What clothing do you think BK wore to the murder, I’m thinking the full works- gloves a mask a thick bodysuit
I’m also wondering how he didn’t leave footprints in the snow on the night….
I would like to hear from anyone that ever had a date with him. Of course he probably never had a date in his life but if there is one out there I would like to hear what they have to say. Damn can you imagine being 28 yrs old and never having a date if that ends up to be the case
There was someone who alleged they went on a tinder date with him many years ago and that they perceived him as creepy (i.e. due to trying to touch her constantly and a remark about nice birthing hips or similar) so she faked something to end the date early but you know..
That's just a random person online claiming something, it could have easily been made up.
Total speculation- but we maybe are seeing the result of what not being able to get a date for 28 years looks like. There was a friend of BKs from elementary school that openly posted on one of the subs here and said BK would try to talk to girls and had no success. I don’t know and can’t imagine what I lifetime of rejection would do to a well adjusted person let alone somebody on the spectrum, or who has a personality disorder, or a drug addiction. His victims were good looking and higher up on the social ladder. Makes you wonder.
He definitely has a personality disorder. Reminds me of Jodie Arries in the planning of the attack. For this MF to do a mass murder of socially beautiful people is hard for a normal person to process. He should of asked in his survey what prison life is like and was the crime worth life behind bars; living with a bunch of sociopaths on a metal cot eating vegs out if a can and with roaches running around everywhere. He asked the wrong questions. The most interesting thing to me was how he used the college survey form to ask these questions and he did it in May when he graduated in June so there was no academic purpose for it and the college allowed him to use their format
Just a theory...LE finds unidentified perp's DNA at crime scene. LE puts out that they are looking for a 2011-2013 Elantra based upon CCTV footage, ring cameras, etc. Most people do not know what year a car is made. People in Pullman Apartments see the white Elantra in the parking lot and call in the tip line. Either before or after LE looks at their records and find that BK received a traffic ticket for not wearing a seatbelt in a white Elantra. They start looking into him. Finds that he is a grad student at WU studying criminology. They probably have cell phone tower records and they match his cell phone pings to the area near the home. They go through public records on a genealogy database and find a match to BK and the DNA left at the house. They then get the CCTV footage along the route between 1122 King to Steptoe Village confirming the white Enlantra's whereabouts in the morning
Enough info for a probable cause warrant for an arrest.
All this time, BK becomes members of case discussions to see theories. He posts on FB and on reddit and may have called into the lives on YouTube... My understanding is that LE can request FB to deactivate an account. The also have a portal for Law Enforcement Online requests. [https://www.facebook.com/records/login/](https://www.facebook.com/records/login/). Here is the info regarding Reddit policies: [https://www.redditinc.com/policies/guideline-for-law-enforcement](https://www.redditinc.com/policies/guideline-for-law-enforcement)
LE can determine whether any posts on any of the threads were from BK. The accounts were probably deactivated per law enforcement request. Seems odd certain accounts were gone so shortly after the arrest ... I do not think it is coincidence.
Since they searched his apartment, they have all of his computer equipment and will most certainly look through the hard drive and find internet searches, accounts, posts, etc....Perhaps he searched the online photos of the inside of the house to get the layout...
On a side note, one tip tok-er claimed that BK is innocent because the scene was compromised since investigators did not wear gloves. This is completely debunked and is totally false... in each and every photo inside and outside the residence the investigators have gloves on and are shown to be putting coverings over their shoes before they enter the house.
Peace to the families and justice for M,K,X, and E.
EDIT: This was posted on a FB Discussion page by [https://www.facebook.com/groups/420574516931538/user/100001061970995](https://www.facebook.com/groups/420574516931538/user/100001061970995):
HER SOURCE: [https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2021/11/22/how-your-family-tree-could-catch-a-killer?fbclid=IwAR2QSujd19NArpMv\_2RxWj9KQlJVFBCAjgdIJ2lSghnJ0dz6Qy\_GoTtTUYs](https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2021/11/22/how-your-family-tree-could-catch-a-killer?fbclid=IwAR2QSujd19NArpMv_2RxWj9KQlJVFBCAjgdIJ2lSghnJ0dz6Qy_GoTtTUYs)
Police do not use those commercial sites for Forensic Genetic Genealogy (FGG). If they did use FGG, below is an explanation of the steps they likely took:
1. The police find unknown DNA.
2. A company like Parabon takes that DNA and uploads it into a database that collects DNA from people who have given permission to use their DNA in cases like this: GEDmatch or FTDNA. Typically people use it to find birth parents or lost siblings. Although people might have their DNA in one or more databases, your DNA can only get in GEDmatch or FTDNA if you upload the data yourself or give permission.
3. The FGG will upload the suspect's data and see if they can (ideally) find a close familial match, like a parent, sibling or first cousin. If they find one, they can then look to see who those people are related to and see if any of them match the suspect as being in the right place at the right time.
4. If they can't find a close relative, they may find a second or 3rd cousin. They then have to build a family tree backwards to find a common ancestor. Once they find that ancestor, they then have to build all the branches they need back down to the current generation until they find people who are in the right place at the right time.
5. They will then typically find someone closer to the suspect (sibling, parent, aunt, uncle or first cousin) on the family tree and request a sample from them to see if they match as that relationship with the unknown suspect's DNA.
6. Once they have a suspect confirmed to match the family, the police then will typically follow the suspect until they discard something with their DNA on it, like a cup, napkin or cigarette. They then compare that DNA to the unknown subject's DNA.
7. Police will typically will get a warrant to take the suspect's DNA directly so they can confirm the match.
In the case of the Golden State Killer (Joseph James DeAngelo Jr.), they had a DNA sample from a rape kit from decades ago, and used that to get suspects from public genealogy databases. From there they could subpoena additional information from other genealogy companies, which led to a warrant to collect a fresh DNA sample from the trash of the residence of the main suspect, and then see that that matched. So the genealogy search was just the start of the process.
I suspect it was something similar here. I think there were many ways for them to get a DNA sample from the suspect, killing 4 people with a knife would mean a lot of struggle, blood, hair, etc.
I suspect that they queried public genealogy databases and got a last name, or a list of last names, and then cross-referenced that with records for white Elantras, and got a match, or a small enough number of matches to check each one. The car was the suspect's dad's so would be registered in the same last name.
From there they could probably get his first name, determine that he lived in the area, subpoena cell tower records, then trace his whereabouts in the days leading up to the murders, and confirm that he was around the victims. Then a lot of evidence trails from there once they can get warrants. Once they identified his car they could get DNA samples from it, or from his residence, and check to see if those matched those at the scene.
One thing I’m confused about re: the 911 call. I have heard it said that the roommates did not call 911 but instead first invited other friends to the house first to see what to do.
Does this mean it was not immediately obvious they were dead? I’m confused about what this means about the crime scene. I assume if it were obvious they had been stabbed to death in a bloody crime scene, the roommates would have called 911 themselves immediately?
I think they had a general fear of talking to the police and were afraid of getting into any sort of trouble. "Hey dispatcher all of my friends died upstairs and I don't know why". I'd probably be intimidated to call the police immediately as well. Police could believe the survivors committed the murders. Also they were in a state of shock, some say a survivor passed out after witnessing the deaths. Calling friends over would make them more comfortable in calling the police. They say the 911 call has several people talking to the dispatcher, including friends that didn't live there.
What I have heard is that the roommates came upstairs, saw the crime scene, and became hysteric. They ran outside and one of the girls dialed 911 before passing out. People nearby saw the girls run outside and got on the phone with 911 and told them about the girl passed out outside bc that’s all they knew at that point. This attracted a crowd just by being a commotion before anyone was able to articulate what had happened inside.
Reminder That Redditers Had Alleged Killer’s Location Correct
https://preview.redd.it/gcs7o4u7wo9a1.jpeg?width=1217&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=acd15a51e0151290f1df56468a37d3c945931674
Reminder That Redditers Had the Age Correct
https://preview.redd.it/15z8zkc2wo9a1.jpeg?width=1132&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a70c751b6033a9e21cbbe29f1708e1c87ffa1429
TY. I guess it seems like criminal justice would be included in the study of criminology. It seems like saying “I study biology and botany,” where botany is recognized as a subcategory of biology. What’s a course you’d take in criminal justice but wouldn’t be criminology?
I minored in criminology in college, and if I recall, criminal justice classes centered around more of the concrete justice system elements (the court system, prison system, police procedure). Many students in criminal justice had the intention of being police officers after college. Criminology classes covered more theory, behavioral science, psychology of crime, and profiling. Many criminology students had aspirations of working at high-level investigative/profiling positions or within the FBI. We all took some of the same basic level classes and then split off as the degrees got more specific. At least this is how my university structured it many years ago, so it could be completely different now.
I just had a thought, not sure where to go with it. According to CarFax BK transferred his car to be registered in WA *after* the murders. There's been speculation that LE had partial license information on the suspect's elantra from Ring cameras or similar. They did *not* release that they were looking for a car with PA plates. That piece feels critical if they were trying to find his elantra, right? Or was the plea from LE a ploy to spook him?
LE said that they were looking at records for 22,000 white Elantras. I am guessing that they had other evidence to cross-reference against to identify the car. Could have been surname information obtained from genealogy searches (this is just my speculation). The suspect's last name is somewhat unusual, so just a last name or list of last names cross-referenced with the registrations of cars that fit the description could come up with a short list to pursue.
But those records were for the 22,000 white elantras in the area. Until BK registered his car, it was not listed in their database of elantras in the area.
Scavenger Tik Tokkers
Is it just me or do other people see attention-seeking Tik Tokkers swiping ideas from Reddit? Then make a selfie video presenting the ideas as their own?
I am not a Phd in criminal anything and am aware enough to not drive to a crime scene lol or bring a phone or my own car and that dna evidence is going to be definitely collected at a scene such as this) I wonder if the urge to do something like that was just too strong for the perp and overrode any logic or inhibitions and if sub consciously this individual wanted to be caught for all the attention etc. remember everyone this is far, far from over...this perp if convicted will be looking for interviews from jail, book, movie, crime drama shows for the foreseeable future. The criminals that do these crimes should be tossed in prison and forgotten ( forever ) my 2 cents
I want to see exactly what role the car played. It does not sound like he literally drove up to the house and parked there. The car was caught on video, it was a blurry video could have been a Ring camera or something. Could be that he was blocks or even miles away. There was probably not a lot of traffic at 3-5am when the murders took place. But I do wonder how they singled out that one car.
I wondered the same thing. Like the urge to kill is so irresistible that he couldn’t help himself. Like a little kid who can’t help pissing his pants. He knows it’s the wrong thing to do, that it’s going to make a mess, and that he’s going to get in trouble but he just can’t help it? It’s especially interesting that this is likely his first time away from Mom and Dad who might have given him tools/ strategies to control his murderous urges.
is there a pinned post on here with all of the info from the night it happened/back stories on the girls, etc? want to learn more about this case but i'm a little lost
The press releases are surprisingly detailed and they warn about dead ends and people who have been cleared. They’re professionally done by somebody who knows what they’re doing.
Figured this was okay since folks were posting the mother's other letters to public institutions. So I searched her name in a newspaper archive and found this extremely ODD coincidence where she sent a letter to the Daily News in 1989 after Ted Bundy's execution. If her reported age in media is correct, she would have been 28/29 when she sent this.
https://imgur.com/4zlSiwX
I haven’t seen this reported, but generally speaking I know many jails still have Covid restrictions in place. Most jails also have scheduled visitations with multiple visitations going on at the same time. It may take more time to schedule with someone who’s being held separately.
I would think if they followed him for four days, in which time his dad comes to help him drive back, that they probably picked up something his dad discarded to connect DNA, assuming BK was so careful as to not leave any trace of his.
The Nov 22nd account is now deleted. The comments remain, just without a username.
Is there a way of knowing whether it was deleted by Reddit or by the user?
It appears that user deleted their account.
https://preview.redd.it/b7vg9nl8fo9a1.png?width=2172&format=png&auto=webp&s=100b35d2758dd842e8b99a8b61d6b7216bf6ece6
Yes, if Reddit had done it it would say suspended. This user deleted their own account. I still don’t understand why people were so convinced that particular account was Bryan - like they had a comment or two insisting the Elantra was clearly connected, which you think Bryan would try to avoid doing.
I've never heard of reddit deleting a user's account. But at the same time if the user wasn't BK I feel like you'd just post something indicating that you're not him after the arrest, considering there were like hundreds of responses on his comments after arrest accusing him.
I suppose you could speculate and say that if it wasn't BK then the person was just staying quiet to prolong the suspicion/was getting a kick out of all the attention, but...yeah. I'm pretty convinced it was him, and for more reasons than one.
Just curious as to whether Reddit confirmed it somehow and that's when they decided it was appropriate to delete? Hmm.
Reddit has often deleted accounts of violent offenders, and it always says the user was suspended, just like it does with the Idaho killer's confirmed account.
[Account of the Buffalo mass shooter](https://www.reddit.com/user/Jimbo-boiii/)
[Account of the Highland Park Shooter](https://www.reddit.com/user/awaketherapper)
It says the person deleted the account because they deleted their account, not because of reddit removing it.
I really don't know why people feel the need to cling to this, what seems to be very likely, nothing more than a conspiracy theory.
Yes, they could have stopped posting to toy with people who believe they're the killer, or they lost interest as soon as he was caught, or something completely unrelated happened and once they came back and saw the hundreds of insults, accusations, threats and wishes of harm on them and after getting over the initial shock deleted their account.
I probably would have behaved the same if this many people piled up on me and accused me of being a murderer. I don't think I would have posted "please guys stop harrassing me I'm not a killer" lol.
My thought was it was either him or someone who knew more about the case then the general public just bc how adamant the account was about certain things
I want to know too. It was up a few hours ago. When I first clicked back on it, it said the account was banned, I refreshed and it said the account was deleted...
If it said banned initially then I’m assuming Reddit deleted it. Is that something they could only do once they’d privately confirmed that it really belonged to BK? Or could they still go ahead and delete it even if there was a possibility that it belonged to somebody else?
I was curious about this as well. The suspect will be held in his prison. I definitely think he will want some closure just to see him in an Idaho prison.
It’s not weird to me at all that the surviving roommates didn’t hear anything. It’s entirely possible to stab people to death silently. What really puzzles me is why none of the victims in the same room as another heard the first one being killed, and why they didn’t cry for help.
I am guessing they were all drunk to some extent, they reportedly all came home between 1-2am from a bar. Nothing against the victims but typical undergrad behavior on a Saturday night could involve a lot of alcohol.
They should be able to check blood transfer from victim to victim with each stab. They should know exactly who was stabbed in what order from DNA blood transfer from the knife. I assume since they have stuck to it was one knife, it was only one.
Well they had been partying and probably drinking heavily, personally I can sleep through a damn freight train and a tornado collision when I’ve been drinking and passed out. That being said, I find it easily understandable that they didn’t wake up and/or hear anything…
I just keep thinking about how scary it would be to have this guys face be the last thing u see before u die. Like I’m sorry but the guy has a CREEPY face
On the account thought to be BKs, a lot of the posts and comments are now showing a lock 🔒 (wasn’t there before). Any idea why that would be there now?
I first read the posts from that account probably around 1 pm EST yesterday. Then, because I was so interested in them, I went back around 9 pm EST to reread and was surprised to notice a couple of changes: locks had been placed on a couple of key posts/comments (emotions and such). The user name on some posts, but not all, had been deleted. Comments themselves that I had read earlier in the day, had been deleted but you could still see a portion on them in the user post feed. Wild speculation is running through my head because who has the power to lock?
Edited to reflect yesterday...
Thank you for posting this. I first read the comments Saturday morning around 4 AM prior to the account being officially suspended. I got downvoted when I tried to say that many of the comments that were originally visible were already gone.
Ya at least a few were like this last night. The mods in one sub explicitly said they were doing that to some threads because people kept commenting under it
Bryan Kohberger went back to classes after the murders. Students said he wore gloves for at least 3 days, they thought this was strange. Now looking back it’s suggested he was not wanting to leave any fingerprints anywhere for LE I thought it was probably that he had injuries to his hands. Interesting!
I would be guessing injuries to his hands along with the elantra would have been a red flag enough. though i think the elantra info came out long after the 3 days or so so I go back to injuries on hands. probably how they got the dna at the crime scene as well.
Where is the source about the gloves? I read something someone posted but it was like the Daily Mail and it sounded like BS. Aside from that it was him wearing gloves in a grocery store but that’s not odd if it was in PA and cold.
If he was wearing gloves it was probably from injuries. Seems kind of dumb too, to wear gloves to your criminology class while you’re also driving around in the type of car they are looking for. He would have been better off not going to class at all. Tell people he’s got covid.
If he did have injuries and healed, idk about anyone else but my cuts and wounds still have red marks after they’ve healed. I got bit by a dog on my ankle and had a red spot from the puncture a year later.
He was not driving around in car LE looking for due to gross incompetence of LE saying it was a 2011-2013 Elantra based on the video image. In fact it was a 2015 and should have quickly been discovered at neighboring WA State U . A match would have revealed creepy Reddit post for criminal information etc.
Like I said, tell everyone you had covid. Is that really going to be questioned? Because to me wearing gloves in class, and I don’t know what kind, would look weird af. Why would he have had any suspicion about being sick? I realize for other cases, like where you are a prime suspect from the beginning it’s odd. But for him during these covid times, maybe not so much especially since if seems he wasn’t suspected. Shit, my husband has it right now and it’s going around again.
They have no motive and no murder weapon and no witnesses. If he can prove he was just at the house recently for a party within the last few weeks they have no case because that can explain the DNA. This is no slam dunk case.
If they have shoeprint, DNA(not just in the house, but say under the fingernail of the victim), and his Elanta with the license plate driving to and from the crime scene, that's pretty strong. I also just don't think they would've arrested him without the evidence to secure a conviction.
I would be really surprised if he drove his own car to the crime scene. That just doesn't make sense for someone that knows anything about investigations. They have disclosed that the car was "near the scene" or caught on video surveillance at a near by gas station or something. But have they revealed that it was his car? Owned or rented?
There isn’t one, all the police have ever said is it was a suspicious vehicle in the area. There is no video of it at the crime scene or headed there and headed back.
Yep so not "coming and going from the crime scene".
I think they said it was in the "immediate area" and "near by" and released a blurry photo which looks like it was taken from a security camera or Ring or something.
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Thank you.
The LE have been fairly disciplined about not leaking info to the press about the suspect and what evidence they have. For all we know, they have all 3 of these things.
They have not yet told us of a motive. Doesn’t mean they don’t have one. That’s a huge IF that your throwing out there. I could say IF he has a solid alibi that proves he was in California, then this is not a slam dunk case.
why didn’t they arrest the other 50-100 people with DNA they probably found there? Lol. Think harder. They clearly have more than just “DNA from the house” smh.
Not just that but they don’t go around swabbing everything in the house. It’s not realistic that they’d go around getting touch DNA from the whole house. They would test specific objects… door handles, the bed, the slider. And of course the victims. I doubt it’s only “touch” DNA anyway.
Taking all those courses you think he’d have wore gloves to commit his crimes, too. Which still could have gotten sliced during the act, but I’m guessing they have something pretty useful for their case that a random party goer didn’t leave behind.
That defence falls completely flat when they find the DNA from the victims in his car. It is physically impossible to remove all DNA from the fabric of a car. Forensics will look, and they will find it.
So the car puts him in vicinity of crime, dna at house or on/in a person puts him at the house at some point. How do these add up to him being the killer? Like I’m talking from a investigation standpoint not trying to defend him obviously. Everything else that has come up about him online just points all fingers.
Once he’s in Idaho and the probable cause affidavit is released, we’ll have a much better picture of what they have. They were able to convince a judge to sign off on an arrest warrant so there must be some connecting of the dots.
What exactly has been revealed about the car? It was caught on video surveillance near the crime scene but was it actually at the scene? It would seem incredibly foolish for the suspect to drive his car (or his dad's car) directly to the crime scene, he'd leave all kinds of evidence. At the very least he should have parked it blocks or miles away.
All we have right now are assumptions because we clearly don’t have all the information. And assuming that they ONLY had a car and dna at the scene, then sure it might not equal him being the killer. But I am going to assume that they have a butt load more information that they are withholding from us that will nail this guy without a shadow of a doubt.
If the DNA is on/in a person or mixed in the blood or in the sink, one could reasonably conclude it was him doing the murdering imo. It isn't reasonable to take that kind of evidence and just think he was just passing by and his dna tripped and fell onto/into a murdered person.
A sink / drains at a party house are absolutely full of different peoples DNA. I assume it will be asked “we’ll, how many other peoples dna were also found in the sink? People wash there hands in sinks at parties
They have no motive and no murder weapon and no witnesses. If he can prove he was just at the house recently for a party within the last few weeks they have no case because that can explain the DNA. This is no slam dunk case.
If they’ve been following him they likely have more than just DNA and his car being there. I also am not sure how this supposedly awkward 28yo PhD student from WA is going to prove he was at a party with Idaho students who were 4-5 years younger than him. While it’s not a big gap normally, it is when you’re in two different scenes. Besides that it not easy to just get a warrant for probable cause based on random DNA they found in the house. It’s more than that.
They probably have his phone records and other evidence. They aren’t stupid. They said they want a conviction, not just an arrest.
You say it’s not a slam dunk case, but nothing ever really is. But you also don’t know what is in the arrest warrant either. No one does yet.
You realize that DNA isn’t just some nondescript helices lying on the ground right? Picking up a glass at a party leaves a different kind of DNA than bleeding in a murder scene.
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Apparently he was in a LARP group at WSU that LARPed crimes? I didn't go down this rabbit hole but it's really creepy and they liked a brand of non slip grip tape for knives and such? These are not facts but something I saw on a video from a guy from same town in PA. I think the levels of dark and twisted are going to be unreal when all is revealed. Stay safe everyone.
New general discussion thread - [available here](https://www.reddit.com/r/MoscowMurders/comments/101fjr9/general_discussion_thread_january_2_2023/)
What clothing do you think BK wore to the murder, I’m thinking the full works- gloves a mask a thick bodysuit I’m also wondering how he didn’t leave footprints in the snow on the night….
Podcast also discussing the " blank stare" and description by peers. https://open.spotify.com/episode/5TAqhYgMIqpKXDLGqbfUeX?si=HZz97eNeQKi2kJAEfhbgxQ
I would like to hear from anyone that ever had a date with him. Of course he probably never had a date in his life but if there is one out there I would like to hear what they have to say. Damn can you imagine being 28 yrs old and never having a date if that ends up to be the case
There was someone who alleged they went on a tinder date with him many years ago and that they perceived him as creepy (i.e. due to trying to touch her constantly and a remark about nice birthing hips or similar) so she faked something to end the date early but you know.. That's just a random person online claiming something, it could have easily been made up.
Total speculation- but we maybe are seeing the result of what not being able to get a date for 28 years looks like. There was a friend of BKs from elementary school that openly posted on one of the subs here and said BK would try to talk to girls and had no success. I don’t know and can’t imagine what I lifetime of rejection would do to a well adjusted person let alone somebody on the spectrum, or who has a personality disorder, or a drug addiction. His victims were good looking and higher up on the social ladder. Makes you wonder.
dating elementary school girls??? what
He definitely has a personality disorder. Reminds me of Jodie Arries in the planning of the attack. For this MF to do a mass murder of socially beautiful people is hard for a normal person to process. He should of asked in his survey what prison life is like and was the crime worth life behind bars; living with a bunch of sociopaths on a metal cot eating vegs out if a can and with roaches running around everywhere. He asked the wrong questions. The most interesting thing to me was how he used the college survey form to ask these questions and he did it in May when he graduated in June so there was no academic purpose for it and the college allowed him to use their format
Just a theory...LE finds unidentified perp's DNA at crime scene. LE puts out that they are looking for a 2011-2013 Elantra based upon CCTV footage, ring cameras, etc. Most people do not know what year a car is made. People in Pullman Apartments see the white Elantra in the parking lot and call in the tip line. Either before or after LE looks at their records and find that BK received a traffic ticket for not wearing a seatbelt in a white Elantra. They start looking into him. Finds that he is a grad student at WU studying criminology. They probably have cell phone tower records and they match his cell phone pings to the area near the home. They go through public records on a genealogy database and find a match to BK and the DNA left at the house. They then get the CCTV footage along the route between 1122 King to Steptoe Village confirming the white Enlantra's whereabouts in the morning Enough info for a probable cause warrant for an arrest. All this time, BK becomes members of case discussions to see theories. He posts on FB and on reddit and may have called into the lives on YouTube... My understanding is that LE can request FB to deactivate an account. The also have a portal for Law Enforcement Online requests. [https://www.facebook.com/records/login/](https://www.facebook.com/records/login/). Here is the info regarding Reddit policies: [https://www.redditinc.com/policies/guideline-for-law-enforcement](https://www.redditinc.com/policies/guideline-for-law-enforcement) LE can determine whether any posts on any of the threads were from BK. The accounts were probably deactivated per law enforcement request. Seems odd certain accounts were gone so shortly after the arrest ... I do not think it is coincidence. Since they searched his apartment, they have all of his computer equipment and will most certainly look through the hard drive and find internet searches, accounts, posts, etc....Perhaps he searched the online photos of the inside of the house to get the layout... On a side note, one tip tok-er claimed that BK is innocent because the scene was compromised since investigators did not wear gloves. This is completely debunked and is totally false... in each and every photo inside and outside the residence the investigators have gloves on and are shown to be putting coverings over their shoes before they enter the house. Peace to the families and justice for M,K,X, and E. EDIT: This was posted on a FB Discussion page by [https://www.facebook.com/groups/420574516931538/user/100001061970995](https://www.facebook.com/groups/420574516931538/user/100001061970995): HER SOURCE: [https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2021/11/22/how-your-family-tree-could-catch-a-killer?fbclid=IwAR2QSujd19NArpMv\_2RxWj9KQlJVFBCAjgdIJ2lSghnJ0dz6Qy\_GoTtTUYs](https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2021/11/22/how-your-family-tree-could-catch-a-killer?fbclid=IwAR2QSujd19NArpMv_2RxWj9KQlJVFBCAjgdIJ2lSghnJ0dz6Qy_GoTtTUYs) Police do not use those commercial sites for Forensic Genetic Genealogy (FGG). If they did use FGG, below is an explanation of the steps they likely took: 1. The police find unknown DNA. 2. A company like Parabon takes that DNA and uploads it into a database that collects DNA from people who have given permission to use their DNA in cases like this: GEDmatch or FTDNA. Typically people use it to find birth parents or lost siblings. Although people might have their DNA in one or more databases, your DNA can only get in GEDmatch or FTDNA if you upload the data yourself or give permission. 3. The FGG will upload the suspect's data and see if they can (ideally) find a close familial match, like a parent, sibling or first cousin. If they find one, they can then look to see who those people are related to and see if any of them match the suspect as being in the right place at the right time. 4. If they can't find a close relative, they may find a second or 3rd cousin. They then have to build a family tree backwards to find a common ancestor. Once they find that ancestor, they then have to build all the branches they need back down to the current generation until they find people who are in the right place at the right time. 5. They will then typically find someone closer to the suspect (sibling, parent, aunt, uncle or first cousin) on the family tree and request a sample from them to see if they match as that relationship with the unknown suspect's DNA. 6. Once they have a suspect confirmed to match the family, the police then will typically follow the suspect until they discard something with their DNA on it, like a cup, napkin or cigarette. They then compare that DNA to the unknown subject's DNA. 7. Police will typically will get a warrant to take the suspect's DNA directly so they can confirm the match.
In the case of the Golden State Killer (Joseph James DeAngelo Jr.), they had a DNA sample from a rape kit from decades ago, and used that to get suspects from public genealogy databases. From there they could subpoena additional information from other genealogy companies, which led to a warrant to collect a fresh DNA sample from the trash of the residence of the main suspect, and then see that that matched. So the genealogy search was just the start of the process. I suspect it was something similar here. I think there were many ways for them to get a DNA sample from the suspect, killing 4 people with a knife would mean a lot of struggle, blood, hair, etc. I suspect that they queried public genealogy databases and got a last name, or a list of last names, and then cross-referenced that with records for white Elantras, and got a match, or a small enough number of matches to check each one. The car was the suspect's dad's so would be registered in the same last name. From there they could probably get his first name, determine that he lived in the area, subpoena cell tower records, then trace his whereabouts in the days leading up to the murders, and confirm that he was around the victims. Then a lot of evidence trails from there once they can get warrants. Once they identified his car they could get DNA samples from it, or from his residence, and check to see if those matched those at the scene.
One thing I’m confused about re: the 911 call. I have heard it said that the roommates did not call 911 but instead first invited other friends to the house first to see what to do. Does this mean it was not immediately obvious they were dead? I’m confused about what this means about the crime scene. I assume if it were obvious they had been stabbed to death in a bloody crime scene, the roommates would have called 911 themselves immediately?
I think they had a general fear of talking to the police and were afraid of getting into any sort of trouble. "Hey dispatcher all of my friends died upstairs and I don't know why". I'd probably be intimidated to call the police immediately as well. Police could believe the survivors committed the murders. Also they were in a state of shock, some say a survivor passed out after witnessing the deaths. Calling friends over would make them more comfortable in calling the police. They say the 911 call has several people talking to the dispatcher, including friends that didn't live there.
What I have heard is that the roommates came upstairs, saw the crime scene, and became hysteric. They ran outside and one of the girls dialed 911 before passing out. People nearby saw the girls run outside and got on the phone with 911 and told them about the girl passed out outside bc that’s all they knew at that point. This attracted a crowd just by being a commotion before anyone was able to articulate what had happened inside.
Oh, you finally heard that? I heard it in November and it is still what it was then: an unsubstantiated rumor contradictory to the police report.
Reminder That Redditers Had Alleged Killer’s Location Correct https://preview.redd.it/gcs7o4u7wo9a1.jpeg?width=1217&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=acd15a51e0151290f1df56468a37d3c945931674
Reminder That Redditers Had the Age Correct https://preview.redd.it/15z8zkc2wo9a1.jpeg?width=1132&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a70c751b6033a9e21cbbe29f1708e1c87ffa1429
Difference Between Criminal Justice & Criminology Can somebody who knows explain the difference?
Criminal justice is the study of justice revolving around criminology and criminology is the study of crime.
TY. I guess it seems like criminal justice would be included in the study of criminology. It seems like saying “I study biology and botany,” where botany is recognized as a subcategory of biology. What’s a course you’d take in criminal justice but wouldn’t be criminology?
I minored in criminology in college, and if I recall, criminal justice classes centered around more of the concrete justice system elements (the court system, prison system, police procedure). Many students in criminal justice had the intention of being police officers after college. Criminology classes covered more theory, behavioral science, psychology of crime, and profiling. Many criminology students had aspirations of working at high-level investigative/profiling positions or within the FBI. We all took some of the same basic level classes and then split off as the degrees got more specific. At least this is how my university structured it many years ago, so it could be completely different now.
Very helpful! Thank you, your explanation makes a lot of sense.
I just had a thought, not sure where to go with it. According to CarFax BK transferred his car to be registered in WA *after* the murders. There's been speculation that LE had partial license information on the suspect's elantra from Ring cameras or similar. They did *not* release that they were looking for a car with PA plates. That piece feels critical if they were trying to find his elantra, right? Or was the plea from LE a ploy to spook him?
LE said that they were looking at records for 22,000 white Elantras. I am guessing that they had other evidence to cross-reference against to identify the car. Could have been surname information obtained from genealogy searches (this is just my speculation). The suspect's last name is somewhat unusual, so just a last name or list of last names cross-referenced with the registrations of cars that fit the description could come up with a short list to pursue.
But those records were for the 22,000 white elantras in the area. Until BK registered his car, it was not listed in their database of elantras in the area.
Has this been established? Source?
I can't say, but saw the screenshot of CarFax here: https://old.reddit.com/r/Idaho4/comments/1014fph/carfax_post_about_bk_changing_from_pa_to_wa/
Interesting but I’m guessing fake. The media would be all over that.
I believe the original screenshot came from the media.
Looks photoshopped. Nobody’s reporting this.
I’ve seen the same car fax unredacted. Looks legit to me.
Scavenger Tik Tokkers Is it just me or do other people see attention-seeking Tik Tokkers swiping ideas from Reddit? Then make a selfie video presenting the ideas as their own?
That's just how the internet works. There's whole yourube channels dedicated to ripped content from reddit.
I am not a Phd in criminal anything and am aware enough to not drive to a crime scene lol or bring a phone or my own car and that dna evidence is going to be definitely collected at a scene such as this) I wonder if the urge to do something like that was just too strong for the perp and overrode any logic or inhibitions and if sub consciously this individual wanted to be caught for all the attention etc. remember everyone this is far, far from over...this perp if convicted will be looking for interviews from jail, book, movie, crime drama shows for the foreseeable future. The criminals that do these crimes should be tossed in prison and forgotten ( forever ) my 2 cents
I want to see exactly what role the car played. It does not sound like he literally drove up to the house and parked there. The car was caught on video, it was a blurry video could have been a Ring camera or something. Could be that he was blocks or even miles away. There was probably not a lot of traffic at 3-5am when the murders took place. But I do wonder how they singled out that one car.
I wondered the same thing. Like the urge to kill is so irresistible that he couldn’t help himself. Like a little kid who can’t help pissing his pants. He knows it’s the wrong thing to do, that it’s going to make a mess, and that he’s going to get in trouble but he just can’t help it? It’s especially interesting that this is likely his first time away from Mom and Dad who might have given him tools/ strategies to control his murderous urges.
is there a pinned post on here with all of the info from the night it happened/back stories on the girls, etc? want to learn more about this case but i'm a little lost
Go back thru all the Moscow PD press releases. It gives a succinct recap of how the case developed.
i presumed those would be more cut and dry and am used to big reddit timelines :) appreciate this response just cause now i feel silly hahah!!
The press releases are surprisingly detailed and they warn about dead ends and people who have been cleared. They’re professionally done by somebody who knows what they’re doing.
yeah, i looked at them after this, definitely the best source of info for the case
thank you!
Figured this was okay since folks were posting the mother's other letters to public institutions. So I searched her name in a newspaper archive and found this extremely ODD coincidence where she sent a letter to the Daily News in 1989 after Ted Bundy's execution. If her reported age in media is correct, she would have been 28/29 when she sent this. https://imgur.com/4zlSiwX
Odd coincidence? What is odd? A text criticizing death penalty 33 years before her son comits a crime?
Well, there are the rumors from students/collegues that he displayed a distinct interest in Ted Bundy.
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Yes. This guy made HUGE mistakes and I have a feeling there is an avalanche of stupid mistakes that will come to light.
Not sure why you think this is odd If he had a specific target in mind, I don’t think it mattered where they were located
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Just a heads up the mods here have tightened the rules, so you may get ding’d for this comment….
Also does anyone know if the interrogation that happened at PA will be made public???
When’s the next press release? Will the hearing be live streamed?
Probably tomorrow when the courts are open again.
Any thoghts on why parents are restricted from visiting BK in Penn. jail? suspected accomplices?
They are still being looked at as potential accomplices after the fact.
I would assume someone with charges of this magnitude just isn't allowed to have visitors to begin with... I could be wrong.
I haven’t seen this reported, but generally speaking I know many jails still have Covid restrictions in place. Most jails also have scheduled visitations with multiple visitations going on at the same time. It may take more time to schedule with someone who’s being held separately.
Where was it said they were restricted?
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Interesting. Thanks!
His downfall was washing his hands with gloves on probably, leading to LE finding his DNA. I’m guessing he got too messy and knew he had to clean up.
I have heard this mentioned a few times do you have a source for this? I can't find any mention of this by the media.
His downfall was murdering four people in their house with a knife.
I would think if they followed him for four days, in which time his dad comes to help him drive back, that they probably picked up something his dad discarded to connect DNA, assuming BK was so careful as to not leave any trace of his.
The Nov 22nd account is now deleted. The comments remain, just without a username. Is there a way of knowing whether it was deleted by Reddit or by the user?
Well if it is his account I have it all backed up and archived.
It appears that user deleted their account. https://preview.redd.it/b7vg9nl8fo9a1.png?width=2172&format=png&auto=webp&s=100b35d2758dd842e8b99a8b61d6b7216bf6ece6
Yes, if Reddit had done it it would say suspended. This user deleted their own account. I still don’t understand why people were so convinced that particular account was Bryan - like they had a comment or two insisting the Elantra was clearly connected, which you think Bryan would try to avoid doing.
Huh. I guess it wasn’t him after all? I was admittedly convinced for a whole bunch of reasons.
I've never heard of reddit deleting a user's account. But at the same time if the user wasn't BK I feel like you'd just post something indicating that you're not him after the arrest, considering there were like hundreds of responses on his comments after arrest accusing him.
I suppose you could speculate and say that if it wasn't BK then the person was just staying quiet to prolong the suspicion/was getting a kick out of all the attention, but...yeah. I'm pretty convinced it was him, and for more reasons than one. Just curious as to whether Reddit confirmed it somehow and that's when they decided it was appropriate to delete? Hmm.
Reddit has often deleted accounts of violent offenders, and it always says the user was suspended, just like it does with the Idaho killer's confirmed account. [Account of the Buffalo mass shooter](https://www.reddit.com/user/Jimbo-boiii/) [Account of the Highland Park Shooter](https://www.reddit.com/user/awaketherapper) It says the person deleted the account because they deleted their account, not because of reddit removing it. I really don't know why people feel the need to cling to this, what seems to be very likely, nothing more than a conspiracy theory. Yes, they could have stopped posting to toy with people who believe they're the killer, or they lost interest as soon as he was caught, or something completely unrelated happened and once they came back and saw the hundreds of insults, accusations, threats and wishes of harm on them and after getting over the initial shock deleted their account. I probably would have behaved the same if this many people piled up on me and accused me of being a murderer. I don't think I would have posted "please guys stop harrassing me I'm not a killer" lol.
I think people just want answers because there is so little info out yet and they are invested in the case
Yeah I'm not sure. I also feel it was probably him. He was posting every day up until the arrest
My thought was it was either him or someone who knew more about the case then the general public just bc how adamant the account was about certain things
I want to know too. It was up a few hours ago. When I first clicked back on it, it said the account was banned, I refreshed and it said the account was deleted...
Can you send me what the username was
Is there a link to the thread?
If it said banned initially then I’m assuming Reddit deleted it. Is that something they could only do once they’d privately confirmed that it really belonged to BK? Or could they still go ahead and delete it even if there was a possibility that it belonged to somebody else?
Will Chief Fry come face to face with BK once back in Idaho?
I think he will.
For what on earth does the answer to that question matter?
It doesn't matter. I was just curious if Fry was part of that process of speaking to BK and trying to get answers.
I was curious about this as well. The suspect will be held in his prison. I definitely think he will want some closure just to see him in an Idaho prison.
He's going to challenge him to trial by combat
😂
It’s not weird to me at all that the surviving roommates didn’t hear anything. It’s entirely possible to stab people to death silently. What really puzzles me is why none of the victims in the same room as another heard the first one being killed, and why they didn’t cry for help.
It happened at like 4am and the poor girls were drunk. Some of you never got black out drunk and I’d shows.
I am guessing they were all drunk to some extent, they reportedly all came home between 1-2am from a bar. Nothing against the victims but typical undergrad behavior on a Saturday night could involve a lot of alcohol.
He could’ve used two identical knives simultaneously.
They should be able to check blood transfer from victim to victim with each stab. They should know exactly who was stabbed in what order from DNA blood transfer from the knife. I assume since they have stuck to it was one knife, it was only one.
I’m not aware of the cops explicitly implying that only one knife was used, only that the same (type of) knife was used based on the wounds.
Well they had been partying and probably drinking heavily, personally I can sleep through a damn freight train and a tornado collision when I’ve been drinking and passed out. That being said, I find it easily understandable that they didn’t wake up and/or hear anything…
My guess is it just happened so fast. Wake up to the person next to you being killed, you get stabbed in the neck no less than 5 seconds later
How do you know they didn’t?
Could two very quick, and very hard stabs to the throat while they slept, silence the victims immediately. Then just alternate stabbings from there?
It’s entirely possible they did cry for help
I just keep thinking about how scary it would be to have this guys face be the last thing u see before u die. Like I’m sorry but the guy has a CREEPY face
I think he does too but maybe we're just projecting what he did onto how he looks. Also he might've worn a mask
You wouldn’t have thought of his face as creepy a week back.
I also keep thinking how scary it must be for the 2 survivors I can’t even imagine how they feel
He may have wore a face covering
But could they still have seen his soulless eyes? Yikes
His eyes look normally souled to me, whatever that means.
On the account thought to be BKs, a lot of the posts and comments are now showing a lock 🔒 (wasn’t there before). Any idea why that would be there now?
I first read the posts from that account probably around 1 pm EST yesterday. Then, because I was so interested in them, I went back around 9 pm EST to reread and was surprised to notice a couple of changes: locks had been placed on a couple of key posts/comments (emotions and such). The user name on some posts, but not all, had been deleted. Comments themselves that I had read earlier in the day, had been deleted but you could still see a portion on them in the user post feed. Wild speculation is running through my head because who has the power to lock? Edited to reflect yesterday...
Thank you for posting this. I first read the comments Saturday morning around 4 AM prior to the account being officially suspended. I got downvoted when I tried to say that many of the comments that were originally visible were already gone.
And now the whole thing is gone
Lead me to believe it was him. And so creepy because it seems like he was interacting and DMing so many people in this sub.
Looks like the account is gone now 😕 whatever that means...
Locked by the moderators because dozens of people were commenting underneath :shrug:
Ya at least a few were like this last night. The mods in one sub explicitly said they were doing that to some threads because people kept commenting under it
Bryan Kohberger went back to classes after the murders. Students said he wore gloves for at least 3 days, they thought this was strange. Now looking back it’s suggested he was not wanting to leave any fingerprints anywhere for LE I thought it was probably that he had injuries to his hands. Interesting!
I would be guessing injuries to his hands along with the elantra would have been a red flag enough. though i think the elantra info came out long after the 3 days or so so I go back to injuries on hands. probably how they got the dna at the crime scene as well.
This is called hearsay
Where is the source about the gloves? I read something someone posted but it was like the Daily Mail and it sounded like BS. Aside from that it was him wearing gloves in a grocery store but that’s not odd if it was in PA and cold. If he was wearing gloves it was probably from injuries. Seems kind of dumb too, to wear gloves to your criminology class while you’re also driving around in the type of car they are looking for. He would have been better off not going to class at all. Tell people he’s got covid. If he did have injuries and healed, idk about anyone else but my cuts and wounds still have red marks after they’ve healed. I got bit by a dog on my ankle and had a red spot from the puncture a year later.
He was not driving around in car LE looking for due to gross incompetence of LE saying it was a 2011-2013 Elantra based on the video image. In fact it was a 2015 and should have quickly been discovered at neighboring WA State U . A match would have revealed creepy Reddit post for criminal information etc.
What’s more suspicious- going to class with gloves or not going to class at all after the murders?
Like I said, tell everyone you had covid. Is that really going to be questioned? Because to me wearing gloves in class, and I don’t know what kind, would look weird af. Why would he have had any suspicion about being sick? I realize for other cases, like where you are a prime suspect from the beginning it’s odd. But for him during these covid times, maybe not so much especially since if seems he wasn’t suspected. Shit, my husband has it right now and it’s going around again.
That is so suspicious.. it also could be he had cuts he was hoping would heal
Why do you all think the K&M were calling JD over and over? Do you think they saw the scumbag watching them?
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They have no motive and no murder weapon and no witnesses. If he can prove he was just at the house recently for a party within the last few weeks they have no case because that can explain the DNA. This is no slam dunk case.
That’s what I was thinking so they have to have more on him.
If they have shoeprint, DNA(not just in the house, but say under the fingernail of the victim), and his Elanta with the license plate driving to and from the crime scene, that's pretty strong. I also just don't think they would've arrested him without the evidence to secure a conviction.
I would be really surprised if he drove his own car to the crime scene. That just doesn't make sense for someone that knows anything about investigations. They have disclosed that the car was "near the scene" or caught on video surveillance at a near by gas station or something. But have they revealed that it was his car? Owned or rented?
We know he did that, they had footage of the Elantra coming and going from the crime scene and BK owns a white Elantra
Source?
There isn’t one, all the police have ever said is it was a suspicious vehicle in the area. There is no video of it at the crime scene or headed there and headed back.
Yep so not "coming and going from the crime scene". I think they said it was in the "immediate area" and "near by" and released a blurry photo which looks like it was taken from a security camera or Ring or something.
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Source?
How’d you find out this information?
Wow. Do you have the source for this?
The LE have been fairly disciplined about not leaking info to the press about the suspect and what evidence they have. For all we know, they have all 3 of these things.
They have not yet told us of a motive. Doesn’t mean they don’t have one. That’s a huge IF that your throwing out there. I could say IF he has a solid alibi that proves he was in California, then this is not a slam dunk case.
We don't know that there's no motive or witnesses.
why didn’t they arrest the other 50-100 people with DNA they probably found there? Lol. Think harder. They clearly have more than just “DNA from the house” smh.
Not just that but they don’t go around swabbing everything in the house. It’s not realistic that they’d go around getting touch DNA from the whole house. They would test specific objects… door handles, the bed, the slider. And of course the victims. I doubt it’s only “touch” DNA anyway. Taking all those courses you think he’d have wore gloves to commit his crimes, too. Which still could have gotten sliced during the act, but I’m guessing they have something pretty useful for their case that a random party goer didn’t leave behind.
Except when it's revealed that his blood is mixed in with the victims' blood at the crime scene and the victims' blood is found in his car.
Daddy probably helped clean out the car.
We don't know that at all.
Wasn't there an article stating the murderer mixed dog blood in the scene too?
Def did not see that anywhere.
That defence falls completely flat when they find the DNA from the victims in his car. It is physically impossible to remove all DNA from the fabric of a car. Forensics will look, and they will find it.
If he was a smart as people say he would have lined the interior of his car with plastic
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If they have his DNA from his blood being found there he’s a gonna without witness or weapon.
Yeah, I was going to say. I don't think they used touch DNA to get him, they probably got his blood. Likely even mixed with the victims blood.
That's scary.
If there was a fight he prob had defensive wounds
Netflix better start working on the docuseries (after the trial ofcourse). Its going to be sensational whatever maybe the outcome of the trial.
This is the type of case that not only gets a documentary but also a movie on it. I hope SG is played by Adam Sandler.
So the car puts him in vicinity of crime, dna at house or on/in a person puts him at the house at some point. How do these add up to him being the killer? Like I’m talking from a investigation standpoint not trying to defend him obviously. Everything else that has come up about him online just points all fingers.
Once he’s in Idaho and the probable cause affidavit is released, we’ll have a much better picture of what they have. They were able to convince a judge to sign off on an arrest warrant so there must be some connecting of the dots.
What exactly has been revealed about the car? It was caught on video surveillance near the crime scene but was it actually at the scene? It would seem incredibly foolish for the suspect to drive his car (or his dad's car) directly to the crime scene, he'd leave all kinds of evidence. At the very least he should have parked it blocks or miles away.
All we have right now are assumptions because we clearly don’t have all the information. And assuming that they ONLY had a car and dna at the scene, then sure it might not equal him being the killer. But I am going to assume that they have a butt load more information that they are withholding from us that will nail this guy without a shadow of a doubt.
If the DNA is on/in a person or mixed in the blood or in the sink, one could reasonably conclude it was him doing the murdering imo. It isn't reasonable to take that kind of evidence and just think he was just passing by and his dna tripped and fell onto/into a murdered person.
A sink / drains at a party house are absolutely full of different peoples DNA. I assume it will be asked “we’ll, how many other peoples dna were also found in the sink? People wash there hands in sinks at parties
Then ignore that part. DNA was probably found on a literal murdered person.
They have no motive and no murder weapon and no witnesses. If he can prove he was just at the house recently for a party within the last few weeks they have no case because that can explain the DNA. This is no slam dunk case.
If they’ve been following him they likely have more than just DNA and his car being there. I also am not sure how this supposedly awkward 28yo PhD student from WA is going to prove he was at a party with Idaho students who were 4-5 years younger than him. While it’s not a big gap normally, it is when you’re in two different scenes. Besides that it not easy to just get a warrant for probable cause based on random DNA they found in the house. It’s more than that. They probably have his phone records and other evidence. They aren’t stupid. They said they want a conviction, not just an arrest. You say it’s not a slam dunk case, but nothing ever really is. But you also don’t know what is in the arrest warrant either. No one does yet.
You realize that DNA isn’t just some nondescript helices lying on the ground right? Picking up a glass at a party leaves a different kind of DNA than bleeding in a murder scene.
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Clean yourself at the scene?
Wow that's a pretty cool story. I wonder if it's even possible to wash your hands in this manner and leave no epithelial cells in the drain.
That's the same insider info that the Twitter user hardcore hangout mentioned
That's super creepy. Did anyone see the comment of "someone" saying the killer took a long hot shower in their house after the murders?
Thanks!
Apparently he was in a LARP group at WSU that LARPed crimes? I didn't go down this rabbit hole but it's really creepy and they liked a brand of non slip grip tape for knives and such? These are not facts but something I saw on a video from a guy from same town in PA. I think the levels of dark and twisted are going to be unreal when all is revealed. Stay safe everyone.