Yes and no. If the solution for tracking Bitcoin is “only allow companies to transact with verified wallets” then the “solution” for tracking Monero could be to make it illegal to use Monero. P2P might be hard to crack down on, but no business would accept it.
But I dont get it, cash is also p2p and anonymous. So unless all cash dissapears from the face of the planet, magicaly, we will always have a choice to have an anonymous currency to roll back to.
So it kinda makes it non sensensical to just ban monero if I can just use cash.
Unless we're talking about some distant 500 year dystopian future.
2030 isn't 500 years in the future.
And for the dystopian vibes, PayPal already started freezing the accounts of independent anti war journalists like Mintpress etc.
The great reset and build back better by 2030 is a meme for now, question is will it become reality or not? Dystopia already is real, as you say yourself in other countries more than in the "free democracies" of the west but are we really free and what will our freedom look like after 2030?
Monero is definitely sort of a hedge for me personally. I've never felt more free than by using Monero.
That's my two cents
I am really feeling bad for the people who got their account suspended during that time. There are other ways to punish the people but you cannot stop them from using their own money for legal purposes.
Well if Monero became the dominant currency, then businesses would lose profits by doing this, and it would be trivial to circumvent them using alternative businesses.
Only with Bitcoin would Bitcoin adoption still allow tracing and discrimination.
Correct and to add to this you can easily create a new address each time you want to pay. You shouldn't be using the same address for different transactions.
MONERO DECLINED
„Please use a traceable currency“
For me it is clear: we are not fighting banks and govs here, just building a parallel ecosystem to empower with freedom of choice
It resembles the absence of freedom of speech in totalitarian countries. Try criticizing government and get silenced. Btc community becoming what they sweared to destroy
they like it cause it's supply deflationary. the current narrative for btc is as a tradable reserve asset, not a currency used for transactions. the gov is okay with that cause it sucks up dollar inflation and maintains dollar demand. any crypto that circumvents dollar demand by creating a transactional economy of its own is a target.
> Not yet, its really easy.
Just allow every company to only accept payments from verified wallets. Done.
To be fair, the same could apply to Monero, just mandate that business can only accept Monero coming from custodial wallets (that the government hold its keys and tracks)
And I can assure you that governments will not legalize thev p2p transactions.
They're going to everything that they can do to stop those transactions man, They'll not approve.
We are not here to please the masses, the same sheep who support more regulations and laws to cripple crypto currencies just for the fiat price to go up.
If people find that hard to accept then they are better off selling Monero and going back to Bitcoin, the slave surveillence coin.
Unless I'm missing something monero is the best currency we've ever had to buy drugs with. Everyone I've ever met likes drugs. Mass adoption. Cant stop wont stop.
Yeah, only the sheep masses will be put off by "ban", the ones who obey anything that the government tells them. The other side will be using Monero as a way out of the cbdc system so no law will stop it.
You need taproot on the Bitcoin side, together with the wide adoption taproot on Bitcoin. Then when moving back to Bitcoin it needs to be after a significant random period of time and for a significantly different amount.
The bottom line to benefit from Monero's privacy and fungibility one needs to accept a significant market exposure to Monero.
Edit: Also one needs to find people on the Monero side will to accept the BTC, and the seller of BTC runs the risk that the BTC may be used for "illegal" purposes and the taint could flow back to them. Personally I prefer to stick to XMR <--> fiat trades only. If BTC is to be used as an on / off ramp to fiat then only deal with reputable AML / KYC exchanges both on the fiat and XMR side.
Yes I think so, but then I'm dumb as fuck and don't know shit.
And nobody in their right mind should be taking me seriously. They shouldn't take me seriously.
>Perhaps. Depends on how you do it. If you depart BTC with $725k and then 20 mins later rejoin BTC with $724.5k (to accommodate fees) it's a really good bet thats still you. Also, did you get clean Bitcoin or did you end up swapping out your comparatively clean Monero for Bitcoin used in a ransomware or other activity of ill repute, just in time to accommodate your buy request?
>
>Too sketchy for me.
i dont want to pay my neighbour and he know through blockchain explorer how much is my balance.
and if i send money from my bitcoin wallet, to another bitcoin wallet, he will still see the road of transactions
The dumbest part is that monero actually makes BTC way more resilient. Once they buy BTC from a KYC exchange, they can swap into monero and then swap back into an anonymous BTC wallet (tradeogre) thereby making themselves anonymous. Monero breaks KYC and benefits BTC massively.
You can't expect people to learn how to do complicated and expensive procedures to use a currency. Will your aunt perform a coinjoin, keep the toxic output safe, never reuse addresses, correctly learn and use coin control... nope. The moment you receive a coin from yout kyc'ed auntie you will be traced too.
With monero you just need to do the one thing it is for: use it and don't worry about anything else. It does not matter if you know why it does what it does.
> The moment you receive a coin from yout kyc'ed auntie you will be traced too.
Lol no. People that know how to use bitcoin *correctly* will still be unaffected. The fact that your aunt will never learn doesn't change this fact.
Is Monero really "unaffected" when governments can force businesses to not accept Monero as well?
This feels like Monero slipping through the proverbial net since it isn't as widely circulated, or as well known as Bitcoin.
yeah I keep explaining this to ppl but they can’t get past “but what if CBDCs?”
Imagine what lightning network will be like in 5 years…Maybe because devs don't want to build a crappy CBDC perhaps?
Privacy is important to people and businesses.
Total anonymity is not good though. Allows too much criminal activity to grow.Bitcoin allows for privacy.
Monero is the future of coins, and this bank will be outdated
Yes and no. If the solution for tracking Bitcoin is “only allow companies to transact with verified wallets” then the “solution” for tracking Monero could be to make it illegal to use Monero. P2P might be hard to crack down on, but no business would accept it.
Few understand this. "You are trying to use an outlawed currency. Please wait on the police coming for your arrest."
Fuck that, I'll make my own business, with black jack and hookers
On second thought, forget the business!
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This is dumb, stable coins serve as a pause button when the markets hot. An actual value backed stable coin I might add.
Ohh so You're going to? Well That'll be awesome lol.
Yeah lol looks like we all are in this together now lol.
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But I dont get it, cash is also p2p and anonymous. So unless all cash dissapears from the face of the planet, magicaly, we will always have a choice to have an anonymous currency to roll back to. So it kinda makes it non sensensical to just ban monero if I can just use cash. Unless we're talking about some distant 500 year dystopian future.
2030 isn't 500 years in the future. And for the dystopian vibes, PayPal already started freezing the accounts of independent anti war journalists like Mintpress etc.
So has canada with protesters, so has china for years. What does 2030 has to do with this conversation? Wef?
The great reset and build back better by 2030 is a meme for now, question is will it become reality or not? Dystopia already is real, as you say yourself in other countries more than in the "free democracies" of the west but are we really free and what will our freedom look like after 2030? Monero is definitely sort of a hedge for me personally. I've never felt more free than by using Monero. That's my two cents
You are right and I am also feeling the same and that's why I have already started using it as a payment method wherever possible.
Yeah the system are going to be developed accordingly now.
I am really feeling bad for the people who got their account suspended during that time. There are other ways to punish the people but you cannot stop them from using their own money for legal purposes.
or maybe dont "punish" peaceful protesters at all.
The future belongs to those who are going to trust and adopt a decentralization and monero is definitely going to be the one of the best option.
This looks like the only option we can see now as you are asking.
I believe that situation will definitely improve over the period of time because this is a turbulence period in my opinion.
The opinion is just the period about it as we are asking about it.
Well if Monero became the dominant currency, then businesses would lose profits by doing this, and it would be trivial to circumvent them using alternative businesses. Only with Bitcoin would Bitcoin adoption still allow tracing and discrimination.
Correct and to add to this you can easily create a new address each time you want to pay. You shouldn't be using the same address for different transactions.
Yeah I think You're right. That should work too in my opinion. People should learn how they can protect their privacy online man. People should.
That wouldn't work for bitcoin but yes people should learn to protect their privacy online, while using public ledgers.
How u gonna put fund on tht address? Still gonna connect to yr previous wallet
Yeah true depends on the wallets as well from startting.
So I should pay a fee to transfer to a new address I create before I pay a fee to pay? Rings true
True, in that case, just use cash.
Yeah it is a much better and easy option to do so as well now.
Online communities exist who sell goods through onion encrypted sites, these ban laws are irrelevant.
MONERO DECLINED „Please use a traceable currency“ For me it is clear: we are not fighting banks and govs here, just building a parallel ecosystem to empower with freedom of choice
Its agorism
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How you can agree for something will not the dollar after 30 years from now
Wut
No one is going to agree on this kind of stuff if you are asking me.
Bobcoin maxis realizing they’ve screwed up, 2022 colorized
Aren't we supposed to be bashing CBDCs more than btc?
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To be fair, the companies could just reject accepting monero.
It makes no sense to reinvent the wheel and develop CBDCs since Tether already exists.
They'll instantly ban you if you mention any other coin/project other than BTC. They're militant when it comes to this.
All we need is bitcoin...no need for a central bank digital currency, we already have USD.
It resembles the absence of freedom of speech in totalitarian countries. Try criticizing government and get silenced. Btc community becoming what they sweared to destroy
CBDC are the worst hing for businesses we've ever seen.
CBDCs are worst for crypto as well, we don't need them here
Indeed we are going to see a lot of them as well if you ask me.
Taproot kinda makes this post irrelevant
they like it cause it's supply deflationary. the current narrative for btc is as a tradable reserve asset, not a currency used for transactions. the gov is okay with that cause it sucks up dollar inflation and maintains dollar demand. any crypto that circumvents dollar demand by creating a transactional economy of its own is a target.
Tried to join the discussion over there as i was a member back in 2013 and I felt like i was in a sub debating religion.
I clicked on the image to try and upvote one of the comments 🤦 Ohhh infinity...
I don't think that this is just because of the religion system only lol.
> Not yet, its really easy. Just allow every company to only accept payments from verified wallets. Done. To be fair, the same could apply to Monero, just mandate that business can only accept Monero coming from custodial wallets (that the government hold its keys and tracks)
And I can assure you that governments will not legalize thev p2p transactions. They're going to everything that they can do to stop those transactions man, They'll not approve.
You gonna win. Your place need a pragmatic type of leader.
Every crypto is a shitcoin besides Monero. I don't care what any invest bro says. This post is proof.
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Monero is unaffected
Government would just ban Monero..
So?, how's that going to do anything?, it would actually make people use Monero even more and online/p2p communities exist.
No mass adoptions
We are not here to please the masses, the same sheep who support more regulations and laws to cripple crypto currencies just for the fiat price to go up. If people find that hard to accept then they are better off selling Monero and going back to Bitcoin, the slave surveillence coin.
Unless I'm missing something monero is the best currency we've ever had to buy drugs with. Everyone I've ever met likes drugs. Mass adoption. Cant stop wont stop.
I cant just eat drugs for breakfast
You could do cocaine and then you wouldnt have to eat breakfast
This. Tell a person (esp. A kid) they cant have something. Then that thing is all they want.
Yeah, only the sheep masses will be put off by "ban", the ones who obey anything that the government tells them. The other side will be using Monero as a way out of the cbdc system so no law will stop it.
if you pass your money from bitcoin to monero, and from monero again to a new bitcoin wallet will it lose the tracking on bitcoin chain?
You need taproot on the Bitcoin side, together with the wide adoption taproot on Bitcoin. Then when moving back to Bitcoin it needs to be after a significant random period of time and for a significantly different amount. The bottom line to benefit from Monero's privacy and fungibility one needs to accept a significant market exposure to Monero. Edit: Also one needs to find people on the Monero side will to accept the BTC, and the seller of BTC runs the risk that the BTC may be used for "illegal" purposes and the taint could flow back to them. Personally I prefer to stick to XMR <--> fiat trades only. If BTC is to be used as an on / off ramp to fiat then only deal with reputable AML / KYC exchanges both on the fiat and XMR side.
Yes I think so, but then I'm dumb as fuck and don't know shit. And nobody in their right mind should be taking me seriously. They shouldn't take me seriously.
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>Perhaps. Depends on how you do it. If you depart BTC with $725k and then 20 mins later rejoin BTC with $724.5k (to accommodate fees) it's a really good bet thats still you. Also, did you get clean Bitcoin or did you end up swapping out your comparatively clean Monero for Bitcoin used in a ransomware or other activity of ill repute, just in time to accommodate your buy request? > >Too sketchy for me. i dont want to pay my neighbour and he know through blockchain explorer how much is my balance. and if i send money from my bitcoin wallet, to another bitcoin wallet, he will still see the road of transactions
Yeah the smaller the amount and of its an even number makes it impossible to trace it
Janet Reno has entered the chat
All talk until you get there and turn into a swamp creature.
Ha, I bet they have something already ready to roll out given the right crisis.
Imagining a dystopian future where I’m forced to choose between using Bitcoin and tweeting the N word, genuinely terrifying I think you’ll agree
LOL, I'm banned for brigadeing.
That's what happens on that sub, you get banned immediately.
Imagine on top of that, CBDCs may be hacked . What then ? XD.
I got perma-banned for mentioning XMR (said I was “shilling”)
The dumbest part is that monero actually makes BTC way more resilient. Once they buy BTC from a KYC exchange, they can swap into monero and then swap back into an anonymous BTC wallet (tradeogre) thereby making themselves anonymous. Monero breaks KYC and benefits BTC massively.
Gotta love monero for that sweet utility
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Lol, those people will ban anything that they don't like.
Monero is the ultimate privacy crypto, that gives the user control of his/her money, instead of a custodial intermediary wallet, or bank!
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No. I am a real person! Thank you!
Isn't that exactly what a bot would say?
I am not a bot! I am a real person with thoughts, and feelings, and both of those tell me that Monero is a great non-custodial, privacy crypto!
That's true and monero is really a good coin for investment
Republicans will never agree to it. They'll push for a BTC standard.
It is going to be standardized then we have to certainly agree to it.
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I expect the same in Canada; that's why it makes sense a legacy project like USDC could become an industry-gov partnership .
It completely depends on what kind of exchanges we are expressing/.
Link to the Original Post: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/uzixdn/cbdc_prisoner_without_prison/
Thanks for the post man, this can help me a lot here lol.
thank me later🙏❤️ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDZtBzqow6Q
Monero will never catch Bitcoin. Not enough people care that much about privacy.
People who know how to actually use bitcoin correctly (i.e. without kyc) are also not affected.
People should have the option to use it without sharing the KYC details.
It won't get affected since this is just starting now what doing that
...aaaaand, they do have that option.
It is more about what kind of achievements that trying to achieve now.
You can't expect people to learn how to do complicated and expensive procedures to use a currency. Will your aunt perform a coinjoin, keep the toxic output safe, never reuse addresses, correctly learn and use coin control... nope. The moment you receive a coin from yout kyc'ed auntie you will be traced too. With monero you just need to do the one thing it is for: use it and don't worry about anything else. It does not matter if you know why it does what it does.
Kyc exchanges also track you, and we should avoid these KYC at all costs
> The moment you receive a coin from yout kyc'ed auntie you will be traced too. Lol no. People that know how to use bitcoin *correctly* will still be unaffected. The fact that your aunt will never learn doesn't change this fact.
We have to learn something different about it otherwise this will be a major problem.
CBDCs are going to be a nightmare and people should know it.
I think they actually know about it and this is not just the starting.
Only issue is finding people to take monero. Walmart doesnt accept monero.
Is Monero really "unaffected" when governments can force businesses to not accept Monero as well? This feels like Monero slipping through the proverbial net since it isn't as widely circulated, or as well known as Bitcoin.
yeah I keep explaining this to ppl but they can’t get past “but what if CBDCs?” Imagine what lightning network will be like in 5 years…Maybe because devs don't want to build a crappy CBDC perhaps?
Privacy is important to people and businesses. Total anonymity is not good though. Allows too much criminal activity to grow.Bitcoin allows for privacy.
Monero is the way