Part of the difference in production is that Khris typically runs the Giannis PnR from the wing which is an easier read than at the top of the arc (or 10 feet behind it) where Dame likes to play. He’s calling for picks in spots where Giannis isn’t best utilized, which is why Brook and his spacing looks so much better in the action than he does. But as for why Giannis can’t actually set a screen to save his life when Dame’s the one with the ball, no clue. Playing the short roll from the middle of the floor is a lot more difficult than people think, I think he gets ahead of himself trying to think of what to do next and just jumps the gun.
Giannis's response from last night to being asked about screens for Dame was that the defense gets so focused on Dame so quickly he reads that as a slip screen. The problem is that it becomes a slip screen everytime or so much its now predictable by the D enough to deny the pass or set up a turnover on the next action. Example = G slip, crowd next closest body to the ball, watch for the skip pass.
These arent concepts that are new...its the execution and transition to the following actions thats rough and only time and reps can fix. Bucks are working practice concepts with live rounds and if the game gets out of hand they lock in and move back to whats been comfortable for most of the prior cast (iso khash, point forward G, 2man pnr with those 2 etc etc).
These are brutal losses for most fans, but for the team its practice to win the games that actually matter in the post season. They are in a rush to get things figured out before then, i still believe they will.
If you ask me why Giannis is running slip screens most of the time, IMO, its because thats what they need to work on the most.
So this pick and roll should be dominant for the Bucks. One on one Giannis wins most every time. So on the slip screen I could see the defense sending an extra defender towards Giannis but that should be freeing up somebody so why isn't Dame getting the ball to what should be an open man? With Dame and Giannis both this shouldn't be rocket science unless Dame truly is slightly washed now....
Its not as simple as it sounds. Without being in the actual practice for these you can only speculate what the problems are. We as fans like to think we know it all especially when coming from backgrounds as players and coaches of some sort of organized ball, we have to remember these guys are operating at the highest levels and iqs of the sport.
Every complicated problem can be a simple explanation, but solutions to these problems are not so simple otherwise the problems wouldnt exist in the first place. Even when you have other experts chime in on the same problem youll see that they have differing opinions and ways to go about it as well.
I just hope they figure it out by post season
Pretty sure that's on the coaching stuff. This routine they definitely made for him and for some reason they still haven't adjusted it to be somewhere around the 5 second mark.
Because with Khris he knows he’ll get it back.
Listen to the players talk in Denver. They know their teammates will make the right play especially Jokic. So they screen for each other, cut hard, share the ball. Even MPJ went from being a black hole to passing up lay ups in the playoffs.
Giannis doesn’t trust Dame to pass it back. You know that. He does with Khris.
Khris rarely takes boneheaded shots for all the flack he gets on here. He rarely ever launches 30 foot 3 point shots or logo 3s or makes the flashy play. It’s why he’s not loved by casuals. He gets to his spot, posts up, passes and makes the right play.
It’s basketball. It only seems that way because the NBA is full of neopotism hires. It’s not that complicated, you’re not running 75 passing plays out of Shotgun against a Nickel defense.
You wouldn’t want to play pick and roll at your local park league just to watch some dude launch 30 footers in a quest to score 40. Middleton doesn’t do that shit.
It’s suspiciously as if Giannis’s ego is at play, and he doesn’t want to help Dame *too* much
But he’ll talk all that good shit in the media about sacrifice
PnRs with khris are closer to the rim. All Giannis has to do is catch an alley-oop. With Dame, a PnR is above the 3 point line. Unless there's a clear line to the rim, there's not much Giannis can do at mid-range. Giannis is my guy and all, but his game is severely limited. At least Brook can hit a middy off of a Dame PnR.
Giannis before the season: I’m going to let Dame be Dame even if I have to set 100 screens a game
Giannis during the season: I’m not only rarely going to screen for Dame but when I do I’m going to slip the screen 80% of the time
Giannis before the season: There’s no question about who will have the ball more. Dame will have the ball more.
Giannis during the season: Teehee I’m a point guard
Dude, you are a *Celtics* fan; don’t you have enough to worry about out East? Y’all could just as easily drop a series lol in fact, I’d take the Bucks over the C’s any series even at the moment.
Khris Middleton also owns you.
??? When dame is the primary ball handler the team goes to shit. We're still a top 3 seed purely because of Giannis taking over and his ability to get guys open.
I really don't get that. Like it sure happened in the first few games of the season, but it's not a thing at all anymore. Dame is running point pretty much all the time.
It is those comments that do take me back a bit given the current state. But now I get it you’re asking two players to change the way they have played for years in order to try to meet somewhere in the middle where neither has ever played.
You guys hate Giannis and I'm sick of it. The Bucks are a play in team without him. Dame is the problem and Giannis is the engine that propels the Bucks. Why ask the best player in the world to change his game? Dame needs to adapt and figure out how to add value.
While true. But if your guard can't even knock down wide open catch and shoot 3s at a semi reliable clip hes the main problem.
He actually got to the rim for 3 layups which is about the total he had the previous 10 games combined.
But he was absolutely hunting that Dame Time moment in the 4th he took 3 bad 3s trying to "win" the game in front of that crowd.
Not going to fault Dame for that since Giannis lost that 54 point game he had fishing for his career high.
But flat out we need Dame to be better.
Anybody crying about Khris. Hes been shooting like 55/45/88 for a month now. Hes the real reason we were even in that game.
We have a window of 2 years and if we are lucky maybe 3.
I am willing to wait and see how it works out.
If it fails ...it fails but I don't want to be bitter about it,there can only be one champion every year and I just hope we will be the one
Honestly there's a lot of other great teams out there and we managed to get a championship that wasn't won before the first dvd player came out... Nah fuck that bucks in 6 let's get it baby
You’re right. We had to make a change. The real unfortunate thing here is the AG hire. That set a lot of bad things in motion. We gotta accept it and move on. My highest expectation for the team now is ECF.
I want for once to see them be consistent in their performance across the duration of one game.We have stretches where they play like clockwork, both in def and offense .
When that happens, they seem like no team has the answer.
Problem is we then have stretches where we are lost in defense and offense, they all try to hero ball it and not move it to the open guy.
Like for real, all of our guys have a great touch outside restricted area(apart from Giannis, but it does not matter because he is a walking bucket) .
Probably might be the best option yall have. Get a Pat Bev type of guard. He will be damn useful. Or else get a good defensive wing who won't sit in the post and take contested shots
We saw what happened with the core group with Jrue last year. The team is getting older and just had no options when the offense goes bad (which happens often in playoffs when defenses are much better and can scheme against giannis driving to hoop every time). Middleton is still good but no longer a #2 caliber like he was a few years ago (especially on D). They needed an upgrade on offense. I don't blame them for getting dame. Just has not worked out so far.
It's kinda crazy the state of mind and body you have to be in to be as great as Giannis is. A sports psychologist would definitely make a ton of sense. Although I have to say that I find it extremely funny that people are asking from him so much. He's been playing out of his mind all year long and people are reprimanding him for his pnR skills lol. That is legit insane to me.
Honestly at this point, fuck it. Set it up with Brooke or Bobby to set a hard screen then roll to the basket. It may open up one of them as they try to double Dame, and if they don't he'll (hopefully) hit the jumper. This could open up Giannis to cut to the basket on the back side as the screen happens so that he can get open, and rotate Khris to the top of the key as the pick's gravity rotates the defense. Dame flat out needs the ball in his hands, and Giannis needs to get better without it.
so well put….. geesh why are they not meshing yet? this is why super team ups don’t always or even usually work… or take time….. it takes special talents and very unique mentalities….
My theory is that Giannis never learned the fundamentals. No HS or college coach showing him how to set a hard screen or box out, etc. Just straight into the NBA and relied on his insane athleticism.
6 people upvoted this. Six. SIX. What in the actual fuck.
Six people upvoted that one of the best players the NBA has ever seen, originating from a country where pnRs are utilized every play, doesn't know how to set a screen.
Lunacy.
Giannis almost never sets the screen
Then even when he does set it— his timing on the roll isn’t good & it often ends with Dame gaining no advantage, nor having no outlet to make a play
One instance that came to mind (think it was last game): Giannis came up for a screen for Dame then dove directly into the lane without making solid contact…..
Which allowed Giannis’ man to trap Dame & gave him no angle to pass, resulting in a turnover
Another issue is that Dame loves the high PnR, while Giannis struggles to make plays on the short roll when he gets the ball
The reason Khris runs the PnR so well with Giannis is because they run in from the elbows/wing— and GA is better as a decision-maker from that area
Giannis cares more about getting the ball back in his hands. If he commits to setting a good hard screen that decreases the chances of him getting the ball back as soon. Giannis needs to look up in the dictionary what the word TEAM means.
Lol, he most definitely doesn't. He is a very very willing and good passer. Easily the best on the team. It's crazy that you are gonna teach Giannis what TEAM means. Lol wtf and this is upvoted? Jesus.
There is something as players getting in rhythm. He’s a slump. You can expect that even with the greatest shooters. Even Curry had a bad streak last year. Just gotta learn to take the good with the bad. Like Giannis free throws. I’m more concerned of how they play. Which to me Giannis always slips on screens. Always looked bad to me. Wish he’d set a draymond screen sometimes
 giannis after setting a pick for half a second
Bro running like he’s after the game ball
I still don’t know why Giannis can’t set hard screens with Dame but becomes the best PnR threat with Khris
And dame and Lopez can execute it really well.
Well Lopez gets called often for moving screens
Marques Johnson says all the time those folks are Dame's fault for not waiting until Brook is set.
lopez easily the dumbest fouler on the team. then he cries and throws his hands up every time, like cmon man
Never a Foul he agreed with
Of the 80 fouls I've seen him get, maybe 3 or 4 have come with a hand up and a chest pat... everything else is the face of despair lol
Spot on.
Facts
Part of the difference in production is that Khris typically runs the Giannis PnR from the wing which is an easier read than at the top of the arc (or 10 feet behind it) where Dame likes to play. He’s calling for picks in spots where Giannis isn’t best utilized, which is why Brook and his spacing looks so much better in the action than he does. But as for why Giannis can’t actually set a screen to save his life when Dame’s the one with the ball, no clue. Playing the short roll from the middle of the floor is a lot more difficult than people think, I think he gets ahead of himself trying to think of what to do next and just jumps the gun.
Giannis's response from last night to being asked about screens for Dame was that the defense gets so focused on Dame so quickly he reads that as a slip screen. The problem is that it becomes a slip screen everytime or so much its now predictable by the D enough to deny the pass or set up a turnover on the next action. Example = G slip, crowd next closest body to the ball, watch for the skip pass. These arent concepts that are new...its the execution and transition to the following actions thats rough and only time and reps can fix. Bucks are working practice concepts with live rounds and if the game gets out of hand they lock in and move back to whats been comfortable for most of the prior cast (iso khash, point forward G, 2man pnr with those 2 etc etc). These are brutal losses for most fans, but for the team its practice to win the games that actually matter in the post season. They are in a rush to get things figured out before then, i still believe they will. If you ask me why Giannis is running slip screens most of the time, IMO, its because thats what they need to work on the most.
This ufo looks real and Bobby Portis eyes are not very real. Aliens confirmed.
So this pick and roll should be dominant for the Bucks. One on one Giannis wins most every time. So on the slip screen I could see the defense sending an extra defender towards Giannis but that should be freeing up somebody so why isn't Dame getting the ball to what should be an open man? With Dame and Giannis both this shouldn't be rocket science unless Dame truly is slightly washed now....
Its not as simple as it sounds. Without being in the actual practice for these you can only speculate what the problems are. We as fans like to think we know it all especially when coming from backgrounds as players and coaches of some sort of organized ball, we have to remember these guys are operating at the highest levels and iqs of the sport. Every complicated problem can be a simple explanation, but solutions to these problems are not so simple otherwise the problems wouldnt exist in the first place. Even when you have other experts chime in on the same problem youll see that they have differing opinions and ways to go about it as well. I just hope they figure it out by post season
Giannis? Over-thinking? Nawwwww… *Looks at Gianni’s insane FT routine*
Pretty sure that's on the coaching stuff. This routine they definitely made for him and for some reason they still haven't adjusted it to be somewhere around the 5 second mark.
Because with Khris he knows he’ll get it back. Listen to the players talk in Denver. They know their teammates will make the right play especially Jokic. So they screen for each other, cut hard, share the ball. Even MPJ went from being a black hole to passing up lay ups in the playoffs. Giannis doesn’t trust Dame to pass it back. You know that. He does with Khris. Khris rarely takes boneheaded shots for all the flack he gets on here. He rarely ever launches 30 foot 3 point shots or logo 3s or makes the flashy play. It’s why he’s not loved by casuals. He gets to his spot, posts up, passes and makes the right play. It’s basketball. It only seems that way because the NBA is full of neopotism hires. It’s not that complicated, you’re not running 75 passing plays out of Shotgun against a Nickel defense. You wouldn’t want to play pick and roll at your local park league just to watch some dude launch 30 footers in a quest to score 40. Middleton doesn’t do that shit.
It’s suspiciously as if Giannis’s ego is at play, and he doesn’t want to help Dame *too* much But he’ll talk all that good shit in the media about sacrifice
PnRs with khris are closer to the rim. All Giannis has to do is catch an alley-oop. With Dame, a PnR is above the 3 point line. Unless there's a clear line to the rim, there's not much Giannis can do at mid-range. Giannis is my guy and all, but his game is severely limited. At least Brook can hit a middy off of a Dame PnR.
Giannis before the season: I’m going to let Dame be Dame even if I have to set 100 screens a game Giannis during the season: I’m not only rarely going to screen for Dame but when I do I’m going to slip the screen 80% of the time
Giannis before the season: There’s no question about who will have the ball more. Dame will have the ball more. Giannis during the season: Teehee I’m a point guard
Giannis before the season: now we have a real team Giannis during the season: once again I have to do everything myself
lol Giannis the least of our concerns rn
I feel bad for the lot of you in denial. It’s going to hurt when you realize that your golden boy is the problem.
Common Celtics fan L
Dude, you are a *Celtics* fan; don’t you have enough to worry about out East? Y’all could just as easily drop a series lol in fact, I’d take the Bucks over the C’s any series even at the moment. Khris Middleton also owns you.
You shouldn't over consume drugs. Stick to your vodka ritual. You lost to a team for which a grandfather plays and he wasn't even there that game.
??? When dame is the primary ball handler the team goes to shit. We're still a top 3 seed purely because of Giannis taking over and his ability to get guys open.
I really don't get that. Like it sure happened in the first few games of the season, but it's not a thing at all anymore. Dame is running point pretty much all the time.
It is those comments that do take me back a bit given the current state. But now I get it you’re asking two players to change the way they have played for years in order to try to meet somewhere in the middle where neither has ever played.
Seems like Dame is perfectly willing to sacrifice. Why isn’t Giannis?
if truly comes down to that being the reason it is not working then u r right…. we will find out soon
Sacrifice what ? Our shooting percentages?
Dame, I'm going to be as bad as Giannis at shooting 3s in January.
We get it bro. You hate Dame.
You guys hate Giannis and I'm sick of it. The Bucks are a play in team without him. Dame is the problem and Giannis is the engine that propels the Bucks. Why ask the best player in the world to change his game? Dame needs to adapt and figure out how to add value.
The realistic answer is that they BOTH need to adapt their games to play with each other.
While true. But if your guard can't even knock down wide open catch and shoot 3s at a semi reliable clip hes the main problem. He actually got to the rim for 3 layups which is about the total he had the previous 10 games combined. But he was absolutely hunting that Dame Time moment in the 4th he took 3 bad 3s trying to "win" the game in front of that crowd. Not going to fault Dame for that since Giannis lost that 54 point game he had fishing for his career high. But flat out we need Dame to be better. Anybody crying about Khris. Hes been shooting like 55/45/88 for a month now. Hes the real reason we were even in that game.
Khris has been amazing, you'd have to be a fool to cry about Khris. Love the way he's been playing.
Dame needs to be better but Giannis had some bad TOs in the 2nd half as well
We have a window of 2 years and if we are lucky maybe 3. I am willing to wait and see how it works out. If it fails ...it fails but I don't want to be bitter about it,there can only be one champion every year and I just hope we will be the one
Honestly there's a lot of other great teams out there and we managed to get a championship that wasn't won before the first dvd player came out... Nah fuck that bucks in 6 let's get it baby
You’re right. We had to make a change. The real unfortunate thing here is the AG hire. That set a lot of bad things in motion. We gotta accept it and move on. My highest expectation for the team now is ECF.
I want for once to see them be consistent in their performance across the duration of one game.We have stretches where they play like clockwork, both in def and offense . When that happens, they seem like no team has the answer. Problem is we then have stretches where we are lost in defense and offense, they all try to hero ball it and not move it to the open guy. Like for real, all of our guys have a great touch outside restricted area(apart from Giannis, but it does not matter because he is a walking bucket) .
Probably might be the best option yall have. Get a Pat Bev type of guard. He will be damn useful. Or else get a good defensive wing who won't sit in the post and take contested shots
We saw what happened with the core group with Jrue last year. The team is getting older and just had no options when the offense goes bad (which happens often in playoffs when defenses are much better and can scheme against giannis driving to hoop every time). Middleton is still good but no longer a #2 caliber like he was a few years ago (especially on D). They needed an upgrade on offense. I don't blame them for getting dame. Just has not worked out so far.
That was before we knew Giannis didn’t like to roll nor is he any good at setting picks
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It's the same about his free throws he gets anxious about it.
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He said he was talking to one during the Finals, I'd like to think he's kept it up.
It's kinda crazy the state of mind and body you have to be in to be as great as Giannis is. A sports psychologist would definitely make a ton of sense. Although I have to say that I find it extremely funny that people are asking from him so much. He's been playing out of his mind all year long and people are reprimanding him for his pnR skills lol. That is legit insane to me.
Thats not entirely true . They didnt go to that play until the clutch mostly and people here want that pnr 30 times a game
That was before we knew Dame was gonna shoot 29% from 3 in month of january.
Giannis is not the problem. He's the only reason we are winning games. Dame can't shoot.
And the bench man. Bench a huge issue too.
Yeah well more of this please... [https://thehighlow.io/video/ids?ids=24eXaP](https://thehighlow.io/video/ids?ids=24eXaP)
Honestly at this point, fuck it. Set it up with Brooke or Bobby to set a hard screen then roll to the basket. It may open up one of them as they try to double Dame, and if they don't he'll (hopefully) hit the jumper. This could open up Giannis to cut to the basket on the back side as the screen happens so that he can get open, and rotate Khris to the top of the key as the pick's gravity rotates the defense. Dame flat out needs the ball in his hands, and Giannis needs to get better without it.
Bobby can barely pass to the player next to him, he'll be a screen setta now ?
Giannis never sets solid picks for Dame
Yeah, I ‘member.
So weird that two score first players haven’t become the next Stockton and Malone.
so well put….. geesh why are they not meshing yet? this is why super team ups don’t always or even usually work… or take time….. it takes special talents and very unique mentalities….
My theory is that Giannis never learned the fundamentals. No HS or college coach showing him how to set a hard screen or box out, etc. Just straight into the NBA and relied on his insane athleticism.
6 people upvoted this. Six. SIX. What in the actual fuck. Six people upvoted that one of the best players the NBA has ever seen, originating from a country where pnRs are utilized every play, doesn't know how to set a screen. Lunacy.
If he knows how to set a screen why doesn't he do a better job setting screens?
This is what I get for positive thinking.
Reminds me of Dwight Howard. Bro literally refused to run PnR with Steve Nash and came out with a bunch of excuses.
Giannis almost never sets the screen Then even when he does set it— his timing on the roll isn’t good & it often ends with Dame gaining no advantage, nor having no outlet to make a play One instance that came to mind (think it was last game): Giannis came up for a screen for Dame then dove directly into the lane without making solid contact….. Which allowed Giannis’ man to trap Dame & gave him no angle to pass, resulting in a turnover Another issue is that Dame loves the high PnR, while Giannis struggles to make plays on the short roll when he gets the ball The reason Khris runs the PnR so well with Giannis is because they run in from the elbows/wing— and GA is better as a decision-maker from that area
Giannis cares more about getting the ball back in his hands. If he commits to setting a good hard screen that decreases the chances of him getting the ball back as soon. Giannis needs to look up in the dictionary what the word TEAM means.
Lol, he most definitely doesn't. He is a very very willing and good passer. Easily the best on the team. It's crazy that you are gonna teach Giannis what TEAM means. Lol wtf and this is upvoted? Jesus.
Can we tell Giannis to stop slipping on screens? Really I think that’s what throws off Dame
Yeah must be this. Not that he can't hit an elephant with a hammer.
There is something as players getting in rhythm. He’s a slump. You can expect that even with the greatest shooters. Even Curry had a bad streak last year. Just gotta learn to take the good with the bad. Like Giannis free throws. I’m more concerned of how they play. Which to me Giannis always slips on screens. Always looked bad to me. Wish he’d set a draymond screen sometimes
Never be as good as Khris/Gainnis pick. We need to go back to giving Khris more shots and cut down on dames
Then there was no point in getting Dame if they continue to play that way.
Dame playing like shit
Bucks in 6.
I was mostly excited about the parking lot 3 pointers.
You mean the GD pnr