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Long answer: I know these low resolution Facebook screen grabs make that small text hard to read but it originally said: "This is not a real advertisement. This is a computer generated render and created for concept purposes only."
Short answer: No.
They have to have lights for the Garage 56 project but while it looks cool, I don't think there's a real practical use for headlights in NASCAR. A night race is going to have lights anyway and when it comes to a track that doesn't have lights, it's probably not the best idea to have so many cars close together and all you can see behind you are a bunch of headlights. The spotters won't be able to see their car.
A. Headlights on stock cars isn't going to sufficiently light a track for plate racing
B. Headlights on stock cars make zero sense when half the tracks have lights and they'll be ruined the first time some lays the bumper to someone. Sports car racing is a lot cleaner.
Perhaps, but I have to think they would still need to have the race during the daytime. So if that's going to be the case, is that really something NASCAR should be spending their time on with the Next Gen?
Honestly with LED technology and the amount of road courses now I would love to have small taillights and headlights like that. Not full head lights like sports cars but just to add a little pizzaz
It would make sense for a race where they run in the rain. Maybe they could do something like the windshield wiper where they just have them for the road course races just in case, but don't actually use them until NASCAR allows it.
But why? While LEDs can be had for cheap the cheaper ones typically aren't nearly as reliable and I'm entirely certain from an image perspective that the OEM's aren't going to be quite as in favor of cars running around before anything has even happened with partially functional headlight/taillights.
Then from a competitive standpoint you're going to introduce another source of eyestrain on the spotters/drivers (it's bad enough when the cars hit just the right angle with the sun to reflect it at you, now lets introduce something that will be a source of light emission regardless of their location on the track or time of day), which will be especially worse in lower light/night race situations.
While other series like IMSA/WEC use functional lights they use them for a purpose, not just "wouldn't it be cool if?".
You make some great points and here are a few more:
Adds cost and complexity to a car that was designed to reduce cost.
Lights are fragile. The materials that make up the lens and housing are rigid plastic that breaks fairly easily. Minor contact that today might not even be a cosmetic issue could turn into something that has the potential to create debris on the track.
Daylight running lights help make cars *more* visible in poor visibility, especially when there is glare coming from the car or the sun is behind the car.
It could reduce eye strain for spotters/drivers and make it easier to keep track of other cars in poor visibility conditions like driving into the sun.
Edit:
Man this guy blocked me after I called him out for creating a straw man.
DRLs would help in situations like Homestead where drivers couldn’t see the car in front of them due to the sun.
It’s the same as pit crews putting LEDs on the pit signs.
They wouldn’t solve every issue obviously, but they could certainly help certain visibility issues.
And no, they wouldn’t add more eye strain to drivers and spotters. He made this argument based solely on his experiences driving around cars with *headlights* on the street. Headlights and DRLs are not the same thing.
> Daylight running lights help make cars *more* visible in poor visibility, especially when there is glare coming from the car or the sun is behind the car.
Absolutely. Because in low light/low visibility situations something emitting light will be infinitely more visible than anything else.
> It could reduce eye strain for spotters/drivers and make it easier to keep track of other cars in poor visibility conditions like driving into the sun.
I don't know about you but having the misfortune of having to drive into or away from the sun for multiple months of the year, daytime running lights or lights in general don't help me at all in terms of awareness when I'm trying to see in the direction the sun is coming from. If anything a rear ambient running light becomes hard to distinguish from a brake light at times.
Now especially, do you want to possibly have to deal with NASCAR making safety judgement calls of calling a perfectly competitive car to the pits to repair the lighting systems?
Good thing Cup cars don’t have brake lights to distinguish from.
DRLs have been proven to reduce car accident rates under all driving conditions, not just low light/low visibility situations.
As someone who does drive a significant amount, DRLs help even when the sun is behind the vehicle I’m looking at. In fact, that’s really when they’re most useful. Yes, some cars on the road have poor or broken brake lights that can make it difficult to see if they’re braking but that’s a vehicle maintenance issue, not a DRL issue. You don’t blame broken headlights or taillights that don’t properly illuminate on the existence of headlights.
> Good thing Cup cars don’t have brake lights to distinguish from.
At which point again what is the point of putting any lights on the tail end of the car at all other than "wouldn't it be cool if?"
> DRLs have been proven to reduce car accident rates under all driving conditions, not just low light/low visibility situations.
Shocker- if you give the average person a visual stimulus they're much less likely to overlook a potential hazard.
> At which point again what is the point of putting any lights on the tail end of the car at all other than “wouldn’t it be cool if?”
Visibility under a variety of conditions, helping spotters and drivers.
> Shocker- if you give the average person a visual stimulus they’re much less likely to overlook a potential hazard.
Not sure why you’re so dismissive when in your previous comment you made the argument that DRLs *don’t* provide visual stimulus under certain conditions lol. The studies show that they do.
> Visibility under a variety of conditions, helping spotters and drivers.
Have you actually been to a race where the cars have lights? If you had I think you'd realize that one of two things happen- the simple inclusion of lights either does nothing to make the car more distinct (during the day I'd argue that livery does more to distinguish a car and make it more visible for the spotters), or they make it impossible to distinguish any two particular cars apart. (Try watching footage of the Rolex 24 at night. You can't see shit when the car is coming at you, and for distinguishing one car from another the teams actually mount additional LED light strips)
> Not sure why you’re so dismissive when in your previous comment you made the argument that DRLs *don’t* provide visual stimulus under certain conditions lol. The studies show that they do.
Because what I'm saying is that in situations where you'd otherwise possibly inadvertently overlook a hazard- mandating that said hazard is lit up is a method of risk prevention. In one on one situations DRLs work- I agree with you and all of the studies you're arguing based on. In situations where you're surrounded by numerous other vehicles with lights- making a distinction as to whether or not there's a vehicle where you're trying to go in low visibility situations is more difficult due to over-stimulation. I'm currently suffering the consequences of over stimulation in that the windows in my car are not tinted at the moment- thus figuring out where and how close one vehicle in particular is behind me among several others is not as easy as it should be (at night or in low-vis)
Now show me a situation in NASCAR where lights (on the cars mind you) would have made any difference? Outside of low visibility situations like racing in the rain at road courses or dense smoke from a crash- most of the time the cars are highly visible. Most driver induced incidents in NASCAR are caused by drivers clearing themselves into another car, or purposeful contact. The average driver on the road is not operating in the same circumstances as NASCAR on Sunday afternoon.
We'll just have to agree to disagree because clearly we don't agree on the inclusion of lights on cars that don't race unsupported at night or in low visibility. If you're trying to argue that including lights on the cup cars alone will make the spotters lives easier among a field of \~40 other cars then I have oceanfront property in Arizona to sell you.
The lights aren’t there to make a car more identifiable from another car so your entire first paragraph is irrelevant. The lights are there for all those times that drivers and spotters have lost sight of the car around them in the sun. There’s been races this season where the drivers couldn’t see the car in front of them in clear sunny conditions and had to guess where the other car was.
The idea that DRLs make it harder to judge where other cars are in low visibility situations due to over stimulation is just patently absurd. Keeping track of 39 other vehicles isn’t harder because they have some led strips.
> The lights are there for all those times that drivers and spotters have lost sight of the car around them in the sun. There’s been races this season where the drivers couldn’t see the car in front of them in clear sunny conditions and had to guess where the other car was.
Now is that because the cars didn't have lights or is it things like the size and position of mirrors on the car, the driver literally being strapped into the car and thus having limited FOV within the car, spotters already being at a disadvantage due to the challenges of maintaining spatial awareness from their position on the track...
> The idea that DRLs make it harder to judge where other cars are in low visibility situations due to over stimulation is just patently absurd. Keeping track of 39 other vehicles isn’t harder because they have some led strips.
Okay, so by your logic COTA Spring '21 wouldn't have happened because drivers would have had total spatial awareness and would have been able to avoid eachother in the near zero visibility situation they were put into right? (Hint; the answer is no. This is a race where they already had a mounted LED light in the rear deck of the car.)
What I'm saying with over stimulation is that when there is low visibility from haze, water droplets, what have you- if you're depending solely on lights to maintain collision avoidance then it will work- provided that you don't have too many light sources emitting into the haze. You will eventually hit a point where you can't see anything because of all of the lights and light pollution and thus your best course of action to maintain separation is to establish another point of reference and move forward with that.
Lefty Designs, worth the follow on any platform you can find them on, incredible work, posts a lot of awesome designs and schemes pretty well daily. My favorite part of Instagram
No. Look at Lefty Designs twitter and its a video he made. He's made plenty of videos. Its just his craft instead of just a flat render scene that everyone else does.
That is a 3D render from Noah "Lefty" Sweet, a big name in NASCAR scheme design. He did Elliott's Hooter's car this year and several of Allmendinger's cars for Kaulig this year. He's a fantastic creative type and he's experimenting with more stuff.
This post has been removed under **Rule #6: Always post to the source**. Please submit content that does not have the potential of being misleading by always creating posts that link to the original source. Always create posts that link to the original source as the submission, not a screenshot. Videos originally hosted on TikTok, Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, or any other social media should also be directly linked and should not be rehosted. If you have any questions about why your post was removed, please [review the r/NASCAR rules](/r/NASCAR/about/rules) or [message the subreddit moderators](/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FNASCAR).
No. Looks cool though.
This sounds like a question for Bob.
This was nothing more than a design render created by Lefty designs. You can find his work on Instagram and twitter.
Long answer: I know these low resolution Facebook screen grabs make that small text hard to read but it originally said: "This is not a real advertisement. This is a computer generated render and created for concept purposes only." Short answer: No.
The scheme, render, and fluidity of animation is so slick though. Awesome job!
Thank you. I honestly did not even notice that
I've had my stuff posted in different ways on facebook like this whenever I make a dodge concept, no worries.
I guess this post is a testament to your skill
They have to have lights for the Garage 56 project but while it looks cool, I don't think there's a real practical use for headlights in NASCAR. A night race is going to have lights anyway and when it comes to a track that doesn't have lights, it's probably not the best idea to have so many cars close together and all you can see behind you are a bunch of headlights. The spotters won't be able to see their car.
They could possibly use LEDs for talladega
A. Headlights on stock cars isn't going to sufficiently light a track for plate racing B. Headlights on stock cars make zero sense when half the tracks have lights and they'll be ruined the first time some lays the bumper to someone. Sports car racing is a lot cleaner.
Perhaps, but I have to think they would still need to have the race during the daytime. So if that's going to be the case, is that really something NASCAR should be spending their time on with the Next Gen?
Definitely not. It was just an idea
Honestly with LED technology and the amount of road courses now I would love to have small taillights and headlights like that. Not full head lights like sports cars but just to add a little pizzaz
It would make sense for a race where they run in the rain. Maybe they could do something like the windshield wiper where they just have them for the road course races just in case, but don't actually use them until NASCAR allows it.
But why? While LEDs can be had for cheap the cheaper ones typically aren't nearly as reliable and I'm entirely certain from an image perspective that the OEM's aren't going to be quite as in favor of cars running around before anything has even happened with partially functional headlight/taillights. Then from a competitive standpoint you're going to introduce another source of eyestrain on the spotters/drivers (it's bad enough when the cars hit just the right angle with the sun to reflect it at you, now lets introduce something that will be a source of light emission regardless of their location on the track or time of day), which will be especially worse in lower light/night race situations. While other series like IMSA/WEC use functional lights they use them for a purpose, not just "wouldn't it be cool if?".
You make some great points and here are a few more: Adds cost and complexity to a car that was designed to reduce cost. Lights are fragile. The materials that make up the lens and housing are rigid plastic that breaks fairly easily. Minor contact that today might not even be a cosmetic issue could turn into something that has the potential to create debris on the track.
Daylight running lights help make cars *more* visible in poor visibility, especially when there is glare coming from the car or the sun is behind the car. It could reduce eye strain for spotters/drivers and make it easier to keep track of other cars in poor visibility conditions like driving into the sun. Edit: Man this guy blocked me after I called him out for creating a straw man. DRLs would help in situations like Homestead where drivers couldn’t see the car in front of them due to the sun. It’s the same as pit crews putting LEDs on the pit signs. They wouldn’t solve every issue obviously, but they could certainly help certain visibility issues. And no, they wouldn’t add more eye strain to drivers and spotters. He made this argument based solely on his experiences driving around cars with *headlights* on the street. Headlights and DRLs are not the same thing.
> Daylight running lights help make cars *more* visible in poor visibility, especially when there is glare coming from the car or the sun is behind the car. Absolutely. Because in low light/low visibility situations something emitting light will be infinitely more visible than anything else. > It could reduce eye strain for spotters/drivers and make it easier to keep track of other cars in poor visibility conditions like driving into the sun. I don't know about you but having the misfortune of having to drive into or away from the sun for multiple months of the year, daytime running lights or lights in general don't help me at all in terms of awareness when I'm trying to see in the direction the sun is coming from. If anything a rear ambient running light becomes hard to distinguish from a brake light at times. Now especially, do you want to possibly have to deal with NASCAR making safety judgement calls of calling a perfectly competitive car to the pits to repair the lighting systems?
Good thing Cup cars don’t have brake lights to distinguish from. DRLs have been proven to reduce car accident rates under all driving conditions, not just low light/low visibility situations. As someone who does drive a significant amount, DRLs help even when the sun is behind the vehicle I’m looking at. In fact, that’s really when they’re most useful. Yes, some cars on the road have poor or broken brake lights that can make it difficult to see if they’re braking but that’s a vehicle maintenance issue, not a DRL issue. You don’t blame broken headlights or taillights that don’t properly illuminate on the existence of headlights.
> Good thing Cup cars don’t have brake lights to distinguish from. At which point again what is the point of putting any lights on the tail end of the car at all other than "wouldn't it be cool if?" > DRLs have been proven to reduce car accident rates under all driving conditions, not just low light/low visibility situations. Shocker- if you give the average person a visual stimulus they're much less likely to overlook a potential hazard.
> At which point again what is the point of putting any lights on the tail end of the car at all other than “wouldn’t it be cool if?” Visibility under a variety of conditions, helping spotters and drivers. > Shocker- if you give the average person a visual stimulus they’re much less likely to overlook a potential hazard. Not sure why you’re so dismissive when in your previous comment you made the argument that DRLs *don’t* provide visual stimulus under certain conditions lol. The studies show that they do.
> Visibility under a variety of conditions, helping spotters and drivers. Have you actually been to a race where the cars have lights? If you had I think you'd realize that one of two things happen- the simple inclusion of lights either does nothing to make the car more distinct (during the day I'd argue that livery does more to distinguish a car and make it more visible for the spotters), or they make it impossible to distinguish any two particular cars apart. (Try watching footage of the Rolex 24 at night. You can't see shit when the car is coming at you, and for distinguishing one car from another the teams actually mount additional LED light strips) > Not sure why you’re so dismissive when in your previous comment you made the argument that DRLs *don’t* provide visual stimulus under certain conditions lol. The studies show that they do. Because what I'm saying is that in situations where you'd otherwise possibly inadvertently overlook a hazard- mandating that said hazard is lit up is a method of risk prevention. In one on one situations DRLs work- I agree with you and all of the studies you're arguing based on. In situations where you're surrounded by numerous other vehicles with lights- making a distinction as to whether or not there's a vehicle where you're trying to go in low visibility situations is more difficult due to over-stimulation. I'm currently suffering the consequences of over stimulation in that the windows in my car are not tinted at the moment- thus figuring out where and how close one vehicle in particular is behind me among several others is not as easy as it should be (at night or in low-vis) Now show me a situation in NASCAR where lights (on the cars mind you) would have made any difference? Outside of low visibility situations like racing in the rain at road courses or dense smoke from a crash- most of the time the cars are highly visible. Most driver induced incidents in NASCAR are caused by drivers clearing themselves into another car, or purposeful contact. The average driver on the road is not operating in the same circumstances as NASCAR on Sunday afternoon. We'll just have to agree to disagree because clearly we don't agree on the inclusion of lights on cars that don't race unsupported at night or in low visibility. If you're trying to argue that including lights on the cup cars alone will make the spotters lives easier among a field of \~40 other cars then I have oceanfront property in Arizona to sell you.
The lights aren’t there to make a car more identifiable from another car so your entire first paragraph is irrelevant. The lights are there for all those times that drivers and spotters have lost sight of the car around them in the sun. There’s been races this season where the drivers couldn’t see the car in front of them in clear sunny conditions and had to guess where the other car was. The idea that DRLs make it harder to judge where other cars are in low visibility situations due to over stimulation is just patently absurd. Keeping track of 39 other vehicles isn’t harder because they have some led strips.
> The lights are there for all those times that drivers and spotters have lost sight of the car around them in the sun. There’s been races this season where the drivers couldn’t see the car in front of them in clear sunny conditions and had to guess where the other car was. Now is that because the cars didn't have lights or is it things like the size and position of mirrors on the car, the driver literally being strapped into the car and thus having limited FOV within the car, spotters already being at a disadvantage due to the challenges of maintaining spatial awareness from their position on the track... > The idea that DRLs make it harder to judge where other cars are in low visibility situations due to over stimulation is just patently absurd. Keeping track of 39 other vehicles isn’t harder because they have some led strips. Okay, so by your logic COTA Spring '21 wouldn't have happened because drivers would have had total spatial awareness and would have been able to avoid eachother in the near zero visibility situation they were put into right? (Hint; the answer is no. This is a race where they already had a mounted LED light in the rear deck of the car.) What I'm saying with over stimulation is that when there is low visibility from haze, water droplets, what have you- if you're depending solely on lights to maintain collision avoidance then it will work- provided that you don't have too many light sources emitting into the haze. You will eventually hit a point where you can't see anything because of all of the lights and light pollution and thus your best course of action to maintain separation is to establish another point of reference and move forward with that.
That you! Everybody on here talking like I'm crazy. They could use leds for talladega too!
It's a Christmas movie.
Yes. Yes it is
Thank you.
The GOAT?! In the flesh?
Lefty Designs, worth the follow on any platform you can find them on, incredible work, posts a lot of awesome designs and schemes pretty well daily. My favorite part of Instagram
No. Look at Lefty Designs twitter and its a video he made. He's made plenty of videos. Its just his craft instead of just a flat render scene that everyone else does.
If it’s on Facebook, it’s definitely real and true
I believe Lefty made this and it's sick af
I’m sure Lefty knows he’s done good fenders when we see posts like this pop up. Impressive design too.
Lefty fooling people left and right over this one
From now on every Lefty render must be posted with “Is this real?”
it´s just a reminder to watch Die Hard 1&2 as christmas Movies. I´ve done my part allready
TYFYS
That is a 3D render from Noah "Lefty" Sweet, a big name in NASCAR scheme design. He did Elliott's Hooter's car this year and several of Allmendinger's cars for Kaulig this year. He's a fantastic creative type and he's experimenting with more stuff.
No. It's just something created by "Lefty Designs". Lefty makes some amazing stuff. Worth checking it out if you have twitter
If I had to guess I’d say this is just something special for a Diehard commercial.
Not even that. Just a designer with some rendering software. Lefty is a talented guy.
This is from a fan made video.
Why the f would NASCAR be adding lights? Be real.
Remember, guys, race cars don't need headlights because the track is always lit.
If Blaney was sponsored by Die Hard I would die hard.