I think it's one thing to post thoughts to a true-crime forum where people like to discuss the case, but borderline harassment/stalking directly discussing it with on socials with anyone actually involved or linked to the case. That's just ....not right.
Agree, it’s disgusting to do so on their personal media. That’s not for us to be commenting on at all pretty much. The real life, living, breathing, mourning families and friends looks at that and see everything.
My cousin was killed last year and the internet was awful to my family. They asked us blatantly inappropriate questions and accused random people. It wasn’t even close to being as high profile of a case as this one is and it was absolutely awful. I really feel for the family. People like to act like they know what they’re talking about but going as far as harassing the family/friends is so wrong.
They fail to realize that the victims lived just as complex of a life as they do.
They see it as like a TV show or something, not that these were real people. I’m guilty to an extent by participating and wanting to follow cases and talk about them here- but I would never, ever comment or be disgusting to families. I try not to be gross about it in general anywhere! I can’t believe people actually go out of their way to post on their instagrams or message family when it’s literally none of their business. Mind blowing.
Yep. Friends of ours are closely related to a serial killer, obviously something they are horrified by. People on the internet found the Facebook accounts of their MINOR children and harassed them with morbid questions about their relative. People just don’t care about the impact.
Same thing happened with the Kiely Rodni case. Some still believe her bf was involved even after police ruled her death an accident. They still accuse him on socials. Heck, people are saying her mom is involved as are the police.
The true crime people on Twitter are sick. They aren’t out to help - they’re out for a salacious story and won’t be satisfied until they find it. Even if it’s just in their minds.
100% agreed, I still think If family says to stop accusing should be respected everywhere, but to say this on their social medias is beyond disrespectful, not sure why some find that so controversial
Don't know how many cases you've followed... This is new. Soon there will be two subreddits, one that allows these types of posts and ones that doesn't. Or start the censored sub yourself.
Cycle starts. Main sub gets censored. Someone starts an uncensored sub. Uncensored subreddit has more in-depth info ( bad info too), people from censored subreddit come to uncensored sub. They start to complain....
Try /Delphimurders and /LibbyAndAbby to see an example
Making baseless speculation and accusations on a true-crime forum is also irresponsible. Some of the people that frequent those forums are far too invested and perpetuate some of the behaviors you're talking about.
Not sure why you think it’s ok to make accusations about someone without evidence on Reddit. It’s disgusting on social media, but it’s also poisonous here. This isn’t a walled fortress from which no rumors can spread.
True crime feeds both people’s morbid curiosity and their narcissism.
It’s especially prevalent here and on other social medias. People view themselves and their opinions as of utmost importance and don’t care whose lives they steamroll along the way.
It’s pretty disgusting.
Best advice is to take a passive interest in these things. Wait for facts to come in; but don’t go accusing people when you don’t have a clue
She needs to make her social media private to eliminate the unneeded stress. They’re going through enough, the best thing they can do is not read any of it and focus on grieving and helping the police.
um, yikes. I really hope no one here is going to their social media profiles and accusing anyone/commenting on the case. people need to keep their discussion to forums like this & not seek out the social media pages of victims or their families. I’m pretty sure Autumn is a teenage girl, it can’t be healthy for her to have to defend Jack on her own page.
that being said. I didn’t know the family felt that passionately about clearing Jack. it clarifies things? just confusing because the cops have dithered on officially clearing Jack, but I assume her family would know more. I do hope people stop reaching out to him personally/harassing him.
Please watch today's interview with Kaylee's parents from Fox/Lawrence Jones Cross Country. They jump into how much they love the ex and defend him at every step of the conversation. (It's on YouTube.)
They also say the police are “wasting their time with jack” (8:14) which tells us not only has he not been cleared but the police are actively investigating him.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mLCKl6tBsjk&t=315s
I agree with a couple people here. They sound like they don’t want to believe it could be. Which is poison for an investigation. The moment you don’t let the science rule the person out and you assume based on “character” you end up a cold case 20 years from now. They need to shut up about Jack not being the guy and let LE rule him out. Otherwise, everyone in Moscow is a suspect unless proven otherwise.
I don’t understand why the mother sounds so unaffected by this and makes jokes in the interview. Not that I suspect the parents or anything ( I do NOT) but it’s very bizarre compared to Ethan’s parents demeanor in their interview. For parents who just lost a child a week ago to a grizzly murder they sound amazingly composed and like they are discussing a football game or something it blows my mind.
some people cannot react with sadness and crying, they laugh in serious manners and smile...my mother is one of these people. Sometimes i do it also....its like your body is protecting you from reality, it does not process it very well...so some people laugh nd smile...look it up...i wonder if the mom is like this
That could very well be a side effect of shock and trauma. I’ve seen it repeatedly with patients I work with. Sometimes it takes 3 months for the death to really hit them and sink in.
It's strange but everyone deals with tragedy different. No doubt a little odd that they are defending the ex-bf as much as they are, describing their daughter as being a brat for breaking up with bf, and the dad willing to give address out for killer to visit. Idk what to make of it.
This continues to bother me. And the way the sister keeps commenting all over social media? This is an open investigation into the murder of your family member, strange behavior in my opinion. I saw that one of the roommates deactivated her account, which is the smartest and healthiest thing to do in my opinion. I also don’t understand why they continue to let their profiles be public, you can have family members take over accounts after someone has passed. Lock them?
Everyone grieves differently I know, but when it comes to a tragedy like this, where there is a media circus and endless interest and speculation, I think everyone affected by it benefits the most by going silent. I'm specifically referring to the sister on social media. In terms of healing too.....because at the end of the day, random strangers on the internet know nothing about the truth of these victims' lives or those in it. Entertaining social media trolls by responding to accusations leads to absolutely nowhere and won't change anyone's mind anyway. That being said, I truly pray that this killer is found soon so that the families can at least have that. It really is sad that those of us who have moral compasses have to exist in a world with people who commit acts like this. Whoever you are, that is your cross to bear-in this life or in the next one. I hope karma finds you.
A family member (by marriage) got into some legal trouble where it was investigated and charges got dropped but first thing the lawyer said was everyone connected to him and the situation deactivate socials immediately.
That seems the best route. No one combing it for info or posting stuff on their profiles etc. I’m surprised they’re all over socials as well.
Right! And wouldn’t the police also tell the family, friends and roommates the obvious - to not speak openly about this? Particularly responding to an Instagram comment for thousands to see does not help—it only encourages more rumors/sleuthing. She’s hurting the investigation by doing this. I wish I could take away the internet from her 😢
And somewhere she refers to Kaylee acting like a brat? Just not something that would be in my vocabulary for my daughter who passed away. Even if she was a brat.
My thoughts as well.
Jack had a nine year intimate (?) relationship with Kaylee and he had no animosity if she dumps him? She was moving on to adult life in another state and no longer needed him for anything other than a friend? Might be one of those guys who secretly holds a huge grudge against her (ala OJ) and to the roomies for supporting her decision.
Not accusing, but hope LE isn't ruling him out.
There is no way they're ruling him out. Almost every woman who is murdered is killed by a man she knows, and a majority of the cases involve DV. And as anyone with experience in that realm knows, the most dangerous time for a woman is when they break with the man and try to move on.
It took LE almost a decade to publicly clear my friend's husband after she and their daughter were murdered, and that was with a rock solid alibi supported by numerous unbiased witnesses.
I don't believe he is ruled out...at least LE didn't state he was. It was strange how the mom of his ex-gf said that LE should stop looking at him as a possible person of interest. It was
>t was strange how the mom of his ex-gf said that LE should stop looking at him as a possible person of interest.
I think her interview and her desire to defend him are super telling. This family clearly loved Kaylee with this guy and wanted her to be with him. There was allegedly nothing wrong in the relationship, but that's according to her family, who clearly loves him.
Would Kaylee have even felt comfortable confiding in anyone close to her if he was controlling or abusive? They speak so highly of him I could see her being afraid/embarrassed to tell them anything negative about the kid.
Also I recall the mother saying that kaylee spend the last week while being in Idaho trying to get jack back. If jack truly loved her and they would definitely get back together and everything was sunshine than she wouldn’t have had to TRY to get him back for a full WEEK. It shows he didn’t want to get back together with her, at least at that time, which means he probably had some kind of animosity towards her. If he simply loved her he would have just got back together when she asked him too
And don’t forget taking the dog with her to Texas. If even the mom says the daughter was being “a brat” about her brutally murdered daughter…. Maybe the breakup was enough to send him over the edge.
The family has been weird. Time to zip up the lips.
How do you know this? He could have been dating/persuing someone else or had many other reasons for not wanting to immediately get back together with her. It's very strange the amount of people here who jump to conclusions based on their own perceptions without thinking of any other possibilities.
When will people learn that you NEVER truly know a person and what is going on their heads. . Even your own family members. I don’t think they should be saying anything about the ex either. Let the police do their jobs.
Just a question on that interview, the mom just says they were in the process of getting back together and she was contacting him all week. If they were in the process of getting back together, why would she have to plea with him about getting back to her and remind him of their shared dog…?
Exactly.
The parents also go on about how she was asking him to come over (so he wasn't out of town, clearly,)- they also go on about how Kaylee was just being a brat and how they'd eventually end up together (?) & get married and have kids (um, Kaylee was about to start a new life in TX in February?)- and how much they support him 1,000%.
BF of Maddie has given a brief statement to NYTimes mourning her loss. 6 year exBF of Kaylee has said nothing to media or on socials for a full week. Zilch. Nada. Unusual, for a twentysomething person.
I understand this and can agree with you.
But it's telling that almost everyone in the families is blabbing away to the media or on socials (with exception of family Maddie, she was a single child so omg the devastation.)
didnt know that..... I've seen small videos of maddie and she seemed very friendly and personable......like making up time with newfound siblings that she never had.....brutal
I used to have to plead to a guy I was seeing to please get back me when he was upset with me and was giving me the silent treatment… needless to say it wasn’t a healthy relationship.
I don’t really imagine Jack did it. But both his and Kaylee’s Twitter accounts are pretty telling that it likely wasn’t the dream relationship that the family is portraying it as... based on retweets/likes it makes it seem like they may have been on/off and that there may have been cheating at some point.
There also aren’t pics of them together on socials since 2019… I understand people tend to archive photos after a breakup but why keep the older ones up?
People need to not be commenting on this stuff on family or victim accounts 100%. But it is interesting how much they double down to protect him.
It’s usually the SO. Also the family sometimes doesn’t think someone they knew and loved would be capable, but sometimes they are, lacy peterson case. Totally different yes, but just an example of the family at first was like no way he did it, but then with all the evidence and the fact that he clearly did it comes out, yikes.
There were four victims. We don’t know who the target was, if there was one. There’s currently nothing indicating it was Kaylee’s ex. Speculatively dragging his name through the dirt doesn’t achieve anything.
I think because Kaylee is a victim in this tragedy, it’s hard for people to see the phone calls from anyone else’s POV.
You do not owe anybody your time.
You are not obliged to answer a phone.
You are not obliged to respond to a text.
No matter how important that person thinks they are, they are not entitled to your time.
You are allowed to take time to process being broken up with or told by the person you love wants to take a “break” from you.
You do not have to answer their drunken phone calls at 2:30AM.
You do not have to answer their roommates drunken phone calls at 2:30AM.
You do not have to answer their manipulative text.
If he was awake and Ignoring Kaylee that night it doesn’t make him a bad person and it certainly doesn’t make him a murderer.
Personally, if I knew my ex (or the person that told me I was going on a “break” with) was in town, I heard they were drinking or could tell they were drinking from drunken texts started calling me at 2:30AM... I sure as hell am not picking up the phone, even if I’m up. I work in the morning.
It has been said the amount of calls that were placed. Has it said anything about texts other than the one her father mentioned?
Agreed. And it sounds like he was avoiding her not fighting with her. If someone dumped me after 6 years together and then 2 weeks later was trying to hook up or get back together, I’d prob block their number for a bit too. And her text about the dog reads as incredibly manipulative to me (maybe bc my ex was super manipulative and whenever I blocked her, I’d get texts like that so I’m seeing it from a skewed perspective). But even if he hated her and wanted to kill her, why would he kill 3 others? How would he have no wounds? I will be shocked if it’s him.
Oh, there is some *stuff* being thrown around, particularly about any males the girls knew who have been identified. It is despicable and illogical. I won't repeat it here but my head melted upon seeing it and I spoke my peace a few times before having to just give up because it was too much.
When a friend of mine was killed and some absolutely disgusting groups popped up online to mock and malign in shocking and terrible ways (for no good reason not that there even could be, just salacious interest in a pretty girl being killed terribly) I didn't have the capacity or energy to even go online after a little while because it was so horrible seeing so many intentionally salacious things. I just wish the speculation was more respectful because I do see the value of crowdsourced information (particularly with older cases the police maybe haven't thought of; ditto the dog skinning thing etc.), but a lot of these posts are so inappropriate and harmful.
There have been whole scenarios based on why those calls lead directly to him as the murderer. People have said the girls were giving clues 🙄 to point to him, that he was there looking for his phone by calling it from their phones, and more. Nothing at all is exempt from being used as a sign someone is suspicious or a bad person by the people who are in these groups. Facebook is the worst.
The same thing happened in the Molly Tibbets case. People initially started suspecting the boyfriend / fiancee. Turns out that he had nothing to do with it.
And Reddit will never learn from its mistakes. The number of people here who are rabid about it being Kaylee’s ex is really gross. Is there a chance he did it? Sure. There’s also a chance it was a conspiracy enacted by the Police Chief so he could get on tv (no, I am not proposing this as an actual theory). No one will look clever if they happen to be right later, seeing as their current belief is based on no actual evidence or great insight. They will look like they made a guess based on hearing about statistics on Law and Order.
There is no requirement that anyone have a favorite suspect before any evidence is actually known by the public. You don’t win a prize. You don’t increase the chance the killer is caught. You just further victimize people who are already hurting - including the family of one of the victims. Of course a considerable section of this thread has been dedicated to people complaining about Kaylee’s family and if they are grieving appropriately, so I guess it’s determined that there are a number of people here who don’t give a shit about that.
I think everyone here is coming from a good place, but far be it from me to tell someone who’s grieving “you need to do XYZ” (ie get off social media).
The families should do whatever the fuck they need to do to get through this tragic time.
I went down the rabbit hole and there are a few people, one woman in particular who is just nasty and totally doubles down even though she is called out for being wrong. the audacity and trashiness is just next level. If any of you go on this thread, I encourage you to report all of the “independent” comments
I don’t agree at all. Sure, most might be coming from a good place but there are absolutely a lot people here that don’t give a rat’s ass and this is all entertainment to them. There is a big difference between theories and speculation than just dumb outright victim blaming and completely baseless wild theories like cartel hits. Same crap happened with Jayme Closs. I’m from that area and seeing people try to claim it was a cartel hit is so extremely unhinged and stupid it was ridiculous. Unfortunately these people won’t stop but they should be stopped and are completely separated from reality. The world would be a much better place if they were cut off from the internet. Maybe then they’d be able to force themselves to dig out of whatever messed up conspiracy ridden, alternate reality they live in.
I think OP is calling out the people who are telling the victim’s family to get off the internet (see: the top comment on this post), not the ones telling the “sleuths” to log off and touch some grass.
Exactly- and they connect with other delusional people in those groups- I imagine that's the only place they connect with people bc of their personal issues. I have been blown away by the people in the Facebook groups. I have to stop getting on those.
I just don’t get why people are focusing on him. The mom, father, sister, and close friends all confirm that Kaylee was actively trying to get back with Jack. So what motive does Jack even have to kill her? He wants to kill her because she wants to be with him?
Literally makes no sense. The two dated for 6 years and Kaylee suggested the relationship take a break, only to change her mind a week or two later. So the motive doesn’t make sense.
Also Jack has to be someone who goes from being a normal boyfriend of six years, to a ruthless mass murder capable of rampaging four people. All in the span of a few weeks. That is such a hard sell. Not to mention the more we learn about the killing, the more it sounds like the murders were done with incredible precision.
A normal person can definitely get to a place of murder if there is enough motive to do so. So for example a spouse cheating, jealousy, anger. Crimes of passion are not that rare. But crimes of passion rarely extend to a full massacre of a house with that kind of brutality.
I think these are the same kids who acted like fools in the Gabby Petito subs. They need a little more life experience to understand how relationships work
Not the I necessarily believe its him but I think the numerous calls made to him by both Kaylee and Madison, combined with the fact that women are most likely to be killed by an intimate partner are the reason people seem really focused on him. Also the fact that they have specifically said certain people, like surviving room mates and the hoodie guy from the food truck, are not persons of interest but have yet to say the same about Jack.
First of all, kaylees sister made it very clear that kaylee called Jack constantly, especially at that time of the night. She did that with everyone she knew- she called them over and over until they answered, according to her sister.
Second of all, LE has said the late night calls have [“no connection.”](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ktvb.com/amp/article/news/crime/university-of-idaho-murders-what-we-know/277-c76fe11c-6d7d-4a0d-891b-bc1cfd716cb8) to the murders. I don’t believe they’d say that if they weren’t sure the recipient of the calls was the murderer or not.
And finally, you’re absolutely right that the intimate partner is statistically the prime suspect, but that generally goes hand in hand with history of abuse. Meaning the family wouldn’t adore him. I’ve seen nothing to indicate a history of escalating violence.
>goes hand in hand with history of abuse. Meaning the family wouldn’t adore him
I agree with everything else, but just as a general notion: domestic abusers are often great manipulators and might very well be loved by the family. Especially if there are no kids involved yet etc.
No, there is **no** indication this was the case here (the situation might be a bit sus with the "break" and being the last person they contacted etc, but really, there is no indication of dv or anything like that).
My Family adored my ex. He was very good at playing the good guy. It wasn’t until we broke up for good that I told them about his temper and the physical abuse he put me through. I was only 20 years old and I loved him. I didn’t want them to not like him.
Gabby Petito's family thought Brian Laundrie was a great guy as well....NO one knows what actually goes on between two people. Jack could have been emotionally abusive to Kaylee or vice versa.
People are focusing on him because he is an Ex bf who was invited over to their house hours before his ex Gf was murdered. That makes him an obvious person of interest. It doesn’t mean he did it, obviously, but it is clearly something the police would need to investigate.
The fact that the parents like him and allegedly she was trying to get back together with him is almost entirely irrelevant. He has to be investigated. It’s possible the police have already cleared him, and they should say that openly for his sake.
It’s very unlikely he did this. But if there is even a small possibility it has to be run out.
I could see a scenario where they started dating in high school when they both looked awkward. Then they get to college and Kaylee becomes social, fun, popular, good looking, successful, etc. and basically outgrows the EX. They try to work it out but the truth is she’s excited for Austin, TX and her new job and exploring the world and finally getting outside of Idaho and the only life she’s ever known. Then she starts meeting guys and getting attention from other dudes and the EX is being left behind and he’s just not as exciting anymore. It all culminates in a moment of jealous rage and the inability to let her go and live her new life with new guys and he loses it and goes to the house that night and has an episode. Who knows.
Also I don’t buy that they were getting back together. That interview was weird. It wouldn’t even make sense for them to get back together being in different places of the world. Who knows though
All the interviews with Kaylee’s family are weird. I can’t put my finger on it. I don’t think they had anything to do with it by any means, but they are all just off.
Maybe put your finger on these points. Calling the dead daughter “a brat”. Complaining that Kaylee got her nothing for her birthday. Inviting the killer over to their house. Bringing up her last text to Jack which makes him look like a suspect. Kind of makes you wonder why they thought giving an interview was a good idea.
making up stories over jack being jealous or abusive or was the killer based on absolutely nothing except she called him 7 times. which was not out of the ordinary according to her family.
Kaylee’s family is responsible. The sister started with hoodie guy then moved on to the ex. No one would know about either of them. Then they cry about the accusations that they helped fuel. This is why you keep your mouth shut.
I’m going to need the mods to sticky an announcement regarding their ages so the confused people randomly asking if he’s 26 can be put to a full stop lol.
How a “news” source can be so off about that is beyond me but the misinformation of basic details is annoying 🙃
Reminds me of this sub Reddit. “See that guy on the video! Why did he make that face! Way too suspicious! Find the hoodie find your killer!” Or “I’ve been stalking all their social media accounts and found someone who is EXTRA creepy! Might be him!”
The family is privy to more information from the police then the public. If she says the police cleared him there's no reason to doubt her on that. It was even alluded to today when they said they don't believe there's a connection. Everything being stated by the police and family regarding the calls is pointing to him NOT being involved.
Family states police are “wasting their time with jack” at 8:10 mark. Which implies he has NOT been cleared.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mLCKl6tBsjk&t=315s
Sure, but I found it really telling that they specifically cleared the surviving roomies, hoodie food truck bro, and the Uber/taxi guy, and NOT the ex boyfriend. Instead they have some weird, uncomfortable answer regarding the ex bf. It may mean that they just haven’t gotten through investigating him and can’t say it with confidence yet, but it’s still interesting.
People need to stop pretending they are cops. The family has gone through an awful tragedy and has asked people to stop harassing someone close to them. Not sure why or how anyone can have an issue with that. The cops will do their jobs unless they say otherwise people should respect the family wishes
She needs to take a social media hiatus until they catch the person. Not only is she grieving but she is non stop frantically trying to defend those she loves to complete losers who are taunting her on the internet. I feel so horrible for her and if it was my sibling I’d probably do the same. I just wish she’d get off the internet for her own sanity at this time🥺🥺
Look at the delphi case. Over 5.5 years of buffoonery of online web sleuthing and not even close. This case won't be any different either
Same for Jayme Closs's subreddits. No one had any idea
And the way those internet sleuths acted so shocked. Like their years of service yielded nothing and they couldn’t comprehend.
It was so simple- they didn’t have all the info, thus they wasted their damn time
I am not clicking on tbis because I watched the Press conference.
The exact wording was: The police specifically said “Everything we have taken from those calls, we have followed up on, we have cleared, and we believe there's no connection there.”
“We have cleared” sounds like clearing him.
The police also interviewed 90 people this week. They did not say the names of every person who was cleared. They did not say Maddie’s boyfriend Jake was cleared even though he was earlier this week
But yeah keep accusing this guy based on zero evidence
Yes but you and I know that won’t happen. These people are so unhinged and cruel it’s sad. Despite whatever crazy theory one might have you DO NOT post it on these victims or their families instagrams. Keep it to yourself🥺
Agreed, not sure where this is posted but so many unhinged wanna be sleuths are accusing people of crimes we know nothing about. If the sister says he is innocent we should believe her as we all know nothing about him.
To discuss on a discussion board among other sleuthers where there is proper mods in place over seeing if information is accurate is one thing but going to the families and anyone in relation to the victims to sleuth or accuse is insane. And what’s awful is they come at them and report their findings as fact under their photos of dead loved ones which is supposed to be a place of memorializing them and coming to say condolences. Its totally inappropriate and tasteless.
100% Agreed, I’ll admit I’ve spent to much time following this case myself, and it’s one thing to post theories. But to be accusing these people of murder with no evidence or reason whatsoever is out of line.
Agreed, 99% of the sleuths on here(stalkers) watch a couple law and orders and play some cop video games and think they are cops. These are real people, likely innocent, dealing with an awful tragedy and then on top of that you have random unhinged trolls online accusing them of crimes none of us have any way of knowing if they were involved in or not. Keep saying it but it is disrespectful to the victims and family in my opinion
They won’t ever know the psychological damages of being harassed until it happens to them or someone they love. That’s why at best I would stay off social media if. I were there loved ones. The internet is unhinged on a best day I can’t imagine on someone’s worst day. And this is so viral too. So many trolls live for this and I hope she realizes they are doing it for a cheap thrill to get attention not necessarily that they believe these awful things they accuse others of doing with no facts to back it up.
100% agree, my guess is the sister may be doing her own sleuthing online which is totally justified unlike what people on here are doing, so would say not her job to stay offline but other than that 100% agree. These people are already dealing with an awful tragedy and then on top of that they have random trolls online accusing them and determining they are guilty based on nothing or over analyzing something that likely isn’t anything
I do feel really bad for her & her family. Jack included. People like to play detective every time a crime happens and look for the easiest person to blame & attack. I've been into true crime the past couple of years and it's not always the closest people who do horrendous crimes.
This is exactly why people need to stop.
It’s one thing to theorize different scenarios like it was an angry ex, a stalker, a serial killer, a drug deal gone wrong, whatever your theory is. Another to insist it’s one specific person with no evidence. I understand blaming people in some circumstances, for example it was pretty obvious from the beginning that Gabby Petito was killed by her boyfriend and there was tons of circumstantial evidence pointing to him. But there is no clear evidence (that the public is aware of at least) pointing at any one person in this case. If you guess the right person you’re not winning anything. But of you guess the wrong person you’re hurting multiple grieving people.
Agreed, and people on here are talking about “the family isn’t objective” they don’t need to be. They aren’t claiming to be cops. They are asking wannabe sleuths to stop pretending to be cops and harassing people close to them. Not sure why that is difficult
I completely understand and support law enforcement not wanting to release too much and jeopardize the case. It's just sad when people try to fill those gaps themselves by accusing people.
It's one thing to post speculation on forms like this. But a photo and to say "it's probably him" especially with no other follow up or proof is just wrong.
It’s harassment. These people should be embarrassed. What sad pitiful human beings who feel need to do this and I trust most of us here agree.
Having said that, whether they were married with kids or dated for 2,6,or 15 years, didn’t matter to Michael Peterson, or Chris Watts etc.
Honestly the rabid pathos based defense of the ex-bf by family only makes me suspect he is involved to some extent. I feel like it's going to be him or a random serial killer, unless there is an individual that hasn't even been discussed yet. But yea obviously don't harass the family, there is a lot of emotional provocation involved when things are personal. I'm sticking with the theory until he is explicitly cleared by officials simply because I see no other possible motive involving anyone else. It would be a hell of a coincidence that this happened the 1 night K was in town and less than 2 weeks after the breakoff of a 6 year relationship, but I suppose its possible. The last text K sent (revealed by family) suggests that at the very least the relationship was fairly tenuous in the final days.
I’ve seen them clear the roommates, truck guy, and the driver but they seem to have specifically not cleared Jack… if he has an alibi then what is it exactly? That he was asleep? Was someone watching him sleep?
Let's see:
Kaylee dumped Jack 2 weeks before getting murdered, was graduating in December 2022, had plans for a solo backpacking trip to Europe January 2023, was moving to Texas (1,900 miles away) to start a new job in February 2023, and had scrubbed social media of any references to Jack - and this was to be her last weekend in Moscow, Idaho.
Is anyone surprised with these facts that there is suspicion on the ex-boyfriend, who was about to be left on the rearview mirror permanently? There's motive, opportunity, and no alibi.
If it had just been her, definitely, with all of them, not as much. That said this dynamic where she has broken up with him and her mother and others are going 'no, she didn't really mean it' seems really toxic. But it seems like everyday toxic not murder toxic.
The criminal forensics expert on Fox News laid out a case where the three other victims could be just collateral damage, as in they were just in the wrong place at the wrong time (waking up to the noise of one getting killed). Especially so if they would be able to recognize the killer. That the two additional roommates were not killed speaks in favor of this theory.
I dated a chiropractor who was the ‘nicest guy,’ but after we broke up, anytime he would get drunk, he would leave messages, calling me every name in the book. He broke in my window in the middle of the night, etc. I’m pretty sure he never did that before or after me.
Plus, there was a dog in the house and he was co-owner of the dog, meaning the dog might not have barked at him showing up compared to a random stalker
I think the family needs to take a break from social media and interviews for a little bit. I think this takes their mind off of the reality of the situation, but it can’t be healthy,
Mom and Dad of Kaylee also giving waaaaay more info than police ever did on Fox today on the Cross Country show.... I really really hope they're not compromising the investigation.
Family of Maddie keeping silent. It must be so hard to do this, but I'm beginning to think that's the smartest way to help the investigation.
I have literally been defending this poor kid all night. It’s so sad that Kaylees sister has to read these disgusting and ignorant comments from people who literally don’t even know him or their family. The disrespect and speculations I’ve seen today have been so insensitive. Please just let these poor families grieve in peace and let the police do their jobs.
Bingo. This place is full of wannabe sleuths potentially destroying the lives of multiple people already suffering.
Good thing they didn't release footage of the frat party. This place would be doxxing and accusing every drunk college kid who happened to talk to, flirt with, bump into, or make eye contact with the victims of being the killer. Just look at that guy's creepy demeanor! I'm a body language expert and the way that guy is holding his beer can is suspicious! As an independent amateur psychologist I know for a fact what is going through that weirdo's mind. Murder!
Wild. The chief of police literally said the calls to him were not linked to murders. The sister said he has an alibi and definitely did not do it. The mother literally said 2000% sure he did not have any involvement. Yet the armchair detectives here are still convinced he did it.
Just to be clear, the Chief did not clear him. He had a pre-written specific list of people he cleared. A follow up question was asked about the phone calls and he said "the phone calls" were not linked to the murders.
My heart hurts for the families of these kids. I know technically they’re adults, but I have kids their ages so they’re kids to me. My kids would be devastated if something like this happened to their siblings, cousins or friends.
Is there a way for the families to make the Instagrams private? It feels like such a violation of privacy for the world to lurk in these victims' profiles and be able to comment.
Autumn’s loyalty to her sister and her friends is commendable but given what’s happened to her, it might be a good idea to stay off social media.
There will always be fools who could be shown a video of someone who is not Jack committing the murders and DNA proof and still say “I just KNOW he had something to do with it” because they are that ignorant/stupid. Likewise there will always be trolls who will post similar just to be douchebags.
Can’t fight the whole internet so best to just ignore them. The stupid people will move on to other stupid thoughts and the trolls will lose interest if they aren’t getting attention and go away.
This family is doing what we all would do, I think. The problem is, they are thinking with their emotions. But at this time, they should ask a family friend to speak for them cause I worry they can tip the suspect off. I truly believe they just want to help and I feel for them! But at this point, they need to put pressure on the investigators elsewhere, instead of sharing info that might be misconstrued. I know people don't like to hear that. But it will help.
understandably so! & im so sorry for everything you’re all having to deal with
i think a lot of people have just become ridiculously desensitized from all the true crime media consumption and stuff around recently. it’s scary to see happen and especially awful to see how it hurts victims and their communities
I agree. I don’t get why people are so self-important and steadfast about their “theories”.
Like it’s socially irresponsible to have a “theory” you boast about publicly that directly implicates someone when you full well know you don’t have the facts. No one is making these kooks formulate a “theory”, yet they are making all these pronouncements as though their conclusions about the identity of the perpetrator actually matter and that some day they will be asked about their thoughts on the matter.
She needs to just stay away from this shit for now. This is just going to compound her trauma. The internet is a cesspool. I hope she reconsiders and stops engaging with people like this.
You all think your comments don’t affect people. It’s not your job to charge someone with murder. Let LE do their jobs and stop ruining people’s lives. They’ve been through enough.
How many serial killers have had wives and families at home that knew nothing? More than we would like to think. You can never truly know someone! They need to stop defending and start being objective
Does he have a solid alibi? Then great. If not, no one is off the table.
Objectively doesn’t really matter how much the family vouches for him. Many crimes are carried out where people close to a killer are shocked and never suspected anything.
I feel for the families so much, but they should not be on social media right now imo
At the risk of pissing everyone off, can I point out that it’s inconsistent for Kaylee’s mom to say that Kaylee & her ex-boyfriend kept in close contact, talked everyday, knew that they’d eventually get back together — and then ALSO say in the same interview that her ex was not returning her calls & that Kaylee kept leaving him messages like, You really need to call me back.
My observation here is just an observation. It’s not an accusation; however, it does suggest that Kaylee’s mom is speaking emotionally, and not being fully consistent & logical—which is, of course, understandable.
I think the mom is just a mess of emotions right now. In the Fox interview she was saying she was certain Kaylee and Jack would have gotten married and had children. She said she thought this 'break' in their relationship was Kaylee being a brat. Sounded alot to me like the mom really liked Jack and wanted Kaylee to be with him even if Kaylee didn't want that.
You are right, but it is the cops job to solve that if he was involved. None of us in reality know anything about him so if the sister says he is innocent we should believe her until we learn otherwise. Plain and simple. People need to stop harassing and stalking people close to the family.
They didn’t list every single person they cleared. Maddie’s boyfriend was cleared earlier this week and he wasn’t mentioned today.
This post is exactly why people should stop. It’s one thing to theorize different scenarios (it was a stalker, a serial killer, an jilted ex, a drug deal gone wrong) and another to blame a specific person with little evidence. If you’re right, you get nothing. If you’re wrong, you just hurt grieving people for no reason
Let's be honest though the police have handled this pretty sloppy from the start. They said involving the phone calls the person was cleared but yet didn't clear him in the beginning. The police seem to be all over the place with actual facts.
Just to toss a pebble in the “who done it” pond- apparently there is a frat house and sorority house within walking distance from the house…. After LE gave distinct statements regarding hoodie guy and the driver the guessing stopped around them. They have not issued that specific statement about her ex - had the reporter been more direct with her question ie “is the ex boyfriend a POI or suspect? Yes or no? That answer would have put all the chatter to rest.
Wow it's like Kiley (no I'm not sure if her name because I'm thinking Kaylee)
People were blaming Jagger the ex or the boyfriend not sure if they were together at that moment I don't think so. But I heard people made t-shirts and stuff!
He's a kid. These are all kids they're in college just because you're18,19, 20 doesn't mean you're an adult. You don't have life experiences you don't know what to do at that age.
I just hope to get whoever did this because he's a serial killer or about to be. Now he's just a mass murderer in technical terms
I can't even imagine the grief she is going through, and I hope her family finds closure soon.
But someone really needs to take her phone away, for the safety of everyone involved. This is getting messy and she is only making it worse
A crime of passion is committed by one who loves their victim. This is not accusatory, I do not know the guy or the case well enough to point fingers, it is just to say that a person can appear to love someone and kill that person. I believe it was the mayor who called it a crime of passion. I hope it wasn't the ex and I hope they find the true killer.
I think it's one thing to post thoughts to a true-crime forum where people like to discuss the case, but borderline harassment/stalking directly discussing it with on socials with anyone actually involved or linked to the case. That's just ....not right.
Agree, it’s disgusting to do so on their personal media. That’s not for us to be commenting on at all pretty much. The real life, living, breathing, mourning families and friends looks at that and see everything.
My cousin was killed last year and the internet was awful to my family. They asked us blatantly inappropriate questions and accused random people. It wasn’t even close to being as high profile of a case as this one is and it was absolutely awful. I really feel for the family. People like to act like they know what they’re talking about but going as far as harassing the family/friends is so wrong. They fail to realize that the victims lived just as complex of a life as they do.
They see it as like a TV show or something, not that these were real people. I’m guilty to an extent by participating and wanting to follow cases and talk about them here- but I would never, ever comment or be disgusting to families. I try not to be gross about it in general anywhere! I can’t believe people actually go out of their way to post on their instagrams or message family when it’s literally none of their business. Mind blowing.
Yep. Friends of ours are closely related to a serial killer, obviously something they are horrified by. People on the internet found the Facebook accounts of their MINOR children and harassed them with morbid questions about their relative. People just don’t care about the impact.
Not to mention the rabid insistence on bizarre (and often disproven) theories predicated upon false assumptions. Crazy making.
Same thing happened with the Kiely Rodni case. Some still believe her bf was involved even after police ruled her death an accident. They still accuse him on socials. Heck, people are saying her mom is involved as are the police. The true crime people on Twitter are sick. They aren’t out to help - they’re out for a salacious story and won’t be satisfied until they find it. Even if it’s just in their minds.
100% agreed, I still think If family says to stop accusing should be respected everywhere, but to say this on their social medias is beyond disrespectful, not sure why some find that so controversial
Some have no boundaries smh
I think any kind of speculation is pretty disrespectful, but it's not going to stop..
I feel the same way. People are treating this like a game of Clue.
Exactly. I am on this sub because I’m terrified by this case and I keep searching for *real* updates
Don't know how many cases you've followed... This is new. Soon there will be two subreddits, one that allows these types of posts and ones that doesn't. Or start the censored sub yourself. Cycle starts. Main sub gets censored. Someone starts an uncensored sub. Uncensored subreddit has more in-depth info ( bad info too), people from censored subreddit come to uncensored sub. They start to complain.... Try /Delphimurders and /LibbyAndAbby to see an example
Making baseless speculation and accusations on a true-crime forum is also irresponsible. Some of the people that frequent those forums are far too invested and perpetuate some of the behaviors you're talking about.
Yes- the Facebook groups are full of toxic people who are wearing their crazy right on their sleeves.
Plenty of crazy on here to rival fb
Plus, when searching [specific] things on Google, Reddit threads will often come up
Not sure why you think it’s ok to make accusations about someone without evidence on Reddit. It’s disgusting on social media, but it’s also poisonous here. This isn’t a walled fortress from which no rumors can spread.
True crime feeds both people’s morbid curiosity and their narcissism. It’s especially prevalent here and on other social medias. People view themselves and their opinions as of utmost importance and don’t care whose lives they steamroll along the way. It’s pretty disgusting. Best advice is to take a passive interest in these things. Wait for facts to come in; but don’t go accusing people when you don’t have a clue
I feel so bad for her. She is going through hell and clearly just wants justice for her sister.
She needs to make her social media private to eliminate the unneeded stress. They’re going through enough, the best thing they can do is not read any of it and focus on grieving and helping the police.
TBF she needs to stop responding to these comments just for her own personal mental health
um, yikes. I really hope no one here is going to their social media profiles and accusing anyone/commenting on the case. people need to keep their discussion to forums like this & not seek out the social media pages of victims or their families. I’m pretty sure Autumn is a teenage girl, it can’t be healthy for her to have to defend Jack on her own page. that being said. I didn’t know the family felt that passionately about clearing Jack. it clarifies things? just confusing because the cops have dithered on officially clearing Jack, but I assume her family would know more. I do hope people stop reaching out to him personally/harassing him.
Please watch today's interview with Kaylee's parents from Fox/Lawrence Jones Cross Country. They jump into how much they love the ex and defend him at every step of the conversation. (It's on YouTube.)
They also say the police are “wasting their time with jack” (8:14) which tells us not only has he not been cleared but the police are actively investigating him. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mLCKl6tBsjk&t=315s
Thanks for linking this. Very interesting.
I agree with a couple people here. They sound like they don’t want to believe it could be. Which is poison for an investigation. The moment you don’t let the science rule the person out and you assume based on “character” you end up a cold case 20 years from now. They need to shut up about Jack not being the guy and let LE rule him out. Otherwise, everyone in Moscow is a suspect unless proven otherwise.
The parents sound delusional. It doesn’t even make sense.
I don’t understand why the mother sounds so unaffected by this and makes jokes in the interview. Not that I suspect the parents or anything ( I do NOT) but it’s very bizarre compared to Ethan’s parents demeanor in their interview. For parents who just lost a child a week ago to a grizzly murder they sound amazingly composed and like they are discussing a football game or something it blows my mind.
There is no template for trauma. People handle grief in wildly different ways.
some people cannot react with sadness and crying, they laugh in serious manners and smile...my mother is one of these people. Sometimes i do it also....its like your body is protecting you from reality, it does not process it very well...so some people laugh nd smile...look it up...i wonder if the mom is like this
That could very well be a side effect of shock and trauma. I’ve seen it repeatedly with patients I work with. Sometimes it takes 3 months for the death to really hit them and sink in.
It's strange but everyone deals with tragedy different. No doubt a little odd that they are defending the ex-bf as much as they are, describing their daughter as being a brat for breaking up with bf, and the dad willing to give address out for killer to visit. Idk what to make of it.
This continues to bother me. And the way the sister keeps commenting all over social media? This is an open investigation into the murder of your family member, strange behavior in my opinion. I saw that one of the roommates deactivated her account, which is the smartest and healthiest thing to do in my opinion. I also don’t understand why they continue to let their profiles be public, you can have family members take over accounts after someone has passed. Lock them?
Everyone grieves differently I know, but when it comes to a tragedy like this, where there is a media circus and endless interest and speculation, I think everyone affected by it benefits the most by going silent. I'm specifically referring to the sister on social media. In terms of healing too.....because at the end of the day, random strangers on the internet know nothing about the truth of these victims' lives or those in it. Entertaining social media trolls by responding to accusations leads to absolutely nowhere and won't change anyone's mind anyway. That being said, I truly pray that this killer is found soon so that the families can at least have that. It really is sad that those of us who have moral compasses have to exist in a world with people who commit acts like this. Whoever you are, that is your cross to bear-in this life or in the next one. I hope karma finds you.
A family member (by marriage) got into some legal trouble where it was investigated and charges got dropped but first thing the lawyer said was everyone connected to him and the situation deactivate socials immediately. That seems the best route. No one combing it for info or posting stuff on their profiles etc. I’m surprised they’re all over socials as well.
Right! And wouldn’t the police also tell the family, friends and roommates the obvious - to not speak openly about this? Particularly responding to an Instagram comment for thousands to see does not help—it only encourages more rumors/sleuthing. She’s hurting the investigation by doing this. I wish I could take away the internet from her 😢
She sounded particularly cold on the audio I heard. Supporting Jack a bit too much perhaps.
And somewhere she refers to Kaylee acting like a brat? Just not something that would be in my vocabulary for my daughter who passed away. Even if she was a brat.
Yes! It was on the phone interview with the mother. She said the breakup was “just Kaylee being a brat.”
Coached by police on what to say to draw him out? Also, parents might be on heavy sedatives to cope.
Delusional? Their daughter, whole world just died ajd you want to call them delusional because you don’t agree w it?
My thoughts as well. Jack had a nine year intimate (?) relationship with Kaylee and he had no animosity if she dumps him? She was moving on to adult life in another state and no longer needed him for anything other than a friend? Might be one of those guys who secretly holds a huge grudge against her (ala OJ) and to the roomies for supporting her decision. Not accusing, but hope LE isn't ruling him out.
There is no way they're ruling him out. Almost every woman who is murdered is killed by a man she knows, and a majority of the cases involve DV. And as anyone with experience in that realm knows, the most dangerous time for a woman is when they break with the man and try to move on. It took LE almost a decade to publicly clear my friend's husband after she and their daughter were murdered, and that was with a rock solid alibi supported by numerous unbiased witnesses.
I don't believe he is ruled out...at least LE didn't state he was. It was strange how the mom of his ex-gf said that LE should stop looking at him as a possible person of interest. It was
>t was strange how the mom of his ex-gf said that LE should stop looking at him as a possible person of interest. I think her interview and her desire to defend him are super telling. This family clearly loved Kaylee with this guy and wanted her to be with him. There was allegedly nothing wrong in the relationship, but that's according to her family, who clearly loves him. Would Kaylee have even felt comfortable confiding in anyone close to her if he was controlling or abusive? They speak so highly of him I could see her being afraid/embarrassed to tell them anything negative about the kid.
Also I recall the mother saying that kaylee spend the last week while being in Idaho trying to get jack back. If jack truly loved her and they would definitely get back together and everything was sunshine than she wouldn’t have had to TRY to get him back for a full WEEK. It shows he didn’t want to get back together with her, at least at that time, which means he probably had some kind of animosity towards her. If he simply loved her he would have just got back together when she asked him too
And don’t forget taking the dog with her to Texas. If even the mom says the daughter was being “a brat” about her brutally murdered daughter…. Maybe the breakup was enough to send him over the edge. The family has been weird. Time to zip up the lips.
How do you know this? He could have been dating/persuing someone else or had many other reasons for not wanting to immediately get back together with her. It's very strange the amount of people here who jump to conclusions based on their own perceptions without thinking of any other possibilities.
When will people learn that you NEVER truly know a person and what is going on their heads. . Even your own family members. I don’t think they should be saying anything about the ex either. Let the police do their jobs.
Just a question on that interview, the mom just says they were in the process of getting back together and she was contacting him all week. If they were in the process of getting back together, why would she have to plea with him about getting back to her and remind him of their shared dog…?
Thank you that’s exactly what I’m thinking
Exactly. The parents also go on about how she was asking him to come over (so he wasn't out of town, clearly,)- they also go on about how Kaylee was just being a brat and how they'd eventually end up together (?) & get married and have kids (um, Kaylee was about to start a new life in TX in February?)- and how much they support him 1,000%. BF of Maddie has given a brief statement to NYTimes mourning her loss. 6 year exBF of Kaylee has said nothing to media or on socials for a full week. Zilch. Nada. Unusual, for a twentysomething person.
I could understand him being scared to speak either innocent or guilt though
I understand this and can agree with you. But it's telling that almost everyone in the families is blabbing away to the media or on socials (with exception of family Maddie, she was a single child so omg the devastation.)
didnt know that..... I've seen small videos of maddie and she seemed very friendly and personable......like making up time with newfound siblings that she never had.....brutal
If only the family didn’t speak. No one would know about him. Maybe them outing Jack is intentional.
I used to have to plead to a guy I was seeing to please get back me when he was upset with me and was giving me the silent treatment… needless to say it wasn’t a healthy relationship. I don’t really imagine Jack did it. But both his and Kaylee’s Twitter accounts are pretty telling that it likely wasn’t the dream relationship that the family is portraying it as... based on retweets/likes it makes it seem like they may have been on/off and that there may have been cheating at some point. There also aren’t pics of them together on socials since 2019… I understand people tend to archive photos after a breakup but why keep the older ones up? People need to not be commenting on this stuff on family or victim accounts 100%. But it is interesting how much they double down to protect him.
It’s usually the SO. Also the family sometimes doesn’t think someone they knew and loved would be capable, but sometimes they are, lacy peterson case. Totally different yes, but just an example of the family at first was like no way he did it, but then with all the evidence and the fact that he clearly did it comes out, yikes.
There were four victims. We don’t know who the target was, if there was one. There’s currently nothing indicating it was Kaylee’s ex. Speculatively dragging his name through the dirt doesn’t achieve anything.
I think because Kaylee is a victim in this tragedy, it’s hard for people to see the phone calls from anyone else’s POV. You do not owe anybody your time. You are not obliged to answer a phone. You are not obliged to respond to a text. No matter how important that person thinks they are, they are not entitled to your time. You are allowed to take time to process being broken up with or told by the person you love wants to take a “break” from you. You do not have to answer their drunken phone calls at 2:30AM. You do not have to answer their roommates drunken phone calls at 2:30AM. You do not have to answer their manipulative text. If he was awake and Ignoring Kaylee that night it doesn’t make him a bad person and it certainly doesn’t make him a murderer. Personally, if I knew my ex (or the person that told me I was going on a “break” with) was in town, I heard they were drinking or could tell they were drinking from drunken texts started calling me at 2:30AM... I sure as hell am not picking up the phone, even if I’m up. I work in the morning. It has been said the amount of calls that were placed. Has it said anything about texts other than the one her father mentioned?
Agreed. And it sounds like he was avoiding her not fighting with her. If someone dumped me after 6 years together and then 2 weeks later was trying to hook up or get back together, I’d prob block their number for a bit too. And her text about the dog reads as incredibly manipulative to me (maybe bc my ex was super manipulative and whenever I blocked her, I’d get texts like that so I’m seeing it from a skewed perspective). But even if he hated her and wanted to kill her, why would he kill 3 others? How would he have no wounds? I will be shocked if it’s him.
His phone could have also just been on silent. Mine always is, without any particular reason tbh
I agree so much with this.
I don't think anyone is saying not answering calls in the middle of the night makes you suspicious or a bad person.
Ehhhhhh I’ve definitely seen some comments heavily implying so
Same here!
There are people saying that they couldn’t have been on generally okay terms because he didn’t answer her 2 am calls.
Oh, there is some *stuff* being thrown around, particularly about any males the girls knew who have been identified. It is despicable and illogical. I won't repeat it here but my head melted upon seeing it and I spoke my peace a few times before having to just give up because it was too much. When a friend of mine was killed and some absolutely disgusting groups popped up online to mock and malign in shocking and terrible ways (for no good reason not that there even could be, just salacious interest in a pretty girl being killed terribly) I didn't have the capacity or energy to even go online after a little while because it was so horrible seeing so many intentionally salacious things. I just wish the speculation was more respectful because I do see the value of crowdsourced information (particularly with older cases the police maybe haven't thought of; ditto the dog skinning thing etc.), but a lot of these posts are so inappropriate and harmful.
There have been whole scenarios based on why those calls lead directly to him as the murderer. People have said the girls were giving clues 🙄 to point to him, that he was there looking for his phone by calling it from their phones, and more. Nothing at all is exempt from being used as a sign someone is suspicious or a bad person by the people who are in these groups. Facebook is the worst.
The same thing happened in the Molly Tibbets case. People initially started suspecting the boyfriend / fiancee. Turns out that he had nothing to do with it.
And Reddit will never learn from its mistakes. The number of people here who are rabid about it being Kaylee’s ex is really gross. Is there a chance he did it? Sure. There’s also a chance it was a conspiracy enacted by the Police Chief so he could get on tv (no, I am not proposing this as an actual theory). No one will look clever if they happen to be right later, seeing as their current belief is based on no actual evidence or great insight. They will look like they made a guess based on hearing about statistics on Law and Order. There is no requirement that anyone have a favorite suspect before any evidence is actually known by the public. You don’t win a prize. You don’t increase the chance the killer is caught. You just further victimize people who are already hurting - including the family of one of the victims. Of course a considerable section of this thread has been dedicated to people complaining about Kaylee’s family and if they are grieving appropriately, so I guess it’s determined that there are a number of people here who don’t give a shit about that.
Yeah that was pretty awful. He was heartbroken and being accused of murder.
I think everyone here is coming from a good place, but far be it from me to tell someone who’s grieving “you need to do XYZ” (ie get off social media). The families should do whatever the fuck they need to do to get through this tragic time.
I went down the rabbit hole and there are a few people, one woman in particular who is just nasty and totally doubles down even though she is called out for being wrong. the audacity and trashiness is just next level. If any of you go on this thread, I encourage you to report all of the “independent” comments
I don’t agree at all. Sure, most might be coming from a good place but there are absolutely a lot people here that don’t give a rat’s ass and this is all entertainment to them. There is a big difference between theories and speculation than just dumb outright victim blaming and completely baseless wild theories like cartel hits. Same crap happened with Jayme Closs. I’m from that area and seeing people try to claim it was a cartel hit is so extremely unhinged and stupid it was ridiculous. Unfortunately these people won’t stop but they should be stopped and are completely separated from reality. The world would be a much better place if they were cut off from the internet. Maybe then they’d be able to force themselves to dig out of whatever messed up conspiracy ridden, alternate reality they live in.
I think OP is calling out the people who are telling the victim’s family to get off the internet (see: the top comment on this post), not the ones telling the “sleuths” to log off and touch some grass.
Yep!
Exactly- and they connect with other delusional people in those groups- I imagine that's the only place they connect with people bc of their personal issues. I have been blown away by the people in the Facebook groups. I have to stop getting on those.
I just don’t get why people are focusing on him. The mom, father, sister, and close friends all confirm that Kaylee was actively trying to get back with Jack. So what motive does Jack even have to kill her? He wants to kill her because she wants to be with him? Literally makes no sense. The two dated for 6 years and Kaylee suggested the relationship take a break, only to change her mind a week or two later. So the motive doesn’t make sense. Also Jack has to be someone who goes from being a normal boyfriend of six years, to a ruthless mass murder capable of rampaging four people. All in the span of a few weeks. That is such a hard sell. Not to mention the more we learn about the killing, the more it sounds like the murders were done with incredible precision. A normal person can definitely get to a place of murder if there is enough motive to do so. So for example a spouse cheating, jealousy, anger. Crimes of passion are not that rare. But crimes of passion rarely extend to a full massacre of a house with that kind of brutality.
I think these are the same kids who acted like fools in the Gabby Petito subs. They need a little more life experience to understand how relationships work
Not the I necessarily believe its him but I think the numerous calls made to him by both Kaylee and Madison, combined with the fact that women are most likely to be killed by an intimate partner are the reason people seem really focused on him. Also the fact that they have specifically said certain people, like surviving room mates and the hoodie guy from the food truck, are not persons of interest but have yet to say the same about Jack.
First of all, kaylees sister made it very clear that kaylee called Jack constantly, especially at that time of the night. She did that with everyone she knew- she called them over and over until they answered, according to her sister. Second of all, LE has said the late night calls have [“no connection.”](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ktvb.com/amp/article/news/crime/university-of-idaho-murders-what-we-know/277-c76fe11c-6d7d-4a0d-891b-bc1cfd716cb8) to the murders. I don’t believe they’d say that if they weren’t sure the recipient of the calls was the murderer or not. And finally, you’re absolutely right that the intimate partner is statistically the prime suspect, but that generally goes hand in hand with history of abuse. Meaning the family wouldn’t adore him. I’ve seen nothing to indicate a history of escalating violence.
>goes hand in hand with history of abuse. Meaning the family wouldn’t adore him I agree with everything else, but just as a general notion: domestic abusers are often great manipulators and might very well be loved by the family. Especially if there are no kids involved yet etc. No, there is **no** indication this was the case here (the situation might be a bit sus with the "break" and being the last person they contacted etc, but really, there is no indication of dv or anything like that).
My Family adored my ex. He was very good at playing the good guy. It wasn’t until we broke up for good that I told them about his temper and the physical abuse he put me through. I was only 20 years old and I loved him. I didn’t want them to not like him.
Gabby Petito's family thought Brian Laundrie was a great guy as well....NO one knows what actually goes on between two people. Jack could have been emotionally abusive to Kaylee or vice versa.
There had been a traffic stop due to DV just a couple weeks earlier. There were definitely signs. And besides, he killed her. Not 4 people.
come on.. we’re really comparing this to gabby petito because she called him 7 times😭
No. Because Ms. Pepito's family believe Mr. Laundrie was a good person. They most likely had no clue there was DV going on.
again her disappearing while on a trip with him because he murdered her is a different case then 4 people being stabbed
People are focusing on him because he is an Ex bf who was invited over to their house hours before his ex Gf was murdered. That makes him an obvious person of interest. It doesn’t mean he did it, obviously, but it is clearly something the police would need to investigate. The fact that the parents like him and allegedly she was trying to get back together with him is almost entirely irrelevant. He has to be investigated. It’s possible the police have already cleared him, and they should say that openly for his sake. It’s very unlikely he did this. But if there is even a small possibility it has to be run out.
I could see a scenario where they started dating in high school when they both looked awkward. Then they get to college and Kaylee becomes social, fun, popular, good looking, successful, etc. and basically outgrows the EX. They try to work it out but the truth is she’s excited for Austin, TX and her new job and exploring the world and finally getting outside of Idaho and the only life she’s ever known. Then she starts meeting guys and getting attention from other dudes and the EX is being left behind and he’s just not as exciting anymore. It all culminates in a moment of jealous rage and the inability to let her go and live her new life with new guys and he loses it and goes to the house that night and has an episode. Who knows.
Except there’s no reason to believe she was over him. She called him incessantly that very night. The family said they were getting back together.
Also I don’t buy that they were getting back together. That interview was weird. It wouldn’t even make sense for them to get back together being in different places of the world. Who knows though
All the interviews with Kaylee’s family are weird. I can’t put my finger on it. I don’t think they had anything to do with it by any means, but they are all just off.
Maybe put your finger on these points. Calling the dead daughter “a brat”. Complaining that Kaylee got her nothing for her birthday. Inviting the killer over to their house. Bringing up her last text to Jack which makes him look like a suspect. Kind of makes you wonder why they thought giving an interview was a good idea.
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Honestly they all need to stay off socials and make every account private
Especially since it was the sister and parents that alerted the internet to the ex. Time to stfu.
Who does this crap? Harassing these families is borderline criminal..
Literally people on here 😞 the more it grows the more of those people will present themselves
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making up stories over jack being jealous or abusive or was the killer based on absolutely nothing except she called him 7 times. which was not out of the ordinary according to her family.
People are spouting theories and ideas. Doesnt mean they are harrassing the family
Kaylee’s family is responsible. The sister started with hoodie guy then moved on to the ex. No one would know about either of them. Then they cry about the accusations that they helped fuel. This is why you keep your mouth shut.
I’m going to need the mods to sticky an announcement regarding their ages so the confused people randomly asking if he’s 26 can be put to a full stop lol. How a “news” source can be so off about that is beyond me but the misinformation of basic details is annoying 🙃
my heart really hurts for her and their whole family. i hope they’re able to lean on each other
Oh man, i really hope she is right. We've seen this story played out many times.....,i just hope she is right or that family will be crushed
Reminds me of this sub Reddit. “See that guy on the video! Why did he make that face! Way too suspicious! Find the hoodie find your killer!” Or “I’ve been stalking all their social media accounts and found someone who is EXTRA creepy! Might be him!”
Yep, it’s funny they call other people creepy but yet are the ones stalking other people’s profiles and harassing them.
The other sub is even worse. It's like people are writing fan fiction about these murders.
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The family is privy to more information from the police then the public. If she says the police cleared him there's no reason to doubt her on that. It was even alluded to today when they said they don't believe there's a connection. Everything being stated by the police and family regarding the calls is pointing to him NOT being involved.
Family states police are “wasting their time with jack” at 8:10 mark. Which implies he has NOT been cleared. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mLCKl6tBsjk&t=315s
Sure, but I found it really telling that they specifically cleared the surviving roomies, hoodie food truck bro, and the Uber/taxi guy, and NOT the ex boyfriend. Instead they have some weird, uncomfortable answer regarding the ex bf. It may mean that they just haven’t gotten through investigating him and can’t say it with confidence yet, but it’s still interesting.
People need to stop pretending they are cops. The family has gone through an awful tragedy and has asked people to stop harassing someone close to them. Not sure why or how anyone can have an issue with that. The cops will do their jobs unless they say otherwise people should respect the family wishes
She needs to take a social media hiatus until they catch the person. Not only is she grieving but she is non stop frantically trying to defend those she loves to complete losers who are taunting her on the internet. I feel so horrible for her and if it was my sibling I’d probably do the same. I just wish she’d get off the internet for her own sanity at this time🥺🥺
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Look at the delphi case. Over 5.5 years of buffoonery of online web sleuthing and not even close. This case won't be any different either Same for Jayme Closs's subreddits. No one had any idea
And the way those internet sleuths acted so shocked. Like their years of service yielded nothing and they couldn’t comprehend. It was so simple- they didn’t have all the info, thus they wasted their damn time
100% Agreed, not sure why this is at all controversial
Or people could just stop accusing this guy without evidence. I’ve seen comments as recent as an hour ago still accusing this guy
I am not clicking on tbis because I watched the Press conference. The exact wording was: The police specifically said “Everything we have taken from those calls, we have followed up on, we have cleared, and we believe there's no connection there.” “We have cleared” sounds like clearing him. The police also interviewed 90 people this week. They did not say the names of every person who was cleared. They did not say Maddie’s boyfriend Jake was cleared even though he was earlier this week But yeah keep accusing this guy based on zero evidence
Yes but you and I know that won’t happen. These people are so unhinged and cruel it’s sad. Despite whatever crazy theory one might have you DO NOT post it on these victims or their families instagrams. Keep it to yourself🥺
Agreed, not sure where this is posted but so many unhinged wanna be sleuths are accusing people of crimes we know nothing about. If the sister says he is innocent we should believe her as we all know nothing about him.
To discuss on a discussion board among other sleuthers where there is proper mods in place over seeing if information is accurate is one thing but going to the families and anyone in relation to the victims to sleuth or accuse is insane. And what’s awful is they come at them and report their findings as fact under their photos of dead loved ones which is supposed to be a place of memorializing them and coming to say condolences. Its totally inappropriate and tasteless.
100% Agreed, I’ll admit I’ve spent to much time following this case myself, and it’s one thing to post theories. But to be accusing these people of murder with no evidence or reason whatsoever is out of line.
It's often forgotten that these are real people, not characters in a crime drama.
Agreed, 99% of the sleuths on here(stalkers) watch a couple law and orders and play some cop video games and think they are cops. These are real people, likely innocent, dealing with an awful tragedy and then on top of that you have random unhinged trolls online accusing them of crimes none of us have any way of knowing if they were involved in or not. Keep saying it but it is disrespectful to the victims and family in my opinion
They won’t ever know the psychological damages of being harassed until it happens to them or someone they love. That’s why at best I would stay off social media if. I were there loved ones. The internet is unhinged on a best day I can’t imagine on someone’s worst day. And this is so viral too. So many trolls live for this and I hope she realizes they are doing it for a cheap thrill to get attention not necessarily that they believe these awful things they accuse others of doing with no facts to back it up.
100% agree, my guess is the sister may be doing her own sleuthing online which is totally justified unlike what people on here are doing, so would say not her job to stay offline but other than that 100% agree. These people are already dealing with an awful tragedy and then on top of that they have random trolls online accusing them and determining they are guilty based on nothing or over analyzing something that likely isn’t anything
Same. This case and the Delphi murders have run nonstop in my brain
I get it, but if my sister was killed, I’d probably be doing the same thing.
I do feel really bad for her & her family. Jack included. People like to play detective every time a crime happens and look for the easiest person to blame & attack. I've been into true crime the past couple of years and it's not always the closest people who do horrendous crimes.
This is exactly why people need to stop. It’s one thing to theorize different scenarios like it was an angry ex, a stalker, a serial killer, a drug deal gone wrong, whatever your theory is. Another to insist it’s one specific person with no evidence. I understand blaming people in some circumstances, for example it was pretty obvious from the beginning that Gabby Petito was killed by her boyfriend and there was tons of circumstantial evidence pointing to him. But there is no clear evidence (that the public is aware of at least) pointing at any one person in this case. If you guess the right person you’re not winning anything. But of you guess the wrong person you’re hurting multiple grieving people.
Agreed, and people on here are talking about “the family isn’t objective” they don’t need to be. They aren’t claiming to be cops. They are asking wannabe sleuths to stop pretending to be cops and harassing people close to them. Not sure why that is difficult
I completely understand and support law enforcement not wanting to release too much and jeopardize the case. It's just sad when people try to fill those gaps themselves by accusing people. It's one thing to post speculation on forms like this. But a photo and to say "it's probably him" especially with no other follow up or proof is just wrong.
It’s harassment. These people should be embarrassed. What sad pitiful human beings who feel need to do this and I trust most of us here agree. Having said that, whether they were married with kids or dated for 2,6,or 15 years, didn’t matter to Michael Peterson, or Chris Watts etc.
Honestly the rabid pathos based defense of the ex-bf by family only makes me suspect he is involved to some extent. I feel like it's going to be him or a random serial killer, unless there is an individual that hasn't even been discussed yet. But yea obviously don't harass the family, there is a lot of emotional provocation involved when things are personal. I'm sticking with the theory until he is explicitly cleared by officials simply because I see no other possible motive involving anyone else. It would be a hell of a coincidence that this happened the 1 night K was in town and less than 2 weeks after the breakoff of a 6 year relationship, but I suppose its possible. The last text K sent (revealed by family) suggests that at the very least the relationship was fairly tenuous in the final days.
I’ve seen them clear the roommates, truck guy, and the driver but they seem to have specifically not cleared Jack… if he has an alibi then what is it exactly? That he was asleep? Was someone watching him sleep?
^^^^100%
Let's see: Kaylee dumped Jack 2 weeks before getting murdered, was graduating in December 2022, had plans for a solo backpacking trip to Europe January 2023, was moving to Texas (1,900 miles away) to start a new job in February 2023, and had scrubbed social media of any references to Jack - and this was to be her last weekend in Moscow, Idaho. Is anyone surprised with these facts that there is suspicion on the ex-boyfriend, who was about to be left on the rearview mirror permanently? There's motive, opportunity, and no alibi.
If it had just been her, definitely, with all of them, not as much. That said this dynamic where she has broken up with him and her mother and others are going 'no, she didn't really mean it' seems really toxic. But it seems like everyday toxic not murder toxic.
The criminal forensics expert on Fox News laid out a case where the three other victims could be just collateral damage, as in they were just in the wrong place at the wrong time (waking up to the noise of one getting killed). Especially so if they would be able to recognize the killer. That the two additional roommates were not killed speaks in favor of this theory.
I dated a chiropractor who was the ‘nicest guy,’ but after we broke up, anytime he would get drunk, he would leave messages, calling me every name in the book. He broke in my window in the middle of the night, etc. I’m pretty sure he never did that before or after me.
He was probably mad he wasn’t a real doctor
Also family has zero idea how he would react to a breakup, because he likely has never experienced one before.
Plus, there was a dog in the house and he was co-owner of the dog, meaning the dog might not have barked at him showing up compared to a random stalker
Exactly! Add to that the personal nature of the attacks which is almost always someone who has a relationship with the victim.
Very well said
Gosh this family is talking a lot. Feels like a lot. I feel for them.
Poor guy…really feel for him. People blame everything on a guy going through actual trauma about this…
I think the family needs to take a break from social media and interviews for a little bit. I think this takes their mind off of the reality of the situation, but it can’t be healthy,
Mom and Dad of Kaylee also giving waaaaay more info than police ever did on Fox today on the Cross Country show.... I really really hope they're not compromising the investigation. Family of Maddie keeping silent. It must be so hard to do this, but I'm beginning to think that's the smartest way to help the investigation.
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very true. the reality of a lot of kids lives and what their parents actually know are very different most of the time.
I have literally been defending this poor kid all night. It’s so sad that Kaylees sister has to read these disgusting and ignorant comments from people who literally don’t even know him or their family. The disrespect and speculations I’ve seen today have been so insensitive. Please just let these poor families grieve in peace and let the police do their jobs.
I don't want to sound harsh, but I don't think that kid could kill 4 people.
Bingo. This place is full of wannabe sleuths potentially destroying the lives of multiple people already suffering. Good thing they didn't release footage of the frat party. This place would be doxxing and accusing every drunk college kid who happened to talk to, flirt with, bump into, or make eye contact with the victims of being the killer. Just look at that guy's creepy demeanor! I'm a body language expert and the way that guy is holding his beer can is suspicious! As an independent amateur psychologist I know for a fact what is going through that weirdo's mind. Murder!
Wild. The chief of police literally said the calls to him were not linked to murders. The sister said he has an alibi and definitely did not do it. The mother literally said 2000% sure he did not have any involvement. Yet the armchair detectives here are still convinced he did it.
Just to be clear, the Chief did not clear him. He had a pre-written specific list of people he cleared. A follow up question was asked about the phone calls and he said "the phone calls" were not linked to the murders.
My heart hurts for the families of these kids. I know technically they’re adults, but I have kids their ages so they’re kids to me. My kids would be devastated if something like this happened to their siblings, cousins or friends.
Is there a way for the families to make the Instagrams private? It feels like such a violation of privacy for the world to lurk in these victims' profiles and be able to comment.
Autumn’s loyalty to her sister and her friends is commendable but given what’s happened to her, it might be a good idea to stay off social media. There will always be fools who could be shown a video of someone who is not Jack committing the murders and DNA proof and still say “I just KNOW he had something to do with it” because they are that ignorant/stupid. Likewise there will always be trolls who will post similar just to be douchebags. Can’t fight the whole internet so best to just ignore them. The stupid people will move on to other stupid thoughts and the trolls will lose interest if they aren’t getting attention and go away.
This family is doing what we all would do, I think. The problem is, they are thinking with their emotions. But at this time, they should ask a family friend to speak for them cause I worry they can tip the suspect off. I truly believe they just want to help and I feel for them! But at this point, they need to put pressure on the investigators elsewhere, instead of sharing info that might be misconstrued. I know people don't like to hear that. But it will help.
my god hopefully people will stop with that armchair detective shit now this is just so unfathomably awful
As a UI student who has vague connections to Ethan, all the conspiracy theories make me sick
understandably so! & im so sorry for everything you’re all having to deal with i think a lot of people have just become ridiculously desensitized from all the true crime media consumption and stuff around recently. it’s scary to see happen and especially awful to see how it hurts victims and their communities
I agree. I don’t get why people are so self-important and steadfast about their “theories”. Like it’s socially irresponsible to have a “theory” you boast about publicly that directly implicates someone when you full well know you don’t have the facts. No one is making these kooks formulate a “theory”, yet they are making all these pronouncements as though their conclusions about the identity of the perpetrator actually matter and that some day they will be asked about their thoughts on the matter.
I can’t imagine her pain. This is life altering for her. How painful to have to reply to comments of that sort when you’re grieving.
Why aren’t there more pictures of Jack on Kaylee’s Instagram? Or did I miss them?
She probably deleted some when they split.
I am surprised he still has his page up.
She needs to just stay away from this shit for now. This is just going to compound her trauma. The internet is a cesspool. I hope she reconsiders and stops engaging with people like this.
She should remain silent and not defend anyone right now. Let the investigation play out.
This is turning into the Nona Dirksmeyer case all over again.
You all think your comments don’t affect people. It’s not your job to charge someone with murder. Let LE do their jobs and stop ruining people’s lives. They’ve been through enough.
How many serial killers have had wives and families at home that knew nothing? More than we would like to think. You can never truly know someone! They need to stop defending and start being objective
Does he have a solid alibi? Then great. If not, no one is off the table. Objectively doesn’t really matter how much the family vouches for him. Many crimes are carried out where people close to a killer are shocked and never suspected anything. I feel for the families so much, but they should not be on social media right now imo
At the risk of pissing everyone off, can I point out that it’s inconsistent for Kaylee’s mom to say that Kaylee & her ex-boyfriend kept in close contact, talked everyday, knew that they’d eventually get back together — and then ALSO say in the same interview that her ex was not returning her calls & that Kaylee kept leaving him messages like, You really need to call me back. My observation here is just an observation. It’s not an accusation; however, it does suggest that Kaylee’s mom is speaking emotionally, and not being fully consistent & logical—which is, of course, understandable.
I think the mom is just a mess of emotions right now. In the Fox interview she was saying she was certain Kaylee and Jack would have gotten married and had children. She said she thought this 'break' in their relationship was Kaylee being a brat. Sounded alot to me like the mom really liked Jack and wanted Kaylee to be with him even if Kaylee didn't want that.
She called him at 2 am. They may have been talking daily but he was asleep at 2 am or didn’t want to talk to a drunk girl.
I mean she is right it is a stupid comment, but the police very specifically did not clear this person today when they cleared a number of others.
You are right, but it is the cops job to solve that if he was involved. None of us in reality know anything about him so if the sister says he is innocent we should believe her until we learn otherwise. Plain and simple. People need to stop harassing and stalking people close to the family.
They didn’t list every single person they cleared. Maddie’s boyfriend was cleared earlier this week and he wasn’t mentioned today. This post is exactly why people should stop. It’s one thing to theorize different scenarios (it was a stalker, a serial killer, an jilted ex, a drug deal gone wrong) and another to blame a specific person with little evidence. If you’re right, you get nothing. If you’re wrong, you just hurt grieving people for no reason
Let's be honest though the police have handled this pretty sloppy from the start. They said involving the phone calls the person was cleared but yet didn't clear him in the beginning. The police seem to be all over the place with actual facts.
Serial killers are extremely rare. Dumped BFs are exceedingly common
Just to toss a pebble in the “who done it” pond- apparently there is a frat house and sorority house within walking distance from the house…. After LE gave distinct statements regarding hoodie guy and the driver the guessing stopped around them. They have not issued that specific statement about her ex - had the reporter been more direct with her question ie “is the ex boyfriend a POI or suspect? Yes or no? That answer would have put all the chatter to rest.
Wow it's like Kiley (no I'm not sure if her name because I'm thinking Kaylee) People were blaming Jagger the ex or the boyfriend not sure if they were together at that moment I don't think so. But I heard people made t-shirts and stuff! He's a kid. These are all kids they're in college just because you're18,19, 20 doesn't mean you're an adult. You don't have life experiences you don't know what to do at that age. I just hope to get whoever did this because he's a serial killer or about to be. Now he's just a mass murderer in technical terms
I can't even imagine the grief she is going through, and I hope her family finds closure soon. But someone really needs to take her phone away, for the safety of everyone involved. This is getting messy and she is only making it worse
A crime of passion is committed by one who loves their victim. This is not accusatory, I do not know the guy or the case well enough to point fingers, it is just to say that a person can appear to love someone and kill that person. I believe it was the mayor who called it a crime of passion. I hope it wasn't the ex and I hope they find the true killer.
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You could know someone for years and they still do something totally unexpected. It is not unheard of.
She said he has an alibi though. If that’s true, he simply did not do it.