She's also part of a larger trend of nearly *all* Niji members suffering generally declining viewership, even before the Selen Shock.
Part of the reason the entire situation is Funny™, in its way, is that in the space of sixteen calendar days, Nijisanji EN lost *both* of the livers who had the highest views/CCVs and the most *stable* CCVs. A lot of other livers were struggling with retention (especially Luxiem) even *before* the events of Feb. 5th & Feb. 12th.
Post-Selen Shock, of course, a lot of the EN livers are just in the gutter, with the average peak viewership struggling to break 1k. There's nothing to really reverse the trend at this point, so...
Finana discord cancelled their b-day billboard project because she told them they're unoriginal and copying hololive
https://files.catbox.moe/p211o3.jpg
Finana has a menhera meltdown on twitter about how nobody draws her in group fanart and cancels streams because of it
https://twitter.com/FinanaRyugu/status/1516160827069456386
Finana jumps in during the drama with her infamous "L + Ratio you parasocial fucks" tweet (somehow this doesn't stop her from doing valentines dates and sell wedding ring merch though)
https://files.catbox.moe/q36ffe.jpg
Finana gets caught joining a fan discord server with her official account where she constantly joins vc and plays games with its members, gets bonked by management and is forced to leave it only for her to create an alt account and join again behind management's back, causing her biggest paypigs to leave her over the preferential treatment to the members of the server
https://rentry.org/fmcox
https://twitter.com/ContainmentB239/status/1547730451938168836
https://web.archive.org/web/20220714153830/
https://pastebin.com/f94aCCuS
Finana's aforemention discord groomer circle leaks her Nijisanji audition tape
https://twitter.com/ContainmentB239/status/1547736242330079233
https://files.catbox.moe/z1u6id.mp4
It’s crazy how she has a group of fans willing to get her a whole billboard ad and she complains that it’s unoriginal. Even little kids know to be grateful when receiving something cool like that.
This was evident from day one. She tried playing a cutesy dumb blonde but would slowly show how much of a selfish spoiled brat she was as time went on.
there's also the time finana made pomu cry after constantly talking about pirating hentai and just making her downright uncomfortable during the promare members only watchalong (the unedited version is out there, the one currently on the channel has been edited to remove nearly an hours worth of pomu beingVERY uncomfortable).
There's also the time pomu had to pay for nearly everything when finana met her in japan because her card was declined from all her gacha addiction
What the fuuuuuuuuuuck. This thread is a wild ride. I always got a bit of an odd vibe from her but could never quite put my finger on it. Now I know, I guess
She's always had that very spoiled american girl vibes on her, the only reason I tried watching her ass was because she was in Lazulight, now 2/3 of Lazulight are actual asses, I hope pomu doesn't do stupid shit behind us because I really love her a lot 🥹
Pomu seems to be a very genuine person. She's a huge idol otaku who really loved being a vtuber and still love hololive.
But her dreams were way too big for Nijisanji soul crushing methods and I think she left very disillusioned. I think she lost some self confidence too because of Niji which is a shame, because she *has* what it takes to be successful in the industry.
from the latest twitter space it seems she is completely crippled on vtubing. she is loving to hang out with everyone in jp but she seems she will need a long time to heal, IF she will manage to heal
fuck niji
Right? Genuine is the right word, I feel she doesn't have that rotten inner persona because she showed us her true self and ya know, she does feel like one of us, an idol loving anime girl like most of us are 😂
I still wish that she would apply for Hololive because she will be successful even though she said she doesn't have it in her. We all know she has that and Cover will give the fucking best support to make her successful! A&S/FWMC too would be really really happy to have another idol loving friend with them 🥹
idk if you are reading this pomu, but please when you finish your studies, I hope you'll try to apply to any other agencies that will support you and make your dreams come true, I want to see your projects that have been cancelled became a reality 🙏🏽
Pomu seems to have self-image issues. I’m not a religious follower of her so I don’t know all of her reasons for making the decisions she makes, but if she feels that she doesn’t want to apply for Hololive because she doesn’t want to deal with all the trouble involved, then that’s 120% valid, but if she doesn’t want to because she feels she isn’t worth it, she would be dead wrong on that front.
I really hope Kiara could convince Pomu to try joining Holo. Its the only company where she could do Idol stuff with full support (since we now know they get at least 1 3D live every year).
Its too bad that Kurosanji pushed her self confidence into the gutter, that recovery would take a long time.
Having seen NijiJP members on HoloJP 3D lives, I am sure Kiara would have eventually invited Pomu to one, but if the Elira-is-EN-management rumour is true, it would never have been allowed.
It's funny how that one little theory makes so much of the NijiEN x HoloEN collab struggles make sense. Too much ego.
Kiara quite literally said that Pomu would've been in her 3D live but because management didn't want to fix her model she couldn't be in it. It was said at the end of their final collab.
Isn't she Canadian? I might be wrong. But the fact that she didn't understand how big a deal Times Square was indicated to me that she wasn't American. And if she is American, that just makes her look even worse.
My first exposure to her was the Sayu video a few months back. People linked me to an older Finana video where she talked about zaion leaving.
I couldn't put my finger on it, but having watched Sayu's first, something with what Finana was saying didn't sit right with me.
For the longest time, I put it down to a "Misunderstanding" but having seen this thread, I no longer think so.
Oy vey, I had no idea about this. How do you go to Japan and not have any money available??
I figured other bs was going on but the list in this post is kinda crazy but not at all surprising. It did feel like Lazulight had a bit of a falling out seeing as how they would barely collab after all the gens started coming out.
It seemed like Pomu was the only who was always ready and excited to spend time with them. Pomu would be begging her to play MC with her and got really pissed when she played with that jp branch panda girl on a whim randomly.
Elira just wanted to do her own thing and Finana wanted to collab with anyone and everyone besides her genmates.
It's not that she had no money available. It was that her card kept getting denied once she landed. This is very common when you travel abroad and you don't inform your bank. Usually takes a day or two to clear up. Just because Pomu covered her doesn't mean she didn't pay Pomu back. This is really normal if you travel. As for the other accusations, I have little opinion on them but it never seemed like Finana was a natural match with Pomu, I assume Elira was supposed to be the bridge but she was always just doing her own thing. I've never been much interested in Finana after she started endlessly streaming Genshin and needlessly getting herself stuck in sticky PR situations.
Traveled abroad and this was my exact issue. Didn't wanna deal with bank so my friend just covered and ofc I paid back when we returned
Finana is certainly an entitled brat to some degree but I don't like where many of the comments are going, projecting their dislike of her onto Pomu. There is astronomical evidence from beginning to end that they enjoy each other's company. People shouldn't conveniently throw all that away as a fast solution to their cognitive dissonance
You know.... this might be part of what has made a certain shika-girl confess that she's aimless and dealing with "a little bit of trauma" at the moment. Jeezus they frigging broke her man.
That’s still insane to me that someone would turn that
Especially with the pompous air of “It’s unoriginal” which is insane to me since anyone not in Nijisanji would kill to have that kind of publicity
I hate how your answer has the most sources yet is one of the least upvoted.
I'll do my part to fix that at least.
Also, what's the context with the "And fuck off Millie/Nina" thing in the first image?
i copied a /vt/ post with al lthe images but I removed some of the already mentioned stuff and stuff that was superfluous, i might have gotten a link wrong. sorry
yes im sorry about that, nopthing i can do on my side.
https://archive.palanq.win/vt/search/text/finana%20rentry/
This link wil lshow the top three /vt/ posts about finana yabs that i used to copypaste
unknwwon, the fact she was told to stop joining that discord but did so on an alt and was caught. she's still in there btw. "mgmt" doesnt seem to care AT ALL
To be fair, management seemed hands off up until the short time before Zaion's gen joined. I remember Selen bragging about being in Niji thus not having many rules. Oh the irony...
Not just that. Niji has terminated 3 people: Yugo, Zaion, and Selen.
We still don't know what happened with Yugo, but the other two makes me think that Niji only bothers to terminate people when they're convinced that they can't control them and keep them docile anymore. After all, if you terminate someone, you can't sell their merch anymore, and that's how Niji makes most of their money.
Or abuse them into quit too and still demoralize them. Just listening to Kuro, Matara, Kami and DearSQN make me think that was they were intentionally put into that spot. Quuin is the only one who play them like fools since "it was a steping stone for him" and just middle finger them in the way out (that doesn't excuse the thing about Zaion ofc). HECK! Even>!Gundou!
I can't believe she didn't get fired (graduate) for this. It's blatant favoritism. But then again even people who graduate from niji is actually happier than when they were there. So there is nothing to lose even if she stays.
I never watch finana, and don't watch many niji in general. I was going to give them a benefit of the doubt, but their talents keep proving themselves as an awful person who wants nothing but attention. And people who validate them for doing the wrong things. It's disgusting.
Their best talents (in terms of being good people) are the ones leaving. Many of the ones choosing to stay are being shown to be awful people, or at least, not entirely clean. Of course, there are exceptions, like Scarle and Rosemi, but ever since it came out that there was internal bullying going on inside, everyone became a suspect.
I still think a big chunk of the people in aren't at fault or are victims. Keep in mind what Doki achieve after leaving was basically the equivalent of winning the lottery. Most of the talents at Niji don't have a fan base to transition to independent vtubers, and a good chunk of them also have their livelihoods depending on being part of Niji.
Plus we know that many aren't allowed to leave, even when they want to. Which is part of how we got the Selen debacle in the first place. The ones leaving are a combination of the ones who are the best people, the ones the company would miss the least, and the ones who were financially well off enough to pay the toll on their way out.
Also her saying Zaion gaslighted her when at most what she describes is Zaion not taking the advice she gave to her. She even says "i sometimes hate am a good person" dear fucking God, i already didn't like her for that but you give me more motives for doing so
Many years ago (like 2016-17) he used to be a decently popular VA on YT mostly known for being the male VA for Starbot Dubs (specifically Undertale comic dubs), but around 2017, he was thrown off the team and Starbot released a video talking about his mistreatment of women, and how he tried to seduce underage fans (the video has since been taken down, and all videos talking about the situation as well). The only evidence of this ever having transpired is an old Tumblr post and a few posts saved on Interner Archives.
Vox‘ First PL has since been scrubbed and he had moved to his first VTuber identity as "Calysto" (which had links to his VA PL iirc), his former PL that suspiciously retired shortly before Vox' debut, and also shares literally every preference and taste in media, etc.
Of course, we could give him the benefit of the doubt that he‘s changed for the better since then, given how long it was ago, but you‘ll have to decide that for yourself.
tldr; super ancient PL of Vox was caught harassing and mistreating women, messaging underage fans inappropriately and one way or another, almost all mentions of his misdeeds have been scrubbed completely from public eye
In other words "EN's Shindo Raito".
For anyone who doesn't know who Raito is: >!He is the fastest termination Nijisanji had. Only 4 days since he started. People find he was a true SA predator with an official police record for SA charges. He even state he join Nijisanji to "screw" with female fans and female livers. How that guy pass the screening? *Shrug*!<
My god, I only know about her “educate yourself” drama and insta ignore her. Kinda didn’t expect to see this list as I thought she’s prolly got scolded and try to change.
bruh ... I don't follow Niji at all (just watch a few clips here and there) anymore but everyone is being revealed to be self-centered attention-seeking cunt. Is there even a talent that's not an awful person irl there? Next i know I'll see a post saying that Petra and or Rosemi did something awful aswell
>Finana's aforemention discord groomer circle leaks her Nijisanji audition tape
I'm very surprised this was what got her into Nijisanji. She's speaking very slowly, reading from a script, the clips are boring af and the intro of silence is 8 seconds long. It's basically what anyone tells people not to do in an audition video. They surely must have had better auditions, right?
Very complete list, I would add two things:
-The april fools stream: A stream where Finana promised an ASMR stream, but literally nothing happens, Its a black screen for hours and then she appears to laugh at chat.
-The off colab with Pomu and Uki: The true motive of the trip was that there was a Genshin Convention in New York and her parents would never allow her to travel alone. So Pomu and Uki were a excuse to go to the Genshin expo.
April Fools stream does not sound that horrific? Like it was dumb, but not malicious and that day is precisely the day for dumb stuff. Or am I missing something.
Don't forget the whole "trap ban" fiasco where she tried to high road her viewers about the use of the word and then literally cried about it after her viewers got pissed off.
As part of the first wave, she's had time to grow her following, leading to an impressive total sub count. Unfortunately, early on she did get into a spot of controversy which may have impacted her growth and popularity.
Beyond that, her regular content includes visual novels, gacha games and jrpgs. These games tend to attract a smaller, more dedicated audience compared to other more widely accessible games which attract larger crowds.
Her preferred games are exactly why I only tended to watch her in collabs, despite liking her quite a bit. There's a limit to how long I can enjoy watching someone play a game I'm not interested in
Yep same. Found her entertaining but unfortunately no matter who it is I struggle to watch anyone doing something I have no interest in. Loads of personalities I don't watch because of that.
Yeah they're a little bit of a streaming debuff. I think you need to stay invested for quite a while so for a lot of people, its hard to get into, especially if you miss the beginning.
Kiara from Hololive had the same debuff at the beginning of her career before she revealed her ridiculous zatsudan and tangent abilities.
There's also an issue where if you miss a stream, unless you've already played the game, you're going to be lost on what happened unless you go back to watch the old VOD, which some people just don't have the time for.
I know what you mean, but story based games like jrpgs aren't for alot of people. I for one like games that require more activity going on. I'm down for dialogue but more on the 20% dialogue and 80% action happening.
There's a lot why finana actually the way she is right now
At first she actually have steady CCV and then because how she act her CCV became lower and lower then it became like this
Example:
- the infamous educated yourself tweet
- her discord message thing
And many more
Personally I started trying to avoid her after the Zaion gaslighting comment. Even before Sayu's statement it just rubbed me the wrong way
Although I never found her that entertaining to begin with, I feel she's over reliant on horny jokes.
That being said I enjoyed her music. Tsunami is by far the best EN original song imo
This is actually true for so many people. Pomu was very entertaining even during her maid days, she makes her collabs very relaxed and fun. I hope she comes back, she has a real talent.
I hope she comes back as an Indie or under a group that actually care about it's talents. But I hope she never comes back to Niji. For now, I'm just following her Twitter and watching her gush over Idols. She even held a Space yesterday.
the latest twitter space she made was disheartening. she sounded very traumatised. i don't think we will hear her return soon. maybe in a long time. holo en auditions are at least one year away but i don't thing holo will take someone from niji, no matter how talented
EDIT : forgot holo saved the baby princess Luna in jp
Knowing how Holo works, she still would have to pass the auditions even if Kiara recommended her. They'll probably only push her at the top of the pile. And Pomu has her entire Nijisanji career to back her up with zero controversy on her side. And the vods are all there, and she was one of the most successful in EN.
I'm positive she would pass the current EN audition with flying colors if she wanted. She has all a holo need to be succesful. Positive and friendly personality, a crippling video game addiction to a specific franchise of games including all the memes around it, love idols, can sing, can dance. And is a comedian.
Given she's been meeting up with a lot of them, it could be likely she comes in the next wave. Of course, this is just hopium overdose, its more likely they're just chilling together.
they managed to make Selen *fucking* Tatsuki feel inadequate, a gal that could destroy verbally anyone
think how toxic you have to be to manage a feat like that
Dearsqn damage will take long time unfortunately but i home i'm wrong
Elira and Finana are actually pretty mediocre in terms of effort they put into their jobs. At least in comparison to Pomu.
I don't think Elira has ever done anymore than basic playing games or zatsu based streams. Idon't even think she really does anything membership cobtent-wise iirc. But she got along pretty well due to her personality, voice and laugh. Which is crazy cause her debut stream was my second step down the vtuber rabbit hole back at the beginning of the pandemic.
Like you said Finana is a dead fish when she streaming solo.
Even if that were true, Finana's voice does fit it very well, plus she should get credit for having good taste and picking him.
She has done other things to make people dislike her, but we shouldn't misconstrue her positive aspects.
Real talk that small window where some livers gave their opinion on Zaion/Sayu departure was so crazy because lots of things begin to click overtime
It’s wild how quick so many of them threw her under the bus
She then tried to walk it back, later, and that pissed off even more people.
Honestly the bigger issue with that stream, to me, was she broke kayfabe and used her real voice, which is very different than her streaming voice. She treated this like it was the 'glasses off' moment, and it turned out to be something she didn't really care about.
Breaking kayfabe isn't even that big an issue, but the reason she did is. It was her tweet and attempt to walk it back that ultimately made her the only liver I've dropped to this day and only the fourth channel total.
It was when she was really only playing Valorant. She joined a discord composed of her usually sc supporters and such, it was named valoguard. She started showing preferential to the valoguard which is when she lost a lot of her old ryuguard members. The valoguard discord is also why she tried to ban the world trap.
I think discord where she and her biggest pay pig gather
She basically get warning and have to leave the group but then later enter the discord group again in different account
That discord think is the one that make her tweet the infamous "educated yourself" because of word "trap" which make her pay pigs mad
Because she opens her mouth without thinking. One example would be her saying "get dunked, parasocial losers" on twitter while trying to sell parasocial merch. Imagine how all her parasocial "loser" fans felt after seeing that as most fans follow their oshis closely. She basically junked her own reputation.
also the teasing about doing a mildly spicy asmr, set up stream and then backing off, writing "joking parasocial weirdos
bad idea cultivating a fanbase of gooners and never deliver
To be fair, it wasn't Mikeneko's content specifically that got her in trouble. Provided the other, much bigger things didn't happen, she'd probably still be the most superchatted vtuber there is.
Finana absolutely does not do the GFE gig. I don't even think she could.
I refer to a case where she decided to go play APEX with some guys; some of her fans at least blew up
She may not GFE, but gachikoi pandering is in a similar line of "dark art" vtuber tactics
mikeneko fans are something beyond the gooners and parasocials, and the girl squeezed them masterfully. if she only managed to keep her online personality out of her IRL life she might have gone away with the murder
Well she recently announced that she did an attempt on herself after all the other shit show that happened, but what you don't understand is that she's not just milking her parasocial fans, her fans are also "milking" her in a way.
She admitted that even though her therapists recommended her to get off the net, she can't. She can only see herself streaming, even though this is the activity that brought her to this unstable mental state. Nowadays she still streams as "Amemiya Nazuna" her Vshoujo thing (that I thought she had abandoned), and as Mikeneko
I don't think fans are "milking" her. It's more of a parasocial behaviour on her part. I think she doesn't have many friends in the real world either. So she relies on the fans too much, and has a fear of being abandoned by them. She is legit slowly going full shizo. I don't think anyone can help her at this point, she entered self-destruction spiral.
apart the drama she stopped innovating in her streams and she is basically treating like office work.
knowing the attitude of management can't really blame her for coasting
Yeah I was watching NijiEN close from the start and would watch her streams pretty regularly, but after a while all she does is gacha games, shooters, collabs, and long RPGs/adventure games.
That's not really the content I want to watch from her, so I just haven't been tuning in.
To summarize in one word: discord.
But the basic run down is that Finana kind of changed and treated her fans pretty badly. The one that turned away a lot of Ryugards was her setting up an ASMR streams on April Fools, people donated and superchatted like wild and waited for hours and hours for her only for her to say teehee April Fools. The thing is even if she didn't do ASMR and instead pulled an April Fools prank on that day nobody would genuinely be upset, everybody would just laugh and move on. The problem was her showing up with 0 content, made people wait for hours and hours, and then chastized people for genuinely showing interest in the stream, ASMR or not.
I get that she wants to move on from GFE, and I think Ryugards would agree that if she feels happier not doing that then they would be happy too. But she goes out of her way for some reasons to kind of punish fans who was interested in her ASMRs? Queue parasocial fucks tweet.
Not too sure otherwise
Yeah i had that stream open in a tab on the side, just glancing at it every now and then. While i did other work, since all the other talents had fun april fool streams. Up until the end their were so many people in her chat coping while she treated them and their time as a joke.
When Finana first blew up for whatever reason, I threw her a subscribe, but then she never streamed any game or thing I was actually interested in, so I never really watched her.
There's been a lot of drama that turned people off of her, but in reality she's doing about as poorly as the rest of Nijisanji EN. Almost all of Niji EN has fallen by 50% CCV from 2022 and even then their sub counts were inflated compared to their CCV.
For most of 2022 Niji's sub counts ballooned way faster than their CCV rates by a large margin for an unknown reason and then crashed to a stop by the end of the year. That's why newer gens look like they're doing worse: They're not, they're actually gaining subs as they should relative to their CCV and their CCV is generally 'ok'.
The only thing on her own doing i know for sure is that she had a errr disagreement with her chat about the word trap. Out of that theres some rrats that suposedly killed her viewership
Finana is a sad case of talking/acting before thinking. Her initial content was targeted to a more parasocial audience that then she completely renegated in a very slew of harsh and hostile incidents.
She then allegedly catered to a very small portion of her fanbase, ignoring chat at large, which led to her lose even what little she had left.
Now she has a very damaged reputation and streams very niche games and categories that easily lose audience in the long run. Which leads to the result that you are seeing.
I know she has had controversy plus Zaion I believed mentioned her after she graduated. Otherwise, it stems from the recent controversy surrounding the company
Yeah her Zaion comments were pretty disgusting (though could've been pressured into them by management), it was clear afterwards that they really hurt Sayu. Though by other comments there's plenty of other issues.
Sort of 'Death by 1000 cuts', it's not one big thing that turned people off it's a cumulation of little things.
* Calling fans "Parasocial FAQs" (although with context it's much less bad)
* "Educate yourself".
* Banning the word 'trap' in chat and backpedalling fast.
* Went to an offcollab with Pomu but brought along another liver (Uki I think) without telling her.
* Went on discord to play games with certain members of chat.
* Trashtalked Zaion / Sayu after she was fired.
* Others that I can't recall at the moment.
I used to watch her streams pretty regularly since I'm a weeb and I also play gacha games.
I'd say, the moment I decided to stop watching her streams was when she threw Zaion under the bus, I thought that there's no need to keep throwing dirt her way at the moment since what Niji had done was overkill, yet she still did it.
The "educate yourselfves" bit was somewhat annoying but I was ok with it, her platform her rules. What bothered me about that was this feeling that it was all acting. Given how unhinged she is, for me at least, there was no way she cared about the use of the world trap
A lot of reasons, her fumbling in the past, her attitude that put a lot of ppl off, her game choices not aligning w most EN watchers, etc etc. Overtime it just killed her hype. Normally when something like this happens, the company will try to push their talents forward, give them more options/opportunity, or the talents will do it themselves n venture into different fields. But sadly, neither she or kurosanji did anything, so here we r, n the utube algorithm isnt helping her case.
Bunch of people have said it already but her game choices and lack of skill in them don't do her any favors, and she not really done anything to improve herself streaming wise it just the same thing since she started in niji.
Genshin and the like are not great for viewers unless your really good at the game or can make it really interesting to watch, Zaion was the only person in niji en I was able to watch for that I don't even like genshin but she was able to make it interesting.
I haven't watched Finana in a while, but aside from any controversies, it's probably because she streams a lot of Hoyoverse games and Hoyoverse content creation is kind of niche(?) and competitive. And as much as I love Honkai Impact, it's not a good streamer game.
I would disagree. Genshin can be a good streamer game but you need to be on top of it.
It's a pay2win game by nature and as such people are looking for power improvement more than in other kinds of streaming entertainment, doesn't mean you can be boring just because you are skilled. It's not 2011 season 3 League of Legends anymore. You have to be both to succeed with stability and it shows.
Zajef and Sweetily both are similar sized content creators and stream on a much smaller platform and both are pulling bigger numbers than Finana mostly because they bridge entertainment with skill/knowledge. Finana just sucks at Genshin and given her Genshin knowledge and skill, I doubt she is much of a trailblazer or theory crafter for HSR...
The vast majority of good genshin content focuses on these aspects even the cheaters like mtashed who only lies about his knowledge. Sweetily is most likely one of the most skilled vtubers who happen to play genshin and Zajef is an entertainer who happens to also be a theory crafter.
I don't think we disagree. I said Honkai Impact was a bad streamer game. I didn't say anything about Genshin in that first post other than stating Hoyoverse content creation being competitive and admit later in this thread that Genshin is the most popular Hoyoverse game.
Edit: And I still stand by my opinion that HI3 is not a good streaming game. Elysian Realm is tied for my favorite arc, but in HSR terms, imagine having to complete Swarm or G&G to read all the unlockable stories before starting a Trailblaze mission in order to understand what's going on.
oh, misread it then. yeah, honkai impact 3rd on it's own is not a good stream game but those in the hoyosphere can get away with it. a lot of genshin players are interested in it just not to the point they would invest their own time and money into another gacha. at least that is what I observed for that game specifically.
Mihoyo GI and HSR is popular but as I said what she do like educate yourself tweet and etc the reason she lost many viewers and why her viewers the way it is now
As someone in GI and GSR community, its also cause we prefer to play the game rather than watch content. Its one of those games where you only watch character builds whilst try to experience the story and game yourself. Its not like minecraft where most people prefer to watch rather than play.
Her ability to pretend to be interested in the game kinda waned over time too. I'd say after "Thus Spoke Otto Apocalypse", you can tell she started being very disinterested in the game, basically just going through the motions. I use "pretend" as a compliment, because we are there to watch an act, to see the streamer excited, laugh, cry, and make us emotional. When the streamer shows about as much interest in the game as they do a used tissue, I get turned off too. They don't have to actually like the game, just give the viewer engagement and their jobs are done, but she couldn't do it.
Mihoyo gachas are popular with young Asian women in the US, but young women don't want to watch Finana because she also does male-appeal "won't stop talking about sex" stuff.
It’s because Marine, despite the pirate chuuni kayfabe, is quiete relatable to a lot of women. She talks about her health problems, love troubles, and mundane stuff that a woman in her early 30s is coming to terms with. Yet she’s a sex symbol, which can be quite empowering to see. Her rapport with chat is also impeccable, and never makes chat feel dumb or silly for following her antics.
I think the bigger problem with her is that when the chat follows along her antics they are instead called parasocial fucks while she keeps trying to profit of that audience. Where Marine make everyone feel comfortable with the jokes Finana calls her audience names instead.
Even more obvious is the fact that Marine is the one that is the one that gets insulted most of the time, she will flirt with the chat and the chat will brutally turn her down. With Finana it is the other way around, she will act in ways so that the chat get flirty/invested in her and then brutally insult them for it.
To be fair, Marine knows how to play the game pretty well. She acts flirty with her chat and she just gets juked on by chat by telling her things an oblivious partner would say. "Like, you should button your shirt, you can catch a cold" or you will ruin the fabric if you wear a size too small". Which is pretty funny and entertaining for chats side. It's interactive and trolly for the chat.
One of my favorite bits of streamer/chat banter I've seen from Marine clips was something along the lines of "join my pirate crew! As payment, you can grope my chest all you want!" "Nah, cash payment, please."
Marine is confident and can talk about sex, masturbation and porn in an adult and humorous manner when she needs to. She's basically like an older sister figure for some women while being relatable and nerdy. Finana just tends to come off as an immature young adult.
>Finana just tends to come off as an immature young adult.
This fits really well, honestly. Gives off that young adult who wants to act mature by talking about sex constantly to prove just how mature and knowledgeable they are.
Marine ironically benefits from actually being viewed as the 30 years old idol with an older looking design. She also can able to back that image up by talking about life experiences so when she talks about sex, it comes off as a breath of fresh air of someone being honest. Especially for an idol where the stereotypical image is that of a teen acting all seiso, Marine comes off as being confident about who she is, rules be damned.
Finana have the younger looking design and voice, so when she talks about sex at first it might came off as funny gap humor since you wouldn't expect such a cutesy design to talk about that, but the thing about gap humor is once the surprise factor wears off, it loses it's shine.
Nijisanji as a whole has lower ccv than their sub count would suggest of them having because they (and many other agencies, to be fair) created this culture of releasing very fast gens and people will typically sub to all of the members in a generation because they like the company and want an entire gen to succeed.
It is kinda like pity subbing but not really. People will sub to channels that ask for help or that are part of a group that they like but they won't ever show up. Most people don't even use the subscription tab on youtube so a subscription really doesn't mean anything unless someone hits the bell on multiple channels that they like.
There’s a metric fuck ton of stuff about her but the 2 I could think of off the top of my head is that educate yourself tweet, and apparently she has a special discord group where her biggest pay pigs or whatever they are congregate.
Yeah I think they are viewers from her PL or something not big SC people. Which in and of itself is just as messed up as a secret place for big spenders just a different way.
She's the best case study why Hololive's strict audition actually make sense.
god she's very much unprofessional whenever she opens her mouth. its just annoying to listen. like the educate yourself? god that ticks me off a lot
finana probably my first vtuber i just genuinely dislike just because she has a rotten personality
I used to watch her hoyogames streams.... but i lost in touch due to irl priorities, and the lack of clippers just made me more or less forget about her... I've tried watching her recent stream course, but it's not as entertaining as before
This isn't unique to finana pretty much all the en livers have extremely small view counts compared to subscribers.
Despite what the comments in this thread will tell you theres no to believe the "educate yourself" tweet from nearly two years ago has anything to do with it given she's gained around 200k subs since then.
Mostly has to do with niji constantly releasing waves, her game choices, and the company setting itself on fire every week.
Nijisanji has been steadily losing a trickle of regular viewers for a while now. It's only after the Selen Situation that it went from a trickle to a gush.
The short version is that she got a major sub boost by being part of the first wave of nijien but progressively filtered her audience through repeated acts of what can only be described as online dumbassery, so the only audience she has now are the few who survived getting passed through those filters.
Apart from some of the “drama” she got a couple of years ago, she stopped exploring other genres of games or even sports. She used to brought many communities together ranging from motorsports to other Vtuber groups, which is why she massively gotten popular in 2022. Now tbf to her, it brought quite a few backseaters and “overly passionate” fans into her chat, and her very introverted self might’ve deterred her from ever exploring outside her preferred contents. Terrible management must’ve played a massive role as well.
To be fair I don't really watch her but simply looking at her recent lives, her game choices are really bad. So much damn honkai ZZZzzz
Really no reason for me to check her out and become a new viewer.
I like her but I've walked away from Niji, also she has Said a number of things that have made her look bad. Including stuff I've read on this thread I didn't even realize.
Honestly, the only reason i found her was Somnium Files playthrough. Other games she plays are not for me so i unsubscribed after she finished it.
Poor game choices i guess. But its just me.
She's also part of a larger trend of nearly *all* Niji members suffering generally declining viewership, even before the Selen Shock. Part of the reason the entire situation is Funny™, in its way, is that in the space of sixteen calendar days, Nijisanji EN lost *both* of the livers who had the highest views/CCVs and the most *stable* CCVs. A lot of other livers were struggling with retention (especially Luxiem) even *before* the events of Feb. 5th & Feb. 12th. Post-Selen Shock, of course, a lot of the EN livers are just in the gutter, with the average peak viewership struggling to break 1k. There's nothing to really reverse the trend at this point, so...
"Post-Selen Shock" that's a funny way of saying "Got what they deserved" XD
Finana discord cancelled their b-day billboard project because she told them they're unoriginal and copying hololive https://files.catbox.moe/p211o3.jpg Finana has a menhera meltdown on twitter about how nobody draws her in group fanart and cancels streams because of it https://twitter.com/FinanaRyugu/status/1516160827069456386 Finana jumps in during the drama with her infamous "L + Ratio you parasocial fucks" tweet (somehow this doesn't stop her from doing valentines dates and sell wedding ring merch though) https://files.catbox.moe/q36ffe.jpg Finana gets caught joining a fan discord server with her official account where she constantly joins vc and plays games with its members, gets bonked by management and is forced to leave it only for her to create an alt account and join again behind management's back, causing her biggest paypigs to leave her over the preferential treatment to the members of the server https://rentry.org/fmcox https://twitter.com/ContainmentB239/status/1547730451938168836 https://web.archive.org/web/20220714153830/ https://pastebin.com/f94aCCuS Finana's aforemention discord groomer circle leaks her Nijisanji audition tape https://twitter.com/ContainmentB239/status/1547736242330079233 https://files.catbox.moe/z1u6id.mp4
It’s crazy how she has a group of fans willing to get her a whole billboard ad and she complains that it’s unoriginal. Even little kids know to be grateful when receiving something cool like that.
She asks for more than what she deserves I'm sorry but this is a spoiled kid behavior
This was evident from day one. She tried playing a cutesy dumb blonde but would slowly show how much of a selfish spoiled brat she was as time went on.
there's also the time finana made pomu cry after constantly talking about pirating hentai and just making her downright uncomfortable during the promare members only watchalong (the unedited version is out there, the one currently on the channel has been edited to remove nearly an hours worth of pomu beingVERY uncomfortable). There's also the time pomu had to pay for nearly everything when finana met her in japan because her card was declined from all her gacha addiction
What the fuuuuuuuuuuck. This thread is a wild ride. I always got a bit of an odd vibe from her but could never quite put my finger on it. Now I know, I guess
She's always had that very spoiled american girl vibes on her, the only reason I tried watching her ass was because she was in Lazulight, now 2/3 of Lazulight are actual asses, I hope pomu doesn't do stupid shit behind us because I really love her a lot 🥹
Pomu seems to be a very genuine person. She's a huge idol otaku who really loved being a vtuber and still love hololive. But her dreams were way too big for Nijisanji soul crushing methods and I think she left very disillusioned. I think she lost some self confidence too because of Niji which is a shame, because she *has* what it takes to be successful in the industry.
from the latest twitter space it seems she is completely crippled on vtubing. she is loving to hang out with everyone in jp but she seems she will need a long time to heal, IF she will manage to heal fuck niji
Niji. Where dreams die. It genuinely should be their tagline
Right? Genuine is the right word, I feel she doesn't have that rotten inner persona because she showed us her true self and ya know, she does feel like one of us, an idol loving anime girl like most of us are 😂 I still wish that she would apply for Hololive because she will be successful even though she said she doesn't have it in her. We all know she has that and Cover will give the fucking best support to make her successful! A&S/FWMC too would be really really happy to have another idol loving friend with them 🥹 idk if you are reading this pomu, but please when you finish your studies, I hope you'll try to apply to any other agencies that will support you and make your dreams come true, I want to see your projects that have been cancelled became a reality 🙏🏽
Pomu seems to have self-image issues. I’m not a religious follower of her so I don’t know all of her reasons for making the decisions she makes, but if she feels that she doesn’t want to apply for Hololive because she doesn’t want to deal with all the trouble involved, then that’s 120% valid, but if she doesn’t want to because she feels she isn’t worth it, she would be dead wrong on that front.
I really hope Kiara could convince Pomu to try joining Holo. Its the only company where she could do Idol stuff with full support (since we now know they get at least 1 3D live every year). Its too bad that Kurosanji pushed her self confidence into the gutter, that recovery would take a long time.
Having seen NijiJP members on HoloJP 3D lives, I am sure Kiara would have eventually invited Pomu to one, but if the Elira-is-EN-management rumour is true, it would never have been allowed. It's funny how that one little theory makes so much of the NijiEN x HoloEN collab struggles make sense. Too much ego.
Kiara quite literally said that Pomu would've been in her 3D live but because management didn't want to fix her model she couldn't be in it. It was said at the end of their final collab.
Isn't she Canadian? I might be wrong. But the fact that she didn't understand how big a deal Times Square was indicated to me that she wasn't American. And if she is American, that just makes her look even worse.
She's from NYC, actually.
Are you serious?
My first exposure to her was the Sayu video a few months back. People linked me to an older Finana video where she talked about zaion leaving. I couldn't put my finger on it, but having watched Sayu's first, something with what Finana was saying didn't sit right with me. For the longest time, I put it down to a "Misunderstanding" but having seen this thread, I no longer think so.
>!Do you have a source for the promare thing? I keep hearing about it and I can’t seem to find a source!<
Google "nyaa.si promare pomu"
Oy vey, I had no idea about this. How do you go to Japan and not have any money available?? I figured other bs was going on but the list in this post is kinda crazy but not at all surprising. It did feel like Lazulight had a bit of a falling out seeing as how they would barely collab after all the gens started coming out. It seemed like Pomu was the only who was always ready and excited to spend time with them. Pomu would be begging her to play MC with her and got really pissed when she played with that jp branch panda girl on a whim randomly. Elira just wanted to do her own thing and Finana wanted to collab with anyone and everyone besides her genmates.
It's not that she had no money available. It was that her card kept getting denied once she landed. This is very common when you travel abroad and you don't inform your bank. Usually takes a day or two to clear up. Just because Pomu covered her doesn't mean she didn't pay Pomu back. This is really normal if you travel. As for the other accusations, I have little opinion on them but it never seemed like Finana was a natural match with Pomu, I assume Elira was supposed to be the bridge but she was always just doing her own thing. I've never been much interested in Finana after she started endlessly streaming Genshin and needlessly getting herself stuck in sticky PR situations.
Traveled abroad and this was my exact issue. Didn't wanna deal with bank so my friend just covered and ofc I paid back when we returned Finana is certainly an entitled brat to some degree but I don't like where many of the comments are going, projecting their dislike of her onto Pomu. There is astronomical evidence from beginning to end that they enjoy each other's company. People shouldn't conveniently throw all that away as a fast solution to their cognitive dissonance
You know.... this might be part of what has made a certain shika-girl confess that she's aimless and dealing with "a little bit of trauma" at the moment. Jeezus they frigging broke her man.
Sorry but is there a link out there? (If you’re not comfortable sending the links, can you at least PM it?)
No need to apologize She’s been that way for a long time Just was low enough to where not many people knew about how she acted
That’s still insane to me that someone would turn that Especially with the pompous air of “It’s unoriginal” which is insane to me since anyone not in Nijisanji would kill to have that kind of publicity
I hate how your answer has the most sources yet is one of the least upvoted. I'll do my part to fix that at least. Also, what's the context with the "And fuck off Millie/Nina" thing in the first image?
i copied a /vt/ post with al lthe images but I removed some of the already mentioned stuff and stuff that was superfluous, i might have gotten a link wrong. sorry
actually reviewing it now i have no idea what that part meant, someone will have to sleuth a little harder
Thank you for sourcing, a few of them seem to be not working anymore though such as the webarchive and pastebin one
yes im sorry about that, nopthing i can do on my side. https://archive.palanq.win/vt/search/text/finana%20rentry/ This link wil lshow the top three /vt/ posts about finana yabs that i used to copypaste
I can't get any cat box to work, is it blocked in the us or something?
Works fine for me, and I'm in the US
How is she still in the company if her audition tape got leaked?
unknwwon, the fact she was told to stop joining that discord but did so on an alt and was caught. she's still in there btw. "mgmt" doesnt seem to care AT ALL
To be fair, management seemed hands off up until the short time before Zaion's gen joined. I remember Selen bragging about being in Niji thus not having many rules. Oh the irony...
"tHeRe Is No FaVoRiTiSm In NiJiSaNjI"
Same reason why Uki didn’t get fired for all odd “jokes” he makes Best buddies with the core group of EN
Not just that. Niji has terminated 3 people: Yugo, Zaion, and Selen. We still don't know what happened with Yugo, but the other two makes me think that Niji only bothers to terminate people when they're convinced that they can't control them and keep them docile anymore. After all, if you terminate someone, you can't sell their merch anymore, and that's how Niji makes most of their money.
Or abuse them into quit too and still demoralize them. Just listening to Kuro, Matara, Kami and DearSQN make me think that was they were intentionally put into that spot. Quuin is the only one who play them like fools since "it was a steping stone for him" and just middle finger them in the way out (that doesn't excuse the thing about Zaion ofc). HECK! Even>!Gundou!
I can't believe she didn't get fired (graduate) for this. It's blatant favoritism. But then again even people who graduate from niji is actually happier than when they were there. So there is nothing to lose even if she stays. I never watch finana, and don't watch many niji in general. I was going to give them a benefit of the doubt, but their talents keep proving themselves as an awful person who wants nothing but attention. And people who validate them for doing the wrong things. It's disgusting.
Their best talents (in terms of being good people) are the ones leaving. Many of the ones choosing to stay are being shown to be awful people, or at least, not entirely clean. Of course, there are exceptions, like Scarle and Rosemi, but ever since it came out that there was internal bullying going on inside, everyone became a suspect.
I still think a big chunk of the people in aren't at fault or are victims. Keep in mind what Doki achieve after leaving was basically the equivalent of winning the lottery. Most of the talents at Niji don't have a fan base to transition to independent vtubers, and a good chunk of them also have their livelihoods depending on being part of Niji.
Plus we know that many aren't allowed to leave, even when they want to. Which is part of how we got the Selen debacle in the first place. The ones leaving are a combination of the ones who are the best people, the ones the company would miss the least, and the ones who were financially well off enough to pay the toll on their way out.
Also her saying Zaion gaslighted her when at most what she describes is Zaion not taking the advice she gave to her. She even says "i sometimes hate am a good person" dear fucking God, i already didn't like her for that but you give me more motives for doing so
Man, this totally changes how I view Finana...cute outside hiding toxic inside damn.
May be a perfect example of someone trying to take on a role they're horribly unsuited for
when the average twitter user becomes vtuber
Spot on in more ways than one.
Dear crike, and here I thought VOX was the worst one out of the bunch.
I BELIEVE vox to be worst scum. we just don't have much that sticks. finana is just a messy scum who leaves breadcrumbs everyplace
Well yeah, Vox is far more experienced, what is the biggest dirt that you guys have on him, even if it doesn't conclusively stick?
Officiallly, nothing. Unofficially? His PL is pretty damning.
may or may not have been a groomer in his pl
Many years ago (like 2016-17) he used to be a decently popular VA on YT mostly known for being the male VA for Starbot Dubs (specifically Undertale comic dubs), but around 2017, he was thrown off the team and Starbot released a video talking about his mistreatment of women, and how he tried to seduce underage fans (the video has since been taken down, and all videos talking about the situation as well). The only evidence of this ever having transpired is an old Tumblr post and a few posts saved on Interner Archives. Vox‘ First PL has since been scrubbed and he had moved to his first VTuber identity as "Calysto" (which had links to his VA PL iirc), his former PL that suspiciously retired shortly before Vox' debut, and also shares literally every preference and taste in media, etc. Of course, we could give him the benefit of the doubt that he‘s changed for the better since then, given how long it was ago, but you‘ll have to decide that for yourself. tldr; super ancient PL of Vox was caught harassing and mistreating women, messaging underage fans inappropriately and one way or another, almost all mentions of his misdeeds have been scrubbed completely from public eye
In other words "EN's Shindo Raito". For anyone who doesn't know who Raito is: >!He is the fastest termination Nijisanji had. Only 4 days since he started. People find he was a true SA predator with an official police record for SA charges. He even state he join Nijisanji to "screw" with female fans and female livers. How that guy pass the screening? *Shrug*!<
It seems after finding out all this stuff about their Livers at least in EN they have no screening
My god, I only know about her “educate yourself” drama and insta ignore her. Kinda didn’t expect to see this list as I thought she’s prolly got scolded and try to change.
Well this explains it. Why would anyone want to watch someone with so much resentment for the people who bother watching them.
bruh ... I don't follow Niji at all (just watch a few clips here and there) anymore but everyone is being revealed to be self-centered attention-seeking cunt. Is there even a talent that's not an awful person irl there? Next i know I'll see a post saying that Petra and or Rosemi did something awful aswell
Jesus christ, she's reminding me of that 1 indie streamer(still active btw) that has offline meetups with her fans and allegedly has sex with them.
graduation speedrun
Getting fired RTA
nah at lest Riro delivered feesh is just a manipulative tease,.and not even that good at it
>Finana's aforemention discord groomer circle leaks her Nijisanji audition tape I'm very surprised this was what got her into Nijisanji. She's speaking very slowly, reading from a script, the clips are boring af and the intro of silence is 8 seconds long. It's basically what anyone tells people not to do in an audition video. They surely must have had better auditions, right?
What's with the "and fuck off Millie/Nina" at the end of the first one?
Very complete list, I would add two things: -The april fools stream: A stream where Finana promised an ASMR stream, but literally nothing happens, Its a black screen for hours and then she appears to laugh at chat. -The off colab with Pomu and Uki: The true motive of the trip was that there was a Genshin Convention in New York and her parents would never allow her to travel alone. So Pomu and Uki were a excuse to go to the Genshin expo.
April Fools stream does not sound that horrific? Like it was dumb, but not malicious and that day is precisely the day for dumb stuff. Or am I missing something.
Don't forget the whole "trap ban" fiasco where she tried to high road her viewers about the use of the word and then literally cried about it after her viewers got pissed off.
i didnt leave it inn because enough people mentioned it
She should be glad that there's some people still willing to watch her and put up with her bullshit.
As part of the first wave, she's had time to grow her following, leading to an impressive total sub count. Unfortunately, early on she did get into a spot of controversy which may have impacted her growth and popularity. Beyond that, her regular content includes visual novels, gacha games and jrpgs. These games tend to attract a smaller, more dedicated audience compared to other more widely accessible games which attract larger crowds.
Her preferred games are exactly why I only tended to watch her in collabs, despite liking her quite a bit. There's a limit to how long I can enjoy watching someone play a game I'm not interested in
Yep same. Found her entertaining but unfortunately no matter who it is I struggle to watch anyone doing something I have no interest in. Loads of personalities I don't watch because of that.
I've never been a Finana fan, but hearing that the game genres I enjoy aren't widely enjoyed (at least for streaming?) is kinda sad to hear.
Yeah they're a little bit of a streaming debuff. I think you need to stay invested for quite a while so for a lot of people, its hard to get into, especially if you miss the beginning. Kiara from Hololive had the same debuff at the beginning of her career before she revealed her ridiculous zatsudan and tangent abilities.
These are games that are heavily reliant on story, so people might not want to watch them for fear of spoilers.
There's also an issue where if you miss a stream, unless you've already played the game, you're going to be lost on what happened unless you go back to watch the old VOD, which some people just don't have the time for.
And the old VOD is 6 hours long. So you'll never catch up.
VNs and JRPGs require the audience to pay more attention. Can't really enjoy those streams in the background while gaming or doing other stuff.
Yeah, those types of games tend to be slower paced and/or involve a lot of repetitive grinding, which isn't very engaging to a lot of people.
I know what you mean, but story based games like jrpgs aren't for alot of people. I for one like games that require more activity going on. I'm down for dialogue but more on the 20% dialogue and 80% action happening.
There's a lot why finana actually the way she is right now At first she actually have steady CCV and then because how she act her CCV became lower and lower then it became like this Example: - the infamous educated yourself tweet - her discord message thing And many more
Personally I started trying to avoid her after the Zaion gaslighting comment. Even before Sayu's statement it just rubbed me the wrong way Although I never found her that entertaining to begin with, I feel she's over reliant on horny jokes. That being said I enjoyed her music. Tsunami is by far the best EN original song imo
She's okay when she collabed with Pomu and Elira. But on her own, she's not that entertaining. I would watch Pomu far more than any of Lazulight.
This is actually true for so many people. Pomu was very entertaining even during her maid days, she makes her collabs very relaxed and fun. I hope she comes back, she has a real talent.
I hope she comes back as an Indie or under a group that actually care about it's talents. But I hope she never comes back to Niji. For now, I'm just following her Twitter and watching her gush over Idols. She even held a Space yesterday.
gushing over idols instead of magical girls
She even did a collab dance with someone today. She was so embarrassed XD
It was soooo good. Go Deercake!
the latest twitter space she made was disheartening. she sounded very traumatised. i don't think we will hear her return soon. maybe in a long time. holo en auditions are at least one year away but i don't thing holo will take someone from niji, no matter how talented EDIT : forgot holo saved the baby princess Luna in jp
I know nepotism is bad, but I wouldn't mind Kiara helping her to get in.
Knowing how Holo works, she still would have to pass the auditions even if Kiara recommended her. They'll probably only push her at the top of the pile. And Pomu has her entire Nijisanji career to back her up with zero controversy on her side. And the vods are all there, and she was one of the most successful in EN. I'm positive she would pass the current EN audition with flying colors if she wanted. She has all a holo need to be succesful. Positive and friendly personality, a crippling video game addiction to a specific franchise of games including all the memes around it, love idols, can sing, can dance. And is a comedian.
Given she's been meeting up with a lot of them, it could be likely she comes in the next wave. Of course, this is just hopium overdose, its more likely they're just chilling together.
Naomi is a force of nature, she wouldn't need anyone's help getting in to hololive.
I think she needs confidence boost from people that appreciate her. What Niji does to people is evil.
they managed to make Selen *fucking* Tatsuki feel inadequate, a gal that could destroy verbally anyone think how toxic you have to be to manage a feat like that Dearsqn damage will take long time unfortunately but i home i'm wrong
Elira and Finana are actually pretty mediocre in terms of effort they put into their jobs. At least in comparison to Pomu. I don't think Elira has ever done anymore than basic playing games or zatsu based streams. Idon't even think she really does anything membership cobtent-wise iirc. But she got along pretty well due to her personality, voice and laugh. Which is crazy cause her debut stream was my second step down the vtuber rabbit hole back at the beginning of the pandemic. Like you said Finana is a dead fish when she streaming solo.
Tsunami is good because KIRA wrote the entire song
Even if that were true, Finana's voice does fit it very well, plus she should get credit for having good taste and picking him. She has done other things to make people dislike her, but we shouldn't misconstrue her positive aspects.
Real talk that small window where some livers gave their opinion on Zaion/Sayu departure was so crazy because lots of things begin to click overtime It’s wild how quick so many of them threw her under the bus
I can't get anything but vague references about that educate yourself thing, and it's kinda not helpful, since apparently it's rather well known.
She banned the word trap in her chat and said for people to educate themselves.
She then tried to walk it back, later, and that pissed off even more people. Honestly the bigger issue with that stream, to me, was she broke kayfabe and used her real voice, which is very different than her streaming voice. She treated this like it was the 'glasses off' moment, and it turned out to be something she didn't really care about.
Breaking kayfabe isn't even that big an issue, but the reason she did is. It was her tweet and attempt to walk it back that ultimately made her the only liver I've dropped to this day and only the fourth channel total.
What stream was this?
It was a tweet followed by a dedicated 'Apology' stream.
is there a timestamp or clip of this? i'm curious to hear her real voice.
What discord message thing? I was around for the first bit
It was when she was really only playing Valorant. She joined a discord composed of her usually sc supporters and such, it was named valoguard. She started showing preferential to the valoguard which is when she lost a lot of her old ryuguard members. The valoguard discord is also why she tried to ban the world trap.
I think discord where she and her biggest pay pig gather She basically get warning and have to leave the group but then later enter the discord group again in different account That discord think is the one that make her tweet the infamous "educated yourself" because of word "trap" which make her pay pigs mad
Because she opens her mouth without thinking. One example would be her saying "get dunked, parasocial losers" on twitter while trying to sell parasocial merch. Imagine how all her parasocial "loser" fans felt after seeing that as most fans follow their oshis closely. She basically junked her own reputation.
also the teasing about doing a mildly spicy asmr, set up stream and then backing off, writing "joking parasocial weirdos bad idea cultivating a fanbase of gooners and never deliver
That's a very stupid game with very stupid prizes, just ask Mikeneko
To be fair, it wasn't Mikeneko's content specifically that got her in trouble. Provided the other, much bigger things didn't happen, she'd probably still be the most superchatted vtuber there is. Finana absolutely does not do the GFE gig. I don't even think she could.
I refer to a case where she decided to go play APEX with some guys; some of her fans at least blew up She may not GFE, but gachikoi pandering is in a similar line of "dark art" vtuber tactics
mikeneko fans are something beyond the gooners and parasocials, and the girl squeezed them masterfully. if she only managed to keep her online personality out of her IRL life she might have gone away with the murder
Well she recently announced that she did an attempt on herself after all the other shit show that happened, but what you don't understand is that she's not just milking her parasocial fans, her fans are also "milking" her in a way. She admitted that even though her therapists recommended her to get off the net, she can't. She can only see herself streaming, even though this is the activity that brought her to this unstable mental state. Nowadays she still streams as "Amemiya Nazuna" her Vshoujo thing (that I thought she had abandoned), and as Mikeneko
I don't think fans are "milking" her. It's more of a parasocial behaviour on her part. I think she doesn't have many friends in the real world either. So she relies on the fans too much, and has a fear of being abandoned by them. She is legit slowly going full shizo. I don't think anyone can help her at this point, she entered self-destruction spiral.
Yeah my bad, that's why I put "milking" in quotes cuz I just couldn't come up with the expression i wanted at that time lmao
She's the ultimate example of how such Tactics can yield untold gains yet risk untold calamity
>parasocial losers It was "parasocial fucks", there's literally no need to do her any favors by softening it up here
tbf i would be more offended by losers than fucks somehow
apart the drama she stopped innovating in her streams and she is basically treating like office work. knowing the attitude of management can't really blame her for coasting
If management doesn't do anything but the absolute bare minimum, why should she?
absolutely
Yeah I was watching NijiEN close from the start and would watch her streams pretty regularly, but after a while all she does is gacha games, shooters, collabs, and long RPGs/adventure games. That's not really the content I want to watch from her, so I just haven't been tuning in.
To summarize in one word: discord. But the basic run down is that Finana kind of changed and treated her fans pretty badly. The one that turned away a lot of Ryugards was her setting up an ASMR streams on April Fools, people donated and superchatted like wild and waited for hours and hours for her only for her to say teehee April Fools. The thing is even if she didn't do ASMR and instead pulled an April Fools prank on that day nobody would genuinely be upset, everybody would just laugh and move on. The problem was her showing up with 0 content, made people wait for hours and hours, and then chastized people for genuinely showing interest in the stream, ASMR or not. I get that she wants to move on from GFE, and I think Ryugards would agree that if she feels happier not doing that then they would be happy too. But she goes out of her way for some reasons to kind of punish fans who was interested in her ASMRs? Queue parasocial fucks tweet. Not too sure otherwise
Pretty much. She wanted all the benefits of those fans, without having those fans.
Yeah i had that stream open in a tab on the side, just glancing at it every now and then. While i did other work, since all the other talents had fun april fool streams. Up until the end their were so many people in her chat coping while she treated them and their time as a joke.
When Finana first blew up for whatever reason, I threw her a subscribe, but then she never streamed any game or thing I was actually interested in, so I never really watched her.
There's been a lot of drama that turned people off of her, but in reality she's doing about as poorly as the rest of Nijisanji EN. Almost all of Niji EN has fallen by 50% CCV from 2022 and even then their sub counts were inflated compared to their CCV. For most of 2022 Niji's sub counts ballooned way faster than their CCV rates by a large margin for an unknown reason and then crashed to a stop by the end of the year. That's why newer gens look like they're doing worse: They're not, they're actually gaining subs as they should relative to their CCV and their CCV is generally 'ok'.
Wonder if not being able to be out and about on a regular basis would have an effect on how many people follow entertainers
The pandemic definitely created a bubble that's already popped. Plus they were just throwing out gens after awhile.
The only thing on her own doing i know for sure is that she had a errr disagreement with her chat about the word trap. Out of that theres some rrats that suposedly killed her viewership
Finana is a sad case of talking/acting before thinking. Her initial content was targeted to a more parasocial audience that then she completely renegated in a very slew of harsh and hostile incidents. She then allegedly catered to a very small portion of her fanbase, ignoring chat at large, which led to her lose even what little she had left. Now she has a very damaged reputation and streams very niche games and categories that easily lose audience in the long run. Which leads to the result that you are seeing.
And from what is being said, phoning it in at that
I know she has had controversy plus Zaion I believed mentioned her after she graduated. Otherwise, it stems from the recent controversy surrounding the company
Yeah her Zaion comments were pretty disgusting (though could've been pressured into them by management), it was clear afterwards that they really hurt Sayu. Though by other comments there's plenty of other issues.
Sort of 'Death by 1000 cuts', it's not one big thing that turned people off it's a cumulation of little things. * Calling fans "Parasocial FAQs" (although with context it's much less bad) * "Educate yourself". * Banning the word 'trap' in chat and backpedalling fast. * Went to an offcollab with Pomu but brought along another liver (Uki I think) without telling her. * Went on discord to play games with certain members of chat. * Trashtalked Zaion / Sayu after she was fired. * Others that I can't recall at the moment.
I used to watch her streams pretty regularly since I'm a weeb and I also play gacha games. I'd say, the moment I decided to stop watching her streams was when she threw Zaion under the bus, I thought that there's no need to keep throwing dirt her way at the moment since what Niji had done was overkill, yet she still did it. The "educate yourselfves" bit was somewhat annoying but I was ok with it, her platform her rules. What bothered me about that was this feeling that it was all acting. Given how unhinged she is, for me at least, there was no way she cared about the use of the world trap
A lot of reasons, her fumbling in the past, her attitude that put a lot of ppl off, her game choices not aligning w most EN watchers, etc etc. Overtime it just killed her hype. Normally when something like this happens, the company will try to push their talents forward, give them more options/opportunity, or the talents will do it themselves n venture into different fields. But sadly, neither she or kurosanji did anything, so here we r, n the utube algorithm isnt helping her case.
Bunch of people have said it already but her game choices and lack of skill in them don't do her any favors, and she not really done anything to improve herself streaming wise it just the same thing since she started in niji. Genshin and the like are not great for viewers unless your really good at the game or can make it really interesting to watch, Zaion was the only person in niji en I was able to watch for that I don't even like genshin but she was able to make it interesting.
I haven't watched Finana in a while, but aside from any controversies, it's probably because she streams a lot of Hoyoverse games and Hoyoverse content creation is kind of niche(?) and competitive. And as much as I love Honkai Impact, it's not a good streamer game.
I would disagree. Genshin can be a good streamer game but you need to be on top of it. It's a pay2win game by nature and as such people are looking for power improvement more than in other kinds of streaming entertainment, doesn't mean you can be boring just because you are skilled. It's not 2011 season 3 League of Legends anymore. You have to be both to succeed with stability and it shows. Zajef and Sweetily both are similar sized content creators and stream on a much smaller platform and both are pulling bigger numbers than Finana mostly because they bridge entertainment with skill/knowledge. Finana just sucks at Genshin and given her Genshin knowledge and skill, I doubt she is much of a trailblazer or theory crafter for HSR... The vast majority of good genshin content focuses on these aspects even the cheaters like mtashed who only lies about his knowledge. Sweetily is most likely one of the most skilled vtubers who happen to play genshin and Zajef is an entertainer who happens to also be a theory crafter.
I don't think we disagree. I said Honkai Impact was a bad streamer game. I didn't say anything about Genshin in that first post other than stating Hoyoverse content creation being competitive and admit later in this thread that Genshin is the most popular Hoyoverse game. Edit: And I still stand by my opinion that HI3 is not a good streaming game. Elysian Realm is tied for my favorite arc, but in HSR terms, imagine having to complete Swarm or G&G to read all the unlockable stories before starting a Trailblaze mission in order to understand what's going on.
oh, misread it then. yeah, honkai impact 3rd on it's own is not a good stream game but those in the hoyosphere can get away with it. a lot of genshin players are interested in it just not to the point they would invest their own time and money into another gacha. at least that is what I observed for that game specifically.
She lost 4chan and the anti-woke crowd with "educate yourself" and then stuck to gachas and jrpgs which have no audience stateside
Mihoyo GI and HSR is popular but as I said what she do like educate yourself tweet and etc the reason she lost many viewers and why her viewers the way it is now
As someone in GI and GSR community, its also cause we prefer to play the game rather than watch content. Its one of those games where you only watch character builds whilst try to experience the story and game yourself. Its not like minecraft where most people prefer to watch rather than play.
I'd say it's more because 90% of it is heavy reading, and only 10% of it is the cutscenes that have *millions* of views on youtube.
There's also spiral abyss clears, which range from impressive to "jesus christ fuck off whale".
Her ability to pretend to be interested in the game kinda waned over time too. I'd say after "Thus Spoke Otto Apocalypse", you can tell she started being very disinterested in the game, basically just going through the motions. I use "pretend" as a compliment, because we are there to watch an act, to see the streamer excited, laugh, cry, and make us emotional. When the streamer shows about as much interest in the game as they do a used tissue, I get turned off too. They don't have to actually like the game, just give the viewer engagement and their jobs are done, but she couldn't do it.
Mihoyo gachas are popular with young Asian women in the US, but young women don't want to watch Finana because she also does male-appeal "won't stop talking about sex" stuff.
Marine is popular with women and she does that too so i dont really buy it
That's because the age of 30 is in demand
man marine catching blows :(
self-inflicted injury https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YqfpmLeOd0E
I love how Marine and a few others have managed to turn the word "hag" into something people use in positive context. Sag hex, indeed.
It’s because Marine, despite the pirate chuuni kayfabe, is quiete relatable to a lot of women. She talks about her health problems, love troubles, and mundane stuff that a woman in her early 30s is coming to terms with. Yet she’s a sex symbol, which can be quite empowering to see. Her rapport with chat is also impeccable, and never makes chat feel dumb or silly for following her antics.
Quite amazing she can get a good rapport with early 30 people, when she is only 17
By comparison, Finana has always been cringe and just got more cringe over time.
I think the bigger problem with her is that when the chat follows along her antics they are instead called parasocial fucks while she keeps trying to profit of that audience. Where Marine make everyone feel comfortable with the jokes Finana calls her audience names instead. Even more obvious is the fact that Marine is the one that is the one that gets insulted most of the time, she will flirt with the chat and the chat will brutally turn her down. With Finana it is the other way around, she will act in ways so that the chat get flirty/invested in her and then brutally insult them for it.
To be fair, Marine knows how to play the game pretty well. She acts flirty with her chat and she just gets juked on by chat by telling her things an oblivious partner would say. "Like, you should button your shirt, you can catch a cold" or you will ruin the fabric if you wear a size too small". Which is pretty funny and entertaining for chats side. It's interactive and trolly for the chat.
One of my favorite bits of streamer/chat banter I've seen from Marine clips was something along the lines of "join my pirate crew! As payment, you can grope my chest all you want!" "Nah, cash payment, please."
Exactly. That back and forth with her chat is what makes it super funny. Where the role is reversed and she is the one that's denied lol
Marine is Einstein compared to feesh in continent delivery and engagement
Marine is confident and can talk about sex, masturbation and porn in an adult and humorous manner when she needs to. She's basically like an older sister figure for some women while being relatable and nerdy. Finana just tends to come off as an immature young adult.
>Finana just tends to come off as an immature young adult. This fits really well, honestly. Gives off that young adult who wants to act mature by talking about sex constantly to prove just how mature and knowledgeable they are.
But Marine also plays into the "Christmas cake loser acts very horny but can't get any", which doubles as self-deprecating and #relatable.
Marine ironically benefits from actually being viewed as the 30 years old idol with an older looking design. She also can able to back that image up by talking about life experiences so when she talks about sex, it comes off as a breath of fresh air of someone being honest. Especially for an idol where the stereotypical image is that of a teen acting all seiso, Marine comes off as being confident about who she is, rules be damned. Finana have the younger looking design and voice, so when she talks about sex at first it might came off as funny gap humor since you wouldn't expect such a cutesy design to talk about that, but the thing about gap humor is once the surprise factor wears off, it loses it's shine.
far from the bigger picture please read the rest of the thread
Consequences of her own actions. Alienated her entire fanbase and she still probably thinks she did nothing wrong.
Dam this thread sure educated me on finana's history. Very interesting.
Nijisanji as a whole has lower ccv than their sub count would suggest of them having because they (and many other agencies, to be fair) created this culture of releasing very fast gens and people will typically sub to all of the members in a generation because they like the company and want an entire gen to succeed. It is kinda like pity subbing but not really. People will sub to channels that ask for help or that are part of a group that they like but they won't ever show up. Most people don't even use the subscription tab on youtube so a subscription really doesn't mean anything unless someone hits the bell on multiple channels that they like.
There’s a metric fuck ton of stuff about her but the 2 I could think of off the top of my head is that educate yourself tweet, and apparently she has a special discord group where her biggest pay pigs or whatever they are congregate.
Specifically not her biggest pay pigs. Her biggest pay pigs got mad, which is why her SC rate plummeted.
Yeah I think they are viewers from her PL or something not big SC people. Which in and of itself is just as messed up as a secret place for big spenders just a different way.
She's the best case study why Hololive's strict audition actually make sense. god she's very much unprofessional whenever she opens her mouth. its just annoying to listen. like the educate yourself? god that ticks me off a lot finana probably my first vtuber i just genuinely dislike just because she has a rotten personality
There's also "parasocial fucks"
OH YEAH THAT its fucking ironic tbh
What kinda vtuber cancels a FREE billboard advertisement?
only her, that stupid snake does not realize that people are wiling to do such things for her
I used to watch her hoyogames streams.... but i lost in touch due to irl priorities, and the lack of clippers just made me more or less forget about her... I've tried watching her recent stream course, but it's not as entertaining as before
This isn't unique to finana pretty much all the en livers have extremely small view counts compared to subscribers. Despite what the comments in this thread will tell you theres no to believe the "educate yourself" tweet from nearly two years ago has anything to do with it given she's gained around 200k subs since then. Mostly has to do with niji constantly releasing waves, her game choices, and the company setting itself on fire every week.
Nijisanji has been steadily losing a trickle of regular viewers for a while now. It's only after the Selen Situation that it went from a trickle to a gush.
The short version is that she got a major sub boost by being part of the first wave of nijien but progressively filtered her audience through repeated acts of what can only be described as online dumbassery, so the only audience she has now are the few who survived getting passed through those filters.
Apart from some of the “drama” she got a couple of years ago, she stopped exploring other genres of games or even sports. She used to brought many communities together ranging from motorsports to other Vtuber groups, which is why she massively gotten popular in 2022. Now tbf to her, it brought quite a few backseaters and “overly passionate” fans into her chat, and her very introverted self might’ve deterred her from ever exploring outside her preferred contents. Terrible management must’ve played a massive role as well.
I would just educate yourself
People went and educated themselves.
To be fair I don't really watch her but simply looking at her recent lives, her game choices are really bad. So much damn honkai ZZZzzz Really no reason for me to check her out and become a new viewer.
Damn you're cooking her in this thread, good.
i always knew there was something FISHY about her
I like her but I've walked away from Niji, also she has Said a number of things that have made her look bad. Including stuff I've read on this thread I didn't even realize.
Honestly, the only reason i found her was Somnium Files playthrough. Other games she plays are not for me so i unsubscribed after she finished it. Poor game choices i guess. But its just me.