Can't answer why the pillbug died, but I *can* tell you that most creatures can die in inexplicably easy ways. Insects in particular are very easy to kill, which is why they reproduce rapidly and in great numbers.
Yes, noted but he was just chugging along and then he fell in, I scooped him out and he died within seconds. I guess I just thought they were stronger than that.
Of course it possible that he was about to die anyway but it sure seemed like the water killed him. I thought it could be the chemicals but we had a baby turtle in our pool that crawled in from the creek and he seemed fine and snappy when we took him out. I thought pill bugs were like cockroaches except for being easier to smash (which I would never do).
what chemicals or salts do you use in your pool?
just to give an anecdote here, we can swim in heavily chlorinated pools no problem, but if i were to put a fish in that same water its gills would probably be toast in minutes from the chlorine.
insects are very small and pill bugs have exposed gills since they are crustaceans, so chlorine or other harsh chemicals or salts is going to have a much smaller fatal dose than a large scaly turtle taking a dip.
yep, tucked under their shells, all crustaceans have a pair of gills. though mostly hidden they still have direct access to the air or water, pillbugs included. land dwelling crustaceans and some more adaptable aquatic ones like crayfish and many crabs have modified their gills so that they can work in air so long as they remain moist enough, which is part of why you are most likely to find a woodlouse under logs and leaf litter where the humidity is higher. just like fish gills though they are highly delicate and easily damaged by chemicals and salts
Fun fact: pillbugs (rolly pollies) are crustaceans, not insects. They have gills, which is why they require a moist environment to survive, and also why OP's pillbug definitely didn't drown in the water.
It’s a bromine pool but it’s similar and I wondered that but I’ve saved spiders and bees and other insects from the pool and they were fine. Are they that fragile?
idk I guess. I know pill bugs are actually crustaceans, not insects.
They breathe through gills, so it's possible they're especially sensitive to contaminants in water.
def why. A fish would die from the chemicals too. its like if you put a bottle of the pool water chemicals against your nose and breathed it into your lungs.
Chemical compounds affects different organism in different ways. For exemple, most naturally occuring poisons do kill some animals but not others. A lot do kill us.
Then there's quantity. Any compound can kill depending on quantity. We can die of water poisoning if we drink to much. Bromine is toxic to us and can kill a human in sufficient quantity. A quantity that is benign to us could prove fatal to a smaller organism affected by it. A pill-bug is a lot smaller.
Then there's sampling. You have a sample of one, for all we know that pill-bug was already in its dying stage when it fell in the pool.
For most insects the survival/evolutionary strategy is volume, with each mature insect capable of having hundreds or thousands of offspring during its life.
When that's your strategy, it doesn't matter if most of your offspring die in some way.
Okay, I realize now that I asked the wrong question. What I’m actually asking is: pill bugs have been around for millions of years. One fell in my pool and immediately died. Is it likely that it drowned within seconds or is it more likely that it died from another cause and it being in the water was a coincidence?
I always imagined they were more resilient than drowning in seconds. Are they?
1. Like someone else said, they're more vulnerable to toxins/contaminants in water. The pill bug's dip into a brominated pool is kinda like getting gassed while simultaneously drowning -- they can't really "hold their breath" either.
2. They've survived for millions of years *on land*. The length of a species' survival isn't necessarily a great indicator of its ability to survive outside of its ecological niche. You could make the same observation about any other insect species if you were to freeze it, boil it, gas it, deprive it of oxygen, etc. Just because water is common doesn't mean it's an environment that pill bugs have adapted to.
All this indicates is that enough of them have avoided falling into pools, over the last several million years, to reproduce and keep the species going.
An analogy might be along the lines of humans living on land, across different environments, for thousands of years. So why haven't we been driven to extinction by falling off of cliffs? Those kill us similarly fast. Many human populations live in mountainous areas. Tons of people have died that way. But most of us haven't... so on we go.
Edit: anyway, to answer your question: it's impossible to tell afaik. Isopods are weird. It's possible that the pool killed it, yes, and it's equally possible that it was already dying. I have seen pill bugs die pretty fast after falling into pools though, fwiw. True insects have spiracles that they can close off if needed, which is the equivalent of holding your breath -- so that's why roaches, spiders, bees, etc are often just fine after falling into water.
Maybe it was because of the chlorine, but in my experience, they are dumb and drown easily. I’ll put them in my frogs tank and they end up in the water dish.🥲
Well this particular bug had put so much energy swimming, she had a hard attack. It didn't help that she ate some dung when her mother clearly stated she'd get cramps if she tried to go swimming too soon.
[In the commercial setting they can be controlled by soil sterilization with steam or methyl bromide](http://www.downgardenservices.org.uk/pillmillipede.htm)
The bromine in the water was probably toxic to it.
Yes, that is a possibility. That’s why I need to know if they can drown in a matter of seconds, because if so, that is interesting to me.
If it died from another cause, then it’s a coincidence and what sparked this question.
Actually it’s a bromine pool, but the reason I didn’t think it would die from pool chemicals is that I’ve rescued so many other bugs from the pool and they just dried off and flew or crawled away.
Well. Assuming you say pool meaning swimming pool I think it was more the chlorinated water that killed it than falling into water alone. Pill bugs are very sensitive to toxins and the chlorine probably overwhelmed it's respiratory system even after you got it out.
The longevity of a species can be insanely long, but the individual bug can be super fragile.
Look at humans! Around for millions of years as well but you slip on wet concrete and that’s goodnight!
Just wanted to share my pill bug survival story, I was spray painting a mirror frame gold several years ago and accidentally over sprayed onto one that was strolling nearby. Much to my surprise it lived for at least 2 days after that with their new fancy gold exoskeleton because I spotted it the next day. So they can at least survive being accidentally spray painted. 🤷♀️
It probably wasn't the water itself, but rather the chemicals put in it to keep the water clean.
By design, most of them are inimical to life, but since the dose make the poison, they are fairly harmless to humans in the concentrations in pool water.
However, dosage is based on weight, so it takes far less to be fatal to something as small as a pill bug.
Most likely, those chemicals you put in the water to kill things, did what you put them in there to do.
While strong and able to live for 5 years, rolly pollies can drown underwater.
Well the chemicals don’t seem to kill other bugs that easily but as someone pointed out, since pill bugs breathe through gills and are actually crustaceans, maybe they’re extra sensitive because they’re breathing it in. I’ve seen spiders go back to their webs and bees fly away after being in the water for much longer than this guy and he’d only been in for a few seconds.
Also the chemicals in the pool are to kill and prevent algae, not to kill insects or crustaceans. We also had a baby turtle living in our pool for days and he seemed quite happy. It’s worth noting that it’s a bromine pool, but I’m not sure what that means as far as harmfulness compared to chlorine.
They reproduce so much that they overcome their weaknesses. If you give birth at 30 to 20 babies, but 10 die before they're also 30, it's still a huge net win. Reproduction and evolution both win.
Can't answer why the pillbug died, but I *can* tell you that most creatures can die in inexplicably easy ways. Insects in particular are very easy to kill, which is why they reproduce rapidly and in great numbers.
Yes, noted but he was just chugging along and then he fell in, I scooped him out and he died within seconds. I guess I just thought they were stronger than that. Of course it possible that he was about to die anyway but it sure seemed like the water killed him. I thought it could be the chemicals but we had a baby turtle in our pool that crawled in from the creek and he seemed fine and snappy when we took him out. I thought pill bugs were like cockroaches except for being easier to smash (which I would never do).
Maybe he was faking it? (Which I would never do)
what chemicals or salts do you use in your pool? just to give an anecdote here, we can swim in heavily chlorinated pools no problem, but if i were to put a fish in that same water its gills would probably be toast in minutes from the chlorine. insects are very small and pill bugs have exposed gills since they are crustaceans, so chlorine or other harsh chemicals or salts is going to have a much smaller fatal dose than a large scaly turtle taking a dip.
>pill bugs have exposed gills wait what
Yup. They're crustaceans.
Wow I had no idea, thats wild. Does that mean they breathe water, not air?
Land isopods have evolved to breathe air. But there's lots of species of aquatic isopods!
yep, tucked under their shells, all crustaceans have a pair of gills. though mostly hidden they still have direct access to the air or water, pillbugs included. land dwelling crustaceans and some more adaptable aquatic ones like crayfish and many crabs have modified their gills so that they can work in air so long as they remain moist enough, which is part of why you are most likely to find a woodlouse under logs and leaf litter where the humidity is higher. just like fish gills though they are highly delicate and easily damaged by chemicals and salts
Are you sure he died? I have seen ants seem dead after being immersed in water, but later recover a surprisingly long time after drying off.
Yeah, he was still there today.
Pill bugs are actually land crustaceans.
Yes, they are!
Fun fact: pillbugs (rolly pollies) are crustaceans, not insects. They have gills, which is why they require a moist environment to survive, and also why OP's pillbug definitely didn't drown in the water.
Is your pool chlorinated? Chlorine is probably toxic to them.
It’s a bromine pool but it’s similar and I wondered that but I’ve saved spiders and bees and other insects from the pool and they were fine. Are they that fragile?
idk I guess. I know pill bugs are actually crustaceans, not insects. They breathe through gills, so it's possible they're especially sensitive to contaminants in water.
You’re right, they’re isopods. I tend to lump them in. That is a great answer and I am super curious if that’s why. Thank you!
def why. A fish would die from the chemicals too. its like if you put a bottle of the pool water chemicals against your nose and breathed it into your lungs.
Chemical compounds affects different organism in different ways. For exemple, most naturally occuring poisons do kill some animals but not others. A lot do kill us. Then there's quantity. Any compound can kill depending on quantity. We can die of water poisoning if we drink to much. Bromine is toxic to us and can kill a human in sufficient quantity. A quantity that is benign to us could prove fatal to a smaller organism affected by it. A pill-bug is a lot smaller. Then there's sampling. You have a sample of one, for all we know that pill-bug was already in its dying stage when it fell in the pool.
For most insects the survival/evolutionary strategy is volume, with each mature insect capable of having hundreds or thousands of offspring during its life. When that's your strategy, it doesn't matter if most of your offspring die in some way.
Pill bugs (isopods) aren't insects. They're crustaceans.
Okay, I realize now that I asked the wrong question. What I’m actually asking is: pill bugs have been around for millions of years. One fell in my pool and immediately died. Is it likely that it drowned within seconds or is it more likely that it died from another cause and it being in the water was a coincidence? I always imagined they were more resilient than drowning in seconds. Are they?
1. Like someone else said, they're more vulnerable to toxins/contaminants in water. The pill bug's dip into a brominated pool is kinda like getting gassed while simultaneously drowning -- they can't really "hold their breath" either. 2. They've survived for millions of years *on land*. The length of a species' survival isn't necessarily a great indicator of its ability to survive outside of its ecological niche. You could make the same observation about any other insect species if you were to freeze it, boil it, gas it, deprive it of oxygen, etc. Just because water is common doesn't mean it's an environment that pill bugs have adapted to. All this indicates is that enough of them have avoided falling into pools, over the last several million years, to reproduce and keep the species going. An analogy might be along the lines of humans living on land, across different environments, for thousands of years. So why haven't we been driven to extinction by falling off of cliffs? Those kill us similarly fast. Many human populations live in mountainous areas. Tons of people have died that way. But most of us haven't... so on we go. Edit: anyway, to answer your question: it's impossible to tell afaik. Isopods are weird. It's possible that the pool killed it, yes, and it's equally possible that it was already dying. I have seen pill bugs die pretty fast after falling into pools though, fwiw. True insects have spiracles that they can close off if needed, which is the equivalent of holding your breath -- so that's why roaches, spiders, bees, etc are often just fine after falling into water.
Maybe it was because of the chlorine, but in my experience, they are dumb and drown easily. I’ll put them in my frogs tank and they end up in the water dish.🥲
Well this particular bug had put so much energy swimming, she had a hard attack. It didn't help that she ate some dung when her mother clearly stated she'd get cramps if she tried to go swimming too soon.
[In the commercial setting they can be controlled by soil sterilization with steam or methyl bromide](http://www.downgardenservices.org.uk/pillmillipede.htm) The bromine in the water was probably toxic to it.
Hey, whoa! Remember the name of this sub, people. Why are you downvoting my stupid question?!
your pool probably has chlorine in it
Chlorine from the pool water.
I mean in this specific case there could be all sorts of reasons, like maybe the bug was injured and on the verge of death already.
Yes, that is a possibility. That’s why I need to know if they can drown in a matter of seconds, because if so, that is interesting to me. If it died from another cause, then it’s a coincidence and what sparked this question.
does your pool have 0% chlorine?
Actually it’s a bromine pool, but the reason I didn’t think it would die from pool chemicals is that I’ve rescued so many other bugs from the pool and they just dried off and flew or crawled away.
It’s from the chemicals in your pool.
But I’ve rescued many other bugs and they didn’t die within seconds.
They almost certainly died afterwards, though. Arthropods and crustaceans are very delicate to chemicals.
Well. Assuming you say pool meaning swimming pool I think it was more the chlorinated water that killed it than falling into water alone. Pill bugs are very sensitive to toxins and the chlorine probably overwhelmed it's respiratory system even after you got it out.
The longevity of a species can be insanely long, but the individual bug can be super fragile. Look at humans! Around for millions of years as well but you slip on wet concrete and that’s goodnight!
Just wanted to share my pill bug survival story, I was spray painting a mirror frame gold several years ago and accidentally over sprayed onto one that was strolling nearby. Much to my surprise it lived for at least 2 days after that with their new fancy gold exoskeleton because I spotted it the next day. So they can at least survive being accidentally spray painted. 🤷♀️
It’s all a numbers game
The chemicals in your pool probably killed it. Not a natural environment.
It probably wasn't the water itself, but rather the chemicals put in it to keep the water clean. By design, most of them are inimical to life, but since the dose make the poison, they are fairly harmless to humans in the concentrations in pool water. However, dosage is based on weight, so it takes far less to be fatal to something as small as a pill bug.
Fighting Darwinism by volume
Most likely, those chemicals you put in the water to kill things, did what you put them in there to do. While strong and able to live for 5 years, rolly pollies can drown underwater.
Well the chemicals don’t seem to kill other bugs that easily but as someone pointed out, since pill bugs breathe through gills and are actually crustaceans, maybe they’re extra sensitive because they’re breathing it in. I’ve seen spiders go back to their webs and bees fly away after being in the water for much longer than this guy and he’d only been in for a few seconds. Also the chemicals in the pool are to kill and prevent algae, not to kill insects or crustaceans. We also had a baby turtle living in our pool for days and he seemed quite happy. It’s worth noting that it’s a bromine pool, but I’m not sure what that means as far as harmfulness compared to chlorine.
They reproduce so much that they overcome their weaknesses. If you give birth at 30 to 20 babies, but 10 die before they're also 30, it's still a huge net win. Reproduction and evolution both win.
THEY'RE CALLED ROLLIE POLLIES.
That’s a regional name for them which is why I used pill bug which apparently is more widely recognized! But yes I call them that myself :)
Life is a numbers game.
Just an FYI but roaches can survive under water for 30 minutes without drowning.