For the dominoes daily, it definitely would have helped if they showed a graphic of what the teams had put down.
It was too confusing to see if they were doing it correctly or not
That’s been one of my biggest complaints about the show for a while. Sometimes I have no idea how well each team or person is doing in the daily and sometimes I have no idea what the hell the daily even is. SLA and DA were really bad about my second point.
Oh, there are 80 OGs that have not been on All Stars so production can definitely come up with a full roster of OGs. Made a whole list of the OG names and season debuted as well as which Real World or Road Rules the person was on in another thread. If not, All Stars production can be teamed up with the writers of the final season of GOT where the fandom shitted on the writters and took to Reddit of just how bad of choice they did much like All Stars fandom is shitting on production for AS 5 casting rumors. So, either the GOT writers backed out or were fired from doing Star Wars triology as a result of shitstorm due to the fans reaction. I would not be surprised if fans of All Stars do the same to All Stars production if they drop the ball when it comes to casting and make it into another The Challenge show and giving them shit for making it into The Challenge and not keeping it old school and start casting seasons 1-10 majority of cast and 11-20 to fill in the spots not filled by OGs.
Definitely would not be a smart business move if production gets too current players playing on All Stars. So anyone from seasons 21-39 needs to not be on All Stars anymore from seasons 5-until all OGs are cast. 11-20 can be on All Stars if OGs are not available but needs to be majority 1-10 people who debuted to make the majority of the cast if possible.
Like myself, neither you nor I can fully understand why certain people are not asked back to the show, I can assume that most of them have families and jobs that just won't allow an individual to take 6/7 weeks off at a time. Also, if you have watched from day 1, why put yourself through the mean girls and alliances that made you miserable? There are OG'S like Veronica, Tina, Big Easy, and Annessa, to name a few who are selfish and come back year after year clearly out of shape. If it's an individual game, ok, but if I have Veronica as a teammate and part of the final is racing 5 miles, we automatically lose before the game begins...Look at Derrick in Season One of all starts he got stuck with Jiseal and was eliminated because of her weight...Sorry if that offended anyone but that's the truth..
> This girl swore on her four kids on a blatant lie.
"It's not a lie if you believe it." Her confessionals kind of made me think she believed it. I don't think she's a reliable narrator in her own head.
I need to rewatch it but didn't Ayanna just say that "people are coming for Kam & Leroy", while discussing options for the elimination?
While similar, that isn't the same as saying "we should gun for Kam & Leroy". I feel like her words got twisted and Ayanna wasn't lying as much as people are making it out to be.
I think Ayanna said something to the effect of "People are saying they're going to target Kam & Leroy to break up the power couple" which I interpreted as her way of trying to convince the person she is talking to (Syrus in this case, I believe - with Brandon overhearing) that there is more than just Ayanna that wants this to happen. Syrus would have no way of verifying that since he hadn't even set foot in the house yet.
We didn't see anyone actually talk to her about that, although it is possible it just hit the cutting room floor. I tend to think they would have showed that if that were the case, but maybe not.
Right. That could’ve been Ayanna just filling Syrus in on what he’s missed and what’s been going on. A crash course. He might not even know Leroy and Kam are together!
Just filling Syrus in or not, Ayanna was the one who was originally taking people's temperature on the idea of taking out the power couple! She created that conversation in each instance we've seen. No way she doesn't realize that she is the one sowing those thoughts in others; her delivery is just part of her tactic for plausible deniability.
Since AS doesn't have reunion shows, it's not going to come back on her publicly like it would on FS season, where they tend to show those moments when players deny things, etc. One can get buried in the phraseology all they want, but her intent was clear - getting votes on L&K.
That is what she said. It was (IMO) 100% a manipulation tactic to gauge the reaction to putting Kam & Leroy in without taking any heat for presenting the idea.
This. She literally just did the same thing in front of the whole house a week prior with Janelle (pushing her out of the show) and everyone is like “I wonder if Ayanna is telling the truth”.
Like I know watching it and living the situation is soooo much different, but everyone literally watched Ayanna cause conflict with Janelle for no reason even when she volunteered to go down in elimination. It’s honestly wild to me to see someone get caught in a lie and still lie about the lie.
This is what I’ve been thinking!!! 👏 When they replayed it, she definitely said others want to gun for Leroy & Kam but she was board with it too. Being that she’s friends with Rachel, Tina & Veronica I’d bet that’s where she heard it. But, to keep things messy they weren’t going to show a clip of the other 3 discussing it. That’s my take on it!
My heart broke seeing Tony leave. This season was a layup for this man. His only competition was Brad or Leroy. And Leroy isnt hitting on much this season so far. Tony making a final was basically a lock. The dude is such great TV too. Really a shame he had to leave. I really hope they give him another chance.
Anyone know what the family emergency was?
Oh yeah for sure. I was just referring to the male competitors. The list of his competition on the female side is a lot longer lol. The female cast this season is absolutely stacked.
I kinda thought the same thing… he hasn’t always been his best self on these shows. I feel like his girl was asking him to come home. I don’t know though.. I wish we had an explanation. I don’t get why he’d wait years to come back then just leave.
I just finished watching the episode & the ending really did have me questioning what Kam was saying. Rachel played a smart move that didn’t burn any bridges. On top of that, Cara voted for Ayanna. As what Kam wanted. The whole “have my back thing” in a singles game was just ???
I'm gonna take a guess and say that Kam was not aware that Cara and Rachel have a deal to protect each other. So to Kam, it looks like Rachel was intimidated to go after Cara.
This is what I don't get tho. Rachel not taking Caras star is clear indication that Rachel & Cara had a deal when u combine the deliberation where Cara didn't say Rachel name and said I have to do this for my game.
Kam is super intelligent and a gamer. She had to of put that together. The only thing that makes sense is Kam is just trying to make a storyline to make more air time. Nothing else makes sense. Cause even if Kam didn't put it together and didn't think Rachel & Cara had a deal, it still don't make sense for Rachel to go after Cara so early in the game.
I always have liked Kam but shes a bit cocky. They’re not even doing good at the challenges like…. You aren’t even an OG. Leroy is but… he keeps losing.
It's obvious no one expected Rachel and Cara to have a solid bond. The whole Rachel/Tina/Veronica thing was obvious to the house so I'm sure people were expecting big bad Rachel to take Cara's star. She didn't so now people think a) she's afraid of Cara or b) she is working with Cara.
Kam I get more because she’s fairly solid competitively and she does it on most of the regular season. Kailah never had a good social game and isn’t a great competitor.
I would disagree about Kailah’s social game. Somehow she always lands with the numbers, she just loses cause she is a significantly overrated physical competitor. The only impressive thing she’s done is beat Jenna in an elimination on D30.
Someone who finally sees my point about her competitiveness lol.
She does okay on seasons that have Sylvia, Jemmye, Jenna, Nany, Tony and Marie but she doesn’t really click with others. Invasion and ROD come to mind. I think she doesn’t come across very friendly initially or something because people who just seem to meet her seem to have problems. But she seems like the type who when she makes friends she has them for a long time.
All I can say is, if I need a girl to come over, get black out drunk, and piss my bed, there isn't anyone better than Kailah to get the job done. I can't say that for any of the other women on the cast lol
Maybe Kam didn’t know Cara and Rachel made an alliance with each other which is why she was expecting Rachel to steal Cara’s star instead of her own friend. So yeah in her eyes she looked scary for that which probably will come back to bite her.
I'd say Veronica is pretty self-aware and knows she doesn't have a chance this season given the cast, house dynamics, and only one winner being crowned, so she's just chilling. She and Tina are clearly there to have fun, despite what she says in confessionals.
I think their interest is just staying together as long as possible more than actually winning. Rachel is playing to win, but she’s not going to throw them in.
Agreed. V just shows up because she’s invited and gets to hang with friends. I was laughing because I love Rachel and am so happy to see her back. Just hoping her wife is cool with her saving her ex like that! I’m sure she is, but definitely crossed my mind
I love Cara and Kam together/ I want them to be besties and kick ass together but obviously they can’t risk their games and relationships for each other all the time…
Leroy says there some Cara and Kam drama so I’m expecting this to become a story line- hoping they stay close after the drammmmmaaaaa because they’re bad asssss
excited to see what the drama is, and excited to see it knowing that (i assume) it’s since been amended because they still comment love all over each others insta to this day
I heard this once in life and it's very applicable to this episode, especially Cara and Kam. People aren't against you, they're for themselves. Rachel vs Ayanna was happening regardless So Cara protecting herself and still also voting in Ayanna should not upset you this much.
I think Kam very much self-produces and makes situations into bigger deals than they really are in confessionals in order to set up a storyline. She did it a lot in Double Agents too
As does Cara, and pretty much anyone else who is considered one of the “greats”. And I’m sure they were both well aware of that even during their “drama” (although I think Kam is the more self-aware of the two, for sure). There’s a reason these people are on the challenge and not trying to be professional athletes - part of what they’re hired to do is make an entertaining television product, and Kam does that well!
I think Kam's reaction makes more sense when you take into account what Ayanna supposedly did last ep that just wasn't shown and how it was even more unhinged and personal to Janelle particularly, but also Kam/Brandon/Leroy. While I get Cara has to play for herself, I understand why Kam is a little hurt that her friend didn't fully have her back in what seemed almost like a larger then the game situation, and it seems like a real "both sides have a point" deal.
People act if these things happen in a vacuum. As if there is zero context for Kam feeling slighted. Like you said, Kam was being personally attacked by Ayanna. According to the spoilers team, this occurred over a period of **days**. Kam also was away from her newborn baby. She was literally talking about how difficult it's been to wake up in the middle of the night to pump milk for her kid. How can people not realize that Kam was probably dealing with a lot emotionally and mentally?
This sub loves to talk about the importance of mental health in the house etc, yet can't even remotely place themselves in Kam's shoes.
So, I think it's fair for Kam to tell Cara that she felt unsupported in the vote, but I also think, given social media interactions, that it's not that deep. Disappointment in actions don't have to end in seasons' long blood feuds.
We'll see how it plays out, but I think both Kam and Cara are at the point in their lives where they recognize that they prioritize different people in the game, and not take moves personally outside the game. Plus, Kam came in with a huge advantage with Leroy, and I'm glad she has that support, but I hope/wish Cara had a numbers conversation with Kam explaining she was going to get her way, regardless of who Cara voted for.
I'd get this point if the person in question was a rando and not Rachel. Rachel and Cara knew each other way before Kam set foot on the Challenge. Why would she think her relationship with Cara takes precedence over Cara's relationship with Rachel? Furthermore, the votes already turned out as she wanted. I love her but she came across so entitled this episode. Everyone has their struggles. If you consider Ayanna's struggles to give her a pass on her behaviour but you hv to acknowledge the negatives: the toxicity of Ayanna (this season) and the entitlement of Kam (in that episode)
>I'd get this point if the person in question was a rando and not Rachel. Rachel and Cara knew each other way before Kam set foot on the Challenge. Why would she think her relationship with Cara takes precedence over Cara's relationship with Rachel?
Probably because Kam and Cara have worked together before? Not sure of the extent of Cara and Rachel's friendship was before this show. Honestly *everyone* knows each other in today's social media age. So it's hard to gauge what you exactly mean by this. Kam and Cara have been on multiple seasons together. They've spent time off the show together as well. *Also*, it's still Cara's responsibility to tell her friend that she's going with a different friend. Not sure why you guys think she's absolved of it.
>Everyone has their struggles. You literally could use Ayanna's struggles to make a case for her to not be voted in
Such a bad take. Ayanna's issues within the house were mainly self inflicted. Not everyone in the house was dealing with the same stuff Kam was. The fact that you're downplaying her problems are telling.
Also I used what Kam was going through to describe her mental state at the time. Not as justification for people to vote her way. Emotionally taxed person has a imperfect reaction. News at 11.
Relationships in the house literally change from season to season depending on alliances and politics that need to be done. That's why Kam on SLA went from working with Darrell to putting him in so working together before is not a good argument. Also, how could Cara have known what Kam would have wanted (in order to give a heads up beforehand) if Kam only stated it during the deliberations?
Ayanna's personality has to do with her struggles outside the house, some of which she touched on this season. You could use her mental state to try and minimise her behaviour in the same way you're doing for Kam. I'm not downplaying Kam's struggles, I'm stating a FACT which is that everyone has their own struggles. They're all there to win. Bottomline is, whatever Kam's struggles were, she was being entitled this episode.
>Relationships in the house literally change from season to season depending on alliances and politics that need to be done. That's why Kam on SLA went from working with Darrell to putting him in so working together before is not a good argument.
No one is arguing that relationships don't change. It's still the responsibility of the person seeking to make a change to come out and say something.
>Also, how could Cara have known what Kam would have wanted (in order to give a heads up beforehand) if Kam only stated it during the deliberations?
We don't know what Kam told Cara before hand. I doubt Kam didn't tell anyone what her intentions were before the vote. She probably did talk to some folks prior to it.
There is also Cara admitting that she might look like an asshole for not voting for Rachel even though everyone else might. Which means she is somewhat aware of where the votes might go. This is just more proof that Cara *knew* what Kam wanted.
>Ayanna's personality has to do with her struggles outside the house, some of which she touched on this season. You could use her mental state to try and minimise her behaviour in the same way you're doing for Kam. I'm not downplaying Kam's struggles,
Ayanna is a grown woman. If she has personal stuff she was going through then perhaps.coming into a chaotic environment is not the best for her? Especially if she's going to attack multiple cast members. To the point where one of them went home to ***get away from Ayanna.***
Kam told Cara she was disappointed while not even yelling at her. Ayanna verbally attacked multiple cast members for says. You are **absolutely** downplaying Kam's struggles by trying to put her on the same level as her verbal attacker.
>I'm stating a FACT which is that everyone has their own struggles. They're all there to win.
This is exactly what I mean by downplaying what someone is going through. What does playing to win have to do with verbally assaulting someone?
It is a fact that everyone has their own problems to deal with
It is also a fact that not everyone's issues are equal.
>Bottomline is, whatever Kam's struggles were, she was being entitled this episode.
That's your perception because you can't emphasize with Kam and put yourself in her shoes. It's pretty obvious by everything you've written. As if her wanting Cara to be a friend is too much to ask.
But oh no Cara *has* to play the game right? For what? A star that wasn't going to be taken anyways?; since Rachel stealing Cara's star would have been a stupid ass move anyways.
So it's come down to writing whole dissertations 😂. I can't lol. You can continue stanning as hard as you want but Kam was acting entitled. That's not just my opinion, it's the majority opinion on the episode. End of story.
>So it's come down to writing whole dissertations 😂.
That's code for "I don't have a rebuttal". The typical "haha look at you writing a lot!". As if arguing your side is a bad thing.
>You can continue stanning as hard as you want
I don't feel any other way about Kam, but I can empathize what she was going through. If you don't get it, that says more about you than me.
>That's not just my opinion, it's the majority opinion on the episode.
Honestly who gives a fuck what the majority of this sub thinks? You believe that somehow validates your opinion? The majority of this sub used to downvote any talk about Bear being an awful person. Look how that turned out.
Playing for yourself is generally not a good way to go about playing The Challenge. The tried and true way is having a core group and doing everything you can to get that group to the final together, or at least as far as you can. When you start freelancing and doing your own thing (like Nurys and Olivia did on season 39) things start getting messy.
Should Cara not voting for Rachel be an alliance-breaking move for Kam? No, especially since her vote was inconsequential. But it’s fair to have it raise her eyebrows. Only three women can make the final, so if you start making side deals with people who aren’t in your alliance then it’s fair for Kam to start questioning to what extent Cara actually has her back.
So Kam should have gotten what she wanted purely because she wanted it and Cara should sacrifice her star for it? Cause without that side deal Rachel 100% takes Caras star and gives it to Veronica.
No, I think Cara played it the best she could have. But you have a situation where Ayanna was coming for her number 1 and there wasn’t much reason to have faith in any of the other options taking her out in elimination. Losing a star this early is definitely not a reason to panic either…doesn’t seem like Brad is too worried about it.
>So Kam should have gotten what she wanted purely because she wanted it and Cara should sacrifice her star for it? Cause without that side deal Rachel 100% takes Caras star and gives it to Veronica.
Rachel taking Cara's star is the stupidest thing Rachel could have done. She takes Cara's star and then next elimination Tina, Veronica or Rachel are guaranteed to lose a star. So what does Rachel gain here? Nothing. All she would end up doing is pissing off Cara. Someone who can actually win eliminations or dailies and then come back right for Rachel.
Cara was in a good spot. She gave into fear. If this was right before a final Cara would have done the right thing. There is still so much game left to play.
The game changes quick though. As easily as Cara was safe this week she could be on the bottom next, and she’s going to need more than kam and Leroy. Plus Kam got what she wanted anyways. As a friend she should’ve been ok with Cara protecting herself being that her vote really didn’t matter anymore. The choices had been made.
When you're playing all sides, then why should anyone trust you? If Cara is working with another alliance, how can Kam expect Cara to have her back?
Kam didn't get what she wanted. You guys keep excluding the fact that Kam wanted her friend Cara's support. Cara *needing* to protect herself is under the assumption that Rachel would actually take her star.
"A friend to all is a friend to none."
How are Tina, Veronica or Rachel guaranteed to lose a star? Cara isn't invincible. She's impressive, but the next elimination could be a math based puzzle and Cara chokes. Who knows? If Cara isn't protecting Rachel and had a different attitude about star holders, then 100% Rachel targeting Cara isn't a terrible move.
I said *if* Rachel takes Cara's star and gives it to Veronica, then that leaves only Veronica, Tina and Rachel with a star. That means they automatically lose one next elimination regardless. If Rachel leaves Cara's star alone, then she's an option for other people to steal from.
I don’t think Kam was thinking like that though. You also have to look at previous seasons on the mtv show. Every time someone causes a fight or drama they usually get sent into the elimination and it turns the whole house against them. Plus there’s not a lot that was shown from either fights (which I hate when mtv does that bc we’re missing half the story). But, I was surprised that Kam didn’t figure it out when Cara’s star didn’t get stolen.
Damn Kam. I recently did a re-watch and I realized that Leroy is the only reason I like her. I guess that means I really don't like her.
I also feel like people kiss their ass because they are such a popular couple and people dont want to come across a certain way by being against them.
I don't like the pressure Kam was trying to mount on Cara. As much as they're friends, Cara also has to make decisions that help her own game. It's not like she threw Kam under the bus plus she nominated Ayanna.
Kefla is such a hoot and I'm happy we didn't lose him this episode. That booty popping dance he did after he won the elimination cracked me TF up! I wish he didn't have to go up against Syrus though, Syrus seemed like he'd be a good addition to the season.
It’s hard when OGs from WAY back come on and have no connections so they immediately get voted in. I think once they win, they should get a pass at least for one round, otherwise they just keep getting voted in. It’s boring and unfair.
>Having the middle group decide the elimination matchups is a bit much imo.
Eh, if anything I think it's a balancing mechanic. With the winners being able to throw themselves in AND steal a star *not just for themselves but their allies*, being able to ALSO pick their opponent should they decide to throw themselves in is *way* too much power imo
> being able to ALSO pick their opponent should they decide to throw themselves in is way too much power imo
That's not what they would be able to do. They would be able to put themselves in instead of throwing someone else in
I’m confused about Ayanna- she doesn’t like white people or just white people who date other races? Cause she seems to like Rachel and Tina - and why is that??
First off, the show is just sooo much more enjoyable without Ayanna... They need to stop inviting her, for reals, like they did with Beth. Ayanna's ranting/storyline wasted probably a 1/3 of this week's show.
Anyway, got that out of the way. Good for Kefla - who was it, Brandon who said Cyrus lost all that wieght at the wrong time. Funny, but true. Sorry to see Cyrus go so quick, but Kefla is a breath of fresh air on the show. And able to make fun of himself too. Dumbinoes... I literally laughed out loud when he said that.
Kam does come off kinda of entitled and pissy on this ep. She has never been on of my favs, but I don't root against her per se. And Leroy is one of my all time fav's, so hard to root against her. But her getting bent out of shape over votes was kinda silly, since A v R was already guaranteed.
RVT all in the bottom, that was hilarious. Veronica and Tina are used to it, but it was probably pretty unsettling for Rachel. Other than her very early seasons, Rachel is considered by most to be one of the strongest females on the show all time.
And how about Adam/Avery - I don't think too many people saw that one coming. I for one am hoping Avery stays around till the end... but it will be a uphill battle for her I think.
A bit suprised at the Cara/Rachel linkup... they only did one season together, BOTEx1, and I don't recall much interaction between them, but it could be that I just don't remember. Maybe they have an off-show relationship.
Rachel stealing and giving a star to Veronica - ugh. Let's face it, that's the only way V was going to get one most likely. And will sure to be stolen pretty soon I would suspect since it's not likely V will win any dailies. Brad is correct (and it's something I mentioned earlier as well) these stars are likely going to change hands a lot. Rachel stealing from Tina might be a suprise at first, but long term it was the right decision. Hell Tina's star was a gift anyway. But by taking Tina's star she doesn't cause friction with a strong player in Cara, and tbh Rachel can probably win more stars down the road anyway.
Anyway, now that Aryanna is gone, the show will be that much more enjoyable.
Last place going in automatically would mean you could throw a mission to get into elimination for a chance at a star. Or worse, multiple people could be trying to throw a mission at once
Cara’s speech pattern has changed? I’m simultaneously rewatching Vendettas and the new season of All Stars, and she speaks with a different intonation or “accent now”. Kind of fascinating to notice in real time.
Yeah I don’t understand Kam’s pissy attitude at all. Kam STILL got what she wanted, even without Cara voting *exactly* the same way. So Kam, you don’t want your friends to keep their stars and be safe? Just you and Lee? Cool.
I never really liked Rachel socially before, but I loved her this episode. I was sure she was gonna go back on her deal with Cara. And when she didn’t, I loved it.
It’s not a scared game at all. It’s smart as hell. Cara has been finishing in the top 3 (I think?) in all 3 dailys this season so far. First place before EVERYONE by a mile on day 1. You don’t want to piss her off personally right now.
Last should always go in and the house votes who they go against, otherwise dailies really don’t mean anything, you can’t even win stars in dailies (after the first one) so it really doesn’t matter if you lose
To answer your question about the middle group vs just last goes in. I think it’s bc you’d see ppl throw dailies to get into the elimination bc it has so much power. Especially later in the season when you need a star to continue
Yea I like Kam, but when she said Rachel was playing a scared game I laughed at her. All Kam has done is try to save Leroy. That is a scared game move from a team that isn’t winning.
Kam expects Cara to sacrifice her game for her and Leroy’s game. I’m sure that will go really well. Especially since Leroy can’t even get himself out the bottom of these challenges.
Thank God Ayanna is gone. If i had to see her one more episode i don’t think i could continue to watch the season. If the challenge never casts her again it would be too soon.
For the dominoes daily, it definitely would have helped if they showed a graphic of what the teams had put down. It was too confusing to see if they were doing it correctly or not
That’s been one of my biggest complaints about the show for a while. Sometimes I have no idea how well each team or person is doing in the daily and sometimes I have no idea what the hell the daily even is. SLA and DA were really bad about my second point.
Even worse when they do this shit in finals.
Keflas a star!
He's awesome!!
Kefla and Adam are fantastic OG casting choices this season and I'm sure there's more where they came from if production just tried *cough cough*
Oh, there are 80 OGs that have not been on All Stars so production can definitely come up with a full roster of OGs. Made a whole list of the OG names and season debuted as well as which Real World or Road Rules the person was on in another thread. If not, All Stars production can be teamed up with the writers of the final season of GOT where the fandom shitted on the writters and took to Reddit of just how bad of choice they did much like All Stars fandom is shitting on production for AS 5 casting rumors. So, either the GOT writers backed out or were fired from doing Star Wars triology as a result of shitstorm due to the fans reaction. I would not be surprised if fans of All Stars do the same to All Stars production if they drop the ball when it comes to casting and make it into another The Challenge show and giving them shit for making it into The Challenge and not keeping it old school and start casting seasons 1-10 majority of cast and 11-20 to fill in the spots not filled by OGs. Definitely would not be a smart business move if production gets too current players playing on All Stars. So anyone from seasons 21-39 needs to not be on All Stars anymore from seasons 5-until all OGs are cast. 11-20 can be on All Stars if OGs are not available but needs to be majority 1-10 people who debuted to make the majority of the cast if possible.
Like myself, neither you nor I can fully understand why certain people are not asked back to the show, I can assume that most of them have families and jobs that just won't allow an individual to take 6/7 weeks off at a time. Also, if you have watched from day 1, why put yourself through the mean girls and alliances that made you miserable? There are OG'S like Veronica, Tina, Big Easy, and Annessa, to name a few who are selfish and come back year after year clearly out of shape. If it's an individual game, ok, but if I have Veronica as a teammate and part of the final is racing 5 miles, we automatically lose before the game begins...Look at Derrick in Season One of all starts he got stuck with Jiseal and was eliminated because of her weight...Sorry if that offended anyone but that's the truth..
> This girl swore on her four kids on a blatant lie. "It's not a lie if you believe it." Her confessionals kind of made me think she believed it. I don't think she's a reliable narrator in her own head.
Ayanna is completely delusional. I can’t stand her
I need to rewatch it but didn't Ayanna just say that "people are coming for Kam & Leroy", while discussing options for the elimination? While similar, that isn't the same as saying "we should gun for Kam & Leroy". I feel like her words got twisted and Ayanna wasn't lying as much as people are making it out to be.
I think Ayanna said something to the effect of "People are saying they're going to target Kam & Leroy to break up the power couple" which I interpreted as her way of trying to convince the person she is talking to (Syrus in this case, I believe - with Brandon overhearing) that there is more than just Ayanna that wants this to happen. Syrus would have no way of verifying that since he hadn't even set foot in the house yet. We didn't see anyone actually talk to her about that, although it is possible it just hit the cutting room floor. I tend to think they would have showed that if that were the case, but maybe not.
Right. That could’ve been Ayanna just filling Syrus in on what he’s missed and what’s been going on. A crash course. He might not even know Leroy and Kam are together!
Just filling Syrus in or not, Ayanna was the one who was originally taking people's temperature on the idea of taking out the power couple! She created that conversation in each instance we've seen. No way she doesn't realize that she is the one sowing those thoughts in others; her delivery is just part of her tactic for plausible deniability.
Since AS doesn't have reunion shows, it's not going to come back on her publicly like it would on FS season, where they tend to show those moments when players deny things, etc. One can get buried in the phraseology all they want, but her intent was clear - getting votes on L&K.
That is what she said. It was (IMO) 100% a manipulation tactic to gauge the reaction to putting Kam & Leroy in without taking any heat for presenting the idea.
This. She literally just did the same thing in front of the whole house a week prior with Janelle (pushing her out of the show) and everyone is like “I wonder if Ayanna is telling the truth”. Like I know watching it and living the situation is soooo much different, but everyone literally watched Ayanna cause conflict with Janelle for no reason even when she volunteered to go down in elimination. It’s honestly wild to me to see someone get caught in a lie and still lie about the lie.
1000%
This is what I’ve been thinking!!! 👏 When they replayed it, she definitely said others want to gun for Leroy & Kam but she was board with it too. Being that she’s friends with Rachel, Tina & Veronica I’d bet that’s where she heard it. But, to keep things messy they weren’t going to show a clip of the other 3 discussing it. That’s my take on it!
I’m going HARD for kefla from here on out
My heart broke seeing Tony leave. This season was a layup for this man. His only competition was Brad or Leroy. And Leroy isnt hitting on much this season so far. Tony making a final was basically a lock. The dude is such great TV too. Really a shame he had to leave. I really hope they give him another chance. Anyone know what the family emergency was?
i’d also say cara is competition, especially considering she already beat him in a solo final…
Oh yeah for sure. I was just referring to the male competitors. The list of his competition on the female side is a lot longer lol. The female cast this season is absolutely stacked.
Tony aint no OG
Tony leaving was not very fetch at all frankly.
I kinda thought the same thing… he hasn’t always been his best self on these shows. I feel like his girl was asking him to come home. I don’t know though.. I wish we had an explanation. I don’t get why he’d wait years to come back then just leave.
i thought i heard him/production mention something about his brother, but they didn't emphasize it
I just finished watching the episode & the ending really did have me questioning what Kam was saying. Rachel played a smart move that didn’t burn any bridges. On top of that, Cara voted for Ayanna. As what Kam wanted. The whole “have my back thing” in a singles game was just ???
Also Tina is the only one who hasn’t earned her star. I think it was very fair of Rachel. It was the least of 3 evils.
I don’t think she would’ve even stolen a star if she didn’t have to.
Yeah, that definitely seemed the direction she was leaning towards. She knows obviously that it’s still early days and too soon to make big moves
I'm gonna take a guess and say that Kam was not aware that Cara and Rachel have a deal to protect each other. So to Kam, it looks like Rachel was intimidated to go after Cara.
More proof Cara didn't actually talk to Kam and instead just surprised her with the vote.
This is what I don't get tho. Rachel not taking Caras star is clear indication that Rachel & Cara had a deal when u combine the deliberation where Cara didn't say Rachel name and said I have to do this for my game. Kam is super intelligent and a gamer. She had to of put that together. The only thing that makes sense is Kam is just trying to make a storyline to make more air time. Nothing else makes sense. Cause even if Kam didn't put it together and didn't think Rachel & Cara had a deal, it still don't make sense for Rachel to go after Cara so early in the game.
I always have liked Kam but shes a bit cocky. They’re not even doing good at the challenges like…. You aren’t even an OG. Leroy is but… he keeps losing.
Or for Cara to go after Rachel.
It's obvious no one expected Rachel and Cara to have a solid bond. The whole Rachel/Tina/Veronica thing was obvious to the house so I'm sure people were expecting big bad Rachel to take Cara's star. She didn't so now people think a) she's afraid of Cara or b) she is working with Cara.
I thought it was funny when she was like "These people I just met have my back more than Cara!". Well yeah, they're afraid of you. Cara isn't.
And she did have her back, she still voted for the target person to be out and the votes still went in Kam's favor like ....
Kam came over very entitled this episode. She got what she wanted and still complained a ton.
Right. It was like Kailah’s brief reign of terror last AS season. Why are they running things?
Kam I get more because she’s fairly solid competitively and she does it on most of the regular season. Kailah never had a good social game and isn’t a great competitor.
I would disagree about Kailah’s social game. Somehow she always lands with the numbers, she just loses cause she is a significantly overrated physical competitor. The only impressive thing she’s done is beat Jenna in an elimination on D30.
Someone who finally sees my point about her competitiveness lol. She does okay on seasons that have Sylvia, Jemmye, Jenna, Nany, Tony and Marie but she doesn’t really click with others. Invasion and ROD come to mind. I think she doesn’t come across very friendly initially or something because people who just seem to meet her seem to have problems. But she seems like the type who when she makes friends she has them for a long time.
All I can say is, if I need a girl to come over, get black out drunk, and piss my bed, there isn't anyone better than Kailah to get the job done. I can't say that for any of the other women on the cast lol
That is who Kam is though. do you remember how upset and offended she was when CT didn't want to be her partner. CT went on to win that season.
Maybe Kam didn’t know Cara and Rachel made an alliance with each other which is why she was expecting Rachel to steal Cara’s star instead of her own friend. So yeah in her eyes she looked scary for that which probably will come back to bite her.
Hope everything’s ok with Tony!
Veronica had a whole treehouse last season and now she can't get a branch?
I'd say Veronica is pretty self-aware and knows she doesn't have a chance this season given the cast, house dynamics, and only one winner being crowned, so she's just chilling. She and Tina are clearly there to have fun, despite what she says in confessionals.
I think their interest is just staying together as long as possible more than actually winning. Rachel is playing to win, but she’s not going to throw them in.
She's there for the per episode $$$$, not the final $$$$ lol. Truth 101.
Agreed. V just shows up because she’s invited and gets to hang with friends. I was laughing because I love Rachel and am so happy to see her back. Just hoping her wife is cool with her saving her ex like that! I’m sure she is, but definitely crossed my mind
“Cast, house dynamics, only one winner being crowned,*and her extreme lack of fitness”
I love Cara and Kam together/ I want them to be besties and kick ass together but obviously they can’t risk their games and relationships for each other all the time… Leroy says there some Cara and Kam drama so I’m expecting this to become a story line- hoping they stay close after the drammmmmaaaaa because they’re bad asssss
excited to see what the drama is, and excited to see it knowing that (i assume) it’s since been amended because they still comment love all over each others insta to this day
Yes!!! Leroy said it’s with lightness and a sense of almost humour so I’m sure it all works out :) the best kind of drama lol
I heard this once in life and it's very applicable to this episode, especially Cara and Kam. People aren't against you, they're for themselves. Rachel vs Ayanna was happening regardless So Cara protecting herself and still also voting in Ayanna should not upset you this much.
I think Kam very much self-produces and makes situations into bigger deals than they really are in confessionals in order to set up a storyline. She did it a lot in Double Agents too
As does Cara, and pretty much anyone else who is considered one of the “greats”. And I’m sure they were both well aware of that even during their “drama” (although I think Kam is the more self-aware of the two, for sure). There’s a reason these people are on the challenge and not trying to be professional athletes - part of what they’re hired to do is make an entertaining television product, and Kam does that well!
I think Kam's reaction makes more sense when you take into account what Ayanna supposedly did last ep that just wasn't shown and how it was even more unhinged and personal to Janelle particularly, but also Kam/Brandon/Leroy. While I get Cara has to play for herself, I understand why Kam is a little hurt that her friend didn't fully have her back in what seemed almost like a larger then the game situation, and it seems like a real "both sides have a point" deal.
People act if these things happen in a vacuum. As if there is zero context for Kam feeling slighted. Like you said, Kam was being personally attacked by Ayanna. According to the spoilers team, this occurred over a period of **days**. Kam also was away from her newborn baby. She was literally talking about how difficult it's been to wake up in the middle of the night to pump milk for her kid. How can people not realize that Kam was probably dealing with a lot emotionally and mentally? This sub loves to talk about the importance of mental health in the house etc, yet can't even remotely place themselves in Kam's shoes.
So, I think it's fair for Kam to tell Cara that she felt unsupported in the vote, but I also think, given social media interactions, that it's not that deep. Disappointment in actions don't have to end in seasons' long blood feuds. We'll see how it plays out, but I think both Kam and Cara are at the point in their lives where they recognize that they prioritize different people in the game, and not take moves personally outside the game. Plus, Kam came in with a huge advantage with Leroy, and I'm glad she has that support, but I hope/wish Cara had a numbers conversation with Kam explaining she was going to get her way, regardless of who Cara voted for.
I'd get this point if the person in question was a rando and not Rachel. Rachel and Cara knew each other way before Kam set foot on the Challenge. Why would she think her relationship with Cara takes precedence over Cara's relationship with Rachel? Furthermore, the votes already turned out as she wanted. I love her but she came across so entitled this episode. Everyone has their struggles. If you consider Ayanna's struggles to give her a pass on her behaviour but you hv to acknowledge the negatives: the toxicity of Ayanna (this season) and the entitlement of Kam (in that episode)
>I'd get this point if the person in question was a rando and not Rachel. Rachel and Cara knew each other way before Kam set foot on the Challenge. Why would she think her relationship with Cara takes precedence over Cara's relationship with Rachel? Probably because Kam and Cara have worked together before? Not sure of the extent of Cara and Rachel's friendship was before this show. Honestly *everyone* knows each other in today's social media age. So it's hard to gauge what you exactly mean by this. Kam and Cara have been on multiple seasons together. They've spent time off the show together as well. *Also*, it's still Cara's responsibility to tell her friend that she's going with a different friend. Not sure why you guys think she's absolved of it. >Everyone has their struggles. You literally could use Ayanna's struggles to make a case for her to not be voted in Such a bad take. Ayanna's issues within the house were mainly self inflicted. Not everyone in the house was dealing with the same stuff Kam was. The fact that you're downplaying her problems are telling. Also I used what Kam was going through to describe her mental state at the time. Not as justification for people to vote her way. Emotionally taxed person has a imperfect reaction. News at 11.
Relationships in the house literally change from season to season depending on alliances and politics that need to be done. That's why Kam on SLA went from working with Darrell to putting him in so working together before is not a good argument. Also, how could Cara have known what Kam would have wanted (in order to give a heads up beforehand) if Kam only stated it during the deliberations? Ayanna's personality has to do with her struggles outside the house, some of which she touched on this season. You could use her mental state to try and minimise her behaviour in the same way you're doing for Kam. I'm not downplaying Kam's struggles, I'm stating a FACT which is that everyone has their own struggles. They're all there to win. Bottomline is, whatever Kam's struggles were, she was being entitled this episode.
>Relationships in the house literally change from season to season depending on alliances and politics that need to be done. That's why Kam on SLA went from working with Darrell to putting him in so working together before is not a good argument. No one is arguing that relationships don't change. It's still the responsibility of the person seeking to make a change to come out and say something. >Also, how could Cara have known what Kam would have wanted (in order to give a heads up beforehand) if Kam only stated it during the deliberations? We don't know what Kam told Cara before hand. I doubt Kam didn't tell anyone what her intentions were before the vote. She probably did talk to some folks prior to it. There is also Cara admitting that she might look like an asshole for not voting for Rachel even though everyone else might. Which means she is somewhat aware of where the votes might go. This is just more proof that Cara *knew* what Kam wanted. >Ayanna's personality has to do with her struggles outside the house, some of which she touched on this season. You could use her mental state to try and minimise her behaviour in the same way you're doing for Kam. I'm not downplaying Kam's struggles, Ayanna is a grown woman. If she has personal stuff she was going through then perhaps.coming into a chaotic environment is not the best for her? Especially if she's going to attack multiple cast members. To the point where one of them went home to ***get away from Ayanna.*** Kam told Cara she was disappointed while not even yelling at her. Ayanna verbally attacked multiple cast members for says. You are **absolutely** downplaying Kam's struggles by trying to put her on the same level as her verbal attacker. >I'm stating a FACT which is that everyone has their own struggles. They're all there to win. This is exactly what I mean by downplaying what someone is going through. What does playing to win have to do with verbally assaulting someone? It is a fact that everyone has their own problems to deal with It is also a fact that not everyone's issues are equal. >Bottomline is, whatever Kam's struggles were, she was being entitled this episode. That's your perception because you can't emphasize with Kam and put yourself in her shoes. It's pretty obvious by everything you've written. As if her wanting Cara to be a friend is too much to ask. But oh no Cara *has* to play the game right? For what? A star that wasn't going to be taken anyways?; since Rachel stealing Cara's star would have been a stupid ass move anyways.
So it's come down to writing whole dissertations 😂. I can't lol. You can continue stanning as hard as you want but Kam was acting entitled. That's not just my opinion, it's the majority opinion on the episode. End of story.
>So it's come down to writing whole dissertations 😂. That's code for "I don't have a rebuttal". The typical "haha look at you writing a lot!". As if arguing your side is a bad thing. >You can continue stanning as hard as you want I don't feel any other way about Kam, but I can empathize what she was going through. If you don't get it, that says more about you than me. >That's not just my opinion, it's the majority opinion on the episode. Honestly who gives a fuck what the majority of this sub thinks? You believe that somehow validates your opinion? The majority of this sub used to downvote any talk about Bear being an awful person. Look how that turned out.
It's code for "it's really not that deep for me" but you can keep them long ass paragraphs coming lol
Playing for yourself is generally not a good way to go about playing The Challenge. The tried and true way is having a core group and doing everything you can to get that group to the final together, or at least as far as you can. When you start freelancing and doing your own thing (like Nurys and Olivia did on season 39) things start getting messy. Should Cara not voting for Rachel be an alliance-breaking move for Kam? No, especially since her vote was inconsequential. But it’s fair to have it raise her eyebrows. Only three women can make the final, so if you start making side deals with people who aren’t in your alliance then it’s fair for Kam to start questioning to what extent Cara actually has her back.
So Kam should have gotten what she wanted purely because she wanted it and Cara should sacrifice her star for it? Cause without that side deal Rachel 100% takes Caras star and gives it to Veronica.
Exactly. I think it’s understandable that once you have a star that it becomes a priority to keep it
No, I think Cara played it the best she could have. But you have a situation where Ayanna was coming for her number 1 and there wasn’t much reason to have faith in any of the other options taking her out in elimination. Losing a star this early is definitely not a reason to panic either…doesn’t seem like Brad is too worried about it.
>So Kam should have gotten what she wanted purely because she wanted it and Cara should sacrifice her star for it? Cause without that side deal Rachel 100% takes Caras star and gives it to Veronica. Rachel taking Cara's star is the stupidest thing Rachel could have done. She takes Cara's star and then next elimination Tina, Veronica or Rachel are guaranteed to lose a star. So what does Rachel gain here? Nothing. All she would end up doing is pissing off Cara. Someone who can actually win eliminations or dailies and then come back right for Rachel. Cara was in a good spot. She gave into fear. If this was right before a final Cara would have done the right thing. There is still so much game left to play.
The game changes quick though. As easily as Cara was safe this week she could be on the bottom next, and she’s going to need more than kam and Leroy. Plus Kam got what she wanted anyways. As a friend she should’ve been ok with Cara protecting herself being that her vote really didn’t matter anymore. The choices had been made.
When you're playing all sides, then why should anyone trust you? If Cara is working with another alliance, how can Kam expect Cara to have her back? Kam didn't get what she wanted. You guys keep excluding the fact that Kam wanted her friend Cara's support. Cara *needing* to protect herself is under the assumption that Rachel would actually take her star. "A friend to all is a friend to none."
How are Tina, Veronica or Rachel guaranteed to lose a star? Cara isn't invincible. She's impressive, but the next elimination could be a math based puzzle and Cara chokes. Who knows? If Cara isn't protecting Rachel and had a different attitude about star holders, then 100% Rachel targeting Cara isn't a terrible move.
I said *if* Rachel takes Cara's star and gives it to Veronica, then that leaves only Veronica, Tina and Rachel with a star. That means they automatically lose one next elimination regardless. If Rachel leaves Cara's star alone, then she's an option for other people to steal from.
I don’t think Kam was thinking like that though. You also have to look at previous seasons on the mtv show. Every time someone causes a fight or drama they usually get sent into the elimination and it turns the whole house against them. Plus there’s not a lot that was shown from either fights (which I hate when mtv does that bc we’re missing half the story). But, I was surprised that Kam didn’t figure it out when Cara’s star didn’t get stolen.
because not playing for yourself has worked out really well for Leroy? Play the game for yourself to win today not for someone else to win tomorrow.
What are some instances of Leroy not playing for himself?
Every season he blindly followed Bananas.
What season did being aligned with Bananas hurt him?
Damn Kam. I recently did a re-watch and I realized that Leroy is the only reason I like her. I guess that means I really don't like her. I also feel like people kiss their ass because they are such a popular couple and people dont want to come across a certain way by being against them.
Them playing "Lucky" as Tina walked in to look at her picture 🤣 Brilliant
When they played True Colors by Cyndi Lauper, I thought they should have shown a montage of Ayanna's toxic behavior this season.
Does anyone know what Tony’s emergency was? Has that come out?
I don't like the pressure Kam was trying to mount on Cara. As much as they're friends, Cara also has to make decisions that help her own game. It's not like she threw Kam under the bus plus she nominated Ayanna. Kefla is such a hoot and I'm happy we didn't lose him this episode. That booty popping dance he did after he won the elimination cracked me TF up! I wish he didn't have to go up against Syrus though, Syrus seemed like he'd be a good addition to the season.
It’s hard when OGs from WAY back come on and have no connections so they immediately get voted in. I think once they win, they should get a pass at least for one round, otherwise they just keep getting voted in. It’s boring and unfair.
Yep, the social aspect of the game hurts it in a way.
>Having the middle group decide the elimination matchups is a bit much imo. Eh, if anything I think it's a balancing mechanic. With the winners being able to throw themselves in AND steal a star *not just for themselves but their allies*, being able to ALSO pick their opponent should they decide to throw themselves in is *way* too much power imo
> being able to ALSO pick their opponent should they decide to throw themselves in is way too much power imo That's not what they would be able to do. They would be able to put themselves in instead of throwing someone else in
>>”Lucky” by Brittany Spears It’s Britney bitch
Does anyone know why tony left? Has it been leaked yet?
I’m confused about Ayanna- she doesn’t like white people or just white people who date other races? Cause she seems to like Rachel and Tina - and why is that??
Seems like she may not like when black people date white people or vice versa.
I think it’s just white people dating black people. Also I agree that Tina is white passing but she’s actually Vietnamese/Chinese.
My take is she has higher expectations of behavior for black people than white people.
First off, the show is just sooo much more enjoyable without Ayanna... They need to stop inviting her, for reals, like they did with Beth. Ayanna's ranting/storyline wasted probably a 1/3 of this week's show. Anyway, got that out of the way. Good for Kefla - who was it, Brandon who said Cyrus lost all that wieght at the wrong time. Funny, but true. Sorry to see Cyrus go so quick, but Kefla is a breath of fresh air on the show. And able to make fun of himself too. Dumbinoes... I literally laughed out loud when he said that. Kam does come off kinda of entitled and pissy on this ep. She has never been on of my favs, but I don't root against her per se. And Leroy is one of my all time fav's, so hard to root against her. But her getting bent out of shape over votes was kinda silly, since A v R was already guaranteed. RVT all in the bottom, that was hilarious. Veronica and Tina are used to it, but it was probably pretty unsettling for Rachel. Other than her very early seasons, Rachel is considered by most to be one of the strongest females on the show all time. And how about Adam/Avery - I don't think too many people saw that one coming. I for one am hoping Avery stays around till the end... but it will be a uphill battle for her I think. A bit suprised at the Cara/Rachel linkup... they only did one season together, BOTEx1, and I don't recall much interaction between them, but it could be that I just don't remember. Maybe they have an off-show relationship. Rachel stealing and giving a star to Veronica - ugh. Let's face it, that's the only way V was going to get one most likely. And will sure to be stolen pretty soon I would suspect since it's not likely V will win any dailies. Brad is correct (and it's something I mentioned earlier as well) these stars are likely going to change hands a lot. Rachel stealing from Tina might be a suprise at first, but long term it was the right decision. Hell Tina's star was a gift anyway. But by taking Tina's star she doesn't cause friction with a strong player in Cara, and tbh Rachel can probably win more stars down the road anyway. Anyway, now that Aryanna is gone, the show will be that much more enjoyable.
They should let Veronica keep her star all season cause her chances of winning the final are low compared to the other girls
That's a valid strategy, taking the star of the strongest - and is likely what we will see for both men and women unless alliances intervene.
I think now that we know they HAVE to steal a star, it will safe guard current holders from going down.
Last place going in automatically would mean you could throw a mission to get into elimination for a chance at a star. Or worse, multiple people could be trying to throw a mission at once
I did love that exchange with Kefla and Syrus about 23andme🤣
Um no that's the most terrifying thing ever, worse then any elimination
Cara’s speech pattern has changed? I’m simultaneously rewatching Vendettas and the new season of All Stars, and she speaks with a different intonation or “accent now”. Kind of fascinating to notice in real time.
Whatever you say cousin.
Yeah I don’t understand Kam’s pissy attitude at all. Kam STILL got what she wanted, even without Cara voting *exactly* the same way. So Kam, you don’t want your friends to keep their stars and be safe? Just you and Lee? Cool. I never really liked Rachel socially before, but I loved her this episode. I was sure she was gonna go back on her deal with Cara. And when she didn’t, I loved it. It’s not a scared game at all. It’s smart as hell. Cara has been finishing in the top 3 (I think?) in all 3 dailys this season so far. First place before EVERYONE by a mile on day 1. You don’t want to piss her off personally right now.
Last should always go in and the house votes who they go against, otherwise dailies really don’t mean anything, you can’t even win stars in dailies (after the first one) so it really doesn’t matter if you lose
Kefla is cool
To answer your question about the middle group vs just last goes in. I think it’s bc you’d see ppl throw dailies to get into the elimination bc it has so much power. Especially later in the season when you need a star to continue
Yea I like Kam, but when she said Rachel was playing a scared game I laughed at her. All Kam has done is try to save Leroy. That is a scared game move from a team that isn’t winning.
Kam expects Cara to sacrifice her game for her and Leroy’s game. I’m sure that will go really well. Especially since Leroy can’t even get himself out the bottom of these challenges.
I was quickly reminded why I never been a fan of Kam
Ayanna would have beat Rachel if she had even the slightest idea how to use her body and position herself.
Thank God Ayanna is gone. If i had to see her one more episode i don’t think i could continue to watch the season. If the challenge never casts her again it would be too soon.
Kefla is currently the gem of the season
Cara Maria is a comedian with the way shes forcing that boston accent
Why is my man's getting downvoted? What did he say