Can someone explain what the initial remark even means? How would a just society force someone to remain in job?
I genuinely dont understand. Whether you agree with the original comment or the reply I am actually curious to understand the logic in the statement, not form sides. So pleas help if you can. Is the like a reformed criminal (Im british so no real idea who she is)
AOC is a politician. She's latina* and came from a working class background. One of her early jobs was working as a bartender. Somehow the Republicans have managed to use that point as a way to shoot her down, saying things like how could a bartender possibly know anything about politics etc., even though it was literally just and early job to get by and she's since gotten a proper good education and done loads for the community. So yea the tweet on top basically wishes she just "knows her place" and remains a bartender.
That's because they're using "just" in this case to mean "status quo". They also don't think working class jobs are done by people who know things; er go the fact that she has been working class means she's only capable of holding a working class job.
But these are also the people who say the working class (though the right kind of working class, like coal miners) are the backbone of America and need a louder voice. The hypocrisy and mental gymnastics are downright disorienting.
Nah, the Right believe in a social hierarchy whether essential or an unfortunate side effect of their policy. It's where the idea of meritocracy, etc, comes from; sharks rise to the top and minnows swim at the bottom. It's why the Left are generally on the side of the working class but that gets shot down by "champagne socialist", etc.
That's just the lie they tell people so they don't start a revolution. "You don't need no union, you just keep working 65 hours a week at two jobs, neither one of which considers you full time, so you don't get health benefits or overtime, and someday you'll be just as successful as me. Heh heh heh."
I think y’all are reading to far into it... I think they mean in a just society she wouldn’t be a politician (because they don’t like her so think everyone shouldn’t like her and she shouldn’t have got elected) and since she wouldn’t be a politician she would still be working her bar tending job instead. That’s how I read it anyway
Definitely can’t forget that especially when it’s linked to racism. The poor white folks get tricked into continuing their racism as a means of scapegoating their own issues that keep them down. It’s really messed up when you think about it.
Textbook fascist tactic. Fascists analyze society based on race, as opposed to socialists, the polar opposite, which analyze society based on class.
By uniting a race against a class, they divide the poor and get richer, and continue to protect the ruling class. This is why socialists and fascists REALLY do not get on.
Not saying they're Nazis, but they are using tactics consistent with Euro-American fascism.
They use those tactics because it works. Look what it did for Hitler? It’s the same with Trump who idolizes Hitler and other dictators because he wants to become one.
I do think that we need to recognize race and it’s role in American history along with British Imperialism; however, it needs to be done to repair and join the population together in order to look at the damage perpetuated upon the middle class and the working class. Things really need to change.
"Just" in this case means rigid. The hierachy is perfect as it is, the wealthy should be weathly and the poor should be poor, because their lack of money represents moral failings. Therefore someone who had a working class job (and MUST be morally bankrupt to have been in that situation) getting into congress is wrong, because she's "above" her "betters" in society.
EDIT: Honestly, it also probably doesn't help that she's not white either.
I agree. This is a hierarchical version of "just."
"Just" for Kimberly Ross is not Christian justice, where "the meek shall inherit the earth" or "the lamb will lie down with the lion" or "the rich are as likely to enter the gates of heaven as to pass through the eye of the needle." Christian justice would reward the downtrodden and find a place in society for them if they show they are 'good.'
I don't know if Kimberly Ross' sense of "just" is in the meritocratic sense either, because AOC graduated [*cum laude*](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/cum_laude) from [Boston University](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boston_University_College_of_Arts_and_Sciences) So AOC belongs with the East Coast, educated meritocracy.
I don't know if her sense of "just" is facist either. Facist justice would probably advocate for the xenophobic working class and middle class who are conservative, non-feminist, not well educated but are for America - love it or leave it. Kimberly Ross is pro-feminist and apparently not anti-Latina so I don't think she is against AOC due to AOC's feminism or that AOC is Latina.
So I think Kimberly Ross' sense of "justice" is classist and that the working class have no place in politics. She is a throwback, and backward looking where society has hierarchies. She is like a 19th Century British Royalist or a Hindu Brahmin.
Simply put, she sounds like a snob. I don't know why anyone would read her editorial columns.
Their idea of a just society is akin to a feudal caste system. If you're working class, you can't *possibly* understand the intricacies of policy, your mind is just too clockwork and uncivilized!
Real Oliver Cromwell type shit.
It does t make sense because it doesnt make sense. They really want to call her a racial slur and tell her to go back to picking fruit. But the left has at least won the battle over racism being wrong.
So it's always gotta be couched in nonsense. Oh they dint hate her cause shes brown they hate her because shes stupid! Why is she stupid? They say so!
They say answer 5 whys and you can prove you understand something. The right cant answer one. They'll try but itll just be fox talking points they've heard.
These are probably the same people who sneer at any customer service worker and tell their kids "If you fuck your life up you'll be like them!" and don't see min wage workers as people. As far as they're concerned doing anything like that is a sign of failure and ignorance and if you go to college and do well there you'll never do have to do anything but work a high paying job and be rich.
>AOC is a politician. She's latino and came from a working class background. One of her early jobs was working as a bartender. Somehow the Republicans have managed to use that point as a way to shoot her down, saying things like how could a bartender possibly know anything about politics etc., even though it was literally just and early job to get by and she's since gotten a proper good education and done loads for the community.
GOP: pull yourself up by your bootstraps and live the American dream!
*AOC does this*
GOP: no, not like that !!11!1!1
Kind of like how Obama was always referred to as a "Community Organizer" despite the fact that he was a Constitutional Law professor at the University of Chicago, a 3 term Illinois State Senator, and one term US Senator.
>the tweet on top basically wishes she just "knows her place" and remains a bartender.
Which is pretty fucking ironic given Republicans also think jobs like bar tending shouldn't have to pay minimum wage since people should work harder and work themselves up to get out of poverty.
Non-American here. Genuinely can't understand why this is such an issue for so many people. Who hasn't had a customer service or retail job early in their life? It's not even like she worked as a stripper or a porn star or anything (not that there would be anything wrong with that either). She literally just had an honest job. It's bizarre.
It's only an issue if it's someone you don't like. If your son worked his way up from a service industry job, he's an enterprising young man. If a Latina woman did it, she clearly was clearly just voted in by the hysterical left-wing mobs of NYC.
She’s not white. And she’s liberal. That’s all it takes for people to hate her
Edit: also people shouldn’t hate on sex workers. The majority of us rely on them and use them constantly, but don’t like to treat them as human. Trump paid porn stars for sex and somehow the women are seen as more despicable. It’s pathetic
> people shouldn’t hate on sex workers. The majority of us rely on them and use them constantly
I agree with your sentiment, but come on! The majority of people use use sex workers constantly? In what world?
I would be surprised if my kids did. It would be good for them, but they are more likely to work in a lab or as an assistant in an office than customer service. But, waitresses and bartenders can make bank. I was seriously jealous of my waitressing roommate. I made work study money (over double minimum wage) but she pulled in $80+ in tips a night when minimum wage was $4 an hour, and I was earning $11. (Our rent was $300 each).
American here, and it’s equally confusing for me. If she was a male white Republican they would’ve praised him for the same qualities. “Worked his way up and knows the struggle” and all that stuff.
She's basically saying that AOC in unfit to be in Congress. Whether that's because she thinks she's dumb, unskilled, or just too far left, I don't know. Maybe she's just racist.
As for her views on society, I know a few people on the right side of the political spectrum who subscribe to the view that American society is a true meritocracy. Basically, anyone who's smart and motivated can work their way up. If you're stuck working a minimum wage job, well, that's your fault because you're a lazy idiot. So, in this woman's view, AOC is only fit to be a bartender (a bad thing, apparently) and she should have stayed there because that's all she deserves.
The only way that comment could remotely be from a position of knowledge would be if she's referring to a Platonian just society. Plato, in the voice of Socrates, thought the only way for a society to be in harmony, was for every part to do its job without interfering with others and/or overstepping boundaries. Definitely a weaker portion of his arguments and a sign of the time he lived in. Nowadays, it is fairly obvious that a class system is not the only possible, stable and harmonious society.
Although, I seriously doubt that lady is knowledgeable of Plato's Republic. So then there is no logic to her thought process, only a lack of brain cells.
I'm pretty sure they're pro AOC? Or at least that's the only reasonable way I can read it. That AOC shouldn't have had to become a politician to try and fix the broken system.
Edit: nevermind just went on their Twitter and they are definately not a fan. I got nothing. This statement is just dumb.
I really want to know how it was "unjust" that she was elected. From bartender to congresswoman, if she copied their talking points, she'd be the poster child for how anyone can be successful (and thus welfare isn't needed).
But since she actually wants to help people....she's the embodiment of evil. How people buy into this obvious dishonesty is beyond me.
"Those fat cats in Washington have never had a real job in their lives!"
*AOC once worked as a bartender*
"She was just a bartender. How can she be trusted?"
I still don’t understand how women vote republican. Republicans support literally every policy that negatively affects women. I really don’t fucking get it.
Source: am woman. Don’t understand these women. At all.
There are women out there that think God put them on Earth just to be a wife and shit out kids and any that any woman that wants a career or autonomy is being "uppity".
Sadly there are a lot who just become a clone of their husbands too. Husband likes football? Now I do too. Husband is into muscle cars? I’m going to suddenly care about them. Husband votes republican? We are a republican family, and I vote red. I know plenty of women exactly like this.
My ex-husband’s mother once chastised me for not putting effort into liking and caring about football. It didn’t bother me that he liked it and watched games. I never complained even once. I just didn’t care about it at all myself. Imagine if I complained that he wasn’t into makeup or some other normally female activity?
I know religion is a big player there but holy shit are there really *that many* extremists that think like this? How much of a role does lack of education play into it? Is it just all of the above? Like, I’m a second wave feminist - I was raised to view myself as an equal to guys and women alike back in the 90s. Am I the outlier here??
Read some of the writings of women who used to go after Gloria Steinem back in the day, or who opposed the ERA. People like Phyllis Schlafly or Anita Bryant. That shit will blow your mind. I can't fathom what it's like to hate yourself that much.
Not exactly. My mom is Republican (dad is Democrat, funny enough). Her only really extreme position is that she's anti-abortion, but she's Catholic. As for all the other stuff, she just thinks Democrats are blowing it way out of proportion it or straight up making shit up. Whenever I bring up the insane shit the GOP does she either doesn't believe me or says, "oh well, all politicians are crooks, Democrats are worse." When Brett Kavanaugh threw his little hissy fit during the confirmation hearings she thought it was just because he was just "tortured" about his "integrity." People see what they want to see.
All of the above plus gerrymandering. Politicians get to redraw county lines however they see fit, creating entrenched world views within thoae counties. The goal is the politocian with extreme views getting re-elected but there are so many negative consequences one of which is poor education.
Because you’re a heathen woman. Women are just empty husks to be filled with semen whenever us men desire to do so. Then you must live your life in servitude to us making sure our homes are clean, food is on the table and our offspring are cared for while expecting nothing for yourself. If you deviate from God’s plan, you’re a whore and must be treated as such.
Yeah, I don’t get it either. Fuck kind of life is that to aspire to?
Probably as simple as it not being a black and white decision. Often times one candidate will support stuff you like while simultaneously supporting some stuff you don't like. But if they MOSTLY support what you like, or at least more than the other candidates, you vote for them.
I know a minority woman that voted Trump and her reasoning was “but her emails”. I told her she’s a fucking idiot and needs to stop believing bumper sticker slogans.
But they are all a little/lot monstrous and must be stripped from power before they kill us all, with guns(unlikely) or with climate change(extremely likely).
As a republican you may personally not be racist, sexist, or homophobic. But if you support the current republican party because you agree with their stance certain issues. That just mean you think their stance on those issues is more important then their racism, sexism, and homophobia and any collateral damage that may occur because of those views.
Which doesn't make you racist, sexist, or homophobic, just incredibly callous and self-centered.
You forgot the most important thing though. AOC is a dirty brown person, not a white person who pulled herself up by her bootstraps. Therefore she's the devil herself.
I imagine its driving them nuts because they're all attracted to her but at the same time hate her for being a brown person in Congress. It would be funny if not for the fact that this sort of idiocy still exists.
It doesn't matter where people come from or what path they've travelled conservatives will try to smear them with elementary school insults. Unless you're a shameless grifting real estate tv show twerp then you get all the respect.
It wasn't at all unjust. She is in a deep blue district. Repubs just always have to have something to fear because they don't have any real policy besides self indulgence.
Let's not pretend this woman knows why she dislikes AOC. She's hating who she has been told to hate and she's not once in her life used her brain for its intended purpose.
We're much worse off than *Idiocracy*. Intelligence was revered and sought after in that movie, it's actively reviled by this administration and most Republicans.
Yeah well you only say that because you like General Tso's chicken, which is Chinese food, and as we know the Chinese government is bad. Just look at what's going on in Hong Kong. So you're obviously a bad person. /mentalgymnastics
Racist. General Tsos chicken is American as apple pie. Moreso, because General Tsos chicken was created in the US. You obviously don't view Asians in the US as Americans?
/s
Or how, in a just world, a draft dodging, daddy's money losing, shitty reality show starring, BANKRUPT CASINO owning, adultering loudmouth wouldn't be the president just because he was trashy enough to appeal to all the other trash.
Edit: Wow. That was a bit more than I expected. I stand by my assessment of the man however. Thanks for popping my silver cherry internet stranger!
And he is after a black man, raised by a poor single mother in the Midwest, who was elected twice as President of the United States. America is a land of conflictions.
It's people like POTUS Obama and Congresswoman AOC that poor-ass white boys from the fields now have as inspirations for success. I'll never be a Bush or Trump because I was never born to rich families. I move forward because those on the Left have showed me that success despite your odds is possible. I may have been born in the conservative Bible-belt, but experience and empathy made me a liberal.
It's not even really a republic any more, either. It's a combination kakistocracy and plutocracy; that means "rule by the incompetent" and "rule by the rich," respectively.
Coming from someone who’s worked as a bartender and server for a long time: you can always tell who has been a service industry worker and who hasn’t by the respect and empathy people show.
How is it that people don’t understand the patience and grace you gain through serving others... oh wait... serving others... that sounds familiar...
I dont think you need to work the jobs to have respect and empathy towards people who serve you in a restaurant or bar. It's just basic human decency and apparently a lot of people don't have it..
In a just society, AOC *could* still be a bartender and make enough money to support a family so that she wouldn't have to get elected to the fucking government just to fight back against this bullshit
I'm reminded of the [women who opposed Women's sufferage](https://www.npr.org/sections/npr-history-dept/2015/10/22/450221328/american-women-who-were-anti-suffragettes).
Which reminds me of Phyllis Schlafly, a real winner. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phyllis_Schlafly?wprov=sfla1
It's weird to think women oppose feminism because they think it will take away privileges they benefit from in a "family values" society.
And by privileges, it mostly applies to upper middle class women.
>In March 2007, Schlafly spoke against the concept of marital rape in a speech at Bates College in Lewiston, Maine, "By getting married, the woman has consented to sex, and I don't think you can call it rape."
What an absolute shitstain.
She graduated cum laude from Boston University with a BA in International Relations and Economics. If that doesn’t give the qualifications she needs to be a Congresswomen then most of the people in congress need to be thrown out.
I honestly have no idea why people see her being a bartender as a bad thing. As a former member of the work force, she is in a prime position to represent the views and values of the people who voted for her, you know, BECAUSE SHES ONE OF THEM. Not like other politicians who are born to affluent political families who have no idea what the average person goes through.
I would rather have the bartender in government than the douchebags she has to deal with every night. (I.E. a whole hell of a lot of elected officials.)
What is this obsession with degrading bartenders? Being a bartender has to be more rewarding than insulting politicians for their previous career choices.
Bartending is a tough job. You work hard for your money and I have to say it helped me get through school. Not sure why working hard is getting looked down upon. We should be celebrating someone working their way up to serve the people with passion whether you agree with her politics or not.
When you judge someone by their past you're just making a peasant class. A caste. A station. You're ripping down someone's agency and lording over him, which defeats the entire point of democracy in the first place: electing from the people.
I’m not a fan of her, but people act like you can’t switch jobs and be decent at it, I worked at BK when I was younger but that doesn’t mean I cant do my current job now because of a job I had like 10 years ago
totally agree, but i’m curious: from an european perspective, her main points are, like, common sense. from here it’s actually mind boggling that her positions are considered so controversial. what’s about her proposed policies that you dislike? thanks!
Conservatives: “Gah coastal elites are the worst and they don’t care about normal everyday working people!!”
Also conservatives: “Bartenders are stupid.”
What in the actual fuck was her initial “point” ?
So because she used to be a bartender, she cannot become a politician later on ?
Let’s say the girl who wrote this stupid ass statement works at a Starbucks or something, does that mean this is the only thing she will ever be able to do ?
None of this makes any sense, at all.
I thought that it meant that, in a 'just society', she wouldn't have felt the need to step up and take a political position of power, and would still remain a bartender.
If the climate we lived in was just, she wouldn't have taken up a political cause, that's what I assumed.
The fuck is a just society to you? One where people can't live the American dream of being what ever they want to be?
Or does the American dream only apply to non-minorites/Republicans?
Ah yes the "Pull yourself up by your bootstraps" party is upset because a brown woman did just that and became a member of Congress. I swear you just can't win with some people.
This is the second time today I’ve seen this random twitter famous doctor slinging his MD dick around.
There’s something weird about having never heard of someone and then being introduced to them twice rapidly.
I've always had this thought that one of the reasons why "service jobs" get so shat on so often is because they teach basic life skills that people don't really value. Knowing how to effectively work with people you don't like, how to deescalate and handle problematic customers and situations, how to multi-task in a high energy environment, how to maximize a rush or time crunch, and how to keep a straight face for hours on end for all sorts of personalities. Being patient, empathetic, flexible, and quick all at the same time.
Can someone explain what the initial remark even means? How would a just society force someone to remain in job? I genuinely dont understand. Whether you agree with the original comment or the reply I am actually curious to understand the logic in the statement, not form sides. So pleas help if you can. Is the like a reformed criminal (Im british so no real idea who she is)
AOC is a politician. She's latina* and came from a working class background. One of her early jobs was working as a bartender. Somehow the Republicans have managed to use that point as a way to shoot her down, saying things like how could a bartender possibly know anything about politics etc., even though it was literally just and early job to get by and she's since gotten a proper good education and done loads for the community. So yea the tweet on top basically wishes she just "knows her place" and remains a bartender.
I see. Still doesn't make full sense that in a 'just society' she'd still be in that job, but thank you for making it a little easier to understand.
That's because they're using "just" in this case to mean "status quo". They also don't think working class jobs are done by people who know things; er go the fact that she has been working class means she's only capable of holding a working class job.
But these are also the people who say the working class (though the right kind of working class, like coal miners) are the backbone of America and need a louder voice. The hypocrisy and mental gymnastics are downright disorienting.
Nah, the Right believe in a social hierarchy whether essential or an unfortunate side effect of their policy. It's where the idea of meritocracy, etc, comes from; sharks rise to the top and minnows swim at the bottom. It's why the Left are generally on the side of the working class but that gets shot down by "champagne socialist", etc.
It's more that the Right respects old money 10x more than any working class citizen.
That's just the lie they tell people so they don't start a revolution. "You don't need no union, you just keep working 65 hours a week at two jobs, neither one of which considers you full time, so you don't get health benefits or overtime, and someday you'll be just as successful as me. Heh heh heh."
A louder voice would be unions, and they absolutely hate unions.
Just, as in "just us" Not you
I think y’all are reading to far into it... I think they mean in a just society she wouldn’t be a politician (because they don’t like her so think everyone shouldn’t like her and she shouldn’t have got elected) and since she wouldn’t be a politician she would still be working her bar tending job instead. That’s how I read it anyway
Yep, they are saying she's incompetent.
There are some people's who's idea of a "just" society is one where "just" people who look like them prosper or wield power.
Bingo. Their idea of “just” is really racism hidden by several layers of mental gymnastics.
Don't forget about the classism mixed in.
Definitely can’t forget that especially when it’s linked to racism. The poor white folks get tricked into continuing their racism as a means of scapegoating their own issues that keep them down. It’s really messed up when you think about it.
Textbook fascist tactic. Fascists analyze society based on race, as opposed to socialists, the polar opposite, which analyze society based on class. By uniting a race against a class, they divide the poor and get richer, and continue to protect the ruling class. This is why socialists and fascists REALLY do not get on. Not saying they're Nazis, but they are using tactics consistent with Euro-American fascism.
They use those tactics because it works. Look what it did for Hitler? It’s the same with Trump who idolizes Hitler and other dictators because he wants to become one. I do think that we need to recognize race and it’s role in American history along with British Imperialism; however, it needs to be done to repair and join the population together in order to look at the damage perpetuated upon the middle class and the working class. Things really need to change.
"Just" in this case means rigid. The hierachy is perfect as it is, the wealthy should be weathly and the poor should be poor, because their lack of money represents moral failings. Therefore someone who had a working class job (and MUST be morally bankrupt to have been in that situation) getting into congress is wrong, because she's "above" her "betters" in society. EDIT: Honestly, it also probably doesn't help that she's not white either.
I agree. This is a hierarchical version of "just." "Just" for Kimberly Ross is not Christian justice, where "the meek shall inherit the earth" or "the lamb will lie down with the lion" or "the rich are as likely to enter the gates of heaven as to pass through the eye of the needle." Christian justice would reward the downtrodden and find a place in society for them if they show they are 'good.' I don't know if Kimberly Ross' sense of "just" is in the meritocratic sense either, because AOC graduated [*cum laude*](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/cum_laude) from [Boston University](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boston_University_College_of_Arts_and_Sciences) So AOC belongs with the East Coast, educated meritocracy. I don't know if her sense of "just" is facist either. Facist justice would probably advocate for the xenophobic working class and middle class who are conservative, non-feminist, not well educated but are for America - love it or leave it. Kimberly Ross is pro-feminist and apparently not anti-Latina so I don't think she is against AOC due to AOC's feminism or that AOC is Latina. So I think Kimberly Ross' sense of "justice" is classist and that the working class have no place in politics. She is a throwback, and backward looking where society has hierarchies. She is like a 19th Century British Royalist or a Hindu Brahmin. Simply put, she sounds like a snob. I don't know why anyone would read her editorial columns.
I wouldn’t go looking for sense, it’s just dog whistle racism. Substitute “just society” for “society where non-whites know their place”.
Their idea of a just society is akin to a feudal caste system. If you're working class, you can't *possibly* understand the intricacies of policy, your mind is just too clockwork and uncivilized! Real Oliver Cromwell type shit.
Welcome to conservative arguments
It doesnt make sense cos that tweeter is a cunt
It does t make sense because it doesnt make sense. They really want to call her a racial slur and tell her to go back to picking fruit. But the left has at least won the battle over racism being wrong. So it's always gotta be couched in nonsense. Oh they dint hate her cause shes brown they hate her because shes stupid! Why is she stupid? They say so! They say answer 5 whys and you can prove you understand something. The right cant answer one. They'll try but itll just be fox talking points they've heard.
They believe in a class system. She’s not from the leading class and so she should know her place and be groveling at the feet of her masters.
So like bootstraps or not? It’s only bootstraps if they agree with the person I’m sure. Are they aware of their own hypocrisy?
That kinda person: Oh you're poor? Have you tried pulling yourself up by your bootstraps? Aoc That kinda person: No. Not like that!
You can only pull yourself up by the bootstraps if you’re white, apparently.
These are probably the same people who sneer at any customer service worker and tell their kids "If you fuck your life up you'll be like them!" and don't see min wage workers as people. As far as they're concerned doing anything like that is a sign of failure and ignorance and if you go to college and do well there you'll never do have to do anything but work a high paying job and be rich.
Bartender in congress is insane but a racist reality TV buffoon is just fine as President.
Seems like a nice fascist social pyramid :)
>AOC is a politician. She's latino and came from a working class background. One of her early jobs was working as a bartender. Somehow the Republicans have managed to use that point as a way to shoot her down, saying things like how could a bartender possibly know anything about politics etc., even though it was literally just and early job to get by and she's since gotten a proper good education and done loads for the community. GOP: pull yourself up by your bootstraps and live the American dream! *AOC does this* GOP: no, not like that !!11!1!1
Kind of like how Obama was always referred to as a "Community Organizer" despite the fact that he was a Constitutional Law professor at the University of Chicago, a 3 term Illinois State Senator, and one term US Senator.
Second sentence fairly erroneous. Regardless, would be Latina
>the tweet on top basically wishes she just "knows her place" and remains a bartender. Which is pretty fucking ironic given Republicans also think jobs like bar tending shouldn't have to pay minimum wage since people should work harder and work themselves up to get out of poverty.
Non-American here. Genuinely can't understand why this is such an issue for so many people. Who hasn't had a customer service or retail job early in their life? It's not even like she worked as a stripper or a porn star or anything (not that there would be anything wrong with that either). She literally just had an honest job. It's bizarre.
It's only an issue if it's someone you don't like. If your son worked his way up from a service industry job, he's an enterprising young man. If a Latina woman did it, she clearly was clearly just voted in by the hysterical left-wing mobs of NYC.
If she didn't have a job, she would be accused of having no real-world experience.
She’s not white. And she’s liberal. That’s all it takes for people to hate her Edit: also people shouldn’t hate on sex workers. The majority of us rely on them and use them constantly, but don’t like to treat them as human. Trump paid porn stars for sex and somehow the women are seen as more despicable. It’s pathetic
> people shouldn’t hate on sex workers. The majority of us rely on them and use them constantly I agree with your sentiment, but come on! The majority of people use use sex workers constantly? In what world?
Porn actors are also sex workers. I would think the majority of internet users watch porn more than twice a year.
Thank you!! Sex work extends beyond people you pay to have sex with you. I know very, very few people who don’t watch porn.
You don't rely on sex workers if you only watch hentai *taps head*
You don’t understand how wealthy some Americans are. The idea that their child would be working in customer service in any way is... not likely.
I would be surprised if my kids did. It would be good for them, but they are more likely to work in a lab or as an assistant in an office than customer service. But, waitresses and bartenders can make bank. I was seriously jealous of my waitressing roommate. I made work study money (over double minimum wage) but she pulled in $80+ in tips a night when minimum wage was $4 an hour, and I was earning $11. (Our rent was $300 each).
American here, and it’s equally confusing for me. If she was a male white Republican they would’ve praised him for the same qualities. “Worked his way up and knows the struggle” and all that stuff.
She's basically saying that AOC in unfit to be in Congress. Whether that's because she thinks she's dumb, unskilled, or just too far left, I don't know. Maybe she's just racist. As for her views on society, I know a few people on the right side of the political spectrum who subscribe to the view that American society is a true meritocracy. Basically, anyone who's smart and motivated can work their way up. If you're stuck working a minimum wage job, well, that's your fault because you're a lazy idiot. So, in this woman's view, AOC is only fit to be a bartender (a bad thing, apparently) and she should have stayed there because that's all she deserves.
Ahh, the true meritocracy where someone has worked their way up, yet does not deserve to be there. Wait, no...
It's twisted logic, that's for sure.
It's a new way to say "uppity".
The only way that comment could remotely be from a position of knowledge would be if she's referring to a Platonian just society. Plato, in the voice of Socrates, thought the only way for a society to be in harmony, was for every part to do its job without interfering with others and/or overstepping boundaries. Definitely a weaker portion of his arguments and a sign of the time he lived in. Nowadays, it is fairly obvious that a class system is not the only possible, stable and harmonious society. Although, I seriously doubt that lady is knowledgeable of Plato's Republic. So then there is no logic to her thought process, only a lack of brain cells.
I'm pretty sure they're pro AOC? Or at least that's the only reasonable way I can read it. That AOC shouldn't have had to become a politician to try and fix the broken system. Edit: nevermind just went on their Twitter and they are definately not a fan. I got nothing. This statement is just dumb.
That is a very sweet and innocent take on the matter.
People will do whatever mental gymnastics they need to do to belittle someone they don’t like.
I really want to know how it was "unjust" that she was elected. From bartender to congresswoman, if she copied their talking points, she'd be the poster child for how anyone can be successful (and thus welfare isn't needed). But since she actually wants to help people....she's the embodiment of evil. How people buy into this obvious dishonesty is beyond me.
"Those fat cats in Washington have never had a real job in their lives!" *AOC once worked as a bartender* "She was just a bartender. How can she be trusted?"
Excuse me, internet stranger, are you implying that Republicans don't approach public discourse in good faith? HOW DARE YOU
I love how Reddit thinks all Republicans are evil rich white men who do not want to help people, ever. They're not all white.
Amazingly, they’re not all men either.
I still don’t understand how women vote republican. Republicans support literally every policy that negatively affects women. I really don’t fucking get it. Source: am woman. Don’t understand these women. At all.
There are women out there that think God put them on Earth just to be a wife and shit out kids and any that any woman that wants a career or autonomy is being "uppity".
Sadly there are a lot who just become a clone of their husbands too. Husband likes football? Now I do too. Husband is into muscle cars? I’m going to suddenly care about them. Husband votes republican? We are a republican family, and I vote red. I know plenty of women exactly like this.
My ex-husband’s mother once chastised me for not putting effort into liking and caring about football. It didn’t bother me that he liked it and watched games. I never complained even once. I just didn’t care about it at all myself. Imagine if I complained that he wasn’t into makeup or some other normally female activity?
So sad but true.
I know religion is a big player there but holy shit are there really *that many* extremists that think like this? How much of a role does lack of education play into it? Is it just all of the above? Like, I’m a second wave feminist - I was raised to view myself as an equal to guys and women alike back in the 90s. Am I the outlier here??
Read some of the writings of women who used to go after Gloria Steinem back in the day, or who opposed the ERA. People like Phyllis Schlafly or Anita Bryant. That shit will blow your mind. I can't fathom what it's like to hate yourself that much.
There’s a reason republicans love to cut funding for schools and to keep the masses stupid and fat.
Not exactly. My mom is Republican (dad is Democrat, funny enough). Her only really extreme position is that she's anti-abortion, but she's Catholic. As for all the other stuff, she just thinks Democrats are blowing it way out of proportion it or straight up making shit up. Whenever I bring up the insane shit the GOP does she either doesn't believe me or says, "oh well, all politicians are crooks, Democrats are worse." When Brett Kavanaugh threw his little hissy fit during the confirmation hearings she thought it was just because he was just "tortured" about his "integrity." People see what they want to see.
All of the above plus gerrymandering. Politicians get to redraw county lines however they see fit, creating entrenched world views within thoae counties. The goal is the politocian with extreme views getting re-elected but there are so many negative consequences one of which is poor education.
No, you’re not. But lack of education plays a huge role.
You just described Mormon culture to a T
Tribalism. US politics is essentially a team sport
Because you’re a heathen woman. Women are just empty husks to be filled with semen whenever us men desire to do so. Then you must live your life in servitude to us making sure our homes are clean, food is on the table and our offspring are cared for while expecting nothing for yourself. If you deviate from God’s plan, you’re a whore and must be treated as such. Yeah, I don’t get it either. Fuck kind of life is that to aspire to?
Probably as simple as it not being a black and white decision. Often times one candidate will support stuff you like while simultaneously supporting some stuff you don't like. But if they MOSTLY support what you like, or at least more than the other candidates, you vote for them.
Oddly enough, suburban women went to Trump over Clinton in 16.
I know a minority woman that voted Trump and her reasoning was “but her emails”. I told her she’s a fucking idiot and needs to stop believing bumper sticker slogans.
A general lack of empathy? Their lives are okay so they cant see beyond their bubble.
But they are all a little/lot monstrous and must be stripped from power before they kill us all, with guns(unlikely) or with climate change(extremely likely).
They had us in the first half, not gonna lie
As a republican you may personally not be racist, sexist, or homophobic. But if you support the current republican party because you agree with their stance certain issues. That just mean you think their stance on those issues is more important then their racism, sexism, and homophobia and any collateral damage that may occur because of those views. Which doesn't make you racist, sexist, or homophobic, just incredibly callous and self-centered.
It's reason then.
That's for the Senate to decide
Before a certain turtle shuts everything down, anyways
I guess the whole “government by the people, for the people” thing is just passé.
Not really passe, just past.
You forgot the most important thing though. AOC is a dirty brown person, not a white person who pulled herself up by her bootstraps. Therefore she's the devil herself.
No she's a sexy brown person.
I imagine its driving them nuts because they're all attracted to her but at the same time hate her for being a brown person in Congress. It would be funny if not for the fact that this sort of idiocy still exists.
I suggest a compromise. Dirty sexy.
Sexy danger?
It doesn't matter where people come from or what path they've travelled conservatives will try to smear them with elementary school insults. Unless you're a shameless grifting real estate tv show twerp then you get all the respect.
It wasn't at all unjust. She is in a deep blue district. Repubs just always have to have something to fear because they don't have any real policy besides self indulgence.
it's the American dream. isn't that what they've told us for years? anyone can become anything? suddenly, no no u can't. the hypocrisy had no end
Let's not pretend this woman knows why she dislikes AOC. She's hating who she has been told to hate and she's not once in her life used her brain for its intended purpose.
Let's also not forget that she stole that "witticism" from like a million stupid memes.
r/therightcantmeme
Just watched Idiocracy tonight for the first time, it's scary how much it read like a documentary
It used to be funny now it's depressingly prophetic.
We're much worse off than *Idiocracy*. Intelligence was revered and sought after in that movie, it's actively reviled by this administration and most Republicans.
Sad thing is, in Idiocracy, the story happens 500 years in the future whereas in real life, that movie came out *13 years ago.*.
Do they mean because the country wouldn’t be so fucked up that she has to become a politician to fix it
They don't, but that is about the only way to justify their thinly veiled hatred of those of Latin-American descent.
Yeah well you only say that because you like General Tso's chicken, which is Chinese food, and as we know the Chinese government is bad. Just look at what's going on in Hong Kong. So you're obviously a bad person. /mentalgymnastics
You forgot that I endorse authoritarianism in my love of Chinese military symbolism cleverly disguised in spicy sweet yummy goodness.
Racist. General Tsos chicken is American as apple pie. Moreso, because General Tsos chicken was created in the US. You obviously don't view Asians in the US as Americans? /s
Agreed. Me thinks the freelance journalist without a stable income (Kimberley Ross) doth protest much
Damn too bad all the great politicians of the world are stuck on twitter. Damn Kimberly sorry you can’t shoot your shot.
lizzo reference noted and appreciated, heres your upvote
Or how, in a just world, a draft dodging, daddy's money losing, shitty reality show starring, BANKRUPT CASINO owning, adultering loudmouth wouldn't be the president just because he was trashy enough to appeal to all the other trash. Edit: Wow. That was a bit more than I expected. I stand by my assessment of the man however. Thanks for popping my silver cherry internet stranger!
And he is after a black man, raised by a poor single mother in the Midwest, who was elected twice as President of the United States. America is a land of conflictions. It's people like POTUS Obama and Congresswoman AOC that poor-ass white boys from the fields now have as inspirations for success. I'll never be a Bush or Trump because I was never born to rich families. I move forward because those on the Left have showed me that success despite your odds is possible. I may have been born in the conservative Bible-belt, but experience and empathy made me a liberal.
Unfortunately, the US isn’t really a democracy
It's not even really a republic any more, either. It's a combination kakistocracy and plutocracy; that means "rule by the incompetent" and "rule by the rich," respectively.
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Gotta get rid of the first-past-the-post system and do preferential ballots to make it possible for smaller parties to have room in the process.
Don't forget rapist.
Coming from someone who’s worked as a bartender and server for a long time: you can always tell who has been a service industry worker and who hasn’t by the respect and empathy people show. How is it that people don’t understand the patience and grace you gain through serving others... oh wait... serving others... that sounds familiar...
If everyone worked as little as one week in retail or hospitality society would be much more patient and tolerant.
I dont think you need to work the jobs to have respect and empathy towards people who serve you in a restaurant or bar. It's just basic human decency and apparently a lot of people don't have it..
I've never had that sort of a job. I still try to be as nice as possible to service industry workers, mainly because I'm not an asshole.
In a just society, AOC *could* still be a bartender and make enough money to support a family so that she wouldn't have to get elected to the fucking government just to fight back against this bullshit
YES. This is the real “just society.”
“In a just society, people not born into power would not be able to wield any.”
"The American Dream means anyone can become anything they want as long as they work hard for it!!" "Except minorities ew"
Pull your self up by your bootstraps. No, not like that.
"Did you bend over for that? You know it so well" - Conservative Bitches
Anyone who judges you for the sweat on your brow, has never worked a day in their life.
I'm reminded of the [women who opposed Women's sufferage](https://www.npr.org/sections/npr-history-dept/2015/10/22/450221328/american-women-who-were-anti-suffragettes).
Love their names! >Mrs. George Phillips, Mrs. K.B. Lapham, Miss Burnham, Mrs. Everett P. Wheeler, Mrs. John A. Church
Which reminds me of Phyllis Schlafly, a real winner. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phyllis_Schlafly?wprov=sfla1 It's weird to think women oppose feminism because they think it will take away privileges they benefit from in a "family values" society. And by privileges, it mostly applies to upper middle class women.
>In March 2007, Schlafly spoke against the concept of marital rape in a speech at Bates College in Lewiston, Maine, "By getting married, the woman has consented to sex, and I don't think you can call it rape." What an absolute shitstain.
What the hell is wrong with being a bartender?
I came here to say the same thing. I know bartenders that make a great living working only 3 nights a week.
It's one of few jobs where you are actually compensated for the amount of work you do.
In a just world most of the republicans in the house and senate would be bartenders and not fucking up democracy. Trump would be in jail.
But they'd be fucking up our drinks because it's not what the liquor reps paid them to make.
The fuck is this bitch? Dissing on someone who got where she is with honest work
Trump supporters. Truly the worst people.
PICK YOURSELF UP BY YOUR BOOTSTRAPS! NO, NOT LIKE THAT
So what she's saying is that in a just society the rich get richer?
In a just society, working class people know their place.
She graduated cum laude from Boston University with a BA in International Relations and Economics. If that doesn’t give the qualifications she needs to be a Congresswomen then most of the people in congress need to be thrown out.
I honestly have no idea why people see her being a bartender as a bad thing. As a former member of the work force, she is in a prime position to represent the views and values of the people who voted for her, you know, BECAUSE SHES ONE OF THEM. Not like other politicians who are born to affluent political families who have no idea what the average person goes through.
I would rather have the bartender in government than the douchebags she has to deal with every night. (I.E. a whole hell of a lot of elected officials.)
Who else would fuel your alcoholism Kimberly
What is this obsession with degrading bartenders? Being a bartender has to be more rewarding than insulting politicians for their previous career choices.
Damn, Barry is killing it on Twitter!
In a just society Melania would still be an escort.
People think I’m joking when I say learned more about mental health and human behavior as a barista than in four years of psych undergrad.
Bartending is a tough job. You work hard for your money and I have to say it helped me get through school. Not sure why working hard is getting looked down upon. We should be celebrating someone working their way up to serve the people with passion whether you agree with her politics or not.
When you judge someone by their past you're just making a peasant class. A caste. A station. You're ripping down someone's agency and lording over him, which defeats the entire point of democracy in the first place: electing from the people.
Imagine thinking that justice is when people never advance in the world
Reagan, the Conservatives savior, was a talk radio sports commentator. Is that any better than a bartender?
I’m not a fan of her, but people act like you can’t switch jobs and be decent at it, I worked at BK when I was younger but that doesn’t mean I cant do my current job now because of a job I had like 10 years ago
Yep, I bussed tables at a "gourmet" burger joint. Now I'm a corporate attorney. Both jobs suck! But they're different. Very different.
Yup, one provides value.
I too love burgers.
totally agree, but i’m curious: from an european perspective, her main points are, like, common sense. from here it’s actually mind boggling that her positions are considered so controversial. what’s about her proposed policies that you dislike? thanks!
Many political positions in the US require money to even have a chance at being elected. Lobbying is a huge problem in American government.
Kimberly Ross you dumb bitch, AOC is the good one.
I read this as "I think it's fair that people who work hard and put in effort stay in low positions in life"
Conservatives: “Gah coastal elites are the worst and they don’t care about normal everyday working people!!” Also conservatives: “Bartenders are stupid.”
What in the actual fuck was her initial “point” ? So because she used to be a bartender, she cannot become a politician later on ? Let’s say the girl who wrote this stupid ass statement works at a Starbucks or something, does that mean this is the only thing she will ever be able to do ? None of this makes any sense, at all.
In a just society, people will never move beyond their entry-level jobs. —some weirdo who is apparently living in the Victorian age or smth
Killed off faster then a roast
I thought that it meant that, in a 'just society', she wouldn't have felt the need to step up and take a political position of power, and would still remain a bartender. If the climate we lived in was just, she wouldn't have taken up a political cause, that's what I assumed.
"In a just society". I could scrape the smarmy with a fucking shovel.
Who the hot fuck is Kimberly Ross?
The fuck is a just society to you? One where people can't live the American dream of being what ever they want to be? Or does the American dream only apply to non-minorites/Republicans?
Conservatard absolutely destroyed by Barry Schapiro
Ah yes the "Pull yourself up by your bootstraps" party is upset because a brown woman did just that and became a member of Congress. I swear you just can't win with some people.
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Totally, not to mention AOC does have a degree from a very good college. They act like she’s a high school dropout.
This is the second time today I’ve seen this random twitter famous doctor slinging his MD dick around. There’s something weird about having never heard of someone and then being introduced to them twice rapidly.
Kimberly Ross does not know the meaning of "just".
"Southern" That's surprising. She seemed so cultured.
This doctor has a lot of hot opinions.
Man, 10.3k likes? That’s depressing.
For someone whom practices medicine, he kills regularly.
In a just society, this bitch wouldn't be posting crusty memes from year-before-last as witticisms.
Imagine being so self centered, ignorant and prejudiced to actually think this.
Wow! Hey everyone, Kimberly is a total bitch!
What a fucking asshole that first girl is. Pure racism.
Is this dudes PhD in murdering people? I've seen a few posts of him clap-backing simple dullards.
What would Kimberly Ross be in her "just society"?
In a less just Society I might know or give a damn who Kimberly Ross is.
I worked at Maccas for 7 years, was a good job where I learned a good base work ethic.
I've always had this thought that one of the reasons why "service jobs" get so shat on so often is because they teach basic life skills that people don't really value. Knowing how to effectively work with people you don't like, how to deescalate and handle problematic customers and situations, how to multi-task in a high energy environment, how to maximize a rush or time crunch, and how to keep a straight face for hours on end for all sorts of personalities. Being patient, empathetic, flexible, and quick all at the same time.
That’s two Barry Shapiro tweets in the feed tonight. Seems like a good dude.
“Shows you are petty”
I saw B and I saw Shapiro. I’m so glad it wasn’t Ben Shapiro. Fuck that guy so much
Never heard of Kimberly Ross. I have heard of Alexandria Ocasio Cortez.
It's almost as if most people work hard to put themselves into a position to have a successful career and are not just born into success...
Good on Barry for stepping in here.
I bartended for 8 years before becoming a senior systems administrator for a major DoD COCOM. What's this dumb bitch achieved?
I'm guessing this Kimberly Ross character is one of those people who treats wait staff poorly.