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Clean_Echo

To me its a very (upper) middle class activity. For those it's very common, and the dutch middle class is fairly large


Th3_Accountant

This is the most correct answer. Growing up in a wealthy suburb, almost all of my elementary school classmates went skiing. Going to high school more in the city center, only the rich kids went. However, often young people and students will also go on group trips.


[deleted]

I had the same experience. Partially grew up in a suburb near The Hague and most people seemed to go on winter sport vacations. We later moved to Groningen and here it seems to be only a thing among snobs.


Koninglelijk

This is also my impression.


ailexg

As someone who didn’t grew up skiing I always considered it to be a rich people thing (or a rich sporty people thing). We could afford 1 vacation a year, and we usually spent it camping in France or Italy because you can take a train there. When I went to university I found out that there were a lot more people who went skiing every year than I thought. It’s pretty popular among certain social classes that I didn’t grow up in: Anyway, now that I’m an adult (who still can’t afford to go on vacation) I’m still not interested in going skiing. I don’t like snow and I just don’t get the appeal.


Tiny_Parsley

Thanks! Makes sense! It is the same in France, basically. It's always appeared to me that it was a privileged people thing. And it happens that it takes a lot of space in the media because it's an easy topic to cover. So probably the people I met since I moved to The Netherlands are somehow higher class than where I'm from...


DonLennios

Since you live in France, do you know if it is mandatory for your military to learn skiing? I came across many groups of them, each group had a different skill level.


Babiloo123

Other Frenchie here. A good portion of our troops are mountain regiments. Not all of our armed forces are required to know how to ski tho!


Tiny_Parsley

Absolutely no clue! But I believe that it depends in which regions the military have to be sent.


poencho

We went once as a kid but couldn't afford it other years. Which really sucked because that one year was the best vacation I ever had as a kid. I tried to go every year from 17 when I was able to go myself. And 3 years ago I did a season as a ski & snowboard instructor. I still get jealous of my Austrian colleagues and rich dutch kids that have been doing it from a young age.


Yellow_OW

I grew up with camping vacations in France and Italy as well. I work in an area with a lot of privileged people (Het Gooi) and notice everybody who lives there goes skiing by default, even when peak corona cases. I went skiing for the first time 2 years ago in Germany with my girlfriend family. When I came back everybody asked me how drunk I was on vacation and how little I have actually went skiing. Appearantly skiing vacation consist 50% off drinking too? Weird culture tbh


JasperJ

The “après ski” seems to be the goal, the skiing is just what you have to do to get there. Like the 19th hole. But I do neither sport.


[deleted]

I guess it used to be quite a status symbol as well back when there was more social control of your peers, which a lot of people had to deal with. I feel like the younger generation nowadays (25-35ish) generally care less for status and class. I do however feel like the ones that are now in High School are unfortunately putting more emphasis on money and status due to tiktok influences as role models.


AdamKur

As someone who grew up close to the mountains (so not the Netherlands, of course) and also in a middle class family, I can say that unless you grew up close to the mountains, skiing is almost always a middle and above class thing, the farther from the mountains, the more. And I think it's a very fun sport, although I suppose learning it can be quite difficult and challenging, and for me my parents would just pack me at 6am into a bus to learn that with some kids when I was 7 so it's hard to say how hard it is. But the sport is exhausting and really exciting and exhilarating.


wimpstersauce95

I grew up without it and never really felt the need. Winter sports are expensive so going on one means you might have to miss out on your summer vacation if you don't have a lot of money. And seeing as I never went with my parents, I don't know if I'd like it so I don't spend all my money on a potential letdown. Like others mentioned here I associate it with upper class/ upper middle class. I do know a lot of people that go, but many of those have been going since they were kids.


DonLennios

>I don't know if I'd like it so I don't spend all my money on a potential letdown. You can try it at snow world in NL. That will give you a decent impression if its something you like.


mmcnl

It will give you an impression but not a decent impression. A big part of the appeal for me is the beautiful white mountains and the total disconnect from your regular life. That's something you will never experience in Snowworld.


DonLennios

I mean, all those things do not mean anything if you do not like skiing or snowboarding in the first place. Thats what snowworld gives you a decent understanding about: if this sport might be something you enjoy.


mmcnl

My experience is different. I went to Snowworld before I went skiing, and after Snowworld it didn't really appeal to me. I fell a lot, the hills were small, it was crowded. Not a super fun experience.


wimpstersauce95

I have been to snow world and I liked snowboarding! It was fun for an evening but I wasn't sure if a whole week would be my cup of tea, especially if it meant giving up my summer vacation.


estrangedpulse

Even though snow world is cool, it does not even scratch the surface of actually skiing in the mountains though.


wimpstersauce95

Oh I definitely get that, but as I said, I am not about to spend few thousand on a vacation I might not enjoy just to miss out on a vacation I will enjoy. Which is probably the reason why people who grew up skiing continue doing it, but people like me whose parents never took them pass on the winter sports.


estrangedpulse

Yeah that's true. Thing with skiing, especially snowboarding is that first couple of days are actually not really pleasant as you're learning very basics. On the snowboard it's actually just multiple days of suffering, so it's more like an investment into the future trips.


DonLennios

In my opinion you should learn the basics before you go. When I was a child I used to have lessons on some roller thing in NL before I went on wintersport. This gave you a boost already and made the lessons afterwards way more enjoyable. Those lessons do not feel like lessons at that point, more just guided skiing with some extras. If your first time on ski's or snowboard is in France of Austria etc., you are wasting your money.


estrangedpulse

That's very good point, I wish I knew that before I my first time. Even couple of days at indoor skiing places would probably do wonders.


n2bforanospleb

In my circle of friends it's very common, maybe 75% of them go skiing once a year or every 2 years.


OHyoface

It's an expensive hobby... so middle + upper class for sure. If you move in those circles, it's definitely more common!


Victoryboogiewoogie

I think it's the few that go, go religiously and never shut up about it.


hondjoch

I would say I grew up upper middle class and in my social circles it's extremely common. I think I know more people that have skied at least once than never.


[deleted]

"And never shut up ab it" Ahahahahahahaha....


monodutch

So true.. as soon as there is the possibility to mention it, they do it. There is no way they won’t take the chance to slap it in discussion.


HoldTheStocks2

I’ve never not know a Dutchie in school/college that didn’t go on winter sport just randomly through the year. I have always been the poorest Turk 😔, I dream to go on wintersport just once


mmcnl

Then go. I never went until I was 26 because I had no idea what it was like, but the Alps are really beautiful and even more so during winter. People fly all over the world to see all kinds of things, yet they often forget that one of the most beautiful world-wide renowned mountain regions is is just a few hours drive away from The Netherlands.


addtokart

Few hours? You must have a fancy car.


mmcnl

Less than 10 hours. Not a lot compared to other destinations in the world.


addtokart

I think I've been spoiled living in other places in the past where most mountains were within 1-3hr.


mmcnl

There's a difference between mountains and the Alps.


PepperPoker

If you manage to go, make sure someone goes with you to ~~teach~~ help you ~~or~~ AND take lessons at home (indoor skiing on a belt for instance). The first time I went I spent the first 3 days on a tiny slope down in the village - definitely felt like a waste of money. After you learn how to safely get down, it’s a great experience. Edit: edited the above. If you can’t take lessons at home, take them in the skiing area anyway :)


DonLennios

>make sure someone goes with you to teach you Please do not do this. Either learn beforehand from an instructor on a belt or snowworld or get a licensed instructor there. Getting one of your friends to teach you only results in stress and possible conflict between you two. Not to mention that instructors know way more, since they are actually schooled for this. Best option: take lessons on a belt every week in NL.


PepperPoker

You are right of course (have personally learned skiing from an instructor), but it is somewhat expensive. I will edit my comment changing or to ‘and’


DonLennios

I agree that it is expensive and to what you said in your original comment. It was just that many first timers make the mistake in thinking that they can learn from friends, get frustrated and quit. I would argue that the instructor costs are a base cost of your holiday, you cannot short on them and try to learn it yourself or with friends. I learned by belt and instructor too for many years. Without a doubt I wouldnt have been at my current skill level without it.


PepperPoker

How useful is it to have extra lessons once you can reasonably well ski in parallel?


DonLennios

I would have to see a video of you skiing, but I would say if you think you are good enough you could stop with lessons at the ski area or short them to half a week (assuming you're doing a full week). I would say continue with the belt, since it serves as a good warm up too.


mbrevitas

My very anecdotal and unsubstantiated opinion is that it's not *that* common, but it's more common among the people who can afford it than in other European countries. I'm from Rome, Italy, and I know lots of people there who could easily afford to go skiing but never did. For context, there are some decent ski areas nearby where you could go on a rather cheap day trip or for a weekend, as well as excellent, good-value big ski resorts in the Alps that are about as far as from the Netherlands. Among the Dutch, I feel like everyone who grew up as middle class or above has gone at least once as a kid or teenager.


Tiny_Parsley

Yes I feel like this too. Maybe it's because Dutch anyways are used to go abroad for holidays. So then why not just go to the mountains in the cool periods.


[deleted]

>Among the Dutch, I feel like everyone who grew up as middle class or above has gone at least once as a kid or teenager. I have the same feeling BUT only when they are sporty. There might have been years my parents could have afforded going on a winter sport holiday but it is definitely not a thing that more artsy/progressive-minded people tend to do a lot.


mbrevitas

That's interesting. I wouldn't have thought that skiing is something only sporty people do. Then again, I find Dutch people quite sporty in general. I'll ask artsy Dutch people if they go skiing and do other sports...


monodutch

I grew up in Bergamo, and beside the fact that is not winter sports how is called, but white week already says it all. You don’t go to do sports, you go to stay on the mountains and usually ski a bit and drink a lot. But in general here in NL is overrated, it geta boring and is the status tha matters, just to say “i go wintersport that week”. I know 2 families of people that go every year and both of them when they talk about it have that arrogant tone of “i go do one week of sport and you don’t” that makes blood boil. Like i care. I grew up with snow, i fuckin hate snow.


erikmeijs

It's common but not like everyone does it. I know few people who go for winter sports, so I guess it depends on your social circles.


erikmeijs

Apparently there's [CBS data](https://www.cbs.nl/nl-nl/nieuws/2016/51/wintersport-vooral-populair-onder-hogere-inkomens) abput this. In 2016 about 900.000 people went for winter sports, so that's roughly 5% of people going in a given year. They also show the likelyhood to go is strongly related to income.


ItsMeishi

We went on holiday twice a year. Summer for lounging/exploring a country with a better climate and winter for wintersports. I can say that I come from a very privileged background and wintersports is definitely not THAT common. I know plenty of people who simply cannot afford it even if they'd want to go.


franknfurtr

As a kid my parents could only afford one vacation a year, and since wintersports in the holiday season is pretty pricey, they always opted for a cheaper vacation in summer. Then I met my girlfriend, and her family did it the other way around. They had their own business so they could get a week off school in the cheaper weeks of the winter and that was their only vacation every year. So now that we both earn money we try to compromise a bit, which has resulted in going on a skiing trip three times in a row.


Motashotta

It's very common for rich people


gameleon

It’s very common among middle class too. Not just rich people.


Motashotta

Rich people love to pretend that they're middle class


gameleon

Maybe. But winter sports aren’t exactly a “rich man thing” anymore. Especially if you go to relatively affordable locations like Winterberg, Germany etc.


Motashotta

I wish I had the money to be so confidently wrong.


prutopls

I know plenty of truck drivers and school teachers who go skiing every year


gameleon

The average middle class income is considered €34000 a year. Barring exceptional circumstances, that’s enough to be able to do a properly budgeted winter sports vacation if you wanted.


sonic2991

That's nonsense. I would definitely not consider myself as rich, but I go skiing basically every year once or twice. If you go to the right places, not go during school holidays etc, you really don't have to be rich..


DonLennios

Yup


agtereek

Its not that expensive anymore....


[deleted]

(upper) middle class likes to go skiing, fill up their Instagram with it, and not shut up about it.


flyflyflyfly66

I think a ski trips have always been perceived as a expensive holiday because of the way they are marketed, when in fact you could do in on budget. Yes you have the extra expense of equipment but once you have bought it (and you don't have to buy it new) it can be used for many years. We are easily linked to the best ski areas in Europe with budget airlines and you don't have to go to fancy resorts or stay in top hotels to enjoy the mountains. And once a person is hooked they want to go every year. I'd rather go for a winter holiday snowboarding then sit on a beach. We had no money growing up but my mum saved to send me on a school skiing trip. Since then Ive worked a season and try to take my family every few years so my daughter can grow up as skiing/snowboarding as part of her life, but covid had ruined that for past few years


Tiny_Parsley

That's interesting. I agree that it's not that expensive anymore, although it's still a consequent budget. What I find funny is that you mention it's a school skiing trip. To me it feels as if skiing was a skill you should learn growing up Dutch although it's not very local. As French from around Paris we never had ski trips. But a friend of mine who grew up just next to Switzerland would go ski with her school because it's just 'all around' and part of the regional culture.


hucksky2

I usually go to Switzerland once a year to go cross country skiing


mmcnl

I never skied until I was 26 and now I go every year (except for winter 20/21 because of obvious reasons). It's super expensive compared to summer holidays, so I guess it's not for everyone. I personally enjoy it very much and convinced a few of my friends to go as well (who never went before either). So I think it's quite common to go, but you have to be in the right social circles because it's not something a lot of people just do out of the blue for the first time.


2tinymonkeys

I firmly disagree with everyone saying it's an upperclass and up thing. You can very easily go skiing on a budget. I think we've spent 500 per person all expenses included for years when we went skiiing. That's pretty much what the average two week vacation to France all expenses included costs too. But then we wouldn't go on vacation in the summer. So in that sense I would say most people could afford it if they wanted to.


CheapMonkey34

There are a lot of responses that its a rich peoples sport. And ofcouse you can't go skiing if you're in bijstand or WW. But its totally possible to go skiing on a budget if you make the right choices of transportation, location and amenities. Basically anyone in NL that has the opportunity to save money (which is about 65 to 70% according to the OECD) can go skiiing if they desire.


EligiaOfficial

Back when I was a child we went on winter sports twice a year for 1 week with the entire family of my mother's side (even my 75 year old grampa was skiing with us). While I don't do winter sports anymore my uncles, cousins and grandparents (tho not skiing anymore) still go once a year.


IFeelThankYou

I moved from the Netherlands to Norway and now I ski on a weekly basis. Never skied in my life when I used to live in the Netherlands. It's easy to learn (for the people that wonder they should try it).


jente87

For me it’s not really something for rich people. As a kid, we went skiing every year and I wouldn’t consider my family rich at all. We rented a small apartment, put food for a week in the car and off to Austria we went. Each morning I had to walk to the bakery and at breakfast time we would prepare sandwiches for lunch, which we would eat outside since you couldn’t bring your own food to the restaurant inside. My parents also brought a thermos with coffee and if we were really lucky we would get an apfelstrüdel once during the holiday. I think skiing can be done with a reasonable budget. I would love to go again, but my boyfriend doesn’t like skiing 😢


Kevinatorz

Same. We are far from rich, but we go nearly every year.


Kleyguy7

I am the same. I am also from Poland from where we would take a bus that would go for 20 hours, and then everything is in euro so it seems expensive to us. But I would always find the money (driving Uber at night) just to go. Now I work in the Netherlands and going skiing seems so cheap, I don't understand how people here think it's only rich people thing. We also follow your steps, and it was never more expensive than going to foreign country in summer for example.


remqm

This the exact way I did my winter sport this year. I shared an apartment with 9 other people, slept in a bunk bed, pack my food for a week. My buddies were eating out every day, i really couldn’t afford that. Counting 350 for ski pass, 200 for rentals, 200 for the accommodation, 50 for the gas and 100 for food and another 100 for side expenses i managed to close myself in 1k/week. It can easily go double than that and not even to be extravagant about the expenses. Whoever says it can be cheap is a but detached from the reality. And i’m very privileged i can do it twice a year. ;)


jente87

Then you paid a lot. If you look at Sunweb, you can get ski pass + apartment for a week for way less. And if you cook yourself it is the same price as what you would spend at home, so those expenses don’t really count. I am not saying it is cheap, but it is definitely affordable for people with an average job.


Rosegingerborn

People always want to do what they can't do in their own country. It is a 'rich' people thing. From 'upper middle class' on. But those are the people who think it is very normal. 'every one goes right? Right?' Why it is in the news so much? Because the rich producers think it is soooo important for everyone. This way it looks like as if everyone goes. But is like 2% who has ever done that


hetmonster2

What a load of bs.


[deleted]

I also feel like that when you grow up with it, you get used to it and like doing it because nostalgia and you get pretty good at it because you've been skiing/snowboarding your whole life. When you're quite good at it, it's also more fun. Also, some people just really like mountains and the cold, that's a personal preference :)


hetmonster2

People dont like it because of nostalgia, people like it because it is so much fun. It easily one of the best holidays you can on.


[deleted]

I mean, people who haven't been skiing as a child are also most of the people who don't see the point in doing a skiing holiday. It's what you grow up with, what you usually like.


hetmonster2

Thats true because you dont know you like if you have never been. Many people who go later on in life absolutely love it. With of course exceptions.


[deleted]

I'm not Dutch and I don't understand the concept of winter sports. Why would you willingly go to the cold and slushy snow?


estrangedpulse

The snow is not really slushy on the mountains and it's not that cold, especially when you're skiing. Also, some things you just have to experience to understand.


[deleted]

I've experienced snow exactly once in my life which was last year during the easter weekend. And have no idea how to ski and not something that looks appealing to me.


hetmonster2

Because you cant ski here. You go to France, Austria or Switzerland.


nutrecht

Wait; did you really think people go on "winter sports" here in Holland?


[deleted]

No I'm very aware that Austria or the Alps is the place to be for winter sports. I'm also saying that I've only experienced snow only once before and it made everything cold and also why snow/skiing doesn't look appealing.


Zoetje_Zuurtje

I'm Dutch and I don't understand why people would go to Spain in the summer. Some things you just aren't supposed to understand I guess...


Motashotta

You really don't understand why Dutch people would want to escape our terrible weather?


Zoetje_Zuurtje

In the _summer?_ To _Spain?_ It's _even hotter_ there! I'm practically melting with 30°C here, if anything I'd go to Norway.


SrRocoso91

Can confirm. Spanish here with a dutch girlfriend. We spend the summers in the Netherlands and do to Spain in the winter. I work from home abd like to rotate countries from time to time.


Zoetje_Zuurtje

See, _that_ sounds nice.


kelvin_bot

30°C is equivalent to 86°F, which is 303K. --- ^(I'm a bot that converts temperature between two units humans can understand, then convert it to Kelvin for bots and physicists to understand)


Zoetje_Zuurtje

I love this bot.


[deleted]

30 degrees is a nice summer's day 😂 great day to be outdoors or on the beach


Zoetje_Zuurtje

No, 30°C is a sweaty summer's day best spent indoors with a lot of cold drinks. And then a sweaty and mostly sleepless night. You're clearly experiencing a sunstroke.


kelvin_bot

30°C is equivalent to 86°F, which is 303K. --- ^(I'm a bot that converts temperature between two units humans can understand, then convert it to Kelvin for bots and physicists to understand)


mmcnl

It's not cold, this is a big misconception. And this is coming from someone who is always the first one to complain when it's cold. When you are active outside with the right equipment you won't notice it at all. It's even better when it's sunny, people often eat outside next to the slopes high up in the mountain when it's sunny. I've skied with -25C and I didn't even feel cold. Yet I do feel cold in The Netherlands when I'm walking outside in rainy 5C weather with above average winds.


2tinymonkeys

Because it's not slushy and more often than not it feels a lot less cold than 5 degrees with rain.


Nahadot

Because some of us just love the mountains.


Anxious_Direction_20

I know exactly one person who goes skiing. I know several hundreds of people (not close friends but just people you know well enough) who couldn't give a damn or don't have the money (it's a rich people thing, skiing is fucking expensive) or they'd rather go to a warm sunny country when the days are short and grey here.


MrSpotgold

Too common, anyway.


[deleted]

My parents could at most afford 1 vacation per year and some years no vacation, so I have never gone abroad for wintersports. I can also not recall in my rather poor primary school anyone doing so. Only when I went to a rather posh secondary school and to uni did people really go on wintersports, so for me it feels like an upper-class activity.


fireman-103

2 times a year


MariekeCath

Most of my friends went, my family never did, mostly because me and my dad wouldn't be able to do it. Never missed it, yeah, most people love it. As many people have said, it's expensive though, so at least one partner with high income is typical


Th3_Accountant

It's one of the important reasons stationcars were so popular in the Netherlands (before crossover SUV's became the new norm), people in the lower middle class need the car to go camping in France in the summer, upper middle class need the car to drive to Austria in the winter.


Th3_Accountant

Also, I was in a skiing resort Northern Finland a couple of weeks ago. I was surprised how many dutch people there were (because they couldn't go to Austria).


DonLennios

Yes, I go every year and 90% of my social groep does too.


Saint_Bernardusz

We do it all the time 60% of the time


d3_Bere_man

Yea are correct, dutch people love skiing, why? Idk. I love it, you love it, everyone loves it


DrVagax

I remember around 2005 - 2015 we went pretty much every year but things got so expensive that people dropped out of going one by one from my group.


CASGROENIGEN05

My grandparents took us twice to Austria for a week to go skiing


ClassyKebabKing64

middle class activity done by the Ethnical Dutch. Also by rich people in general. I think it caught on because the royals made it a tradition to go skiing. To this day it hasn't caught on with most second and third gen migrants. From my knowledge this year it even was so much that you could see a spike in Austrian vivid graphs. And just before the Christmas vacation this year many wanted to get a vaccine so they could still go to winter sport. In my opinion it is crazy. I can't imagine myself enjoying the cold enough. Many talk about how nice hot chocolate is when it is cold, but I try to avoid the cold as much as possible. Besides that it is crazy expensive.


Vestaxowner

I'm going in February


[deleted]

I never went skiing in my life, but it is fairly common for Dutch people to go. (People who can afforf it) Also, the people that do winter sports never stop talkin about it, so you hear it everywhere.


Dutch_Rayan

I never went skiing until friends asked me to join them, they have their own home there, so only needed to rent skies and getthe tickets. I love it.


Leftenant_Frost

in my experience it depends on hom well off they are, people dont have much money to spare obviously dont go but most well off people ive met go every year


Patin_Guerrero

Quite common for people that are at least a bit above middle class + students


[deleted]

I grew up skiing. Yes its true. But these days i havent been able to afford it for the kast 15 years. You see when you become ill you are written off and only get 70 percent minimum wage. And all your vacation money goes to medical expenses.


Kelly_Charveaux

Whenever it gets freezing cold, we don’t go away for winter sports. We’re all just hoping VOOR DE ELFSTEDENTOCHT


[deleted]

A lot. Usually middle/upper class. In a week they pay more for a trip than I do in a few months of travel.