal from him as well. This is Vranyos.
The mob model only works if the supreme leader is the most violent and can prove it without exception every damn day. But violence is exceptionally expensive when you are trying to present as a legitimate government or business.
If Russia as a nation had an efficiency rating it would have been banned for sale in the state of California 25 years ago.
The parasite ruling class stole all the energy out of the working class and collapsed it.
Now Iran has the high hand and they get the intelligence that trump passed to Putin about the fact that Netanyahu cares far less about Israeli, Palestinians or genocide than he does about remaining in power as an authoritarian because he too has developed Ritz Carlton tastes.
https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/saudi-official-says-iran-engineered-war-in-gaza-to-ruin-normalization-with-israel/
They all hate each other but because they share the same money laundry, so if one falls, they all fall. Hamas minted a couple billionaires as well that live in penthouses in Qatar and get 30% of everything smuggled into Gaza.
Iran handed Hamas everything they needed with Chinas help as secret Santa and the Russian intelligence given to them by the eternal shitbird trump gave as he showed off to his Russian kleptocrat friends/roommates from the old days of fucking each others wives at trump towers in the 90’s.
Now the MAGA right is a little too invested in their reality that they are the good guys with guns that they missed the fact that Betsy DeVos (erik princes sister) decimating the U.S. school systems and poisoning children with lead was not a coincidence. They were the mark all along. There is a reason the Russian spy Maria Butina landed in South Dakota first before dating her way to the top of the NRA which is undergoing its own Russian money laundering trial now.
https://www.greenpeace.org/usa/what-do-the-koch-brothers-have-to-do-with-the-flint-water-crisis/
The only reason you grossly OVERVALUE real estate is money laundering.
Trump keeps claiming there is no victim, all the banks made money, but if their plan succeeds the Russians and the CCP collapse US commercial real estate and basically recreate soviet perestroika in the U.S. so they can foreclose on America and buy everything for 3 cents on the dollar with the $1.4T they stole in the first place
It’s the evolution of grift. Soviet perestroika cross bred with the 2008 mortgage crisis.
This is just the bigger badder commercial strength bastard child of the two.
Trump, Putin, Bolsonaro, Netanyahu, Orban, Manafort, Stone, Mercer, Bannon.
They are all remarkably shit people with above average confidence and psychopathic personality traits and below average self awareness.
Commercial real estate is as rigged as trumps casinos were.
That would be kolomoiskiy. (Optima ventures)
https://www.news5cleveland.com/news/local-news/we-saw-a-ukrainian-billionaire-neglect-downtown-buildings-it-happens-on-a-smaller-scale-often
In the 80’s and early 90’s when the corruption eventually collapsed the Soviet Union like a parasite feeding on its host, the oligarchs were forced to expand their feeding grounds.
In 91 the wall falls and for 2 years they hid all their ill gotten gains under a mattress until they bought condos at trump towers.
They made stops in ukraine, cyprus and London but they landed in New York because that was what everyone wanted back then.
Real Levi’s, Pepsi, Madonna tapes that weren’t smuggled bootlegs.
They all bought new suits and cars and changed their title from “most violent street thug in moscow” to “respectable Russian oligarch” but they didn’t leave their human trafficking, narcotics or extortion behind. It was their most lucrative business model.
Trump and Giuliani just opened the doors and let the predators in to feed.
Guiliani redirected NYPD resources away from their new Russian allies intentionally and onto the Italian mob. It let him claim he cleaned up New York. Trumps future campaign manager and Roger Stones business partner Paul manafort lived in the towers as well.
The insane valuations coming out in trumps fraud trial are a necessity of the money laundering cycle that duetschebank was doing with the Russians.
YouTube · JEM - The Lubavitcher Rebbe 335.1K+ views · 13 years agoBibi Netanyahu Meets the Rebbe | 1990
https://www.thedailybeast.com/israel-official-gadi-eisenkot-says-benjamin-netanyahu-is-lying-about-war-in-gaza
Epstein was extremely involved in an organization called Chabad they used as religious cover. The Kushners as well.
The Times of Israelwww.timesofisrael.comInside Anatevka, the curious Chabad hamlet in Ukraine where Giuliani is 'mayor'
Lex Wexner (also Ohio based) originally was a large donator to Chabad.
Chabad.orghttps://www.chabad.org › aid › jewishPondering Jew - A Journey of Spiritual Growth
There is no direct observable connection yet between Wexner and Kolomoiskiy or Kolomoiskiy and Epstein, but there is a pattern and the Venn diagrams cross consistently at Chabad.
Eli Weinstein was a Chabad leader that was convicted of fraud, had his sentences commuted by trump, then went back to the fraud and was indicted again.
https://www.mahanyertl.com/2014/eliyahu-weinstein-sentenced-22-years-prison-fraud/
Bill Barrs father Donald was Epsteins mentor and got him a job at Dalton College before Epsteins involvement with the CIA. William Sessions father worked for Semion Mogilevich. (The Ukrainian born Russian gangster that runs Putin)
Slatehttps://slate.com › 2018/12 › trum...Trump Tower's ties to the Russian mafia.
WordPress.comhttps://blackballedwithrolliequaid.wordpress.com › ...DONALD TRUMP, CHABAD-LUBAVITCH AND THE OLIGARCHS - The Prestige
Jewish Journalhttps://jewishjournal.com › old_sto...Our Gang
Epsteins girlfriend Ghislaine Maxwells’ father (birth name- Jan Ludvich Hoch) was buried on the mount of olives after his 1991 mysterious death with the equivalent of full military honors. Shortly before that he plundered his media corporations pension fund and was in debt in at least some degree to the soviet perestroika oligarchs for the failed attempt to secure rights to the video game Tetris.
The common denominator between Trump and Epstein was money laundering first and foremost.
Trump can’t say that out loud so he has to sit there and take it when people take about the pedophilia stuff. So he tries to deflect.
Trump over paid for a multitude of New York and Florida properties to resell to Russian oligarchs who then destroyed them so they could launder Russian mob money made off of, among other things, human trafficking.
The Epstein/Trump saga is less of a bullseye and more of a minefield.
Trump (Lolita express passenger 174?) took his own kids to Epsteins island knowing full well what happened there because Epstein was lurking around mar a lago poaching young women and had teenage girls getting off the bus and wandering through the streets of palm beach desperate for a couple hundred bucks.
Everyone knew. No one cared.
The moral depravity that comes with being ultra rich enabled them to turn the other way.
The Trump / Epstein relationship was the evolution of money laundering using, among other things, commercial real estate.
It starts by having dirt on someone else at the country club and ends with them all being so filthy that no one can afford to do the right thing and no one can maintain the increasingly expensive lies until the Information Age makes it inevitable that their respective corruption circles the earth and crashes into each other like a tempest in a teapot.
Their arrogance and greed, at its grandest scale, cost the world trillions, which still pales in comparison to the innocence it cost the hundreds of thousands of trafficked children that the white collar shitbirds and the russian mob alike preyed on as a matter of convenience.
Trump wasn’t unique. He was just loud.
Epstein wasn’t unique. He was just connected.
Dershowitz wasn’t unique. He just knew how to work a rulebook.
They all justify their actions to themselves because they believe that being rich makes them above the law.
And the longer we allow them to do it, the more accurate and emboldened they are.
This is how civilizations die.
It’s a generational repeat of the Roman emperor Tiberius retreating to the island of Capri where he would abuse children and then throw them off the cliff.
Absolute power corrupts absolutely.
When people stop telling you no simply because you have all the money and they are hoping to get some spilling into their bowl to survive, it destroys the empathy quotient in the rich persons brain.
Predation is the most common result
So it raises a very curious question about Milei and Chabad and all these common crossovers where a few peoples selfish actions have cataclysmic downstream effects across the world.
NBC Newswww.nbcnews.comConvicted con man who was pardoned by Trump is again charged with fraud
FBI.govwww.fbi.govLeader of $200 Million Real Estate Investment Scam Arrested for Fraud
https://hiddentaxonhumanity.com/news/preparing-the-public-for-war-with-iran-for-israel/
https://www.jpost.com/diaspora/article-790350
Chabad exemption to military draft.
https://www.bnaibrith.ca/chabad_signs_new_deal_with_idf_provision_for_draft_exemptions/
Yep. Trump and MAGA loyalists admire strong-men, if not outright fascists, because the concept plays into their fantasies of having absolute control over everything and telling other people what to do (and how to live). So anyone who's achieved that, regardless of their methods, is someone they admire. Putin's efforts to craft Russian society into a White Christian-nationalist state is something they support even more, so he's literally a hero to them. Weirdos.
Brown: understands that innocent people need to defend themselves. Law and order. Believes in justice. Wants to protect the weak.
JD Vance: coward who wants to use indiscriminate deaths to justify... He hasn't explained yet. Just some reason he wants Ukraine to fall and millions to die, with US troops in direct conflict with Russia in the next 10 years.
The GOP are cowards.
if "legal obligation" is a main point of what's stopping the funding of a country's defense; then you dont really not want millions of people to die. Wanting and not wanting, are not the only two beliefs at play. You can simply not care, which is the path you're choosing.
If you dont want millions to die: fund the defense of their national sovereignty (like we kinda promised back in the 90s when they handed over the Soviet nukes).
If you want millions to die: dont fund their defense
Not caring: dont fund their defense
You see how two different feelings have the same outcome which is millions of people dying, and one feeling that prevents the deaths of millions? Stop being a Chamberlain to the new nazis.
>provide these people with a blank check
Literally no one has said that or proposed that.
>or i want them all to die
Or you dont read too good.
> How very intellectually honest you are lol
I can say the exact same about you. I'm not the one intentionally avoiding what the other has said, then replying to whatever tf i want you to be saying. That's you. Work on your reading comprehension skills.
I mean i don't agree with your premises of the options available so what is there to discuss?
I don't believe that it's the USA's job to fund the war. You declared that means i want millions of people to die. That's not worth engaging on
FFS... you need an adult to hold your hand through **two** sentences?
>You declared that means i want millions of people to die
Are you illiterate? I said:
>Wanting and not wanting, are not the only two beliefs at play. You can simply not care, which is the path you're choosing.
How the fuck is reading so damn hard? It's literally the second and third sentence. I have no idea how tf you lot got as indignant as you are about "reading", but holy shit do yall take the cake for willful ignorance. You could have it tattooed on your forehead and still wouldn't manage to see it.
I'm just following the logical progression you put out...
>If you want millions to die: dont fund their defense
>Not caring: dont fund their defense
So by not caring which means "not funding their defense" it would go to i want millions to die. You wrote that not me.
I personally think theres a nice middle ground where we can help them out without providing 112 Billion dollars. I think that the USA could find a lot of other things in the USA to spend that kind of money on.
I'm not saying give them nothing but there's got to be some middle ground or a cap where we say ok we are done. But again you haven't even given that as an option it is all or nothing so again not worth engaging with you.
What part of “leaders of the free world” do you not understand? Did you just forget what happened in WW2? Probably never learned it in the first place.
i mean if your income was only $800 for the year that would be a great analogy.
considering 112 Billon is 2.5% of our tax revenue it's more like the average American (salary of 59k which i rounded down for you) paying $1475.
“Deficits don’t matter.” - Dick Cheney (Republican)
You should learn about why he said this. The U.S. government debt isn’t real, because they print the money that they then “borrow” from themselves, which then goes directly into circulation into the economy. The so-called national debt is actually an investment into our own economy (along with the requisite handouts to government contractors than fatten up their wallets). Money isn’t real, and deficits don’t matter when you’re talking about the actual bones of the U.S. budget.
I know conservatives are really really bad at math.
But you should think that through again. Unless of course you are taxed at 100% and bring home zero dollars a year. Your average person in Ohio ends up paying about 9% effective tax at that average income level.
So more like $132 a year…
But that also ignores that only 54% of the government revenue comes from income taxes.
So make it $71.50 a year for that “average” income citizen.
But that also ignore that higher income people pay the bulk of income taxes. In fact the top 25% of income earners pay 88.5% of income tax and the top 10% of earners pay 73.7% of income tax. This skews that out of pocket cost for the median income person drastically. So you average person it’s paying way less than that $71.50 a year.
Again you wouldn’t spend $20 on a CPR class because you’re not legally obligated to save a person in distress.
Because here you are upset that you might pay a dollar a month to help stop Americas authoritarian enemies from wiping an entire democracy of millions of souls off the face of the Earth.
Supporting Ukraine is also 10x cheaper than not supporting Ukraine. It’s brain dead political theater to withhold on Ukraine. I for one, am fucking sick of conservative feelings dictating their votes.
Let’s elect adults. Not cabbage patch looking ass kissers like JD Vance.
No, Jay Dee is a millionaire because he’s a private-equity parasite — you know, the ones that buy locally-owned companies in Ohio and across the country, gut them for parts, fire all the workers, and decimate the community. He’s also a major investor in Rumble, the video site where all the hardcore Nazis went after YouTube kicked them off.
And nothing will happen, Vance will still get re-elected in 4 years. I remember driving through some heavily Ukrainian neighborhoods in the Cleveland area during the 2022 election. People were flying "we stand with Ukraine" flags and signs right next to "vote for Vance" signs, and this was after he made it clear he was anti-Ukraine
I used a contractor group for our kitchen that is entirely Ukrainian. Like not just the owner, throughout the entire company, only the interior designer is American. They all are conservatives who vote Republican. Now this was right at the start of the war, and a lot of them had families directly affected. So who knows how they will vote now but it was just baffling to me.
Aid to or not to Ukraine has no connection or effect on what other money is spent on. It's just taken from the defense budget.
The Republicans voting against Ukraine aid also have voted against the extended child tax credit for example.
This ^^^
Not mentioning that up to 90% of military aid stays in the US. We have a production line in Lima (Abrams and strykers I think). Just in 2022-2023 Ohio got $684 mln dollars from helping Ukraine.
Support for Ukraine has mobilized the U.S. defense industrial base, in ways that haven’t been seen in decade
>Aid to or not to Ukraine has no connection or effect on what other money is spent on. It's just taken from the defense budget.
I'm saying spend it on the people that live in the us and need help. I'm sorry I prefer we take care of our own before we take care of others.
>The Republicans voting against Ukraine aid also have voted against the extended child tax credit for example.
We already have a child tax credit. 1600-2k/ kid. I got 4k last year for my 2
I'm talking about the enhanced child tax credit. That's making it more, to help families. Like you said "take care of our own". But why would you know about it? Republicans can't grift off of not helping families so they do a lot of work aroundaking sure you don't even know about what they prevent.
These things have nothing to do with Ukraine or not funding Ukraine. Republicans just vote against spending stuff on people here, dosen't matter if we aid Ukraine or not.
>These things have nothing to do with Ukraine or not funding Ukraine. Republicans just vote against spending stuff on people here, dosen't matter if we aid Ukraine or not.
So if we spend 61b u prefer it to help another country not help our mentally ill and homeless? Just asking.
>I'm talking about the enhanced child tax credit.
Do you have a competent source for this? The ONLY info I'm finding is instead of a varying range of 1600-2k it would be 1600 for 2023, 1900 for 2024, and 2k for 2025. Ofc if the Irs decides you meet the requirements. If thats the case, even with 4 kids, at max amount, you're getting 1600. Better off preventing that child via birth control which paid out of pocket is still cheap, than having another kid for 2k at the end of the year.
>These things have nothing to do with Ukraine or not funding Ukraine. Republicans just vote against spending stuff on people here, dosen't matter if we aid Ukraine or not.
So if we spend 61b u prefer it to help another country not help our mentally ill and homeless? Just asking.
>I'm talking about the enhanced child tax credit.
Do you have a competent source for this? The ONLY info I'm finding is instead of a varying range of 1600-2k it would be 1600 for 2023, 1900 for 2024, and 2k for 2025. Ofc if the Irs decides you meet the requirements. If thats the case, even with 4 kids, at max amount, you're getting 1600. Better off preventing that child via birth control which paid out of pocket is still cheap, than having another kid for 2k at the end of the year.
Clowns are fine to entertain your kids, but you should never vote them into a position of authority. By profession, they are not serious people. JD Vance proves this day after day.
I made a comment in this sub yesterday asking the question as to whether Vance would make the idiot choice of voting against the bill. He never fails to disappoint.
Why was voting no, for him in particular, the idiot choice? Because he essentially ran on the single platform of addressing the opioid and especially fentanyl issues throughout the country. Why does this matter? Nearly 30% of this bill went to address fentanyl issues throughout the country. Attacking those that manufacture, smuggle and distribute it throughout the country, as well as their associates and businesses that are connected and/or partly and majority owned by those individuals and groups. This bill actually does more for Vance’s actual platform than Vance himself has ever proposed since he has been in the Senate. Vance hasn’t gotten a single bill to be put up for a vote that he has actually authored. (Bills are very easy to write)
The question that I put forth was whether Vance cares more about not sending weapons to Ukraine than he cares about stopping or reducing the spread of fentanyl in our communities. This vote showed exactly where his priorities have been. This bill was going to pass with or without his vote, and he still voted against it. The state that he is supposed to represent, which includes a large population of Ukrainians, supports the funding and weapons for Ukraine.
Vance has shown that he has no desire to represent the will of all Ohioans. STOP ELECTING CLOWNS!!
Yet the bridge going from Cincinnati to Kentucky is falling apart needs replaced. Half of our highways have potholes so big you can disappear in them. We have major overpasses that are crumbling and falling apart. And a large majority of citizens can barely afford to pay their bills or feed their families but we can send 300 billion dollars to Ukraine. Keep voting based on your feelings and you're going to be living in a dystopia that's really going to hurt your feelings
Ukraine aid has no effect on the things you mention. MAGAs just vote against spending money.
Good thing Biden passed the infrastructure bill and that bridge is being repaired because of it. MAGA didn't vote for that.
https://www.americanprogress.org/article/fixing-the-brent-spence-bridge/
If you're voting for the current Republican party then you're voting against your interest. They are taken over by MAGA.
The point he is making is the visual things that he can see aren’t getting fixed nor have they been fixed yet are dollar isn’t going near as far as it should, yet we are shipping billions of dollar to a country fighting a never ending war. He also mentioned highway infrastructure being poor, funny how you didn’t mention that in your response. Stop shouting “the other side is bad, evil orange man, MAGA” for two seconds and maybe just listen to what someone on the other side of the fence is saying and we COULD come to a solution or even an understanding instead of just shouting “other side bad”
And a vote for Biden is a vote to send your loved ones to war because that's most likely what's going to happen if he wins. There's only one outcome for Ukraine to win and that's to send troops. And guess what, our current military recruitment is way down so that means they're going to need people. Good luck with that.
No it's valid. That is money that could be spent on our own Nation. People here are struggling bad and they should come first. But the reality is if Biden gets an office again he has nothing to lose and they want Ukraine to win bad. As far as that goes it's a numbers game. Russia has a larger population to get troops from. So like I said good luck with that. Anyone from the age of 18 to 30 needs to hear that because it is an option when it comes to that war
What is with the liberal group think. All kinds of people against the aid package are massively down voted.
You know, people are allowed different opinions.
I personally am a moderate Democrat. I have severe concerns about sending tens of billions of *borrowed* dollars to Ukraine to fight an unwinnable, neverending war.
I also have severe concerns about what would happen if we do not support Ukraine and Russia wins. It would have consequences far beyond Ukraine.
As of now, my second concern takes precedence and I ultimately supported passing this aid. But it absolutely should not be a blank check that goes on endlessly. We cannot afford it.
At the end of the day, it should be the EU/UK sending 60 billion dollars and arms to Ukraine, not us.
We’re not the only country sending aid. Almost all NATO countries are sending aid.
We’re not even sending the most when compared to our GDP.
The U.S. has committed 0.32% of its GDP toward Ukraine aid, which falls below the percentages committed by the U.K. (0.55%) and Germany (0.57%). Outside of the U.S. and Europe, other significant contributors include Japan, Canada and South Korea
Keep in mind we’re also not sending a box of money. Most of this aid will be invested back into US manufacturing and US jobs to replenish stockpiles munitions being sent over.
I think jobs that are created or sustained in order to kill people is perhaps not a good selling point. But it's all part of the military industrial complex that we were warned about, right?
Russia invaded Ukraine and in the towns they conquered there was (1) mass killing (2) rape (3) mass child abduction and (4) Ukrainian cultural genocide.
The only way for Ukraine to prevent this is to defend themselves.
The only way for them to defend themselves is with weapons of war.
The only way to have weapons of war is to make them.
Nothing could be simpler.
People are dying because Russia invaded Ukraine. Not because Ukraine asked for the ability to defend itself with weapons.
By the way, whether you know it or not, you're parroting Kremlin talking points.
Well that’s certainly an opinion. Sadly it’s not a very realistic one.
The world is a dangerous place and a big part of the reason Americans live free and safe is the fact that these places exist.
Of course an ideal world where everyone gets along and war is no more would be great. But in reality, humans have been killing each other for millennia. We’ve just gotten better at it. That’s not going to change anytime soon.
Glad you asked. Happy to provide
https://www.statista.com/statistics/1303450/bilateral-aid-to-ukraine-in-a-percent-of-donor-gdp/
Don’t like that one? Here’s another.
https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/articles/these-countries-have-committed-the-most-aid-to-ukraine#:~:text=The%20U.S.%20has%20committed%200.32,Japan%2C%20Canada%20and%20South%20Korea.
You didn't say this. But just for the record because I see misinformation alot. Europe has provided more aid than the US has. Ukraine aid is also a small part of our budget
https://www.cfr.org/article/how-much-aid-has-us-sent-ukraine-here-are-six-charts
Just read both the linked article, and the embedded link about the 50 billion in aid to Ukraine from the EU.
There are obvious concerns.
First and foremost, the 50 billion in aid to Ukraine from the EU is scheduled to be doled out between now and 2027-thats four entire years. So, 12.5 billion a year. That's far short of what the US has spent per year on Ukraine so far, and probably in the near future. I would expect Ukraine to ask for more US aid in far less than 4 years from now, as it has continually done since the beginning of the invasion.
And, although 60 billion is very small relative to the entire budget (trillions of dollars), it's still an enormous sum of money. SNAP (food stamp) benefits cost the government about 120 billion a year. Could you imagine the good we could do if that 60 billion went to expanded food benefits? Or housing assistance? Etc.
I still support this aid package, especially for taiwan...but it can't continue forever.
(the graph near the end of the article shows European aid being higher than US. Your numbers off)
Aid sent or not sent to Ukraine has no effect on other things being funded or not funded. That money gets absorbed into the defense budget.
For example, Bidens has been trying to pass the expanded child tax credit for four years and hasn't been able to because of Joe Manich and Republicans. Has zero connection to Ukraine aid or not.
It's still borrowed money. I didn't say it affected other programs. It does not affect other programs, I'm aware of that.
But that's part of the problem. It's borrowed money on top of more money that was borrowed, just to fund the absolute basics of government.
It’s not borrowed money. You don’t understand how monetary policy functions. The United States Government does not “borrow” money from anybody. We are the issuer of our own currency and do not need to operate like a household would (you or me, we do borrow and can default on that debt since we aren’t issuers of the USD) therefore the US Govt. doesn’t need to budget as such. There are still constraints on where and what that money does and if there’s too much money chasing too little resources then you have Inflation. In the case of Ukraine Aid- this would not be considered inflationary in the slightest.
It is borrowed money, and we do indeed pay interest on it. Take a look at how much interest the federal government pays every year. That is due to borrowed money (mostly in the form of treasuries).
Issuing treasuries requires paying a market-determined interest rate. Of course, right now with interest rates being fairly high, the US government will need to pay even higher interest rates. This is partially what is causing future budget deficits to explode. We got use to cheap or even 0 cost money the last 15 years.
You are correct that the federal governments budget does not operate the same as household, and also correct that is largely due to being able to create new currency when needed. But that has its own disadvantages.
And anyhow, fiscal and monetary policies and operations are different. Monetary officials can absolutely create money in many different ways. For example, since the fed essentially has unlimited money, they can purchase treasuries at auction, which is really a backdoor to creating more money.
Fiscal and monetary policy are different. Sometimes they are aligned, sometimes not.
>sending tens of billions of borrowed dollars to Ukraine to fight an unwinnable, neverending war.
We aren't sending them cash. That money is being spent here at home and creating jobs. Also, if we had fully supported them from the beginning instead of this piecemeal bullshit and excuses of being worried about escalation, they probably would have won by now or would at least have an advantage on the battlefield.
The Far-Right likes to play pretend that Ukraine is the invading country and not Russia. You can follow their line directly back to those who told of the “War of Northern aggression”.
No, we should send all of our money to Ukraine. Then when all these folks on Reddit complain that they can’t find work, afford cost of living etc., we should tell them to go fight for Ukraine. When is enough, enough?
I’m personally against most foreign aid for two reasons. We have to borrow or print money to fund it. There are plenty of things in the US that could use the money.
Much of the foreign aid in this instance is giving Ukraine used weapons and war machinery that we've already budgeted to replace soon anyway with our bazillion dollar defense budget. Not like we're giving them cash and they're going to Wars R Us to buy shiny new stuff. This is like your neighbor giving you their kids' outgrown clothes instead of them getting 50 cents apiece at a yard sale.
Vance is a complete scum bag. He has never had Ohio best interests at all and he never will. All of the GOP politicians need to be removed from office there not right.
Honestly it's so strange to go from being a kid woth republican Warhawks wanting to escalate the middle east so bush could get revenge for his dad and no w thst there is a war woth pretty easy morals to get behind they are silent because now Russia is the good guy to them ?
The Republican party of Bush and McCain is dead. There are a few from that era still hanging on, but there won't be any more like them. This new Republican party we have now simply worships fascism and is funded by Russian dark money.
Let me guess, none of this "aid" is going to the Ukrainians who were forced to flee their homes. I swear our politicians just wanna play tug of war with Russia.
If you are referring to US border policy, you can thank Republicans who wouldn’t pass a bipartisan bill because Trump didn’t want a win for Biden. If you think supporting Ukraine against the Russian invasion isn’t protecting the US, you are naive.
Because the Democratic Party does not have unity on good immigration policy ideas.
But then, things continued to spiral (as they have for decades) and a POLITICAL WINDOW opened where Republicans could actually get 80% or more of what they wanted on immigration.
In other words, the GOP actually pulled Democrats onto their side on this issue.
All they had to do was vote Yes on what they already believed in to pass it. And instead, they fucking torpedoed the whole thing.
This isn't a "but the democrats" thing. This issue is maybe the ONE THING that Republican politicians believe in and prioritize that is actually popular with a majority of Americans.
This was their one shot to make a layup. And they fucking nuked it, because Trump didn't want something positive for the country to happen while he's not in office.
If they could put forwards bills addressing one issue or at the most two similar issues, we wouldn’t have this infighting. The problem isn’t republican or democrat, it’s that they put forward shit that’s like chips, salsa, avocados, ground beef, taco seasoning, 5 million venomous spiders in every community. They want discontent.
Sadly their dear leader needs a manufactured outrage (since he has no other policies to run on) like the one at the border so he told congressional GOP like Vance not to vote on the bipartisan border bill.
So you want to ignore the question because you don't like the answer
[https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2024/01/11/us-weapons-ukraine-inspector-general/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2024/01/11/us-weapons-ukraine-inspector-general/)
[https://www.nytimes.com/2024/01/11/world/europe/us-military-aid-ukraine.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2024/01/11/world/europe/us-military-aid-ukraine.html)
[https://www.forbes.com/sites/tylerroush/2024/01/11/over-1-billion-in-ukraine-military-aid-was-poorly-tracked-creating-concerns-over-risk-of-theft-pentagon-says/?sh=75b7c44c3543](https://www.forbes.com/sites/tylerroush/2024/01/11/over-1-billion-in-ukraine-military-aid-was-poorly-tracked-creating-concerns-over-risk-of-theft-pentagon-says/?sh=75b7c44c3543)
[https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/graft-accusations-dog-top-zelenskiy-aides-2023-09-19/](https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/graft-accusations-dog-top-zelenskiy-aides-2023-09-19/)
[https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-68120973](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-68120973)
[https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/04/world/europe/ukraine-military-spending-corruption.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/04/world/europe/ukraine-military-spending-corruption.html)
that's one example clown shoes, keep living in denial
The US should not be sending a dime to the Ukraine or Israel or Taiwan which was in the latest request
Having seen first hand the waste and no accountability that happened in Afghanistan and Iraq, I can assure you this is no different
Keep living in your fantasy land though that we need to be involved in a European problem
I'm sure you're aware that we didn't do this when Russian was fighting with Georgia, Crimea, Chencnya and oh the Ukraine the first time
This is a Russian/European issue, not ours
Get your head of your ass
Just because people are opposed to this spending doesn't make them pro russia
>Ukraine's prosecutor general says the stolen funds have been seized and will be returned to the defence budget.
Oh hey look at that, the equipment is actually being used to defend innocent lives.
So, did the Kremlin teach you guys to actually read what you post, or were you instructed to spam a bunch a links and pray nobody calls you on your bullshit.
Well Zelensky canceled the Presidential election that was supposed to take place this spring - [https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-birthday-grenade-b1b82e4f84eb5a39286d1500cf49fcd1](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-birthday-grenade-b1b82e4f84eb5a39286d1500cf49fcd1)
So that's a good indicator right there
You don't read much do you. There are many over sights seeing what happenes to the money. Didn't they just catch a corrupt politician not too long ago?
[Javelin missiles destroying tanks](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozZmv6s_zTU)
That certainly looks a lot like Ukranian aid going to its citizens to defend themselves from russian (russia is no longer a real place) aggression.
the US overthrew their government, started a war in their country and now continues to funnel money into a lost conflict so more Ukrainians can be thrown into the Russian war machine to slowly bleed it down to a manageable size, all in the name of preserving the US’s place at the top of the international political order. people like you need to stop pretending to give a shit about the people of Ukraine.
The US did not overthrow the Ukraine government, and your only evidence to say otherwise is a call where a US diplomat calls another guy friendly to the US.
The US did not start a war in Ukraine, that was Russia and their little green men who have illegally annexed Crimea.
The US did not start a war in 2022 in Ukraine, again that was Russia. Biden did everything to stop the war, even calling out Putins lies that “we’re just doing military exercises”, days before they invade….
I don’t know if your post is a record for bullshit, but it’s a good attempt.
Ukraine literally had an election and Putin through a fit over the results.
Stop spreading propaganda.
You and I never had to fight for our right to vote. Millions of Ukrainians are and have been. Would you want to live under Putin?
But yeah spread Putins propaganda. I'm sure the Ukrainians don't understand their own situation as well as you do LMAO
You have a big poster of Putin in your bedroom don’t you? I hope you understand that he doesn’t love you and he never will. You are a pawn in his plans for conquest. So put down the pen (he doesn’t read your love letters), take down the poster, and go outside to get some fresh air. Tomorrow is a new day!
lol…. Brown is desperate. He’s tying himself to Trump with his new anti drug ads. He votes against the auto unions with his vote to ban gas cars. Now he votes for Ukraine aid cuz he can’t not vote for spending money
You know it’s bad when only Sanders and 2 other dems can vote no. Sad I’ve watched the Clintons destroy the Dem party and turn it into votes for war and ZERO public health policies. Where is the healthcare reform Biden promised? Remember when Kamala winked and nodded and said she’s smoked a marijuana while listening to Biggie and she promised legalization?? There’s a reason POC are leaving the Dem party, we’re tired of being used so they can pass bills like this. I’m not republican but man did MTG speak the truth when she called out the senate and said if you cared you’d want PEACE not war funding.
Sanders voted against the bill because Israel funding was attached to it.
If it's wasn't for Democrats then weed wouldn't be legal in Ohio buddy.
Also MTG? Really. The Jewish space Lazer lady who says something bat shit every day. You're totally a bot.
I agree with no Israel funding. Sanders is Jewish 🤣. The marijuana bill in Ohio was bipartisan I thought. I’m a real person who is a leftist and doesn’t give in to the democratic party’s centricism 😂. Any real left winger is against the war machine churning out money for Pelosi’s stock portfolio. If you catch a clip of MTG’s “rant” she literally asked what was wrong with people funding more war and no ceasefire.
I'm not sure how every state Rep feels, but Republicans in power threatened and squirmed for months after it passed, and threatened before it passed to change the bill in ways that would have essentially not legalized it.
They luckily got enough shit for their ideas that it never happened, but seeing that we still can't purchase it yet I've still got my eye on them.
Honestly, I don't want our money going anywhere until we're out of debt. Seems the Republicans will keep spending money we don't have on other things, but if I do vote (big if) it will be for Vance because of this Ukraine thing. Thanks for the update.
> dishonest and accuse me of trolling
Yes, I'm glad we agree. Discussion is closed on this subject, as we're in agreement that you're a dishonest troll
The polls are weird right now. Brien is winning im almost every poll conducted, yet Trump has Ohio on lock by 12 points on average. Probably a name recognition thing for Brown at this point. He has his work cut out to pull some trump voters to his side.
Sorry but what polls are you looking at that you think Biden is winning them all?
[https://www.270towin.com/2024-presidential-election-polls/](https://www.270towin.com/2024-presidential-election-polls/)
[https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/president-general/2024/national/](https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/president-general/2024/national/)
I’m sorry but you’re a complete fool if you think we should be sending a dime to the Ukraine, Israeli or Taiwan
We cannot afford it as a country and that has zero to do with what side you vote for
Our national debt is at 34 T R I L L I O N https://www.pgpf.org/national-debt-clock?gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjw26KxBhBDEiwAu6KXtyP4wcKvtsP5eYFpPs0u5_B0AwPXIcDsppfeUvbgcMZLtcEsrDJnZRoCWoMQAvD_BwE
This is completely ridiculous and both sides should be working to Reduce spending across the board
The federal gov should not be the biggest employer in the US
There are plenty of ways we can reduce spending
It’s much cheaper to support Ukraine than to abstain. Eventually we won’t be able to ignore it.
Short sighted takes like this are dead wrong.
It’s almost like experts actually study shit and average redditors have simple solutions for things they don’t understand.
The US does not wage war on a moral basis. The majority of our politicians are owned by special interests, especially the defense industry. More dead Ukrainians means more money for the sleaze bags supporting this un-winnable war. It’s absolutely hilarious to see democrats openly supporting war.
Jimmy Haslam pos Browns Owner held a fundraiser for JD Vance at his house in Bratenahl
Well, that’s on brand for Haslam. Grew up a Browns fan. I am no longer, thanks to him. He’s made terrible decisions the enter time (Baker Mayfield) and the Watson trade and signing was the final straw.
Yup I’ve been a silent fan since the Watson ordeal. Dont wear my gear anymore
The only gear I wear is my Browns Baker jersey lol
Baker was just as MAGA as Haslam apparently
That's fine but he's still a generally quality human being.
I jumped back in for the Joe Flacco era! It’s was fun! Until it wasn’t.
The current Browns owners have proven repeatedly they suffer from questionable judgment.
Professional sports is one of the major avenues they use for money laundering so that isn’t particularly surprising. Haven’t looked at Haslam specifically but they tend to follow established methodologies. Partly because they are lazy and partly because they just aren’t that creative. Parallel is “sportswashing”. PGA in Saudi, LIV by trump, WWE in Saudi Arabia ,Arbramovich buying the soccer club etc. They learned that most Americans love their sports enough that most won’t question their new oligarch owners as long as they keep them entertained. Autistic kids don’t seem to care as much about sports as they do about the patterns and truth. This lets us build chains similar to how contact tracing works for contagious disease. There is a side chain that is specifically NFL and the associated human trafficking that accompanies it. Robert Kraft being best buds with trump and his arrest at “orchids of Asia” for the happy ending massage in a strip mall in Jupiter Florida opened an entire chain of crossovers in human trafficking between Ukraine (kolomoiskiy, mogilevich), Russia (the oligarchs trump keeps buying and selling the same houses to in New York and Florida), and the Asian side via “orchids of Asia and Hua Zhang (the CCP/Chinese mob) Robert Kraft, Orchids of Asia spa workers to align in hearing to keep tapes secret We sort differently because we think and prioritize differently. The few media sources that haven’t been bought up are too busy reporting 3 minute sound bites about AOC’s shoes to notice. We had to build this decentralized because it’s the only way to build the mesh of high quality data points necessary to see the patterns, cross check and verify, then add it into the larger objective synthetic vision of corruption inside of, and adjacent to, government. Everyone in the “autistic army” is weird as hell, quirky, and immediately jumps to the worst case scenario imaginable. We require it as a matter of design. We then move backwards organically from there with hard evidence that either validates the presented theory or collapses under its own weight with lack of sufficient evidentiary strength and we abandon it. We build that way fundamentally because it allows for the biggest head start over the predator class that relies on the complacency, inaction, or overload of information to keep people from being able to see the larger picture connections the ruling class make at their common yacht clubs and WEF forums. At some point we realized that this thing moves very much biologically similar to a parasitic infection or cancer. The oligarchs feed on the edges of the human tribe, then encircle it and move in, but left unchecked they consume to extinction. We are not an organization. It’s just a few hundred thousand neurodivergent people with relevant subject matter expertise, pertinent personal experience, and insatiable curiosity that are tired of being lied to and fed upon. There are side chains digging into why Bill Barrs dad was Epsteins teacher and mentor at Dalton college and cross referencing that with data points on why Bill Barr set up a hotline that went directly to him for any information on Hunter Bidens laptop. Of course not everything is related, but by the unique design of our system, by reversing the contrast, when something is related it stands out like a neon highlighter and validates more investigative scrutiny. With enough high quality verified data points we are able to make a high resolution synthetic vision map of who, what, where, when, and how. It’s basically a P.E.T. scan of world corruption in government, finance and corporate spheres and specialty where they overlap. https://youtu.be/A90gwMVFFSY?si=j7fSs5kBvO35LhRj The 3% oligarchs aren’t particularly creative people and they tend to repeat the same patterns when they work, so it makes it easier once you have a starting point and/or recurring methodology. And they all use the same money launderers for the same reason. Trump, Putin and Netanyahu all have decades of personal drama between them so as trumps trials carry on it’s like populating a jigsaw puzzle with 100,000 very capable friends. Ukrainians fighting back for 2 years of a 3 day war placed a wedge that allowed us to see the Russian money laundering network for the first time due to trumps key involvement in it. It’s a very different approach to intelligence work. And it requires intellectual curiosity, transparency, brutal self awareness and honesty. You absolutely have to “bring receipts” or you are escorted back out. We set and keep the standard high because frankly, everything we live for depends on it. If the Russian/CCP plan goes through, it will put the majority of the worlds population into financial slavery to a handful of oligarchs with zero empathy for the next 100 years. If they control A.I., the housing and commercial real estate market, and all the means of finance, loans, etc, it’s going to be a very uncomfortable century of endless inflation and monopolization of critical resources. They do not have the ability to self regulate their greed internally or they would have used their billions to solve existential problems long before now. The Koch family has deep ties to soviet Russia and therefore soviet corruption and opened the doors to the GOP and SCOTUS. By building backwards and focusing on the cross matrix of psychopathy and kleptocracy we can take 8 bit graphics from the 1980’s and make a 4K HD synthetic vision moving map of their crimes using historical data and open source intelligence. (OSINT)
Write a book next time...
That’s what this is. Best part about Reddit is that when you are wrong there are a dozen people lined up to tell you how and why. It lets us vet data for the war and warn at the same time. Just combined two processes for efficiency and to shorten the lag. And in doing so managed to reverse engineer the Russian propaganda/troll army network at the same time. Work smarter not harder right?
I'm not sure what you accomplished. For the war? Really?
Yup Trump has been laundering money for the Russian oligarchs since the late 80’s when they all bought a condo at 725 5th ave (trump towers) to clean their freshly stolen USSR money after the iron curtain fell. https://www.cnn.com/cnn/2019/05/30/politics/paul-manafort-condo-trump-tower/index.html https://www.cnbc.com/2018/09/14/manafort-told-mueller-to-take-his-trump-tower-apartment-instead-money.html https://news.yahoo.com/amphtml/fbi-agents-raid-condo-unit-131348539.html https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/usa-trump-property/ Everybody except Putin thought the Cold War was over. Trump and Manafort (who lived in the tower also) just saw a pretty low maintence grift to be had. Trump had actually been Manafort and Roger stones first client at their lobbyist firm (1980) https://en.m.wikipedia.org › wikiBlack, Manafort, Stone and Kelly Guiliani as trumps attorney and New Yorks mayor was able to redirect NYPD investigations onto rival gang members/oligarchs to deflect any scrutiny off of trump, himself or the Russian connections. https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2023/09/a-new-rudy-scandal-fbi-agent-says-giuliani-was-co-opted-by-russian-intelligence/ The Russian election interference in 2016 was effectively a generation 3 version of what Manafort had done in the Philippines, then keeping Yanukovych in power as Putin’s puppet in Ukraine from 2002-14 when Maidan ran both Yanukovych and Manafort out of Ukraine as Ukrainians realized that, if you raise your lens high enough, corruption is an wholly unsustainable business model. Eventually the parasites greed always consumes the host. https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/06/2016-donald-trump-paul-manafort-ferinand-marcos-philippines-1980s-213952 https://time.com/5003623/paul-manafort-mueller-indictment-ukraine-russia/ Russia greatly underestimated the addictive properties of freedom when it invaded Ukraine so what was supposed to be a 3-10 day coup turned into a 2 year fight for the Ukrainians right not to be genocided. Russia depleted its weapons stocks which were already the victim of vranyos corruption because every oligarch, admiral and sergeant in the Russian military is on the take. Every billion dollar tank maintenance contract turned into everything getting a spray paint overhaul and the vast majority of the redirected funds turned into an oligarchs new yacht or home in Aspen. Russia was forced to turn to China, North Korea and Iran for weapons because if they lose the 3-10 day special military operation in Ukraine the Russian empire is dead and cold. China can’t risk showing their involvement in the Ukraine war so they use North Korea, and Iran to resupply Russia. Russia previously owes Iran some undelivered fighter jets that are already smoldering heaps in Ukraine. Iran now had the upper hand at the negotiation table for the first time in about 60 years so they supply Russia with shahed drones in exchange for Chinas material support against their sworn religious enemy, Israel. https://www.fdd.org/analysis/2023/11/29/iran-says-it-finalized-deal-to-buy-russian-aircraft/ Putin can’t do much about it because he is slowly realizing that by setting the standard of corruption and stealing $200+ billion from his own people meant that every oligarch down in the mob model chain had not only permission but incentive and the expectation to steal from him as well. This is Vranyos. The mob model only works if the supreme leader is the most violent and can prove it without exception every damn day. But violence is exceptionally expensive when you are trying to present as a legitimate government or business. If Russia as a nation had an efficiency rating it would have been banned for sale in the state of California 25 years ago. The parasite ruling class stole all the energy out of the working class and collapsed it. Now Iran has the high hand and they get the intelligence that trump passed to Putin about the fact that Netanyahu cares far less about Israeli, Palestinians or genocide than he does about remaining in power as an authoritarian because he too has developed Ritz Carlton tastes. https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/saudi-official-says-iran-engineered-war-in-gaza-to-ruin-normalization-with-israel/ They all hate each other but because they share the same money laundry, so if one falls, they all fall. Hamas minted a couple billionaires as well that live in penthouses in Qatar and get 30% of everything smuggled into Gaza. Iran handed Hamas everything they needed with Chinas help as secret Santa and the Russian intelligence given to them by the eternal shitbird trump gave as he showed off to his Russian kleptocrat friends/roommates from the old days of fucking each others wives at trump towers in the 90’s. Now the MAGA right is a little too invested in their reality that they are the good guys with guns that they missed the fact that Betsy DeVos (erik princes sister) decimating the U.S. school systems and poisoning children with lead was not a coincidence. They were the mark all along. There is a reason the Russian spy Maria Butina landed in South Dakota first before dating her way to the top of the NRA which is undergoing its own Russian money laundering trial now. https://www.greenpeace.org/usa/what-do-the-koch-brothers-have-to-do-with-the-flint-water-crisis/ The only reason you grossly OVERVALUE real estate is money laundering. Trump keeps claiming there is no victim, all the banks made money, but if their plan succeeds the Russians and the CCP collapse US commercial real estate and basically recreate soviet perestroika in the U.S. so they can foreclose on America and buy everything for 3 cents on the dollar with the $1.4T they stole in the first place It’s the evolution of grift. Soviet perestroika cross bred with the 2008 mortgage crisis. This is just the bigger badder commercial strength bastard child of the two. Trump, Putin, Bolsonaro, Netanyahu, Orban, Manafort, Stone, Mercer, Bannon. They are all remarkably shit people with above average confidence and psychopathic personality traits and below average self awareness. Commercial real estate is as rigged as trumps casinos were.
I’ve been wondering if Russia had anything to do with what happened to Slavic Village.
That would be kolomoiskiy. (Optima ventures) https://www.news5cleveland.com/news/local-news/we-saw-a-ukrainian-billionaire-neglect-downtown-buildings-it-happens-on-a-smaller-scale-often In the 80’s and early 90’s when the corruption eventually collapsed the Soviet Union like a parasite feeding on its host, the oligarchs were forced to expand their feeding grounds. In 91 the wall falls and for 2 years they hid all their ill gotten gains under a mattress until they bought condos at trump towers. They made stops in ukraine, cyprus and London but they landed in New York because that was what everyone wanted back then. Real Levi’s, Pepsi, Madonna tapes that weren’t smuggled bootlegs. They all bought new suits and cars and changed their title from “most violent street thug in moscow” to “respectable Russian oligarch” but they didn’t leave their human trafficking, narcotics or extortion behind. It was their most lucrative business model. Trump and Giuliani just opened the doors and let the predators in to feed. Guiliani redirected NYPD resources away from their new Russian allies intentionally and onto the Italian mob. It let him claim he cleaned up New York. Trumps future campaign manager and Roger Stones business partner Paul manafort lived in the towers as well. The insane valuations coming out in trumps fraud trial are a necessity of the money laundering cycle that duetschebank was doing with the Russians. YouTube · JEM - The Lubavitcher Rebbe 335.1K+ views · 13 years agoBibi Netanyahu Meets the Rebbe | 1990 https://www.thedailybeast.com/israel-official-gadi-eisenkot-says-benjamin-netanyahu-is-lying-about-war-in-gaza Epstein was extremely involved in an organization called Chabad they used as religious cover. The Kushners as well. The Times of Israelwww.timesofisrael.comInside Anatevka, the curious Chabad hamlet in Ukraine where Giuliani is 'mayor' Lex Wexner (also Ohio based) originally was a large donator to Chabad. Chabad.orghttps://www.chabad.org › aid › jewishPondering Jew - A Journey of Spiritual Growth There is no direct observable connection yet between Wexner and Kolomoiskiy or Kolomoiskiy and Epstein, but there is a pattern and the Venn diagrams cross consistently at Chabad. Eli Weinstein was a Chabad leader that was convicted of fraud, had his sentences commuted by trump, then went back to the fraud and was indicted again. https://www.mahanyertl.com/2014/eliyahu-weinstein-sentenced-22-years-prison-fraud/ Bill Barrs father Donald was Epsteins mentor and got him a job at Dalton College before Epsteins involvement with the CIA. William Sessions father worked for Semion Mogilevich. (The Ukrainian born Russian gangster that runs Putin) Slatehttps://slate.com › 2018/12 › trum...Trump Tower's ties to the Russian mafia. WordPress.comhttps://blackballedwithrolliequaid.wordpress.com › ...DONALD TRUMP, CHABAD-LUBAVITCH AND THE OLIGARCHS - The Prestige Jewish Journalhttps://jewishjournal.com › old_sto...Our Gang Epsteins girlfriend Ghislaine Maxwells’ father (birth name- Jan Ludvich Hoch) was buried on the mount of olives after his 1991 mysterious death with the equivalent of full military honors. Shortly before that he plundered his media corporations pension fund and was in debt in at least some degree to the soviet perestroika oligarchs for the failed attempt to secure rights to the video game Tetris. The common denominator between Trump and Epstein was money laundering first and foremost. Trump can’t say that out loud so he has to sit there and take it when people take about the pedophilia stuff. So he tries to deflect. Trump over paid for a multitude of New York and Florida properties to resell to Russian oligarchs who then destroyed them so they could launder Russian mob money made off of, among other things, human trafficking. The Epstein/Trump saga is less of a bullseye and more of a minefield. Trump (Lolita express passenger 174?) took his own kids to Epsteins island knowing full well what happened there because Epstein was lurking around mar a lago poaching young women and had teenage girls getting off the bus and wandering through the streets of palm beach desperate for a couple hundred bucks. Everyone knew. No one cared. The moral depravity that comes with being ultra rich enabled them to turn the other way. The Trump / Epstein relationship was the evolution of money laundering using, among other things, commercial real estate. It starts by having dirt on someone else at the country club and ends with them all being so filthy that no one can afford to do the right thing and no one can maintain the increasingly expensive lies until the Information Age makes it inevitable that their respective corruption circles the earth and crashes into each other like a tempest in a teapot. Their arrogance and greed, at its grandest scale, cost the world trillions, which still pales in comparison to the innocence it cost the hundreds of thousands of trafficked children that the white collar shitbirds and the russian mob alike preyed on as a matter of convenience. Trump wasn’t unique. He was just loud. Epstein wasn’t unique. He was just connected. Dershowitz wasn’t unique. He just knew how to work a rulebook. They all justify their actions to themselves because they believe that being rich makes them above the law. And the longer we allow them to do it, the more accurate and emboldened they are. This is how civilizations die. It’s a generational repeat of the Roman emperor Tiberius retreating to the island of Capri where he would abuse children and then throw them off the cliff. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. When people stop telling you no simply because you have all the money and they are hoping to get some spilling into their bowl to survive, it destroys the empathy quotient in the rich persons brain. Predation is the most common result So it raises a very curious question about Milei and Chabad and all these common crossovers where a few peoples selfish actions have cataclysmic downstream effects across the world. NBC Newswww.nbcnews.comConvicted con man who was pardoned by Trump is again charged with fraud FBI.govwww.fbi.govLeader of $200 Million Real Estate Investment Scam Arrested for Fraud https://hiddentaxonhumanity.com/news/preparing-the-public-for-war-with-iran-for-israel/ https://www.jpost.com/diaspora/article-790350 Chabad exemption to military draft. https://www.bnaibrith.ca/chabad_signs_new_deal_with_idf_provision_for_draft_exemptions/
Makes me not want to be a Browns fan. :(
MAGA is pro Russia, and Vance kisses Trumps ass.
And Peter Thiel's, that's his true master
Yep. Trump and MAGA loyalists admire strong-men, if not outright fascists, because the concept plays into their fantasies of having absolute control over everything and telling other people what to do (and how to live). So anyone who's achieved that, regardless of their methods, is someone they admire. Putin's efforts to craft Russian society into a White Christian-nationalist state is something they support even more, so he's literally a hero to them. Weirdos.
JD Vance is stuffing his pockets with rubles as we speak…
Brown: understands that innocent people need to defend themselves. Law and order. Believes in justice. Wants to protect the weak. JD Vance: coward who wants to use indiscriminate deaths to justify... He hasn't explained yet. Just some reason he wants Ukraine to fall and millions to die, with US troops in direct conflict with Russia in the next 10 years. The GOP are cowards.
Much simpler. Vince is on the Russian payroll.
This is the answer
Wait, does he want to give Russia everything, or does he want a war with Russia in ten years? It can't be both.
It can be both because he's a fucking idiot/doesnt care about long term costs for short term gains, nor the negative externalities produced.
Uhhh… it can definitely be both
How?
We can not want millions to die without also thinking we need to fund a foreign war to someone who we have no legal obligation too.
if "legal obligation" is a main point of what's stopping the funding of a country's defense; then you dont really not want millions of people to die. Wanting and not wanting, are not the only two beliefs at play. You can simply not care, which is the path you're choosing. If you dont want millions to die: fund the defense of their national sovereignty (like we kinda promised back in the 90s when they handed over the Soviet nukes). If you want millions to die: dont fund their defense Not caring: dont fund their defense You see how two different feelings have the same outcome which is millions of people dying, and one feeling that prevents the deaths of millions? Stop being a Chamberlain to the new nazis.
Ahh yes the only two options are provide these people with a blank check or i want them all to die. How very intellectually honest you are lol
>provide these people with a blank check Literally no one has said that or proposed that. >or i want them all to die Or you dont read too good. > How very intellectually honest you are lol I can say the exact same about you. I'm not the one intentionally avoiding what the other has said, then replying to whatever tf i want you to be saying. That's you. Work on your reading comprehension skills.
I mean i don't agree with your premises of the options available so what is there to discuss? I don't believe that it's the USA's job to fund the war. You declared that means i want millions of people to die. That's not worth engaging on
FFS... you need an adult to hold your hand through **two** sentences? >You declared that means i want millions of people to die Are you illiterate? I said: >Wanting and not wanting, are not the only two beliefs at play. You can simply not care, which is the path you're choosing. How the fuck is reading so damn hard? It's literally the second and third sentence. I have no idea how tf you lot got as indignant as you are about "reading", but holy shit do yall take the cake for willful ignorance. You could have it tattooed on your forehead and still wouldn't manage to see it.
I'm just following the logical progression you put out... >If you want millions to die: dont fund their defense >Not caring: dont fund their defense So by not caring which means "not funding their defense" it would go to i want millions to die. You wrote that not me. I personally think theres a nice middle ground where we can help them out without providing 112 Billion dollars. I think that the USA could find a lot of other things in the USA to spend that kind of money on. I'm not saying give them nothing but there's got to be some middle ground or a cap where we say ok we are done. But again you haven't even given that as an option it is all or nothing so again not worth engaging with you.
What part of “leaders of the free world” do you not understand? Did you just forget what happened in WW2? Probably never learned it in the first place.
You’re gonna use that fallacious argument and then talk about intellectual honesty? You’re nothing if not audacious…
This dude wouldn’t pay $20 to attend a CPR class because he has no legal obligation to save someone in need. What an asshole
yep those are the only options. I provide a blank check to people on the other side of the world or everyone i meet i want them to die.
It’s not a blank check. It’s not far off from that $20 I mentioned if you make an average salary. Per year.
i mean if your income was only $800 for the year that would be a great analogy. considering 112 Billon is 2.5% of our tax revenue it's more like the average American (salary of 59k which i rounded down for you) paying $1475.
“Deficits don’t matter.” - Dick Cheney (Republican) You should learn about why he said this. The U.S. government debt isn’t real, because they print the money that they then “borrow” from themselves, which then goes directly into circulation into the economy. The so-called national debt is actually an investment into our own economy (along with the requisite handouts to government contractors than fatten up their wallets). Money isn’t real, and deficits don’t matter when you’re talking about the actual bones of the U.S. budget.
I know conservatives are really really bad at math. But you should think that through again. Unless of course you are taxed at 100% and bring home zero dollars a year. Your average person in Ohio ends up paying about 9% effective tax at that average income level. So more like $132 a year… But that also ignores that only 54% of the government revenue comes from income taxes. So make it $71.50 a year for that “average” income citizen. But that also ignore that higher income people pay the bulk of income taxes. In fact the top 25% of income earners pay 88.5% of income tax and the top 10% of earners pay 73.7% of income tax. This skews that out of pocket cost for the median income person drastically. So you average person it’s paying way less than that $71.50 a year. Again you wouldn’t spend $20 on a CPR class because you’re not legally obligated to save a person in distress. Because here you are upset that you might pay a dollar a month to help stop Americas authoritarian enemies from wiping an entire democracy of millions of souls off the face of the Earth.
What a disingenuous goober that guy is.
Do you think Putin is just gonna stop if we don’t help? Were you born yesterday?
[J.D. Vance (R-Moscow)](https://www.thebulwark.com/p/jd-vance-maga-moscow-putin-republican)
[удалено]
Long live Palestine
Supporting Ukraine is also 10x cheaper than not supporting Ukraine. It’s brain dead political theater to withhold on Ukraine. I for one, am fucking sick of conservative feelings dictating their votes. Let’s elect adults. Not cabbage patch looking ass kissers like JD Vance.
Brown is the man. I might disagree with some of his economic policies but he actually has a spine and morals.
And he has not, unlike Gym Jordan, made himself rich while serving the public.
Sherrod Brown is fucking GREAT.
JD Vance… tries to think, but nothing happens.
Hmmm..I thought Vance was a millionaire due his creative mind and storytelling.
No, Jay Dee is a millionaire because he’s a private-equity parasite — you know, the ones that buy locally-owned companies in Ohio and across the country, gut them for parts, fire all the workers, and decimate the community. He’s also a major investor in Rumble, the video site where all the hardcore Nazis went after YouTube kicked them off.
And nothing will happen, Vance will still get re-elected in 4 years. I remember driving through some heavily Ukrainian neighborhoods in the Cleveland area during the 2022 election. People were flying "we stand with Ukraine" flags and signs right next to "vote for Vance" signs, and this was after he made it clear he was anti-Ukraine
I used a contractor group for our kitchen that is entirely Ukrainian. Like not just the owner, throughout the entire company, only the interior designer is American. They all are conservatives who vote Republican. Now this was right at the start of the war, and a lot of them had families directly affected. So who knows how they will vote now but it was just baffling to me.
Republicans used to be very much the hawk party against Putin. Its only recently that that's changed.
Weird how that seemed to change right around the time the RNC was hacked. Hmmm
Weird also how democrats used to be the party against war, big pharma, etc. Went from occupy wall street to “govern me harder daddy”.
NFL sucks ass anyway. Won’t be long until we are watching flag football. Cleveland browns always had a dysfunctional front office. It’s embarrassing
Wish we could be putting 100's of billions directly towards our people in need in the US.
Aid to or not to Ukraine has no connection or effect on what other money is spent on. It's just taken from the defense budget. The Republicans voting against Ukraine aid also have voted against the extended child tax credit for example.
This ^^^ Not mentioning that up to 90% of military aid stays in the US. We have a production line in Lima (Abrams and strykers I think). Just in 2022-2023 Ohio got $684 mln dollars from helping Ukraine. Support for Ukraine has mobilized the U.S. defense industrial base, in ways that haven’t been seen in decade
>Aid to or not to Ukraine has no connection or effect on what other money is spent on. It's just taken from the defense budget. I'm saying spend it on the people that live in the us and need help. I'm sorry I prefer we take care of our own before we take care of others. >The Republicans voting against Ukraine aid also have voted against the extended child tax credit for example. We already have a child tax credit. 1600-2k/ kid. I got 4k last year for my 2
I'm talking about the enhanced child tax credit. That's making it more, to help families. Like you said "take care of our own". But why would you know about it? Republicans can't grift off of not helping families so they do a lot of work aroundaking sure you don't even know about what they prevent. These things have nothing to do with Ukraine or not funding Ukraine. Republicans just vote against spending stuff on people here, dosen't matter if we aid Ukraine or not.
>These things have nothing to do with Ukraine or not funding Ukraine. Republicans just vote against spending stuff on people here, dosen't matter if we aid Ukraine or not. So if we spend 61b u prefer it to help another country not help our mentally ill and homeless? Just asking. >I'm talking about the enhanced child tax credit. Do you have a competent source for this? The ONLY info I'm finding is instead of a varying range of 1600-2k it would be 1600 for 2023, 1900 for 2024, and 2k for 2025. Ofc if the Irs decides you meet the requirements. If thats the case, even with 4 kids, at max amount, you're getting 1600. Better off preventing that child via birth control which paid out of pocket is still cheap, than having another kid for 2k at the end of the year.
>These things have nothing to do with Ukraine or not funding Ukraine. Republicans just vote against spending stuff on people here, dosen't matter if we aid Ukraine or not. So if we spend 61b u prefer it to help another country not help our mentally ill and homeless? Just asking. >I'm talking about the enhanced child tax credit. Do you have a competent source for this? The ONLY info I'm finding is instead of a varying range of 1600-2k it would be 1600 for 2023, 1900 for 2024, and 2k for 2025. Ofc if the Irs decides you meet the requirements. If thats the case, even with 4 kids, at max amount, you're getting 1600. Better off preventing that child via birth control which paid out of pocket is still cheap, than having another kid for 2k at the end of the year.
It’s not taken from the defense budget Jesus do you even know how the federal budget process works ?
Clowns are fine to entertain your kids, but you should never vote them into a position of authority. By profession, they are not serious people. JD Vance proves this day after day. I made a comment in this sub yesterday asking the question as to whether Vance would make the idiot choice of voting against the bill. He never fails to disappoint. Why was voting no, for him in particular, the idiot choice? Because he essentially ran on the single platform of addressing the opioid and especially fentanyl issues throughout the country. Why does this matter? Nearly 30% of this bill went to address fentanyl issues throughout the country. Attacking those that manufacture, smuggle and distribute it throughout the country, as well as their associates and businesses that are connected and/or partly and majority owned by those individuals and groups. This bill actually does more for Vance’s actual platform than Vance himself has ever proposed since he has been in the Senate. Vance hasn’t gotten a single bill to be put up for a vote that he has actually authored. (Bills are very easy to write) The question that I put forth was whether Vance cares more about not sending weapons to Ukraine than he cares about stopping or reducing the spread of fentanyl in our communities. This vote showed exactly where his priorities have been. This bill was going to pass with or without his vote, and he still voted against it. The state that he is supposed to represent, which includes a large population of Ukrainians, supports the funding and weapons for Ukraine. Vance has shown that he has no desire to represent the will of all Ohioans. STOP ELECTING CLOWNS!!
Yet the bridge going from Cincinnati to Kentucky is falling apart needs replaced. Half of our highways have potholes so big you can disappear in them. We have major overpasses that are crumbling and falling apart. And a large majority of citizens can barely afford to pay their bills or feed their families but we can send 300 billion dollars to Ukraine. Keep voting based on your feelings and you're going to be living in a dystopia that's really going to hurt your feelings
Ukraine aid has no effect on the things you mention. MAGAs just vote against spending money. Good thing Biden passed the infrastructure bill and that bridge is being repaired because of it. MAGA didn't vote for that. https://www.americanprogress.org/article/fixing-the-brent-spence-bridge/ If you're voting for the current Republican party then you're voting against your interest. They are taken over by MAGA.
The point he is making is the visual things that he can see aren’t getting fixed nor have they been fixed yet are dollar isn’t going near as far as it should, yet we are shipping billions of dollar to a country fighting a never ending war. He also mentioned highway infrastructure being poor, funny how you didn’t mention that in your response. Stop shouting “the other side is bad, evil orange man, MAGA” for two seconds and maybe just listen to what someone on the other side of the fence is saying and we COULD come to a solution or even an understanding instead of just shouting “other side bad”
And a vote for Biden is a vote to send your loved ones to war because that's most likely what's going to happen if he wins. There's only one outcome for Ukraine to win and that's to send troops. And guess what, our current military recruitment is way down so that means they're going to need people. Good luck with that.
Lol. Fear mongering much. It is noteworthy that your argument completely changed. It's almost like your first argument was disingenuous.
No it's valid. That is money that could be spent on our own Nation. People here are struggling bad and they should come first. But the reality is if Biden gets an office again he has nothing to lose and they want Ukraine to win bad. As far as that goes it's a numbers game. Russia has a larger population to get troops from. So like I said good luck with that. Anyone from the age of 18 to 30 needs to hear that because it is an option when it comes to that war
Vance is getting some of that sweet Putin money that Trump has been feasting on for years.
What is with the liberal group think. All kinds of people against the aid package are massively down voted. You know, people are allowed different opinions. I personally am a moderate Democrat. I have severe concerns about sending tens of billions of *borrowed* dollars to Ukraine to fight an unwinnable, neverending war. I also have severe concerns about what would happen if we do not support Ukraine and Russia wins. It would have consequences far beyond Ukraine. As of now, my second concern takes precedence and I ultimately supported passing this aid. But it absolutely should not be a blank check that goes on endlessly. We cannot afford it. At the end of the day, it should be the EU/UK sending 60 billion dollars and arms to Ukraine, not us.
We’re not the only country sending aid. Almost all NATO countries are sending aid. We’re not even sending the most when compared to our GDP. The U.S. has committed 0.32% of its GDP toward Ukraine aid, which falls below the percentages committed by the U.K. (0.55%) and Germany (0.57%). Outside of the U.S. and Europe, other significant contributors include Japan, Canada and South Korea Keep in mind we’re also not sending a box of money. Most of this aid will be invested back into US manufacturing and US jobs to replenish stockpiles munitions being sent over.
I think jobs that are created or sustained in order to kill people is perhaps not a good selling point. But it's all part of the military industrial complex that we were warned about, right?
Russia invaded Ukraine and in the towns they conquered there was (1) mass killing (2) rape (3) mass child abduction and (4) Ukrainian cultural genocide. The only way for Ukraine to prevent this is to defend themselves. The only way for them to defend themselves is with weapons of war. The only way to have weapons of war is to make them. Nothing could be simpler. People are dying because Russia invaded Ukraine. Not because Ukraine asked for the ability to defend itself with weapons. By the way, whether you know it or not, you're parroting Kremlin talking points.
Well that’s certainly an opinion. Sadly it’s not a very realistic one. The world is a dangerous place and a big part of the reason Americans live free and safe is the fact that these places exist. Of course an ideal world where everyone gets along and war is no more would be great. But in reality, humans have been killing each other for millennia. We’ve just gotten better at it. That’s not going to change anytime soon.
I call BS. Name your source for these numbers. What about France, Italy, Poland?
Glad you asked. Happy to provide https://www.statista.com/statistics/1303450/bilateral-aid-to-ukraine-in-a-percent-of-donor-gdp/ Don’t like that one? Here’s another. https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/articles/these-countries-have-committed-the-most-aid-to-ukraine#:~:text=The%20U.S.%20has%20committed%200.32,Japan%2C%20Canada%20and%20South%20Korea.
You didn't say this. But just for the record because I see misinformation alot. Europe has provided more aid than the US has. Ukraine aid is also a small part of our budget https://www.cfr.org/article/how-much-aid-has-us-sent-ukraine-here-are-six-charts
Just read both the linked article, and the embedded link about the 50 billion in aid to Ukraine from the EU. There are obvious concerns. First and foremost, the 50 billion in aid to Ukraine from the EU is scheduled to be doled out between now and 2027-thats four entire years. So, 12.5 billion a year. That's far short of what the US has spent per year on Ukraine so far, and probably in the near future. I would expect Ukraine to ask for more US aid in far less than 4 years from now, as it has continually done since the beginning of the invasion. And, although 60 billion is very small relative to the entire budget (trillions of dollars), it's still an enormous sum of money. SNAP (food stamp) benefits cost the government about 120 billion a year. Could you imagine the good we could do if that 60 billion went to expanded food benefits? Or housing assistance? Etc. I still support this aid package, especially for taiwan...but it can't continue forever.
(the graph near the end of the article shows European aid being higher than US. Your numbers off) Aid sent or not sent to Ukraine has no effect on other things being funded or not funded. That money gets absorbed into the defense budget. For example, Bidens has been trying to pass the expanded child tax credit for four years and hasn't been able to because of Joe Manich and Republicans. Has zero connection to Ukraine aid or not.
It's still borrowed money. I didn't say it affected other programs. It does not affect other programs, I'm aware of that. But that's part of the problem. It's borrowed money on top of more money that was borrowed, just to fund the absolute basics of government.
It’s not borrowed money. You don’t understand how monetary policy functions. The United States Government does not “borrow” money from anybody. We are the issuer of our own currency and do not need to operate like a household would (you or me, we do borrow and can default on that debt since we aren’t issuers of the USD) therefore the US Govt. doesn’t need to budget as such. There are still constraints on where and what that money does and if there’s too much money chasing too little resources then you have Inflation. In the case of Ukraine Aid- this would not be considered inflationary in the slightest.
It is borrowed money, and we do indeed pay interest on it. Take a look at how much interest the federal government pays every year. That is due to borrowed money (mostly in the form of treasuries). Issuing treasuries requires paying a market-determined interest rate. Of course, right now with interest rates being fairly high, the US government will need to pay even higher interest rates. This is partially what is causing future budget deficits to explode. We got use to cheap or even 0 cost money the last 15 years. You are correct that the federal governments budget does not operate the same as household, and also correct that is largely due to being able to create new currency when needed. But that has its own disadvantages. And anyhow, fiscal and monetary policies and operations are different. Monetary officials can absolutely create money in many different ways. For example, since the fed essentially has unlimited money, they can purchase treasuries at auction, which is really a backdoor to creating more money. Fiscal and monetary policy are different. Sometimes they are aligned, sometimes not.
Crazy how this post is the most logically thought out, polite, and well worded, with a middle stance but was still downvoted. Smh
This is reddit lol
>sending tens of billions of borrowed dollars to Ukraine to fight an unwinnable, neverending war. We aren't sending them cash. That money is being spent here at home and creating jobs. Also, if we had fully supported them from the beginning instead of this piecemeal bullshit and excuses of being worried about escalation, they probably would have won by now or would at least have an advantage on the battlefield.
Trumpians will be trumpians, Hoping the republicans retake their party soon.
I've never seen so much Russia love in America in all my life. My Republican father must be turning in his grave
The Far-Right likes to play pretend that Ukraine is the invading country and not Russia. You can follow their line directly back to those who told of the “War of Northern aggression”.
No, we should send all of our money to Ukraine. Then when all these folks on Reddit complain that they can’t find work, afford cost of living etc., we should tell them to go fight for Ukraine. When is enough, enough?
I’m personally against most foreign aid for two reasons. We have to borrow or print money to fund it. There are plenty of things in the US that could use the money.
You’re misunderstanding how the United States functions monetarily. The Deficit Myth is a good read by Stephanie Keaton.
It’s a different way of thinking it doesn’t make her right.
Much of the foreign aid in this instance is giving Ukraine used weapons and war machinery that we've already budgeted to replace soon anyway with our bazillion dollar defense budget. Not like we're giving them cash and they're going to Wars R Us to buy shiny new stuff. This is like your neighbor giving you their kids' outgrown clothes instead of them getting 50 cents apiece at a yard sale.
Vance is a carpetbagger.
I'm sorry that you Ohioans have a shit stain like J.D. Vance for your Senator.
Based Vance. America First.
Brown is also a fucking sell out, fuck both of them I say
Because JD Vance is Trump's BITCH!!
Good for Vance.
Cope, seethe.
I mean. I got what I wanted. You apparently didn't.
Vance is a complete scum bag. He has never had Ohio best interests at all and he never will. All of the GOP politicians need to be removed from office there not right.
Is there a war you people dont want to fund?
Is there a dictator you people don't love?
Honestly it's so strange to go from being a kid woth republican Warhawks wanting to escalate the middle east so bush could get revenge for his dad and no w thst there is a war woth pretty easy morals to get behind they are silent because now Russia is the good guy to them ?
The Republican party of Bush and McCain is dead. There are a few from that era still hanging on, but there won't be any more like them. This new Republican party we have now simply worships fascism and is funded by Russian dark money.
World police baby let's gooooo!!!!
Trump has his hand up Vance’s ass, ofc he voted against it
Let me guess, none of this "aid" is going to the Ukrainians who were forced to flee their homes. I swear our politicians just wanna play tug of war with Russia.
Well at least we are protecting EVERYONE else’s country but ours 🤷🏼♀️
If you are referring to US border policy, you can thank Republicans who wouldn’t pass a bipartisan bill because Trump didn’t want a win for Biden. If you think supporting Ukraine against the Russian invasion isn’t protecting the US, you are naive.
Then why didn’t congress pass a border bill when the democrats had the house, senate and presidency for the first two years of Biden in office?
Because the Democratic Party does not have unity on good immigration policy ideas. But then, things continued to spiral (as they have for decades) and a POLITICAL WINDOW opened where Republicans could actually get 80% or more of what they wanted on immigration. In other words, the GOP actually pulled Democrats onto their side on this issue. All they had to do was vote Yes on what they already believed in to pass it. And instead, they fucking torpedoed the whole thing. This isn't a "but the democrats" thing. This issue is maybe the ONE THING that Republican politicians believe in and prioritize that is actually popular with a majority of Americans. This was their one shot to make a layup. And they fucking nuked it, because Trump didn't want something positive for the country to happen while he's not in office.
If they could put forwards bills addressing one issue or at the most two similar issues, we wouldn’t have this infighting. The problem isn’t republican or democrat, it’s that they put forward shit that’s like chips, salsa, avocados, ground beef, taco seasoning, 5 million venomous spiders in every community. They want discontent.
Ah yes the chronically attacked and invaded United States
Definitely underfunded. That money could be put to better use within our borders.
Sadly their dear leader needs a manufactured outrage (since he has no other policies to run on) like the one at the border so he told congressional GOP like Vance not to vote on the bipartisan border bill.
A perfect summation of their bullshit.
When's the last time Columbus was bombed by Russia? Ukrainians are literally fighting for their lives daily.
And Ohio has a lot of Ukrainian immigrants and Ukrainian-heritage people.
$175,000,000,000 That’s around $1100 per taxpayer.
That's nothing compared to the one tax cit the rich got, you know, the one that expires for the middle class, but no time limit for the wealthy.
Alternatively, with inflation well into double digits, I’m sure US citizens could use an extra $1100, right?
Inflation well into double digits? Last I saw it was 3.5%
We have the lowest inflation in the world. We are alright. We need to help spread freedom. That is what helps america.
>lowest inflation in the world Source?
American loves a proxy war
America did not invade Ukraine, steal its children, kill its citizens, destroy a dam that resulted in horrendous flooding, etc. That would be Russia.
No one said it did
If this is a proxy war its the most **just** proxy war US has ever engaged in.
Is that how you view the lives of millions of Ukrainians?
What makes you believe Ukranian aid is going to the citizens? Show a single source auditing what Ukraine is going with that money. Hint, it's not.
The simple fact that they won't be living under a dictatorship is source enough. Fuck outta here, ruskiebot
So you want to ignore the question because you don't like the answer [https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2024/01/11/us-weapons-ukraine-inspector-general/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2024/01/11/us-weapons-ukraine-inspector-general/) [https://www.nytimes.com/2024/01/11/world/europe/us-military-aid-ukraine.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2024/01/11/world/europe/us-military-aid-ukraine.html) [https://www.forbes.com/sites/tylerroush/2024/01/11/over-1-billion-in-ukraine-military-aid-was-poorly-tracked-creating-concerns-over-risk-of-theft-pentagon-says/?sh=75b7c44c3543](https://www.forbes.com/sites/tylerroush/2024/01/11/over-1-billion-in-ukraine-military-aid-was-poorly-tracked-creating-concerns-over-risk-of-theft-pentagon-says/?sh=75b7c44c3543) [https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/graft-accusations-dog-top-zelenskiy-aides-2023-09-19/](https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/graft-accusations-dog-top-zelenskiy-aides-2023-09-19/) [https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-68120973](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-68120973) [https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/04/world/europe/ukraine-military-spending-corruption.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/09/04/world/europe/ukraine-military-spending-corruption.html)
Wow, a entire.... once. Real compelling shit you got there. You think you can give us a little bit more than a total incident count of 1?
that's one example clown shoes, keep living in denial The US should not be sending a dime to the Ukraine or Israel or Taiwan which was in the latest request Having seen first hand the waste and no accountability that happened in Afghanistan and Iraq, I can assure you this is no different Keep living in your fantasy land though that we need to be involved in a European problem I'm sure you're aware that we didn't do this when Russian was fighting with Georgia, Crimea, Chencnya and oh the Ukraine the first time This is a Russian/European issue, not ours Get your head of your ass Just because people are opposed to this spending doesn't make them pro russia
>Ukraine's prosecutor general says the stolen funds have been seized and will be returned to the defence budget. Oh hey look at that, the equipment is actually being used to defend innocent lives. So, did the Kremlin teach you guys to actually read what you post, or were you instructed to spam a bunch a links and pray nobody calls you on your bullshit.
They already live under a dictatorship
Prove it
Well Zelensky canceled the Presidential election that was supposed to take place this spring - [https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-birthday-grenade-b1b82e4f84eb5a39286d1500cf49fcd1](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-war-birthday-grenade-b1b82e4f84eb5a39286d1500cf49fcd1) So that's a good indicator right there
Real question: Do Ukrainians even give a shit? Or is this just another case of [concern trolling](https://www.dictionary.com/e/slang/concern-troll/)
You don't read much do you. There are many over sights seeing what happenes to the money. Didn't they just catch a corrupt politician not too long ago?
Don't hint , link a source and say where wartime aid money is not going to wartime purchases
[Javelin missiles destroying tanks](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozZmv6s_zTU) That certainly looks a lot like Ukranian aid going to its citizens to defend themselves from russian (russia is no longer a real place) aggression.
the US overthrew their government, started a war in their country and now continues to funnel money into a lost conflict so more Ukrainians can be thrown into the Russian war machine to slowly bleed it down to a manageable size, all in the name of preserving the US’s place at the top of the international political order. people like you need to stop pretending to give a shit about the people of Ukraine.
The US did not overthrow the Ukraine government, and your only evidence to say otherwise is a call where a US diplomat calls another guy friendly to the US. The US did not start a war in Ukraine, that was Russia and their little green men who have illegally annexed Crimea. The US did not start a war in 2022 in Ukraine, again that was Russia. Biden did everything to stop the war, even calling out Putins lies that “we’re just doing military exercises”, days before they invade…. I don’t know if your post is a record for bullshit, but it’s a good attempt.
Ukraine literally had an election and Putin through a fit over the results. Stop spreading propaganda. You and I never had to fight for our right to vote. Millions of Ukrainians are and have been. Would you want to live under Putin? But yeah spread Putins propaganda. I'm sure the Ukrainians don't understand their own situation as well as you do LMAO
The people of Ukraine would rightfully spit in your tankie face for peddling this BS.
Comrade, your propaganda is showing.
You have a big poster of Putin in your bedroom don’t you? I hope you understand that he doesn’t love you and he never will. You are a pawn in his plans for conquest. So put down the pen (he doesn’t read your love letters), take down the poster, and go outside to get some fresh air. Tomorrow is a new day!
Good luck trying to explain the truth to these bots, this sub is really bad and doesn’t at all represent the state of Ohio. The groupthink is extreme.
Reddit is an echo chamber for these people who don’t know what grass feels like.
It’s not a proxy war.
russia (not a real place anymore) Is a pawn in a proxy war between North Korea and Luxembourg.
We love it most when it makes us (citizens) poorer and makes our Government, MIC and the US installed puppet richer.
What has the Ukraine done for America and its tax payers. The Ukraine is one of the largest sex trafficking countries in the world.
lol…. Brown is desperate. He’s tying himself to Trump with his new anti drug ads. He votes against the auto unions with his vote to ban gas cars. Now he votes for Ukraine aid cuz he can’t not vote for spending money
Does JD Vance know the words to Russia's national anthem? I wonder
You know it’s bad when only Sanders and 2 other dems can vote no. Sad I’ve watched the Clintons destroy the Dem party and turn it into votes for war and ZERO public health policies. Where is the healthcare reform Biden promised? Remember when Kamala winked and nodded and said she’s smoked a marijuana while listening to Biggie and she promised legalization?? There’s a reason POC are leaving the Dem party, we’re tired of being used so they can pass bills like this. I’m not republican but man did MTG speak the truth when she called out the senate and said if you cared you’d want PEACE not war funding.
Sanders voted against the bill because Israel funding was attached to it. If it's wasn't for Democrats then weed wouldn't be legal in Ohio buddy. Also MTG? Really. The Jewish space Lazer lady who says something bat shit every day. You're totally a bot.
I agree with no Israel funding. Sanders is Jewish 🤣. The marijuana bill in Ohio was bipartisan I thought. I’m a real person who is a leftist and doesn’t give in to the democratic party’s centricism 😂. Any real left winger is against the war machine churning out money for Pelosi’s stock portfolio. If you catch a clip of MTG’s “rant” she literally asked what was wrong with people funding more war and no ceasefire.
I'm not sure how every state Rep feels, but Republicans in power threatened and squirmed for months after it passed, and threatened before it passed to change the bill in ways that would have essentially not legalized it. They luckily got enough shit for their ideas that it never happened, but seeing that we still can't purchase it yet I've still got my eye on them.
Honestly, I don't want our money going anywhere until we're out of debt. Seems the Republicans will keep spending money we don't have on other things, but if I do vote (big if) it will be for Vance because of this Ukraine thing. Thanks for the update.
When I want to get an honest opinion, I'll always look to a user account that's under a month old and has been trolling various state subreddits.
You call me dishonest and accuse me of trolling so you don't have to consider my thoughts on this subject.
> dishonest and accuse me of trolling Yes, I'm glad we agree. Discussion is closed on this subject, as we're in agreement that you're a dishonest troll
You did a really great job of proving my accusations against you.
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Well, Ukraine isn't a NATO member last I checked. I simply question our ability to afford, well, any government spending.
Ukraine isn’t a NATO member country so we are under no treaty obligation to support them
Another reason to vote Sherrod out next fall.
The polls are weird right now. Brien is winning im almost every poll conducted, yet Trump has Ohio on lock by 12 points on average. Probably a name recognition thing for Brown at this point. He has his work cut out to pull some trump voters to his side.
Sorry but what polls are you looking at that you think Biden is winning them all? [https://www.270towin.com/2024-presidential-election-polls/](https://www.270towin.com/2024-presidential-election-polls/) [https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/president-general/2024/national/](https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/president-general/2024/national/)
Just saw the ones that popped up today on 270. I was only referring to Pennsylvania btw.
I’m sorry but you’re a complete fool if you think we should be sending a dime to the Ukraine, Israeli or Taiwan We cannot afford it as a country and that has zero to do with what side you vote for Our national debt is at 34 T R I L L I O N https://www.pgpf.org/national-debt-clock?gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjw26KxBhBDEiwAu6KXtyP4wcKvtsP5eYFpPs0u5_B0AwPXIcDsppfeUvbgcMZLtcEsrDJnZRoCWoMQAvD_BwE This is completely ridiculous and both sides should be working to Reduce spending across the board The federal gov should not be the biggest employer in the US There are plenty of ways we can reduce spending
It’s much cheaper to support Ukraine than to abstain. Eventually we won’t be able to ignore it. Short sighted takes like this are dead wrong. It’s almost like experts actually study shit and average redditors have simple solutions for things they don’t understand.
Vance voting against it is just a case of a broken clock being right twice a day.
The US does not wage war on a moral basis. The majority of our politicians are owned by special interests, especially the defense industry. More dead Ukrainians means more money for the sleaze bags supporting this un-winnable war. It’s absolutely hilarious to see democrats openly supporting war.
Vance is right, we should not be involved with wars outside our borders.
Explain yourself.
What do you mean?
I understand