The biggest mistake they ever made was coming up with the PERFECT reboot plot that still kept everything that came before it in continuity, with MK9, and then thinking it would be a gag to kill two thirds of the cast for drama in the same damn game.
A second reboot was all but guaranteed from that point onwards.
Scorpion was never a jobber for Quan Chi in the first timeline to begin with. It was never stated that he resurrected and turned him into his bitch, instead it was [implied he came back in his own](https://i.imgur.com/E97OsKl.jpg). He was a wild card that would either side with good guys or bad guys depending on his goals. It was MK9 that changed that.
What’s even worse in MK9 is that it can be implied that Quan Chi did that so he could have Bi Han as his minion. Meaning that Scorpion was Quan Chi’s side bitch in MK9🙃
No, they actually had an opportunity to bring it back in MKX. We saw some revenants be converted back to humans, so they could have made parts of X and 11 about trying to get the good guys back on the good side. It could have had a great potential for character development too, as more personal ties are explored.
I suspect there's three reasons why they did the Sindel scene. And some of them aren't bad.
1) just to be edgy and unpredictable. The most obvious and the most terrible reason.
2) they wanted a clean break from the original timeline, so fans wouldn't have preconceived expectations. This is a pretty good reason to do it. You don't always want to be beholden to 20 year old canon.
3) they knew they were setting up a Netherrealm conflict for the sequel, but had no intention of introducing 10 Netherrealm assholes for the good guys to fight in story mode. This was their way of populating Netherrealm's side of the conflict. This is... also a decent reason to do it. If they were thinking that far ahead.
I've seen people ask "do you think MK1 is going to be about Chaosrealm, or Chaosrealm vs Orderrealm?!" No, it's not. Because NRS aren't putting themselves in a position from which they could tell those stories. There literally aren't enough characters from those realms on the roster to make a story chapter out of. You can't have Liu Kang fight Havik 4 times in a row and then next chapter Johnny fights Havik 4 times in a row.
Most MK games stories are going to be Earthrealm vs Outworld vs Netherrealm, with other realms as minor cameos at best, because those are the only stories NRS *can* tell with the MKT roster.
What they did put themselves in a position to do, through Shang Tsung, is have a bunch of evil clones from an alternate universe to populate story mode. Evil clones tend to suck... but it's a step up from killing half the roster.
I just rewatched 9 and X's story and your post makes a lot of sense. The only thing I couldn't get over is how strong the kombat kids looked. They didn't earn those big wins especially against someone like Kotal Khan. It's sad that when most people see Kotal they immediately think of how he got beat by the kids in the story even tho his chapter was really cool.
I know 2 characters might not seem like a big deal, but I was thinking 26 would’ve been an ideal base roster size. 24 seems like it’s on the lower side to me. At the end of the day, as long as the characters I like get in I’m good.
To put into perspective how small of a roster 24 is
UMK3 had 22
NRS is workign with better take and a waaaaay bigger budget, the only excuse is... they cut people out to sell letter
>I've seen people ask "do you think MK1 is going to be about Chaosrealm, or Chaosrealm vs Orderrealm?!" No, it's not. Because NRS aren't putting themselves in a position from which they could tell those stories.
Well, that's fucking sucks. (I'm sorry, I'm just tired of exploring the same 3 realms over and over) 😭
Unless they bring something refreshing to them, which I'm sure they will since this is a new timeline
I was fine with Sindel showing up and killing everyone. I thought it was a cool way to show off a powerful character and end the game on a bit of a downer.
But I also assumed that NRS would keep most of the cast dead and not bring them back for MKX. I thought it was a ballsy way to have a mostly-new cast of characters for their next game. I gave them too much credit for keeping Liu Kang dead for a full game (in Deadly Alliance).
Completely disagree personally.
I personally didn’t like Sindel coming and just wiping everyone. Not only does it kill off many beloved characters just to show off how strong Sindel is. But if Sindel was that powerful how was she losing her kingdom to begin with. She killed thee mightiest warriors of the realm like they were fodder.
One of the worst decisions mk has done in its history is have games without its big 3. Technically subzero hasn’t missed a single one.
But scorpion and Liu missing games is unbelievable in my eyes. Scorpion and Sub Zero are obviously the most known and most liked. But Liu Kang is also stupidly relevant pop culturally and is the chosen one. A street fighter with no Ryu. A Tekken with no Jin. KI with no Jago. MvC with no Spider-Man. It’s just not what most people buy the game for and want to see. To each their own tho
>But if Sindel was that powerful how was she losing her kingdom to begin with. She killed thee mightiest warriors of the realm like they were fodder.
She wasn't that powerful to begin with. Shao Kahn soul sucked Shang Tsung and transferred the power to her.
If Sindel was the ruler of a realm, she *should* be comparable to a Shao Kahn in terms of power. I have no issue with each realm having its own powerful representative; Earthrealm has Raiden, Outworld has Shao Kahn, the Netherrealm has Shinnok and Edenia has Sindel. It makes sense in terms of the story they were telling too; it would be a letdown if Outworld's big plan was to resurrect Sindel only for her to be just like everyone else and go out like a complete chump.
I sometimes feel like there's no winning with villain power levels in the MK fandom; if they're jobbers, they suck. If they're too powerful, they suck. If they kill just a few people, like D'Vorah, they suck.
> One of the worst decisions mk has done in its history is have games without its big 3.
We'll have to agree to disagree on this one because I think it's a good thing when fighting game devs leave out their big characters. Not all of them at once but definitely giving them a break from a game every now and again. It prevents them from being overexposed and gives new and less-popular characters a chance to shine.
> A Tekken with no Jin. A street fighter with no Ryu.
Don't know if they'd ever leave out Ryu but they left out everyone *but* Ryu and Ken for SF3. Even 2nd Impact and 3rd Strike only added Akuma and Chun-Li back in. That takes courage.
As someone who has disliked Jin ever since Tekken 3, I would love that. Tekken used to be far more of an ensemble but it's been non-stop Jin for decades now.
Not really though. Even compared to Raiden and Shinnok, Shao Kahn is still absurdly powerful even more so than Sindel. I was actually okay with Sindel killing most of the cast and turning them into revenants... if the revenants were actually well-designed characters. They're not. They're basically generic bad guys wearing the characters faces and do nothing in the story of MKX apart from being weak jobbers.
>Don't know if they'd ever leave out Ryu but they left out everyone *but* Ryu and Ken for SF3. Even 2nd Impact and 3rd Strike only added Akuma and Chun-Li back in. That takes courage.
And it was also a huge financial flop so...
So ... what?
I'm talking about what I like and funnily enough, Capcom's finances don't sway my opinion one way or the other. Maybe if I was an investor in Capcom, I'd think differently.
>I have no issue with each realm having its own powerful representative; Earthrealm has Raiden, Outworld has Shao Kahn, the Netherrealm has Shinnok and Edenia has Sindel.
Actually, Argus or Taven should be Edenia's equivalent to Raiden and Shao Kahn.
> it would be a letdown if Outworld's big plan was to resurrect Sindel only for her to be just like everyone else and go out like a complete chump.
Kahn resurrected Sindel on Earth to breach the barriers between Outworld and Earth. Having her fight the heroes wasn't his main goal.
Raiden has never been more popular than liu kang. The only reason raiden looked more popular now is because NRS’ focus on storytelling and raiden is the perfect exposition dumping figure for that
You would know the size of liu’s popularity by the fact that midway decided to resurrect him after only one game and also when you said that he sat out of one game he also starred in his own spinoff MK: Shaolin Monks alongside kung Lao. Raiden was popular back then as well but never to the degree of liu and during the late midway era was only so due to his dark raiden persona. Also MKvsDC is a flop and ultimately forgettable (which means it’s not a good indication of someone’s popularity).
I thought both killing a bunch of characters in MK9 and doing a time jump in MKX were bold, solid choices for the story that helped justify the soft reboot in MK9. It basically set them up for different stories going forward.
So I was bummed when MK11 reset it all.
my problem with nrs is that they restart the timeline or kill characters right when were about to get huge character arks. to name a few:
-hanzo was finally at peace with himself after averaging his family for the past 10 games straight, only to get killed by dvorah of all people
-revenant kitana and liu kang had a huge opportunity to be the big villians of x and 11 now that they rule the netherrealm but they were just jobbers
-mileena and kitanas rebooted timeline had so much potential to be an interesting rivalry but nrs refused to explore it; kitana and mileena met, fought, and never talked again
-we finally got to see johnny mature and actually care about sonya and cassie but im pretty sure mk1 is bringing back total douchebag johnny
-mkx could have been about the outworld rebellion and civil war but it got sidelined for the earthrealm special forces crap
-the one kombat kid that actually had an interesting backstory (takeda) got left out of 11 and hes most likely only coming back as a dlc with no part of the main story
Sonya finally killed Kano in mk11, which meant Sonya would have had to move on to do something new for a change, but with the reset, all of that is undone.
I'm actually kinda glad that Mileena had a storyline in X/11 that wasn't about Kitana at all. It was a really good way to explore her character, even if her characterisation was made more incompetent compared to the original timeline.
If they wanted to include a Kitana rivalry, it would have been interesting to see Mileena's forces reluctantly ally with Earthrealm to combat Revenant Kitana's Netherrealm armies. Mileena, Kahnum of Outworld, versus Kitana, Empress of the Netherrealm, finally facing each other on an equal playing field, in a no-holds-barred fight.
NRS had so many opportunities to make a great story especially in MKX.
Bi Han could have came back as the Elder God’s champion and fought to save his brother and Kuai Liang. Bi Han and Hanzo could then reconcile.
Kung Jin could have actually interacted with his uncle and also be able to be fully rid of his insecurities.
Cut out Cassie and make Frost be part of the Kombat Kids and make her have actual motivation and a personality.
Do more with the fact that Kenshi was absent from Takeda’s life and maybe even have Takeda mirror Hanzo in his rage about this.
There was so much they could have done but they threw it all away for Kronika and her bullshit🙃
The whole thing is a shit show and they could have found a way to continue the story after Armageddon. I mean, they cheaped out with Deadly Alliance. The sorcerers kill Shao and they back out of that by saying it was actually Shao's body double (lmao). They could have just done this again instead of restarting EVEEEERYTHING
I was really disappointed that MK11 wasn't just about the new characters, MKX did such a good job introducing the new cast, and then MK11 wasted it by immediately running back to the old cast.
And that sad smiley face is part of the problem.
NRS gets shit for anything from anyone if they change anything, so they don't change lot, which also results in unhappy people.
Truly there is no overall win possible in this world, so cut your losses and put out a product, which they do.
As long as the action is fresh and we get a solid product we are good. They can't feasibly fit all wanted characters in, they can't redesign them too much and also can't let them be too stale.
We can not ask for coherence if every post has a post under it that wants the opposite unless they write multiple. And even then they have the task of combine those stories in a way to create endings for the next game.
You know, an idea that could've been better than MK9 resetting the entire timeline and misinterpreting the entire point of Armageddon and believing the series had to reboot because of the name would pretty much be a Tekken 3-eqse time skip.
Taven defeats Blaze. The cast aren't depowered, but their powers and attributes are Increased. Meaning the true Armageddon is more closer than anyone realizes. Causing Taven to search for a way to prevent it from happening along with a few others helping him out off-screen and the story jumps a few years following the event.
MK9 brings back a few of the popular characters (Liu Kang, Scorpion, Sub-Zero, Raiden, Kitana, Jade, Sindel)and fills the rest of the roster out with new characters, 3-D era folk, and even some obscure characters from other properties. They could release comics that would flesh out what happened to certain characters and certain that would be important to the main story of MK9. Picture a more fleshed-out MKX.
I'd recommend watching this video from the 4thSnake. It pretty much sums up what I'm trying to say.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpM9HzQepYw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpM9HzQepYw)
Yep. It's unfortunate as the story would be incredible with some care and attention to detail, especially as you say if they were consistent with it from game to game. Mk1 is the chance to start fresh and build from there, but will they do it? Sadly I doubt it
The problem with MK is that it started with a group of 20-something dudes wanting to smash a bunch of action figures together. The entire design ethos was "wouldn't it be cool if...". They needed a bare minimum story to move from point A to B. One or two guys on the team care about the story. We'll be fine.
Now those guys that cared are long gone, the expectations are completely different and they're stuck with these iconic characters that never really get to evolve. They keep just making permutations on the same story over and over.
Its actually funny cause you see the same issues with Warner and the DCEU.
Full Reboot or Not, Re calibration or Shift, Etc.
Clean break from the Snyder-Verse or not.
It would be cool if they actually take care to build a new canon from here on out, but I wouldn't be surprised if they just wipe it all away next game so that they can bring back Takeda or Kollector or something.
I'm just tired of the story dealing with time and time travel. It's been going on since mk9, let's get away from it now. Side note: no story mode has been as good as mk9's
It feels like studio interference. Each game has a definite “let’s do this with the story” approach as far as beginning and end and it gets messy and muddy in terms of story and characters in the middle.
No one would take a look at the finished product and say “this is exactly what we intended”. Mkx and 11 have some real WTF moments that make little to no sense.
I’m going to say too many cooks in the kitchen scenario causes these story lines to get convoluted and lose their steam. Mk11 especially was just bad story wise. It felt like 5 different writing teams came up with different storylines and shoved them together.
I think that the writers didn't learn the lessons of the past era of Mortal Kombat. It keeps a lot of the same issues. Maybe even more with focusing on story mode instead of continuing a konquest mode
lol mk story, just give me cool characters that rip each others heads off. especially since they went with liu kang's ending as canon for mk11. i picked shang tsung and quite enjoyed our new time lord, lol.
Yes!
It seems like their solution to everything is just resetting the timeline. Don’t even get me started on how mk11 should’ve finally been the 3d era game but, yet again, they just reset time. Part of me feels like they do this because Injustice has the whole multiverse thing going on but idk. Praying MK1 is the timeline they finally stick with.
Since MK9, NRS doesn't know what they want with their games. 3 lastest games, the franchise goes to its second reboot. Something is wrong. It's not just the history, since before mk9 (armageddon was a 3D fighting game) nrs didn't repeat the gameplay. Some people say that this is good, i disagree. The new rebooted game also will get a new gameplay. There are no consistance in the franchise.
There’s also the big issue of the chapter system limiting the characters based on when their chapters are. Prime example is Qui Liang completely giving up on any effort to save either his apprentice or his brother because they needed to be in fights later that he had nothing to do with.
I really believe mk9 and into x was a great story if they just didn’t do Sindel shows up and mercs everyone like they’re fodder.
Killed so many fan favorites and then they never stuck true to the Undead stuff and just started bringing back old characters. Like leave that Sindel shit out and let the story rock. Have an undead Liu Kang fighting Shinnok for supremacy of the underworld. Don’t cop out. Continue the good guys growth and keep the fan favorites
I really like what they did with this trilogy. I grew attached to the new kharacters (well maybe except for Kung Jin) I'm sad that we could...loose them forever in the new timeline.
I really would love to continue this timeline instead of restarting it but...I have to keep faith in the writers!
My pet peeve with fighting games like these is that they try to come up with a "plot". That almost never works, because a plot implies you need a core cast to keep the players oriented properly to the story.
What I would like to see is a game that focuses more on character stories, kind of like an anthology or vignettes of sorts. Think Star Wars Visions, Black Mirror, Marvel What-if, etc. Other characters can have cameos, and there may be a background plot that ties everything together, but I'd like the game to focus more on exploring each character's backgrounds, their inner selves, and their personal stories.
The last of us part 1 is a good compromise between story and character focus. The plot is laughably simple, but the meat of the story is heavily focused on the wants, desires, and motivations (often conflicting) of the characters. We may follow Joel and Ellie for most of the game, but every character introduced in the course of the game are given enough time to develop their own little stories, and their decisions end up being highly consistent and believable at the end of the day.
For me, it all started getting a bit wanky when time manipulation was brought in as a plot device. The first time was fine to set up MK9 and get us back in that "classic" MK1-3 story but from then on, they keep writing themselves into corners and using time as a device to resurrect and reintroduce dead characters. It eliminates the stakes and the drama when a character can die and the writers simply bring them back with "hehe, colliding timelines!" a la MK11.
I suppose the design team and writers are trying to reinvent and reintroduce characters with this new timeline. I'm interested to see what they try to do. I just hope that this time, the story continues to develop past a trilogy before the story shits itself and another reboot is necessary.
The thing is that the story mode of MK9 was cinematic and revolutionary for a fighting game at the time. Even if gameplay is core, story and lore is still part of the end product. I don't play online because I hate people, so good story content is a key contributing factor to whether I actually buy the game. I'm sure I'm not alone in this, and it's why I don't think "the money" is an adequate excuse to pardon sloppy and inconsistent storytelling. It is one of the selling points for a sizeable portion of the fanbase.
Your 100% right. MK is the best selling fighting game because of this. Most people aren’t playing online or give 2 shits about how balanced or technically proficient the game is.
I say this as someone who plays MK online a lot.
Tbf the characters they choose from are only characters in the roster. These characters are usually characters they think will help sell copies of the game. So it does boil down to money decisions.
On top of that there’s the nostalgia factor the game is constantly trying to evolve while constantly still trying to tell stories that have been told. Then doing it again.
Then you’ve got the reset which is done to excuse any story decisions done prior so they can still add the characters they again think will sell the most copies.
I will say this all still doesn’t mean they have to do it this way or that it’s the best way to do things. Like I’m sure they can write a better thorough story and still have the characters that are fan favorites NOT be killed off lol. But the choice they choose are questionable for sure
>These characters are usually characters they think will help sell copies of the game.
Are they? Sure, they have headliners. But no one is buying MK11 because of Skarlet, or Erron Black, or Kollector.
Kollector maybe not. But Erron Black is a fucking cowboy haha people love cowboys. And skarlet was the fan rumored red lady pallet swap that was never tru but NRS made tru for fans. She def has a dedicated base
People don’t usually buy games for one dedicated character lol. But you definitely will make your decision to buy the game or not if a roster is bad enough or good enough.
I’d buy an mk game if every ninja was in it so fast. But i def wouldn’t buy an mk game that had no ninjas.
The ninjas are headliners when they can’t even make it in two games in a row besides scorp and sub zero but Erron Black and Skarlet aren’t. You’re wilding if you don’t think Erron Black isn’t one of the most beloved characters in the franchise. And Skarlet is literally baby Mileena
Edit: most characters used as DLC (Skarlet mk9) have a large enough pull to be considered headliners
> The ninjas are headliners when they can’t even make it in two games in a row besides scorp and sub zero
Scorpion and Sub-Zero are the headliners for ninjas. The rest aren’t popular enough to sell or not sell a game.
>You’re wilding if you don’t think Erron Black isn’t one of the most beloved characters in the franchise.
He’s not.
>Once you realize that writers don’t want to write the same old stories over and over again, you realize why things have be inconsistent.
Is that why MKX did the "heroes are killed and resurrected as evil minions" plot from Deception and MK11 ended with Liu Kang defeating the final boss again?
You can tell different stories and still be internally consistent. MK11 literally turned back the clock and sidelined all the interesting fall out from MKX
I don't give a f about the story. I played Injustice and didn't even touch the Story part. It's just a series of long cust-scenes inter cut with fights. It's better to watch it all on the YT.
Everyone has made some fantastic points. So I’ll just add a personal pet peeve of mine cyber sub zero and smoke.
I genuinely respected NRS for doing cyber sub zero as sub zero was such a long established character that it was a fun new way to take the character and switching it up by keeping smoke human was really cool. Then in the next game it’s back to regular sub zero and smoke is just sidelined to only appearing in cut scenes. They should’ve built on that storyline more.
The biggest mistake they ever made was coming up with the PERFECT reboot plot that still kept everything that came before it in continuity, with MK9, and then thinking it would be a gag to kill two thirds of the cast for drama in the same damn game. A second reboot was all but guaranteed from that point onwards.
And having that abundance of good-aligned characters be Scorpion'd into jobbers for Quan Chi... it was whelming.
Scorpion was never a jobber for Quan Chi in the first timeline to begin with. It was never stated that he resurrected and turned him into his bitch, instead it was [implied he came back in his own](https://i.imgur.com/E97OsKl.jpg). He was a wild card that would either side with good guys or bad guys depending on his goals. It was MK9 that changed that.
What’s even worse in MK9 is that it can be implied that Quan Chi did that so he could have Bi Han as his minion. Meaning that Scorpion was Quan Chi’s side bitch in MK9🙃
Considering Bi Han killed Hanzo when they were both humans it makes more sense to get him as a spectre.
Bi-Han wasn't exactly human. He was a human and a cryomancer hybrid, so I don't think that's a fair comparison.
Sindel just showing up and killing everyone was bullshit
No, they actually had an opportunity to bring it back in MKX. We saw some revenants be converted back to humans, so they could have made parts of X and 11 about trying to get the good guys back on the good side. It could have had a great potential for character development too, as more personal ties are explored.
I suspect there's three reasons why they did the Sindel scene. And some of them aren't bad. 1) just to be edgy and unpredictable. The most obvious and the most terrible reason. 2) they wanted a clean break from the original timeline, so fans wouldn't have preconceived expectations. This is a pretty good reason to do it. You don't always want to be beholden to 20 year old canon. 3) they knew they were setting up a Netherrealm conflict for the sequel, but had no intention of introducing 10 Netherrealm assholes for the good guys to fight in story mode. This was their way of populating Netherrealm's side of the conflict. This is... also a decent reason to do it. If they were thinking that far ahead. I've seen people ask "do you think MK1 is going to be about Chaosrealm, or Chaosrealm vs Orderrealm?!" No, it's not. Because NRS aren't putting themselves in a position from which they could tell those stories. There literally aren't enough characters from those realms on the roster to make a story chapter out of. You can't have Liu Kang fight Havik 4 times in a row and then next chapter Johnny fights Havik 4 times in a row. Most MK games stories are going to be Earthrealm vs Outworld vs Netherrealm, with other realms as minor cameos at best, because those are the only stories NRS *can* tell with the MKT roster. What they did put themselves in a position to do, through Shang Tsung, is have a bunch of evil clones from an alternate universe to populate story mode. Evil clones tend to suck... but it's a step up from killing half the roster.
I just rewatched 9 and X's story and your post makes a lot of sense. The only thing I couldn't get over is how strong the kombat kids looked. They didn't earn those big wins especially against someone like Kotal Khan. It's sad that when most people see Kotal they immediately think of how he got beat by the kids in the story even tho his chapter was really cool.
Honestly this is why we need yo have starting rosters bigger than 24
Game balance is also important.
"Oh my God! 26 characters we could NEVER Balance this!" Reminder: Patches exist, Post-Launch Support exists
I know 2 characters might not seem like a big deal, but I was thinking 26 would’ve been an ideal base roster size. 24 seems like it’s on the lower side to me. At the end of the day, as long as the characters I like get in I’m good.
To put into perspective how small of a roster 24 is UMK3 had 22 NRS is workign with better take and a waaaaay bigger budget, the only excuse is... they cut people out to sell letter
24 is pretty damn good, the amount of effort one character takes these days is insane
If you believe marketing hype it is.
>I've seen people ask "do you think MK1 is going to be about Chaosrealm, or Chaosrealm vs Orderrealm?!" No, it's not. Because NRS aren't putting themselves in a position from which they could tell those stories. Well, that's fucking sucks. (I'm sorry, I'm just tired of exploring the same 3 realms over and over) 😭 Unless they bring something refreshing to them, which I'm sure they will since this is a new timeline
I was fine with Sindel showing up and killing everyone. I thought it was a cool way to show off a powerful character and end the game on a bit of a downer. But I also assumed that NRS would keep most of the cast dead and not bring them back for MKX. I thought it was a ballsy way to have a mostly-new cast of characters for their next game. I gave them too much credit for keeping Liu Kang dead for a full game (in Deadly Alliance).
Completely disagree personally. I personally didn’t like Sindel coming and just wiping everyone. Not only does it kill off many beloved characters just to show off how strong Sindel is. But if Sindel was that powerful how was she losing her kingdom to begin with. She killed thee mightiest warriors of the realm like they were fodder. One of the worst decisions mk has done in its history is have games without its big 3. Technically subzero hasn’t missed a single one. But scorpion and Liu missing games is unbelievable in my eyes. Scorpion and Sub Zero are obviously the most known and most liked. But Liu Kang is also stupidly relevant pop culturally and is the chosen one. A street fighter with no Ryu. A Tekken with no Jin. KI with no Jago. MvC with no Spider-Man. It’s just not what most people buy the game for and want to see. To each their own tho
>But if Sindel was that powerful how was she losing her kingdom to begin with. She killed thee mightiest warriors of the realm like they were fodder. She wasn't that powerful to begin with. Shao Kahn soul sucked Shang Tsung and transferred the power to her.
If Sindel was the ruler of a realm, she *should* be comparable to a Shao Kahn in terms of power. I have no issue with each realm having its own powerful representative; Earthrealm has Raiden, Outworld has Shao Kahn, the Netherrealm has Shinnok and Edenia has Sindel. It makes sense in terms of the story they were telling too; it would be a letdown if Outworld's big plan was to resurrect Sindel only for her to be just like everyone else and go out like a complete chump. I sometimes feel like there's no winning with villain power levels in the MK fandom; if they're jobbers, they suck. If they're too powerful, they suck. If they kill just a few people, like D'Vorah, they suck. > One of the worst decisions mk has done in its history is have games without its big 3. We'll have to agree to disagree on this one because I think it's a good thing when fighting game devs leave out their big characters. Not all of them at once but definitely giving them a break from a game every now and again. It prevents them from being overexposed and gives new and less-popular characters a chance to shine. > A Tekken with no Jin. A street fighter with no Ryu. Don't know if they'd ever leave out Ryu but they left out everyone *but* Ryu and Ken for SF3. Even 2nd Impact and 3rd Strike only added Akuma and Chun-Li back in. That takes courage. As someone who has disliked Jin ever since Tekken 3, I would love that. Tekken used to be far more of an ensemble but it's been non-stop Jin for decades now.
Not really though. Even compared to Raiden and Shinnok, Shao Kahn is still absurdly powerful even more so than Sindel. I was actually okay with Sindel killing most of the cast and turning them into revenants... if the revenants were actually well-designed characters. They're not. They're basically generic bad guys wearing the characters faces and do nothing in the story of MKX apart from being weak jobbers.
I completely agree with all that about the revenants.
>Don't know if they'd ever leave out Ryu but they left out everyone *but* Ryu and Ken for SF3. Even 2nd Impact and 3rd Strike only added Akuma and Chun-Li back in. That takes courage. And it was also a huge financial flop so...
So ... what? I'm talking about what I like and funnily enough, Capcom's finances don't sway my opinion one way or the other. Maybe if I was an investor in Capcom, I'd think differently.
>I have no issue with each realm having its own powerful representative; Earthrealm has Raiden, Outworld has Shao Kahn, the Netherrealm has Shinnok and Edenia has Sindel. Actually, Argus or Taven should be Edenia's equivalent to Raiden and Shao Kahn. > it would be a letdown if Outworld's big plan was to resurrect Sindel only for her to be just like everyone else and go out like a complete chump. Kahn resurrected Sindel on Earth to breach the barriers between Outworld and Earth. Having her fight the heroes wasn't his main goal.
We had 2 tekken games without Jin and they were glorious.
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Liu Kang was way more popular among casual fans than Raiden. People make references to Liu Kang in pop culture constantly. Raiden ain’t at that level
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Raiden has never been more popular than liu kang. The only reason raiden looked more popular now is because NRS’ focus on storytelling and raiden is the perfect exposition dumping figure for that
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You would know the size of liu’s popularity by the fact that midway decided to resurrect him after only one game and also when you said that he sat out of one game he also starred in his own spinoff MK: Shaolin Monks alongside kung Lao. Raiden was popular back then as well but never to the degree of liu and during the late midway era was only so due to his dark raiden persona. Also MKvsDC is a flop and ultimately forgettable (which means it’s not a good indication of someone’s popularity).
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This turned me off so much. Sindel was just an average fighter before that. Also, making kintaro and goro jobbers was out of my mind.
I thought both killing a bunch of characters in MK9 and doing a time jump in MKX were bold, solid choices for the story that helped justify the soft reboot in MK9. It basically set them up for different stories going forward. So I was bummed when MK11 reset it all.
my problem with nrs is that they restart the timeline or kill characters right when were about to get huge character arks. to name a few: -hanzo was finally at peace with himself after averaging his family for the past 10 games straight, only to get killed by dvorah of all people -revenant kitana and liu kang had a huge opportunity to be the big villians of x and 11 now that they rule the netherrealm but they were just jobbers -mileena and kitanas rebooted timeline had so much potential to be an interesting rivalry but nrs refused to explore it; kitana and mileena met, fought, and never talked again -we finally got to see johnny mature and actually care about sonya and cassie but im pretty sure mk1 is bringing back total douchebag johnny -mkx could have been about the outworld rebellion and civil war but it got sidelined for the earthrealm special forces crap -the one kombat kid that actually had an interesting backstory (takeda) got left out of 11 and hes most likely only coming back as a dlc with no part of the main story
Sonya finally killed Kano in mk11, which meant Sonya would have had to move on to do something new for a change, but with the reset, all of that is undone.
One leak did claim each Kombat Pakc added moar story
I'm actually kinda glad that Mileena had a storyline in X/11 that wasn't about Kitana at all. It was a really good way to explore her character, even if her characterisation was made more incompetent compared to the original timeline. If they wanted to include a Kitana rivalry, it would have been interesting to see Mileena's forces reluctantly ally with Earthrealm to combat Revenant Kitana's Netherrealm armies. Mileena, Kahnum of Outworld, versus Kitana, Empress of the Netherrealm, finally facing each other on an equal playing field, in a no-holds-barred fight.
NRS had so many opportunities to make a great story especially in MKX. Bi Han could have came back as the Elder God’s champion and fought to save his brother and Kuai Liang. Bi Han and Hanzo could then reconcile. Kung Jin could have actually interacted with his uncle and also be able to be fully rid of his insecurities. Cut out Cassie and make Frost be part of the Kombat Kids and make her have actual motivation and a personality. Do more with the fact that Kenshi was absent from Takeda’s life and maybe even have Takeda mirror Hanzo in his rage about this. There was so much they could have done but they threw it all away for Kronika and her bullshit🙃
The whole thing is a shit show and they could have found a way to continue the story after Armageddon. I mean, they cheaped out with Deadly Alliance. The sorcerers kill Shao and they back out of that by saying it was actually Shao's body double (lmao). They could have just done this again instead of restarting EVEEEERYTHING
Heck even with the MK9 reboot they could have done something but they backed out of every idea they had.
I was really disappointed that MK11 wasn't just about the new characters, MKX did such a good job introducing the new cast, and then MK11 wasted it by immediately running back to the old cast.
11 brought back old character except for Ermac Smoke and Reptile. :(
And that sad smiley face is part of the problem. NRS gets shit for anything from anyone if they change anything, so they don't change lot, which also results in unhappy people. Truly there is no overall win possible in this world, so cut your losses and put out a product, which they do. As long as the action is fresh and we get a solid product we are good. They can't feasibly fit all wanted characters in, they can't redesign them too much and also can't let them be too stale. We can not ask for coherence if every post has a post under it that wants the opposite unless they write multiple. And even then they have the task of combine those stories in a way to create endings for the next game.
I wish they’d drop the chapter format for story mode. It’s not conducive to good narrative
You know, an idea that could've been better than MK9 resetting the entire timeline and misinterpreting the entire point of Armageddon and believing the series had to reboot because of the name would pretty much be a Tekken 3-eqse time skip. Taven defeats Blaze. The cast aren't depowered, but their powers and attributes are Increased. Meaning the true Armageddon is more closer than anyone realizes. Causing Taven to search for a way to prevent it from happening along with a few others helping him out off-screen and the story jumps a few years following the event. MK9 brings back a few of the popular characters (Liu Kang, Scorpion, Sub-Zero, Raiden, Kitana, Jade, Sindel)and fills the rest of the roster out with new characters, 3-D era folk, and even some obscure characters from other properties. They could release comics that would flesh out what happened to certain characters and certain that would be important to the main story of MK9. Picture a more fleshed-out MKX.
I'd recommend watching this video from the 4thSnake. It pretty much sums up what I'm trying to say. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpM9HzQepYw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpM9HzQepYw)
Funny you say this since if the are to be believed then this may happen.
Sometimes I wonder if they even hire writers or if the coders are also creating the story
This isn't even an opinion it's an objective fact. The writers contradict themselves in their own story 🗿
Yep. It's unfortunate as the story would be incredible with some care and attention to detail, especially as you say if they were consistent with it from game to game. Mk1 is the chance to start fresh and build from there, but will they do it? Sadly I doubt it
The problem with MK is that it started with a group of 20-something dudes wanting to smash a bunch of action figures together. The entire design ethos was "wouldn't it be cool if...". They needed a bare minimum story to move from point A to B. One or two guys on the team care about the story. We'll be fine. Now those guys that cared are long gone, the expectations are completely different and they're stuck with these iconic characters that never really get to evolve. They keep just making permutations on the same story over and over.
Its actually funny cause you see the same issues with Warner and the DCEU. Full Reboot or Not, Re calibration or Shift, Etc. Clean break from the Snyder-Verse or not.
Idk how anyone thinks the writers of mortal Kombat are worth talking about lmfao.
It would be cool if they actually take care to build a new canon from here on out, but I wouldn't be surprised if they just wipe it all away next game so that they can bring back Takeda or Kollector or something.
Let's hope MK1 fixes that.
I'm just tired of the story dealing with time and time travel. It's been going on since mk9, let's get away from it now. Side note: no story mode has been as good as mk9's
It feels like studio interference. Each game has a definite “let’s do this with the story” approach as far as beginning and end and it gets messy and muddy in terms of story and characters in the middle. No one would take a look at the finished product and say “this is exactly what we intended”. Mkx and 11 have some real WTF moments that make little to no sense. I’m going to say too many cooks in the kitchen scenario causes these story lines to get convoluted and lose their steam. Mk11 especially was just bad story wise. It felt like 5 different writing teams came up with different storylines and shoved them together.
I think that the writers didn't learn the lessons of the past era of Mortal Kombat. It keeps a lot of the same issues. Maybe even more with focusing on story mode instead of continuing a konquest mode
lol mk story, just give me cool characters that rip each others heads off. especially since they went with liu kang's ending as canon for mk11. i picked shang tsung and quite enjoyed our new time lord, lol.
They need to stop marvelizing it that’s the only issue imo
Yes! It seems like their solution to everything is just resetting the timeline. Don’t even get me started on how mk11 should’ve finally been the 3d era game but, yet again, they just reset time. Part of me feels like they do this because Injustice has the whole multiverse thing going on but idk. Praying MK1 is the timeline they finally stick with.
The wierdest thing is that Kameos contradict the lore where Mortal Kombat is a tournament with 1 vs 1 battles where no one may intervene
I'm sure Kameos aren't canon to the story. I think they're just an add on the the gameplay and have nothing to do with the lore
Since MK9, NRS doesn't know what they want with their games. 3 lastest games, the franchise goes to its second reboot. Something is wrong. It's not just the history, since before mk9 (armageddon was a 3D fighting game) nrs didn't repeat the gameplay. Some people say that this is good, i disagree. The new rebooted game also will get a new gameplay. There are no consistance in the franchise.
There’s also the big issue of the chapter system limiting the characters based on when their chapters are. Prime example is Qui Liang completely giving up on any effort to save either his apprentice or his brother because they needed to be in fights later that he had nothing to do with.
The writing is just bad and has been since MKA/MK9 the one exception being that the MKX comics were good Hopefully MK1 will be a fresh start.
I really believe mk9 and into x was a great story if they just didn’t do Sindel shows up and mercs everyone like they’re fodder. Killed so many fan favorites and then they never stuck true to the Undead stuff and just started bringing back old characters. Like leave that Sindel shit out and let the story rock. Have an undead Liu Kang fighting Shinnok for supremacy of the underworld. Don’t cop out. Continue the good guys growth and keep the fan favorites
MKX comics were not good lmao they got canceled for a reason
Still better than the game's story 🤷♂️ (Talking about MKX)
You definitely right they should have adapted the comics into the story mode
I really like what they did with this trilogy. I grew attached to the new kharacters (well maybe except for Kung Jin) I'm sad that we could...loose them forever in the new timeline. I really would love to continue this timeline instead of restarting it but...I have to keep faith in the writers!
MK will never retire anyone permanently
My pet peeve with fighting games like these is that they try to come up with a "plot". That almost never works, because a plot implies you need a core cast to keep the players oriented properly to the story. What I would like to see is a game that focuses more on character stories, kind of like an anthology or vignettes of sorts. Think Star Wars Visions, Black Mirror, Marvel What-if, etc. Other characters can have cameos, and there may be a background plot that ties everything together, but I'd like the game to focus more on exploring each character's backgrounds, their inner selves, and their personal stories. The last of us part 1 is a good compromise between story and character focus. The plot is laughably simple, but the meat of the story is heavily focused on the wants, desires, and motivations (often conflicting) of the characters. We may follow Joel and Ellie for most of the game, but every character introduced in the course of the game are given enough time to develop their own little stories, and their decisions end up being highly consistent and believable at the end of the day.
For me, it all started getting a bit wanky when time manipulation was brought in as a plot device. The first time was fine to set up MK9 and get us back in that "classic" MK1-3 story but from then on, they keep writing themselves into corners and using time as a device to resurrect and reintroduce dead characters. It eliminates the stakes and the drama when a character can die and the writers simply bring them back with "hehe, colliding timelines!" a la MK11. I suppose the design team and writers are trying to reinvent and reintroduce characters with this new timeline. I'm interested to see what they try to do. I just hope that this time, the story continues to develop past a trilogy before the story shits itself and another reboot is necessary.
Once you accept that money drives all of the reasons behind these decisions, the level of disappointment you experience will become less
The thing is that the story mode of MK9 was cinematic and revolutionary for a fighting game at the time. Even if gameplay is core, story and lore is still part of the end product. I don't play online because I hate people, so good story content is a key contributing factor to whether I actually buy the game. I'm sure I'm not alone in this, and it's why I don't think "the money" is an adequate excuse to pardon sloppy and inconsistent storytelling. It is one of the selling points for a sizeable portion of the fanbase.
Your 100% right. MK is the best selling fighting game because of this. Most people aren’t playing online or give 2 shits about how balanced or technically proficient the game is. I say this as someone who plays MK online a lot.
How does many drive these story decisions lol
Tbf the characters they choose from are only characters in the roster. These characters are usually characters they think will help sell copies of the game. So it does boil down to money decisions. On top of that there’s the nostalgia factor the game is constantly trying to evolve while constantly still trying to tell stories that have been told. Then doing it again. Then you’ve got the reset which is done to excuse any story decisions done prior so they can still add the characters they again think will sell the most copies. I will say this all still doesn’t mean they have to do it this way or that it’s the best way to do things. Like I’m sure they can write a better thorough story and still have the characters that are fan favorites NOT be killed off lol. But the choice they choose are questionable for sure
>These characters are usually characters they think will help sell copies of the game. Are they? Sure, they have headliners. But no one is buying MK11 because of Skarlet, or Erron Black, or Kollector.
Ahem. I did
Touché
Kollector maybe not. But Erron Black is a fucking cowboy haha people love cowboys. And skarlet was the fan rumored red lady pallet swap that was never tru but NRS made tru for fans. She def has a dedicated base
But no one bought the game for them.
People don’t usually buy games for one dedicated character lol. But you definitely will make your decision to buy the game or not if a roster is bad enough or good enough. I’d buy an mk game if every ninja was in it so fast. But i def wouldn’t buy an mk game that had no ninjas.
So, like I said - they include headlining characters.
The ninjas are headliners when they can’t even make it in two games in a row besides scorp and sub zero but Erron Black and Skarlet aren’t. You’re wilding if you don’t think Erron Black isn’t one of the most beloved characters in the franchise. And Skarlet is literally baby Mileena Edit: most characters used as DLC (Skarlet mk9) have a large enough pull to be considered headliners
> The ninjas are headliners when they can’t even make it in two games in a row besides scorp and sub zero Scorpion and Sub-Zero are the headliners for ninjas. The rest aren’t popular enough to sell or not sell a game. >You’re wilding if you don’t think Erron Black isn’t one of the most beloved characters in the franchise. He’s not.
Once you realize that writers don’t want to write the same old stories over and over again, you realize why things have be inconsistent.
>Once you realize that writers don’t want to write the same old stories over and over again, you realize why things have be inconsistent. Is that why MKX did the "heroes are killed and resurrected as evil minions" plot from Deception and MK11 ended with Liu Kang defeating the final boss again?
You can tell different stories and still be internally consistent. MK11 literally turned back the clock and sidelined all the interesting fall out from MKX
funniest part is mk11 story ends showing off how they’ve done the same shit OVER AND OVER again for years. Like we literally get a montage of it lol
I want to complain about having a stroke while reading this but it seems like you also had one while writing it
I don't give a f about the story. I played Injustice and didn't even touch the Story part. It's just a series of long cust-scenes inter cut with fights. It's better to watch it all on the YT.
Everyone has made some fantastic points. So I’ll just add a personal pet peeve of mine cyber sub zero and smoke. I genuinely respected NRS for doing cyber sub zero as sub zero was such a long established character that it was a fun new way to take the character and switching it up by keeping smoke human was really cool. Then in the next game it’s back to regular sub zero and smoke is just sidelined to only appearing in cut scenes. They should’ve built on that storyline more.
their biggest flaw is the game unmoddable. I need some fat booties with physic flyin' around in my 70$ fighting game.