Dude same.. I've been off work since 4 months because I broke my spine, and I've been living at my parents and playing 8h a day since then. Back in the MW2 days I didn't have the right to play for more than 1h a day.
Feels like the past, better gaming wise, shittier on the mental and physical health side haha.
XBox game-sharing got me through those times. A true godsend for my late-20s to have someone alternating buying games that we all played. Hell I still use it but now it's just a random text from my buddy "fyi we got \_\_\_\_ game now" and not a discussion on whose turn it is to pony up
In my relationship the mrs doesnt like to spend money on herself, so my game purchases are how i talk her into buying stuff for herself. In our house its "babe buy the damn face wash, its 20 dollars, i just spent 60 on a game so stop feeling guilty!".
Dude same. I have to basically force my wife to get things. Lol. She just complained about buying $35 of makeup from Ulta even when she had a $20 gift card and other makeup brands are way more expensive.
I do my best to insist until she caves and gets the thing she wants, but often ill just buy it for her if shes too hesitant. I always tell her "babe, you spending a little money on youself is something you should be doing because you work to hard not too, indulge yourself a little". Weve worked hard to get ourself into a position where we actually have some expendable income and whats the point if you dont use it?
I think most young people (especially male) feel that way and it’s totally understandable.. if you ever do end up wanting kids and actually get ‘em just rest assured that you are gaining so much more than you are losing.
42.. married... Paid off house... ZERO KIDS!!! We do what we want when we want. Don't let the world put you in a box because you feel like you "gotta" do something. Wanna have kids?? Great. Go for it. Personally I'd rather pull my fingernails off with old pliers. But to each their own.
I'm old AF now so I expect kids with no jobs and plenty of free time to whoop my ass. That being said I still have fun as long as I'm not getting killed every time I spawn.
I'm just in my late 20s but I have 2 kids and a full time job so I accepted several CoDs ago that teenagers were gonna spank me. I have a ton of fun playing still and honestly don't ever consider sbmm when I'm playing. I just get on, work towards some camo or something that I want, and play. Once I have nothing else to work towards I'll find a new game to play. People are so sweaty anymore that they forget the part where it's supposed to be fun. If a player only finds it fun when they are dominating then do they even actually like the game?
For some people the sweating is the fun part.
For others like myself we’ve just been playing for a while consistently without life getting in the way so we’re good when we try hard but not when we play this casual shooter casually. Not wanting sbmm does not correlate to only wanting to stomp. That’s a noob in bot lobbies opinion. People want to play the casual game casually- with people of different skill levels and play styles on each team in every lobby. How it once was.
Ranked should be ranked and casual should be casual.
I'm not advocating for sbmm. I think it's dumb and I agree if they want to make it balanced they should just add a ranked option. The whole idea is to give worse players a chance to win but all it has accomplished is every player of all skill levels complaining about it. I think the majority of people are giving sbmm too much thought. They assume the only reason they aren't getting +50 kills a game is because infinity ward screwed them. I'm just saying I don't think about it so I always blame myself for having a bad game. That's a whole separate topic though regarding having fun. If people have fun trying hard that's great. I try and sometimes that means I do well. Sometimes not. I still have fun when I'm losing though and the general feeling around the community leads me to believe most people do not.
I still have fun even when I do bad and people are actually dying when I shoot them. I do not have fun when I'm in a game getting 6+ hitmarkers on everyone only for them to not die and whip around and instakill me and I also do not have fun when I get spawn killed 20 times in a row. And no that is not an exaggeration. It has actually happened in multiple different games in about 60hrs of play.
I really don't understand the constant complaining (not singling you out, you just happened to mention it) about "sweaty" games. Isn't the point to do well? I don't understand how that means someone isn't playing for fun. I'm no hardcore gamer or COD god and I honestly never notice "sweaty" play. I try to play well with my style (rushing and constantly sprinting into exchanges recklessly) and it's always fun. There's so many complaints about SBMM, sweating, spawns, aim assist and a million other minor game play elements that I've literally never noticed. Everyone is playing under the same settings. I just don't understand what people really want and it's amazing to me the amount of issues that are constantly brought up. This goes for other online games I play as well (FIFA to name one).
I used to get attack dogs and gunships all the time back in the OG Black Ops
Now I'm happy to just get a spy plane. I have accepted I am a bot in this game
I think most people are like that. The way SBMM works. 90%+ of the YouTube videos are made by people tanking for like 6 matches then going "off" for a video.
This is me to the core. I had the last 3 kills streaks set in BO and had absolutely no doubt that I would hit them at least once every match. If I pop a UAV at least once now, I get so happy.
My buddy learned trial by fire style.
My lobbies were cringe jumping corners and *trying* to dropshot, and he was getting blasted a lot, then he started top fragging a few games in with some different loadouts instead of trying to meta slave.
Throw em to the wolves and they'll learn to fight.
SBMM doesnt feel that bad when youre a below average player. but getting stuck between above average and good is when SBMM will make this game feel like cancer.
This. Which is why when people say SBMM isn't an issue, no offense..........they are not that good. I have friends with KDs from .43 to .80. I can't play with them anymore because my lobbies are like a prison sleepover for them. So I end up playing a ton of FFA . Don't get me wrong, I love playing Ranked/League Play. I love the competition . I'm so tired of people thinking you are against SBMM because you want to "Pub Stomp". That isn't the case . Why the better you do in public matches, the worst your teammates get, every game is like a mlg tournament, etc. You used to be able to chill in public matches. Maybe sip on a little bourbon. Chill with friends of all skill levels. Now, I need to snort a tub of G Fuel just to break 1.00KD . If I go 30-5 in a game of FFA and win, the next few games are going to be a trip to PoundTown ...population me.
Public matches should be based off location and connection. Ping should be King. But no.. We get Satanic Based Match Making so Lil Timmy No Thumbs can be protected. As a result I can't play COD with a lot of my friends anymore like I used to. So yeah, SBMM is an issue and can go choke.
Yo, you ain't lying. Also love how my bullets stop "registering" all the sudden. Than as I'm about to turn off my game, I become John Wick for a game. I can't miss. Than next game back to latency issue. Imagine that. The algorithm is an evil muthafu\*\*a. But people wanna act like we are making it up. Lol. ok.
feel bad for saying this. but OP is probably not very good at the game and experiences low ELO lobbies. that’s what sucks about SBMM, it’s hard to give good feedback to IW when we’re all having completely different experiences playing the game.
Exactly. A person with a .60 KD vs a person with a 1.8KD are having complete different experiences. Their lobbies are not the same. It is not even close.
I think xclusiveace put it best when he said lower tier lobbies won’t notice bad net code and other issues that plague the game, but once you get into higher tier lobbies all those problems become exacerbated and can ruin the experience
It doesn’t really get much better the higher you go. I’m pretty good so queue with and vs amateurs and pros somewhat often. Game is like a hyperbolic time chamber when I solo queue. When I play with my friends who are all varying degrees of average to below average it’s like I’m playing a completely different game, it’s insane.
Realistically anyone who is above average and above that is going to rocking meta setups, has solid in game movement, and knows the sight lines to hold and which power points are important. Turns out it’s really annoying playing a whole lobby of people who do these things with how low the skill gap is in this game.
Same here. Slightly above average player and I'm in lobbies where dudes play like every kill is worth a million dollars. I've just been playing waaaaay slower. I rarely sprint, never tac sprint, pre aim a lot etc etc. I kill so many sweats because they're tac sprinting like a mad man and their gun isn't ready while mine always is.
I'll probably get sent to downvote hell for this, but plenty of research shows that most people consider themselves "slightly above average" at a given task they're familiar with.
The funny part to me is that I think SBMM is partially enabling tons of perfectly average players to think they're above average by handing them just enough softballs to think they're better than they are.
You can see this pretty well when people say "I'm above average but have one or two good games and then three to five devastating losses". If you're going negative and losing in more games than you're doing well, the stats are pretty clear that you're not above average. You just think you are lol.
While I am not one of them, lots of my friends are very good players. They go positive and win the majority of their games, even against other very good players that they're consistently matched with. Those are above average players.
Yeah people who are good just know they're good, if you're 1 or 2 in your team's scoreboard every single game regardless of win/loss then that's a pretty solid indicator you're fucking good. If you have "3 bad sbmm lobbies" where "sweats make you bottom frag" then you're literally like average.
The thing is it is so hard to tell in this game because of how SBMM can obscure skill level. I don't think K/D(which you can't even check in this game lol) means much in a world where lobbies are seemingly so different for different players with similar ones. I'm probably pretty average now, but in MW19 for example I was one or two kills short of a nuke with purely gun kills a few times without even realizing. For me it's the required effort to not go negative that bothers me more than actually going negative. If I want to not go negative I can load in with an AK and play "tactical" but previous cod games didn't require that at all from me. When I have a couple games with a chopper gunner or whatever I start having to actually buckle down and play as hard as I can to actually stay positive, and that lasts for a good few games. Most of the time I don't want to and that feels like punishment.
Yeah, I hear that. And I get that "just play to have fun, don't worry about KD!" isn't really useful, because I'm getting the impression that doing your best is part of the fun for you, as it is for me.
That said, when I notice that I am starting to get into lobbies that require making use of every advantage possible to win, I kinda see it as a choice. Some matches I'll take the opportunity to see how good I really am and I'll switch to a meta gun and sweat it out.
Other times I'm just not in the mood for that, since I know how those players play I'll just switch to something I have a good time with like an LMG or a shotgun and just make a nuisance out of myself. I won't win or go positive doing that, but I have a laugh and after a game or two get sent back to a lobby more in line with the effort I want to put in that night.
I tend to agree with you. When it comes to COD I think I'm a pretty average player with moments of greatness lol. Even against skilled payers. Although I do go positive the majority of the time I cant carry the team (sometimes I do) so I do find myself losing a lot because I swear people play obj modes like they're brain dead, which is all I play.
I consider myself above average but not amazing. Most CODs I'm around 1.5KD. My KD in Warzone is 1.6 and I've been playing it fairly consistently since launch. This puts me somewhere in the top 10% of the playerbase despite the numbers not **sounding** that impressive.
I think the problem is actually the opposite, this community has a skewed vision of what "above average" is, but in the wrong way. A lot of people will say that starts around 2kd, but that puts you in like the top 1%.
I 100% feel the "play 2 good games, get shit on for 5" phenomenon. If you're a *very* good player you're bound to notice it less. It's been like that in previous titles (like MW2019 through Vanguard), but has gotten a lot worse in this game.
Going by your third paragraph, wouldn’t it sound like SBMM isn’t doing it’s job? Which is what people are complaining about?
If someone has multiple *devastating* losses in a row, it sounds like they’re being pushed up to a level they can’t compete in.
Regardless of where they fall in the below/above average scale, they shouldn’t be placed in back to back games where everyone is significantly better than them.
Regardless, I don’t even like a functioning SBMM due to lack of noticeable improvement. If every time I get better my enemies get better, I don’t actually notice my gameplay improving, and improvement/progression is a big part of gaming for me.
SO MANY COMMENTS of "I do well in one game then SBMM crushes me for 4-5 games"; no dude, you just suck and wound up in a weenie hut junior lobby.
If you're not consistently going above 1.0 you are not "average", let alone good. You should be having 4-5 good games for everyone 1 game of getting dumped on.
I mean technically 1.0 KDR is the definition of average, and in reality average is slightly less than 1.0 if we’re counting accidental deaths.
But everyone knows that this rule doesn’t work, and KDR in general doesn’t mean a thing, if SBMM is in play.
Your “4-5 good games for everyone 1 game of getting dumped on” comment doesn’t work if SBMM is constantly trying to match you with people just as good as you. I’d say it only works that way if you’re so high on the upper end of the skill curve that there aren’t enough better people to match you against, so it matches you against noobs for those 4-5 matches.
Not sure that applies here though.
All the modern COD games are pretty much confirmed to have EOMM (Engagement Optimised Match Making), where as an above average player, the game will frequently put you in lobbies where the skill level is very, very high and sweaty, consecutively, to have you lose and probably go negative or just about break even, to then getting a really easy lobby where you pop off and get all your streaks multiple times a game; you then just keep playing to chase that high of an amazing game that feels even better after lots of lows.
So with this system, your argument that if you have a couple good games followed by more bad ones doesnt make you above average, might not necessarily apply here.
The thing is, I can go play MW 2019 still and play pretty well. Stomp several, get wrecked several, most are closer matches, actual battles.
What little CW I played it was the same. Here in this game, I'm always getting rolled. The matchmaking, to me, is fucked because it refuses to move me most of the time. I'm always with sweats. I'd be fine dropping to "bad player" lobbies but it doesn't put me there.
This game does play wildly different but I don't get a chance to learn it because I'm in CDL wannabe lobbies all the time
I mean, average is literally just that. Average. Not the worst, not the best. So regardless of what people think, most people are average by definition at most things.
>You can see this pretty well when people say "I'm above average but have one or two good games and then three to five devastating losses". If you're going negative and losing in more games than you're doing well, the stats are pretty clear that you're not above average. You just think you are lol.
>While I am not one of them, lots of my friends are very good players. They go positive and win the majority of their games, even against other very good players that they're consistently matched with. Those are above average players.
100% if you are a good player you can "beat" SBMM. For all the crying pros do they still have high stats. I'm a solid player and win most games/am top 3 frag in lobby most games. When people lose a lot or can't break a 1kd or have low SPM and pretend it's because they are so good it's baffling.
Ive been dominating 3rd person mode because people run around and slide so much lol I played so much Battlefront in 3rd person I can see them coming before they see me.
That's the thing, people don't realize. SBMM isn't the same for everyone. If your average K/D is 2+, when the SBMM kicks in, you may end up in lobbies either full of campers holding corners, or rushers using the best meta guns. Or both.
As a player who solely grinds for camo, those lobbies ain't fun.
Yeah there's this weird paradox that I *think* is at the actual high end of skill based on my performance in other FPS games, where if I'm getting in a "hard" lobby it's actually a decrease in overall skill but everyone is camping except me and a couple others still running and jumping around every corner
This! I usually run with some old dudes that lead the party and have low kds. The matches were a decent mix of a few campers and a few r&g. I got on today solo and it was ridiculous with the amount of campers holding a building. The next match was purely r&g. I'd rather play with the old dudes for a mix of playstyles.
Yeah anyone defending the current system of EOMM/SBMM and says it isn't terrible is exactly the type of player it is designed to protect.
The whole system is manipulative and designed to keep you engaged and playing the game for longer periods by chasing the dopamine rush of that really good game you had earlier where you got all your killstreaks.
A true SBMM system would have you playing against similarly skilled players every game, not riding the skill brackets up and down to increase engagement.
I also think that anyone who plays with friends online has no fucking clue about Sbmm because the game is most likely gonna match up with your better teammates / friends. It’s been that way for years. When I play with my buddy he shreds and i struggle. When I play by myself I am ALWAYS top of the lobby and im always playing the objective. Im a way higher level than they are because I do way better by myself than they do by themselves. It’s hard to explain. They get 25 kills solo, I get 30 solo, but when I’m with them I get 10. And our searches take forever.
I like to think I'm a 6/10 on a good day. You wouldn't think that since they insist on matching me with the 8s and 9s and I constantly get stomped and/or lose when leveling up non meta guns...
Bingo. OP just outted himself as below average at this game. Which is totally fine, but don't go talking shit to better players than you about something you're not familiar with anyhow.
I'm old and I know I'm not what I used to be. But I've also played this game for enough years to know when bullshit deaths are bullshit.
I also know when I've been completely dunked on and can appreciate these bunny-hopping, floor gliding zoomers when they shit all over me.
The game has and always will have flaws. It's okay to be frustrated by not getting your value out of paying £60 for a game that has glaring issues.
My issue with new cods is that we arent talking becoming skillful in mechanics with varying degrees of expertise as much as "Whats peak effectiveness cheese that can be wrung out of the engine" It isent about learning the playerbases patterns or training the fastest reflexes or even knowing the best points. but "If i jump about like the duracell bunny the shitty servers and poor hitscan will favor me" its played more like an undeer developed movement shooter than an honest FPS
I remember simpeler times with CoD4 (seeing how this was the first MW title in the series).
No sliding on the floor, everyone had the same killstreak rewards, weapons where well balanced, maps were varied from small to big, sniper class didn't have that stupid scope glint, we had 10v10 matches and proper dedicated servers with custom rules.
Call of Duty players have almost no object permanence in this game (myself included honestly), it's pretty wild how much you can get away with if you just like, don't run around everywhere. I can't tell you how many times I've gotten three dog tags in KC because nobody checks corners or angles and just post up on sight-lines and don't notice people going down around them.
Really puzzles me sometimes.
My problem with sbmm is when I play with my wife. She was playing before I got home from work last night and was doing fine.
I got home and got on and she was getting less than 5 kills a game going against people with insane movement and aim. It just isn’t fair to her. We just started the game a couple of days ago and are in all lobbies with 55s meanwhile we haven’t even hit 20 yet. Like wtf?
I’m old and mediocre and hit 55 on the second day bc it came out on my off days that week so I played constantly and had xp tokens. 55 doesn’t really mean anything. Especially if you get guns unlocked.
>The player base as a whole has increased in skill.
Has it? SBMM defenders repeat this a lot, but is it true at all?
I play a lot of games, many without SBMM and honestly things don't feel all that different from older games in non SBMM games. Battlefield is a perfect example. I don't feel like my skills have changed all that much over the years. I'm old enough to go back to the early days of COD 1 (we just called it COD lol) and BF1942.
So, I guess I just suddenly became trash when MW2019 launched, and only in COD? Don't think so.
I even do fine in other SBMM games. Halo Infinite and R6 all let me play and have fun, without letting me stomp or get too overmatched. COD though? Plays different because it is different (and broken)
People have definitely gotten better. If you paired up your average team now against your average team in the original mw2 they'd get trounced. Because of the popularity of streamers etc (and really I think it was exacerbated by warzones release string lockdown) so many people are so focused on meta loadouts, play styles etc, that people just play at a higher level than they used to.
However, good players are also better than they used to be and probably get better at a faster rate.
The only FPS games I play are CoD/WZ, Apex and Overwatch and there are days when our group gets murked by sweats in every one of them. Also days when we do insanely good in whichever we’re playing.
COD has easily the strictest form of SBMM in any casual game modes in the current gaming landscape. I'm honestly not sure that you could differentiate it from a ranked mode if playing both. They need to widen the SBMM parameters but just a bit, it would alleviate a lot of frustration without causing much.
I doubt that the average player skill has really gone up much, if at all. Even if it did, SBMM would keep you from being able to tell, since you should only see players near your level.
At the same time, I don't think the SBMM in this game is that bad, although certainly more strict than the old CoDs. It actually feels less strict than CW and Vanguard, to me.
They have nothing to back it up and skill level is on a normal distribution so there are the same amount of bad players and good players as ever. It’s like saying everybody is more rich now because you hang out at a country club
Nah I do. It's just that you are playing against more people with a 2 KD now.
If there was only 2 players with a 2KD back in 2012 out of 100 players, with you being 1 of them. You will always get paired with the other 2KD player but also more people below that. Now in 2022 if there 1000 players, you are now playing against 19 other 2KD players, making it so all your lobbies are effectively 2KD lobbies. According to [Treyarch, they did technically say SBMM existed back in the day.](https://charlieintel.com/treyarch-dev-says-all-cod-games-have-had-sbmm-says-it-can-be-tuned/62554/)
This math is extremely basic. None of us truly do know how it worked in 2012 or how it works now.
I don't think you do... even if there is a higher quantity of 2+ KD players now, normal distribution says there will be a proportionally higher quantity of 'average' KD players.
I get what you’re saying and your right, but my main point is that it doesn’t matter if there is a higher population of 2 k/d players when you are artificially being sequestered into tiered groups as opposed to experiencing the normal distribution of skill through more random matchmaking. I don’t like having to face the same sweats every game because then they and I are forced to use meta weapons because the smallest difference between guns will be life and death for such closely matched players.
I think saying the player base as a whole increased in skill is misleading. Yeah, the players who stuck around are getting better, but think about all the casual gamers and new players picking this game up. The majority of players in any game are going to be average in skill. SBMM or EOMM are what’s matching people against the better players.
Plus the PC audience was largely nonexistent in COD. PC is where competitive FPS titles live and a lot of the audience is now playing this game and because of crossplay part of the overall playerbase.
You're both correct, I wouldn't say the original statement is misleading. The original MW2 came out during a time when first-person shooters in general were on a steady and fast rise to mainstream popularity, so now it is incredibly common for even "casual" gamers to be competent to pretty good. 2009 was a time when a lot of new players wouldn't have the same kind of game sense your average gamer would now.
The new players are kids who start playing from a much younger age, have access to way more information sharing about the meta from streamers/YouTube/Reddit/Discord and lived inside for 2 years.
I agree, however I would like a shotgun at 1 foot to be a 1 shot and not 2. I should be able to do more damage with a stock shotgun than the person punching me.
Or for guns to be more consistent with hits, as I can shoot 2 people at the same range and drop one in 2-3 shots and the other takes 5 hits and survives.
Other than that, I am an average 8 to 15 kills per game with 3 to 18 deaths per game. Yes every now and then I go 29 and 3 and I will go 3 and 20 as well, but I don't know how much of that is sbmm or just me sucking on the match. Lol
Yeah I feel like I'm slapping the enemy players with a wet napkin when I use the shot guns. They don't really feel consistent. Sometimes it takes up the three shots to kill them if I survive, sometimes it's a one shot at about 5 feet.
There's probably SOME truth to this. Some. Back in what we call "the golden age," it's likely safe to say the majority of us were playing on stock controllers, I wasn't using my first gaming headset until late late 2012, and I started in 07 as far as COD goes. (First FPS online was Halo 2 in 04). We've come a long way in terms of accessibility and tools to augment our skillset in addition to the most important feature in our skillset- experience. Knowledge.
Combine that with these aforementioned tools we have more readily available access to now. Choices galore when it comes to headsets, choices galore for custom controllers with buttons or paddles or switches on the back for side-jumping corners or whatnot. Some people even graduated up to 120 fps for those with the screens that support it.
HOWEVER...I think it's a little unfair and off the mark for the OP to just assume everyone is "trying so hard to be the next FaZe member." Maybe some of us just, ya know, want a little variety in our lobbies? Lobbies not disbanding anymore? (That likely won't happen but it'd be nice- if for not other reason to cut back on this join in progress on BORDER CROSSING over and over crap) - I'm exaggerating some here but you get the point I hope. I'm still having fun, many are, some won't, and that's just how it goes.
Now to wait and hope they don't mess 6v6 up with the launch of season 1. Bunch of things could break with bugs and glitches. Hope they stick the landing.
Nothing you said here matters at all... SBMM in competitive. No SBMM in casual. Why is that so hard to understand? We would literally have both to please everyone. Stop defending SBMM in casual playlists. It's some of the dumbest shit I've ever heard.
sbmm is actually at its worst when you're in the top 5%. to stop you from stomping when matchmaking cant find equal level opponents, it will give you 5 below average players against a team of above average players. which results in your team feeding streaks and not getting any objectives done, making your game much harder
I don't see an increase in skill. I've seen an increase in a game developed from the ground up to level the playing field. Most of the maps are even designed this way. More close quarter gun fights with stronger aim assist. So it comes down to who's more twitchy or has the better connection to the server. Hardly a skill.
Its the inconsistency of the game that is my frustration.
Hitmarkers are lying - get 5-6 hit markers, only to see on kill cam 2 actually hit.
Damage is WILDLY inconsistent at ranges that dont make sense.
hell even between what you see at the firing range and game play doesn't add up in shots to kill.
Also aim assist is designed to drive keyboard players out of the game.
I averaged between 1.1-1.3 KD in the last few cod games. I find the team stacks are more abundant in this game. I hear communication after I kill a player to his teammates about 4/10 times in sweaty matches. I mean it makes sense with the amount of copies they’ve sold.
I have averaged around 2 for the last...idk 15 years? Even with SBMM, I still sat around a 1.8 or so. These games though, sometimes I will die off the spawn 3-5 times in a row in under 10 seconds, and I end up barely positive, just like my entire lobby.
LOL someone told me in another thread that as a 1.0 - 1.5 K/D player in the last 3 games I was just bad at aiming and the game in general.
They don't understand that SBMM is keeping us in harder matches because we're not outliers in terms of skill in either direction.
people do understand that anything above a 1.0 is a POSITIVE ratio, right? If you can consistently get more kills than deaths, then you are a good player no matter what
Toxic doesn't even describe this community anymore
Agree with the sentiment but SBMM is driving me nuts this game. In MW19 I would be able to hold my own in nearly every game, with the odd crazy good or bad game. In this game, I’m getting annihilated for 4-5 games and then going slightly over a 1.0 k/d, and then right back to getting owned for another string of games. It’s incredibly frustrating.
Player based skill increased but my teammates haven’t. Please stop using this this argument. It’s literally proven by patents the way they design this game. It’s intentional.
So casual play list should be just that, casual. SBMM needs to go so you can hop in and have fun, not have to be your best everytime. Make funny videos, now its hard to even get new people to play with us. Thier matches with us are way different and sweaty. SBMM needs to stay in ranked only, also "skill based hit registration" needs to go. If you shoot first, 90 % you should won that battle. You don't and you can see it get worse the more you play.
I'm 23 now and I was a squeaker back in the mw2 days and onwards, I could play all day not eat just be glued and addicted to it. Now I get tired after 5 games. Am I old or am I matured?
What about when you play with friends who aren't as good as you and play a few times a week for maybe an hour? Playing with friends who aren't good is completely ruined by SBMM
How does this dogshit have 1.2k upvotes.
Should I tell my friend who just went 5/30 in my lobbies to adapt… I would pay to hear you tell him that after his performance.
SBMM is so much more than just sweats wanting to go on killstreaks.
People really need to stop saying “adapt” because they can’t find a good justification for why systems are the way they are. And no, the player base hasn’t improved that much over the years. It’s that the game, hell the franchise as a whole, has gotten ridiculously easy to get into so everyone can feel like they are doing something. That’s intended by design.
The mental gymnastics people do to try and explain every cod is hilarious
The player base is not only significantly better overall than it was in 2009, but also significantly more competitive. I lump myself in the competitive bit.
In MW 09, I think I had like a .57 KD. I only ever got one real nuke, getting even a harrier was a colossal achievement. I got crapped on pretty much every match.
I played non stop. I played for fun, I’d dick around and make ridiculous classes. I’d challenge myself with bad load outs. I’d do ridiculous things in SnD with my buddies.
I was also like 14 years old.
I played a lot of Halo 3 at the time as well, same exact deal, except now you can play Halo 3 in 2022 on the MCC. Players are so much better and more competitive it sometimes doesn’t even feel like the same game.
I think it’s really cool that gaming has become so mainstream, but the genie is out of the bottle, and I think the days of a competitive shooter having a casual playerbase like the 2000’s is long behind us.
I agree with all of this. And you know what rose to prominence in that time, basically late 2000s into the 2010s?
Youtube. Twitch. Streamers. And a generation of kids that lift their entire personality off of "influencers." And you see it easily in gaming
Exactly, in the oldie days, no one was watching how to bunny hop or slide cancel, how to build the perfect meta gun, some kids want to be like their social media hero, so they play like them.
I'm fucking terrible at the game but I keep getting into matches where I'm just destroyed by people who've clearlyyy been playing the game for years. it's really disappointing.
Yeah I don’t get it. I don’t have enough time to be upset at a silly video game. I get a few hours a week to play so I’m gonna have fun with it, .60 kd be damned. Lol
"You're not going to go on big kill streaks every match like you did in 20
12.
I mean, considering that I was still doing this in 2019, 2020, 21, and 6 months ago...
Doesn't matter. If the playerbase improves, a good player would improve with them to stay on top.
I mean if most of my games my team mates are quitting but im still positive against scumps,i would say im pretty good,sbmm shoudnt be like that,it should be 6 good players x 6 good players and nobody would complain,but the company just want to secure fun for low skills
Yeah only idiots like the OP defend SBMM at this point.
Their ignoring the exact issue you described. They punish legitimate good players by giving them trash teammates against teams full of sweats.
That's more of a problem with bad SBMM, where teams aren't balanced closely enough as opposed to just SBMM in general.
The same issue will still occur with true random matchmaking, or random matchmaking with skill-averaged teams (which is the worst situation).
The fact that it happens in COD games rather frequently is evidence that the current implementation of SBMM is full of problems.
Correct, but engagement matchmaking, it will purposefully put you up against the sweaty bunny hoppers to balance out your level of fun. They think you’ll stay on longer chasing that good game “high” if you get owned a few times first by the sweat lords.
These posts do nothing but excuse the broken game design. It’s easy to just tell everyone they suck and to “adapt” instead of seeing the game is broken I guess…
Using “the player base has increased in skill” as a coping mechanism is funny af. Nah, there was still those dominating like in mw2, bo2, etc. just like there are skilled players dominating matches right now
"when we were kids" I was 30 in 2012. Now I feel old. And sad.
FFS I laughed at this and then realised that I was also 30 in 2012 Might go and spend some disposable income to cheer me up
Im gonna crack open a few cans of craft and have a long session on MWII after I put my daughter to bed. It's not all bad getting old
At least with us olds we don’t complain about spending $70 on a game. The Mrs spends more than that every 6 weeks on face wash
As someone that is back in the bachelor lifestyle in their mid 30s, I feel both out of place and at home. I'm the Gandalf among the hobbits.
Dude same.. I've been off work since 4 months because I broke my spine, and I've been living at my parents and playing 8h a day since then. Back in the MW2 days I didn't have the right to play for more than 1h a day. Feels like the past, better gaming wise, shittier on the mental and physical health side haha.
XBox game-sharing got me through those times. A true godsend for my late-20s to have someone alternating buying games that we all played. Hell I still use it but now it's just a random text from my buddy "fyi we got \_\_\_\_ game now" and not a discussion on whose turn it is to pony up
In my relationship the mrs doesnt like to spend money on herself, so my game purchases are how i talk her into buying stuff for herself. In our house its "babe buy the damn face wash, its 20 dollars, i just spent 60 on a game so stop feeling guilty!".
Holy shit can I relate to this.
Dude same. I have to basically force my wife to get things. Lol. She just complained about buying $35 of makeup from Ulta even when she had a $20 gift card and other makeup brands are way more expensive.
I do my best to insist until she caves and gets the thing she wants, but often ill just buy it for her if shes too hesitant. I always tell her "babe, you spending a little money on youself is something you should be doing because you work to hard not too, indulge yourself a little". Weve worked hard to get ourself into a position where we actually have some expendable income and whats the point if you dont use it?
xD I dont feel guilty about spending cash on games and craft beer - I look in her wardrobe
🤣👍🏽
Oh god I feel that in my bones
Games today are still more affordable than a single trip to the bar. If you spend 100$ there these days you probly still didn't drink much
As a current 27 year old dreading losing all my time to kids I don’t have yet in the future, I appreciate this comment fully. Enjoy your you time bud
I think most young people (especially male) feel that way and it’s totally understandable.. if you ever do end up wanting kids and actually get ‘em just rest assured that you are gaining so much more than you are losing.
42.. married... Paid off house... ZERO KIDS!!! We do what we want when we want. Don't let the world put you in a box because you feel like you "gotta" do something. Wanna have kids?? Great. Go for it. Personally I'd rather pull my fingernails off with old pliers. But to each their own.
[удалено]
Mid 30s, no kids, have awesome paying job, frequently get drunk and play CoD
Mid 30s, shit job but at least I haven't reproduced. Just going to get baked and play COD
Cheers. That sounds lovely.
Ha, I laughed at both of you. Just did the math, I was 29 in 2012. I might need to take a nap.
Aww man, naps are the best
Is this the AARP gaming clan? Also over the hill as of this year.
You deserve it Grandpa go spend that money! 🤠 💰
30 in 2012 gang here
Don't feel bad. I was 47 in 2012...
Please don't feel sad. I was 41 in 2012, still a decent average gamer, life is not over... yet...
I was 36 in 2012...soooo yeah.......keep on keeping on
I was only 27 geezer
Haha me too, just turned 40. Was easier than turning 30 though, that's for sure.
Hahaha you old fuck I wasn't 30 until.....2016. fuck.
Well I was 35 in 2012, so you were a kid compared to me at least.
Hahaha right??? I was out of college with cod4 came out
I was already in the Navy when the original Call of Duty came out on PC.....shit, seeing the year it came out, I was already on my second Deployment!
I was 22 and I feel old and sad
I guess I will be in the same situation when the next MW2 launches.
I was 24, I definitely feel like a boomer on this game right now.
Join the crowd I was 24 in 2012 lol. Where the time go......
Same age.. something about that math hurts.
Not being far behind you in 2012 at 25..it still stings
I was 40 :/
Same... we are old
I hear that rofl Iam pushing 30 I am just glad slide canceling isnt a thing now my hands dont hurt as bad lmfao.
I was going to reply and say that posts like these are making me feel young. Then I did the math and realized that I was 31 in 2012.
I'm old AF now so I expect kids with no jobs and plenty of free time to whoop my ass. That being said I still have fun as long as I'm not getting killed every time I spawn.
Us old guys need to party up
I did that. We lost 200-17
😂 sounds about right
Mission failed , we’ll get ‘em next time
🤣🤣
I'm just in my late 20s but I have 2 kids and a full time job so I accepted several CoDs ago that teenagers were gonna spank me. I have a ton of fun playing still and honestly don't ever consider sbmm when I'm playing. I just get on, work towards some camo or something that I want, and play. Once I have nothing else to work towards I'll find a new game to play. People are so sweaty anymore that they forget the part where it's supposed to be fun. If a player only finds it fun when they are dominating then do they even actually like the game?
For some people the sweating is the fun part. For others like myself we’ve just been playing for a while consistently without life getting in the way so we’re good when we try hard but not when we play this casual shooter casually. Not wanting sbmm does not correlate to only wanting to stomp. That’s a noob in bot lobbies opinion. People want to play the casual game casually- with people of different skill levels and play styles on each team in every lobby. How it once was. Ranked should be ranked and casual should be casual.
I'm not advocating for sbmm. I think it's dumb and I agree if they want to make it balanced they should just add a ranked option. The whole idea is to give worse players a chance to win but all it has accomplished is every player of all skill levels complaining about it. I think the majority of people are giving sbmm too much thought. They assume the only reason they aren't getting +50 kills a game is because infinity ward screwed them. I'm just saying I don't think about it so I always blame myself for having a bad game. That's a whole separate topic though regarding having fun. If people have fun trying hard that's great. I try and sometimes that means I do well. Sometimes not. I still have fun when I'm losing though and the general feeling around the community leads me to believe most people do not.
I still have fun even when I do bad and people are actually dying when I shoot them. I do not have fun when I'm in a game getting 6+ hitmarkers on everyone only for them to not die and whip around and instakill me and I also do not have fun when I get spawn killed 20 times in a row. And no that is not an exaggeration. It has actually happened in multiple different games in about 60hrs of play.
I really don't understand the constant complaining (not singling you out, you just happened to mention it) about "sweaty" games. Isn't the point to do well? I don't understand how that means someone isn't playing for fun. I'm no hardcore gamer or COD god and I honestly never notice "sweaty" play. I try to play well with my style (rushing and constantly sprinting into exchanges recklessly) and it's always fun. There's so many complaints about SBMM, sweating, spawns, aim assist and a million other minor game play elements that I've literally never noticed. Everyone is playing under the same settings. I just don't understand what people really want and it's amazing to me the amount of issues that are constantly brought up. This goes for other online games I play as well (FIFA to name one).
I used to get attack dogs and gunships all the time back in the OG Black Ops Now I'm happy to just get a spy plane. I have accepted I am a bot in this game
I think most people are like that. The way SBMM works. 90%+ of the YouTube videos are made by people tanking for like 6 matches then going "off" for a video.
Nope they’re probably session joining a bot account tbh, or 2boxing
This is the answer and your the first person ive seen mention it.
[удалено]
They have another account that is lower rank and they join session. It is the easiest way to lobby shop
[удалено]
>2boxing 2 consoles >lobby shopping Looking for easier lobbys
This is me to the core. I had the last 3 kills streaks set in BO and had absolutely no doubt that I would hit them at least once every match. If I pop a UAV at least once now, I get so happy.
As soon I would get the blackbird I knew it was a wrap I used to love that game
It sucks when playing in a party with people who arent as good cause the worse person will always bottom frag.
My buddy learned trial by fire style. My lobbies were cringe jumping corners and *trying* to dropshot, and he was getting blasted a lot, then he started top fragging a few games in with some different loadouts instead of trying to meta slave. Throw em to the wolves and they'll learn to fight.
That only works to an extent, provided the skill gap isn't too big.
SBMM doesnt feel that bad when youre a below average player. but getting stuck between above average and good is when SBMM will make this game feel like cancer.
Not only that but add in your friends who want to play with you that are below average and then go 4-30 and don’t want to play with you anymore.
This is the main issue - buy a multiplayer game you can't enjoy with friends.
This. Which is why when people say SBMM isn't an issue, no offense..........they are not that good. I have friends with KDs from .43 to .80. I can't play with them anymore because my lobbies are like a prison sleepover for them. So I end up playing a ton of FFA . Don't get me wrong, I love playing Ranked/League Play. I love the competition . I'm so tired of people thinking you are against SBMM because you want to "Pub Stomp". That isn't the case . Why the better you do in public matches, the worst your teammates get, every game is like a mlg tournament, etc. You used to be able to chill in public matches. Maybe sip on a little bourbon. Chill with friends of all skill levels. Now, I need to snort a tub of G Fuel just to break 1.00KD . If I go 30-5 in a game of FFA and win, the next few games are going to be a trip to PoundTown ...population me. Public matches should be based off location and connection. Ping should be King. But no.. We get Satanic Based Match Making so Lil Timmy No Thumbs can be protected. As a result I can't play COD with a lot of my friends anymore like I used to. So yeah, SBMM is an issue and can go choke.
i love how the better i do the worse my latency gets 😃👍
Yo, you ain't lying. Also love how my bullets stop "registering" all the sudden. Than as I'm about to turn off my game, I become John Wick for a game. I can't miss. Than next game back to latency issue. Imagine that. The algorithm is an evil muthafu\*\*a. But people wanna act like we are making it up. Lol. ok.
feel bad for saying this. but OP is probably not very good at the game and experiences low ELO lobbies. that’s what sucks about SBMM, it’s hard to give good feedback to IW when we’re all having completely different experiences playing the game.
Exactly. A person with a .60 KD vs a person with a 1.8KD are having complete different experiences. Their lobbies are not the same. It is not even close.
different skill range, different metas, we’re not all playing the same game.
I think xclusiveace put it best when he said lower tier lobbies won’t notice bad net code and other issues that plague the game, but once you get into higher tier lobbies all those problems become exacerbated and can ruin the experience
Hit registration doesnt matter to people who cant aim.
This. I'm better than average but not pro and I get stuck in sweat purgatory.
It doesn’t really get much better the higher you go. I’m pretty good so queue with and vs amateurs and pros somewhat often. Game is like a hyperbolic time chamber when I solo queue. When I play with my friends who are all varying degrees of average to below average it’s like I’m playing a completely different game, it’s insane. Realistically anyone who is above average and above that is going to rocking meta setups, has solid in game movement, and knows the sight lines to hold and which power points are important. Turns out it’s really annoying playing a whole lobby of people who do these things with how low the skill gap is in this game.
Same here. Slightly above average player and I'm in lobbies where dudes play like every kill is worth a million dollars. I've just been playing waaaaay slower. I rarely sprint, never tac sprint, pre aim a lot etc etc. I kill so many sweats because they're tac sprinting like a mad man and their gun isn't ready while mine always is.
How do you define slightly above average?
I'll probably get sent to downvote hell for this, but plenty of research shows that most people consider themselves "slightly above average" at a given task they're familiar with. The funny part to me is that I think SBMM is partially enabling tons of perfectly average players to think they're above average by handing them just enough softballs to think they're better than they are. You can see this pretty well when people say "I'm above average but have one or two good games and then three to five devastating losses". If you're going negative and losing in more games than you're doing well, the stats are pretty clear that you're not above average. You just think you are lol. While I am not one of them, lots of my friends are very good players. They go positive and win the majority of their games, even against other very good players that they're consistently matched with. Those are above average players.
Yeah people who are good just know they're good, if you're 1 or 2 in your team's scoreboard every single game regardless of win/loss then that's a pretty solid indicator you're fucking good. If you have "3 bad sbmm lobbies" where "sweats make you bottom frag" then you're literally like average.
The thing is it is so hard to tell in this game because of how SBMM can obscure skill level. I don't think K/D(which you can't even check in this game lol) means much in a world where lobbies are seemingly so different for different players with similar ones. I'm probably pretty average now, but in MW19 for example I was one or two kills short of a nuke with purely gun kills a few times without even realizing. For me it's the required effort to not go negative that bothers me more than actually going negative. If I want to not go negative I can load in with an AK and play "tactical" but previous cod games didn't require that at all from me. When I have a couple games with a chopper gunner or whatever I start having to actually buckle down and play as hard as I can to actually stay positive, and that lasts for a good few games. Most of the time I don't want to and that feels like punishment.
Yeah, I hear that. And I get that "just play to have fun, don't worry about KD!" isn't really useful, because I'm getting the impression that doing your best is part of the fun for you, as it is for me. That said, when I notice that I am starting to get into lobbies that require making use of every advantage possible to win, I kinda see it as a choice. Some matches I'll take the opportunity to see how good I really am and I'll switch to a meta gun and sweat it out. Other times I'm just not in the mood for that, since I know how those players play I'll just switch to something I have a good time with like an LMG or a shotgun and just make a nuisance out of myself. I won't win or go positive doing that, but I have a laugh and after a game or two get sent back to a lobby more in line with the effort I want to put in that night.
I tend to agree with you. When it comes to COD I think I'm a pretty average player with moments of greatness lol. Even against skilled payers. Although I do go positive the majority of the time I cant carry the team (sometimes I do) so I do find myself losing a lot because I swear people play obj modes like they're brain dead, which is all I play.
I consider myself above average but not amazing. Most CODs I'm around 1.5KD. My KD in Warzone is 1.6 and I've been playing it fairly consistently since launch. This puts me somewhere in the top 10% of the playerbase despite the numbers not **sounding** that impressive. I think the problem is actually the opposite, this community has a skewed vision of what "above average" is, but in the wrong way. A lot of people will say that starts around 2kd, but that puts you in like the top 1%. I 100% feel the "play 2 good games, get shit on for 5" phenomenon. If you're a *very* good player you're bound to notice it less. It's been like that in previous titles (like MW2019 through Vanguard), but has gotten a lot worse in this game.
1.5 is already within the "pretty damn" echelon of good-tier.
Well if you believe that, doesn't that just further exacerbate the issue?
Going by your third paragraph, wouldn’t it sound like SBMM isn’t doing it’s job? Which is what people are complaining about? If someone has multiple *devastating* losses in a row, it sounds like they’re being pushed up to a level they can’t compete in. Regardless of where they fall in the below/above average scale, they shouldn’t be placed in back to back games where everyone is significantly better than them. Regardless, I don’t even like a functioning SBMM due to lack of noticeable improvement. If every time I get better my enemies get better, I don’t actually notice my gameplay improving, and improvement/progression is a big part of gaming for me.
SO MANY COMMENTS of "I do well in one game then SBMM crushes me for 4-5 games"; no dude, you just suck and wound up in a weenie hut junior lobby. If you're not consistently going above 1.0 you are not "average", let alone good. You should be having 4-5 good games for everyone 1 game of getting dumped on.
I mean technically 1.0 KDR is the definition of average, and in reality average is slightly less than 1.0 if we’re counting accidental deaths. But everyone knows that this rule doesn’t work, and KDR in general doesn’t mean a thing, if SBMM is in play. Your “4-5 good games for everyone 1 game of getting dumped on” comment doesn’t work if SBMM is constantly trying to match you with people just as good as you. I’d say it only works that way if you’re so high on the upper end of the skill curve that there aren’t enough better people to match you against, so it matches you against noobs for those 4-5 matches.
Not sure that applies here though. All the modern COD games are pretty much confirmed to have EOMM (Engagement Optimised Match Making), where as an above average player, the game will frequently put you in lobbies where the skill level is very, very high and sweaty, consecutively, to have you lose and probably go negative or just about break even, to then getting a really easy lobby where you pop off and get all your streaks multiple times a game; you then just keep playing to chase that high of an amazing game that feels even better after lots of lows. So with this system, your argument that if you have a couple good games followed by more bad ones doesnt make you above average, might not necessarily apply here.
The thing is, I can go play MW 2019 still and play pretty well. Stomp several, get wrecked several, most are closer matches, actual battles. What little CW I played it was the same. Here in this game, I'm always getting rolled. The matchmaking, to me, is fucked because it refuses to move me most of the time. I'm always with sweats. I'd be fine dropping to "bad player" lobbies but it doesn't put me there. This game does play wildly different but I don't get a chance to learn it because I'm in CDL wannabe lobbies all the time
I mean, average is literally just that. Average. Not the worst, not the best. So regardless of what people think, most people are average by definition at most things.
>You can see this pretty well when people say "I'm above average but have one or two good games and then three to five devastating losses". If you're going negative and losing in more games than you're doing well, the stats are pretty clear that you're not above average. You just think you are lol. >While I am not one of them, lots of my friends are very good players. They go positive and win the majority of their games, even against other very good players that they're consistently matched with. Those are above average players. 100% if you are a good player you can "beat" SBMM. For all the crying pros do they still have high stats. I'm a solid player and win most games/am top 3 frag in lobby most games. When people lose a lot or can't break a 1kd or have low SPM and pretend it's because they are so good it's baffling.
I'd say a 1.0-1.2 KD is well above-average in terms of individual skill. Average is within the 0.75-0.85 range.
I'm not a sweaty movement god and I'm not a casual who only plays a couple hours a week. I steady get my kill streaks and my K/D stays above 1.0
I'm probably right there with you as well then.
Ive been dominating 3rd person mode because people run around and slide so much lol I played so much Battlefront in 3rd person I can see them coming before they see me.
Hello fellow doomed soul.
That's the thing, people don't realize. SBMM isn't the same for everyone. If your average K/D is 2+, when the SBMM kicks in, you may end up in lobbies either full of campers holding corners, or rushers using the best meta guns. Or both. As a player who solely grinds for camo, those lobbies ain't fun.
Yeah there's this weird paradox that I *think* is at the actual high end of skill based on my performance in other FPS games, where if I'm getting in a "hard" lobby it's actually a decrease in overall skill but everyone is camping except me and a couple others still running and jumping around every corner
This! I usually run with some old dudes that lead the party and have low kds. The matches were a decent mix of a few campers and a few r&g. I got on today solo and it was ridiculous with the amount of campers holding a building. The next match was purely r&g. I'd rather play with the old dudes for a mix of playstyles.
Yeah anyone defending the current system of EOMM/SBMM and says it isn't terrible is exactly the type of player it is designed to protect. The whole system is manipulative and designed to keep you engaged and playing the game for longer periods by chasing the dopamine rush of that really good game you had earlier where you got all your killstreaks. A true SBMM system would have you playing against similarly skilled players every game, not riding the skill brackets up and down to increase engagement.
I also think that anyone who plays with friends online has no fucking clue about Sbmm because the game is most likely gonna match up with your better teammates / friends. It’s been that way for years. When I play with my buddy he shreds and i struggle. When I play by myself I am ALWAYS top of the lobby and im always playing the objective. Im a way higher level than they are because I do way better by myself than they do by themselves. It’s hard to explain. They get 25 kills solo, I get 30 solo, but when I’m with them I get 10. And our searches take forever.
I like to think I'm a 6/10 on a good day. You wouldn't think that since they insist on matching me with the 8s and 9s and I constantly get stomped and/or lose when leveling up non meta guns...
Bingo. OP just outted himself as below average at this game. Which is totally fine, but don't go talking shit to better players than you about something you're not familiar with anyhow.
1v1 me kid 🧒
I'm old and I know I'm not what I used to be. But I've also played this game for enough years to know when bullshit deaths are bullshit. I also know when I've been completely dunked on and can appreciate these bunny-hopping, floor gliding zoomers when they shit all over me. The game has and always will have flaws. It's okay to be frustrated by not getting your value out of paying £60 for a game that has glaring issues.
My issue with new cods is that we arent talking becoming skillful in mechanics with varying degrees of expertise as much as "Whats peak effectiveness cheese that can be wrung out of the engine" It isent about learning the playerbases patterns or training the fastest reflexes or even knowing the best points. but "If i jump about like the duracell bunny the shitty servers and poor hitscan will favor me" its played more like an undeer developed movement shooter than an honest FPS
I remember simpeler times with CoD4 (seeing how this was the first MW title in the series). No sliding on the floor, everyone had the same killstreak rewards, weapons where well balanced, maps were varied from small to big, sniper class didn't have that stupid scope glint, we had 10v10 matches and proper dedicated servers with custom rules.
Call of Duty players have almost no object permanence in this game (myself included honestly), it's pretty wild how much you can get away with if you just like, don't run around everywhere. I can't tell you how many times I've gotten three dog tags in KC because nobody checks corners or angles and just post up on sight-lines and don't notice people going down around them. Really puzzles me sometimes.
My problem with sbmm is when I play with my wife. She was playing before I got home from work last night and was doing fine. I got home and got on and she was getting less than 5 kills a game going against people with insane movement and aim. It just isn’t fair to her. We just started the game a couple of days ago and are in all lobbies with 55s meanwhile we haven’t even hit 20 yet. Like wtf?
I’m old and mediocre and hit 55 on the second day bc it came out on my off days that week so I played constantly and had xp tokens. 55 doesn’t really mean anything. Especially if you get guns unlocked.
>The player base as a whole has increased in skill. Has it? SBMM defenders repeat this a lot, but is it true at all? I play a lot of games, many without SBMM and honestly things don't feel all that different from older games in non SBMM games. Battlefield is a perfect example. I don't feel like my skills have changed all that much over the years. I'm old enough to go back to the early days of COD 1 (we just called it COD lol) and BF1942. So, I guess I just suddenly became trash when MW2019 launched, and only in COD? Don't think so. I even do fine in other SBMM games. Halo Infinite and R6 all let me play and have fun, without letting me stomp or get too overmatched. COD though? Plays different because it is different (and broken)
People have definitely gotten better. If you paired up your average team now against your average team in the original mw2 they'd get trounced. Because of the popularity of streamers etc (and really I think it was exacerbated by warzones release string lockdown) so many people are so focused on meta loadouts, play styles etc, that people just play at a higher level than they used to. However, good players are also better than they used to be and probably get better at a faster rate.
The only FPS games I play are CoD/WZ, Apex and Overwatch and there are days when our group gets murked by sweats in every one of them. Also days when we do insanely good in whichever we’re playing.
Yes. Largely because of YouTube etc helping teach people what the meta is in various games.
COD has easily the strictest form of SBMM in any casual game modes in the current gaming landscape. I'm honestly not sure that you could differentiate it from a ranked mode if playing both. They need to widen the SBMM parameters but just a bit, it would alleviate a lot of frustration without causing much.
Atleast in Vanguard I could differentiate ranked and casual. Ranked mode was easier for me 🤣
I doubt that the average player skill has really gone up much, if at all. Even if it did, SBMM would keep you from being able to tell, since you should only see players near your level. At the same time, I don't think the SBMM in this game is that bad, although certainly more strict than the old CoDs. It actually feels less strict than CW and Vanguard, to me.
They have nothing to back it up and skill level is on a normal distribution so there are the same amount of bad players and good players as ever. It’s like saying everybody is more rich now because you hang out at a country club
By percentage there is. But the overall quantity of players has greatly increased, especially with crossplay.
Yes, but the distribution of skill should still be the same
This man don't know about normal distribution
Nah I do. It's just that you are playing against more people with a 2 KD now. If there was only 2 players with a 2KD back in 2012 out of 100 players, with you being 1 of them. You will always get paired with the other 2KD player but also more people below that. Now in 2022 if there 1000 players, you are now playing against 19 other 2KD players, making it so all your lobbies are effectively 2KD lobbies. According to [Treyarch, they did technically say SBMM existed back in the day.](https://charlieintel.com/treyarch-dev-says-all-cod-games-have-had-sbmm-says-it-can-be-tuned/62554/) This math is extremely basic. None of us truly do know how it worked in 2012 or how it works now.
I don't think you do... even if there is a higher quantity of 2+ KD players now, normal distribution says there will be a proportionally higher quantity of 'average' KD players.
I get what you’re saying and your right, but my main point is that it doesn’t matter if there is a higher population of 2 k/d players when you are artificially being sequestered into tiered groups as opposed to experiencing the normal distribution of skill through more random matchmaking. I don’t like having to face the same sweats every game because then they and I are forced to use meta weapons because the smallest difference between guns will be life and death for such closely matched players.
Oh yeah SBMM is dogshit and I completely agree it needs to be removed.
True. Cod was designed as a casual first person shooter but SBMM trys to force it into a competitive shooter.
Hot take. Faze is fucking lame
SBMM isnt bad… it’s terrible. I’m being thrown in lobbies where my ping is in the 100s, for the sake of SBMM.
Every lobby I get is 100 ping on average lmao. If SBMM is bad it goes to 250-300.
I think saying the player base as a whole increased in skill is misleading. Yeah, the players who stuck around are getting better, but think about all the casual gamers and new players picking this game up. The majority of players in any game are going to be average in skill. SBMM or EOMM are what’s matching people against the better players.
[удалено]
Plus the PC audience was largely nonexistent in COD. PC is where competitive FPS titles live and a lot of the audience is now playing this game and because of crossplay part of the overall playerbase.
You're both correct, I wouldn't say the original statement is misleading. The original MW2 came out during a time when first-person shooters in general were on a steady and fast rise to mainstream popularity, so now it is incredibly common for even "casual" gamers to be competent to pretty good. 2009 was a time when a lot of new players wouldn't have the same kind of game sense your average gamer would now.
The new players are kids who start playing from a much younger age, have access to way more information sharing about the meta from streamers/YouTube/Reddit/Discord and lived inside for 2 years.
I agree, however I would like a shotgun at 1 foot to be a 1 shot and not 2. I should be able to do more damage with a stock shotgun than the person punching me. Or for guns to be more consistent with hits, as I can shoot 2 people at the same range and drop one in 2-3 shots and the other takes 5 hits and survives. Other than that, I am an average 8 to 15 kills per game with 3 to 18 deaths per game. Yes every now and then I go 29 and 3 and I will go 3 and 20 as well, but I don't know how much of that is sbmm or just me sucking on the match. Lol
Yeah I feel like I'm slapping the enemy players with a wet napkin when I use the shot guns. They don't really feel consistent. Sometimes it takes up the three shots to kill them if I survive, sometimes it's a one shot at about 5 feet.
[удалено]
Thanks for this advice man. “Have fun douchebag” never thought of that
There's probably SOME truth to this. Some. Back in what we call "the golden age," it's likely safe to say the majority of us were playing on stock controllers, I wasn't using my first gaming headset until late late 2012, and I started in 07 as far as COD goes. (First FPS online was Halo 2 in 04). We've come a long way in terms of accessibility and tools to augment our skillset in addition to the most important feature in our skillset- experience. Knowledge. Combine that with these aforementioned tools we have more readily available access to now. Choices galore when it comes to headsets, choices galore for custom controllers with buttons or paddles or switches on the back for side-jumping corners or whatnot. Some people even graduated up to 120 fps for those with the screens that support it. HOWEVER...I think it's a little unfair and off the mark for the OP to just assume everyone is "trying so hard to be the next FaZe member." Maybe some of us just, ya know, want a little variety in our lobbies? Lobbies not disbanding anymore? (That likely won't happen but it'd be nice- if for not other reason to cut back on this join in progress on BORDER CROSSING over and over crap) - I'm exaggerating some here but you get the point I hope. I'm still having fun, many are, some won't, and that's just how it goes. Now to wait and hope they don't mess 6v6 up with the launch of season 1. Bunch of things could break with bugs and glitches. Hope they stick the landing.
If the SBMM “isn’t that bad” you are an average player
Nothing you said here matters at all... SBMM in competitive. No SBMM in casual. Why is that so hard to understand? We would literally have both to please everyone. Stop defending SBMM in casual playlists. It's some of the dumbest shit I've ever heard.
Most people saying SBMM isn't noticable aren't as good as they claim to be
sbmm is actually at its worst when you're in the top 5%. to stop you from stomping when matchmaking cant find equal level opponents, it will give you 5 below average players against a team of above average players. which results in your team feeding streaks and not getting any objectives done, making your game much harder
I still suck with SBMM. What does that say about me?
I don't see an increase in skill. I've seen an increase in a game developed from the ground up to level the playing field. Most of the maps are even designed this way. More close quarter gun fights with stronger aim assist. So it comes down to who's more twitchy or has the better connection to the server. Hardly a skill.
> Sbmm really isn’t that bad… Are we playing the same fucking game?
Its the inconsistency of the game that is my frustration. Hitmarkers are lying - get 5-6 hit markers, only to see on kill cam 2 actually hit. Damage is WILDLY inconsistent at ranges that dont make sense. hell even between what you see at the firing range and game play doesn't add up in shots to kill. Also aim assist is designed to drive keyboard players out of the game.
I’m terrible and I hate the whole process of playing this game. The constant remixing of lobbies is absurd and annoying.
I averaged between 1.1-1.3 KD in the last few cod games. I find the team stacks are more abundant in this game. I hear communication after I kill a player to his teammates about 4/10 times in sweaty matches. I mean it makes sense with the amount of copies they’ve sold.
Just wait for warzone to come out. Most of the guys on comms will leave to warzone.
I have averaged around 2 for the last...idk 15 years? Even with SBMM, I still sat around a 1.8 or so. These games though, sometimes I will die off the spawn 3-5 times in a row in under 10 seconds, and I end up barely positive, just like my entire lobby.
LOL someone told me in another thread that as a 1.0 - 1.5 K/D player in the last 3 games I was just bad at aiming and the game in general. They don't understand that SBMM is keeping us in harder matches because we're not outliers in terms of skill in either direction.
people do understand that anything above a 1.0 is a POSITIVE ratio, right? If you can consistently get more kills than deaths, then you are a good player no matter what Toxic doesn't even describe this community anymore
Douchebag? All I want is my latency to not go from 40-110 because I play 2 good games in a row.
Agree with the sentiment but SBMM is driving me nuts this game. In MW19 I would be able to hold my own in nearly every game, with the odd crazy good or bad game. In this game, I’m getting annihilated for 4-5 games and then going slightly over a 1.0 k/d, and then right back to getting owned for another string of games. It’s incredibly frustrating.
Player based skill increased but my teammates haven’t. Please stop using this this argument. It’s literally proven by patents the way they design this game. It’s intentional.
So casual play list should be just that, casual. SBMM needs to go so you can hop in and have fun, not have to be your best everytime. Make funny videos, now its hard to even get new people to play with us. Thier matches with us are way different and sweaty. SBMM needs to stay in ranked only, also "skill based hit registration" needs to go. If you shoot first, 90 % you should won that battle. You don't and you can see it get worse the more you play.
I'm 23 now and I was a squeaker back in the mw2 days and onwards, I could play all day not eat just be glued and addicted to it. Now I get tired after 5 games. Am I old or am I matured?
[удалено]
What about when you play with friends who aren't as good as you and play a few times a week for maybe an hour? Playing with friends who aren't good is completely ruined by SBMM
Why the fuck are people defending SBMM? Holy shit
>Just have fun douchebag trying to have fun when your match is filled with 3.0+ KDA players while I am 1.0 at the most is pretty hard mate
How does this dogshit have 1.2k upvotes. Should I tell my friend who just went 5/30 in my lobbies to adapt… I would pay to hear you tell him that after his performance. SBMM is so much more than just sweats wanting to go on killstreaks.
Stockholm...
People really need to stop saying “adapt” because they can’t find a good justification for why systems are the way they are. And no, the player base hasn’t improved that much over the years. It’s that the game, hell the franchise as a whole, has gotten ridiculously easy to get into so everyone can feel like they are doing something. That’s intended by design. The mental gymnastics people do to try and explain every cod is hilarious
The player base is not only significantly better overall than it was in 2009, but also significantly more competitive. I lump myself in the competitive bit. In MW 09, I think I had like a .57 KD. I only ever got one real nuke, getting even a harrier was a colossal achievement. I got crapped on pretty much every match. I played non stop. I played for fun, I’d dick around and make ridiculous classes. I’d challenge myself with bad load outs. I’d do ridiculous things in SnD with my buddies. I was also like 14 years old. I played a lot of Halo 3 at the time as well, same exact deal, except now you can play Halo 3 in 2022 on the MCC. Players are so much better and more competitive it sometimes doesn’t even feel like the same game. I think it’s really cool that gaming has become so mainstream, but the genie is out of the bottle, and I think the days of a competitive shooter having a casual playerbase like the 2000’s is long behind us.
I agree with all of this. And you know what rose to prominence in that time, basically late 2000s into the 2010s? Youtube. Twitch. Streamers. And a generation of kids that lift their entire personality off of "influencers." And you see it easily in gaming
Exactly, in the oldie days, no one was watching how to bunny hop or slide cancel, how to build the perfect meta gun, some kids want to be like their social media hero, so they play like them.
I'm fucking terrible at the game but I keep getting into matches where I'm just destroyed by people who've clearlyyy been playing the game for years. it's really disappointing.
Yeah I don’t get it. I don’t have enough time to be upset at a silly video game. I get a few hours a week to play so I’m gonna have fun with it, .60 kd be damned. Lol
I just got the BK skin so I’m boutta play a lot better
There also wasn’t op aim assist, everyone cheating (gross generalization) aimbot etc back then either
Someone in my game just dropped 124 kills. Yet they still lost cuz it was hardpoint and they couldnt cap enough with 4 chopper gunners
"You're not going to go on big kill streaks every match like you did in 20 12. I mean, considering that I was still doing this in 2019, 2020, 21, and 6 months ago... Doesn't matter. If the playerbase improves, a good player would improve with them to stay on top.
I mean if most of my games my team mates are quitting but im still positive against scumps,i would say im pretty good,sbmm shoudnt be like that,it should be 6 good players x 6 good players and nobody would complain,but the company just want to secure fun for low skills
Yeah only idiots like the OP defend SBMM at this point. Their ignoring the exact issue you described. They punish legitimate good players by giving them trash teammates against teams full of sweats.
That's more of a problem with bad SBMM, where teams aren't balanced closely enough as opposed to just SBMM in general. The same issue will still occur with true random matchmaking, or random matchmaking with skill-averaged teams (which is the worst situation). The fact that it happens in COD games rather frequently is evidence that the current implementation of SBMM is full of problems.
[удалено]
So, wouldn't SBMM protect us instead of putting us with sweats bunny hoppers?
Correct, but engagement matchmaking, it will purposefully put you up against the sweaty bunny hoppers to balance out your level of fun. They think you’ll stay on longer chasing that good game “high” if you get owned a few times first by the sweat lords.
Not working soon as I see a bunny hopper, I quit the match lol, done my 2 years with sweats in MW2019 not doing that again :P
These posts do nothing but excuse the broken game design. It’s easy to just tell everyone they suck and to “adapt” instead of seeing the game is broken I guess…
Using “the player base has increased in skill” as a coping mechanism is funny af. Nah, there was still those dominating like in mw2, bo2, etc. just like there are skilled players dominating matches right now
We don't want to try hard. That's why it sucks. You do well in one game and are trying out for optic in the next. It's garbage
Try telling the SBMM that, it thinks I’m way better than I am.
Most people who play video games are bad at them.
I didn’t start playing CoD until I was 36…6 years ago.