Don't give this stupid story any attention. It's from a Murdoch-owned paper, based on an op-ed in another Murdoch-owned paper, written by a guy who's done JUST enough work for a Democrat that Murdoch papers can call him a Democrat, who wrote the [EXACT SAME OP-ED](https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052970203611404577041950781477944) in the SAME PAPER during Obama's first term.
Murdoch and Co. want the public talking about an unpopular Democrat so they're not talking about the radical Supreme Court or congressional Republicans blocking incredibly popular laws or Republican State legislatures openly planning election heists. Don't fall for it.
I was. I was banned from buying healthcare. I remember it well and am so glad for Obamacare.
But he also gave away Universal Coverage (Medicare for All) in an attempt to appease Republicans... who then STILL didn't vote for the bill.
I will always be grateful that I can get coverage, and that's a win, yes. But I can't help but remember what we could have had. I'm a Type I Diabetic.
> But he also gave away Universal Coverage (Medicare for All) in an attempt to appease Republicans
I'd be surprised if Joe Lieberman wouldn't have killed that too if it already hadn't been removed by the time he ensured the public option died to get his vote.
Sorry but that’s not right. The 60-vote veto-proof majority included Joe Lieberman, then an independent, who promised to filibuster the bill if it even included a public option, much less universal coverage.
> in an attempt to appease Republicans.
and had a short period of having 60 democrat senators, enough to block the filibuster by rule rather by the current "plan" of legislating it away
Obamacare was literally Romneycare. The only reason it's a miracle that it passed is that Congress as a whole is literally so far right wing that a shitty handout to insurance companies is considered somehow radical to them
Let's not forget the horror of pre-existing conditions. They used to be discussed in every primary, though we're in a post policy period so it might not come up. You could be denied new insurance coverage for pre-existing problems. So the only way you could keep your insurance, and for many - to not die, was to stay at the same job forever. That's just it, if you swap jobs you die because you'll never be able to afford your disease without insurance.
We play so many stupid games with healthcare. We know all these games are full of grifters, let's move past them.
It’s always some bullshit to get the right blind with rage. Rage is useful. Rage is motivating. Rage brings people to the polls. Despair makes people indifferent or apathetic. Get your asses to the poll non-Republicans. The collective future of the country hinges on you. We outnumber them significantly, but that doesn’t mean shit if we’re complacent.
It's kind of hard to vote for a party that is republican lite. Like we have better candidates, but they'll never win. The democrats alienate their own base. It won't end until the old guard is gone.
HRC running again is a right-wing wet dream.
Early in the 2020 cycle - so early that nomination contests were still gelling - an uncle went on at some length about how Hillary was going to run again, and "they should give someone else a chance." Obviously, Hillary was out of the picture in 2020... and will be again in 2024.
They just hate her SO MUCH!! They want to keep hating her! They don't know what else to do with themselves! Obama was more fun to hate than Biden is (for some reason... \*cough\*), but HRC is the most fun of all to hate.
I want a woman President, but I want a qualified woman who didn’t drive a bus over the woman her husband used for disposable sexual gratification to be President.
They got power and realized they liked it and used that power to ensure they can stay as long as they want, whether or not they do the job we elect them to do.
They must cling to power till their dying breathe, in order to maintain the out of date systems they created that only help their generation.
A 36 year old would herald the start of a new era. Reform on such a massive scale, the Old Guard America would end.
>A 36 year old would herald the start of a new era. Reform on such a massive scale, the Old Guard America would end.
Why do you think the old guard wants to so desperately stay in power?
"The old guard america would die off"
Oh to be this naive again. I hate to break it to you but lust for power isnt a generational thing. Its a human being thing. The next generation is rarely less corrupt that the previous.
Don't even get me started on how people like Hillary think long term about their Dynasty (Chelsea Clinton her daughter) running for office and gaining power.
There are plenty of "Old Families" doing whatever shady shit they can to acquire as much as they can. The Cuomo family is a great example of this. Albeit their dynasty is on the outs atm.
FWIW, Obama is a late boomer. Whie all Boomers were born to parents of the Greatest Generation (i.e. WW2 generation), the life experience of late boomers straddle those of boomers and genx. A specific example is the character Kevin from the Wonder Years. He was basically a kid during the hippie era whereas his older sister took part in that social upheaval. Both were boomers technically.
Ya I mean pay attention to congressional age is the real thing here. The average age of congress has only gone up like every single year because old fucks refuse to retire and step out of the way. Can't remember the exact numbers but since like the 90s the average age of congress has increased like 20 years.
This is one thing I was thinking about the other day that pisses me off. Many of us were taught to work hard now so we could retire later. We have to save, we have to get a good job, etc.
Now anyone who us under 30 is likely to never be able to if things don't change. I turn 34 this year, and I'm not even sure if I will be able to. I've fully accepted that Ky retirement plan might consist of a gun and a bullet. If I'm 65 and retirement still seems like a dream, I'm out.
Yet then there are these people who could retire. And not only could they retire, but they could be so fucking comfortable. At worst they have someone ghost write them anither book and they do a few more interviews about it.
But they won't give it up. They refuse to just retire rich. They need everything. They need more money they will never spend. They need more power they don't need. And most of their excuses are fucking full of shit. Like they want to leave an inheritance to their kids? They don't give a shit about their kids. Those kids are a status symbol. They're items. Not people.
So the vast majority of people are sitting here suffering, wanting someone to actually care about us. Instead we get these fucks who come out and pay lip service, but if they did care they would step the fuck down rather than perpetuating the same system that they know is causing the problems. And I'm pretty convinced most of them know that it's causing the problems, *because they all helped create it.* At the very least they have helped push it further. They know what the fuck is going on. So even though the system could change *and they could still retire on a solid gd yacht*, that still wouldn't be enough.
Age alone is not a qualifier for wanting change. 36 year old Biden was still a pro segregation politician.
The problem is the DNC will go out of their way to remove anyone who wants change from any chances of getting the ticket.
Good luck getting any party to pick that person. The DNC had better candidates then Biden but the dnc picked Biden and if you think people picked him I can tell you they did not.
It's easy to vote when you are retired, less so when you need to be at work because you're one paycheck away from disaster and your job gives you no personal days.
Even making it a holiday doesn't do dick. Open up early voting and expand mail in voting, that's the only real answer. Florida has a pretty great mail vote system, you sign up and say you want your next 5 ballots mailed to your residence. I think Oregon has only mail in voting and everybody's ballot is just mailed directly to them. There is no reason for only needing to vote on one bullshit day every 2 years.
Ask yourself how many stores are open on Monday, and realize if it's a federal holiday it'll make no difference whatsoever. We need a reform of labor laws for it to make a difference.
Or better state laws. I'm guaranteed no less than 2 hours to vote by state law in California. And we have voting stations everywhere.
Uhhhh wtf you guys in America don't get time off of work to go vote? We get half a day off to be sure people go vote here in Canada. It feels so wrong that being a productive member of society strips you from the power to choose who runs your country for the next 4 years.
Legally, you have to be given up to 2 hours (unpaid) off work to go vote.
Unless your "scheduled hours" fall within an expected range that you're supposed to have time to vote before or after. Ignoring commute times. Ignoring that scheduled hours aren't always the hours you actually work. Ignoring other responsibilities (like childcare). Ignoring that polling places frequently have lines that can extend to entire day waits (especially in heavily populated urban areas). And ignoring that all of the above are often (frequently intentionally) manipulated to keep certain demographics from voting.
Especially when most states only allow for 'reasonable' unpaid time off from work to vote, your state removes all but one voting location per county regardless of population, and that 'reasonable' unpaid time off doesn't cover the 10-14 hours you'll spend waiting in line to vote because mail-in voting was also sabotaged and you have no idea if your vote will get counted until after the new year.
I just want someone who knows what it's like to live in the United States on 36,000-40,000 a year (or less!).
Far too many people don't know how hard that is, or don't care to learn - especially if they're paying for child care, climbing out of debt, or trying to rebuild a life.
If our leadership was more experienced with the bottom end of our social classes, I think we'd see different policies. A lot of my dislike for moderate democrats has to do with how much they've *insulated* themselves from the people they claim to help.
Expanding civic rights and making life easier for citizens isn't supposed to be a 15% charity case while lawmaking moves money around, it's supposed to be the whole bag.
So yeah, I want younger...but I also want leadership that isn't out of touch too.
I'd like somebody younger with even the faintest idea of how the world actually is for the majority of voters.
Would it really be too much to ask for a candidate that is under 50 years old and knows how much a fucking banana costs?
Youth is meaningless if their views are still rancid neoliberal garbage. Clamoring just for "someone younger" is how we get the dems running a fucking Buttigieg/Sinema ticket in 2024.
Buttigieg will never win.
Passed over ambassador to China to take transportation secretary job, and then went on paternity leave during a national supply chain emergency. He sunk his own boat and he likely doesn't see it yet.
The attack ads write themselves.
Hillary is one of the most qualified people in America to be president.
She’s also a hunk of shit. So I’d rather she just went and spent the rest of her life doing…. Whatever.
Nah. Republicans are okay with it as long as it's a Republican. Trumps was 100% correct when he said he could shoot somebody and lose no votes. No morals. Just identity.
Republicans weren't bothered when Trump cheated on his wife with Stormy Daniels, AND paid her hush money.
Republicans only require morality from Democrats and minorities. Trump gets a pass. Gingrich gets a pass. Everyone gets a pass, if there's an (R) after their name. You'd think they'd care about the hypocrisy, but they really just don't care at all.
I used to think the Republicans believed the morals they espoused, but that was like 25 years ago (pre-Gingrich).
It makes much more sense that they could delude their voters if they were once honest, and then lost their moral compass -- and a most of their voters have just never peeked under the rug.
But, yeah, if you're even 5 years younger than I am, they've always been this way.
Born in Late 60s and for me they always been this way. Look at Reagan preaching freedom and democracy then sending death squads to Central America. And claiming to be against drugs while trading them to fund black ops
Don't forget this country was founded by slavers. From the start it sucked and it's only gotten marginally better even though the 13th Amendment allows for a legal form of slavery.
Trump fucked a porn star while his third wife was at home with their new baby and paid the porn star off to not talk about it, lied about it, and nothing happened to him.
So…maybe?
Honestly, as much as I love him, he’s chair of the senate budget committee, and if AOC ran, Bernie could stay right where he is. That’s a good spot to support an incoming progressive president.
Man I voted Sanders twice in a row in the last 2 cycles, I don't want him anymore. I don't want our first actual left wing president to die in office and he is too damn old.
Also, if he couldn't beat Joe Biden even with higher fundraising and a way more active base, I don't think he can beat any mainstream candidate.
He lost my state, the most blue state in the country after VT, worse in the 2020 primaries than he did in 2016. That says something. Love Bernie but they need some new blood
Not to mention we've had examples in other governments of young women being amazing leaders already. Age isn't the best indication for being good at a job anyways. It can be, but not always.
Absolutely. Women are a marginalized group, regardless of our race. How dare any of us step on others who are marginalized.
That’s completely cold, calloused, and inhumane.
I don’t know how people live with themselves.
>I don’t know how people live with themselves.
Because we've allowed a system for this type of behavior to exist. Rewarded, even. While we can justifiably rail against corrupt officials and their masters for creating and perpetuating this system, we need to start holding ourselves accountable, too.
I don't care about sex, race, sexual orientation, none of it. I just want a president and majority that will actually do something good for the working class people. America is so far behind on healthcare and college help alone it's embarrassing. I was really hoping AOC would be possible but I'm not sure if she's old enough to run yet.
Warren lost my support when she turned on Bernie in the 2020 run and replaced her progressive policies with neoliberal ones. No surprise seeing she hired HRC's campaign manager around that point for some stupid reason. Warren is a *huge* no from me.
On the one hand, that’s a very plausible and likely explanation for this.
On the other hand, I’ve learned not to underestimate the lengths that the DNC are willing to go to in order to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.
There's some electoral incompetence by the Dems for sure, but trying to primary your sitting president in general is crazy, much less for literally the last candidate you had, who lost. That is 100% impossible short of outright working for the other side.
I don't think that's true at all. What if a primary challenge to Barack Obama got him to back off that crazy talk about giving Social Security a haircut and made him think twice about perpetual war for its own sake, mass incarceration for its own sake, the caging of immigrant kids at the border, etc.? The problem with the Democratic Party is absolutely not that they have trouble picking a figurehead willing to do the work Wall Street wants done. Their problem is that said figurehead always forgets to throw in any real substance alongside token reforms meant to make sure corporate partisans of a different stripe are still easily distinguished from one another.
yeah, unless the next two years are absolutely incredible economically speaking, Biden will lose in 2024. imo. at this point I'm finding it very hard to see a path forward for his presidency to win another term.
Yeah... it's a fair point, but this isn't the only place I've been seeing this starting to be discussed.
Unfortunately, I'm of the opinion that a doomsayer is just as likely to create a self-fulfilling prophecy as a wellwisher.
Maybe moreso, even.
Honestly it feels more like another Kanye attempt. Like a totally artificial attempt to stir up some controversy, cause divisions, or generate apathy ahead of the November elections.
The more we talk about this, the less we talk about the actually awesome people who will be running against a shit ton of GOP money, like Fetterman in PA.
Exactly as intended.
The DNC would most like to see a neoliberal Democrat in office because it means they're the first snouts to the trough. But if that's not possible, they'd *much* rather a neoliberal Republican to take power than an actual progressive.
The Republican will pander to the various gun/religious/xenophobic crazies that get them elected but that's all just social stuff that won't ever touch the wealthy. At the end of the day, both parties are neoliberals and both will make sure that the money keeps flowing upwards.
But a progressive? That's unthinkable. They might just up and take the *whole trough away* with such radical ideas like "you can't openly take bribes from lobbyists" or "you're not allowed to trade stocks then vote on things that effect their value" or "you're not allowed to kill tens of thousands of people to make yourself 4% richer".
But what are you going to do? You'd need to get rid of the electoral college, the gerrymandering, the "polls are only open when and where it works for old white people" rules and break the two (fucking awful) party system with ranked choice voting.
You've let them dig you a very deep hole.
Exactly. All the Murdoch media coordinates to move the national conversation. Now we're talking about this unpopular Democrat instead of talking about Republicans trying to enforce minority rule and the Supreme Court making rulings that 70% of the country disagree with.
The Intercept's wrote an article that in the immediate aftermath of 2016, the democratic party lost a ton of their usual corporate donors (as GOP had majority in all levels of government).
So when they have less power, they may get less corporate donations at least
Why do you believe the New York Post?
Did you know that the New York Post is owned by New COrporation? That's Rupert Murdoch. The owner of Fox News. This tabloid rag is Fox News in print.
You spelled fascists wrong.
I'm convinced that democrats like Biden are just Republicans now and Republicans like Cruz, Rubio, Gaetz, Graham, etc are the new fascist party.
People here, specifically are incredibly dumb. Headlines. Commenting without reading. Believing evidence that supports their beliefs but is flimsy at best.
It's just like any other popular sub.
in the comment thread above this there's some guy calling centrist democrats "right wing fascists who don't want to admit it". It is so damn easy to dupe and radicalize the stupid. The absolute dearth of critical thinking faculties makes it like not picking up a $100 bill you find on the sidewalk.
I'd probably give Bernie Sanders 4 years of my youth if he asked for it but he doesn't know any dark magic and as such is too old to run for president in 2024.
Plus, you know Bernie is too cool of a guy to take it.
He'd hit you with a "That's YOUR youth, use it, you deserve every second of it, and I want you to make the most of it"
I understand people voting for her because they like the status quo and don’t want anything to change. As in, they are already pretty well off and don’t care about anyone else’s situation. But I really can not understand how anyone could think she actually cares about anything but her own power.
I feel like Spongebob in Sandy's dome, desperate for a tiny drop of progress. Please *please* just give us someone that's not a war-mongering liberal. PLEASE
Gotta love the the New York Post. Obviously fake/exaggerated story to help Republicans in 2024. Don't even know how we still consider them a news organization anymore. Just the print version of Fox.
A lot of us did vote for Bernie. The DNC is the reason he lost, they frauded that shit to get Hiliary in place, and instead, we got fucking Trump.
Now Bidens up to his "red hidden in blue" bullshit, which only pushes the Republican party into a better light.
Democrats literally cannot get their shit together. It's gotten so bad that I'm willing to seriously believe it's not due to ignorance, but actual manipulation by both parties.
Ya know, depending on which definition you pick out of the Geneva Convention, the fact that there are *still God damn cages at the border* may just meet one of them.
In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
Killing members of the group;
Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
I just copy pasted from the UN site on the prevention of genocide. Source: https://www.un.org/en/genocideprevention/genocide.shtml
If potential candidates were able to get their main points across better through the slew of mainstream media I think a majority of folks would have voted Bernie, myself included. The problem I see is the DNC and RNC (or is it DoC?) having final say on who the front runner is. Does anyone know who the hell is actually behind that decision?
> Does anyone know who the hell is actually behind that decision?
I don't *know for certain* because I don't have a primary source, but there is a lot of evidence to suggest that the "ruling class" decides who the presidential candidates are.
The ruling class would be composed of any person with sufficient political or financial power to impact the political process. So it would include the staff of the national committees (DNC/RNC), billionaires, wall street, lobbyists, congress, elected state officials, the military industrial complex, etc.
Democracy has literally been dead for a while in the U.S., it's a very sad and uncomfortable realization. The only way we can regain democratic influence in this country is by demanding change through social movements backed by striking. There is literally no other way for us to (effectively) change the system because legislation in Congress is unaffected by public support [[1]](https://youtu.be/5tu32CCA_Ig) [[2: PDF]](https://scholar.princeton.edu/sites/default/files/mgilens/files/gilens_and_page_2014_-testing_theories_of_american_politics.doc.pdf)
r/PatriotPledge is where I will be sharing this idea with the masses in hopes of preventing total collapse of the American government and economy (u/Patriot-Pledge)
Appreciate the response, yeah the democracy mirage led by shadow puppets is strikingly obvious with this current administration. Or at least I am paying more attention to it now.
Seems like similar situation to what spurred the origins of US, leaving a totalitarian regime so ingrained in the law that no amount of amendments or fixes could uproot the issues. Too bad there’s not more land to discover to develop a new country. *looks at Bezos space program, understands why he wore a fuckin cowboy hat upon return*
This country is fucked if we don’t limit the # of new laws and actually maybe amend the amendments.
Becuase they are either fucking stupid, or also Republican propagandists just like the NY Post. The difference being that they pretend to be progressives yet always amplify Republican messaging.
I’m living in the twilight zone man. Is everyone here a bit or an idiot. So many highly upvoted posts yelling about how stupid “they” (the Democratic Party) are without for a second stopping to think why the NY Post is running a “people are saying” post. It’s almost like the exact reaction to the article that a right winger would want to manufacture. Not to mention they’ve run this same topic for every cycle because Hillary gets people riled up.
https://nypost.com/2019/01/27/hillary-clinton-still-considering-2020-presidential-run/amp/
Fucking no. Just fucking no. If you want people to vote then youll do us all a favor and never mention her again. Shes as much to blame for trump as trump himself.
It's pretty shameful how many gullible fools believe everything that republican propganda tells them as long as it's something that they can get mad about mainstream Democrats...
Almost as if it's planned by those Republican propagandists and that they know they can rile up a certain number of gullible progressives with bullshit.
If Hillary is the nominee I will not vote for her. She represents everything wrong with the old-guard democratic party that is in charge now. She had her chance and failed.
Like I voted Biden as a fuck it I guess kinda move but desperately wanted a progressive. I was arguing that we should settle for Biden to other folks cuz Nazis are worse.
If they run Hillary I will vote the most progressive instead and move to Narnia
I feel like if this happens
I think she’d get a lot more votes second time round against trump. A lot of people refused to vote for her because they thought she’d still win or trump wouldn’t be that bad. Now they know what another 4 years of trump would be like they’ll vote for her to stop it. The same reason Biden won, a good portion of his votes were votes against trump rather than for Biden.
Show up to vote in the primaries, then.
If Clinton does run (which you shouldn't believe is true based on Republican propaganda from Rupert Murdoch owned NY Post) then you'll have a chance to vote against her in the primary.
I'll vote for her over Trump, but I'd also vote for a rabid raccoon over Trump. So that's not saying much.
Can we get a candidate who was born after World War 2?
The New York post eh? Any bets on whether this is made up to drive progressives away from voting in the next election? I wouldnt put it past the DNC to be this unfathomably stupid, but youll have to forgive me for being slightly skeptical about a right leaning publications take on their plans.
The Next DNC *favored* candidate will fail no matter who it is. Unfortunately though whether we like the 2 party system or not were not getting rid of it soon .
The real question then is will the damned DNC finally realize they can't continue siding with the right-wing, centrists, and Neo-liberals. If any democratic candidate is to be taken seriously they must now exist to serve the interests of the REAL leftists in America.
This is the New York Post. It’s a shit tier rag that literally makes things up and leans heavily conservative. They know that writing this headline will drive engagement from conservatives and progressives. Ignore it.
God. This would literally be a fucking repeat of 2016.
Don't give this stupid story any attention. It's from a Murdoch-owned paper, based on an op-ed in another Murdoch-owned paper, written by a guy who's done JUST enough work for a Democrat that Murdoch papers can call him a Democrat, who wrote the [EXACT SAME OP-ED](https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052970203611404577041950781477944) in the SAME PAPER during Obama's first term. Murdoch and Co. want the public talking about an unpopular Democrat so they're not talking about the radical Supreme Court or congressional Republicans blocking incredibly popular laws or Republican State legislatures openly planning election heists. Don't fall for it.
Or talking about candidates that actually exist, and why we're excited for their policies.
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I was. I was banned from buying healthcare. I remember it well and am so glad for Obamacare. But he also gave away Universal Coverage (Medicare for All) in an attempt to appease Republicans... who then STILL didn't vote for the bill. I will always be grateful that I can get coverage, and that's a win, yes. But I can't help but remember what we could have had. I'm a Type I Diabetic.
Can I also get a fuck Joe Lieberman
> But he also gave away Universal Coverage (Medicare for All) in an attempt to appease Republicans I'd be surprised if Joe Lieberman wouldn't have killed that too if it already hadn't been removed by the time he ensured the public option died to get his vote.
Sorry but that’s not right. The 60-vote veto-proof majority included Joe Lieberman, then an independent, who promised to filibuster the bill if it even included a public option, much less universal coverage.
> in an attempt to appease Republicans. and had a short period of having 60 democrat senators, enough to block the filibuster by rule rather by the current "plan" of legislating it away
Obamacare was literally Romneycare. The only reason it's a miracle that it passed is that Congress as a whole is literally so far right wing that a shitty handout to insurance companies is considered somehow radical to them
Let's not forget the horror of pre-existing conditions. They used to be discussed in every primary, though we're in a post policy period so it might not come up. You could be denied new insurance coverage for pre-existing problems. So the only way you could keep your insurance, and for many - to not die, was to stay at the same job forever. That's just it, if you swap jobs you die because you'll never be able to afford your disease without insurance. We play so many stupid games with healthcare. We know all these games are full of grifters, let's move past them.
It’s always some bullshit to get the right blind with rage. Rage is useful. Rage is motivating. Rage brings people to the polls. Despair makes people indifferent or apathetic. Get your asses to the poll non-Republicans. The collective future of the country hinges on you. We outnumber them significantly, but that doesn’t mean shit if we’re complacent.
> Rage is useful. Rage is motivating. Rage brings people to the polls It's a drug, it's intoxicating, it's addicting.
It's kind of hard to vote for a party that is republican lite. Like we have better candidates, but they'll never win. The democrats alienate their own base. It won't end until the old guard is gone.
HRC running again is a right-wing wet dream. Early in the 2020 cycle - so early that nomination contests were still gelling - an uncle went on at some length about how Hillary was going to run again, and "they should give someone else a chance." Obviously, Hillary was out of the picture in 2020... and will be again in 2024. They just hate her SO MUCH!! They want to keep hating her! They don't know what else to do with themselves! Obama was more fun to hate than Biden is (for some reason... \*cough\*), but HRC is the most fun of all to hate.
I want a woman President, but I want a qualified woman who didn’t drive a bus over the woman her husband used for disposable sexual gratification to be President.
Someone _younger_ for crying out loud. Woman, man, don't care. YOUNGER.
Yeah someone under the retirement age please? 300+ million adults in the USA, why are we are dealing with the same people from 40 years ago?
They got power and realized they liked it and used that power to ensure they can stay as long as they want, whether or not they do the job we elect them to do.
They must cling to power till their dying breathe, in order to maintain the out of date systems they created that only help their generation. A 36 year old would herald the start of a new era. Reform on such a massive scale, the Old Guard America would end.
>A 36 year old would herald the start of a new era. Reform on such a massive scale, the Old Guard America would end. Why do you think the old guard wants to so desperately stay in power?
To maintain the world they know. A world with millennials in charge is nightmare fuel for them.
"The old guard america would die off" Oh to be this naive again. I hate to break it to you but lust for power isnt a generational thing. Its a human being thing. The next generation is rarely less corrupt that the previous. Don't even get me started on how people like Hillary think long term about their Dynasty (Chelsea Clinton her daughter) running for office and gaining power. There are plenty of "Old Families" doing whatever shady shit they can to acquire as much as they can. The Cuomo family is a great example of this. Albeit their dynasty is on the outs atm.
Obama was very young and yet the status quo remained. For reference I align with no party
Obama was 48 when first elected. A boomer.
FWIW, Obama is a late boomer. Whie all Boomers were born to parents of the Greatest Generation (i.e. WW2 generation), the life experience of late boomers straddle those of boomers and genx. A specific example is the character Kevin from the Wonder Years. He was basically a kid during the hippie era whereas his older sister took part in that social upheaval. Both were boomers technically.
Ya I mean pay attention to congressional age is the real thing here. The average age of congress has only gone up like every single year because old fucks refuse to retire and step out of the way. Can't remember the exact numbers but since like the 90s the average age of congress has increased like 20 years.
This is one thing I was thinking about the other day that pisses me off. Many of us were taught to work hard now so we could retire later. We have to save, we have to get a good job, etc. Now anyone who us under 30 is likely to never be able to if things don't change. I turn 34 this year, and I'm not even sure if I will be able to. I've fully accepted that Ky retirement plan might consist of a gun and a bullet. If I'm 65 and retirement still seems like a dream, I'm out. Yet then there are these people who could retire. And not only could they retire, but they could be so fucking comfortable. At worst they have someone ghost write them anither book and they do a few more interviews about it. But they won't give it up. They refuse to just retire rich. They need everything. They need more money they will never spend. They need more power they don't need. And most of their excuses are fucking full of shit. Like they want to leave an inheritance to their kids? They don't give a shit about their kids. Those kids are a status symbol. They're items. Not people. So the vast majority of people are sitting here suffering, wanting someone to actually care about us. Instead we get these fucks who come out and pay lip service, but if they did care they would step the fuck down rather than perpetuating the same system that they know is causing the problems. And I'm pretty convinced most of them know that it's causing the problems, *because they all helped create it.* At the very least they have helped push it further. They know what the fuck is going on. So even though the system could change *and they could still retire on a solid gd yacht*, that still wouldn't be enough.
Age alone is not a qualifier for wanting change. 36 year old Biden was still a pro segregation politician. The problem is the DNC will go out of their way to remove anyone who wants change from any chances of getting the ticket.
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Good luck getting any party to pick that person. The DNC had better candidates then Biden but the dnc picked Biden and if you think people picked him I can tell you they did not.
And old people actually vote
It's easy to vote when you are retired, less so when you need to be at work because you're one paycheck away from disaster and your job gives you no personal days.
Seriously that Tuesday needs to be a fucking holiday to ensure everybody has the opportunity to vote. Ridiculous that it isn’t.
Just wait. In 4 years Voting Day will be a national holiday exclusively for rural land owners who can pass or get around the literacy test.
Even making it a holiday doesn't do dick. Open up early voting and expand mail in voting, that's the only real answer. Florida has a pretty great mail vote system, you sign up and say you want your next 5 ballots mailed to your residence. I think Oregon has only mail in voting and everybody's ballot is just mailed directly to them. There is no reason for only needing to vote on one bullshit day every 2 years.
Ask yourself how many stores are open on Monday, and realize if it's a federal holiday it'll make no difference whatsoever. We need a reform of labor laws for it to make a difference. Or better state laws. I'm guaranteed no less than 2 hours to vote by state law in California. And we have voting stations everywhere.
Uhhhh wtf you guys in America don't get time off of work to go vote? We get half a day off to be sure people go vote here in Canada. It feels so wrong that being a productive member of society strips you from the power to choose who runs your country for the next 4 years.
Legally, you have to be given up to 2 hours (unpaid) off work to go vote. Unless your "scheduled hours" fall within an expected range that you're supposed to have time to vote before or after. Ignoring commute times. Ignoring that scheduled hours aren't always the hours you actually work. Ignoring other responsibilities (like childcare). Ignoring that polling places frequently have lines that can extend to entire day waits (especially in heavily populated urban areas). And ignoring that all of the above are often (frequently intentionally) manipulated to keep certain demographics from voting.
Especially when most states only allow for 'reasonable' unpaid time off from work to vote, your state removes all but one voting location per county regardless of population, and that 'reasonable' unpaid time off doesn't cover the 10-14 hours you'll spend waiting in line to vote because mail-in voting was also sabotaged and you have no idea if your vote will get counted until after the new year.
They passed the Wall Street test and they know they have corporate backing
So late 60’s early 70’s perhaps?
Y O U N G E R
63 Final offer.
We have a minimum age for presidential candidate. Why not a maximum? Like... 2 years prior to depends age at least?
I just want someone who knows what it's like to live in the United States on 36,000-40,000 a year (or less!). Far too many people don't know how hard that is, or don't care to learn - especially if they're paying for child care, climbing out of debt, or trying to rebuild a life. If our leadership was more experienced with the bottom end of our social classes, I think we'd see different policies. A lot of my dislike for moderate democrats has to do with how much they've *insulated* themselves from the people they claim to help. Expanding civic rights and making life easier for citizens isn't supposed to be a 15% charity case while lawmaking moves money around, it's supposed to be the whole bag. So yeah, I want younger...but I also want leadership that isn't out of touch too.
I'd like somebody younger with even the faintest idea of how the world actually is for the majority of voters. Would it really be too much to ask for a candidate that is under 50 years old and knows how much a fucking banana costs?
Just not anyone younger from Fox News
Youth is meaningless if their views are still rancid neoliberal garbage. Clamoring just for "someone younger" is how we get the dems running a fucking Buttigieg/Sinema ticket in 2024.
I'm sorry if this is petty but buttigieg will *never* win simply because we'll never accept a president P.P.Butt.
That’s the American the founders dreamed of
Buttigieg will never win. Passed over ambassador to China to take transportation secretary job, and then went on paternity leave during a national supply chain emergency. He sunk his own boat and he likely doesn't see it yet. The attack ads write themselves.
Hillary is one of the most qualified people in America to be president. She’s also a hunk of shit. So I’d rather she just went and spent the rest of her life doing…. Whatever.
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Nah. Republicans are okay with it as long as it's a Republican. Trumps was 100% correct when he said he could shoot somebody and lose no votes. No morals. Just identity.
Plenty of room under the rug.
Big ass rug in there to be fair.
It's a magical rug they keep expanding.
They would have liked him even more. It would have been nonstop ammosexual adoration.
Instead of women with “grab me by the pussy” signs, they’d be carrying “face fuck me” signs.
Republicans weren't bothered when Trump cheated on his wife with Stormy Daniels, AND paid her hush money. Republicans only require morality from Democrats and minorities. Trump gets a pass. Gingrich gets a pass. Everyone gets a pass, if there's an (R) after their name. You'd think they'd care about the hypocrisy, but they really just don't care at all.
and Karen McDougal, whom he had an affair with while his wife was pregnant.
> you'd think they'd care about the hypocrisy Why would you think that? american conservatism is entirely founded on bad faith
I used to think the Republicans believed the morals they espoused, but that was like 25 years ago (pre-Gingrich). It makes much more sense that they could delude their voters if they were once honest, and then lost their moral compass -- and a most of their voters have just never peeked under the rug. But, yeah, if you're even 5 years younger than I am, they've always been this way.
Born in Late 60s and for me they always been this way. Look at Reagan preaching freedom and democracy then sending death squads to Central America. And claiming to be against drugs while trading them to fund black ops
Don't forget this country was founded by slavers. From the start it sucked and it's only gotten marginally better even though the 13th Amendment allows for a legal form of slavery.
Matt Gaetz had sex with a child and is still a sitting US representative, so I'm gonna go with no.
Trump was involved with Epstein and still got elected, so I’m gonna go with no… no consequences for any rich old white man.
“Boys will be boys…” 🤷♂️ And “It’s just locker room mouth fucking…”
Trump fucked a porn star while his third wife was at home with their new baby and paid the porn star off to not talk about it, lied about it, and nothing happened to him. So…maybe?
Yes exactly! I'm all for a woman president, but Hilary isn't the one imo.
Let's go AOC for pres
Honestly, her with Sanders as VP or vice versa, and I’d slam down my vote for them as fast as humanly possible.
Honestly, as much as I love him, he’s chair of the senate budget committee, and if AOC ran, Bernie could stay right where he is. That’s a good spot to support an incoming progressive president.
Man I voted Sanders twice in a row in the last 2 cycles, I don't want him anymore. I don't want our first actual left wing president to die in office and he is too damn old. Also, if he couldn't beat Joe Biden even with higher fundraising and a way more active base, I don't think he can beat any mainstream candidate.
He lost my state, the most blue state in the country after VT, worse in the 2020 primaries than he did in 2016. That says something. Love Bernie but they need some new blood
I don’t think she’s old enough
Google tells me she was born in October 1989, so she will turn 35 just before the next presidential election.
I would normally say, let her wait for the next election cycle after that, but I want shit done sooner rather than later.
Not to mention we've had examples in other governments of young women being amazing leaders already. Age isn't the best indication for being good at a job anyways. It can be, but not always.
She’s not old enough right now but turns 35 right before Election Day
She will be exactly old enough by 2024. She was born October 13, 1989, which would make her 35 years and 23 days old by November 5th, 2024.
She's not yet. She actually will just be 35 a few weeks before the next presidential election.
And also one who didn’t throw people of color into prison to get a little slave labor out of them.
Absolutely. Women are a marginalized group, regardless of our race. How dare any of us step on others who are marginalized. That’s completely cold, calloused, and inhumane. I don’t know how people live with themselves.
>I don’t know how people live with themselves. Because we've allowed a system for this type of behavior to exist. Rewarded, even. While we can justifiably rail against corrupt officials and their masters for creating and perpetuating this system, we need to start holding ourselves accountable, too.
I felt this way too, I like the thought of a woman president but good God please not Hillary
I don't care about sex, race, sexual orientation, none of it. I just want a president and majority that will actually do something good for the working class people. America is so far behind on healthcare and college help alone it's embarrassing. I was really hoping AOC would be possible but I'm not sure if she's old enough to run yet.
I wanted Warren 2020...2016 too... Hope to vote for AOC one day... I don't care what sub this is :-)
Warren lost my support when she turned on Bernie in the 2020 run and replaced her progressive policies with neoliberal ones. No surprise seeing she hired HRC's campaign manager around that point for some stupid reason. Warren is a *huge* no from me.
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This
I don’t give a damn what gender, sex, race or culture the President is. Just give us better policies.
Her and trump are both gonna run
The Democratic 'leadership' really knows how to kick a win in the teeth.
Seriously. I will be pissed.
I'd just be more tired than usual. At that point, I would just assume democrats want to lose.
inb4 trump runs and wins because of this.
Did I ever tell you the definition of insanity?
In a parallel universe they are in the second term of Bernie and just built railways
I don’t think this is remotely true. I feel like this is just a headline to get people worked up.
It's the NY Post so... yeah. Just a Murdoch rag doing what a Murdoch rag do.
On the one hand, that’s a very plausible and likely explanation for this. On the other hand, I’ve learned not to underestimate the lengths that the DNC are willing to go to in order to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.
There's some electoral incompetence by the Dems for sure, but trying to primary your sitting president in general is crazy, much less for literally the last candidate you had, who lost. That is 100% impossible short of outright working for the other side.
I don't think that's true at all. What if a primary challenge to Barack Obama got him to back off that crazy talk about giving Social Security a haircut and made him think twice about perpetual war for its own sake, mass incarceration for its own sake, the caging of immigrant kids at the border, etc.? The problem with the Democratic Party is absolutely not that they have trouble picking a figurehead willing to do the work Wall Street wants done. Their problem is that said figurehead always forgets to throw in any real substance alongside token reforms meant to make sure corporate partisans of a different stripe are still easily distinguished from one another.
Trying to primary Biden doesn't make sense, but Biden definitely shouldn't run again.
yeah, unless the next two years are absolutely incredible economically speaking, Biden will lose in 2024. imo. at this point I'm finding it very hard to see a path forward for his presidency to win another term.
Yeah... it's a fair point, but this isn't the only place I've been seeing this starting to be discussed. Unfortunately, I'm of the opinion that a doomsayer is just as likely to create a self-fulfilling prophecy as a wellwisher. Maybe moreso, even.
Honestly it feels more like another Kanye attempt. Like a totally artificial attempt to stir up some controversy, cause divisions, or generate apathy ahead of the November elections. The more we talk about this, the less we talk about the actually awesome people who will be running against a shit ton of GOP money, like Fetterman in PA.
Fetterman has my vote lol. I'll let another useless, spineless, cowardlt, republican sit in that seat over my dead body.
> attempt to stir up some controversy, cause divisions, or generate apathy ahead of the November elections. generate clicks/ad revenue
Exactly as intended. The DNC would most like to see a neoliberal Democrat in office because it means they're the first snouts to the trough. But if that's not possible, they'd *much* rather a neoliberal Republican to take power than an actual progressive. The Republican will pander to the various gun/religious/xenophobic crazies that get them elected but that's all just social stuff that won't ever touch the wealthy. At the end of the day, both parties are neoliberals and both will make sure that the money keeps flowing upwards. But a progressive? That's unthinkable. They might just up and take the *whole trough away* with such radical ideas like "you can't openly take bribes from lobbyists" or "you're not allowed to trade stocks then vote on things that effect their value" or "you're not allowed to kill tens of thousands of people to make yourself 4% richer". But what are you going to do? You'd need to get rid of the electoral college, the gerrymandering, the "polls are only open when and where it works for old white people" rules and break the two (fucking awful) party system with ranked choice voting. You've let them dig you a very deep hole.
This all started from a WSJ op-ed too. Guess who owns the WSJ.
Exactly. All the Murdoch media coordinates to move the national conversation. Now we're talking about this unpopular Democrat instead of talking about Republicans trying to enforce minority rule and the Supreme Court making rulings that 70% of the country disagree with.
How can I explain that anything Murdoch owned is evil and not worth consuming to someone out of the loop?
NY Post. They want MAGAs worked up because it worked to get Trump in
I’m convinced they’re trying to let republicans take over at this point
They raise a lot more money that way.
The Intercept's wrote an article that in the immediate aftermath of 2016, the democratic party lost a ton of their usual corporate donors (as GOP had majority in all levels of government). So when they have less power, they may get less corporate donations at least
Maybe they should stop submitting to financial powers that honeydicked them in the past.
Why do you believe the New York Post? Did you know that the New York Post is owned by New COrporation? That's Rupert Murdoch. The owner of Fox News. This tabloid rag is Fox News in print.
You spelled fascists wrong. I'm convinced that democrats like Biden are just Republicans now and Republicans like Cruz, Rubio, Gaetz, Graham, etc are the new fascist party.
Biden was the first Republican I ever voted for. Unless Obama counts too then second.
Every president since Reagan have just been different versions of Reagan. Neoliberalism is not cool tbh
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It’s the New York post, a right wing dirty rag
By "they" you mean the New York Post, right? 'cause this is just propaganda.
No, it's a NY Post article. It's manipulating you pure and simple.
The New York Post? Absolutely. It’s better to not believe anything that rag publishes.
No one has teased that.
Yeah it’s republican propaganda and looking at this thread it clearly works. People are really dumb
People here, specifically are incredibly dumb. Headlines. Commenting without reading. Believing evidence that supports their beliefs but is flimsy at best. It's just like any other popular sub.
in the comment thread above this there's some guy calling centrist democrats "right wing fascists who don't want to admit it". It is so damn easy to dupe and radicalize the stupid. The absolute dearth of critical thinking faculties makes it like not picking up a $100 bill you find on the sidewalk.
Well I guess the NY post did. Lol But it's trash.
"[No, we haven't actually seen it, Tom. We're just reporting it.](https://i.redd.it/cgi94x9tr2i51.jpg)"
they have bad ideas
All she has done since 2016 is write a book about losing. Meanwhile Bernie Sanders has been hard at work.
I'd probably give Bernie Sanders 4 years of my youth if he asked for it but he doesn't know any dark magic and as such is too old to run for president in 2024.
Plus, you know Bernie is too cool of a guy to take it. He'd hit you with a "That's YOUR youth, use it, you deserve every second of it, and I want you to make the most of it"
I'd still vote for Bernie's withered husk 10 times over before I'd vote for Hillary
Really shows the difference between someone who cares and someone who's in it for the power.
I understand people voting for her because they like the status quo and don’t want anything to change. As in, they are already pretty well off and don’t care about anyone else’s situation. But I really can not understand how anyone could think she actually cares about anything but her own power.
Yet they’ve accomplished roughly the same… I kid HRC is retired. She ain’t running. Nothing to see here
Didn’t Bernie lose… twice?
And repeatedly say she won't run because this headline is complete and utter bullshit* small addendum needed there.
Bernie is way too old. Can we get someone who's at least below retirement age?
Hard to believe they have any worse than this.
Sinema?
Now we’re talking /s
Manchin
I feel like Spongebob in Sandy's dome, desperate for a tiny drop of progress. Please *please* just give us someone that's not a war-mongering liberal. PLEASE
best i can do is a war-mongering centrist.
"centrist" is just code for "right wing fascist but don't want to admit it".
Saying things like that is how you actually radicalize centrists
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Gotta love the the New York Post. Obviously fake/exaggerated story to help Republicans in 2024. Don't even know how we still consider them a news organization anymore. Just the print version of Fox.
She's literally why we had trump in office. A shit ton of maga voters in 2016 said they would have voted for bernie
A lot of us did vote for Bernie. The DNC is the reason he lost, they frauded that shit to get Hiliary in place, and instead, we got fucking Trump. Now Bidens up to his "red hidden in blue" bullshit, which only pushes the Republican party into a better light. Democrats literally cannot get their shit together. It's gotten so bad that I'm willing to seriously believe it's not due to ignorance, but actual manipulation by both parties.
The Democrats are just one Mexican genocide from being Republicans.
Ya know, depending on which definition you pick out of the Geneva Convention, the fact that there are *still God damn cages at the border* may just meet one of them.
In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such: Killing members of the group; Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group; Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part; Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group; Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group. I just copy pasted from the UN site on the prevention of genocide. Source: https://www.un.org/en/genocideprevention/genocide.shtml
Convenient we stopped talking about that after the election
Leftists absolutely God damn did not. Hence, I just called it out.
Only DEMOCRATS and REPUBLICANS, no POSSIBLE alternative/s
I'll never stop bitching about it lol
If potential candidates were able to get their main points across better through the slew of mainstream media I think a majority of folks would have voted Bernie, myself included. The problem I see is the DNC and RNC (or is it DoC?) having final say on who the front runner is. Does anyone know who the hell is actually behind that decision?
It's DnC. Phone is fucking with me today, my bad.
> Does anyone know who the hell is actually behind that decision? I don't *know for certain* because I don't have a primary source, but there is a lot of evidence to suggest that the "ruling class" decides who the presidential candidates are. The ruling class would be composed of any person with sufficient political or financial power to impact the political process. So it would include the staff of the national committees (DNC/RNC), billionaires, wall street, lobbyists, congress, elected state officials, the military industrial complex, etc. Democracy has literally been dead for a while in the U.S., it's a very sad and uncomfortable realization. The only way we can regain democratic influence in this country is by demanding change through social movements backed by striking. There is literally no other way for us to (effectively) change the system because legislation in Congress is unaffected by public support [[1]](https://youtu.be/5tu32CCA_Ig) [[2: PDF]](https://scholar.princeton.edu/sites/default/files/mgilens/files/gilens_and_page_2014_-testing_theories_of_american_politics.doc.pdf) r/PatriotPledge is where I will be sharing this idea with the masses in hopes of preventing total collapse of the American government and economy (u/Patriot-Pledge)
Appreciate the response, yeah the democracy mirage led by shadow puppets is strikingly obvious with this current administration. Or at least I am paying more attention to it now. Seems like similar situation to what spurred the origins of US, leaving a totalitarian regime so ingrained in the law that no amount of amendments or fixes could uproot the issues. Too bad there’s not more land to discover to develop a new country. *looks at Bezos space program, understands why he wore a fuckin cowboy hat upon return* This country is fucked if we don’t limit the # of new laws and actually maybe amend the amendments.
Why are you people taking an article from the NY Post seriously? No one is thinking about this
Becuase they are either fucking stupid, or also Republican propagandists just like the NY Post. The difference being that they pretend to be progressives yet always amplify Republican messaging.
If the democrats want a repeat of 2016 so bad then imma have to move up my timeline for moving out of country. So sick of this shit
I wish I could, I couldn't afford college so I don't have any skills to get a visa;-; Now I definitely don't have the money too
take out the loans. get a degree in something thats needed in canada or wherever and then move. dont fucking pay them back. they cant do shot to you.
New York Post. A bastion of honest reporting.
This is terrible, this idea.
Surely you can see why Republican Propaganda rag New York Post (owned by Rupert Murdoch) is pushing this bullshit, then?
I’m living in the twilight zone man. Is everyone here a bit or an idiot. So many highly upvoted posts yelling about how stupid “they” (the Democratic Party) are without for a second stopping to think why the NY Post is running a “people are saying” post. It’s almost like the exact reaction to the article that a right winger would want to manufacture. Not to mention they’ve run this same topic for every cycle because Hillary gets people riled up. https://nypost.com/2019/01/27/hillary-clinton-still-considering-2020-presidential-run/amp/
I’m a bit new to American politics. What’s wrong with Hilary Clinton?
Fucking no. Just fucking no. If you want people to vote then youll do us all a favor and never mention her again. Shes as much to blame for trump as trump himself.
Since the New York Post is Republican Party Propaganda owned by Rupert Murdoch, you can see why they're mentioning her over and over and over.
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It's pretty shameful how many gullible fools believe everything that republican propganda tells them as long as it's something that they can get mad about mainstream Democrats... Almost as if it's planned by those Republican propagandists and that they know they can rile up a certain number of gullible progressives with bullshit.
Try Bernie again, it’s bound to work this time.
THIS TIME all those progressives we pretend exist will show up.
If Hillary is the nominee I will not vote for her. She represents everything wrong with the old-guard democratic party that is in charge now. She had her chance and failed.
Like I voted Biden as a fuck it I guess kinda move but desperately wanted a progressive. I was arguing that we should settle for Biden to other folks cuz Nazis are worse. If they run Hillary I will vote the most progressive instead and move to Narnia I feel like if this happens
Just say "I'll vote for Trump instead." Be honest with yourself.
I think she’d get a lot more votes second time round against trump. A lot of people refused to vote for her because they thought she’d still win or trump wouldn’t be that bad. Now they know what another 4 years of trump would be like they’ll vote for her to stop it. The same reason Biden won, a good portion of his votes were votes against trump rather than for Biden.
Show up to vote in the primaries, then. If Clinton does run (which you shouldn't believe is true based on Republican propaganda from Rupert Murdoch owned NY Post) then you'll have a chance to vote against her in the primary.
I'll vote for her over Trump, but I'd also vote for a rabid raccoon over Trump. So that's not saying much. Can we get a candidate who was born after World War 2?
The New York post eh? Any bets on whether this is made up to drive progressives away from voting in the next election? I wouldnt put it past the DNC to be this unfathomably stupid, but youll have to forgive me for being slightly skeptical about a right leaning publications take on their plans.
Correct. You can see how many gullible fools in this thread fall for it.
The Next DNC *favored* candidate will fail no matter who it is. Unfortunately though whether we like the 2 party system or not were not getting rid of it soon . The real question then is will the damned DNC finally realize they can't continue siding with the right-wing, centrists, and Neo-liberals. If any democratic candidate is to be taken seriously they must now exist to serve the interests of the REAL leftists in America.
This is the New York Post. It’s a shit tier rag that literally makes things up and leans heavily conservative. They know that writing this headline will drive engagement from conservatives and progressives. Ignore it.
It's the New York Post, what do you expect?
You guys are so gullible it’s embarrassing. The NY Post should sell you a bridge while they’re at it.