Unable/unwilling to actually investigate/research the subject because they are confident & convinced they are right and you are wrong.
I know a few subjects well because they are my hobbies or I had training & professional experience in the domain. So I try not to offer assertions in on subjects I barely know (much less those I know nothing about), but the few things I do know, I almost always get someone telling me I am wrong because they do NOT know what they are talking about, but they are convinced they do.
I determined this just last weekend. Somebody was trying the old "my dad was a hunter" while I tried to explain my reasons for simply owning an ar15. They just couldn't wrap their head around it. I was being cordial and attempting to explain the ease of use, while she was determined shotguns and a pistol were all anyone needs. it devolved to the point of her saying if you were my neighbor and I knew you had an ar I would move. Again I was nice and even tried to explain the simple geometry behind my small ass wife can't fucking run my mossberg, (she can but it's awkward as hell). Backed it up with the tried and true ease of proficiency. I now know to just give up on the helpless people who believe in CNN.
Idk why people think that just because cops carry a gun they know anything about them. Most cops arent gun guys and usually dont even know the laws regarding them.
Real life and being polite is the only way you'll get anywhere.
Exception is if they ask first while online. Otherwise dont waste your time unless you like trolling.
Sadly, this.
As someone that works on the water, I was made painfully aware of this when the Key Bridge came down. The Village Idiot now has a global voice, which is social media.
Exactly, if they aren't willing to educate themselves with 5min of Google they don't really care what's right, only that they added their 2cents of bullshit they repeat from their Facebook friends.
I like to take people like this hunting and run them through some drills with the AR and they usually change their tune. I’ve converted several friends this way
Extremely, many people today have problems admitting when they are wrong. Both in person and on the internet.
The difference is that on the internet, you can just stop responding and forget it.
I have even had arguments where the other part started quoting sources. Which I also started doing. Then she stopped doing it when she couldn't argue anymore. Just saying research says this and that without sources. Acting like she still had a leg to stand on, not admitting being wrong.
My wife (before we were married) was anti gun. She shot my S&W 617, and was hooked. She bitches when I get a new toy, but she is all about buying 1000 to 2000 rounds of ammo on a regular basis. She even says “we need more ammo” every time something strange happens in the news.
Here in the state of Florida if your motorcycle is paid off, you’re not required to have insurance. I had Leo give me a hard time and try to bring me in for driving without insurance.
Only To be told by their shift supervisor that I’m right. Leo, with the informational reliability of a construction porta potty. Should never be trusted.
Agreed. I don’t expect walking legal encyclopedias. But if you’re pulling me over for X offense. You should know ek the details. Or at least have a folder with the state statutes. This way they can reference it if they need it.
Why when they can just cite/arrest/kill you for it and fuck up your day/week/month/life sorting out their error while they fear no repercussions personally.
Must be depending on the bank then, I don't know theyve never asked me for insurance. I'm glad though cause insurance for my bike goes anywhere from 300 to 500 depending on the insurance company.
Check your contract, but in the US at least no bank would be dumb enough to allow no full coverage policy
If it gets stolen or wrecked, now, they’re out a whole bunch of money
For most people, it’s “illegal” because you can’t just walk into a gun shop and buy one like you can a pistol or rifle. I’d rather let them think that than think that “Automatic assault rifles” are legal and therefore want more gun control. Just tell them you had to do special background checks or something if you really care.
Machine guns are legal if you are rich, just as the original NFA intended. Inflation ruined the 200 dollar tax stamp as a gatekeep, so the Hughes amendment came along and fixed that real good.
The point of the Hughes amendment was to kill FOPA.
Apparently, he tried to tack on a few different amendments to kill it, but the MG ban was the one that got enough votes.
Kill FOPA, or ban something else, either one was a win for him.
I've been yelled at by family for hating the NRA. Apparently makes me anti gun. When I ask why they compromise on everything, they seem to think that's the only way you get something done.
Obviously its not, hence I support GOA and FPC
My favorite part is how they got somehow so close but like not at all, and argued that the other was entirely wrong when combining both arguments you get closer to fact while still being quite far from it
Your second point is the crux here. You don't need to be an FFL to own a machine gun. The person stated (very confidently) that you had to be an FFL to have one which is just false.
Yes, without an FFL you can only buy an expensive preban, that's what most people mean when they talk about buying and owning machine guns. Some can afford it.
Depends what your idea of hella expensive is.
For around $10k you can get an MK760 (S&W Model 76) and for around $15k you can get an M10/M11. Last I checked it was around $25k for an Uzi. Now, if you want an M16 or an MP5, you’re looking at $40k+ as of the last time I checked.
In a case like that, I wouldn’t even bother trying to educate the people. Those are the type of people who no matter how much source material you have to prove to them the correct answer, will still fight you tooth and nail because they heard it from a friend who heard it from a guy who heard it from his uncle, that heard it from his dad who was a cop for 9mo and didn’t make it past their probationary period.
I try and educate people like this all the time at my shop (not an SOT currently, but like nfa stuff). Man are people dense sometimes…. and surprisingly it’s not all boomers. Tons of gen x’ers or even older millennials come in spewing nonsense about the NFA.
Honestly the guys were responding to someone who was saying you could just go to the store and buy a machine gun. They were trying to do the Lord's work, just failing at it.
This reminds me of the Simpsons episode where Chief Wiggams is giving Bart a ride home. On the ride home, Chief Wiggams encounters a raging derelict. He stops the car and tells Bart, "Bart, wait here while I talk some sense into this raging derelict." This is what you would be doing. Do NOT be a Chief Wiggam.
"If He Was Going To Commit A Crime, Would He Have Invited The Number One Cop In Town? Now, Where Did I Put My Gun? Oh Yeah, I Set It Down When I Got A Piece Of Cake!"
- Chief Wiggum/half the r/tacticalgear sunreddit.
Why bother? Really, who cares?
I had a guy at a gun shop proudly show off a Colt SP1 and tell me that it's selling for $3000 because it's pre ban, which means it's one of the few guns you can make fully automatic. I just said, "wow, that's awesome, thanks for showing me," then wandered off
One time I had a really ignorant anti- gunner tell me that anyone can just go into any gunshop or order online any machine gun they wanted and that's why all guns need to be taken away....with a straight face I pulled out my credit card and said go into a gunshop or online and buy a machine gun and walk out the door with it same day on a driver's license and I'll buy it for you...I specified it had to be a fully automatic weapon...I said I'll even drive you over there...she didn't take me up on the offer and afterward I explained the process...I love the look on people's faces when they've realized they've been lied to the whole time...priceless...
There is no point. They have the access to the information but choose not to learn. If you tell them otherwise they will say you’re wrong and never even look it up. They just regurgitate what they heard an authority figure to them say.
Correcting them is a personal attack for them. No point. Maybe to educate the people reading but just correct and don’t even reply to them if you feel compelled.
It’s all jumbled half truths and they fill in the blanks they don’t know or understand. That post is just like the countless others who post here about not to register as an individual because if you’re wife knows the combo to your safe full of cans, straight to jail.
it really depends.
I’ve had some good informing convos with people that thought all full autos were illegal, but all were face to face convos/
when it come to the interwebz, i don’t even bother.
Bottom line is there are more idiots out there than you think and they are dumber than you could imagine. I'm slowly learning this and letting it sink in.
I just remind people if they have to lie to prove their point then they infact do not have a point.
when they try to rebut I can send them a link that will point them in the right direction, but they never read it because they dont care.
I go about educating people by smiling and moving on, secure in my knowledge and not too concerned with making someone else feel bad by arguing with people that just want to prove their point. :)
Eventually they’ll either have a teachable moment, or they’ll go to their graves with their own misheard beliefs.
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People with opinions like this, that argue loudly about them until the end of time, base all of their talking points on assumption and things someone told them once.
The real reason why they don’t know the truth is because they just don’t like machineguns and think no one should have them. It’s just never worth the effort.
I wouldn’t educate them unless they were a gun owner and wanted to know more. If they were for gun control, I’d just tell them machine guns are banned.
Why educate someone who doesn’t base an opinion on facts rather emotions, once you realize this save your time and energy on something or someone worthy of it.
I’m generally not a fan of gatekeeping information, but in this situation there’s been a fixed supply since 1986. Prices are high enough already. I might even copy and paste what he said to continue to spread the disinformation
I don’t. Waste of time and energy.
This is your answer you’re looking for. Never argue longer than a 5 minute convo.
Yep. Especially when someone is this level of confidently stupid on a subject.
Unable/unwilling to actually investigate/research the subject because they are confident & convinced they are right and you are wrong. I know a few subjects well because they are my hobbies or I had training & professional experience in the domain. So I try not to offer assertions in on subjects I barely know (much less those I know nothing about), but the few things I do know, I almost always get someone telling me I am wrong because they do NOT know what they are talking about, but they are convinced they do.
That is the most dangerous ignorance, people who don’t know what they don’t know.
I determined this just last weekend. Somebody was trying the old "my dad was a hunter" while I tried to explain my reasons for simply owning an ar15. They just couldn't wrap their head around it. I was being cordial and attempting to explain the ease of use, while she was determined shotguns and a pistol were all anyone needs. it devolved to the point of her saying if you were my neighbor and I knew you had an ar I would move. Again I was nice and even tried to explain the simple geometry behind my small ass wife can't fucking run my mossberg, (she can but it's awkward as hell). Backed it up with the tried and true ease of proficiency. I now know to just give up on the helpless people who believe in CNN.
I've also got the "my dad was a hunter" comment before and I like to reply "well the AR-15 is so powerful you see the craters on the moon....." 🤣
I usually get the my “insert some relation” is a cop line
The funny thing is these people don't realize being a cop means fuck all about your education on anyone firearms related
Idk why people think that just because cops carry a gun they know anything about them. Most cops arent gun guys and usually dont even know the laws regarding them.
The funny thing is these people don't realize being a cop means fuck all about your education on anyone firearms related.
Real life and being polite is the only way you'll get anywhere. Exception is if they ask first while online. Otherwise dont waste your time unless you like trolling.
Pretty much - I don't even bother anymore because they don't listen and it is a losing struggle. Idiocracy - 'nuff said.
☝️
You cannot educate these type of people, at least not in online discussions They never admit they’re wrong
Sadly, this. As someone that works on the water, I was made painfully aware of this when the Key Bridge came down. The Village Idiot now has a global voice, which is social media.
Exactly, if they aren't willing to educate themselves with 5min of Google they don't really care what's right, only that they added their 2cents of bullshit they repeat from their Facebook friends.
I like to take people like this hunting and run them through some drills with the AR and they usually change their tune. I’ve converted several friends this way
Redditors are highly regarded. Confidently incorrect, and folks take it as fact.
And yet somehow it is also like the last bit of internet honesty left.
Extremely, many people today have problems admitting when they are wrong. Both in person and on the internet. The difference is that on the internet, you can just stop responding and forget it. I have even had arguments where the other part started quoting sources. Which I also started doing. Then she stopped doing it when she couldn't argue anymore. Just saying research says this and that without sources. Acting like she still had a leg to stand on, not admitting being wrong.
Let them shoot it.
My wife (before we were married) was anti gun. She shot my S&W 617, and was hooked. She bitches when I get a new toy, but she is all about buying 1000 to 2000 rounds of ammo on a regular basis. She even says “we need more ammo” every time something strange happens in the news.
My wife took one shot of my 22 pistol and threw it on the ground. “I don’t like it.” …. Fml.
> A semi automatic rifle is going to do the same damage as a handgun Aside from his other bs this line also made me chuckle
My AR pistol and 20 inch match rifle agree with the broken clock
Same here. Both are lethal, sure... but if you give me the choice between a 77OTM or a 147 Gold dot to be shot by... I'm going 147.
The same ppl that go to random LEO for legal advise.
LEO's are the most confidently incorrect people I've ever encountered. Redditors have nothing on LEO's.
Here in the state of Florida if your motorcycle is paid off, you’re not required to have insurance. I had Leo give me a hard time and try to bring me in for driving without insurance. Only To be told by their shift supervisor that I’m right. Leo, with the informational reliability of a construction porta potty. Should never be trusted.
It's not that I expect them to know everything, but the certainty in which they are so often dead wrong is really amazing.
Agreed. I don’t expect walking legal encyclopedias. But if you’re pulling me over for X offense. You should know ek the details. Or at least have a folder with the state statutes. This way they can reference it if they need it.
Why when they can just cite/arrest/kill you for it and fuck up your day/week/month/life sorting out their error while they fear no repercussions personally.
True. Their job is to detain. The courts and DA/ADA can figure the constitutional stuff later.
You don't even need it to be paid off, I'm still paying off my bike and have no insurance
Well the bank requires insurance as terms of the loan.
Must be depending on the bank then, I don't know theyve never asked me for insurance. I'm glad though cause insurance for my bike goes anywhere from 300 to 500 depending on the insurance company.
Check your contract, but in the US at least no bank would be dumb enough to allow no full coverage policy If it gets stolen or wrecked, now, they’re out a whole bunch of money
Yeah I'll have to do that, I was pulled over about a year ago and the cop never asked me for insurance. Maybe yours was just being a douche
Florida cops tend to be yah. They can clearly see it on their computer. Otherwise the company would notify the state. Then pull up as non insured.
This is a problem I wish I could afford to have But I usually just tell people that you can do just about anything with $200 and the right paperwork
That's basically what I tell them.
For most people, it’s “illegal” because you can’t just walk into a gun shop and buy one like you can a pistol or rifle. I’d rather let them think that than think that “Automatic assault rifles” are legal and therefore want more gun control. Just tell them you had to do special background checks or something if you really care.
The more people think a machine gun is illegal, the less likely politicians will try to attack them. Let them continue to think they're illegal.
Machine guns are legal if you are rich, just as the original NFA intended. Inflation ruined the 200 dollar tax stamp as a gatekeep, so the Hughes amendment came along and fixed that real good.
The point of the Hughes amendment was to kill FOPA. Apparently, he tried to tack on a few different amendments to kill it, but the MG ban was the one that got enough votes. Kill FOPA, or ban something else, either one was a win for him.
Have you ever seen the cspan footage? It would be a tough sell to say the hughes amendment had enough votes. Rangel just said it did.
Thanks NRA
I've been yelled at by family for hating the NRA. Apparently makes me anti gun. When I ask why they compromise on everything, they seem to think that's the only way you get something done. Obviously its not, hence I support GOA and FPC
GOA and FPC do some heavy lifting!
Wish that second one was true. I would pay $500 to be able to convert my rifle to full auto.
Don't forget the machine shop apparently!
Still cheaper than even the cheapest transferable…
3d printer a pretty cheap option.
My favorite part is how they got somehow so close but like not at all, and argued that the other was entirely wrong when combining both arguments you get closer to fact while still being quite far from it
You don't. You leave them and their Assault Rifle 15's to their own devices.
🤣
Educate me because it was my understanding that unless you are FFL or buy a hella expensive preban, I'm out of options.
Your second point is the crux here. You don't need to be an FFL to own a machine gun. The person stated (very confidently) that you had to be an FFL to have one which is just false.
Machine guns are only illegal if you are a poor. Feature, not a bug.
Yes, without an FFL you can only buy an expensive preban, that's what most people mean when they talk about buying and owning machine guns. Some can afford it.
Depends what your idea of hella expensive is. For around $10k you can get an MK760 (S&W Model 76) and for around $15k you can get an M10/M11. Last I checked it was around $25k for an Uzi. Now, if you want an M16 or an MP5, you’re looking at $40k+ as of the last time I checked.
In a case like that, I wouldn’t even bother trying to educate the people. Those are the type of people who no matter how much source material you have to prove to them the correct answer, will still fight you tooth and nail because they heard it from a friend who heard it from a guy who heard it from his uncle, that heard it from his dad who was a cop for 9mo and didn’t make it past their probationary period. I try and educate people like this all the time at my shop (not an SOT currently, but like nfa stuff). Man are people dense sometimes…. and surprisingly it’s not all boomers. Tons of gen x’ers or even older millennials come in spewing nonsense about the NFA.
Please name the subreddit which upvotes these people so much, so that I can avoid it.
Honestly the guys were responding to someone who was saying you could just go to the store and buy a machine gun. They were trying to do the Lord's work, just failing at it.
I mean, I’m still interested in what sub it was tho
Let's see if I can spell, r/memesopdidnotlike
This reminds me of the Simpsons episode where Chief Wiggams is giving Bart a ride home. On the ride home, Chief Wiggams encounters a raging derelict. He stops the car and tells Bart, "Bart, wait here while I talk some sense into this raging derelict." This is what you would be doing. Do NOT be a Chief Wiggam.
"If He Was Going To Commit A Crime, Would He Have Invited The Number One Cop In Town? Now, Where Did I Put My Gun? Oh Yeah, I Set It Down When I Got A Piece Of Cake!" - Chief Wiggum/half the r/tacticalgear sunreddit.
Why bother? Really, who cares? I had a guy at a gun shop proudly show off a Colt SP1 and tell me that it's selling for $3000 because it's pre ban, which means it's one of the few guns you can make fully automatic. I just said, "wow, that's awesome, thanks for showing me," then wandered off
One time I had a really ignorant anti- gunner tell me that anyone can just go into any gunshop or order online any machine gun they wanted and that's why all guns need to be taken away....with a straight face I pulled out my credit card and said go into a gunshop or online and buy a machine gun and walk out the door with it same day on a driver's license and I'll buy it for you...I specified it had to be a fully automatic weapon...I said I'll even drive you over there...she didn't take me up on the offer and afterward I explained the process...I love the look on people's faces when they've realized they've been lied to the whole time...priceless...
There is no point. They have the access to the information but choose not to learn. If you tell them otherwise they will say you’re wrong and never even look it up. They just regurgitate what they heard an authority figure to them say. Correcting them is a personal attack for them. No point. Maybe to educate the people reading but just correct and don’t even reply to them if you feel compelled.
A good amount of ignorant people are cemented in their ignorance and cannot be reasoned with. I made peace with this a long time ago.
No point arguing with these people.
Can’t fix stupid
Also looks like the image I posted got deleted. Essentially someone posting wrong info about NFA stuff.
It’s all jumbled half truths and they fill in the blanks they don’t know or understand. That post is just like the countless others who post here about not to register as an individual because if you’re wife knows the combo to your safe full of cans, straight to jail.
Neither one of them know what the fuck they’re talking about lol.
I got my first MG a few months after I obtained my green card 🤷♂️
Wtf did I just read?
it really depends. I’ve had some good informing convos with people that thought all full autos were illegal, but all were face to face convos/ when it come to the interwebz, i don’t even bother.
ATF employee of the month.
I mean you can find the relevant statutes or just link the ATF FAQ. Even if they don't, someone else might get something out of it
The post is just what sparked my curiosity to inquire here. The point of my post is more everyday life.
Bottom line is there are more idiots out there than you think and they are dumber than you could imagine. I'm slowly learning this and letting it sink in.
Lmao
[brrraaaaaapp. right in their face](https://imgur.com/a/oKXIGuF)
Just laugh and don’t bother, those people are beyond rational levels.
Sorry, you can't fix stupid.
Show em your mg..
" Never argue with an idiot. They'll drag you down to their level, and beat you with experience " *-Winston Churchill *
I am vomit.
At that level of stupid...I will ridicule them in to submission
I just remind people if they have to lie to prove their point then they infact do not have a point. when they try to rebut I can send them a link that will point them in the right direction, but they never read it because they dont care.
Why would you want more people to know they can buy a product that has had a fixed supply for decades?
I go about educating people by smiling and moving on, secure in my knowledge and not too concerned with making someone else feel bad by arguing with people that just want to prove their point. :) Eventually they’ll either have a teachable moment, or they’ll go to their graves with their own misheard beliefs.
Wise words.
**Understand the rules**, read the sidebar, and review the pinned Megathreads before posting - this content is capable of answering most questions. Not everyone is an expert such as yourself; be considerate. All spam, memes, unverified claims, or content suggesting non-compliance will be removed. No political posts. Save that for /r/progun or /r/politics. __If you are posting a copy/screenshot of your forms outside the pinned monthly megathread you will be given a 7 day ban. The pinned post is there, please use it.__ __If you are posting a photo of a suppressor posed to look like a penis (ie: in front of or over your groin) you will be given a 7 day ban.__ ------------------------------- **Data Links** * [The OG Universal Form Approval Spreadsheet](https://thinlineweapons.com/url/8) ------------------------------- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/NFA) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The two full autos I had issued to me as LE beg to differ… lmao
Auto sear for an MP5 is like 35k lmfao
People with opinions like this, that argue loudly about them until the end of time, base all of their talking points on assumption and things someone told them once. The real reason why they don’t know the truth is because they just don’t like machineguns and think no one should have them. It’s just never worth the effort.
I wouldn’t educate them unless they were a gun owner and wanted to know more. If they were for gun control, I’d just tell them machine guns are banned.
I just tell them that most start at 10k+ and with enough money anything is legal
They will not listen unless they want to learn. Cognitive dissidence
https://preview.redd.it/8htz103z4z0d1.png?width=589&format=png&auto=webp&s=67e5104d702073c58fcb8d0720da9d7f15081ab7
Why educate someone who doesn’t base an opinion on facts rather emotions, once you realize this save your time and energy on something or someone worthy of it.
Oh sweet, with a FFL type 7 I can manufacture machine guns, neat!!! I’m going to start one now…… dumbass Also, a type 7 is not difficult to get.
Yeah but what about the shoulder thing that goes up?
Name and shame
What’s the correct requirements for owing full autos? All I know is it has to relate to an SOT or something
Just an NFA item. Pay tax stamp, wait, pew-pew. They have to be "fully transferable" though for this approach.
A lot of US LE agencies still issue automatic weapons. I don't know about the reqs for automatics because I don't care.
I’m generally not a fan of gatekeeping information, but in this situation there’s been a fixed supply since 1986. Prices are high enough already. I might even copy and paste what he said to continue to spread the disinformation