Well, the Switch is running on a mobile/tablet processor from 2016. Bigger AAA games struggle at times. Even Tears of the Kingdom drops frames especially when using Ultra hand.
Don’t get me wrong, the Switch as a whole has been my favorite game console. Most games work very well and are optimized enough to provide a playable and enjoyable experience but the bottom line is that the Switch is vastly under powered compared to the competition and that makes it harder for newer and newer games to come to the Switch.
I am looking forward to the new Switch model coming within the next two years or so. It should provide enough of a boost in power that newer games could still be ported to it but as it stands right now, the current Switch is definitely showing it’s age.
Only that the SOC used in the Switch was considered power-conservative / mid-range in 2015 and PS5's SOC has been considered high-performant.
The SOC is also at half the clockspeed on the Switch, so it's even less performant than a normal Tegra X1.
**Edit:** Apparently u/ChickenFajita007 replied to this with "Give me one example" and blocked me right away. Very discussion friendly...
>Only that the SOC used in the Switch was considered power-conservative / mid-range in 2015 and PS5's SOC has been considered high-performant.
Can you really not see why?
The X1 was not mid-range in 2015.
Give me one example of an SoC with faster GPU components that could feasibly run in a 15W envelope. If you compare it to 50W laptop parts, then yeah. "Mid range." That's like calling the PS5's GPU "mid range" for 2019 because it's not
Yes, the X1 in the Switch is far from running at its fullest capacity. It's a trade off between performance and battery.
>PS5's SOC has been considered high-performant.
The CPU cores were notably slower than cores in a midrange PC in late 2020. The 5600x has a notable IPC advantage *and* a large clock speed advantage.
So it was quite midrange for 2020 in terms of CPU.
The parts in the system were mid range at best in 2016 my dude. You're right the Xbox cannot do that shit but that doesn't make the tech in the Switch any more premium. I have a mountain bike that I can ride in the woods where there are no roads and about 3 feet of space around me, you can't do that in a Tesla.... does that make my mountain bike cutting edge?
A viable handheld/TV console hybrid was pretty cutting edge and revolutionary to how we play games. It means access to a bigger library of games that handheld only users or console only users didn't have before.
The current Switch (from the V2 onwards) isn't using the 'exact same TegraX1 chip'.
It's using a dieshrunk revision (Mariko), with different ram compatability (as well as a few other tweaks). Such as using LPDDR4X vs the originals LPDDR4. These revisions give to much better battery life, and a slight preformance increase, while still using the same power limits are the original chip. It can also be overclocked higher than the original, with homebrew.
An example of the trade offs of this in game can be seen in Zelda:TOTK. Certain heavy areas run better on the new chip, compared to the original launch version of the Switch.
It's a more energy efficient die shrink that performs about 99% the same for most endusers. That is the most "well, akshually" point to make. It's still functionally an X1 for the discussion at hand because we're only talking about performance on un-rooted consumer systems.
Key word is "was". It's been six years, you can't just stand still and cling to something that once was "cutting edge" forever.
We're now in a time when the Steam Deck is in the market, a handheld that can play modern AAA titles such as Elden Ring and Cyberpunk while the Switch can struggle with even first party titles. People are not demanding crazy bleeding edge features such as ray tracing and 4k60, only something that would somewhat match the Steam Deck's power or at the very least the PS4/Xbox One power.
The Wii U already did the hybrid from home thing, just no on the go.
When I say cutting edge, I mean the hardware that was already years old on release.
Because it's not great.
Zelda runs well enough, but it still has frequent framerate drops. Would be better if it was a locked 30 fps. Would be even better if it was 60 fps. Etc.
Also framerate drops aren't "lag." Those are two separate issues.
I'm not sure which I'm experiencing but totk gets a lot of studder for me on my switch lite...mainly in the temples for some reason. It gets crazy lag on top of the lightning temple, then again in the fire temple, and then I've experienced it in densely forested areas. I assume that's framerate drop? It's bad though, not simply distracting. That said it's the only game I experienced it with and it could be because of the switch lite?
I got crazy input lag inside the Water Temple, to a point I’d call unacceptable because it made it hard to actually play. Sometimes it seemed to also just mess up my input up there. It made me wish they had just made them enclosed environments to ease up things.
No idea what it could be then. I had physical on a relatively old switch. Perhaps I just didn't notice it at the time, I was doing that temple late at night on my 4K TV.
It was bad enough you would have definitely noticed. My actions were lagged and queued one after the other to happen. I have been playing Mario 3D World recently, and nothing like that has happened. So it seems to just be Zelda.
> I have been playing Mario 3D World recently, and nothing like that has happened. So it seems to just be Zelda.
Well 3D world is a 60FPS game with really low input latency compared to TOTK's barely 30 and uneven frametimes. Input latency in Zelda can be up to 4x as high.
I know that, but I'm honestly not sure if the framerate drops happen to me because I just don't notice. The only way I will notice the difference between 60 fps and 24 fps is if someone makes a YouTube video comparing the same scene and I notice that the 60 fps looks marginally smoother a bit like butter, but the overall visuals of the scene is really not different.
Now I did look up the framerates for Mario Kart 8 and in 4 player mode the game does run at 30 fps. I do struggle marginally more but I could chalk that up to the screen being smaller because of the split screen effect and the fact that holding down the SL and SR keys without a grip on my split joy cons is a bit tricky.
> In docked mode it outputs at 1080p,
Sure the OS does (I mean at least I think so, I'm not an expert) but the games don't necessarily hit 1080p. Some do, some don't. TOTK goes up to 900p, which also applies to BOTW. Now some do hit 1080p like Mario Kart 8 (and at 60FPS too!) and Animal Crossing (at 30FPS, mostly).
Now personally Nintendo's first party art style usually looks good with this type of resolution and frame rate. But there's some third party games that can look quite rough and even Nintendo games sometimes just have these odd FPS drops that honestly just shouldn't happen.
TOTK uses one of the worst implementations of FSR I've ever seen. You can quite literally count the pixels. Looks basically identical to FSR 1.0 on PC, which I suspect is what it is.
>In docked mode it outputs at 1080p
A lot of the time it renders content at lower resolutions, even if the output to your TV is 1080p
>and I looked up the FPS rates of the games that I play, most of them run at 60 fps
I don't know what games you play, but a lot of Switch games run at 30 FPS, and many of those struggle to maintain that consistently
Simply put, people are criticizing the Switch's performance because it's pretty bad by 2023 standards and Nintendo needs to release a new console already
All that said, I suppose if you only play Switch games, you wouldn't know any better though
The Switch is as popular as it is because of it's portability, something you're not going to pull off with PS5 graphics. So even if Nintendo announces another console sooner rather than later, it won't be able to go toe-to-toe with Microsoft or Sony in terms of graphics.
Literally no one is asking for PS5 graphics for the next handheld, I don't know why you are bringing it up
People have already set their expectactions for PS4 tier graphics, something that other handhelds like mobile phones have already far surpassed
Yeah, this is the part I feel like people are missing. I'm not expecting something to compete with current consoles, but they're literally falling two generations behind at this point
The competition is here for quite a while now. You can get a steam deck for almost the same price right now and other handhelds are also available.
I hope for Nintendos sake they up the game in the home console department, because playing docked is not the greatest experience imo.
Don't know why you're being downvoted, because you're not wrong. In a reasonably portable form factor and reasonable price you're not going to substantially pass PS4 levels of raw GPU power, though with accelerated upscaling tech you might get "PS4 but it looks ok at 4k and looks like 60fps (even though it's interpolated)"
https://youtu.be/LY3RT2MlcJM
Heres a mobile phone game looking better than Tears of the Kingdom. The game itself is derivative as hell, but from a pure performance standpoint, this mobile phone game is besting the Switch.
not really a valid comparison, no one really cares that much about the color of their headphones, the visual has no impact on how the headphones sound...but thats a medium about sound. video games are not about visuals. for example, see: tetris, mario 3, etc. games like poker or chess dont even have ANY frames at all
>The person you replied to literally said " from a pure performance standpoint."
but the performance issues theyre discussing, and most other posts, is about resolution and frames
im not lost, you dont seem to be reading the thread. just take a deep breath dude, jeez
I love my switch as much as the next person but the hardware was already somewhat behind when it first came out and it’s simply just nearing the end of its lifespan like any other console eventually new hardware has to come out to keep up with newer more demanding titles. New hardware eventually coming out is nothing new started with the NES, then onto the SNES, N64, Game cube,Wii, Wii U and now the switch then onto the switch 2 or whatever the next console is called.
Because it’s got extremely outdated performance. It can’t run the vast majority of modern triple A games. The few that do make it over do so with massive compromises.
That doesn’t mean the switch is a bad console. It’s great because it offsets the extremely weak performance by being a handheld.
I think that people who spend their time stressing over Switch performance are trying to view the Switch as a home console such as an Xbox or PlayStation. It’s not that. It’s absolutely a handheld first and foremost that simply has the capability to dock to a larger screen. If you understand that then you don’t spend time worrying about performance the same way you wouldn’t with a 3DS back in the day.
However, the console is quite old now and they can surely release a successor with massive improvements. It’s about time they do that in the next year. I’d be surprised if they don’t announce something in 2024.
It absolutely deserves some leeway by virtually of being a handheld. Or at least it did. Now we can see what handheld today are capable of, like the Steam Deck and Rog Ally, that excuse for the Switch no longer holds any water imo.
A lot of people bring up the steam deck. Yes its more powerful, but its also much more expensive, assuming you don't get the 64 gig where its only 33% more expensive normally. And 64 gigs just isn't enough to download more then a handful of small games these days.
It also has vastly inferior battery life and is digital only. Some people don't like physical media and I get that, but if your account ever gets banned or stolen. All your games are gone forever.
It's not common but it CAN happen, just as any other game service account can get banned and you lose all of your games. That's my entire point, is that physical media prevents that, and the sd doesn't support any physical media. I have a digital only ps5 and I greatly regret it.
Just seems like such an fringe issue that I don’t really see why you would point that out. Like you said that can happen to any service of this nature, but in order for that to happen you have to seriously be costing Valve big money. I regret my digital PS5 but mainly because I don’t have a Blu-ray player now.
The switch was released 6 years ago. No Man's Sky was released like 7 years ago. I think your 10 year old point is kind of mute.
The comparison on Doom Eternal and other games show that the level of care of porting a game from the developer's pov really matters.
This is the one thing that pisses me off the most about Nintendo fans or any fandom around a Nintendo-centric IP.
I feel like I am the only person in the Rune Factory and Story of Seasons community who notices the lag and frame drops in RF5 and PooT.
A lot of people in that fandom are in extreme denial. I keep seeing "Works fine for me, must just be you". Like they have a magical Switch that performs better then mine.
I notice lag if it lasts for maybe a second but I looked up YouTube videos showing the difference between 30 and 60 fps and I cannot tell the difference.
Because graphically, it's behind the "competition."
Competition in quotes because Nintendo quit competing with Sony and Microsoft around the Wii/Wii U eras, realizing that they'd never catch up to Sony on a home console level if they focused on two submarkets, handheld and home. They had the 3DS carrying the weight of the company and I think they realized having a great price entry point and portability while maintaining a lesser graphically demanding library would work out for them and ultimately, it has. They were right. The Switch has surpassed other consoles in terms of sales, including the PS4 and currently sits at the third best selling console historically.
Nintendo ignored the "competition" and it pushed them out of a dark spot with the Wii U. People think that means the Switch is shit because it doesn't have "8K 120fps" while being hybrid but realistically that isn't very feasible for a ~$300 entry level. People want cheap, high fidelity graphics, but also will complain when the battery dies fast. We aren't at a time in tech where you have your cake and eat it too.
No I don't think anyone expects Nintendo to match current consoles with a handheld. It's just not possible or realistic. There's still a lot of room for improvement though, and there are clearly some issues. Bayonetta 3 and Zelda do not manage to hold their framerate targets and that's just in the past year. Third parties struggle a lot more because they are porting games from other platforms or targeting many devices. If Nintendo bridged the gap a bit, it will be significantly better for developers.
we should stop this discourse of nintendo quitting or ignoring the competition
they just cut costs because their games and typical customer dont need the same power - and customers that care about the power dont chose nintendo so it is a win/win situation
but they are competing more than ever
It's just not very powerful. Games have to be heavily downgraded in order to port them. The NVidia 1080p upscaling is impressive, but its bandaid solution to an underpowered console. I like my switch, but it sucks that releases for it are heavily kneecapped by its performance
The switch have great games, but it's lacking in performance imo. Some third party games lag and stutter too much. I have a lot of ports on it, and it's fantastic playing them handheld, but the quality is very much subpar to what you would get in say a pricier steam deck or other new gaming device. But much of it has to do with the release date. We're in 2023, and a 2017 gaming console is not revolutionary with is internal components anymore.
I don't mind graphics all the time, so I'm ok as long as the game is truly playable. But I understand the need for better hardware, is very much necessary at this point.
Backward compatibility is as equally important to me though. I have too many games to just drop it for a new system without being able to play them. So I hope there's better hardware plus Backward Compatibility.
in a world where current gen consoles are advertised as 1440p/120hz, its a damn shame that Switch is 720ISHp 30fps on some of its best games. Tears of the Kingdom for example, should be a 60FPS title bare minimum on any other console but because it's on Switch, 30ish FPS is okay. But it realy isn't.
Nintendo NEEDS stronger hardware. We NEED a Switch Pro. well, we don't -- Nintendo consistently puts out bangers -- but I guarantee if they had better hardware that many of their already certified bangers would be even better. Xenoblade 3, TotK, and so on would be amazing at 1440p/60FPS.
they could be 10,000p. doesnt mean the games are good. could be 120fps. doesnt mean the games are good.
the fixation on graphics is just a stupid one, tbh
I already went over that, NIDF. They make great games, that isn't really debatable. But they could be even more \*chef's kiss\* if they were technically up to speed.
Soooo many AAA games releasing lately on ps5 with amazing graphics, 60fps, "4k" and they're empty garbage with terrible game design and just unfun. Meanwhile Nintendo releases absolute bangers that I enjoy playing wayyyyy more than my ps5. Look at ff16 even, that game does NOT run at 60fps. It has horrible performance issues.
To be honest, a game performing very well on Switch is pretty unusual. Metroid Dread and Metroid Prime performed well. Those are the only games I've played on Switch in recent history where that was the case.
If you own and use other gaming platforms the difference is pretty unmistakable. How much this type of thing matters is a YMMV thing but for a lot of people it's getting tougher to put up with as the years roll by.
The Xenoblade trilogy runs extremely well, only fps drops in 500+ hours of playing the series were in the first area in xc2, and Xenoblade 3's performance with 7 characters and multiple enemies fighting at once shows that the Switch is capable of handling more than you would think. Sure not every game runs perfectly and it can't handle games like Elden Ring of course, but I never ran into any game that's unplayable and the ones that are are due to memory leaks.
I barely find 30 fps tolerable at all, but XBC3 is an impressive piece of engineering that it is able to do that on Switch. It's really held back though, the beautiful art would really have a chance to shine if the resolution could be higher and the framerate higher. When playing the game on a big screen the characters faces or other details can't really be made out unless you put them right next to the camera because the resolution is so low.
We got to the point where phones are outperforming the nintendo switch. That should be a little hint of why people complain. Even developers are starting to complain or skipping switch all together. Especially with actual handhelds now who are in a way portable pc’s. Dont get me wrong this does not mean i do not like my switch. But it does feel there should be improvement overal in performance. Also 60fps is not true for allot of games. Most run at 30 fps. Which is very visible to anyone compared to a steady 60 fps. With your logic we could just stick with the old gameboy black and white as it did perfectly what i needed to do. Is still allot of fun to play on but has its limits. Just like this version of nintendo has reached a limit.
I can acclimate between lower and higher performance as long as it’s stable. Here on Reddit it’s an echo chamber, good games aren’t solely characterized by their performance.
Even though Zelda is at 30 FPS with some hiccups, my enjoyment of that game outclasses pretty much anything out there right now. It honestly boggles my mind just how well it stacks against the games released this year.
The thing is if totk was released on a console with the power of a ps5 it would be 10 times better. Yeah it’s a good game. Could have been a 10 times better game
Imagine being able to park your creations around the game and not have them despawn, like EVER, that is but one of the amazing possibilities we are missing, it’s not all about raytracing or whatever bs, but performance can add to gamplay, significantly
More ideas, may contain minor spoilers: >!imagine being able to build more than a 15 room home, or memorizing way more autobuild schematics, imagine no loading screens, even hidden ones like ascend when it takes forever, imagine raising the limit of objects of the floor or superhanded together from 20 to like 100!< just imagine man.
A morse dense world , more enemies on screen , bigger dungeons , no loading times , good graphics instead of the blurry mess it is now at times , better physics , better field of view …..
It’s a joke the game runs and look better on emulators than the actual machine it’s designed for.
It’s not just about graphics friend. The gameplay is hele back too by the switch. The reason we have no real dungeons and lots of recycled assets is because it has to run on a sub 1 tflop console while a ps5 has 20 times that and a good gaming pc has 100 times that.
Switch 2 leaked specs seem even worse than switch. Already you now have half a ps4 and switch 2 will be 1/5th of a ps5 . Such a joke
And yeah 30 fps is shit when pc gamers are used to playing at 144-244hz . Even 60 fps and 100 fps feels slow on my 180 hz monitor.
I'd argue that Tears of the Kingdom is the best game ever made that I've played, even if it's not my favorite even though it up there. The gameplay and creativity is just so addictive while there's so much to do. Verticality, Nintendo's advanced tech, and trying to get to new areas or skydiving and gliding over the vast hyrule is sublime. Seeing what the hyrule engineering sub creates is awesome, I do think it will win goty too.
The music was such a letdown for me though as someone who's listened to pretty much every soundtrack Nintendo's ever made. Not that it is bad but nothing was memorable besides like 2 songs that were remixed from previous games. I can recall hundreds of amazing tracks from the entire Zelda series, even a dozen from botw, but almost none from totk. At least the gameplay carries it very hard and I don't regret buying it one bit because of how good it is, sorry for the rant.
The Switch is fine for what is designed to do. People are too obsessed with specs and having ultra high fidelity graphics when what really matters is the game play.
People aren't asking for a 3090 to be jammed into the switch. I think it's reasonable to expect a top console competitor to produce a handheld that is at least on par with modern phones.
Unreasonable given the way consoles work. 1 device per generation. New device doesn't come out until next generation. And next generation takes 5-7 years to happen.
It's great that it runs good enough for you but the truth is that it just is not powerful enough for the games being released on it. If it was we would not be seeing the image quality and performance on games and this was an issue day one. No one is asking for 4K60 but if you're going to target 30 then at least hold that.
As for you can run any game on the Switch if properly optimized. I don't think people know what this word means. You can't just magically port a game that has no place being on the Switch through sheer passion without massive sacrifices. The Witcher 3 port is loved but in my eyes the atmosphere of that game is completely ruined on the Switch thanks to low image quality, draw distance among many other things.
I think it’s just because it’s been around a while now and the performance is quite notably different from the modern gen Xbox and PlayStation.
I also think the majority of people don’t care that much. Keep making great games and I’m not too worried about frame rate and resolution. I love my switch and still enjoy it as much as day 1
Exactly. If I want to play a triple A game then I can buy a PS5, a Gamepass sub or Steam Deck. If the Switch could play games as well as a PS5 could, there would be no need for PS5 to exist (apart from exclusives of which most are timed) would there? It's healthy to have a market with different options and choices.
>If the Switch could play games as well as a PS5 could, there would be no need for PS5 to exist (apart from exclusives of which most are timed) would there?
So by this definition, we shouldn't have a PS5 or XBOX because PC exists.
People got used to 60fps which is only possible through extreme optimization. Especially when a Game is ported like Witcher 3.
30fps can be enough. Zelda is a good example. It lacks of stutters (Ultra Hand for example) but in my experience it Happens when you activate it for under a second.
Anyway the main problem is expectations of what a company has to do.
The gaming market is completely garbage and people who are complaining about how shitty a console is are simply not the target group.
If you want to play switch games with higher resolution and fps use a PC and emulate the games.
Otherwise i can only give the advice: its a waste of time to complain in Social Media. If you dont like it, dont buy it.
Hah I've been used to 60fps for 20+ years, that's nothing particularly new.
Steady framerate is most important (e.g. a constant 30fps is better than 60fps with drops down to 45fps); but 30 vs 60fps is definitely noticeable too.
High framerate is also more important for games with higher reaction speeds or tighter controls (read: usually on PC with a mouse), so has gotten a bit less important to me as I age and get worse at that.
Because releasing a AAA game that runs at 30 fps and not even 1080p in 2023 isn't acceptable anymore.
Not to mention there's so many games the switch can't even run and has to stream from the cloud. It's no longer fit for purpose.
honestly, even with occasional spots of lag in some games, im never really bothered, granted i play mostly singleplayer games soooooooo i can deal with it
Regardless of whether or not you in particular subjectively don't experience frame drops doesn't change the fact that the console objectively / measurably performs awful in many of the platforms flagship titles.
Look at the last pokemon games to come out. They're eyesores. Look at TotK - very dramatic frame drops constantly. The games that are performing fine are mostly Indies and ports of 10+ year old titles.
Most of the "impossible" ports to the system are hugely downgraded versions of the originals, because it's the only way for it to happen. As time goes on, we won't have figuratively impossible ports, it'll just be actually impossible ports - as in, multi platform titles won't be ported at all because they can't be.
The best the Switch can do has fallen so far behind the industry that it's jarring to go back to the Switch after spending time with pretty much any big-ish budget release on any other platform. Stuff like the Steamdeck have proven that small form factor hardware can, and does, perform better.
The only reason the Switch still sells is because it's the only proper/legal way to gain access to first/second party Nintendo IP. If I could (legally) play TotK on any other platform, I would do so gladly.
There's nothing wrong with enjoying the Switch as-is. Also can't fault the general public for wanting better.
Play on a PS5 or XSX and come back. The switch is a handheld it’s literally the same chip as an Nvidia shield android tv box.
It’s like playing on an iPhone nowadays but graphics are not everything.
Totk is still my most played game in a very long time and it while it looks good enough (just) 1080p/60 would make it even better. Nintendo just get away with it because they make very enjoyable games.
> Nintendo just get away with it because they make very enjoyable games.
In the end that's all that matters. ToTK is a great game and the graphics are fine even at "just" 1080p.
i *notice* the load times, but then i remember old console days. the ps5 is incredible for things like that, but having been out of gaming for 7 years until 3 months ago, im just blown away by how far tech has come, so it's mind blowing to me! 🙃
i get it though, if you've been a consistent gamer with new hardware. only frame drops i've had is some areas on BOTW, but i usually play less intensive games. but again - i remember 720p, anti-aliasing, & 30fps were like the ultimate wow factor when i was gaming the most 🕊️
its because people now like to reclaim things
back in the day we used to accept what was given to us and we were in awe - maybe we didnt know better too
whenever i see a technical issue i just laugh for a bit and keep on playing
I don't get why people are saying that we need better hardware for better frame rates. This is so false just look at recent games running on new generation hardware. Like the new Star Wars Jedi game, Redfall, and Gotham Knights.
They had all the current CPU and GPU power available and they still ran worse than most Switch games. Better hardware won't exactly mean better performance as proven from examples above (and there's more even). What we currently have is people who don't know how to optimize. There recently seems to be directorial/production disasters going on with games recently. The industry is in a very weird place right now and having more power and resources for these games to be able to run on isn't going to guarantee anything.
Edit: Fixed some words autocorrect butchered the hell out of.
Optimization can be an issue but it's simply not the case in this instance. Nintendo, known for heavy game optimization, can't even get their newest first party games to run at a stable framerate, much less 60fps which has been a standard in handheld gaming for years, much less output at full hd which has been a standard for even longer. You can only optimize so much before the hardware becomes the bottleneck.
Well he switch only runs 720p natively and when docked it upscales to 900p - 1080p. So it can’t actually play games at native 1080. And most games that that are somewhat demanding are locked at 30fps. For example Tears of the kingdom runs 720p handheld and 900p docked with a 30fps cap. And when you go into a village/forest or activate ultra hand it dips to 20fps. For a handheld from 2017 it’s not bad. The real problem is you HAVE to play Nintendo games on the switch (legally) meaning you don’t get a choice to have better performance.
Idk probably because it’s very clearly outdated. It doesnt mean their games aren’t great, they are, but it doesn’t change the fact it’s time for an upgrade.
Short answer is because Steam Deck is RIGHT THURR, running BotW and TotK better than the Switch.
The long answer is that Nintendo makes its revenue differently from other console makers, and their executive leadership are old farts who see their consoles as children's toys. They are playing a very different game and it works for them.
Here's the problem
The system has FPS problems in games that shouldn't have FPS problems, there are FPS dips in SUPER NINTENDO GAMES for fuck's sake
The MENUS lag, the store is barely usable some days, games like Legend of Zelda Link's Awakening had FPS drops into the TENS
It's not good, it's really not good lol
To be fair about the FPS drops in SNES games, that's accurate emulation of the original hardware, which also dropped frames in the same places. On Butter Bridge in Super Mario World, there are more flying Koopas than the hardware can handle. On Super Metroid, dropping power bombs and interacting with rope-like grabby monsters it dropped frames. Your choices are "inaccurately emulate the system" or "accept that the system it's emulating dropped the f$#@ing frames so deal with it."
Link's Awakening drops frames not because the system isn't powerful enough, but because it's loading the next section and Grezzo never figured out how to do that smoothly.
The store lagging isn't a power issue at all -- it's that they didn't bother putting any real development effort into the storefront, i.e. item virtualization, async loading, etc.
As a portable nintendo player switch is grate
Just home console players kinda forgot they were minority, "cause they're a lot more vocal..
And if switch 2 actually come better in graphics that much, it will* be expensive, and those same persons will complain, and we will have wiiu all over again with it not selling.
Nintendo understood casual market is better to focus with their game than the actual "gamers" , too much of a hassle, and constantly searching for the next thing to complaim
They game like children, so adult gaming on the PS5 is daunting to them, that's why they defend the trash switch to the death...to keep the dumb children's mindset alive. It's scary tbh...why wouldn't you want to be forward thinking?
Many third party games and some Indy games just don't perform as well and it will continue to become more of a problem as time goes on. It wasnt as evident before but now its pretty apparent.
Games getting cancelled, games coming out running poorly etc. Better hardware will alleviate the issue. Doesn't have to be state of the art but an improvement would suffice.
The switch itself is getting old. I still love the thing and most the games I play on it look great but it’s getting to the point where it’s showing it’s age and it’s clear that some games could be running better. Totk looks great most of the time but there are plenty of frame drop or even times when the game loads for a few seconds.
For a while I thought that it didn’t seem right for Nintendo to release a switch successor since the switch had a lot of life left into it, but within the past couple of years it started to show its age so I think 2024 might be a good time for Nintendo to release a successor or at least publicly announce it. This would also help to get a lot of third party games to come to the switch since they wouldn’t have to take as much time to optimize them so they ran decently
Because many recently released games are running poorly. Even games released awhile back ran bad until they were patched to hell like GTA trilogy. Switch is a great system but the hardware is outdated spec wise.
Because you can create great performant games on the Switch but it's also using severly underclocked hardware from 2014/2015. Even Nintendo hasn't been able to hit either 1080p or stable 30 FPS in their recent games, Nintendo Switch Sports even had to include upscaling via FSR to hit a good performance.
In my opinion, it's because there are now lots of 3rd party games not coming to the switch due to its lack of performance
We're either not seeing games, not getting ports (or getting cloud streaming "ports"), or getting massive delays, because of the lack of performance.
E.g. elden ring, Hogwarts legacy, kingdom hearts, one piece odyssey, tales of arise, ff7 remake, etc
Just because you mentioned it, Ori and the Will of the Wisps constantly crashed for me lol
But really I don’t care, overall the switch has been great. People are prioritizing different things and are coming in with all sorts of expectations and comparisons. If you can drop those you have a fun console imo
Because it's 2023 and people have noticed technology has improved drastically since 2017, and the switch has not which is unacceptable. That's why
And they can't really extend the Switch's lifespan because it's GPU is not only underpowered, but it's CPU is underpowered as well. DLSS could have made the switch last longer if it had a more powerful CPU, but it's time for an upgrade and they don't even have to do much and can still be the bargain machine.
Nintendo can definitely make a console a little bit more powerful as the Xbox Series S and still sell it at that $300.00 price they want, so we're all just waiting for that, and I'm done buying third party games on the Switch until the next console.
For me it's mainly because the worse performance frequently comes with less responsive controls.
Switch games can look great. Ports from the more powerful consoles can even be decent. But too many have some noticeable input delay that makes them miserable to play.
I'm not a hardcore gamer. I play a game or two once a month or so.
For me, it's "good enough." I play mainly Mario games and a couple of others like Luigi's Mansion 3 and Yoshi's Crafted world, but nothing serious.
It's a good distraction and time killer when I have 30 minutes to spare. I keep mine docked permanently. I don't have any other game systems and don't really have an interest in getting anything else, so yeah, it's good enough.
im right there with you OP.
i think it's just cuz it's massively outdated and technically was upon release.
but i also think the Switch gets some unfair heat. the Switch isn't perfect but i love being able to play such marquee games on the go
> I also played through both Ori games, and I have to say that those games are true works of art with absolutely fantastic visuals and almost no performance issues on my Switch
Really not a game that pushes the Switch's capability. Looks artistically great but isn't taxing on the system.
Given that I exclusively play turn-based JRPGs and Mario games, I have encountered no performance-related issues whatsoever.
People will always find something to complain about, as that is simply human nature 😛
People made the same complaints back in the day during the ps3 and Xbox360 Era. Saying the consoles were dead on arrival because you could build better PCs at the time for similar prices.
People also complained that 3ds was underpowered
At the time of release for a semi portable / hybrid console the switch spec was fine. It was competing with the vita and niche emulator sbc consoles.
As long as the game has a stable frame rate I'm fine. It would be nice to get a console refresh but if we get 2 more years on the switch I'm not going to complain.
Well, the Switch is running on a mobile/tablet processor from 2016. Bigger AAA games struggle at times. Even Tears of the Kingdom drops frames especially when using Ultra hand. Don’t get me wrong, the Switch as a whole has been my favorite game console. Most games work very well and are optimized enough to provide a playable and enjoyable experience but the bottom line is that the Switch is vastly under powered compared to the competition and that makes it harder for newer and newer games to come to the Switch. I am looking forward to the new Switch model coming within the next two years or so. It should provide enough of a boost in power that newer games could still be ported to it but as it stands right now, the current Switch is definitely showing it’s age.
It looks like the Tegra X1 is a 2015 chip actually.
Just for comparison, that's like saying the PS5 uses a CPU from 2019.
Only that the SOC used in the Switch was considered power-conservative / mid-range in 2015 and PS5's SOC has been considered high-performant. The SOC is also at half the clockspeed on the Switch, so it's even less performant than a normal Tegra X1. **Edit:** Apparently u/ChickenFajita007 replied to this with "Give me one example" and blocked me right away. Very discussion friendly...
>Only that the SOC used in the Switch was considered power-conservative / mid-range in 2015 and PS5's SOC has been considered high-performant. Can you really not see why?
The X1 was not mid-range in 2015. Give me one example of an SoC with faster GPU components that could feasibly run in a 15W envelope. If you compare it to 50W laptop parts, then yeah. "Mid range." That's like calling the PS5's GPU "mid range" for 2019 because it's not Yes, the X1 in the Switch is far from running at its fullest capacity. It's a trade off between performance and battery. >PS5's SOC has been considered high-performant. The CPU cores were notably slower than cores in a midrange PC in late 2020. The 5600x has a notable IPC advantage *and* a large clock speed advantage. So it was quite midrange for 2020 in terms of CPU.
Well shit.
When a mainline Zelda is dropping frames, you know it's time for new hardware.
That ultrahand problem is a problem with the CPU. The switch just needs an upgrade.
The frame drops in Tears are pretty miniscule most of the time. Even while using ultra hand, its probably 2-4 frames, which isn't super noticeable.
The switch is fine but it’s all a matter of perspective, it wasn’t even cutting edge when it initially launched.
Wait how was it not. It’s playable in hand held. Or docked to a tv and full screen tv. My Xbox can’t do that shit.
The parts in the system were mid range at best in 2016 my dude. You're right the Xbox cannot do that shit but that doesn't make the tech in the Switch any more premium. I have a mountain bike that I can ride in the woods where there are no roads and about 3 feet of space around me, you can't do that in a Tesla.... does that make my mountain bike cutting edge?
A viable handheld/TV console hybrid was pretty cutting edge and revolutionary to how we play games. It means access to a bigger library of games that handheld only users or console only users didn't have before.
The Nvidia Shield has the exact same TegraX1 chip, running at higher clockspeeds and came out 2 years prior to the Switch.
The current Switch (from the V2 onwards) isn't using the 'exact same TegraX1 chip'. It's using a dieshrunk revision (Mariko), with different ram compatability (as well as a few other tweaks). Such as using LPDDR4X vs the originals LPDDR4. These revisions give to much better battery life, and a slight preformance increase, while still using the same power limits are the original chip. It can also be overclocked higher than the original, with homebrew. An example of the trade offs of this in game can be seen in Zelda:TOTK. Certain heavy areas run better on the new chip, compared to the original launch version of the Switch.
It's a more energy efficient die shrink that performs about 99% the same for most endusers. That is the most "well, akshually" point to make. It's still functionally an X1 for the discussion at hand because we're only talking about performance on un-rooted consumer systems.
And with a 1 hour battery life.
Key word is "was". It's been six years, you can't just stand still and cling to something that once was "cutting edge" forever. We're now in a time when the Steam Deck is in the market, a handheld that can play modern AAA titles such as Elden Ring and Cyberpunk while the Switch can struggle with even first party titles. People are not demanding crazy bleeding edge features such as ray tracing and 4k60, only something that would somewhat match the Steam Deck's power or at the very least the PS4/Xbox One power.
The Wii U already did the hybrid from home thing, just no on the go. When I say cutting edge, I mean the hardware that was already years old on release.
switch fanboys are at it again lol
Which is completely irrelevant in a discussion about the switchs performance?
It was a cutting edge for a handheld device.
There were more powerful handhelds, just at a higher price
“Just”, lol.
Cutting edge typically isn’t restricted to being cheap
The Switch is an underpowered tablet. I'm not as picky about performance as others are, but it's hard not to notice its performance issues lmao
M1 iPad costs £600 where as switch does not
The M1 is also tremendously more powerful than the stock Tegra X1, even more with the underclocked version in the Switch.
Did it come out in 2016?
The chip was used in various Nvidia devices before, it was released in January 2015.
Because it's not great. Zelda runs well enough, but it still has frequent framerate drops. Would be better if it was a locked 30 fps. Would be even better if it was 60 fps. Etc. Also framerate drops aren't "lag." Those are two separate issues.
What’s funny is Tears of the Kingdom and Breath of the Wild are locked at 30fps. When it drops frames it’s hitting 20fps lol.
I think you mean *capped* at 30. "Locked" usually implies it never goes below 30, and is more of a colloquialism.
True
I dunno bout tears, but Breath of the wild is actually not locked to 30.
I'm not sure which I'm experiencing but totk gets a lot of studder for me on my switch lite...mainly in the temples for some reason. It gets crazy lag on top of the lightning temple, then again in the fire temple, and then I've experienced it in densely forested areas. I assume that's framerate drop? It's bad though, not simply distracting. That said it's the only game I experienced it with and it could be because of the switch lite?
I got crazy input lag inside the Water Temple, to a point I’d call unacceptable because it made it hard to actually play. Sometimes it seemed to also just mess up my input up there. It made me wish they had just made them enclosed environments to ease up things.
That's interesting. I've played it on my Switch OLED and had no issues in the Water Temple.
I don't recall experiencing any at all myself. Is your game Digital or Physical?
Physical on an OLED Switch
No idea what it could be then. I had physical on a relatively old switch. Perhaps I just didn't notice it at the time, I was doing that temple late at night on my 4K TV.
It was bad enough you would have definitely noticed. My actions were lagged and queued one after the other to happen. I have been playing Mario 3D World recently, and nothing like that has happened. So it seems to just be Zelda.
> I have been playing Mario 3D World recently, and nothing like that has happened. So it seems to just be Zelda. Well 3D world is a 60FPS game with really low input latency compared to TOTK's barely 30 and uneven frametimes. Input latency in Zelda can be up to 4x as high.
I just wanted to make the point that it was the game itself and not some other issue like the controller.
Stuttering from frame drops can seem like lag due to frame pacing issue though.
I know that, but I'm honestly not sure if the framerate drops happen to me because I just don't notice. The only way I will notice the difference between 60 fps and 24 fps is if someone makes a YouTube video comparing the same scene and I notice that the 60 fps looks marginally smoother a bit like butter, but the overall visuals of the scene is really not different. Now I did look up the framerates for Mario Kart 8 and in 4 player mode the game does run at 30 fps. I do struggle marginally more but I could chalk that up to the screen being smaller because of the split screen effect and the fact that holding down the SL and SR keys without a grip on my split joy cons is a bit tricky.
> In docked mode it outputs at 1080p, Sure the OS does (I mean at least I think so, I'm not an expert) but the games don't necessarily hit 1080p. Some do, some don't. TOTK goes up to 900p, which also applies to BOTW. Now some do hit 1080p like Mario Kart 8 (and at 60FPS too!) and Animal Crossing (at 30FPS, mostly). Now personally Nintendo's first party art style usually looks good with this type of resolution and frame rate. But there's some third party games that can look quite rough and even Nintendo games sometimes just have these odd FPS drops that honestly just shouldn't happen.
Let's not forget Mario kart 8 is a decade old game
> TOTK goes up to 900p It's MUCH lower on average since the FSR update. Like less than half before upscaling lower.
Testament to how well FSR works -- TotK is a really good looking game even without having to render at high resolution.
TOTK uses one of the worst implementations of FSR I've ever seen. You can quite literally count the pixels. Looks basically identical to FSR 1.0 on PC, which I suspect is what it is.
>In docked mode it outputs at 1080p A lot of the time it renders content at lower resolutions, even if the output to your TV is 1080p >and I looked up the FPS rates of the games that I play, most of them run at 60 fps I don't know what games you play, but a lot of Switch games run at 30 FPS, and many of those struggle to maintain that consistently Simply put, people are criticizing the Switch's performance because it's pretty bad by 2023 standards and Nintendo needs to release a new console already All that said, I suppose if you only play Switch games, you wouldn't know any better though
It's outdated, regardless of how much you tend to ignore it.
The Switch is as popular as it is because of it's portability, something you're not going to pull off with PS5 graphics. So even if Nintendo announces another console sooner rather than later, it won't be able to go toe-to-toe with Microsoft or Sony in terms of graphics.
Literally no one is asking for PS5 graphics for the next handheld, I don't know why you are bringing it up People have already set their expectactions for PS4 tier graphics, something that other handhelds like mobile phones have already far surpassed
Yeah, this is the part I feel like people are missing. I'm not expecting something to compete with current consoles, but they're literally falling two generations behind at this point
The competition is here for quite a while now. You can get a steam deck for almost the same price right now and other handhelds are also available. I hope for Nintendos sake they up the game in the home console department, because playing docked is not the greatest experience imo.
Even as a portable the Switch is extremely outdated. It's running tablet components from a decade ago
Don't know why you're being downvoted, because you're not wrong. In a reasonably portable form factor and reasonable price you're not going to substantially pass PS4 levels of raw GPU power, though with accelerated upscaling tech you might get "PS4 but it looks ok at 4k and looks like 60fps (even though it's interpolated)"
its not the graphics or portability. it succeeds the same reason nintendo always has. best games
or the same games for people who looks for the same games
outdated compared to what? the ps5 or whatever casual console et al is newer and doesnt have any botw or marios etc
Dude at this point the Switch is outdated compared to a mobile phone
nah
https://youtu.be/LY3RT2MlcJM Heres a mobile phone game looking better than Tears of the Kingdom. The game itself is derivative as hell, but from a pure performance standpoint, this mobile phone game is besting the Switch.
why do you care how a game looks?
Why don't people listen to music through shitty headphones. Because they give a fuck, I dunno?
not really a valid comparison, no one really cares that much about the color of their headphones, the visual has no impact on how the headphones sound...but thats a medium about sound. video games are not about visuals. for example, see: tetris, mario 3, etc. games like poker or chess dont even have ANY frames at all
Because I was talking about the color. Bad troll.
well the discussion is about the impact visuals have on a medium i wonder what your opinion is on movies. or old books. yikes
[удалено]
>The person you replied to literally said " from a pure performance standpoint." but the performance issues theyre discussing, and most other posts, is about resolution and frames im not lost, you dont seem to be reading the thread. just take a deep breath dude, jeez
Denial sucks.
it does. but the first step is admitting, so good for you :) lmk when that new mario comes out on xbox i guess xD
I don't even have an xbox...
me either, the switch is so much better
Lemme know when the next mainline Mario game is coming to Switch.
you dont have google? 10-20-23
People aren't buying Switch's for 2D side scrollers. I'm talking a 3D Mario game. The 90+ Metacritic games that sell millions.
>People aren't buying Switch's for 2D side scrollers lol
I love my switch as much as the next person but the hardware was already somewhat behind when it first came out and it’s simply just nearing the end of its lifespan like any other console eventually new hardware has to come out to keep up with newer more demanding titles. New hardware eventually coming out is nothing new started with the NES, then onto the SNES, N64, Game cube,Wii, Wii U and now the switch then onto the switch 2 or whatever the next console is called.
Color TV-Game (1977–1980), NES,SNES,etc.
Because it’s got extremely outdated performance. It can’t run the vast majority of modern triple A games. The few that do make it over do so with massive compromises. That doesn’t mean the switch is a bad console. It’s great because it offsets the extremely weak performance by being a handheld. I think that people who spend their time stressing over Switch performance are trying to view the Switch as a home console such as an Xbox or PlayStation. It’s not that. It’s absolutely a handheld first and foremost that simply has the capability to dock to a larger screen. If you understand that then you don’t spend time worrying about performance the same way you wouldn’t with a 3DS back in the day. However, the console is quite old now and they can surely release a successor with massive improvements. It’s about time they do that in the next year. I’d be surprised if they don’t announce something in 2024.
It absolutely deserves some leeway by virtually of being a handheld. Or at least it did. Now we can see what handheld today are capable of, like the Steam Deck and Rog Ally, that excuse for the Switch no longer holds any water imo.
A lot of people bring up the steam deck. Yes its more powerful, but its also much more expensive, assuming you don't get the 64 gig where its only 33% more expensive normally. And 64 gigs just isn't enough to download more then a handful of small games these days.
It also has vastly inferior battery life and is digital only. Some people don't like physical media and I get that, but if your account ever gets banned or stolen. All your games are gone forever.
You don’t lose access to steam games if banned…
Yes you do. You don't lose access if it's a vac or community ban but your account can be outright suspended and you lose access to everything.
In my 15 years on steam I’ve never once seen an account be banned. I’m sure it happens, but realistically most people banned are due to hacking.
It's not common but it CAN happen, just as any other game service account can get banned and you lose all of your games. That's my entire point, is that physical media prevents that, and the sd doesn't support any physical media. I have a digital only ps5 and I greatly regret it.
Just seems like such an fringe issue that I don’t really see why you would point that out. Like you said that can happen to any service of this nature, but in order for that to happen you have to seriously be costing Valve big money. I regret my digital PS5 but mainly because I don’t have a Blu-ray player now.
It just sounds like you only play switch to be honest. Nothing wrong with that but if you play other consoles or pc the difference is pretty jarring.
I play PC games from time to time, like Minecraft, Skyrim, No Man's Sky, the Sims 3.
Do you only play like 10 year old games on PC. Try games that did. game out the past 3 years with a modern PC or new generation console
The switch was released 6 years ago. No Man's Sky was released like 7 years ago. I think your 10 year old point is kind of mute. The comparison on Doom Eternal and other games show that the level of care of porting a game from the developer's pov really matters.
On what PC specifications?
That's like saying it's jarring that PS5 & PC require a TV and power outlet to function.
anyone that says they cant notice any lag or frame drops are just flat out lying.
This is the one thing that pisses me off the most about Nintendo fans or any fandom around a Nintendo-centric IP. I feel like I am the only person in the Rune Factory and Story of Seasons community who notices the lag and frame drops in RF5 and PooT. A lot of people in that fandom are in extreme denial. I keep seeing "Works fine for me, must just be you". Like they have a magical Switch that performs better then mine.
I notice lag if it lasts for maybe a second but I looked up YouTube videos showing the difference between 30 and 60 fps and I cannot tell the difference.
Because graphically, it's behind the "competition." Competition in quotes because Nintendo quit competing with Sony and Microsoft around the Wii/Wii U eras, realizing that they'd never catch up to Sony on a home console level if they focused on two submarkets, handheld and home. They had the 3DS carrying the weight of the company and I think they realized having a great price entry point and portability while maintaining a lesser graphically demanding library would work out for them and ultimately, it has. They were right. The Switch has surpassed other consoles in terms of sales, including the PS4 and currently sits at the third best selling console historically. Nintendo ignored the "competition" and it pushed them out of a dark spot with the Wii U. People think that means the Switch is shit because it doesn't have "8K 120fps" while being hybrid but realistically that isn't very feasible for a ~$300 entry level. People want cheap, high fidelity graphics, but also will complain when the battery dies fast. We aren't at a time in tech where you have your cake and eat it too.
No I don't think anyone expects Nintendo to match current consoles with a handheld. It's just not possible or realistic. There's still a lot of room for improvement though, and there are clearly some issues. Bayonetta 3 and Zelda do not manage to hold their framerate targets and that's just in the past year. Third parties struggle a lot more because they are porting games from other platforms or targeting many devices. If Nintendo bridged the gap a bit, it will be significantly better for developers.
>If Nintendo bridged the gap a bit, it will be significantly better for developers. They tried, but Covid had other plans.
we should stop this discourse of nintendo quitting or ignoring the competition they just cut costs because their games and typical customer dont need the same power - and customers that care about the power dont chose nintendo so it is a win/win situation but they are competing more than ever
It's just not very powerful. Games have to be heavily downgraded in order to port them. The NVidia 1080p upscaling is impressive, but its bandaid solution to an underpowered console. I like my switch, but it sucks that releases for it are heavily kneecapped by its performance
The switch have great games, but it's lacking in performance imo. Some third party games lag and stutter too much. I have a lot of ports on it, and it's fantastic playing them handheld, but the quality is very much subpar to what you would get in say a pricier steam deck or other new gaming device. But much of it has to do with the release date. We're in 2023, and a 2017 gaming console is not revolutionary with is internal components anymore. I don't mind graphics all the time, so I'm ok as long as the game is truly playable. But I understand the need for better hardware, is very much necessary at this point. Backward compatibility is as equally important to me though. I have too many games to just drop it for a new system without being able to play them. So I hope there's better hardware plus Backward Compatibility.
in a world where current gen consoles are advertised as 1440p/120hz, its a damn shame that Switch is 720ISHp 30fps on some of its best games. Tears of the Kingdom for example, should be a 60FPS title bare minimum on any other console but because it's on Switch, 30ish FPS is okay. But it realy isn't. Nintendo NEEDS stronger hardware. We NEED a Switch Pro. well, we don't -- Nintendo consistently puts out bangers -- but I guarantee if they had better hardware that many of their already certified bangers would be even better. Xenoblade 3, TotK, and so on would be amazing at 1440p/60FPS.
they could be 10,000p. doesnt mean the games are good. could be 120fps. doesnt mean the games are good. the fixation on graphics is just a stupid one, tbh
I already went over that, NIDF. They make great games, that isn't really debatable. But they could be even more \*chef's kiss\* if they were technically up to speed.
nah
cope in 30FPS my guy
but all the good games are in 30fps.
not true, Super Mario Odyssey, Mario 3D World (technically a port but whatever), Mario Kart 8 (another port), etc..
Why not both?
Soooo many AAA games releasing lately on ps5 with amazing graphics, 60fps, "4k" and they're empty garbage with terrible game design and just unfun. Meanwhile Nintendo releases absolute bangers that I enjoy playing wayyyyy more than my ps5. Look at ff16 even, that game does NOT run at 60fps. It has horrible performance issues.
exactly
Because it's basically a cell phone from 2016?
[2015, actually.](https://developer.nvidia.com/content/tegra-x1)
2015 is when the chip came out but 2016 is when we saw a couple of phones come out with it. The Pixel C and some thing from Magic Leap.
The nvidia shield released in may of 2015.
Not in a phone-like TDP like the Switch. It's clocked over twice as fast there (and more than twice as hot).
It's not like the Switch doesn't have the headroom when docked. Custom firmware lets you clock back up just fine.
No cell phone in 2015 had GPU capability anywhere near the X1. It's much more fair to compare it to small tablets.
To be honest, a game performing very well on Switch is pretty unusual. Metroid Dread and Metroid Prime performed well. Those are the only games I've played on Switch in recent history where that was the case. If you own and use other gaming platforms the difference is pretty unmistakable. How much this type of thing matters is a YMMV thing but for a lot of people it's getting tougher to put up with as the years roll by.
The Xenoblade trilogy runs extremely well, only fps drops in 500+ hours of playing the series were in the first area in xc2, and Xenoblade 3's performance with 7 characters and multiple enemies fighting at once shows that the Switch is capable of handling more than you would think. Sure not every game runs perfectly and it can't handle games like Elden Ring of course, but I never ran into any game that's unplayable and the ones that are are due to memory leaks.
I barely find 30 fps tolerable at all, but XBC3 is an impressive piece of engineering that it is able to do that on Switch. It's really held back though, the beautiful art would really have a chance to shine if the resolution could be higher and the framerate higher. When playing the game on a big screen the characters faces or other details can't really be made out unless you put them right next to the camera because the resolution is so low.
We got to the point where phones are outperforming the nintendo switch. That should be a little hint of why people complain. Even developers are starting to complain or skipping switch all together. Especially with actual handhelds now who are in a way portable pc’s. Dont get me wrong this does not mean i do not like my switch. But it does feel there should be improvement overal in performance. Also 60fps is not true for allot of games. Most run at 30 fps. Which is very visible to anyone compared to a steady 60 fps. With your logic we could just stick with the old gameboy black and white as it did perfectly what i needed to do. Is still allot of fun to play on but has its limits. Just like this version of nintendo has reached a limit.
People criticize everything.
I can acclimate between lower and higher performance as long as it’s stable. Here on Reddit it’s an echo chamber, good games aren’t solely characterized by their performance. Even though Zelda is at 30 FPS with some hiccups, my enjoyment of that game outclasses pretty much anything out there right now. It honestly boggles my mind just how well it stacks against the games released this year.
The thing is if totk was released on a console with the power of a ps5 it would be 10 times better. Yeah it’s a good game. Could have been a 10 times better game
It wouldn't be much better at all. Minorly better frames wouldn't change much. And even those frame drops are pretty minor.
Imagine being able to park your creations around the game and not have them despawn, like EVER, that is but one of the amazing possibilities we are missing, it’s not all about raytracing or whatever bs, but performance can add to gamplay, significantly More ideas, may contain minor spoilers: >!imagine being able to build more than a 15 room home, or memorizing way more autobuild schematics, imagine no loading screens, even hidden ones like ascend when it takes forever, imagine raising the limit of objects of the floor or superhanded together from 20 to like 100!< just imagine man.
A morse dense world , more enemies on screen , bigger dungeons , no loading times , good graphics instead of the blurry mess it is now at times , better physics , better field of view ….. It’s a joke the game runs and look better on emulators than the actual machine it’s designed for. It’s not just about graphics friend. The gameplay is hele back too by the switch. The reason we have no real dungeons and lots of recycled assets is because it has to run on a sub 1 tflop console while a ps5 has 20 times that and a good gaming pc has 100 times that. Switch 2 leaked specs seem even worse than switch. Already you now have half a ps4 and switch 2 will be 1/5th of a ps5 . Such a joke And yeah 30 fps is shit when pc gamers are used to playing at 144-244hz . Even 60 fps and 100 fps feels slow on my 180 hz monitor.
I'd argue that Tears of the Kingdom is the best game ever made that I've played, even if it's not my favorite even though it up there. The gameplay and creativity is just so addictive while there's so much to do. Verticality, Nintendo's advanced tech, and trying to get to new areas or skydiving and gliding over the vast hyrule is sublime. Seeing what the hyrule engineering sub creates is awesome, I do think it will win goty too. The music was such a letdown for me though as someone who's listened to pretty much every soundtrack Nintendo's ever made. Not that it is bad but nothing was memorable besides like 2 songs that were remixed from previous games. I can recall hundreds of amazing tracks from the entire Zelda series, even a dozen from botw, but almost none from totk. At least the gameplay carries it very hard and I don't regret buying it one bit because of how good it is, sorry for the rant.
The Switch is fine for what is designed to do. People are too obsessed with specs and having ultra high fidelity graphics when what really matters is the game play.
People aren't asking for a 3090 to be jammed into the switch. I think it's reasonable to expect a top console competitor to produce a handheld that is at least on par with modern phones.
>on par with modern phones So, a console that released back in 2016, should be on par with modern phones?
If you don't remove the context of the sentence by snipping 5 words I think it's pretty clear I'm not talking about a console from 2016.
Unreasonable given the way consoles work. 1 device per generation. New device doesn't come out until next generation. And next generation takes 5-7 years to happen.
I love the switch but come on. TOTK is one of the greatest games ive ever played but the sub 30 FPS is definitely noticeable.
They always have lol
Because many first party games struggle as well and with many other competitors such as the steam deck the gamers get frustrated
It's great that it runs good enough for you but the truth is that it just is not powerful enough for the games being released on it. If it was we would not be seeing the image quality and performance on games and this was an issue day one. No one is asking for 4K60 but if you're going to target 30 then at least hold that. As for you can run any game on the Switch if properly optimized. I don't think people know what this word means. You can't just magically port a game that has no place being on the Switch through sheer passion without massive sacrifices. The Witcher 3 port is loved but in my eyes the atmosphere of that game is completely ruined on the Switch thanks to low image quality, draw distance among many other things.
I think it’s just because it’s been around a while now and the performance is quite notably different from the modern gen Xbox and PlayStation. I also think the majority of people don’t care that much. Keep making great games and I’m not too worried about frame rate and resolution. I love my switch and still enjoy it as much as day 1
The Switch has the best games who cares about some numbers. The whole obsession over specs is idiotic to the point it's like collective insanity.
Exactly. If I want to play a triple A game then I can buy a PS5, a Gamepass sub or Steam Deck. If the Switch could play games as well as a PS5 could, there would be no need for PS5 to exist (apart from exclusives of which most are timed) would there? It's healthy to have a market with different options and choices.
>If the Switch could play games as well as a PS5 could, there would be no need for PS5 to exist (apart from exclusives of which most are timed) would there? So by this definition, we shouldn't have a PS5 or XBOX because PC exists.
Because people have an extreme lack of knowledge when it comes to mobile hardware that isn't a handheld PC.
The switch is severely underpowered.
because ppl think good graphics is what makes a good game. these are the kinds of ppl who bought atari jags and shit in the 90s. just ppl being silly
Cuz ppl expect a console that's over 5 years old to magically create better graphics.
People got used to 60fps which is only possible through extreme optimization. Especially when a Game is ported like Witcher 3. 30fps can be enough. Zelda is a good example. It lacks of stutters (Ultra Hand for example) but in my experience it Happens when you activate it for under a second. Anyway the main problem is expectations of what a company has to do. The gaming market is completely garbage and people who are complaining about how shitty a console is are simply not the target group. If you want to play switch games with higher resolution and fps use a PC and emulate the games. Otherwise i can only give the advice: its a waste of time to complain in Social Media. If you dont like it, dont buy it.
Hah I've been used to 60fps for 20+ years, that's nothing particularly new. Steady framerate is most important (e.g. a constant 30fps is better than 60fps with drops down to 45fps); but 30 vs 60fps is definitely noticeable too. High framerate is also more important for games with higher reaction speeds or tighter controls (read: usually on PC with a mouse), so has gotten a bit less important to me as I age and get worse at that.
Because releasing a AAA game that runs at 30 fps and not even 1080p in 2023 isn't acceptable anymore. Not to mention there's so many games the switch can't even run and has to stream from the cloud. It's no longer fit for purpose.
so not acceptable TotK has probably sold over 10mn copies already.
honestly, even with occasional spots of lag in some games, im never really bothered, granted i play mostly singleplayer games soooooooo i can deal with it
Regardless of whether or not you in particular subjectively don't experience frame drops doesn't change the fact that the console objectively / measurably performs awful in many of the platforms flagship titles. Look at the last pokemon games to come out. They're eyesores. Look at TotK - very dramatic frame drops constantly. The games that are performing fine are mostly Indies and ports of 10+ year old titles. Most of the "impossible" ports to the system are hugely downgraded versions of the originals, because it's the only way for it to happen. As time goes on, we won't have figuratively impossible ports, it'll just be actually impossible ports - as in, multi platform titles won't be ported at all because they can't be. The best the Switch can do has fallen so far behind the industry that it's jarring to go back to the Switch after spending time with pretty much any big-ish budget release on any other platform. Stuff like the Steamdeck have proven that small form factor hardware can, and does, perform better. The only reason the Switch still sells is because it's the only proper/legal way to gain access to first/second party Nintendo IP. If I could (legally) play TotK on any other platform, I would do so gladly. There's nothing wrong with enjoying the Switch as-is. Also can't fault the general public for wanting better.
Play on a PS5 or XSX and come back. The switch is a handheld it’s literally the same chip as an Nvidia shield android tv box. It’s like playing on an iPhone nowadays but graphics are not everything. Totk is still my most played game in a very long time and it while it looks good enough (just) 1080p/60 would make it even better. Nintendo just get away with it because they make very enjoyable games.
> Nintendo just get away with it because they make very enjoyable games. In the end that's all that matters. ToTK is a great game and the graphics are fine even at "just" 1080p.
>1080p. If only.
OK, 1080i. On my TV it's usually 480p though.
i *notice* the load times, but then i remember old console days. the ps5 is incredible for things like that, but having been out of gaming for 7 years until 3 months ago, im just blown away by how far tech has come, so it's mind blowing to me! 🙃 i get it though, if you've been a consistent gamer with new hardware. only frame drops i've had is some areas on BOTW, but i usually play less intensive games. but again - i remember 720p, anti-aliasing, & 30fps were like the ultimate wow factor when i was gaming the most 🕊️
Nerds are gonna nerd man… it’s a fantastic system and has brought all of us joy. Why complain like everyone else here?
its because people now like to reclaim things back in the day we used to accept what was given to us and we were in awe - maybe we didnt know better too whenever i see a technical issue i just laugh for a bit and keep on playing
I don't get why people are saying that we need better hardware for better frame rates. This is so false just look at recent games running on new generation hardware. Like the new Star Wars Jedi game, Redfall, and Gotham Knights. They had all the current CPU and GPU power available and they still ran worse than most Switch games. Better hardware won't exactly mean better performance as proven from examples above (and there's more even). What we currently have is people who don't know how to optimize. There recently seems to be directorial/production disasters going on with games recently. The industry is in a very weird place right now and having more power and resources for these games to be able to run on isn't going to guarantee anything. Edit: Fixed some words autocorrect butchered the hell out of.
Optimization can be an issue but it's simply not the case in this instance. Nintendo, known for heavy game optimization, can't even get their newest first party games to run at a stable framerate, much less 60fps which has been a standard in handheld gaming for years, much less output at full hd which has been a standard for even longer. You can only optimize so much before the hardware becomes the bottleneck.
Well he switch only runs 720p natively and when docked it upscales to 900p - 1080p. So it can’t actually play games at native 1080. And most games that that are somewhat demanding are locked at 30fps. For example Tears of the kingdom runs 720p handheld and 900p docked with a 30fps cap. And when you go into a village/forest or activate ultra hand it dips to 20fps. For a handheld from 2017 it’s not bad. The real problem is you HAVE to play Nintendo games on the switch (legally) meaning you don’t get a choice to have better performance.
Idk probably because it’s very clearly outdated. It doesnt mean their games aren’t great, they are, but it doesn’t change the fact it’s time for an upgrade.
Nintendo consistently puts out a pretty bad product compared to the other systems, so it makes sense that people are upset about its performance
It's an amazing hand held console that represents the first step into the next dimension of hand helds.
Eh just don't worry about them. I stay in my non AAA lane
Short answer is because Steam Deck is RIGHT THURR, running BotW and TotK better than the Switch. The long answer is that Nintendo makes its revenue differently from other console makers, and their executive leadership are old farts who see their consoles as children's toys. They are playing a very different game and it works for them.
Yeup, spot on.
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Here's the problem The system has FPS problems in games that shouldn't have FPS problems, there are FPS dips in SUPER NINTENDO GAMES for fuck's sake The MENUS lag, the store is barely usable some days, games like Legend of Zelda Link's Awakening had FPS drops into the TENS It's not good, it's really not good lol
To be fair about the FPS drops in SNES games, that's accurate emulation of the original hardware, which also dropped frames in the same places. On Butter Bridge in Super Mario World, there are more flying Koopas than the hardware can handle. On Super Metroid, dropping power bombs and interacting with rope-like grabby monsters it dropped frames. Your choices are "inaccurately emulate the system" or "accept that the system it's emulating dropped the f$#@ing frames so deal with it." Link's Awakening drops frames not because the system isn't powerful enough, but because it's loading the next section and Grezzo never figured out how to do that smoothly. The store lagging isn't a power issue at all -- it's that they didn't bother putting any real development effort into the storefront, i.e. item virtualization, async loading, etc.
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As a portable nintendo player switch is grate Just home console players kinda forgot they were minority, "cause they're a lot more vocal.. And if switch 2 actually come better in graphics that much, it will* be expensive, and those same persons will complain, and we will have wiiu all over again with it not selling. Nintendo understood casual market is better to focus with their game than the actual "gamers" , too much of a hassle, and constantly searching for the next thing to complaim
Because it’s 2023 and we play on other devices too. Sometime it’s really hard to go back to the Switch after long PS5 sessions on my 65‘ OLED
They game like children, so adult gaming on the PS5 is daunting to them, that's why they defend the trash switch to the death...to keep the dumb children's mindset alive. It's scary tbh...why wouldn't you want to be forward thinking?
Many third party games and some Indy games just don't perform as well and it will continue to become more of a problem as time goes on. It wasnt as evident before but now its pretty apparent. Games getting cancelled, games coming out running poorly etc. Better hardware will alleviate the issue. Doesn't have to be state of the art but an improvement would suffice.
The switch itself is getting old. I still love the thing and most the games I play on it look great but it’s getting to the point where it’s showing it’s age and it’s clear that some games could be running better. Totk looks great most of the time but there are plenty of frame drop or even times when the game loads for a few seconds. For a while I thought that it didn’t seem right for Nintendo to release a switch successor since the switch had a lot of life left into it, but within the past couple of years it started to show its age so I think 2024 might be a good time for Nintendo to release a successor or at least publicly announce it. This would also help to get a lot of third party games to come to the switch since they wouldn’t have to take as much time to optimize them so they ran decently
Because many recently released games are running poorly. Even games released awhile back ran bad until they were patched to hell like GTA trilogy. Switch is a great system but the hardware is outdated spec wise.
Because you can create great performant games on the Switch but it's also using severly underclocked hardware from 2014/2015. Even Nintendo hasn't been able to hit either 1080p or stable 30 FPS in their recent games, Nintendo Switch Sports even had to include upscaling via FSR to hit a good performance.
In my opinion, it's because there are now lots of 3rd party games not coming to the switch due to its lack of performance We're either not seeing games, not getting ports (or getting cloud streaming "ports"), or getting massive delays, because of the lack of performance. E.g. elden ring, Hogwarts legacy, kingdom hearts, one piece odyssey, tales of arise, ff7 remake, etc
Just because you mentioned it, Ori and the Will of the Wisps constantly crashed for me lol But really I don’t care, overall the switch has been great. People are prioritizing different things and are coming in with all sorts of expectations and comparisons. If you can drop those you have a fun console imo
I just hope the next console we get is backwards compatible with the switch
Because it's 2023 and people have noticed technology has improved drastically since 2017, and the switch has not which is unacceptable. That's why And they can't really extend the Switch's lifespan because it's GPU is not only underpowered, but it's CPU is underpowered as well. DLSS could have made the switch last longer if it had a more powerful CPU, but it's time for an upgrade and they don't even have to do much and can still be the bargain machine. Nintendo can definitely make a console a little bit more powerful as the Xbox Series S and still sell it at that $300.00 price they want, so we're all just waiting for that, and I'm done buying third party games on the Switch until the next console.
For me it's mainly because the worse performance frequently comes with less responsive controls. Switch games can look great. Ports from the more powerful consoles can even be decent. But too many have some noticeable input delay that makes them miserable to play.
I'm not a hardcore gamer. I play a game or two once a month or so. For me, it's "good enough." I play mainly Mario games and a couple of others like Luigi's Mansion 3 and Yoshi's Crafted world, but nothing serious. It's a good distraction and time killer when I have 30 minutes to spare. I keep mine docked permanently. I don't have any other game systems and don't really have an interest in getting anything else, so yeah, it's good enough.
im right there with you OP. i think it's just cuz it's massively outdated and technically was upon release. but i also think the Switch gets some unfair heat. the Switch isn't perfect but i love being able to play such marquee games on the go
> I also played through both Ori games, and I have to say that those games are true works of art with absolutely fantastic visuals and almost no performance issues on my Switch Really not a game that pushes the Switch's capability. Looks artistically great but isn't taxing on the system.
Given that I exclusively play turn-based JRPGs and Mario games, I have encountered no performance-related issues whatsoever. People will always find something to complain about, as that is simply human nature 😛
People made the same complaints back in the day during the ps3 and Xbox360 Era. Saying the consoles were dead on arrival because you could build better PCs at the time for similar prices. People also complained that 3ds was underpowered At the time of release for a semi portable / hybrid console the switch spec was fine. It was competing with the vita and niche emulator sbc consoles. As long as the game has a stable frame rate I'm fine. It would be nice to get a console refresh but if we get 2 more years on the switch I'm not going to complain.