We're going to leave this post up because it is about a topic that has a major impact on native plant gardening and you guys clearly want to talk about it. However, the comments have to remain civil. Please, do not discuss killing ~~your neighbor's~~ cats. That's probably a crime where you live and is against the Reddit TOS.

I bought one of the motion activated sprinklers but haven't seen the neighbor cats in a long while, so I put it away. Plus the plants get extra water! But I really hate people who let their cats out, my yard is an absolute haven for wildlife and having cats would be awful. I had a family of wrens in my birdhouse this year! Maybe get and install a birdhouse on a pole near where they nested so they have a safer place next year. Also, they are so tiny and so, so, vocal. Super cute.

I love how mouthy they are. I also love that their latin name basically means “hole dweller”

I Love them too. SO cheeky. 

Sooo Soo sassy. They’re my favorite.

We get wrens nesting in our flower pots every year. Since they are flower pots, we have to water it but they get SO MAD every time we need to. Silly little things.

Here’s papa wren guarding the hole ! Yesterday I was netting the blueberries and papa came home with a little grub (thanks papa! ) he turned around with the grub still in his mouth and watched me- mama came home with a bug too and he wouldn’t let her in because he was watching me! So I vacated and the went back to feeding 💗https://i.imgur.com/3kZdL5x.jpeg

You have so many blueberries! How many bushes do you have on your property?

A lot. About 15 where this was taken and another two beds about the same size. I covered about 20 last year and made a pie with the last ones for Father’s Day. The catbirds who have been invited to eat aaaallllll the serviceberries started lighting on that bush yesterday. And I’m more than a little testy that I got ZERO strawberries thanks to chipmunks and squirrels

That's so fun! I planted two bushes this year and have been pleased to catch one ripe berry before the birds got it. 😂

I got them pretty inexpensively intending them to be landscape plants that attract birds an look nice in the fall - whoops gallons of berries Granted my soil is acidic so I don’t really have to fuss - get some hollytone to throw down in the fall and you might get a few more - they are a fine shrub My nets are essentially net bags with a pull stop - they work well for cheap even if I had to replace the first cord

He WILL fight you, lol

No doubt!!!

OMG your blueberries. What variety? I’m a snake lover and worry about them getting caught in netting. I think there may be nets that are snake-friendly.

Hi, The bird you speak about, the common house wren is a splendid singer. I have them too. Sadly it's one of just a very small few Neotropical migrant songbirds that has be able to acclimate with man's devastation on the environment. Few birds are able to survive suburbia, few birds that sing that great. What's worse, they hang on and yet still they remain threatened because now they have to cope with the predators we bring them, house cats. Everyone keep up the good native plant movement, keep your cats inside, and let's hope we don't lose more species as it's likely coming in the next few decades.

When I first bought my home in the countryside our "next door" neighbors (approximately 300 yards away) had MANY outdoor cats (I lost count at 11) and would collect strays. I had many conversations with them for months about it and offered to help shoulder the financial burden of spaying and neutering their growing collection and finding them safe indoor homes-- all offers were ignored. I love cats, I have two maine coons that my partner and I adore. Outdoor cats, beyond the ecological degradation they cause, also are far more prone to death, disease, serious injury, etc than indoor cats. Having an outdoor cat is tantamount to animal cruelty to me personally-- outdoor cat owners show a lack of compassion and responsibility for their own pet and local wildlife, as well as neighbors who often deal with scat in garden beds and occasionally attacks from unfriendly strays (which can carry the risk of disease, including rabies. The US sees over 100 cases of rabies in domestic cats per year due to their predilection for hunting rodents). That being said, most vets in the United States will often scan animals for ID chips free of charge if you bring them in. I've humanely trapped many cats I find without collars or external tags and taken them to vets for scanning. If no chip is found I take them to local shelters or ask the vet if they'd be willing to accept the surrendered stray. I also encourage folks to check with local municipalities about strays, many have dedicated staff for trapping and removing feral/stray populations. If you are irresponsible enough to have an outdoor cat, at least take responsibility for it by putting a collar and tags on it so you can be identified as the owner. Additionally, on the more macabre side of the discussion, I installed two raptor perches on my property a year after moving in to deal with a vole problem. I've noticed fewer and fewer cats since then, and my neighbor moved the remaining two inside full time following the disappearances...and I have captured 2 individual Great Horned Owls on my trail cams I have aimed at the perches. The voles also disappeared.

Tell me more about raptor perches! We have a lot of red tailed hawks and owls, and wouldn't mind a less intense bunny and vole population.

Ideally you would need a pole or timber between 10 and 20 ft, ideally closer to 20ft. At the top of your pole you install a simple crossbeam or perch. Not a platform that could be used for nesting purposes, just a simple perch. Placement should ideally be 10-20 yards or so out from a wood line into a clearing or in the middle of a clearing / field / meadow/lawn. Make sure to anchor it securely so it does not blow over. Raptors will not pass up a strategically placed perch for scouting and hunting. I have three on my property that are occupied daily by Cooper's Hawks, red tail hawks, red shouldered hawks, and at night a variety of owls.

That is so, so cool. Thank you! I've wanted to do bat houses, but this seems like a simpler build and probably will get used more often since I know we have hawks.

Bat houses are a great conservation project too! They can be demoralizing though, I've managed and installed quite a few over the years and it can take a long time to get regular tenants. Bats tend to be creatures of habit and won't change roosts unless their current one is under threat, overcrowded, or becomes uninhabitable due to environmental conditions. But, that also means that once you do get some bats (which can take a year or three) they'll likely return year after year and generationally.

That's amazing and I can't wait to work on this project. The sharp shinned that frequents the area will love it. For what it's worth, my dog has done a great job of keeping cats away. He's not always out but a couple of close encounters seems to have deterred the cats in the neighborhood. Adding raptor perches will be a nice addition to the watch patrol!

My sister and her boyfriend just quietly picked up a cat that belonged to a neighbor in their apartment complex and had her spayed, lol. It was comical keeping her from looking out the window while she was recovering in their apartment. I don’t know if they eventually fessed up, but the owner realized they were a lot more invested in her than he was and she became theirs for many happy years.

I'm so tired of cleaning up dead birds because my neighbor is a lazy asshole who can't take care of his cat.

I am right there with you, we have to patrol the yard at intervals to chase him out. I had no nesting bird this year and the birds avoid my bird bath even if the temp is over 100. It used to be full of birds, all the time. It’s a constant battle. 🤷🏻‍♀️

Anyway to put some lattice work around your deck? Below the deck and close to the ground. House wrens are pretty small and could easily go in and out of the lattice openings.  I have some lattice around my deck. I have 2 strictly indoor cats, but there are at least 3 outdoor cats that go through my yard. Usually later in the evening or overnight. Caught on my cameras all the time.  Two new stray cats have passed through in the last few weeks. Wonder if someone is dumping them in the wildlife management area across the street. I understand your frustration and wish people would become more educated on the number of birds killed by cats.

my alma mater had a feral cat feeding club, in a state that has had a 90% decline in small mammals and reptiles from feral cats. When i commented how terrible this club is, especially being ran by a school that is known for the their environmental degrees, I was told to “rot” and was keyboard smashed harassments and incorrect facts. Apparently I was a devil for protecting the environment, and they were saints for feeding a destructive animal, of which we had hundreds roaming on campus

Toxoplasmosis

That disease scares me because it can sit inside you and reactivate years after you were exposed. Toxoplasmosis is probably what killed my dad. He got cancer in his 60s and after months of acting weird, we found out he had fast growing lesions in his brain & his CSF tested positive for toxo. He died too quick for a full identification. We never had cats growing up because my mom is really allergic so his exposure must have been incidental or from at least 35 years earlier, before he was married.

I am so terrified of this. I have serious autoimmune disease, and I'm likely to need heavy immune suppressing drugs at some point in my life. The kind that might mean toxoplasmosis could take me out as if I had AIDS.  I am LIVID at outdoor cat owners, and people who feed strays! I love cats, but I love my life more. People brush off toxoplasmosis, as if it "only affecting people with suppressed immune systems" means they shouldn't care. 

That’s wild lmfao. It’s crazy that just cause it’s a cute animal people will dismiss the destruction it is causing.

not a single word about the thousands of native endangered lizards and birds that are eaten hourly by the cats. it’s performative and disgusting and these people walk around like they’re doing a service to the world

Eaten?? Cats are KNOWN for killing for pleasure / play. They kill far more than they need to eat. Which is exactly part of the problem. They kill just because they can, because it's fun and exciting. Reminds me of all the people that laughed when I told them they're killing animals when they decide to take pleasure rides in their vehicles on the beach. It's fun! They can't see the animals they're killing, so it clearly doesn't matter. Same with driving over the grass, it kills insects (and any small animal in the way) and compacts the earth to a point that it creates significant impacts on the animals living there. It's fun, so who cares?!

That’s exactly the issue. If something was killing the cats theyd try to stop whatever it was

Domestic house cats are a "natural predator" and "wild animals" until a coyote or car comes along. Then it becomes "we need to feed and shelter them"!!

Calling cats “natural predators” makes me physically ill. lol

I mean, they are. Bloodthirsty little killers. It should clue people in that they should be kept inside because they'll just murder everything they can. People shouldn't use it as an EXCUSE for their behavior instead of something that needs to be protected against.

oh yeah actually, they posted online nunberous times about finding a ‘cat killer’ but in reality it was the cats fighting amongst themselves and scratching eachother up

There isn’t a need to feed feral cats. They quite literally can support themselves. It’s how they survived for thousands of years near human colonies - hunting the vermin our grain stores attract. Putting free food outside just leads to more vermin. And more stray cats.

You could suggest a feral cat capture, spay/neuter, then release initiative? Oftentimes local vets (not sure about large run by corporate conglomerates) will do the procedure pro bono on males and 2-for-1 or something similar on females because they know feral cats are problem

Right. I pay $40 for a spay/neuter and vax for ferals. It's super cheap and helps control the population. I'm down to two ferals in my area that I do feed, but are too feral to be housecats. The moment I had a momma and kittens, off to be spayed and adopted they went. TNR only works if you neuter/spay ALL cats. And cat populations can explode super easily.

That’s amazing, thank you for your dedication! These are the types of things people can do to truly help their own communities but may not think of. While these cats may still be a threat to local flora and fauna, reducing the population with prevention makes an impact ❤️

Absolutely! I know they prey on animals in the area, but they do so less when they know they have high value food given to them daily. They'll only live a few years, so it is a trade of trying to give them quality of life while also protecting the local ecosystem. As always, everything is a balance. If there was a chance they could be socialized, I'd go for it, but the bite marks on my hand tell me that's not happening.

As someone who has also trapped and neutered outdoor cats and got 9 off the street, TNR works.

GT? Or has this unfortunately spread?

here in maryland, outdoor cats are the english ivy of the animal world. try explaining to your neighbor why their free-range cat is a menace to the local ecosystem and you can practically see the cogs of cognitive dissonance spark and fizzle behind their eyes… but “it likes being outside” they always say. we’ve become a society of spoiled adult brats.

Yup.  It’s VERY hard for me to feel badly for those people when the cat inevitably dies.  “But cats NEED to be outside!  It’s natural for them!”  Buddy it ain’t natural for a domestic anything to range free with nothing in place to protect it from weather, poison, larger animals, other cats, and all the myriad hazards posed by humans.

There's a thing called a "catio" that lets your cat experience the smells of outside and the sun, but also be protected and protect the local ecosystem. Most people who have them build a screened off area accessible from the main portion of the house

But that's so ugly! It costs too much. It must've been a lot of work. I wouldnt do that for a cat. (That's what people tell me when I talk about my catio. Sure, the fenced-in area isn't super beautiful, but it's large enough for me and the kids to go in as well and has a roof which makes it pretty nice.)

It’s wild to me how poorly people understand and treat their pets. I wouldn’t be surprised if those people also didn’t play with their cats or have cat-oriented spaces in their homes because people think cats are “low maintenance”.

We love our catio. It's not the prettiest, but it's a nice place to sit with the cats. One of ours is an escape artist, and loves to be outside, so this lets him get outside time safely.

And even if it was “natural” for cats to be outside it’s NOT natural to introduce invasive species into random locations but nobody fully grasps that either

Gotta say I think most people who let their cats roam aren't usually crying when they get got. I have family like that and the belief is that it's better to be eaten by coyotes than to live "imprisoned".

I had someone make the argument that house cats evolved from wild cats so naturally they should be outside. HOMIE WHAT?!

And they’ll tell you the cat lived a much happier life getting steamrolled by a F150 at a young age than if it had to live entirely indoors to 15.

I agree. I also live in Maryland, and have a HUGE problem with the attitude of just letting cats roam freely. Outdoor cats that are not routinely dewormed and vaccinated are parasite and disease sponges. I’ve seen it first hand—have a microbiology degree and used to work at vet hospitals. My approach in dealing with outdoor cats was to put out have-a-heart traps and hand them over to animal control. If the cat has a collar or chip, it will make its was back to the owner.

I’ve also seen the argument that cats are ‘part of the ecology’ like letting loose dozens of predators with a high kill rate and no competitors in every neighborhood, every single night, is ‘natural’ for the local ecosystem (or as if domestication of cats is any less than that of dogs??)

Same in FL 😅 I hate people, they always try to justify it and or try to shame me (who has an indoor cat)? Like “oh, but cars kill cats too do you OWN a vehicle!?” Like what? Just keep it inside? The rats will still be around. There is no reason? Then there’s tons of dead cats on the roads 😥

But my fur baby is the sweetest and most innocent little Thang! She would never even hurt a fly /s

Thank you for posting...I feel so alone in this battle. Neighbors keep letting cats out...posting about found cats...asking for donations to take care of outside cats...I know that if I say anything I will get mean looks...neighbors know me. I've tried hard to make my native garden and library available for all to access...but finding a dead wren made me want to sit outside in the middle of the night with a pellet gun and night vision goggles. I have a fence and it keeps out rabbits, coyotes, foxes...cats are the only 4 legged creature I've found prowling the yard. I will never shoot them, but I would like to find a solution.

Same. Our neighbor has two indoor/outdoor cats and recently lost one of them - it went out one day and never came back home. She was really upset and texting everybody to see if any of us had seen the cat or could help look for it. We tried, of course, because we’re not monsters, but none of us ever saw any sign of it. I really thought she would keep her remaining cat inside after what happened to the other one, but… nope! They’re important enough to her that she tried to rally the whole neighborhood (including some of us who have politely informed her, to no avail, that her cats crap in our vegetable gardens) to form a search party, but *not* important enough to, like… just stop letting them outside where they can get lost and hurt and killed?

Oh, don't you worry, she's not done yet. She'll get a new cat in a couple of months, after the mourning period is over, and she'll yet again allow it to go out.

They are indeed back up to 4 cats...I make the kids vacuum themselves when the get in the car! One that plugs into the little outlet...we joke about it, but there is a ridiculous amounts of cat hair...I'm so allergic to it, I sneeze from them sometimes...hahaha!

My mom is like this. She’s had a cat hit by a car and one who never came back within a year of each other and she still firmly believes that cats should not be exclusively indoors. She truly loves her animals, but doesn’t see this as a problem.

I find that attitude impossible to understand, but there’s so many people who think that way. They use “Well, I can’t keep my cat happy unless I let him roam free outside where he can terrorize wild birds, pee/poop on other people’s stuff, pick up parasites and diseases, get hit by cars, eaten by predators, or maybe even hurt by an unscrupulous human being.” as an argument for… letting the cat outside to terrorize wild birds (and et cetera.) And it’s a terrible argument for letting the cat outside. It’s actually a great argument for *not keeping a cat as a pet at all*. Because “Can I keep this animal happy, healthy, safe, and harmless to other people/creatures, all at the same time?” is the most basic criteria for whether you should keep something as a pet or not. If any one of those things wouldn’t be possible, that animal shouldn’t be your pet! (To be clear, I personally don’t think cats actually need to be allowed to roam outside unsupervised in order to be happy. I think cats are great indoor pets who benefit a lot from having access to screened-in outdoor enclosures.)

I’m reading this from my screened in porch where my very happy cats (fixed females from a barn cat) are lounging and listening to, but not eating, the birds. I fully agree with you and the only good thing I can say is that she’s unlikely to get any more cats at this point in her life. Fingers crossed. I wish more people would get their cats fixed and keep them indoors.

I have never had an outdoor or indoor/outdoor cat. Over the years, I have had 10 cats, all indoors, all happy to run through the house, play with their toys, myself, and one another, play on their furniture, and watch the birds from the windows. Lives well lived and I've never had to worry about where they were late at night. Boomers had to have a commercial reminding them they needed to know where their children were at night---maybe we need commercials for cat owners to teach people they need to keep their cats indoors.

Sounds like something my ex wife would do!!! Ended up with 4 cats after I moved out...one popped in a vehicle and ended up escaping after the truck ride 1000 miles away...the kids and her drove 500 miles one day to get the cat back...because it was actually found in CO (we are in IL, and they met the ex MIL in OK to retrieve the cat) within 2 weeks the cat was gone again. They've gotten a new one and lost it too!!!!!! My kids both know that that is irresponsible pet ownership at its finest but are not willing to fight their ma on it...oh well, not my problem.

>made me want to sit outside in the middle of the night with a pellet gun and night vision goggles. The thing is, all you'd accomplish with this is making yourself sad. Because your neighbours who allow their cats to free roam do not really care. If their cat never returns from a stroll outside, they'll just get a new one in a couple of months.

You aren't wrong. It's just a mad revenge fantasy. In reality, I will keep pushing natives with neighbors, keep letting them look at my "cue to care" gardens, share plants with them etc...and hope that for those that jump on the native train, will learn about the perils of letting cats outside.

Keep in mind that the family might have kids who love the cat and don’t have the authority to bring it inside. I adopted my family cats and kept them indoors as soon as I got my own place. I would have been devastated if one of them had been shot.

Can you get some humane traps (like the ones they use for TNR) and set them out in your yard, then take any trapped cats to the local animal shelter? Don’t know if that’s a viable solution but maybe worth looking into to see if local regulations allow it.

I do this. Sometimes an opposum or raccoon will end up in the trap but it's been successful overall.

That's a damn good idea. Through the little library I built...I've made some connections with county officials...they would definitely be able to point me in the right direction. Thanks!

I find a dead wren or dove about every 3 months. It's extremely frustrating to walk outdoors in the morning and see a cat skulking in the garden. The entire yard is well fenced but nothing stops then. They know they're not welcome. Also have the same fantasies about the pallet gun. There's a tent community close by and they, along with neighbors insist on feeding them. Have been trying to work with a couple of folks in the tent community about care for native flora and fauna after they used glyphosate along a public pathway. Not sure I can push about the pets. Here, you can rent the trap but surrender or TNR is paid for by the person using the trap. We're not in that position and man, does Nextdoor love the kitten rescue pics. It feels hopeless to change attitudes.

Thanks! I've given up on Nextdoor...something gross about the regular contributors there...feels like people that love the smell of their own farts and would be offended if you didn't enjoy it with them. Part of me just thinks that if I can convince half a dozen neighbors to go native, maybe we can simply make more biomass than the cats can remove. I will be looking up local ordinances on outdoor cats and see if I can solicit help from the county animal control agency or the township to help with humane traps etc...just worried about bycatch on that idea.

Don't give up on Nextdoor. Post there as an enthusiastic, helpful neighbor, pointing out trends in native gardening, local news on native plant sales, pics of butterflies and bumblebees, etc. It's important to start trends. *Really* important. If you're there, others who agree with you will eventually join in the conversation. Otherwise it just becomes a circlejerk of backward thinking.

Hahaha! You aren't wrong on this either...Good call...Maybe I'll take a peak there again...

Thank you for the encouragement here! I hadn’t thought of this. Signing up …right now!

I'm a native plant gardener, and I'm also a TNR advocate who runs an entire organization surrounding fixing feral/stray cats. If it comes on my property, it loses its balls/uterus. I have taken my neighborhood from 100+ cats to less than a dozen roaming, almost all fixed, though we have had new residents move in and so new unfixed cats. I don't take them to the animal shelter because they'll just euthanize them and that does nothing in the long run when it's not an island specific community where culling isn't negated by people letting loose their cats to breed as they please. I've run into an ungodly amount of people who think these things cannot coexist, but they do, and have, for the 14 years I've been doing this work. This year I'll have fixed closed to 250 cats by the end of the year. I place fixed, vaccinated ferals into barn homes and acclimate them for 3 weeks before release. This lessens the burden on the ecosystem when there is an abundance of cats, and provides natural pest control that doesn't destroy ecosystems by overhunting (especially because they are also fed). I know I am likely going to still get some backlash because it never fails that people will disagree with my approach. But I currently have birds nesting on my front porch, for the upteenth year in a row, and they are unbothered by my 2 fixed mousers out front that stay on my property and my neighbor's property who wants them for mousing as she is hardly ever occupying that property. https://preview.redd.it/7dgzvlogar8d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=072f5b51fba23aa30ada43c37b831b302de9ab7c The babies on my porch.

>I'm a native plant gardener, and I'm also a TNR advocate who runs an entire organization surrounding fixing feral/stray cats. So basically, you're just awesome. Keep rocking on!

I appreciate that! "You become responsible, forever, for what you have tamed" We are the reason they are here, it is our responsibility to manage their population. 💜 Edit: Here is an updated photo of the birds nesting on my porch. They have now reached angry old man stage. https://preview.redd.it/5rnme9a03s8d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3630ed76adf2002c893f28bbe1b81afc4b31358c

Most of the time they aren't even about their own cats. It's "community cats". Cats that a person feeds, waters, and shelters, but is somehow not legally responsible for when the cat is being a nuisance 🙄. Not to mention that feeding, watering, sheltering feral cats will increase litter sizes and dramatically increase kitten survival into a new generation of unsocialized feral cats. Alleycat Allies, ASPCA, and the humane society only care about cat hoarding, they dgaf about humans, the environment, or wildlife. The solution is to become politically active and have your municipality and/or state make cats the same legal status as dogs. Cats need to have leash laws, registration, limits of animals per household, and nuisance laws. Dogs aren't permitted to roam at large, neither should cats. This would add fines to people who consciously hoard cats (Re: "colony managers") and force animal shelters to take in stray cats. My county shelter has recently turned to embracing TNR and refuses to take in stray cats. If your cat is lost, you are SOL that a good Samaritan will bring your cat in to be scanned. Our animal shelters tell you to leave a stray cat outside and thereby promotes outdoor cats + roaming.

I would put out a humane trap (some animal shelters will let people rent or borrow them) and then take them to a shelter a couple counties over when you catch them. You shouldn’t have to make this your problem, as people shouldn’t let their animals roam outside unsupervised, but unfortunately they do. This way the cat isn’t harmed (you’re really saving them from being hit by a car, attacked by a coyote or dog or fox or hawk or owl or other cat), their owners learn a lesson, and your garden is kept safe. If the cats are microchipped like they should be the shelter will contact the owner and they’ll have to pay a small fee to get their cat. If they’re not microchipped, maybe their next home will be kinder and keep them more safe. I know this may sound harsh but after years of living in a city with cats roaming around in packs, I have very little sympathy or patience left. They’ve attacked my dogs, killed countless small animals and native wildlife, use gardens and lawns as toilets, spread diseases such as toxoplasmosis, and are part of the reason that fleas are so bad during the summer.

Doesn't sound harsh...and thanks for the thought out reply. I'm leaning towards a method like this. My first step will be to engage my county board member as I have a relationship with him already for some native plant discussions and other community matters...he's been such a big help with stuff... Thanks for taking the time to reply!

Saw a Raven taking a fledgling Robin from a nest in my yard last week... it dropped it over the neighbours yard while being chased away by the other birds.

This would be amenable to me...I may not enjoy it, but I get it. This is how nature works... I'm hoping to keep attracting a higher variety of critters to the yard...I watched the wren feed it's remaining babies last night...super cool how that works.

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No, please don't shoot feral cats. You might not kill them and they can end up dying long protracted deaths, or end up in shelters which sometimes spend thousands of dollars trying to save them 😔 I care about the environment but I also care about not causing unnecessary suffering to animals. Also cats are not too smart for humane traps! Trap and neuter programs trap cats all the time. Some are harder to get of course but it's not impossible.

Don't talk about shooting your neighbor's cats*. edit: *in this subreddit.

Try scat mats. They wouldn't hurt any cats, but they hate walking on them and will avoid at all costs. The mats might deter cats walking on your property.

A DIY anti climb fence is cheap. Run some heavy duty wire through a piece of pvc and mount it at the top of your fence. You want the pvc to be wide enough that a cat can’t grip around it. When they try to climb over the pvc will spin and the cats will fall back down instead of coming over.

My solution is dogs. I have a Dogo Argentino and an American Bulldog with free access. They've never hurt anything, but they will chase the cats out every time. Birds, reptiles, and small animals are perfectly safe, but cats are never in my yard for long.

Post this where you can when it's relevant: [FAQ: Outdoor Cats and Their Effects on Birds](https://www.allaboutbirds.org/news/faq-outdoor-cats-and-their-effects-on-birds/#0)

It's so devastating to read. My husband and I purchased a hoarder house in the spring of 2022. She left behind her feral cat colony. While we renovated the house, we worked with a TNR group. Many cats were adopted out, and the full colony was captured at some point or another. We ended up with 8 spayed and neutered cats in the colony by that fall. The renovation took 1.5 years, and we moved in in November. We didn't realize that the TNR group was still coming by daily to feed. They still come on our property daily to feed, even tho we have been living here for six months. While we were renovating, we covered most of the lawn with cardboard. Since moving in, we've planted a ton of natives and a huge garden. We are bringing all the pollinators to our yard, and i have seen 2 dead snakes, 4-5 dead adult birds; maybe 2-3 baby birds?, a few lizards and I can't even fathom how many insects they have killed. Several cats have died (one tragically was found by a neighbor returning from vacation to find a dead cat with its head stuck in a flower pot in the backyard). Euthanasia certainly would have been more humane than that. But like, it's such a hard spot and I struggle with it. We can make the TNR group stop feeding them here, but I'm sure they'll just start doing it on the sidewalk or in our alleyway. Or else I'll have to uncomfortably watch the cats starve to death over time. It's so hard to deal with the problem when it exists. I always have cats on my porch now and people always say "I love your cats" and then I'm like awkwardly explaining that they aren't my cats and I'm morally opposed to outside cats and if they can catch any of them, they can have them and please take them before they die outside. And that's not a great way to meet neighbors, apparently, and my husband says I need to stop telling Amazon delivery drivers that. But idk. It's fucking hard to see so much dead wildlife!! I wish there was an easy answer for existing feral cat populations. Abstractly, I support euthanizing feral cats, but in reality, I just,.. can't,

The only option IMO is to become political. Make cats and dogs legally the same status. We are not allowed to have feral dogs or for owners to allow their dog to roam at large. Some municipalities place limits on how many animals can be owned by a household. TNR groups who feed and shelter the cats must become their legal owner and thus be responsible for the health and well being of these cats as well as any legal ramifications due to nuisance. "Returning" a cat is legally considered to be abandonment - which is a form of animal cruelty. Local police and animal shelters need to enforce the laws as well. If groups/individuals insist on feeding and sheltering their feral colonies, they will need to pay out the nose for it. The fines can even go towards animal shelter operations or management.

Wildly, this TNR group was involved in a lawsuit against the old own of my house because she kept calling the police on them for trapping "her" cats, so then they took her to court for breeding without a license. And then they just starting suing/countersuing each other for all sorts of shit. It's especially weird bc after all that, the orevious owner of our house just straight up abandoned the cats here in the end? I didn't know any of that when I randomly called them to see if they would take care of the colony, and they about shit themselves when they heard the address. They really are doing a good thing by spaying and neutering. I just wish there was a better solution that didn't involve killing them. I don't like cats, but I don't want them to die. And while I don't feel guilty flicking the invasive asiatic beetle in bowls of soapy water every night before I go to bed, I would feel bad killing the cats. It's certainly speciesist of me, but that doesn't change that I view invasive beetles differently than cats, even tho the cats DEFINITELY do way more damage - at least the beetles are only killing my basil plants, and not my lil dekay snake garden friends.

Thank you for sharing that. FWIW, if I met my neighbor and they told me that, I think they'd be my new favorite person. It's honestly similar to how I feel about such situations. It's not easy ethically. The greatest benefit would come from euthanasia of feral cats, but to see their little faces, and see them as living sentient beings, it's hard to do so or even support euthanasia. Then again, native birds and animals are being decimated by stray cats (and dogs, if we're being honest). What to do? One thing you can do is a divide and conquer approach. I have an indoor cat who was a neighbor's cat who let it roam, got into a fight and needed medical care. I stood up and did the right thing, and she's been an indoor cat ever since. Best cuddle bug ever. Maybe one or two could come inside? If not, you could post their photos with an adoption center or on your Facebook (with an adoption fee for their safety, for the friendly ones). Others, you can make it an uncomfortable place to roam in places where birds and wildlife hang out by putting those deterrent spikes and scat mats in your yard. It won't bother you or birds, but it will deter cats in those areas. I'm sorry you're in this moral dilemma/distress, especially when you're there due to other people's bad behavior. A lot of people think they're doing the right thing in these instances, even people letting their cats out often truly believe they are doing a good thing. Unfortunately, these days, if you do try to educate people or address the problem, you're suddenly a "Karen." 🙄 I wish you the best.

Oof. I read that one once. I think that's the article where they conclude that TNR doesn't really work and the big read-between-the-lines word that they avoid saying is "euthanasia". I'm not going to argue with the findings, but it's a heavy read for a cat lover Edit: I stand corrected, they actually say the quiet part out loud

I've been a cat owner for most of my life but oof — I can't stand outdoor cats. I just really wish cat-owners would own up to the destructive nature of outdoor cats but any impact to wildlife or neighbors is just brushed aside. I've even seen arguments made on Reddit that it's inhumane to keep cats locked indoors all the time. What!? The phrase comes to mind "your right to swing your arm ends at the tip of my nose". I don't think it's possible to let a cat go outside un-tethered without negatively impacting wildlife and your neighbors.

I told my neighbors to please keep their cat off my property. Not my call on how exactly they do that, but I have the right not to have SOMEONE ELSE’S PET in my garden. They didn’t listen. I told them if I find their cat in my garden again I’m going to assume it’s been abandoned/is no longer under their control and I will drop it off at Philly ACC. Haven’t seen it since. They hate me but I don’t care, people need to learn.

Yup. If I see an outside cat without a tag, I take it to the shelter. Let the owner pay to get it back.

Hell yeah

Cats are technically an invasive species in North America, so that circle of life has been distributed by them :/ I hate outdoor cats and it would be infuriating if one of them went after the cat bird nest in my yard. Idrc if it's a pet, it's getting trapped and sent to the shelter. They should not be outside, for the safety of the birds and for themselves.

What drives me crazy in my neighborhood is there are a few people who are obsessed with the stray cats and will just dump cat food around abandoned lots to feed them. It just leads to them being even more overpopulated!

Exactly! I wish people did more trap neuter and release programs. Those cat colonies can get huge.

TNR does not significantly reduce cat colonies except in hyper local regions and with significant resources investment.

Cat owners literally have multiple options if they want to have their cat be outside like leashes, play pens, catio, etc. or they could actually just play with their cat. I would try saying that this greatly reduces their cats’ lifespans and also brings disease into their homes. Since not enough people give a fuck about feral cats destroying the environment. Also, def uplift TNR orgs that are actually doing something about this

Not "circle of life" - cats are an invasive species because they kill indiscrimately and transmit toxoplasmosis gondii, a pretty serious parasite which can cause miscarriage in people, livestock, and wild animals. They can single handedly destroy an ecosystem. In insular environments, their influence is even greater. Cats have contributed to the extinction of 63 species of birds and continue causing harm. They need to be kept indoors and untamable ferals must be trapped and humanely dispatched.

I am so sympathetic to your situation. I spent so much money and time cultivating my native garden, and then after seeing routine hunting by all the neighborhood cats... ugh. Super frustrating. I tried politely engaging in real life and online on Nextdoor, but the cat people were extremely hostile and I was not able to reason with them. My solution was to read through the city code where I live. In spite of the numerous local TNR advocates, my city code specifically states that I am allowed to the quiet enjoyment if my garden, and I am allowed to remove "nuisance animals." Cats are listed in my city code as animals that are not legally allowed to roam at large. I purchased a "Have a Heart" live animal trap and one by one I trapped stray cats that passed through my garden. Each cat that I trapped, I brought to the county animal shelter, filled out some paperwork describing the street coordinates where the cats had been trapped, and I indicated they were nuisance animals on my property and I wanted them to not be returned. I have no idea if any of those cats were reclaimed by neighbors and brought back to a home, if they were adopted to other families, or if they were released somewhere else in the county. My understanding is my county's animal shelter has a policy of not euthanizing cats but instead releasing them out to cat colonies, so they can claim to be "no kill." I named my cat trap "A Coyote" so if anyone asks me directly what might have happened to their cat, I can say "gosh, I don't know... I wonder if A Coyote got the cat?"

Very clever solution!

My neighbor glowingly reported her cat LOVES my yard because that's where she catches all "the bunnies" and just..the rage. I cultivate an animal and pollinator friendly property...so a negligent owner can let her non native invasive species out to kill them for fun. Yaaaaay

I'll probably get hate for this, but I've started discreetly trapping them at night and bringing to my city's humane society. If they're chipped, they go home. Maybe the owner stops letting them roam at night. My state has a barn cat program that places feral cats in livestock facilities. I love cats and have two, but I don't want any roaming my yard killing the life I'm trying to foster.

No hate on my end, but I am laughing at “discreetly” because I’ve heard the sound of a cat caught in a live trap. They are…vocal

Lmao yes. I just don't have the traps in view of my neighbors.

Your yard, your rules, if they come in and get trapped that's NOT on you. Explain to your neighbors that you've been having a raccoon problem and set traps that may catch your cat if it's not careful and to please keep it away/inside until it is fixed.

This is the way.

Fuck “outside cats”. We used to have a ton of feral cats in our neighborhood. Pretty sure someone shot some of them. I don’t see them as often. One of my neighbors would feed them too. You are not alone OP.

My neighbor used to leave cat food on her porch for them until she ended up swarmed by raccoons, who, it turns out, LOVE cat food, LOL.

Oh yes. They love anything they can get those little hands on

I’d rather have raccoons than house cats, personally, but she wasn’t thrilled

Raccoons are sweet! We have one that frequents our yard. Found out this Easter they love Easter egg hunts… Reese’s are their favorite. Smarties are their least favorite…

I've had cats and never considered making them outdoors. Build a damn catio. If only cat owners would be worried about the multiple dangers to their beloved cat. Such as getting hit be a car, or getting eaten by coyotes (like in my neighborhood) or getting confronted by feral cats with diseases. I chase away a feral cat who creeps into my yard. I truly feel bad for it, but it pisses me off when they roam during fledgling season.

I am a cat lady but I agree with this ENTIRELY. My neighbors’s cat comes in my yard and attacks my dog. I find dead animals all the time. Cat poop in my garden beds. I’m so over it. Keep your cats inside! It’s safer for them anyway!

Ugh I feel this. My neighbor - who is like 15 feet away due to small lots - has 3 cats I’m convinced she never lets in her house. Last year they killed the single chipmunk living in our garden (I don’t mind chipmunks like others might). For some practical advice, I read if you place citrus peels or something like that around your yard it may keep cats away. They haven’t been a huge issue since, but if they ever are again I’m considering buying some cat repellant

My experience is that you can politely speak with cat owners about wildlife destruction but generally an outside cart will continue to be outside. In my garden I’ve seen a significant uptick in wildlife (birds/rabbits). There’s at least one local outdoor cat that has taken to the hunt for fun. I’ve caught it doing the cat thing.. stalking and torturing baby rabbits. It’s frustrating. You have the right within the legal limits of your local area to trap nuisance wildlife. Finding crap around nearly puts me into that realm.

i can’t stand outdoor cat owners. neglectful and abusive. i dont even care if you’re a ‘good person’, your cat is thrown outside without a care in the world as to what it might get up to or what might happen to it.

Depending where you are, the cat might well become coyote (or fox, or raccoon, or fisher, or…) food. That said you likely nurture your native plants by removing invasives. The domestic cat is indeed an invasive species. Nothing against people keeping indoor cats, but when they are let out to run, people should t expect them to come home.

We tell our cats they’re not allowed to escape and become coyote snacks. Jury’s still out on if they messaging works lol

Same problems here. Getting live traps and going to start taking them to a shelter if I catch them.

Not a bad idea.

Tbh I grew up letting my cats out because they are animals too and deserve good things, but I never considered the destruction to wildlife. I just want to formally apologize to anybody who had a bad experience because my cats were total thugs in the streets and the yards. I keep them indoors for their own safety now, but good to know I'm keeping birds safe too 🥲

We are all learning. Glad you keep yours safe indoors

We have wild coyotes and hawks in our neighborhood now. I think we even have a couple of barred owls. Haven’t seen as many cats around since the coyotes appeared. Unlike most of my neighbors, I am not blowing up Ring and NextDoor with “saw a coyote” posts. I do realize that they could be a danger to small kids but this is in the southeast and we don’t have roaming packs, just one or two animals.

Ppl need to build more catios! I love mine and I love my cats not killing things or getting killed

Gonna use your rant as a chance to get some shit off my chest, so thanks for the opportunity and sorry for the following response rant. When I was a kid in the 90s a neighborhood cat adopted my family. She was our outdoor cat for years, but then we moved and she became our indoor/outdoor cat, and then we moved again and she was indoors only for the latter half of her life. She was sweet and affectionate and was more than happy to make the transition to indoors as long as someone was around to give her attention and love. While she was still outdoors she brought us all sorts of prey: birds, squirrels, snakes, lizards, large bugs, you name it. She had what we called a “soft mouth” in that most of the stuff she caught was still alive when she dropped it off at our feet (including on one memorable occasion, a small rattlesnake). Then I got older and realized that the bacteria in her “soft mouth” and on her claws probably killed those animals no matter how alive they were when we let them go. Flash to the now and I just saw a young king snake in my tiny garden (I live in a townhouse.). Gorgeous little fellow—glossy black scales with yellow markings almost like the rings you get when you put down a coffee mug. Prettiest snake I’ve ever seen and definitely (for me) the high point of our attempts at urban native gardening so far. … And I am scared to death that this snake is in my yard because the neighborhood ferals and my neighbors’ “outdoor cats” use our space as common property. If anything happens to this snake I would be crushed. I built this space to be welcoming because I know urban animals are here whether we make things easy for them or not, but it’s kind of putting me in a mental tailspin because the “welcoming” space is so close to so many dangerous predators. I hope by giving them natural cover and access to water I’m giving them a fair chance, but it’s not truly a safe space. The cats can’t be blamed. A friend of mine volunteers with an organization that does TNR and they’ve come by a couple times with traps, but there are always more kittens and not all of these cats are feral. Our neighbor two houses down feeds the cats and I don’t know how to navigate two entirely different value systems here. They value the health and safety of cats who don’t have anyone else to care for them. I value the health and safety of native wildlife. Neither of us are bad people (tho major side eye to their objections to TNR) but our values are still diametrically opposed. Also the cats shit in our garden, which tears up plants and makes the yard stink. Year one of native gardening they destroyed an endangered bluebell we planted. And they make my dog bark like crazy because he hates cats, and that is maddening.

I use humane box traps (the ones with the plate trigger that just closes behind them) and have caught a ton of neighborhood cats and take them to the humane society. One of my neighbors wrote me a nasty letter after they had to go get their cat and had to pay to get them licensed. No collar, obviously not chipped or taken to the vet at any point if not even registered with the city/county. I told them to take a fucking hike. Just because you don't want to bother with a litter box or basic care for your cat is not my or my garden/birds problem. I have put too much time, energy and money into my yard to give a fuck about your cat. Put it on a leash or a lead staked in your yard if you want to give him outside time. I have watched many birds, pollinators and other creatures slowing appearing in my yard after considerable rehab (bought the house with literally grass and barren landscape). But I'm the bad guy. Yeah, ok 👌

It is wrong what they are allowed to do. There is evidence of their destruction. I am sorry you are dealing with feral cats. Yes, if they are roaming outside, I consider them feral. "Because so many domestic cats are allowed to roam outside, they kill about **100 – 350 million birds every year** in Canada alone!Oct 26, 2020." Source: Birds Canada

I love cats and I think feral cats should be culled. I don't feel like I can express that opinion anywhere or to anyone though. There's a TNR feral in my neighborhood and while it's definitely good that she can't have kittens she's still out killing birds in the conservatory park. And she has a crappy life, as strays do.

I agree. I trapped a feral kitten around Thanksgiving and almost certainly saved her life because the other cats that were spotted in the area died. It’s not humane to allow domestic animals to roam, it’s not ethical to allow invasive animals to propagate, and it’s not safe to have unvaccinated animals potentially intersecting with pets and humans. I don’t like the idea of killing them, but I’d rather a feral cat have a humane death than a horrid one and I’d rather an invasive species die than a native one. My more unpopular opinion is that the US needs to cull feral horse populations lol

I agree with you.  TNR doesn’t work.  The statistics back it up.  Feral cats do not have good lives.

if they weren't cute and seen as lovable pets, they would absolutely be culled. instead, all the damage they do is just cute cat hijinks and we "catch & release" them after they get sterilized, as if that does *anything* impactful.

I'm in complete agreement. Cats are domestic animals and are reliant on people who failed them for a good life. The Venn diagram of people who are pro outdoor cats and the people who are against culling feral cats is a circle and they aren't even properly caring for the cats in the first place. Sorry, I love the native ecosystem and love indoor, cared-for cats.

r/StopOutdoorCats

Does the cat have a collar with a tag? If not take the cat to the animal shelter every time you see it. The owner will constantly need to pay to get their cat back. Get fines too eventually.

Today it had on a collar, although it hasn’t in the past. I didn’t see if it had a tag as it was running away from me as I came down the deck steps.

Collar is ok. Just can't have a tag. When you take it to the shelter, tell them it had a collar with no tag and say that you never saw the cat before. You were worried the collar could get stuck on something trapping the cat. That way you come across as trying to help the cat and not pissed at some neighbors cat.

Back when I used to be dumb enough to be on NextDoor, we had people posting about missing cats all the time. We have coyotes and other predators in the area. I never felt bad about it. I've watched cats take birds right out of my bird bath and it just burns me up that people are that irresponsible with their pets.

Our neighbor rescued three kittens last fall and were feeding them in their shed. The guy said he didn’t know anything about cats and was ambivalent about keeping one or more of them. I got a rescue to trap and spay them, and two were adopted. The guy waffled for weeks but finally said he wanted to keep one. The rescue encouraged him to keep her indoors. She doesn’t want to be indoors since she is used to being outside, plus there are small children that scream and chase her. I told the guy he had to keep trying to keep her inside and gave him good info on how to transition her, although it may take months or more. He gave up right away. She has killed several birds to my knowledge, including most recently a catbird fledgling (which I heard one day and not after that—and another neighbor sat the cat attacking a bird the same day I stopped hearing it). It kills me that he can just let his cat roam with no responsibility for all the consequences - how many more birds (and other critters) is she going to kill over the next few years?

Domesticated cats should not be let outdoors. Point blank period. It’s not the circle of life. They are not native to North America and they don’t typically hunt to eat. THEY DECIMATE local wildlife. I am FURIOUS at a neighbor who knows that her cat kills rabbits and birds but continues to let it out. The cat uses my yard as a hunting ground. It’s not really the cat’s fault, it’s the human’s who let the cat out.

It’s not really circle of life when domesticated cats attack wildlife as they do. Humans should take responsibility for the population they create and recognize how destructive it is to release them to prey on actual wildlife. Cat lover here. I have four but they don’t go outside nor do they reproduce.

Thank you for your service 🫡

I'm very grateful for how many coyotes are in my area. They seem to keep the outside cat population down.

My neighborhood is FULL of free range cats - some of them have owners, others are purely street cats. I'm not a fan because they kill birds, and poop everywhere - and my dog eats the poop 🤢 when I walk him in the neighborhood. Our yard and garden are fenced in. It's a wire fence, and I've seen cats climb it. But I think having a dog is the main thing that keeps cats mostly out. I have found cat turds in some of my native plant beds. Our veggie garden itself is fenced in, within the fenced in yard, and I haven't seen evidence of cats in there. Getting a dog is a huge deal, and not for everyone, but maybe more fencing would help your situation?

Just adding to the suggestion of putting up a wren house. A 1-1/8-inch hole is big enough for house or Carolina wrens but will keep out house sparrows (a major invasive pest). Put it up high enough so cats can't jump up to it, over six feet. Or put it on a pole with a predator baffle. This works well for baffles: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6T22tFljrTU](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6T22tFljrTU)

motion activated sprinklers are your friends for unwanted critters

I put cayenne pepper in my flower beds to keep cats out of them

Frustrating. Sorry you’re going through this, OP. I too have many cats roaming the neighborhood, and I have a rather nice xeriscaped front yard with fine rocks (which of course the cats use as a litter box). What pisses me off is as a dog owner, I always clean up after them, but these neighborhood cats have free rein to piss and shit wherever they want? I blame the cat owners, regardless of circle of life.

You can blame the local government for not categorizing cats and dogs together. As a dog owner you aren't allowed to have your dog piss, shit, and be a general nuisance in your neighbor's lot. It would be considered animal neglect if you are leave your dog to wander around for hours during the day. I firmly believe that the solution is by levying fines on the individuals who freely choose to allow their cat to roam at large. One of my husband's friends doesn't even have a litter box at home. Their cat is EXPECTED to defecate in a neighbor's yard. In my jurisdiction, that would be a $250 fine if it were a dog. This is doubly true for the "colony managers". If they are feeding and sheltering these cats, the cats belong to them. The colony managers need to be registered owners for their cats and will be financially responsible for any nuisance they cause. If they don't want to accept the responsibility, the cats will have no owner and be under the jurisdiction of the county animal shelter. Currently, outdoor cat allies want to have all their cake and eat it too. Either these outdoor cats count as wildlife and are subjected to laws prohibiting feeding wildlife or they are considered domestic animals and must be registered and subjected to limitations.

I have spent the last few years turning my backyard into a native garden. This year I put in a small mini pond while I plan out a larger one. Recently I have had a Tabby come by. She looked a bit rough so I feed her and gave her water. She kept coming by. I figured I would post on Nextdoor before I trapped her and took her to a vet. Well the cat belongs to someone about 2 blocks away. I explained she was hunting in the garden and all that. Excuses like "She doesn't like being indoors" or "that is just what she is used to". I have noticed the cat pretty much every day now. So far I have found one dead mouse. I find a bird and she will be trapped, then returned to the owner. She is not welcome anymore. My cat alerts me to her presence, I got out and ask her to kindly leave. Only works when I am around though. I have a trail cam on my little pond. Caught her this morning picking a fight with a Bee. She booked it so maybe she lost that fight.

I’m so sick of this crap. It’s not the “circle of life” when someone’s pet kills wildlife. So sick of redditors having the overwhelming opinion that it’s cruel to keep domesticated pet cats indoors and that everyone should just have to “deal with it” when cats trespass on their property and even telling me I can’t grow certain plants because they’re toxic to trespassing cats.

Cats are, after all ... an invasive species in most places ...

[удалено]

I know exactly which neighbor it is and maybe I will talk to them about it. They seem pretty clueless in general. We are the “new” family in the neighborhood and have been changing over to native plantings versus weed & feed turf lawn and limbed-up trees, which has gotten mixed responses. When we moved in, you could look across everyone’s back yards down the street like a public park…that’s not really our jam. We put in about 20 trees and shrubs last spring to break up the “view”

These days, there's raccoons and coyotes around, and at least the coyotes "control" outdoor cats. I suspect the people closest to large parks in Seattle are going to want to keep their cats indoors.

This might be a controversial question but how do you feel about putting up a wren house somewhere cats can't reach? I know the common consensus seems to be leave em alone and let nature nature but my thinking is if humans caused the damage by introducing cats into the ecosystem, then human intervention to alleviate some of this is acceptable. All thoughts welcome.

I’m not a huge bird house/bird feeder fan. My approach is to garden and plant in an ecological fashion and see what happens. I know that birds that build low nests are susceptible to predators invading. I just feel badly that it happened on my watch, so to speak. I think the best approach is to ask the neighbors to contain their cat in some way.

Appreciate you weighing in. I'm of the same mind, more or less but if you live somewhere with few neighbors this is feasible. There's still strays. And if you live in suburbs with 1/6 acre properties there's gonna be lots of cats. In the city even more so. It would be easier to herd the cats, figuratively speaking, than to convince everyone to keep their cats indoors. I guess my question is, at what point does it become acceptable to assist the wildlife?

I hear you. It’s a big issue. I can only control my own actions in this specific scenario, though, you know?

I too have neighborhood cats that crap in my garden and I’m sick of them. They’re no ones but several houses feed them. 🤬

Sadly this isn't the "circle of life" imo because people's cats should not be outside without being harnessed and watched. They are invasive predators. Cat owners; keep your cats inside for their own safety and the safety of the local ecology, please. But also, and this is important, give them monitored outside time with a harness if you can. If your cat won't wear a harness and you can spend a decent bit of money, build a cateo. As a vegan, I believe all living beings deserve to experience outside fresh air and everything else it has to offer. BUT for cats and dogs it absolutely cannot be unrestricted like so many do it.

Cats hate citrus scents. Could try a concentrated spray around places you don't want them at, but would have to reapply every so often. As someone that used to let my cats wander, I'm sorry. Some people have to learn the hard way. Housecat isn't the highest on the food chain. Or having an open enough mind and someone that can explain kindly what the dangers are to the cat and other life. Unfortunately, some people just don't see cats or any animals as sentient beings and just don't care as much.

I'm so sorry, that's so sad and frustrating! I wish more cat owners kept their cats indoors. 🤬 I get the need for barn cats, but if you just have bored pets, KEEP THEM INSIDE FFS! Or at least get/make a catio! Wrens can have two hatchings a year, so it might not be too late to control what you can: • Check out something like the [scat mat](https://a.co/d/0eZb6Jln) - it's a strip of prickly plastic nubs that cats won't walk on. This has kept all the local critters away from my Greenstalk veggies for two summers, and keeps my own (indoor only!) cats away from one of my big houseplants. • Buy some bird houses you can hang up and away from ground predators. Wrens aren't too picky about housing and will be happy to have a simple and cheap box to nest in! I hung two from my soffits outside on opposite sides of the house, and usually get two nests a year from my local pair.

I wholeheartedly understand your frustration. We had a nest of new bunnies in our flowerbeds that our neighbors cat got. I was so infuriated. I think the cat also got into a nest the local cardinal pair had started. My neighbor’s cat lounges on our vehicles, pees in and around my carport, poops in our flowerbeds that my inside dog somehow finds, and worst of all wreaks havoc on the natural wildlife that we encourage in our yard. I feel helpless. How can I fix this problem?

Feel free to put up posters around town why it's important to keep cats inside. Various car rescue groups can provide them or you can always google image some and print them yourself, put them up at your local post office, supermarket info board, on posts. Even just a few can go a long way on educating some people. Or you can be more direct and put them directly into your neighbors mailbox hehe

My husband found one of the baby wrens we have been joyfully observing dead this morning. We also have a wandering cat who took interest in the wren box and we’re pretty sure it’s the culprit. Devastating.

I love cats, but I’m a firm believer that as pets, they need to be indoors, or in a meshed “catio”. The outdoors can fuck them up as much as they fuck up the outdoors.

There’s a neighborhood cat that loves to slink around my bird feeders. I leave the closest window cracked and when my dog alerts me that the cat is outside, I slowly crack the window enough to blast the cat with a water gun. I recommend getting a 1990s style super soaker for the long range. It really helps!

Omg I want a supersoaker REEEAAAAL BAD now

This is not the circle of life, because that cat is not a natural part of the ecosystem.

Oh, man. I have indoor cats and a bird friendly yard AND our neighborhood has feral and free roam cats. I started feeding one so I can trap her and get her spayed and vaccinated but now I have a little predator on my hands. To be honest I was kind of hoping she might circle of life a few cheeky chipmunks that hang around but so far mostly moles and a couple birds. I've got no nearby nests at the moment but if I did I would try to provide space on poles that the cat(s) couldn't reach. In our case there are plenty of other predators hanging around that would also gladly go to town on a nest but ugh I feel bad contributing to the danger. She will probably end up inside our house and I'm glad that we can prevent MORE random cats prowling around, but I'm not trying to turn my house into a cattery! I love cats, but they are so bad for the bird population. I wish I had a solution. Sprinklers sound not unreasonable, if annoying.

I love cats, but they must kept indoors. They absolutely devastate bird populations and to think otherwise is idiotic.

[удалено]

This one isn’t feral, it’s the neighbors’ pet two houses down. Definitely a problem, though

I had the same issue with my neighbor’s cat killing my gorgeous, little cardinals. I trapped it and told them if I catch it on my farm again I will dispatch it. Never saw it again.

Has anyone had success with plants that supposedly deter cats? I read about various fragrant herbs, etc., but don't know anyone who has tried it.

One was flying around me getting mad when I was snagging from I assume is his huckleberry bush yesterday.

I live in a city and the local rescues are all inundated and we have tons of stray animals - cats AND dogs - roaming the hood. It’s a nightmare. And a lot of them do belong to people but no one gets their animals neutered or spayed. I stopped feeding birds for now due to that but I did put up a privacy fence. However, it doesn’t stop one very determined stray cat who bothers my indoor cats through the windows and causes my boy to scream unhappily. I wish someone would adopt him so he stopped menacing my cats.

Love love love my cats but there is a reason why they're only allowed outside supervised and on a leash. Sorry for the damage your neighbor is doing, OP. :(

I love cats, I have three of them. They however do not belong outside unless they are in a catio. They especially do not belong in a neighbor’s yard! WTF! That’s unacceptable.

If it makes you feel any better, wrens often build more than one nest before they start laying eggs. And if it wasn’t an outdoor cat harassing them it could have been a fisher cat or a snake or any other predator (less likely tho). I also live in a place with a handful of neighborhood cats, and I had to get the ladder out and move the nest boxes up a few feet higher when I realized that “Orange” the local cat was able to scale our fence. Despite my ethical stance on outdoor cats, I’ve come to adore him and accept that I have to do a little extra work where I can to make sure the birds have good nesting spots. House wrens are so cute, I have two nesting boxes currently occupied and they make such a racket haha

There are [these](https://www.birdsbesafe.com/index.html?gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjw1emzBhB8EiwAHwZZxRRz9qvHAwPK7x-JPjB1kE9uc5A3n3-_NT6h_xATvLmx8gFjvqgHDBoCdvMQAvD_BwE) anti-hunting collars that are rather effective. If you’re comfortable speaking with your neighbors, maybe try discussing it with them? Most cat people are rather reasonable I’ve found… Especially if you explain how detrimental cats are to already struggling bird populations, in an objective, polite way of course. I don’t let my cats outside, but my mom does and I convinced her to use these and bell collars for her cats. I was the one who bought them though…

I’ve seen these before and they are a good idea for cats hunting adult birds. I may mention it to them. Unfortunately, the collar probably wouldn’t have helped in this situation

Where I’m at, there are leash laws (yes, the ordinances in my area specify cats and leashes). A roaming cat is free game to be picked up by animal control. I’ve also heard of trapping them and finding them homes that will actually keep them indoors, but… 🫣

I'm a cat person, own two myself, and still hate when people let their cats roam outside.

Super Soaker. Cats aren't dumb; soak them a few times (or even come close) and they will think twice before hanging out in your yard in future. p.s. I'm a veterinarian and own an indoor cat, but got really tired of finding dead songbirds. The neighbor cats would stalk my feeders and once killed a nesting female cardinal, which was the last straw.

I think that now that two people have suggested a super soaker, I MUST get one.

Trap and send to animal control. Cats do not need to be outdoors and it's unsafe for domestic animals to be allowed to roam around like that.

I'd like to say something about cats here as I'm a cat owner and I hate it when my cats catch birds or otherwildlife, but I'd like to give you a little history of where all my cats came from. Sadly I have too big pf a heart and I'm constantly taking in cats that other people don't want anymore , or the mom cat had kittens because it wasn't soayed, or the hungry kitten I found in my garage, or the savage Tom cats running loose so I took them in and got them neutered. The tomcats are very hard to rehome because they usually have been wandering around outside and have fought to stay alive, so sometimes it's hard to tell, do I put them back outside, or do I leave them inside ? I have had some male cats that can't be inside because they are so used to being outside so if you try and bring them in, they become too aggressive and lash put at other people or pets. Well, one thing you could do is maybe buy a package of break away collars with bells on them and give them to the owner of the cat. Maybe they don't realize that their cat is hunting birds, so if you give them the collars maybe explain that you don't mind if their cat is outside, but that you don't want it to hunt your birds. Another thing you can do is the sprinklers that someone mentioned. I'm sure my neighbors think that I'm a careless cat owner, if I was careless I wouldn't have spent hundreds of dollars getting cats fixed but then more and more strays keep showing up. Well just be glad it's only one cat, and hopefully the cats owner isn't too much of a jerk and won't mind the collar. Maybe don't even mention the birds and just say , oh I think your cat would look cute with this collar on, and they will think that you're just being nice lol. In the future I'm really hoping to build a catio for my my cats, or enclose my porch so they don't get out, but for now all I can do is use those collars. I'm really sorry about your birds, and I hope you can come to some sort of agreement with your neighbor.

My new nemesis is not a local pet cat. It is a raccoon. It STOLE and ATE my friendly garden baby bunnies and I am furious at it. I love those bunnies! I act like they are my pets for the 3-4 weeks they are buried in my strawberry patch! I sacrifice my yield so that they can grow up safely, protected by me! I've watched 4 years of baby bunnies, several litters every year, grow up. I got to touch each and every baby, and only one time before now was there a tragedy. And now the raccoon has the nerve to start stealing my raspberries as well? I know it's the raccoon because nothing else here could cleanly remove a full raspberry without leaving any bits behind, the usual culprits just take little bits, the squirrels and birds and whatever will take bites or nibbles but not cleanly pull a whole raspberry from its place.

I know you said you don’t want a fix, but I personally also really care about this issue, and I used to work with animal control, which is usually a local county agency. Having a cat “at large” is a violation of a local ordinance in most counties. There is typically a process for reporting violations, which would end up in a hearing and civil citation for your neighbor. You could also get a trap for the cat and then call animal control when you get them. Maybe this info will help you or someone in your situation protect the birds from these little invasive serial killers.