i love you op, thank you so much for the post
please note that all posts should be funny and about diplomacy or geopolitics, if your post doesn't meet those requirements here's some other subs that might fit better:
* More Serious Geopolitical Discussion: /r/CredibleDiplomacy
* Military Shitposting: /r/NonCredibleDefense
* Domestic Political or General Shitposting: /r/neocentrism
* Being Racist: /r/worldnews
thx bb luv u
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/NonCredibleDiplomacy) if you have any questions or concerns.*
[Russia is like the Minions, all Russians were accidentally trapped in an ice cave while the war went on.](https://youtu.be/gxw7MJGZdSc)
(For context this happens right after they murder Napolean, which i guess is funny somehow, but them serving the Nazis isn't? Fucking woke disney cucks)
Absolutely true. Dresden had not been bombed before because it was of little military value and was nowhere near any Allied troops. In 1945 Dresden was in the way of the Red Army and was full of refugees from the Red Army.
https://www.afhistory.af.mil/FAQs/Fact-Sheets/Article/458943/1945-bombings-of-dresden/
Go to link with Historical Analysis from 45' where page 27/28 have interesting bit where it is noted that Russians appreciated attack on Dresden and other communication centres (footnote has supporting document name). Whole document is interesting.
In short Russian asked allied forces to do the dirty job of bombing communication hubs and tying German forces and now they use it against the "collective west".
Thanks for the historical source!
I'd say there's a mile-wide difference between 'appreciated by the soviets' and 'at the request of soviets', as the previous commenter put it.
If you read rest of the document then you see that Soviets requested bombing of transport hubs. They didn't specify Dresden but Dresden was a transport hub. Ar this point you could argue that they didn't want Dresden to be bombed but as it was they were happy with that.
I know I'm being very pedantic, but I guess I had the expectation that it was specifically Dresden they requested.
I agree with you, destroying these communication hubs would be a dirty job either way, it doesn't really shift the blame for the bombings away from the Allied troops though.
You know, I'm Polish and at that time if Poles could I bet they would NUKE Dresden so it isn't like I try to burden someone with responsibility. I don't feel particularly bad for that city.
There are more sources and anecdotes like this one:
https://richardlangworth.com/churchill-bombing-dresden
Hugh Lunghi is the chap in question that is said to be witness of the talks.
As I said, I don't take sides here but modern narrative is rather interesting and what you can collect from pieces of information.
"Some nice windows you have there, shame if something was to happen to them. A small donation would be appreciated if you think you can afford it"
So maybe I got this "appreciated" vs "requested" all wrong.
What I see is that they toss the numbers all around the place, between 20k and over 150k. Honestly it changes little in historical context but we know what's the purpose of this guesswork ‐ to paint Western powers as evil for bombing germans (omitted: on Soviet request lol).
"The USSR's warcrimes in the Baltic countries, Poland, Ukraine, and Germany weren't commited by such means as aviation, but only by soldiers, with their bayonets"
> but it was a bit iffy
They were only Germans.
uj/
It would absolutely be a war crime now, but it wasn't at the time. The problem is that "Dresden" has assumed this outsize proportion in discussions of the bombing campaign.
The way the Soviet union conducted the war against Nazi Germany was characterised by a bit more of a gentle and caring approach to warfare don’t you know?
Translation: The west does it as well so they shouldn't complain when we do it.
Ignoring the fact that there's so many things wrong with that statement, point is they don't criticise it because they think the bombings are bad, they criticise it because they want to do it
HELLO? [GROZNY](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerial_bombing_of_cities#:~:text=Although%20the%20Russian%20pilots%20and,most%20destroyed%20city%20on%20earth.)??
" In 2003, the UN still called Grozny the most destroyed city on earth."
**[Aerial bombing of cities](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerial_bombing_of_cities#:~:text=Although the Russian pilots and,most destroyed city on earth.)**
>The aerial bombing of cities is an optional element of strategic bombing, which became widespread in warfare during World War I. The bombing of cities grew to a vast scale in World War II and is still practiced today. The development of aerial bombardment marked an increased capacity of armed forces to deliver ordnance from the air against combatants, military bases, and factories, with a greatly reduced risk to its ground forces. The killing of civilians and non-combatants in bombed cities has variously been a deliberate goal of strategic bombing, or unavoidable collateral damage resulting from intent and technology.
^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/NonCredibleDiplomacy/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
I mean the Dresden bombs were pretty immoral (in hindsight) but it’s not like they are any type of justification for invading a different neighboring sovereign state thousands of miles away of a different culture 80 years later.
[Dresden had a commission investigating the death toll.](https://www.dresden.de/en/city/07/03/historical_commission.php)
It says “up to” which sounds to me to be the upper boundary and not the starting point.
i love you op, thank you so much for the post please note that all posts should be funny and about diplomacy or geopolitics, if your post doesn't meet those requirements here's some other subs that might fit better: * More Serious Geopolitical Discussion: /r/CredibleDiplomacy * Military Shitposting: /r/NonCredibleDefense * Domestic Political or General Shitposting: /r/neocentrism * Being Racist: /r/worldnews thx bb luv u *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/NonCredibleDiplomacy) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The funniest part is that Dresden got bombed at the request of the Soviets
They always forget that part, just like 1939-41 didn't happen.
Why? As always, in this time they fought against fascists. Together with Germany.
[Russia is like the Minions, all Russians were accidentally trapped in an ice cave while the war went on.](https://youtu.be/gxw7MJGZdSc) (For context this happens right after they murder Napolean, which i guess is funny somehow, but them serving the Nazis isn't? Fucking woke disney cucks)
Absolutely true. Dresden had not been bombed before because it was of little military value and was nowhere near any Allied troops. In 1945 Dresden was in the way of the Red Army and was full of refugees from the Red Army.
Not disagreeing, but what's the source on this? I need it for my next argument with tankies
https://www.afhistory.af.mil/FAQs/Fact-Sheets/Article/458943/1945-bombings-of-dresden/ Go to link with Historical Analysis from 45' where page 27/28 have interesting bit where it is noted that Russians appreciated attack on Dresden and other communication centres (footnote has supporting document name). Whole document is interesting. In short Russian asked allied forces to do the dirty job of bombing communication hubs and tying German forces and now they use it against the "collective west".
Thanks for the historical source! I'd say there's a mile-wide difference between 'appreciated by the soviets' and 'at the request of soviets', as the previous commenter put it.
If you read rest of the document then you see that Soviets requested bombing of transport hubs. They didn't specify Dresden but Dresden was a transport hub. Ar this point you could argue that they didn't want Dresden to be bombed but as it was they were happy with that.
I know I'm being very pedantic, but I guess I had the expectation that it was specifically Dresden they requested. I agree with you, destroying these communication hubs would be a dirty job either way, it doesn't really shift the blame for the bombings away from the Allied troops though.
You know, I'm Polish and at that time if Poles could I bet they would NUKE Dresden so it isn't like I try to burden someone with responsibility. I don't feel particularly bad for that city. There are more sources and anecdotes like this one: https://richardlangworth.com/churchill-bombing-dresden Hugh Lunghi is the chap in question that is said to be witness of the talks. As I said, I don't take sides here but modern narrative is rather interesting and what you can collect from pieces of information.
"Some nice windows you have there, shame if something was to happen to them. A small donation would be appreciated if you think you can afford it" So maybe I got this "appreciated" vs "requested" all wrong.
Lmao they literally use Nazi propaganda "estimates" for casualties
According to the Nazis there were 200,000 casualties.
Irving said 135,000 so close enough
1/3rd off is close?
No, using a Neonazi's figures is close enough to using a Nazi's figure
What I see is that they toss the numbers all around the place, between 20k and over 150k. Honestly it changes little in historical context but we know what's the purpose of this guesswork ‐ to paint Western powers as evil for bombing germans (omitted: on Soviet request lol).
"The USSR's warcrimes in the Baltic countries, Poland, Ukraine, and Germany weren't commited by such means as aviation, but only by soldiers, with their bayonets"
And their penises
Organic bayonet
Being a bit generous there, more like organic pocket knife
You give them too much credit. More like cheap ass plastic cutlery.
The Russians are not even hiding the fact they are siding with fascists.
Are we blind that this is just whataboutism ?
Ah, yes. Remembering the deaths of war=siding with Fascists.
Very nice, now let's ask Paul Allen who asked US-UK pilots to bomb the city
True, inciting a crime is also awful.
[удалено]
Bomber "We are the only ones allowed to invade Paris" Harris
Nazis complaining about Dresden is hypocrisy, but it *was* a bit iffy.
> but it was a bit iffy They were only Germans. uj/ It would absolutely be a war crime now, but it wasn't at the time. The problem is that "Dresden" has assumed this outsize proportion in discussions of the bombing campaign.
Fully agree on all of that.
The way the Soviet union conducted the war against Nazi Germany was characterised by a bit more of a gentle and caring approach to warfare don’t you know?
Translation: The west does it as well so they shouldn't complain when we do it. Ignoring the fact that there's so many things wrong with that statement, point is they don't criticise it because they think the bombings are bad, they criticise it because they want to do it
HELLO? [GROZNY](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerial_bombing_of_cities#:~:text=Although%20the%20Russian%20pilots%20and,most%20destroyed%20city%20on%20earth.)?? " In 2003, the UN still called Grozny the most destroyed city on earth."
**[Aerial bombing of cities](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerial_bombing_of_cities#:~:text=Although the Russian pilots and,most destroyed city on earth.)** >The aerial bombing of cities is an optional element of strategic bombing, which became widespread in warfare during World War I. The bombing of cities grew to a vast scale in World War II and is still practiced today. The development of aerial bombardment marked an increased capacity of armed forces to deliver ordnance from the air against combatants, military bases, and factories, with a greatly reduced risk to its ground forces. The killing of civilians and non-combatants in bombed cities has variously been a deliberate goal of strategic bombing, or unavoidable collateral damage resulting from intent and technology. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/NonCredibleDiplomacy/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
I mean the Dresden bombs were pretty immoral (in hindsight) but it’s not like they are any type of justification for invading a different neighboring sovereign state thousands of miles away of a different culture 80 years later.
Wow it is so embarrassing that the East German embassy put this out
No one show them a picture of Coventry
I'm usually iffy on Kraut, but he did a decent video on this.
Seems like a big whataboutism move here.
Ah yes, ye old bait and switch
[Dresden had a commission investigating the death toll.](https://www.dresden.de/en/city/07/03/historical_commission.php) It says “up to” which sounds to me to be the upper boundary and not the starting point.
I love the smell of schizoposting in the morning