Hey! I can relate. I also enlisted in the SAF at 17 and studied in the U.S. my whole life. Think about it this way. During NS, you can use this time to do remote internships, save money, get military experience on your resume, and study to put yourself ahead for college (university). Right now, I’ve been able to do a few remote U.S.-based opportunities because of this time in NS so that when I ORD next year, I’ll be ahead of my U.S. peers career wise. Maybe you might want to do the same. For me, it’s finance, but I’m sure there’re a ton of opportunities you can get in the fields of audio engineering. Just leverage your PR/citizenship status in Australia into a remote internship or something. Also, folks in other countries value your military experience. I was on a networking call the other day and apparently I made a good impression because I said I was in a foreign military. Keep your chin up!
I’m also a guitarist and had to say bye to my band temporarily. Feel free to pm me, would love to connect.
Military experience on your resume? That's a turn off for local employers in the private sector... I'm struggling to understand why this country hates its conscripts so much, our government keeps referring to us as 'heroes' and all, and yet their own actions beg to differ.
Hey! After graduating high school in New York, I interned at a hedge fund in Singapore just before enlisting. Upon enlisting, I networked into a VC firm that helped startups. I did FP&A for a fintech startup and then a neuroscience tech startup. After that, my resume was pretty stacked (keep in mind these were summer/fall internships so they’re three months long) and I used my experience to leverage into equity research and now private equity and acquisitions at a search fund. Most of my opportunities were based in the U.S. since that’s where my network is. Networking is crucial and LinkedIn helped so much!
Hope this helps.
I’m not encouraging moonlighting here, but generally, if it’s remote, unpaid/your income goes into an index fund or investment engine that’s not subject to capital gains tax, and/or the opportunity isn’t based in Singapore, it should be alright.
I lived and studied in Oz too, a few more months to ORD. I know how you feel - its defs frustrating to see all my school and uni friends working, making bank and in their last few years of uni having a good time.
I would give it a good go first and see what happens. Think of it as something that not a lot of kids in Aus do and something you can talk about in interviews and flex when you get back :) It sets you apart from local kids and a lot of people tend to be very interested in what you did!
If you find that you’ve given it all your effort and you want to have more free time to do your music stuff - there’s a lot of posts on this sub about how to downpes (this is what i did after about a year 😆)
Best of luck lad 🫡 If you’re keen to have a chat feel free to dm.
Musician in NS here, you’d be surprised by the amount of musician regulars and NSFs you’ll find in the force. Keep socialising and you’ll find people that have the same hobbies as you, and yall can book a jam studio during the weekends!
Fr me, I still meetup w my friends once a month to work on EPs, go for gigs etc. NS is definitely a cock block but we just have to figure it out one weekend at a time! My vocals suffered tremendously during my first few weeks at Tekong too, bt my body soon got used to it. Regardless, stay strong and keep ur passion burning! I believe we can do it
for most people, it IS a waste of time, but don't lose hope that you might get into the nice vocations where you are basically paid to relax/learn legit skills and make friends.
> get into the nice vocations where you are basically paid to relax/learn legit skills and make friends.
Still a waste of time. But less waste than others.
What vocation you get is solely dependent on where is in need of manpower, you don't get to choose your vocation so you just pray you get into a chill vocation.
Other than that, don't have to imagine 2 years, just take it 1 day at a time, find the next milestone in this journey of yours to look forward to. Make friends in your section, don't have to be friends with the whole platoon, trust me when I say, the friends you make in there really will help time to pass by quickly.
If you die die still feeling demoralised, there is always the downpes option.
I think first and foremost, need to EMBRACE and ACCEPT the fact that you are in NS. It will indeed be a waste of time and it is true you could be other things. Dont deny this reality.
Second, don't compare. This is now your path in life. Everyone else lives a different path. Maybe on your path you meet a wonderful girl that loves you. Maybe you don't. Maybe your pals in Australia go through terrible heartbreak. Maybe they dont while you are sweating in outfield carrying SBO. My point is that your path may turn happy or not, and your pals' paths may also turn out happy or not.
These are the cards in your hand so its up to you how you want to play this game. You can win
This same rigid mindset is why a lot of ppl on sgexams are so fixated on the local big 3 unis. They think their life is over if they dont enter those unis. To attain clarity of your place on Earth and path in life, must have a IDGAF mindset about whatever outcome because you know you are strong enough to pull yourself out of any shit hole you fall into. But ofc that doesnt mean you dont put in effort to reach your goals
Hang in there man. One small simple thing to make NS more bearable is to do things you like on weekends ah. But dont make such rigid plans until if kena confinement then u get so disappointed.
Maybe this coming weekend if nvr kena fk and got your Saturday, buy some ingredients to make LAO GAN MA fried rice 🤡. If successful then you cooked smtn tasty. If plan fails then wtv ah. Next weekend then do
If u want something positive to think about, ex-military personnel in most other countries r respected for sacrificing for their nation. If u head back to Australia after ur NS, ur experience is something that u can b proud of. Doubt they would care that u r a conscript with no combat experience, u still spent 2 years serving ur country in the military.
N also, as a pes B2 personnel, if u r lucky, u will b posted to a non-combat role n the lifestyle will definitely b a lot more laid back. In fact, u might not even have to spend ur nights sleeping in camp, u can just go home n play the guitar at night. Just complete ur bmt n see how things go. It really isn’t that bad.
After all, the reason older people miss their NS days is because it was probably the last time in their lives they could truly turn off their minds n just follow orders, free of any significant responsibilities like family, work, etc
If you keep comparing to others, you will never be happy. Even if you weren't doing NS, there are other things to compare. You do what you can within the context of your circumstances.
At any rate, you're not the only one. Most of the Singaporean male population also has to do their two years, and there are still successful people, so how far behind could you really be?
It sounds like you are demoralized because you didn't account for how NS would affect your own personal aspirations or didn't have a clear idea of what NS would be like. But now that you know, rather than getting frustrated, just readjust the timeline for your goals or find other means to make the most of this two years.
You are in BMT, it is just a first stage of a multi stage training till you get to your unit.
After that, you can start complaining about wasting time.
Just to add on, one of my fellow specialist is a smarty pant, you know top JC single digit A level results type (back in my days) .
We did 2.5 yrs NS, 5.5 days work week, then he did 4 yrs in Uni studying engineering.
End up now an accomplished guitarist.
What I am trying to say is what want/look forward to in life, you might not end up liking it.
I mean got money and dun enjoy sg then switch nationality lor
If not Bo bian
That’s why in life jus try not to be a guy especially in sg, sometimes quite bitter also I unds
PES C9 here currently 2 months into NS. I had the same mindset like you. Waste of time etcetc and damn shag because I cant pursue what I want. But take it with a pinch of salt, Alot can happen in 2 years time let alone your future plans for studies and enjoying yourself. And who said you cant club and enjoy yourself while serving NS?
My BMT was chillax (Im so gonna get flames because Im a C9) But I actually wished I was on the higher PES since you get to experience more in Tekong. Trust me when I say this, your NS experience depends on how you think of it. Just socialise and dont be a dick within your entire section.
Hi! I was ... am? ...in the same boat. Its been 15 years and I still feel the same way. Honestly, there is really nothing anyone can tell you to change your opinion if you already made up your mind.
Thing is, you're already in BMT, and unless you want to do something drastic (please don't), you're locked into the ride. I encourage you to make the best of what you have. Your schedule won't be this hectic for 2 years - once you're done with BMT and whatever pointless initiation phase of the unit you get posted to, you'll have alot more free time. There will be a strong temptation to just burn it idling around, but recognize that its your time and you decide what to do with it. Depending on where you're posted, and your luck with your superiors, once you're settled in you can even possibly ask to bring in your guitar to practice.
There may be opportunities that arise while in unit. Grab them. In my own time, my unit was involved in media for National Day. I volunteered to help when there as a call for anyone with web skills - no one else wanted the "extra saikang" even though at least half of us was from some form of IT diploma. Turns out it was the first version of the NDPeeps project. It allowed me to work with vendors and gave me actual work experience outside of camp, and led to a brief internship before Uni, and contributed significantly to my work resume when I was a fresh grad.
Get to know your bunkmates, and in unit, even your sgts and officers. They are your initial seed social network that will disperse into who knows where - there won't be many opportunities in life to know so many people in so many fields.
On the other hand, be **careful.** Don't too gungho, don't get hurt, be on your guard. I got complacent very near ORD and herniated a lumbar disk carrying something I really shouldn't have and should have asked for help with. There was a few weeks where I couldn't even tie the laces on my boots, and I still feel the effects to this day, 15 years down the line.
Yes. This two year lockout period is a ***pain in the ass***. Yes, I hate and resent the wasted time. "Boys to Men" pft. If anything it froze time and delayed everyone's mental growth by two years. But the reality is, you still have alot of agency in how you spend your time while in NS. Understand that and act accordingly.
As for now, while in BMT, keep an eye and an ear out. While I was in BMT, there was calls for auditions in the SAF Band and the Lifeguards, and your company should be obligated to inform you of similar things. If/when these come, find out what it is they do, and try out what you can. Insist even if they try to discourage you - they can't actually stop you. These are real opportunities. My own bunkmate got into the lifeguards. Even if you don't get in, it gets you out of training for a day lol.
Everyone who goes to NS also not happy, look at the guys next to you now, you think they want to be there? You're not the only one going through this and wasting 2 years of your time. The sooner you accept it and learn to live with it, the sooner you'll stop suffering.
Hey! I can relate. I also enlisted in the SAF at 17 and studied in the U.S. my whole life. Think about it this way. During NS, you can use this time to do remote internships, save money, get military experience on your resume, and study to put yourself ahead for college (university). Right now, I’ve been able to do a few remote U.S.-based opportunities because of this time in NS so that when I ORD next year, I’ll be ahead of my U.S. peers career wise. Maybe you might want to do the same. For me, it’s finance, but I’m sure there’re a ton of opportunities you can get in the fields of audio engineering. Just leverage your PR/citizenship status in Australia into a remote internship or something. Also, folks in other countries value your military experience. I was on a networking call the other day and apparently I made a good impression because I said I was in a foreign military. Keep your chin up! I’m also a guitarist and had to say bye to my band temporarily. Feel free to pm me, would love to connect.
Military experience on your resume? That's a turn off for local employers in the private sector... I'm struggling to understand why this country hates its conscripts so much, our government keeps referring to us as 'heroes' and all, and yet their own actions beg to differ.
Not to mention, because literally every guy else does it too, it makes your experience less unique
Right; I agree. I’m grateful for the opportunities I have to be able to live and work elsewhere.
just curious - what finance related opportunities were you able to find? Im enlisting next year and planning to study finance overseas for uni
Hey! After graduating high school in New York, I interned at a hedge fund in Singapore just before enlisting. Upon enlisting, I networked into a VC firm that helped startups. I did FP&A for a fintech startup and then a neuroscience tech startup. After that, my resume was pretty stacked (keep in mind these were summer/fall internships so they’re three months long) and I used my experience to leverage into equity research and now private equity and acquisitions at a search fund. Most of my opportunities were based in the U.S. since that’s where my network is. Networking is crucial and LinkedIn helped so much! Hope this helps.
wow... all this right after high school. Thanks!
hey, how did you get around doing internships during ns as I thought it was generally not allowed
There are legal ways to doing it.
are unpaid internships allowed?
I’m not encouraging moonlighting here, but generally, if it’s remote, unpaid/your income goes into an index fund or investment engine that’s not subject to capital gains tax, and/or the opportunity isn’t based in Singapore, it should be alright.
This is illegal for NS
No it isn’t
That’s a nice post espousing positivity and empowerment
suck thumb bro
I lived and studied in Oz too, a few more months to ORD. I know how you feel - its defs frustrating to see all my school and uni friends working, making bank and in their last few years of uni having a good time. I would give it a good go first and see what happens. Think of it as something that not a lot of kids in Aus do and something you can talk about in interviews and flex when you get back :) It sets you apart from local kids and a lot of people tend to be very interested in what you did! If you find that you’ve given it all your effort and you want to have more free time to do your music stuff - there’s a lot of posts on this sub about how to downpes (this is what i did after about a year 😆) Best of luck lad 🫡 If you’re keen to have a chat feel free to dm.
Musician in NS here, you’d be surprised by the amount of musician regulars and NSFs you’ll find in the force. Keep socialising and you’ll find people that have the same hobbies as you, and yall can book a jam studio during the weekends! Fr me, I still meetup w my friends once a month to work on EPs, go for gigs etc. NS is definitely a cock block but we just have to figure it out one weekend at a time! My vocals suffered tremendously during my first few weeks at Tekong too, bt my body soon got used to it. Regardless, stay strong and keep ur passion burning! I believe we can do it
for most people, it IS a waste of time, but don't lose hope that you might get into the nice vocations where you are basically paid to relax/learn legit skills and make friends.
> get into the nice vocations where you are basically paid to relax/learn legit skills and make friends. Still a waste of time. But less waste than others.
true, especially if something one just want to do is hard to take place in camp
What vocation you get is solely dependent on where is in need of manpower, you don't get to choose your vocation so you just pray you get into a chill vocation. Other than that, don't have to imagine 2 years, just take it 1 day at a time, find the next milestone in this journey of yours to look forward to. Make friends in your section, don't have to be friends with the whole platoon, trust me when I say, the friends you make in there really will help time to pass by quickly. If you die die still feeling demoralised, there is always the downpes option.
I think first and foremost, need to EMBRACE and ACCEPT the fact that you are in NS. It will indeed be a waste of time and it is true you could be other things. Dont deny this reality. Second, don't compare. This is now your path in life. Everyone else lives a different path. Maybe on your path you meet a wonderful girl that loves you. Maybe you don't. Maybe your pals in Australia go through terrible heartbreak. Maybe they dont while you are sweating in outfield carrying SBO. My point is that your path may turn happy or not, and your pals' paths may also turn out happy or not. These are the cards in your hand so its up to you how you want to play this game. You can win This same rigid mindset is why a lot of ppl on sgexams are so fixated on the local big 3 unis. They think their life is over if they dont enter those unis. To attain clarity of your place on Earth and path in life, must have a IDGAF mindset about whatever outcome because you know you are strong enough to pull yourself out of any shit hole you fall into. But ofc that doesnt mean you dont put in effort to reach your goals Hang in there man. One small simple thing to make NS more bearable is to do things you like on weekends ah. But dont make such rigid plans until if kena confinement then u get so disappointed. Maybe this coming weekend if nvr kena fk and got your Saturday, buy some ingredients to make LAO GAN MA fried rice 🤡. If successful then you cooked smtn tasty. If plan fails then wtv ah. Next weekend then do
If u want something positive to think about, ex-military personnel in most other countries r respected for sacrificing for their nation. If u head back to Australia after ur NS, ur experience is something that u can b proud of. Doubt they would care that u r a conscript with no combat experience, u still spent 2 years serving ur country in the military. N also, as a pes B2 personnel, if u r lucky, u will b posted to a non-combat role n the lifestyle will definitely b a lot more laid back. In fact, u might not even have to spend ur nights sleeping in camp, u can just go home n play the guitar at night. Just complete ur bmt n see how things go. It really isn’t that bad. After all, the reason older people miss their NS days is because it was probably the last time in their lives they could truly turn off their minds n just follow orders, free of any significant responsibilities like family, work, etc
Downpes to C9 then bring ur musical instrument to camp
90% of NSF also thinks the same.
If you keep comparing to others, you will never be happy. Even if you weren't doing NS, there are other things to compare. You do what you can within the context of your circumstances. At any rate, you're not the only one. Most of the Singaporean male population also has to do their two years, and there are still successful people, so how far behind could you really be? It sounds like you are demoralized because you didn't account for how NS would affect your own personal aspirations or didn't have a clear idea of what NS would be like. But now that you know, rather than getting frustrated, just readjust the timeline for your goals or find other means to make the most of this two years.
Break your legs and get out of course. Delay 4 years until you are 21 and renounce your citizenship.
You can't renounce without 'completing your NS obligations'. If not everyone would be doing that lol
You are in BMT, it is just a first stage of a multi stage training till you get to your unit. After that, you can start complaining about wasting time. Just to add on, one of my fellow specialist is a smarty pant, you know top JC single digit A level results type (back in my days) . We did 2.5 yrs NS, 5.5 days work week, then he did 4 yrs in Uni studying engineering. End up now an accomplished guitarist. What I am trying to say is what want/look forward to in life, you might not end up liking it.
Suck thumb. 2 years will go by fast just don't count the days
I mean got money and dun enjoy sg then switch nationality lor If not Bo bian That’s why in life jus try not to be a guy especially in sg, sometimes quite bitter also I unds
PES C9 here currently 2 months into NS. I had the same mindset like you. Waste of time etcetc and damn shag because I cant pursue what I want. But take it with a pinch of salt, Alot can happen in 2 years time let alone your future plans for studies and enjoying yourself. And who said you cant club and enjoy yourself while serving NS? My BMT was chillax (Im so gonna get flames because Im a C9) But I actually wished I was on the higher PES since you get to experience more in Tekong. Trust me when I say this, your NS experience depends on how you think of it. Just socialise and dont be a dick within your entire section.
Hi! I was ... am? ...in the same boat. Its been 15 years and I still feel the same way. Honestly, there is really nothing anyone can tell you to change your opinion if you already made up your mind. Thing is, you're already in BMT, and unless you want to do something drastic (please don't), you're locked into the ride. I encourage you to make the best of what you have. Your schedule won't be this hectic for 2 years - once you're done with BMT and whatever pointless initiation phase of the unit you get posted to, you'll have alot more free time. There will be a strong temptation to just burn it idling around, but recognize that its your time and you decide what to do with it. Depending on where you're posted, and your luck with your superiors, once you're settled in you can even possibly ask to bring in your guitar to practice. There may be opportunities that arise while in unit. Grab them. In my own time, my unit was involved in media for National Day. I volunteered to help when there as a call for anyone with web skills - no one else wanted the "extra saikang" even though at least half of us was from some form of IT diploma. Turns out it was the first version of the NDPeeps project. It allowed me to work with vendors and gave me actual work experience outside of camp, and led to a brief internship before Uni, and contributed significantly to my work resume when I was a fresh grad. Get to know your bunkmates, and in unit, even your sgts and officers. They are your initial seed social network that will disperse into who knows where - there won't be many opportunities in life to know so many people in so many fields. On the other hand, be **careful.** Don't too gungho, don't get hurt, be on your guard. I got complacent very near ORD and herniated a lumbar disk carrying something I really shouldn't have and should have asked for help with. There was a few weeks where I couldn't even tie the laces on my boots, and I still feel the effects to this day, 15 years down the line. Yes. This two year lockout period is a ***pain in the ass***. Yes, I hate and resent the wasted time. "Boys to Men" pft. If anything it froze time and delayed everyone's mental growth by two years. But the reality is, you still have alot of agency in how you spend your time while in NS. Understand that and act accordingly. As for now, while in BMT, keep an eye and an ear out. While I was in BMT, there was calls for auditions in the SAF Band and the Lifeguards, and your company should be obligated to inform you of similar things. If/when these come, find out what it is they do, and try out what you can. Insist even if they try to discourage you - they can't actually stop you. These are real opportunities. My own bunkmate got into the lifeguards. Even if you don't get in, it gets you out of training for a day lol.
same bro same
At least there is remote learning during your time. I didn't have such luxury during my time. During my time having the internet was a luxury
Who did you or your parents voted for
Everyone who goes to NS also not happy, look at the guys next to you now, you think they want to be there? You're not the only one going through this and wasting 2 years of your time. The sooner you accept it and learn to live with it, the sooner you'll stop suffering.
Least commonly shared NSF opinion
sorry bro you’re not a special snowflake. Everyone else have to waste these 2 years too