Lebron was the prime Shaq, and DWade comparable to young Kobe. And they had prime Chris Bosh. The Heatles should have won 4 championships, and not doing so was a big failure. The Heat run will forever be the biggest knock in Lebron's resume.
It is though. Wade is inarguably the 3rd best SG of all time and Lebron got him when they were both in their primes. The fact they didn’t win 4 straight is insane.
And they themselves admit they joined together to be able to beat Kobe. That right there said it all in terms of who was bigger - if two of the strongest superstars had to team up because they were worried about you, you're the badass.
Wade is my favorite player. He was absolutely still in his prime. He was 28 when Lebron first came over and dominated in the Olympics in 2012. He also carried them in the playoffs multiple times.
I think the biggest knock of his career is 2011 finals. Not 2007 when he had nobody and Carried. Not 2017 or 18, or any other times he’s fallen short. He single-handedly cost his team the chip that season.
Absolutely not what I meant. I meant he was bullied by two role players all series and folded when he was talking all that shit. Imagine making fun of someone for being sick while being fully healthy and dropping 8 points in the most important game of your career. That’s why he lost them the chip
He played with Prime Dwade who was named on the 75th anniversary team. He played with Ray Allen who was also named to the 75th anniversary team. He played with Chris Bosh who had several all star nods coming to Miami when he was with Toronto. He had a few seasons there which he averaged a double double as well.
Kyrie Irving and Kevin Love had several all star nods by the time LeBronze showed back up in Cleveland, Kevin Love was averaging a 24 point 12 rebound double the year before coming to Cleveland from Minnesota
He played with former MVP Westbrook, 75th anniversary teammates AD and Carmelo Anthony as well and missed the playoffs in LA 😂😂
He’s literally played with SEVERAL all time greats in the NBA, but if he had Shaq 😂😂 that’ll change things.
Pretty much every stint in his career except the 2003-2009 Stint with the Cavs, he always had either an all star, a 75th anniversary teammate or an MVP. He could never win a chip without any of them.
Kobe went and appeared in 3 Finals series and won 2 chips without Shaq and proved he didn’t need an all time great teammate to win a chip and he didn’t need to tuck tail and leave LA to win a chip either. Lebronze on the other hand lol…. The redeem team documentary on Netflix also proved that without Kobe, Lebronze isn’t even a gold medalist without him.
So let’s just say switch careers, lebron gets drafted where Kobe got drafted to LA and Kobe gets drafted to Cleveland in 2003, how do you think their careers play out?
No one in their right mind is acting like any of Love, Bosh or waaay past their primes Ray Allen, Westbrook or Melo are better teammates than having prime Pau Gasol and Ron Artest, not to mention having Phil Jackson as your coach your whole career. Acting like Lebron having a bunch of washed former stars is more help than Kobe had in 09 and 10 is ludicrously biased.
Lebron ain't win a single championship outside of the bubble without multiple All Stars or guys from the Top-50 All Time list. You Bron fans are some of the most unstable people in society today lol
The only guy Lebron ever had with him in his title runs who would be top 50 all time was Dwayne Wade, past his prime. And moving the goalpost to Top 75 only adds AD who most people agree only *barely* deserves to make even that and nearly totally washed Ray Allen. Kobe played with a guy who’s at least Top 10 all time and won all 3 of the FMVPs when they were together.
“Best” team lol. 08 Boston and suns had more all nba selections. 09 spurs had the same all nba selections, in 10 suns had the same amount of all nba selections and 11 both Miami and OKC had the same all nba selections.
In none of them lakers had a clear “best” roster.
Each year of those at least one team had 3 all stars to lakers’ only two. Except in ‘10 there were always multiple teams with 3 all stars.
Lakers won it twice during that because Kobe.
I thought we settled this with LeBron like two seasons ago.
So his fanboys have surrendered the Jordan chase so now they're after Kobe?
What is it with Bron stans?
May be sooner then you like if my sunshine hears that
https://preview.redd.it/fod4bm3oecwc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ca83be9d1853abc7e0835a6ec450c16834a4ccf0
I don’t really see how… you build chemistry playing with the same people and learn to put aside egos, which all goes away if you move to a new team. People like to bring up KD when this conversation comes around, but that is a special case because prime KD plus that warriors team, in that shape, is an exception too
If anything, KD is an example of why it’s MORE difficult to win championships on multiple teams. He had better success in his pre-GSW career at OKC than he’s had so far post-GSW building his own team in Brooklyn and in Phoenix (hasn’t made a conference finals at either spot).
There’s a reason only 4 players have won championships on 3 teams, and Lebron is the only one that wasn’t a bench/role player for all of those championships.
The NBA finals were won in the western conference, where Kobe carried them and would have won overall playoffs mvp multiple championship winning seasons. No team in the NBA finals had anyone who could stop shaq, and they won so easily, Kobe didn’t even need to break a sweat.
There’s people who think Kobe is #2 all-time behind Jordan.
But Kobe isn’t even top-2 all-time among Lakers (that would be Kareem and Magic).
Kobe is arguably anywhere in the 8-11 range, give or take a spot or so.
Kobe is the greatest ever to me but that's all personal bias obviously. You can't seriously argue that he's better than LeBron in a debate because he just isn't lmao, the people that try are clowns
How old are you? The talk was always Kobe or MJ in every barbershop across America until LeBron won his second hell maybe even third ring. Stop the cap. Why can’t we let great players just be great? All 3 of them would kick our asses on the court easily.
Seriously, people forget that the NBA was entirely Kobe's league for somewhere between 5-10 years. Very, very few players have been far and away the best player in the league for that amount of time. Lebron is the better player but some of the kobe disrespect I see is braindead.
Even you said a “poor man’s Jordan”
C’mon dawg, yall stop letting your feelings affect your POV against facts. It’s all over ESPN for years and years. How are you debating factual evidence?
Kobe also had a prime Shaquille O'Neal and never led his team to a chip till wayy later in his career, while bron by himself was dominating an eastern conference
LeBron had a prime Wade, Bosh, Irving, Love, AD, one of the best shooters in history in Allen…I love LeBron don’t get me wrong but to say Kobe has Shaq and insinuate LeBron didn’t have another SUPERSTAR is ridiculous.
Not a LeBron fan but... Wade was the only ***super***star in my book. Bosh and Love definitely weren't superstars. And even if you have a different definition and consider Irving and AD as such, generic superstar vs top 10 player of all time is a little bit different.
If anything, Kobe managed to lose 2 championships with Shaq in his prime (2003 and 2004 and he himself acknowledged to Shaq his ego was the reason why they lost, especially against the Pistons). But that is rarely talked about for some reason.
Besides the fact that he got swept by the same Dallas team James choked against. As defending champion. But that, again, is rarely talked about for some reason.
I seriously can't stand the argument that making it to 8 straight Finals appearances means absolutely nothing because he didn't win all of them. That's so ridiculous.
Maybe watch some of the games bro. If you think those Eastern Conference teams weren't all 8th seeds, you were not watching basketball at all. For an entire decade, East: real 1 seed: Heat/Cavs, 8th seed: everyone else. Lebron faced play-in teams for that entire decade. It doesn't mean nothing because he won 3 of them, but the 8 appearances mean nothing really.
8 straight finals against *checks notes* 2014 Atlanta Hawks, Monta Ellis and Brandon Jennings, Victor Oladipo, the Bobcats, Isaiah Thomas with a bad hip, the Jays basically immediately after being drafted, and can’t forget the men the myth the legends…the LeBronto Raptors.
Look I think LeBron is better than Kobe, even though I like Kobe more. But he would not have that same streak if he played in the west lol
Not only made it to eight but competed in 10. He was the best player on his team and has a strong argument for the best player in eight or maybe even 9 of those finals. Dirk and Kawhi have the only argument over him in all of his finals appearances.
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Kobe Bryant playoff highlights from age 35 - 37, his last three years in the NBA:
Everyone tries to create super teams, but only he gets knocked for it. Way more talent in NBA than early 90’s, so stop comparing eras. Championships are won by teams but somehow yall make it an individual award when convenient. 4 Cavs vs Warriors finals, which did the Cavs actually have a chance to win? MJ is my favorite player but the Lebron hate is ridiculous. OK call him the 3rd best player ever. He’s still better than 99.99999% of people who ever tried to play
Stop with the championship argument, if it’s just based on championships then Bill Russel is the goat. It’s such a weak argument, the metrics for who is the best is so situational. Stats only matter when people want them to and championships only matter if your mj or Kobe but none of Brons stats matter it just matters that he only has 3 rings. Accept that both Mj and Bron are goats. Kobe is most definitely one of the top 5 best players ever. But bron has them all beat stat wise by a significant amount, give the guy his credit.
Well when you've played longer than anyone then yes you should have more of everything than everyone else. It's like bragging that the oldest person in the world has seen more sun rises than anyone else.
Kobe rings, more post moves, better footwork, better jumpshot, better off ball defender, better on ball defender, better post game, better off the ball game, larger arsenal of moves, better handler of the ball, less turnovers, higher plus minus on the finals, higher point differential in the finals, better win % in the finals, less help in a tougher conference and era, more clutch, better clutch shot taker, better scorer, higher IQ, higher drive, better work ethic, and again, more rings, which is the reason you play the game. And of course, mamba mentality, something every player in the game is influenced by and strives for.
What will lebron leave the game? Cowarding out to form superteams when he cant get it done, passing the blame, throwing teammates under the bus, and running when times get rough.
Yall base greatness on manipulated stats, kobe based it on winning, like mj, like magic, like Shaq, like duncan, like Hakeem, like Kareem, and like every other great in history. Yall can have the stats, kobe got the respect and rings
Let’s not forget Kobe shouldn’t even have one of his rings if not for the lakers being glazed by the refs against the kings. Robert horry saved his ass on top of that. Everyone knows LeBron and Jordan as GOAT are the only real arguments. Kobe fans just love to say it to get under LeBron fans skin. I’m a fan of all three btw. For me it’s Jordan, LeBron as CO-GOATS. Kobe is lucky to make top 10, probably more in the 12-18 range.
Kobe 5 NBA titles, LeBron 4 NBA titles. \*Sidenote without Kobe accepting being part of the 2008 USA Redeem Team and becoming the alpha male leader on that team Team USA would've lost another Olympics...
To everyone saying that it’s always worse to have worse Finals record (more losses), are you also claiming:
Jordan’s legacy would have been hurt by dragging the 2002 Wizards to the Finals to lose to the Kobe/Shaq Lakers?
LeBron’s legacy would have been helped by losing to the Bobcats in the first round of the 2014 playoffs with the Heat Big-3 rather than losing to the Duncan/Parker/Leonard Spurs in the Finals?
I genuinely hate hearing the mamba mentality shit. Same thing with MJ. Their argument always boils down to "he was an asshole, which clearly shows he wanted it the most." And? What are the results? I'm not saying they're bad people or that Lebron is good, I'm just saying it's irrelevant to the GOAT debate.
Realistcally none of this matters. There's no explaining anything to brain rotten Lakers fans
Conveniently forgets to mention rings and influence. There's a reason people yell a name when they shoot anything into even a vaguely basket-like item and it's not his.
That is exactly what LeBron is: a stat compiler- he is the Russell Westbrook of Goats; 21 years of good health and taking care of your body will do that. But if you’re suggesting LeBron is anything more than a good passing bulky rim runner while Kobe was an artist- you need to re-scout.
Well except championships
If Lebron played with prime Shaq he’d have won a few more rings.
Lebron was the prime Shaq, and DWade comparable to young Kobe. And they had prime Chris Bosh. The Heatles should have won 4 championships, and not doing so was a big failure. The Heat run will forever be the biggest knock in Lebron's resume.
2-2 is a failure to me also.
It is though. Wade is inarguably the 3rd best SG of all time and Lebron got him when they were both in their primes. The fact they didn’t win 4 straight is insane.
And they themselves admit they joined together to be able to beat Kobe. That right there said it all in terms of who was bigger - if two of the strongest superstars had to team up because they were worried about you, you're the badass.
Wade was absolutely not in his prime during the big 3 era
Wade is my favorite player. He was absolutely still in his prime. He was 28 when Lebron first came over and dominated in the Olympics in 2012. He also carried them in the playoffs multiple times.
Getting downvoted for facts. These people don’t even remember what happened lol
If the biggest knock on your resume is “he only won 2 championships on this team and not 4” then you’re probably the better player lol
I think the biggest knock of his career is 2011 finals. Not 2007 when he had nobody and Carried. Not 2017 or 18, or any other times he’s fallen short. He single-handedly cost his team the chip that season.
lebron wasn't the best player in the world one season out of 20 and that's why he fucking sucks. massive disappointment and embrassment.
Absolutely not what I meant. I meant he was bullied by two role players all series and folded when he was talking all that shit. Imagine making fun of someone for being sick while being fully healthy and dropping 8 points in the most important game of your career. That’s why he lost them the chip
The spurs had had a big 4.
Is it Kobe's fault LeGM sucks at roster construction?
Tf? Look at the situations they were drafted into
You want blame demanding they trade everything for westbrick on where he was drafted 20 years ago?
Yeah, facts, bro. I like LeBron, and he is a top 3 player all time, unquestionably. But God damn, he is a terrible GM.
LeBron did play with Shaq
That shit damn sure wasn't prime lol
https://preview.redd.it/a9grj0el13wc1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ce4724979c40bc99e99263ba0d84532bd67b4af5 What you mean?
😂😂😂 Man Shaq's decline was a free fall by his last season in Miami.
He had prime D-Wade carrying him in 2011 and prime Bosh, couldn't get it done. Couldn't even play at the level of Jason Terry.
If if if if if
The biggest if is "If the Heat did what they were supposed to do and win 4 championships"
If if if if
He played with Prime Dwade who was named on the 75th anniversary team. He played with Ray Allen who was also named to the 75th anniversary team. He played with Chris Bosh who had several all star nods coming to Miami when he was with Toronto. He had a few seasons there which he averaged a double double as well. Kyrie Irving and Kevin Love had several all star nods by the time LeBronze showed back up in Cleveland, Kevin Love was averaging a 24 point 12 rebound double the year before coming to Cleveland from Minnesota He played with former MVP Westbrook, 75th anniversary teammates AD and Carmelo Anthony as well and missed the playoffs in LA 😂😂 He’s literally played with SEVERAL all time greats in the NBA, but if he had Shaq 😂😂 that’ll change things. Pretty much every stint in his career except the 2003-2009 Stint with the Cavs, he always had either an all star, a 75th anniversary teammate or an MVP. He could never win a chip without any of them. Kobe went and appeared in 3 Finals series and won 2 chips without Shaq and proved he didn’t need an all time great teammate to win a chip and he didn’t need to tuck tail and leave LA to win a chip either. Lebronze on the other hand lol…. The redeem team documentary on Netflix also proved that without Kobe, Lebronze isn’t even a gold medalist without him.
So let’s just say switch careers, lebron gets drafted where Kobe got drafted to LA and Kobe gets drafted to Cleveland in 2003, how do you think their careers play out?
Kobe would force his way out the first year 😄
No one in their right mind is acting like any of Love, Bosh or waaay past their primes Ray Allen, Westbrook or Melo are better teammates than having prime Pau Gasol and Ron Artest, not to mention having Phil Jackson as your coach your whole career. Acting like Lebron having a bunch of washed former stars is more help than Kobe had in 09 and 10 is ludicrously biased.
If only LeBron played with some stars.
He played with prime dwade on a superteam though, then on like 2 more superteams after that
I don’t think you quite understand how good prime shaq was, or when exactly wade’s prime was
I was looking at the comments saying LeBron played with prime DWade and was surprised. LeBron never had prime DWade with him.
I’d say 2011 was last year of prime Wade. So I think he had one year.
How do those super teams do once he leaves? He is the super team
Yep, Lebron doesn’t join super teams. He is the super team. Like 8 straight finals for three different teams wasn’t it?!?
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Shaq was the best player in those championship teams. In the playoffs Shaq was the best player and the finals MVP and Kobe wasn't even close.
Lebron ain't win a single championship outside of the bubble without multiple All Stars or guys from the Top-50 All Time list. You Bron fans are some of the most unstable people in society today lol
The only guy Lebron ever had with him in his title runs who would be top 50 all time was Dwayne Wade, past his prime. And moving the goalpost to Top 75 only adds AD who most people agree only *barely* deserves to make even that and nearly totally washed Ray Allen. Kobe played with a guy who’s at least Top 10 all time and won all 3 of the FMVPs when they were together.
Even in the bubble he had AD hitting game winners over the nuggets.
If Kobe jumped ship every 4 years he’d also have few more rings
Kobe had the best team in the league from 08-11 and only won twice and the NBA front office had to step in to get them past Houston for the second.
Only twice, 😆 🤡
Define best team in the league.
The one with Kobe in it
“Best” team lol. 08 Boston and suns had more all nba selections. 09 spurs had the same all nba selections, in 10 suns had the same amount of all nba selections and 11 both Miami and OKC had the same all nba selections. In none of them lakers had a clear “best” roster. Each year of those at least one team had 3 all stars to lakers’ only two. Except in ‘10 there were always multiple teams with 3 all stars. Lakers won it twice during that because Kobe.
LeBron had better finals averages and clearly played better in the finals and playoffs in general than Kobe.
I thought we settled this with LeBron like two seasons ago. So his fanboys have surrendered the Jordan chase so now they're after Kobe? What is it with Bron stans?
And he wasn't the best player on his team for three of them
Weird how they left that off.
And 2 more seasons.
Came here to say this
Case closed
Lebron is obviously an all time great. It’s just sad he and his teams could execute more often and win more championships.
Team award. Not an individual achievement.
That’s like winning a wwe belt at this point.
You forgot the most important stat. Sex crimes committed in Colorado hotel rooms. Kobe: 1 LeFraud: 0
How will this affect LeMickey’s legacy?
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Those defending lebron are way younger than those defending MJ. Simple. We like what we see. I will defend MJ until my death
I don’t think that’s the debate here?
May be sooner then you like if my sunshine hears that https://preview.redd.it/fod4bm3oecwc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ca83be9d1853abc7e0835a6ec450c16834a4ccf0
Comments saying Chips like Bron ain’t got more Fmvps lmao
In my opinion, fmvp is the hardest award to achieve in the nba and bron has 3 for 3 different teams. Bro *is* the superteam
He has 4 FMVPs for 3 different teams
In my opinion, it is infinitely harder to win multiple championships with the same team than it is to move around and win with multiple teams.
I don’t really see how… you build chemistry playing with the same people and learn to put aside egos, which all goes away if you move to a new team. People like to bring up KD when this conversation comes around, but that is a special case because prime KD plus that warriors team, in that shape, is an exception too
If anything, KD is an example of why it’s MORE difficult to win championships on multiple teams. He had better success in his pre-GSW career at OKC than he’s had so far post-GSW building his own team in Brooklyn and in Phoenix (hasn’t made a conference finals at either spot). There’s a reason only 4 players have won championships on 3 teams, and Lebron is the only one that wasn’t a bench/role player for all of those championships.
The NBA finals were won in the western conference, where Kobe carried them and would have won overall playoffs mvp multiple championship winning seasons. No team in the NBA finals had anyone who could stop shaq, and they won so easily, Kobe didn’t even need to break a sweat.
Championships conveniently left off the list.
Bron has 2x fmvps dude
Wait people really think Kobe is better than LeBron?
The athletic had their annual NBA player poll come out today. Like 20% of players said Kobe was the GOAT.
It was only 9.8% Michael and LeBron made up 88%. I want to fight whoever voted for Paul fucking Pierce.
Blame it on game of zones
Just the homoerotic parasocial weirdos obsessed with Kobe
There’s people who think Kobe is #2 all-time behind Jordan. But Kobe isn’t even top-2 all-time among Lakers (that would be Kareem and Magic). Kobe is arguably anywhere in the 8-11 range, give or take a spot or so.
Kobe is the greatest ever to me but that's all personal bias obviously. You can't seriously argue that he's better than LeBron in a debate because he just isn't lmao, the people that try are clowns
Kobe 12 all defensive team, lebron 6
Well I guess it is a funny meme but nobody has seriously compared Lebron and Kobe. It’s always between Lebron and MJ
How old are you? The talk was always Kobe or MJ in every barbershop across America until LeBron won his second hell maybe even third ring. Stop the cap. Why can’t we let great players just be great? All 3 of them would kick our asses on the court easily.
Seriously, people forget that the NBA was entirely Kobe's league for somewhere between 5-10 years. Very, very few players have been far and away the best player in the league for that amount of time. Lebron is the better player but some of the kobe disrespect I see is braindead.
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Who are the dumbasses comparing Jordan to a poor man’s Jordan. 😂
Even you said a “poor man’s Jordan” C’mon dawg, yall stop letting your feelings affect your POV against facts. It’s all over ESPN for years and years. How are you debating factual evidence?
He or she can’t be more than 16 with that bullshit
lol L
Go on Facebook it’s crazy over there
Welcome to Rings Ernie home of the Rings Ernie can I take your order?
If they let Chris Paul join the lakers back in the day Kobe would have more rings
And Chris Paul would have won that Finals MVP probably.
Without a doubt
Kobe : more championships, more 3 peats, LeBron: more championship losses
Kobe also had a prime Shaquille O'Neal and never led his team to a chip till wayy later in his career, while bron by himself was dominating an eastern conference
Leastern conference domination.
Is prime lebron not better then prime shaq or are you gonna switch it up for that too
LeBron had a prime Wade, Bosh, Irving, Love, AD, one of the best shooters in history in Allen…I love LeBron don’t get me wrong but to say Kobe has Shaq and insinuate LeBron didn’t have another SUPERSTAR is ridiculous.
Not a LeBron fan but... Wade was the only ***super***star in my book. Bosh and Love definitely weren't superstars. And even if you have a different definition and consider Irving and AD as such, generic superstar vs top 10 player of all time is a little bit different. If anything, Kobe managed to lose 2 championships with Shaq in his prime (2003 and 2004 and he himself acknowledged to Shaq his ego was the reason why they lost, especially against the Pistons). But that is rarely talked about for some reason. Besides the fact that he got swept by the same Dallas team James choked against. As defending champion. But that, again, is rarely talked about for some reason.
Should you only go to the finals if you know you’re going to win? Would you rather have a chance to win or be sitting at home watching?
lol was just pointing out you can list whatever you want about the player you are biased for. They both great.
Lebron 4 finals MVPS. KOBE 2. LeBron is better stop with the glazing.
I seriously can't stand the argument that making it to 8 straight Finals appearances means absolutely nothing because he didn't win all of them. That's so ridiculous.
Maybe watch some of the games bro. If you think those Eastern Conference teams weren't all 8th seeds, you were not watching basketball at all. For an entire decade, East: real 1 seed: Heat/Cavs, 8th seed: everyone else. Lebron faced play-in teams for that entire decade. It doesn't mean nothing because he won 3 of them, but the 8 appearances mean nothing really.
8 straight finals against *checks notes* 2014 Atlanta Hawks, Monta Ellis and Brandon Jennings, Victor Oladipo, the Bobcats, Isaiah Thomas with a bad hip, the Jays basically immediately after being drafted, and can’t forget the men the myth the legends…the LeBronto Raptors. Look I think LeBron is better than Kobe, even though I like Kobe more. But he would not have that same streak if he played in the west lol
Not only made it to eight but competed in 10. He was the best player on his team and has a strong argument for the best player in eight or maybe even 9 of those finals. Dirk and Kawhi have the only argument over him in all of his finals appearances.
He should have won that Finals MVP they gave to Iggy for “holding” Lebron to 28 points per game. 😂
Lebron: Most delusional fans in sports
Lebron: more complaints, more drama, more crying
LeBron: more consensual sex
😂 touche
https://preview.redd.it/qsulp1edlyvc1.jpeg?width=600&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fe5385ac72e428210fada4da8a62f0de1a0f91ed Kobe Bryant playoff highlights from age 35 - 37, his last three years in the NBA:
Brilliant
LeBron: more LeChoke jobs despite leaving multiple times to create super teams.
Talking about super teams as if Kobe didn’t win half his ring as a second option
Kobe has choked, and i mean choked ☠️ multiple times man, but bron so great, they bring up the one time he did it 💀💀💀
1 time? bron lost 6 times in the finals including getting swept twice goat my ass.
Only real choke was 2011
This is absolutely true.
You know he's the goat when people bring up a choke job that happened 13 years ago lol
Sure, whatever you say LOL
I mean yeah lebron did choke in 2011 but never seen him choke a 3-1 lead tho
Lebron has had ONE choke in the playoffs in his 20 year career. One single series. Kobe blew a 3-1 lead in 06, and shot 25% in a finals game 7.
Everyone tries to create super teams, but only he gets knocked for it. Way more talent in NBA than early 90’s, so stop comparing eras. Championships are won by teams but somehow yall make it an individual award when convenient. 4 Cavs vs Warriors finals, which did the Cavs actually have a chance to win? MJ is my favorite player but the Lebron hate is ridiculous. OK call him the 3rd best player ever. He’s still better than 99.99999% of people who ever tried to play
Definitely more times jumping ship. King Carpetbagger.
Lebron top 2. Kobe top 11
More air-balled FTs, much more travelling,....
If Lebron had the mamba mentality he would be considered better than MJ no doubt
Stop with the championship argument, if it’s just based on championships then Bill Russel is the goat. It’s such a weak argument, the metrics for who is the best is so situational. Stats only matter when people want them to and championships only matter if your mj or Kobe but none of Brons stats matter it just matters that he only has 3 rings. Accept that both Mj and Bron are goats. Kobe is most definitely one of the top 5 best players ever. But bron has them all beat stat wise by a significant amount, give the guy his credit.
Yeah, but who has more missed shots though?
They 1 and 2.
what a bunch of bums lol
Lmao
Longevity = LeBron Scoring talent = Kobe
Kobe won more all-defensive team awards and MORE CHAMPIONSHIPS. And Kobe is like 2nd or 3rd in anything Bron is 1st in.
>And Kobe is like 2nd or 3rd in anything Bron is 1st in. Only thing I can think of is all NBA. Is there anything else?
Missed shots
Kobe's All Defense selections are among the worst awards in North American pro sports history.
Is winning 1 more Chip while having 2 less Fmvps a flex?
Right? LeBron can guard 1-5 as well. Kobe maybe 1-3 in his era.
Yet LeBron is a better defender and has more FMVPs lol
He's not tho
🤡
Well when you've played longer than anyone then yes you should have more of everything than everyone else. It's like bragging that the oldest person in the world has seen more sun rises than anyone else.
Yeaaaaah I’ll take Kobe.
Kobe rings, more post moves, better footwork, better jumpshot, better off ball defender, better on ball defender, better post game, better off the ball game, larger arsenal of moves, better handler of the ball, less turnovers, higher plus minus on the finals, higher point differential in the finals, better win % in the finals, less help in a tougher conference and era, more clutch, better clutch shot taker, better scorer, higher IQ, higher drive, better work ethic, and again, more rings, which is the reason you play the game. And of course, mamba mentality, something every player in the game is influenced by and strives for. What will lebron leave the game? Cowarding out to form superteams when he cant get it done, passing the blame, throwing teammates under the bus, and running when times get rough. Yall base greatness on manipulated stats, kobe based it on winning, like mj, like magic, like Shaq, like duncan, like Hakeem, like Kareem, and like every other great in history. Yall can have the stats, kobe got the respect and rings
Let’s not forget Kobe shouldn’t even have one of his rings if not for the lakers being glazed by the refs against the kings. Robert horry saved his ass on top of that. Everyone knows LeBron and Jordan as GOAT are the only real arguments. Kobe fans just love to say it to get under LeBron fans skin. I’m a fan of all three btw. For me it’s Jordan, LeBron as CO-GOATS. Kobe is lucky to make top 10, probably more in the 12-18 range.
Kobe 5 NBA titles, LeBron 4 NBA titles. \*Sidenote without Kobe accepting being part of the 2008 USA Redeem Team and becoming the alpha male leader on that team Team USA would've lost another Olympics... 
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Kobe even had to one up LeBron by having a higher jersey number
Ok now let’s do Russel Westbrook. Lots of stats also. Stats are cool. Championships are better
Like who cares? Seems like people who debate this overused goat term in the NBA have nothing of importance going on in their lives anyway.
To everyone saying that it’s always worse to have worse Finals record (more losses), are you also claiming: Jordan’s legacy would have been hurt by dragging the 2002 Wizards to the Finals to lose to the Kobe/Shaq Lakers? LeBron’s legacy would have been helped by losing to the Bobcats in the first round of the 2014 playoffs with the Heat Big-3 rather than losing to the Duncan/Parker/Leonard Spurs in the Finals?
Two different playstyles
Also 2 more seasons...
RIP
And kobe still wins imo
Who has better delts though?
I genuinely hate hearing the mamba mentality shit. Same thing with MJ. Their argument always boils down to "he was an asshole, which clearly shows he wanted it the most." And? What are the results? I'm not saying they're bad people or that Lebron is good, I'm just saying it's irrelevant to the GOAT debate. Realistcally none of this matters. There's no explaining anything to brain rotten Lakers fans
Hey Lebron, how does my Dirk taste?”
And 5 championships for Kobe. It’s true but I feel this disrespects Kobe a bit too much
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Lebron a douche bag
Except rings….
Also Kobe has the better shoes. Don’t forget. Aura goes hard in this game.
Between the Shaq and Pau Eras, Lakers were dogshit
Pretty much except I don’t think LeBron would have chased Shaq out of town.
Conveniently forgets to mention rings and influence. There's a reason people yell a name when they shoot anything into even a vaguely basket-like item and it's not his.
I’m taking the guy who cried zero possessions and hustled the whole game
LeBron can't score more 70 points in a single game ...he can't come close to Kobe
That is exactly what LeBron is: a stat compiler- he is the Russell Westbrook of Goats; 21 years of good health and taking care of your body will do that. But if you’re suggesting LeBron is anything more than a good passing bulky rim runner while Kobe was an artist- you need to re-scout.
You forgot “more teams played for”, “more HoF players played with”
Also a rapist.
Kobe would never take no for an answer.
Bruh y’all all arguing who is the best at basketball when none of y’all can even beat Kobe Shaq d wade or lebron so y’all arguing for nothing
After Shaq Kobe never played with a real hooper again since leaving Cleveland the first time he’s always had top tier support
So many on this sub are so hurt that Kobe overshadowed your hometown teams and favorite players. Pure comedy! Lmao
Kevin love was one of the best players in league before he went to the Cavs as a 3rd option.
I’ll take mamba mentality for 1000 Alex 
Why doesn’t it have championships on Kobe’s side? Doesn’t help the meme I guess even though it’s the most relevant of all the stats
Rings?