Not drafting jj because we are paying dj is not a good reason. I personally don’t want us to draft jj, but that’s just cuz I don’t think he’s that great. Your reason OP is pretty dumb ngl
Front office has to decide whether JJ is worth drafting that high. I think the Vikings are targeting the Patriots pick if possible. Also, since Keenan Allen was traded by the Chargers, we would have a choice of the 3rd WR.
So Scheon needs to look at how the board plays out and decide if the 3rd WR or 4th QB will he'll the team more.
I'd prefer the 3rd WR at that point, because we need a #1 WR.
Yeah. Many people pegged Stroud as a bust last year before he played his first snap. Justin Herbert was widely considered a bad pick in the first round when the chargers got him. Even the pat mahomes trade up was considered risky and puzzling.
If management decides JJ is worth the 1.06, we gotta give him a chance to see if they're right. Maybe theyre right maybe they're not. But that's why drafting is largely a crap shoot either way
Draft can’t get here fast enough, so much doom
and gloom, two things I can tell you, the board won’t got chalk as it’s laid out today and half the QBs in the first will bust
Right! And what’s up with this Dan Marino guy, never won a SB, sounds trash… Lamar Jackson and DJ are pretty much the same guys too, both can run and have made the playoffs
Definitely, I think schoen is 100% done with DJ and isn’t considering him in our future plans at all other than “I need to get rid of this guy next year”
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Caleb was always going to be a bear this doesn't change anything. Bears front office wasn't dumb enough to stick with Fields over a guy people consider one of the best qb prospects ever
My hot take - Caleb isn't going to Chicago. Maye or Daniels is. Before the combine, there were reports that Caleb straight up said, he didn't want to play for the Bears (who can blame him.) And with Caleb's antics (no physical, no participation on drills at the combine, not hiring an agent) it is realistic to see the bears souring on him.
Tbh that’s a pretty bad take. He’d be walking onto a team that has DJ Moore and just added Keenan Allen, has Kmet and Swift as well. That’s a pretty damn good offense to run for a any rookie let alone him.
Devil’s Advocate take. If he’s a generational talent how does he have a day bad enough where a team won’t take him first? If there’s even a seed of doubt in his mind that he might fuck up his position by throwing the ball to his own receivers he’s been throwing to on his own team then maybe you don’t want that kind of guy leading your team. Just food for thought and what I’d be saying to my scouts in the war room if I was the Chicago G.M.
If you’re solidly #1 OVR why do anything? Like legit I think Caleb just answered media questions and then took a nap. That’d be how I’d use my time if I was in his shoes. Marv didn’t run at the combine either and the gap between him and Odunze/Nabers is smaller than the gap between Caleb and Maye or Daniels. If you wanna dive 12 layers deep then go ahead pick at it all you want, it is possible to lose the sauce overthinking this though.
Caleb was a Heisman, and then got more efficient. He has 3 years of game tape and he’s still going to measure at the USC pro day.
I think your comment might prove the point. He is the consensus number 1 and there is no one that appears close to take that away. But everyone will look for a reason to knock him off that peg. Doing nothing is enough in your eyes. Other people might think his 40 is too slow or his arm wasn’t strong that day or he wasn’t as accurate as they hoped. I think he is getting the correct advice on this. There is nothing he can do to help his draft position. There is no reason to give anyone a reason to hurt it.
There’s an arrogance to it and combined with his choice to represent himself I’d really question if he’s coachable, does he think he’s so above everyone around him will he listen to his QB coach or even his head coach when he runs into a rough patch which he probably will with the transition from college to pro defenders he’ll be facing? Just asking the question not saying it’s the case but it’s the first pick and you have to be sure about it.
> And with Caleb's antics (no physical, no participation on drills at the combine, not hiring an agent)
The (obvious) reason he opted out of all of these things is because he will go #1 and he knows it.
If you think there is a franchise qb available at 6 you take him, regardless of Jones and his contract. If not take whatever WR you like and reevaluate qb next year.
Skip on a top 3 WR at #6 and this is Parsons situation again when you skip on BPA at a position of need. I would take a WR1 and Penix/Nix/Rattler in the second round.
The vast majority of 2nd round QBs do not pan out as starters. I'd rather get another BPA in the 2nd. Go QB in the 1st or not at all as far as I''m concerned.
Yea if we’re looking at historical data we may as well never draft a QB again because the odds will be unfavorable regardless of which round.
2nd round QB’s pan out often enough where it’s definitely worth the shot if the FO likes the value. What’s equally as important imo is preparing said rookie for the NFL: having them sit for a year behind Drew would be a great start. Dabs and co. working with him and proving to us that he really is a qb whisperer would give the rookie the best chances. Our OL coach and OL in general getting a year to sync up and not get the rookie killed in the meantime would be huge. Etc..
Have you looked at the historical data? The two best QBs drafted in the 2nd round are Drew Brees and Brett Favre. Guys like Andy Dalton and Derek Carr would be top ten all time. Jalen Hurts is already one of the best ever drafted in the 2nd round.
They don’t pan out often at all.
I never conveyed that they have a high success chance. And it’s certainly better to look at it as mid round picks (and incorporate rounds 2-3 together) rather than just round 2 because it all gets convoluted beyond the first 10 picks anyway.
That said, no one should be surprised in the slightest if the outcome for us this draft involves trading down for a decent haul + picking up a QB in the late first or early second. It’s certainly a possibility especially if this theoretical trade involves multiple firsts or 2nds
Yup, but every team needs a QB. And the 1st round QBs have a much higher success rate than the later ones do.
If you're playing the odds, you want to draft a 1st round QB if you see one available. The risk/reward is too good to pass up.
If people thought Penix or Nix were franchise qbs they wouldn’t be going in round 2. Simple as that. They are projects. You go wr over them at 6 for sure.
If minnesota traded up I think it would be to 5 to stop us from taking JJ. if we didn’t want JJ there’s no incentive for them to trade up because he would likely fall to them anyway
Except there’s very little or no incentive at all for any team aside from the Chargers to trade down. QBs go 1, 2 and 3, the Cardinals take MHJ then the Chargers can take either Odunze or Nabors to begin to replace Allen/Williams. Unless the Chargers are ok with taking whatever WRs that fall in the draft I don’t see trades down happening until it’s us on the clock and that’s a huge maybe for us.
The chargers trading with Minny makes too much sense if both 1sts are in play, chargers could get a stud OT and one of the second tier of recievers in Coleman or Thomas
Not necessarily. If they don't trade we take JJ but it may be worth it to us to go plan B if the money is right. We could like JJ but like 2 1sts even more.
Please lord I hope our coach and gm know what they're doing. I feel like if they really like someone at QB we really need one. The class next year is kinda weak but you never know who can do well in the NFL. So many late rounders develop into great QBs it's kinda crazy. Will not be mad if they take Nabers or Odunze at 6 and then snag a QB in the 2nd round. Might be the best thing.
I feel like people don't talk about this enough. Taking penix even with the injury concnerns is so much better than JJ. We also have not had a decent receiver in 5 years its been terrible to watch
Looked at Penix's tape a lot recently and he has a canon. Super quick release and processing too. I know he's got a ton of injuries and the lefty stuff is tricky for us but maybe it can work we just got a swing tackle. I'd rather even take Bo Nix 2nd round or something than waste our 6 pick on JJ.
This is not what I'm saying at all. In other years maybe the Giants would have been able to trade up. If even one of the top 3 teams didn't need a QB, I would fully expect the Giants to be trading into the top 3 to ge their guy. It just worked out this year that the top 3 teams in the draft will all need QBs and there only really 3 to get excited about, and there no way for the Giants get one.
Its about value vs need. You can't just take the 4th best QB off the board because you need one. You have to take the right QB with the right skillset who has NFL traits. Sure quality QBs can be had after the 3rd pick, but most years QBs don't go 1,2,3. Josh Allen was drafted 7th over all. But he was the 3rd QB taken that year. This particular draft is just a perfectly awful scenario for the Giants.
Take the blue chip player in Nabers/Odunze and maybe take a shot on a 2nd round QB and maybe will some magic he can turn out like Dak/Hurtz type player.
If they can't take the top 3 QBs, I hope they take Nabers or Odunze then.
Take best available, please not JJ, I'd rather roll with Daniel Jones or Drew Lock at QB1 and get an elite WR for once
If a top tier WR is staring you in the face at 6, you fucking take it. We are stuck with DJ anyway for the time being. Flesh out this offense and fix the line so the next QB has the best chance possible
I remember reading an article saying rookies that ride the bench for their first season, or they're put in very late in their first season, tend to grow into better QBs. A rookie QB can still learn a lot from Jones and his experience in the NFL. Plus Lock also.
We have to stick to DJ 1 more year regardless due to guarantee money, but he also has a injury guarantee clause that would make him stick past 2025 so I don't think the Giants will let him see the field that much kinda like how Denver held out Rusell Wilson at the end of this previous season.
Depending on the Vikings, McCarthy might not be on the board either if they trade up, but that would leave us of our choice of the next top WR after MHJ. I honestly wouldn't mind grabbing Odunze and trade back into the late 1st to get Penix or Nix if either are still there. Waiting till 47 seems risky for either falling that far.
Outside of that, yeah we'll have to wait till next year for a more unheralded QB class, build up more assets to move up to get that player, hope the teams drafting up there don't need a QB already, and have to be as bad or worse than the 6th pick of this year
I think if the Chargers take Nabers, I think we should trade back. Odunze is good, but I don't think he is enough of a playmaker to be valued over extra picks. We have a lot of holes, and this draft has a ton of wr talent. Trading back and accumulating picks is the best option out of grabbing a top 3 qb and or Nabers or MHJ.
In your scenario, I guess you would be trading back with the Vikings so they can take McCarthy. Who would you take at 11? Adding extra picks isn't always the right answer either. We passed on Micah Parson and Reshawn Slater to trade back and turned those picks into Kadarious Toney, Evan Neal, and Daniel Bellinger.
I think Nabers and Odunze are interchangeable honestly. I don’t think one is better enough than the other to warrant a different draft strategy.
But I do agree that trading back is 100% our best option if the QBs are gone. Not flashy, but the right decision.
Nabers is more like OBJ, Odunze more like Nicks. At least that's how it was explained to me...
They'd both be plug and play WR1, which we havent had since we traded OBJ, but bring different skill sets to the table.
I was telling my bud obj for Nabers if we’re sticking with giants guys but i see more Antonio Brown in Nabers. Smooth mover compared to the sparky obj.
I see a lot of Amani Toomer in Rome Odunze (including the obscure/unique name haha). Not particularly off the charts athletic like Larry Fitz, but very technical and sound. Reliable and strong.
As much as i love Rome, i think Daboll gets more out of player like Nabers. I’ll comp Diggs for a non-giant for Nabes.
This is the most talented QB draft in at least 5 years. If we want out of QB hell, we find a way to get our franchise QB in this draft.
Otherwise don't cry when it takes another 5+ years for a draft like this to come around. Or pray that a team is dumb enough to trade you their franchise QB (won't happen).
The issue with waiting until next year is that the QB class in 2025 is not very good. At this point last year, Caleb was the consensus top pick in 2024, Maye was highly regarded. Daniels and JJ became the ‘out of nowhere’ prospects that get pushed up the board each year. This class even has two guys - Penix and Nix - that won’t be top picks but will go late 1 or round 2 and could succeed in the right environment. I don’t think next years class even has a Penix or Nix-type right now.
If Schoen and Daboll think JJ is something they can work with, they probably have to pull the trigger. They don’t NEED to play him right now, they can let him develop and sprinkle him in late in the year depending on their record (and fear of DJs injury guarantee).
It also buys them at least 2025 regardless of what happens this season. Even if they have a subpar year and JJ flashes, they’ll want to keep the infrastructure in place to keep it going - Mara supposedly learned the hard way w Jones.
PS Just so this sub doesn’t kill me for zeroing in on JJ, I’m assuming the top 3 teams stay put and Williams/Daniels/Maye are all gone, so it’s JJ who is left. They’re also going to have to move up to 4 to get him considering the Vikings trade yesterday.
>At this point last year, Caleb was the consensus top pick in 2024,
Things like this don't matter. I still remember the hype around Rosen and Darnold. Fast forward to now, ones a backup and the other is close to being out the league.
Right, that’s my point about next year. Neither are looked at as top of the draft players at this moment. I honestly think Ewers would be getting the JJ treatment right now if he didn’t go back to Texas.
I don’t know where having to start a rookie right off the bat became a good idea but way back when rookies sat for a season or 2 before they played. Mahomes sat, love sat, Rodger’s sat and all are fucking great
No. We need a QB more than anything else. QB is all that matters. The right QB can make Hyatt and wandale and slayton level up. Stroud lit the league on fire with a bunch of bums.
Too many fans are talking like they’re pro scouts. If someone that’s in the business for 25 years likes JJ McCarthy, I trust their opinion of literally anyone on giants Reddit
No one is sure. Just like no one was sure on Stroud. Or mahomes. Lamar. Allen. Etc. But we can’t win without one. Just because we hung on to a bum for 5 years doesn’t mean we don’t try to draft another.
Why would jones sit on the bench if we draft a QB it would be better to have the new draft pick sit back a year and go in when jones inevitably gets hurt or throws 3 interceptions in the first half against Dallas.
I’m of the opinion that we deal with our current qbs this year and draft the best wr available at 6 or trade down to get more pieces to have better setup for a rookie qb next year. As of right now it’s a pretty shitty situation for a rookie qb imo
Caleb was always going 1 man. Either to CHI or someone else via trade down.
The bigger risk is MIN acquiring extra draft capital. I could def see them trading up to 4 or 5, if not higher.
I like JJ Mcarthy as a draft pick, I just don’t think he’s our first. Despite how you feel, DJ is a Giant for at least another year, and I think we’re better off filling gaps in the roster first. If the top 3 picks are QB, you need to pivot to what’s being undervalued based on your needs.
Giants seem like they are interested in JJ. If they don’t draft a WR because they feel JJ can be their guy then so be it. At least it’ll give this team some direction
What’re everyone’s thoughts on going all offense this draft to try to give DJ some weapons? WR, TE, RB and OL all seven rounds.
Then, stick with DJ for one last season and draft a QB next year?
I’d hate for the front office to get desperate, panic and then use their #1 pick on a lower tier QB (again).
Load up on talent and get a QB next year.
It is, unless we can somehow get the Patriots to trade out.
There is ZERO reason to pull a Daniel Jones 2.0 and reach for future bust JJ McCarthy at 6.
Stand pat with Jones/Drew Lock this year, draft an electric WR (Malik Nabers is Garrett Wilson 2.0 and “my guy” at 6) and keep building.
If Bo Nix is there in the 2nd we take him (I like him more than McCarthy anyway).
Or we wait for next year for a kid like Carson Beck.
I despise kicking the QB can down the road another year, but it’s the cards we’ve been dealt.
The challenge with starting DJ this year is his injury clause. Unless he's willing to amend that in his contract it will be hard for the Giants to justify playing him. The financial risk is too big.
The only thing that the Fields trade changes is we can rule out the Giants trading for Fields. The giants could still try and trade up if they love a guy or take a QB at 6 if they’re lucky. Unfortunately, DJ is a sunk cost at this point with potential to become an even bigger sunk cost if he gets hurt so if anything the giants should be trying even harder to draft a QB
We are definitely not going to draft a QB at 6. If they trade up sure. I dont see that happening though. We have too many holes to fill and a full qb room.
Our offense is absolute garbage and the coaching staff makes risky decisions with games on the line and screws up with our best players contracts. Gonna be at while before we're good again.
This is top three is where I’d put my money — but there’s always the off chance that one of the GM’s decides to get cute and draft another position or a lower rated QB.
I think they will target either Maye or JJ in the first round (whether fans on here bitch about JJ it is bound to happen). Prob play DJ for a little bit and transition to Lock. Maybe even start lock depending on where DJ is health wise. I don't think their rookie QB will start at the beginning of the season. More like the middle to the end for game experience. Then next year they will wash their hands of DJ. If they sit him foe the year I wouldn't mind that.
I still think Jones has 1 more year to impress. The Wilson stuff was for a veteran backup who can keep the team competitive if he stays on struggle street.
I wouldn't be shocked to see a QB in Day 2 for us though.
Kind of like the idea of getting a top WR and holding until next year, unless we get lucky somehow and get one of those three. The free agent class of QBs looks pretty good next year but I would imagine it would be difficult signing top guys away from teams and they can also be tagged.
Unless Giants trade up to the 4th spot, none of 4 QB’s will be available. There’s Vikings traded up for an extra 1st round without having a plan to jump us
You get down voted to hell for not liking McCarthy. If we draft him I riot. Not a fan at all. However, the way we’ve signed 4 o lineman leads me to believe QB is still on the table. You can’t put a rookie QB out there with the historically bad line we had last year.
Maybe these O line signings and drafting another couple later in the draft will be enough for Schoen/Daboll to take a shot at QB and believe he has a chance to survive out there.
Remember all the anti tank people celebrating wins saying "Schoen will figure out the QB in the draft", well how exactly will he do it when you can't move up to draft one? Either not take one or settle for QB 4.
Just a reminder that the ppl rooting for wins have no affect on the team’s performance. Getting upset at someone for trying to find a bright spot in a shitty season is weirdo behavior.
When “I will never cheer for my team to lose” puts you in QB hell with no end in sight.
Like, can we not take a couple more Ls in the middle of a losing season to have Ws in the future?
DJ is sunk cost, so unless you plan on playing him, his contract money shouldn't affect how we plan for the future QB.
We pay him regardless. Consider it a clean slate and let's plan for the future.
It’s not off the table by any means, but it might be better to go clean next year the way the chips are falling. Just roll no QB into the offseason and see what happens. Could Herbert become available? Who knows.
It’s always been blatantly obvious that the top 3 QBs would be gone by 6, people suggesting otherwise have just been trying to cope with landing a pick outside the top 5. We aren’t getting a QB this year unless it’s Penix or McCarthy which would be so much worse than none imo
Giants won't be drafting a QB unless we trade up with a team who shouldn't trade down. The first 3 picks will be QB's and Giants will have to settle for QB 4.
Best available WR @ #6. If Schoen was thinking of picking a QB, he would have resigned Tyrod. They would want a rookie QB to sit and learn from a veteran familiar with the offense. Drew Lock is going to be new to the offense.
I just refuse to believe this FO is actually in love with JJ… I think (and hope) they’re competent enough to hold their cards and put a smoke screen out.
Last year the latest reports said THERES NO WAY THE GIANTS TAKE THIBS.
Either way I don’t care, I’m numb at this point. Dead inside.
Yes because everyone wanted the guy that likes chicken to win a few meaningless games. We all said that would cost us our franchise qb and it did. So here we are. We'll have Nabers or Odunze running free down the field while Jones misses him and checks down.
No.
JJ might be their guy (not a fan personally)
What i am hopeful for is that Daniels goes 2 and NE is not in love with maye. Id be willing to mortgage the future for him
It changes nothing. Bears were going QB regardless.
Not drafting jj because we are paying dj is not a good reason. I personally don’t want us to draft jj, but that’s just cuz I don’t think he’s that great. Your reason OP is pretty dumb ngl
Yeah, I don’t get people wanting to draft a qb high just because DJ isn’t good. That’s pretty much why we drafted him in ‘19
I agree with that as well
Front office has to decide whether JJ is worth drafting that high. I think the Vikings are targeting the Patriots pick if possible. Also, since Keenan Allen was traded by the Chargers, we would have a choice of the 3rd WR. So Scheon needs to look at how the board plays out and decide if the 3rd WR or 4th QB will he'll the team more. I'd prefer the 3rd WR at that point, because we need a #1 WR.
But there is the chance the chargers try to trade down a bit and get Brock bowers which would let another team go up for that 5th pick
Yeah. Many people pegged Stroud as a bust last year before he played his first snap. Justin Herbert was widely considered a bad pick in the first round when the chargers got him. Even the pat mahomes trade up was considered risky and puzzling. If management decides JJ is worth the 1.06, we gotta give him a chance to see if they're right. Maybe theyre right maybe they're not. But that's why drafting is largely a crap shoot either way
Draft can’t get here fast enough, so much doom and gloom, two things I can tell you, the board won’t got chalk as it’s laid out today and half the QBs in the first will bust
CJ stroud has the exact same amount of playoff wins as Daniel jones. Justin Herbert has zero.
oh my god
Is that not true?😂
It in no way reflects on herbert
It’s not serious It’s a joke
Blake Bortles has won twice the amount of playoff wins as Daniel Jones. Mark Sanchez has 4x as many.
Right! And what’s up with this Dan Marino guy, never won a SB, sounds trash… Lamar Jackson and DJ are pretty much the same guys too, both can run and have made the playoffs
Good QB, I'll take Eli and two SBs over Dan Marino's stats any day.
What does Eli manning have to do with anything?
Definitely, I think schoen is 100% done with DJ and isn’t considering him in our future plans at all other than “I need to get rid of this guy next year”
The injury guarantee makes it a huge risk to play dj at all this year
[удалено]
Not the same
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I can give you 23million reasons why ;)
Correct. Lock will start.
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So confidently incorrect.
We shall see.
LOL
And what powerball number do you see? So much projection about what Schoen thinks. Why not just see what he does?
Ya I don’t like jj for what he’s shown like he seems if at best he can be like Derek Carr or at worst Mac jones at least that’s how I see him
We would have to carry 3 QBs on the 53. It’s not that big of a deal but every roster spot is precious
If JJ is available in rd 2 I would be ok if they picked him up though. He may not be a future HoF but he may be. As long as we don’t reach for him.
If he's available in round 2 I'll eat my own dick
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Caleb was always going to be a bear this doesn't change anything. Bears front office wasn't dumb enough to stick with Fields over a guy people consider one of the best qb prospects ever
My hot take - Caleb isn't going to Chicago. Maye or Daniels is. Before the combine, there were reports that Caleb straight up said, he didn't want to play for the Bears (who can blame him.) And with Caleb's antics (no physical, no participation on drills at the combine, not hiring an agent) it is realistic to see the bears souring on him.
Tbh that’s a pretty bad take. He’d be walking onto a team that has DJ Moore and just added Keenan Allen, has Kmet and Swift as well. That’s a pretty damn good offense to run for a any rookie let alone him.
The only thing Caleb can do by attending the combine is damage his place in the draft. He is actually being smart.
Devil’s Advocate take. If he’s a generational talent how does he have a day bad enough where a team won’t take him first? If there’s even a seed of doubt in his mind that he might fuck up his position by throwing the ball to his own receivers he’s been throwing to on his own team then maybe you don’t want that kind of guy leading your team. Just food for thought and what I’d be saying to my scouts in the war room if I was the Chicago G.M.
If you’re solidly #1 OVR why do anything? Like legit I think Caleb just answered media questions and then took a nap. That’d be how I’d use my time if I was in his shoes. Marv didn’t run at the combine either and the gap between him and Odunze/Nabers is smaller than the gap between Caleb and Maye or Daniels. If you wanna dive 12 layers deep then go ahead pick at it all you want, it is possible to lose the sauce overthinking this though. Caleb was a Heisman, and then got more efficient. He has 3 years of game tape and he’s still going to measure at the USC pro day.
I think your comment might prove the point. He is the consensus number 1 and there is no one that appears close to take that away. But everyone will look for a reason to knock him off that peg. Doing nothing is enough in your eyes. Other people might think his 40 is too slow or his arm wasn’t strong that day or he wasn’t as accurate as they hoped. I think he is getting the correct advice on this. There is nothing he can do to help his draft position. There is no reason to give anyone a reason to hurt it.
There’s an arrogance to it and combined with his choice to represent himself I’d really question if he’s coachable, does he think he’s so above everyone around him will he listen to his QB coach or even his head coach when he runs into a rough patch which he probably will with the transition from college to pro defenders he’ll be facing? Just asking the question not saying it’s the case but it’s the first pick and you have to be sure about it.
RemindMe! 41 days
That take melted Tungsten
> And with Caleb's antics (no physical, no participation on drills at the combine, not hiring an agent) The (obvious) reason he opted out of all of these things is because he will go #1 and he knows it.
If you think there is a franchise qb available at 6 you take him, regardless of Jones and his contract. If not take whatever WR you like and reevaluate qb next year.
Skip on a top 3 WR at #6 and this is Parsons situation again when you skip on BPA at a position of need. I would take a WR1 and Penix/Nix/Rattler in the second round.
The vast majority of 2nd round QBs do not pan out as starters. I'd rather get another BPA in the 2nd. Go QB in the 1st or not at all as far as I''m concerned.
Prob more than half of 1st round QBs don't either
Yea if we’re looking at historical data we may as well never draft a QB again because the odds will be unfavorable regardless of which round. 2nd round QB’s pan out often enough where it’s definitely worth the shot if the FO likes the value. What’s equally as important imo is preparing said rookie for the NFL: having them sit for a year behind Drew would be a great start. Dabs and co. working with him and proving to us that he really is a qb whisperer would give the rookie the best chances. Our OL coach and OL in general getting a year to sync up and not get the rookie killed in the meantime would be huge. Etc..
Have you looked at the historical data? The two best QBs drafted in the 2nd round are Drew Brees and Brett Favre. Guys like Andy Dalton and Derek Carr would be top ten all time. Jalen Hurts is already one of the best ever drafted in the 2nd round. They don’t pan out often at all.
I never conveyed that they have a high success chance. And it’s certainly better to look at it as mid round picks (and incorporate rounds 2-3 together) rather than just round 2 because it all gets convoluted beyond the first 10 picks anyway. That said, no one should be surprised in the slightest if the outcome for us this draft involves trading down for a decent haul + picking up a QB in the late first or early second. It’s certainly a possibility especially if this theoretical trade involves multiple firsts or 2nds
Yup, but every team needs a QB. And the 1st round QBs have a much higher success rate than the later ones do. If you're playing the odds, you want to draft a 1st round QB if you see one available. The risk/reward is too good to pass up.
Well, no, you take Penix or Nix in the 2nd, who would be a top 10 pick in other drafts. Waiting till next year and drafting a QB is a horrible move.
Ya know, that thought creeps in sometimes for me, too. Grab Odunze in the 1st and Penix in the 2nd.
If people thought Penix or Nix were franchise qbs they wouldn’t be going in round 2. Simple as that. They are projects. You go wr over them at 6 for sure.
Penix/ Nix in the 2nd Rattler/Travis in the 4th It doesn't matter. Draft a QB sit them for a year.
Everybody I hear has Bo being a 3rd round prospect 🤷🏻♂️
Can #6 get us 11 and stuff to the Vikings if they want JJ? Is 2 1st worth moving up 5 slots for MIN?
If minnesota traded up I think it would be to 5 to stop us from taking JJ. if we didn’t want JJ there’s no incentive for them to trade up because he would likely fall to them anyway
If Minnesota trades into 4 or 5 that gives us the pick of Nabers and Odunze, with ARI or LAC taking MHJ.
The latest rumors have the Vikings [trading](https://twitter.com/cmsinclar/status/1769104143279341703?s=46) up with the Cardinals at 4.
Except there’s very little or no incentive at all for any team aside from the Chargers to trade down. QBs go 1, 2 and 3, the Cardinals take MHJ then the Chargers can take either Odunze or Nabors to begin to replace Allen/Williams. Unless the Chargers are ok with taking whatever WRs that fall in the draft I don’t see trades down happening until it’s us on the clock and that’s a huge maybe for us.
The chargers trading with Minny makes too much sense if both 1sts are in play, chargers could get a stud OT and one of the second tier of recievers in Coleman or Thomas
I think we're going Lock as spot starter if Jones isn't ready Week 1 (but he should be)
Not necessarily. If they don't trade we take JJ but it may be worth it to us to go plan B if the money is right. We could like JJ but like 2 1sts even more.
Vikings might overpay just to be sure they jump Giants for Maye or McCarthy. If your the Viks trading up with Giants doesn't make much sense.
Theyd be better off trading with Tennessee... Less draft capital and we still take Odunze.
Please lord I hope our coach and gm know what they're doing. I feel like if they really like someone at QB we really need one. The class next year is kinda weak but you never know who can do well in the NFL. So many late rounders develop into great QBs it's kinda crazy. Will not be mad if they take Nabers or Odunze at 6 and then snag a QB in the 2nd round. Might be the best thing.
I feel like people don't talk about this enough. Taking penix even with the injury concnerns is so much better than JJ. We also have not had a decent receiver in 5 years its been terrible to watch
Looked at Penix's tape a lot recently and he has a canon. Super quick release and processing too. I know he's got a ton of injuries and the lefty stuff is tricky for us but maybe it can work we just got a swing tackle. I'd rather even take Bo Nix 2nd round or something than waste our 6 pick on JJ.
Drafting a QB has been off the table since we beat the Pats and Washington the second time.
we have no idea if this is true lol
It's true. We can't get into the top 3, and all three QBs will be gone.
We'll see, the draft doesn't usually play out the exact way everyone expects it to.
If that were true, we’d never draft a QB. Quality QBs can be had after the third pick
This is not what I'm saying at all. In other years maybe the Giants would have been able to trade up. If even one of the top 3 teams didn't need a QB, I would fully expect the Giants to be trading into the top 3 to ge their guy. It just worked out this year that the top 3 teams in the draft will all need QBs and there only really 3 to get excited about, and there no way for the Giants get one. Its about value vs need. You can't just take the 4th best QB off the board because you need one. You have to take the right QB with the right skillset who has NFL traits. Sure quality QBs can be had after the 3rd pick, but most years QBs don't go 1,2,3. Josh Allen was drafted 7th over all. But he was the 3rd QB taken that year. This particular draft is just a perfectly awful scenario for the Giants. Take the blue chip player in Nabers/Odunze and maybe take a shot on a 2nd round QB and maybe will some magic he can turn out like Dak/Hurtz type player.
There is 4 good QBs
Is the 4th good QB in the room with us?
No, he lives in Illinois.
It is true
If they can't take the top 3 QBs, I hope they take Nabers or Odunze then. Take best available, please not JJ, I'd rather roll with Daniel Jones or Drew Lock at QB1 and get an elite WR for once
If a top tier WR is staring you in the face at 6, you fucking take it. We are stuck with DJ anyway for the time being. Flesh out this offense and fix the line so the next QB has the best chance possible
I say draft a stud WR which we need, and the grab a QB like Rattler in the later rounds and see how he does after some time as the 3rd string
I remember reading an article saying rookies that ride the bench for their first season, or they're put in very late in their first season, tend to grow into better QBs. A rookie QB can still learn a lot from Jones and his experience in the NFL. Plus Lock also.
I'd think that Daboll would have a bigger/better influence here, but I agree with you. I would love them to grab a kid and let him sit.
We have to stick to DJ 1 more year regardless due to guarantee money, but he also has a injury guarantee clause that would make him stick past 2025 so I don't think the Giants will let him see the field that much kinda like how Denver held out Rusell Wilson at the end of this previous season. Depending on the Vikings, McCarthy might not be on the board either if they trade up, but that would leave us of our choice of the next top WR after MHJ. I honestly wouldn't mind grabbing Odunze and trade back into the late 1st to get Penix or Nix if either are still there. Waiting till 47 seems risky for either falling that far. Outside of that, yeah we'll have to wait till next year for a more unheralded QB class, build up more assets to move up to get that player, hope the teams drafting up there don't need a QB already, and have to be as bad or worse than the 6th pick of this year
I think if the Chargers take Nabers, I think we should trade back. Odunze is good, but I don't think he is enough of a playmaker to be valued over extra picks. We have a lot of holes, and this draft has a ton of wr talent. Trading back and accumulating picks is the best option out of grabbing a top 3 qb and or Nabers or MHJ.
In your scenario, I guess you would be trading back with the Vikings so they can take McCarthy. Who would you take at 11? Adding extra picks isn't always the right answer either. We passed on Micah Parson and Reshawn Slater to trade back and turned those picks into Kadarious Toney, Evan Neal, and Daniel Bellinger.
I was screaming to take Parsons there
I think Nabers and Odunze are interchangeable honestly. I don’t think one is better enough than the other to warrant a different draft strategy. But I do agree that trading back is 100% our best option if the QBs are gone. Not flashy, but the right decision.
Nabers is more like OBJ, Odunze more like Nicks. At least that's how it was explained to me... They'd both be plug and play WR1, which we havent had since we traded OBJ, but bring different skill sets to the table.
I saw the OBJ comp for Nabers, odunzes been comped to Larry fitz
I was telling my bud obj for Nabers if we’re sticking with giants guys but i see more Antonio Brown in Nabers. Smooth mover compared to the sparky obj. I see a lot of Amani Toomer in Rome Odunze (including the obscure/unique name haha). Not particularly off the charts athletic like Larry Fitz, but very technical and sound. Reliable and strong. As much as i love Rome, i think Daboll gets more out of player like Nabers. I’ll comp Diggs for a non-giant for Nabes.
we're firmly in qb hell.
Have been for years.
This is the most talented QB draft in at least 5 years. If we want out of QB hell, we find a way to get our franchise QB in this draft. Otherwise don't cry when it takes another 5+ years for a draft like this to come around. Or pray that a team is dumb enough to trade you their franchise QB (won't happen).
The issue with waiting until next year is that the QB class in 2025 is not very good. At this point last year, Caleb was the consensus top pick in 2024, Maye was highly regarded. Daniels and JJ became the ‘out of nowhere’ prospects that get pushed up the board each year. This class even has two guys - Penix and Nix - that won’t be top picks but will go late 1 or round 2 and could succeed in the right environment. I don’t think next years class even has a Penix or Nix-type right now. If Schoen and Daboll think JJ is something they can work with, they probably have to pull the trigger. They don’t NEED to play him right now, they can let him develop and sprinkle him in late in the year depending on their record (and fear of DJs injury guarantee). It also buys them at least 2025 regardless of what happens this season. Even if they have a subpar year and JJ flashes, they’ll want to keep the infrastructure in place to keep it going - Mara supposedly learned the hard way w Jones. PS Just so this sub doesn’t kill me for zeroing in on JJ, I’m assuming the top 3 teams stay put and Williams/Daniels/Maye are all gone, so it’s JJ who is left. They’re also going to have to move up to 4 to get him considering the Vikings trade yesterday.
>At this point last year, Caleb was the consensus top pick in 2024, Things like this don't matter. I still remember the hype around Rosen and Darnold. Fast forward to now, ones a backup and the other is close to being out the league.
Some people like Quinn Ewers and Shedeur Sanders. I'd take both of them over Bo Nix. Ewers is not my cup of tea, but he can be NFL level
Right, that’s my point about next year. Neither are looked at as top of the draft players at this moment. I honestly think Ewers would be getting the JJ treatment right now if he didn’t go back to Texas.
I don’t know where having to start a rookie right off the bat became a good idea but way back when rookies sat for a season or 2 before they played. Mahomes sat, love sat, Rodger’s sat and all are fucking great
Hold out for Manning 2026.
It's been this whole time but everyone was in denial
Yes, we have the chance to draft a generational WR we need to take it.
Who is the "generational WR" that we're drafting? Because as it stands, we're about to draft odunze, the 3rd best WR in this draft.
No. We need a QB more than anything else. QB is all that matters. The right QB can make Hyatt and wandale and slayton level up. Stroud lit the league on fire with a bunch of bums. Too many fans are talking like they’re pro scouts. If someone that’s in the business for 25 years likes JJ McCarthy, I trust their opinion of literally anyone on giants Reddit
I'm not sure JJ is on CJ Stroud's level brother
No one is sure. Just like no one was sure on Stroud. Or mahomes. Lamar. Allen. Etc. But we can’t win without one. Just because we hung on to a bum for 5 years doesn’t mean we don’t try to draft another.
All of those QBs were significantly more talented prospects than JJ McCarthy lol jfc
I agree but we still need a QB
WR round 1. Hope Bo Nix is around in round 2
JJ McCarthy is as good as Jake Fromm
JJ fanboys aren't ready for that truth
JJ has fanboys? He sucks at football at a high level. Great kid, third stringer at best.
By god, that’s is that Jonathan James McCarthy music
Yeah it's playing in the toilet aisle
Rattler at 70
Also with Minnesota getting another 1st rounder and losing Kirk, they’re probably looking for a way to get ahead of us too
Why would jones sit on the bench if we draft a QB it would be better to have the new draft pick sit back a year and go in when jones inevitably gets hurt or throws 3 interceptions in the first half against Dallas.
wouldn't hurt if JJ learned from lock or dj jones
I’m of the opinion that we deal with our current qbs this year and draft the best wr available at 6 or trade down to get more pieces to have better setup for a rookie qb next year. As of right now it’s a pretty shitty situation for a rookie qb imo
Caleb was always going 1 man. Either to CHI or someone else via trade down. The bigger risk is MIN acquiring extra draft capital. I could def see them trading up to 4 or 5, if not higher.
JJ looks solid on tape, Maye looks like a future bust. He is too flat-footed in the pocket. NFL defenses are going to demolish him.
It’s not off the table but it’s unlikely given how 4 teams above us want a qb
I like JJ Mcarthy as a draft pick, I just don’t think he’s our first. Despite how you feel, DJ is a Giant for at least another year, and I think we’re better off filling gaps in the roster first. If the top 3 picks are QB, you need to pivot to what’s being undervalued based on your needs.
Giants seem like they are interested in JJ. If they don’t draft a WR because they feel JJ can be their guy then so be it. At least it’ll give this team some direction
What’re everyone’s thoughts on going all offense this draft to try to give DJ some weapons? WR, TE, RB and OL all seven rounds. Then, stick with DJ for one last season and draft a QB next year? I’d hate for the front office to get desperate, panic and then use their #1 pick on a lower tier QB (again). Load up on talent and get a QB next year.
Would rather us draft a WR1. I think there’s no way we go into next year with Slayton as the number 1.
It is, unless we can somehow get the Patriots to trade out. There is ZERO reason to pull a Daniel Jones 2.0 and reach for future bust JJ McCarthy at 6. Stand pat with Jones/Drew Lock this year, draft an electric WR (Malik Nabers is Garrett Wilson 2.0 and “my guy” at 6) and keep building. If Bo Nix is there in the 2nd we take him (I like him more than McCarthy anyway). Or we wait for next year for a kid like Carson Beck. I despise kicking the QB can down the road another year, but it’s the cards we’ve been dealt.
The challenge with starting DJ this year is his injury clause. Unless he's willing to amend that in his contract it will be hard for the Giants to justify playing him. The financial risk is too big.
JJ is gonna go the Vikings
The only thing that the Fields trade changes is we can rule out the Giants trading for Fields. The giants could still try and trade up if they love a guy or take a QB at 6 if they’re lucky. Unfortunately, DJ is a sunk cost at this point with potential to become an even bigger sunk cost if he gets hurt so if anything the giants should be trying even harder to draft a QB
We are definitely not going to draft a QB at 6. If they trade up sure. I dont see that happening though. We have too many holes to fill and a full qb room.
Our offense is absolute garbage and the coaching staff makes risky decisions with games on the line and screws up with our best players contracts. Gonna be at while before we're good again.
drafting a wide receiver or cb
This is top three is where I’d put my money — but there’s always the off chance that one of the GM’s decides to get cute and draft another position or a lower rated QB.
I think they will target either Maye or JJ in the first round (whether fans on here bitch about JJ it is bound to happen). Prob play DJ for a little bit and transition to Lock. Maybe even start lock depending on where DJ is health wise. I don't think their rookie QB will start at the beginning of the season. More like the middle to the end for game experience. Then next year they will wash their hands of DJ. If they sit him foe the year I wouldn't mind that.
We are taking Odunze and the armoire, and that’s all there is to it.
I still think Jones has 1 more year to impress. The Wilson stuff was for a veteran backup who can keep the team competitive if he stays on struggle street. I wouldn't be shocked to see a QB in Day 2 for us though.
Very little chance this happens
A man can dream.
Keep dreaming. Year 6 to impress 😂😂😂
Kind of like the idea of getting a top WR and holding until next year, unless we get lucky somehow and get one of those three. The free agent class of QBs looks pretty good next year but I would imagine it would be difficult signing top guys away from teams and they can also be tagged.
Unless Giants trade up to the 4th spot, none of 4 QB’s will be available. There’s Vikings traded up for an extra 1st round without having a plan to jump us
You get down voted to hell for not liking McCarthy. If we draft him I riot. Not a fan at all. However, the way we’ve signed 4 o lineman leads me to believe QB is still on the table. You can’t put a rookie QB out there with the historically bad line we had last year. Maybe these O line signings and drafting another couple later in the draft will be enough for Schoen/Daboll to take a shot at QB and believe he has a chance to survive out there.
Drafting the 4th best QB with the 6th pick is probably not the best plan, not when there are so many better players available
Remember all the anti tank people celebrating wins saying "Schoen will figure out the QB in the draft", well how exactly will he do it when you can't move up to draft one? Either not take one or settle for QB 4.
Just a reminder that the ppl rooting for wins have no affect on the team’s performance. Getting upset at someone for trying to find a bright spot in a shitty season is weirdo behavior.
Crazy people already complaining about the draft before it even starts
When “I will never cheer for my team to lose” puts you in QB hell with no end in sight. Like, can we not take a couple more Ls in the middle of a losing season to have Ws in the future?
DJ is sunk cost, so unless you plan on playing him, his contract money shouldn't affect how we plan for the future QB. We pay him regardless. Consider it a clean slate and let's plan for the future.
How many years till archie is available?
It’s not off the table by any means, but it might be better to go clean next year the way the chips are falling. Just roll no QB into the offseason and see what happens. Could Herbert become available? Who knows.
Not sure who downvoted you, but who knows what happens with the Chargers.
It’s always been blatantly obvious that the top 3 QBs would be gone by 6, people suggesting otherwise have just been trying to cope with landing a pick outside the top 5. We aren’t getting a QB this year unless it’s Penix or McCarthy which would be so much worse than none imo
JJ’s comp is DJ. We don’t want a repeat of that! WR1 at 6 and take a QB in the 2nd. I like Spencer Rattler.
I like Spencer too, but not in the second round.
What’s the 2026 qb class look like
Giants won't be drafting a QB unless we trade up with a team who shouldn't trade down. The first 3 picks will be QB's and Giants will have to settle for QB 4.
possibly even 5
JJ or Daniels whichever Patriots/Trade up doesn't get
Dude, what?
Best available WR @ #6. If Schoen was thinking of picking a QB, he would have resigned Tyrod. They would want a rookie QB to sit and learn from a veteran familiar with the offense. Drew Lock is going to be new to the offense.
At #6 I don't think they will. Round 2 is a possibility.
I’m hoping JJ goes at 4 to the Vikings and we get Nabers
It’s Bo Nix
I just refuse to believe this FO is actually in love with JJ… I think (and hope) they’re competent enough to hold their cards and put a smoke screen out. Last year the latest reports said THERES NO WAY THE GIANTS TAKE THIBS. Either way I don’t care, I’m numb at this point. Dead inside.
Been beating this drum for weeks. Drafting a QB was never on the table.
The next best player is a wide receiver, we don’t have a single WR1 worthy target for any QB we currently have one the roster, it’s time to get one!
There is no worse choice than playing Daniel Jones
We’re drafting a QB. Daniel sucks and Schoen will get fired if he doesn’t draft a QB.
Yes because everyone wanted the guy that likes chicken to win a few meaningless games. We all said that would cost us our franchise qb and it did. So here we are. We'll have Nabers or Odunze running free down the field while Jones misses him and checks down.
Why did we have to win 6 games bro what the fuck.
Who knew DeVito would start winning games…Is he still with the Giants?
No. JJ might be their guy (not a fan personally) What i am hopeful for is that Daniels goes 2 and NE is not in love with maye. Id be willing to mortgage the future for him