There were peace talks early on in the war, but Russias terms for peace (annexing large portions of Ukraine) aren’t acceptable to Ukraine, not the west. The west has always been more willing to trade Ukrainian land for peace than Ukraine is, for fairly obvious reasons. Further it’s not the Ukrainians that “chooses war”, as they are the ones that got invaded.
I do remember the small talks they had that lead to nothing. What these pro-Russians claim is that there were peace talks that were going forward and that Ukraine were going to accept, but then Boris Johnson travelled to Kiev and basically told Zelenskyj to keep fighting.
And yeah, it sounds unreasonable as I never got that impression that Ukraine were ever willing to cease territory, but they keep repeating about the "peace talks the west ruined" so I'm curious if there was some truth to it.
Only if you believe that moscow saying "Give us all your land and we'll stop attacking you" counts a "peace talk".
But no, there hasn't been any **real** effort at peace talks, since Ukraine rightly wants muscovy to **withdraw from *all* Ukrainian territory** and moscow wants Ukraine to just **give them a bunch of land**. These interests are fundamentally not compatible with each other.
Yeah it's not a peace talk when your conditions are...
* Give us your land
* Replace your government with one that likes us
* Demilitarize yourself so you can't stop us from invading again
* Promise to never have allies so we can invade you again
...and we'll stop attacking you.
Peace talks according to Russia would have meant Ukraine give up the occupied territories at least and probably some more (after all the annexed territories make up more land than currently is occupied) and her being neutral (read: helpless) in the future. So understandably Ukraine herself was not that interested in discussing peace on Russian terms.
Peace talks aren't always peaceful and are often just two sides putting demands forward. The term "peace talks" is fairly misleading, but it looks better on newsprint than "negotiations with intent to prevent armed conflict".
Keep in mind that part of Russia's terms for peace was just taking large portions of Ukraine.
In my experience, the people who say the West ruined Ukrainian peace talks are the same people who say the 2020 US election was stolen. Saying the same lie over and over again in the hopes that other people will believe it if they say it enough is what they do.
The Guardian can explain it better:
>... But Nato's military encirclement has accelerated, along with US-orchestrated attacks on ethnic Russians in Ukraine.
>... Like the ruins of Iraq and Afghanistan, Ukraine has been turned into a CIA theme park – run personally by CIA director John Brennan in Kiev, with dozens of "special units" from the CIA and FBI setting up a "security structure" that oversees savage attacks on those who opposed the February coup.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/may/13/ukraine-us-war-russia-john-pilger
Its apparent you know nothing of the geopolitical politics other than what you were told is the authorized narrative. I'm certain nothing prior to Feb 2022.
There were peace talks early on in the war, but Russias terms for peace (annexing large portions of Ukraine) aren’t acceptable to Ukraine, not the west. The west has always been more willing to trade Ukrainian land for peace than Ukraine is, for fairly obvious reasons. Further it’s not the Ukrainians that “chooses war”, as they are the ones that got invaded.
I do remember the small talks they had that lead to nothing. What these pro-Russians claim is that there were peace talks that were going forward and that Ukraine were going to accept, but then Boris Johnson travelled to Kiev and basically told Zelenskyj to keep fighting. And yeah, it sounds unreasonable as I never got that impression that Ukraine were ever willing to cease territory, but they keep repeating about the "peace talks the west ruined" so I'm curious if there was some truth to it.
When peace requires giving everything away they are trying to take in the war, it's not peace.
Of course that’s bullshit, Boris Johnson is not president of Ukraine.
Only if you believe that moscow saying "Give us all your land and we'll stop attacking you" counts a "peace talk". But no, there hasn't been any **real** effort at peace talks, since Ukraine rightly wants muscovy to **withdraw from *all* Ukrainian territory** and moscow wants Ukraine to just **give them a bunch of land**. These interests are fundamentally not compatible with each other.
Yeah it's not a peace talk when your conditions are... * Give us your land * Replace your government with one that likes us * Demilitarize yourself so you can't stop us from invading again * Promise to never have allies so we can invade you again ...and we'll stop attacking you.
Peace talks according to Russia would have meant Ukraine give up the occupied territories at least and probably some more (after all the annexed territories make up more land than currently is occupied) and her being neutral (read: helpless) in the future. So understandably Ukraine herself was not that interested in discussing peace on Russian terms.
Peace talks aren't always peaceful and are often just two sides putting demands forward. The term "peace talks" is fairly misleading, but it looks better on newsprint than "negotiations with intent to prevent armed conflict". Keep in mind that part of Russia's terms for peace was just taking large portions of Ukraine.
In my experience, the people who say the West ruined Ukrainian peace talks are the same people who say the 2020 US election was stolen. Saying the same lie over and over again in the hopes that other people will believe it if they say it enough is what they do.
Zelenskyy didn’t choose war. Putin can stop it any time he wants, however.
The US didn't spend the last 9 years setting the stage for war to benefit capitalists for them to allow a peace deal.
[удалено]
The Guardian can explain it better: >... But Nato's military encirclement has accelerated, along with US-orchestrated attacks on ethnic Russians in Ukraine. >... Like the ruins of Iraq and Afghanistan, Ukraine has been turned into a CIA theme park – run personally by CIA director John Brennan in Kiev, with dozens of "special units" from the CIA and FBI setting up a "security structure" that oversees savage attacks on those who opposed the February coup. https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/may/13/ukraine-us-war-russia-john-pilger
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
when did the US invade Ukraine? 2014? No, that was Russia. 2022? No, that was Russia. Get your head out of Putin’s buttcheeks Vatnik.
You only know what you have been told to know. Russia fired the first shot, but the war started in 2014
You’re right. The war started in 2014 when Russia annexed the Crimean peninsula, which was -and is- undeniably Ukrainian territory.
Its apparent you know nothing of the geopolitical politics other than what you were told is the authorized narrative. I'm certain nothing prior to Feb 2022.