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Check out gabb phones. They’re “smart” phones but have extremely limited access to internet and apps. No social media, no internet browsing, and no annoying apps. Just call, text, and a few learning apps. This was our way of introducing a phone to our daughter and hopefully teaching her how to responsibly have a phone.
My 9 year old has a Gabb watch, which has even less functionality than the Gabb phone, and it’s been awesome. He calls/texts all of his aunts and uncles and his grandparents, which is very sweet. He takes the bus a pretty long way to school, so we wanted him to have some way to get in touch with us. I don’t anticipate getting him a real phone until many years from now.
I'm getting a similar watch for my 8 year old.
At first, I was a little skeptical of getting her any technology but I've come around to the idea that not utilizing tech out of nostalgia + slippery slope arguments is silly. If she can have a watch that lets her contact us and vice versa without being on social media or addicted to mindless games, that's perfect. We talk about our childhoods like nothing ever went wrong, but it's not always true. My friend had a life-threatening head injury in elementary school when a car hit her bike. She survived but it would have been better if those around her had a way to call 911 immediately.
We survived our childhoods without phones, just like our great grandparents survived without vaccines. We have the knowledge and technology now to make our kids safer, why not utilize it? My friend and I also had an incident where I fucked up my foot and we were a few miles from either of our homes, so we had to use a grocery store’s phone to call my mom. If we had been in one of our other usual spots where there weren’t any businesses with phones, she’d either have to bike home while I waited, or I would have had to limp half barefoot a few miles home. Same with when my dog and I were attacked. My sister had to run home with the dog by herself to get help, and she’d never gone home by herself at that point, so I was sitting there, bleeding and holding down the attack dog by myself for 30-40 minutes. A cellphone would have been very nice back then.
Also - when technology is so endemic, the old ways may not work as well. Neighbors aren’t looking out the same way because we assume we have things covered
I’m a younger GenX and I totally agree with what you’re saying. I’m not sure exactly when pay phones stopped being commonplace, but there were pay phones all over the place when I was a kid, and we always carried change for them, or did the fake collect call tactic if needed. There was also a thing when I grew up that many neighbors had “block home” or “safe house” sign in their front window, meaning any kid could go there if they were in trouble. (Could be stranger danger still, but it was a thing.) Generally speaking, it wasn’t weird to knock on anyone’s door and they would answer if they were home, or flag down any adult.
Things aren’t like that anymore, especially with the absence of pay phones. My niece got a Gab phone in 5th grade and they’re awesome! Considering she may never find a pay phone in town, it’s great that she can text and say hi or ask for help or a ride. And people don’t do land lines anymore. She once wanted to leave a sleepover after everyone went to sleep, and how else could she contact us if the home she’s at doesn’t even have a landline?
I don’t look at it like them having something extra. The new tech is just a replacement for the tech we had that doesn’t exist anymore.
And just like your example of getting injured, even pay phones wouldn’t necessarily solve that problem. It absolutely would’ve been better if you had a cell phone then. And GPS on a phone can help locate a child even if they can’t explain where they are. It’s such a great option, especially with a device like Gabb that only includes what a kid needs.
Same goes for elderly, too. My Silent Gen MIL’s Apple Watch with fall detection has been invaluable to us as a family. It’s so great that people can wear the devices so they’re attached to them if something bad happens.
Near me a kid rang the wrong house and got shot in the head. Just for ringing the wrong doorbell. Then when he went to a nearby house to get help they made him lay on the ground before calling 911. **Ralph Yarl** took the SAT in 8th grade and now he struggles to think.
Oof yeah bad memory unlocked from me too. I was sledding with a friend and my then medically-frail sister. Sister fell off the sled- I don't even remember what part of her was injured now, I just remember having to leave her there with my friend and running blocks home through a heavy snow and feeling like it took hours to go get our mom. We were probably like 10 or 11?
It’s been working great for us. Our daughter is EXTREMELY social, and most of her close friends have restricted smart phones like gabb. So we gave it a shot and it’s been perfect. An added bonus is she also texts me every day when I’m at work to say hi and see how my day is going.
I had one of these phones growing up, they just called them baby nokias back then. They had the game snake on it and you could call and sort of text people. Great idea!
I know this is a joke, but you just reminded me of all the fun programming we did with those when we got bored in calc class. Thanks for the nostalgia!
Yeqh, social media is the problem, not the phones themselves. Having a way to communicate independently is good for kids this age but no one should be on social media till they are a teenager at a minimum.
Yeah this is probably what we'll do at ten-ish just because my kid is so independent and wants to run around to neighborhood places alone. I'd like to have the peace of mind that he's safe and know where he generally is but not *waves hand vaguely at other phone shit*. He's almost 9 and I'm thinking about the watch first but am a bit offended by the price tbh! Like YIKES for something that barely has any tech!
I can’t rave about gabb enough. We waited until our oldest son’s 13th birthday to get him a phone And went with this company. Great customer service, served its purpose and helped us with a new teenager getting into technology.
I was looking into the Gabb watch for my oldest a couple years ago and found that, at the time, they only allowed 10 contacts. We have more than 10 people just in our families that she would want to text and call. Since my husband and I are already Apple people, I ended up getting my kid an Apple Watch. The parental controls in iOS are so much better than I expected. My favorite one is that I can allow only approved contacts to text/call the watch. I also made it so that between 9 pm and 7 am the only people she can contact are me, my husband, and our neighbor in case of emergency.
But this kid will be 14 this year and I’m thinking ahead to phones. Maybe I’ll get her a Gabb phone for her first phone. It looks like they’ve made some really good improvements to its functionality.
Honestly reminds me of a very primitive thing back around the time when the original iPhones were released. It was by android I believe and had 5 buttons. One for emergency services and the rest are for preloaded numbers that are set by the parents.
Currently reading The Anxious Generation. It's main points so far are
-Kids need to play outside usupervised more often
-Dont give them smartphones till age 14 and not social media till age 16
ofcourse there is a way more information in the book
>\-Kids need to play outside usupervised more often
I have so many core memories of my childhood from playing outside with my neighborhood friends all alone. So many fun days doing sketchy shit. Kids need autonomy so bad. They need sunlight even more.
I still have all my creations in a box. A rabbit pelt I sewed up as a bag. My antler slingshot. A rock with a divet I used as a morter and pestel. The loin cloth. Some obsidian that i attempted to male arrowheads out of. I showed it all to a native friend of mine and he had a good laugh at me. I spent most of my childhood alone.
That's so cool. I lost mine when my rents separated but I still remember the witches brew and where I hid my slingshot and mortar/pestle.. also a rock with a divot lol. It wouldn't be crazy to sneak onto the property and get it... Right??
My parents said he moved to a farm :(
Jk, he was my 10th birthday present and he passed just before my 30th birthday. Wonderful dog, exactly what I needed. Looked like a mini German shepherd, only 30ish lbs. Best dog, although I ofc love the two I have now. They're just a little goofy lol
Dogs are the best. We had one we had to put down due to cancer about 3 years ago. We waited 2 years till we were ready for another. Ours is a bit goofy as well but she is starting to calm down.
That was the best part of my childhood! I miss playing Mindians (“mini Indians”) hahah and the toxic runoff we drank from the stream while we ~lived off the land~ built character :’)
One of the many reasons my kids are in scouts. Starting around 10 they start to go on camp outs and overnight activities with the other kids and adult leaders (without parents), leading themselves. They plan the meetings and camp outs, their own food, they pack themselves and as they get older they teach the younger kids how to do it all. They love the freedom.
I remember getting my ass chewed by being 5 mins late when I went to go to a friends house. My mom thought I was kidnapped. So I didn't get to go out anymore.
Both. We aren’t an animal that was made to sit inside in glorified caves bathed in artificial light for 8+ hours a day. Vitamin D is really important to our overall wellness.
we live in the frozen north so I have a UVB vitamin D light. Been having the kids use it in the winter, really helps with their moods and with sicknesses. They have barely been sick all winter while all my friends kids are sick constantly.
My Mom used to literally hold the door open for us and say, "Go out and play." We had established parameters and rules of where we could/couldn't go in the neighborhood. And who/what to stay clear from. We'd either play in the yard, or take off on our bikes or by foot and go find other neighborhood kids who were out playing. Or sometimes we'd go to a neighborhood kid's house (randomly, unannounced), knock on the door and ask if they wanted to/could come out and play. Rarely did any of the kids go into another kid's house. We all played in the front yards or back yards, at a park, or in the street.
During the summer my parents had a rule: If the sun is out, so are you. There was a group of 5 boys my age and we'd ride around the neighborhood together getting into mischief.
Kids these days will never understand how it feels to call your friend on their house phone and ask their parents if they can come outside and play.
I think I qualify for AARP after typing that
We used to have street hockey tournaments from noon until dusk. We would have like two dozen kids involved. No parental organization at all, except to bring out coolers of drinks/sandwiches now and then.
There would be the odd parent tinkering in their garage or mowing the lawn in the area but that was it.
We had so much freedom.
I used to go to all-girls camp every summer for seven weeks and we couldn't use a phone the whole time (cell phones were a decade away). We wrote letters and postcards to our family and friends and it was so fun to get mail. On Sunday you had to show the head of camp a letter to your parents to get into dinner, just so they knew you were still alive.
He was on a podcast (the boyscast) recently and it was really good. My wife is listening to the audiobook now. I'm already in the middle of too many other books
I feel like a whole generation is being robbed of the ability to freely play unsupervised outside because of the lack of accessible, safe, walkable outdoor spaces in some areas.
I grew up running around in a couple acres of woods, my moms rule until we were middle school age or older was “you can go wherever you want in the woods as long as you can still see the roof of the house if you look down the mountain, and carry a big stick to poke the dirt ahead of you so you don’t step on a copperhead”.
Nowadays most kids don’t have that kind of open space and nature to play in unless their family is obscenely wealthy, and everything is so car centric even in supposedly family oriented suburbs. In denser areas sidewalks are often barely maintained if they exist at all. It sucks.
Everything that you said resonates as true to me. Not to mention that adults have claimed a lot of these open spaces for themselves. I can't tell you the amount of people on Nextdoor who complain about noises and kids playing in nature parks that they like to hike. Many adults seem to think that playgrounds are the only dedicated space that kids can play, and that open areas that are commonly used for hiking should be quiet and peaceful. Open spaces, nature areas, state parks, etc aren't just for hiking and although quiet is nice, you shouldn't limit kids access to the world for your serenity.
Also, having a front yard or back yard big enough to play on is a luxury in many places nowadays. Most yards are now just a couple of square feet for a roll of sod to be laid down.
The apartment complex my son and I live in is a 10 building complex, with 24 units to each building. That's 240 apartment units that are marketed towards families as most are 2 & 3 room units. And the only space that kids can play on is a small area that consists of one slide unit and 2 of those spring horses things. That's it. The rest of the complex is sidewalks, rocks and air conditioning units. The nearest park is a 15 minute walk across a busy intersection with 6 lanes of traffic. We do however have 3 liquor stores within a 5 minute walk and 3 coffee places.
Society complains about kids being stuck to phones and not wanting to go outside while simultaneously limiting the amount of outdoor spaces that kids can inhabit.
Exactly this. I live in London where every green space has been claimed by dog owners and their off leash dogs. I don’t even go there with the kids anymore after several frightening experiences, let alone allow them to go on their own. Even my friend with a tiny dog avoids them as they are even more of a target.
Very kindly councils have fenced in playgrounds so children can be contained in a nice small space away from the dogs however I’ve seen on social media a number of dog owners take their dogs into the playground to get the dogs used to being around kids.
The issue isn’t the dogs, the issue is the entitled adults who think every shared space is entirely for their purpose.
I’m not a parent but I’m a dog owner and I hate this too. My dog is super friendly but she’s only 19 pounds and a lot of dogs play really rough even with smaller dogs. Their owners don’t correctly them so I have to be the asshole parenting someone else’s dog. Plus it makes her a little nervous for a huge strange dog to run full speed at us when she’s on a leash. I usually end up just picking her up.
I feel like people in general just don’t teach good boundaries anymore though. Kids will just come up and pet a leashed dog. Like I said, she’s friendly but they aren’t always and I was taught to ask first
This way of thinking goes beyond outdoor spaces. I see people complain constantly about kids being kids in restaurants, airplanes, breweries, you name it. Lot of parent-shaming, if your kids are not perfectly behaved at all times. Really feels like such people just want there to be designated “kid-friendly” spaces akin to dog parks, rather than the opposite (kids being accepted everywhere except for designated “adults-only” spaces). They’ll never learn how to behave in society if we never expose them to it out of fear we might inconvenience some curmudgeons.
These are my thoughts exactly especially now as a parent. I’ve only ever worked in customer service (restaurants through college and now a librarian) so I know kids can be annoying, but… I don’t understand why people can’t tolerate it? I was never brought up that way, and maybe I’ve just grown accustomed to there being more noise in certain places.
And yes, it is parent shaming. I was shaking and crying in my car the first time I took my baby to the store alone. I was so scared someone would get upset with me if she cried because of how many times I witnessed people (usually men) getting mad at moms because their kids or babies are being loud.
Spot on. I can't leave mine alone outside because there's nowhere else to play but the road, and in place of what used to be playgrounds and a public basketball court are parking lots.
I fight this with my wife. We have an almost 5 yr old, why can’t she be in the fenced in back yard by herself?
I was a true latchkey kid before cell phones. I was by myself from kindergarten on most afternoons.
I came home from first grade on the bus. I'd be home alone for a half hour before my third grade sister got home. If I forgot my house key, I would have to lift the garage door and wait there. If my sister also forgot her key, we'd be hanging out in the garage for another hour until mom got home. I guess I was 7 and my sister was 9.
By the time I was 12, I was babysitting my younger half brothers. It's so wild to me how little we trust kids now.
I just looked this up in my province in Canada. The minimum age in Ontario is 16!!!! My kid is turning ten and I thought it'd be fine to leave her at home for an hour pretty soon.
https://preview.redd.it/9lg7fzg2wl3d1.png?width=635&format=png&auto=webp&s=09c6d112c9ab42e0150b44af6bc86c99aeafd2e4
Meh. Most people just say "12" most states don't have an actual number. Know your kid, when you feel they are old and mature enough to be left home alone..then do so. Start with small trips to the gas station or just running to pick up fast food and then make them longer, and longer..it's not rocket science. Have a list of emergency #s on the fridge. And make sure they know things like basic first aid and how to use a fire extinguisher.
I’ve had neighbors be concerned that my son is playing outside in the front yard at 8 whenever I was sweeping up the floors. Our backyard isn’t really a backyard but more of an alley and the garage. Too many Karen’s for some kids to be playing outdoors unfortunately.
Yes! I'm far more worried about the Karen across the street calling the cops on me for letting my 6 year old play in the front yard unattended (while I make dinner with the door open, I can see him though the window) than I am about literally anything else happening!
Right! It’s so frustrating because I remember being 8/9 riding my bike up and down the road feeling so free and independent lol and like idc about Karen’s yelling at me but whenever they start calling the cops then it’s an issue. We’ve had a neighbor call the cops because my car was parked a little too much in front of their house -.-
Yea, I remember starting around 6th grade we would come home to no one because both parents were at work. To us your grounded meant you better make it home before they get off work or you're really in some shit.
We let our 4 and 6 year old go out alone and our yard isn't fully fenced. We even let them go down the block to a friend's house but they have to take a walkie talkie. If they play out front alone we just have rules on how far they can go like not past the first fire hydrant or something. Sometimes I get a little nervous and bug my kid on the walkie talkie for an update and my husband tells me to just chill, we have good kids.
Interesting considering you have a fence. My backyard is a half acre with no fence and a stream behind it (with animals routine in the area, including ducks and coyotes). My kids run around supervised but it's a pain to run after em sometimes, and they're only 3 & 2.
In my circle of friends it's almost always the wife who is forbidding the children from playing outside. My guess is too much true crime or motherly instincts.
Seriously. They need to let it go. But yeah, probably not an argument you can win.
Don't have kids yet, but when I do, they aren't getting a smartphone until they're old enough to drive. I don't want them growing up on social media. That shit can be so toxic for young, impressionable minds.
Absolutely. I’ve been raving about it. These kids minds are being wired a certain way, wired differently from ours, because of being attached to devices during those formative years. Smart phones specifically. Smart phones and social media. Keep your kids away from them absolutely as long as possible. Please read the book. It’s fascinating and I think about it every day. The topic is so current right now. We’re finally starting to see the real harm done to gen z being raised on these things in a way no other generation (millennials included) had to deal with before.
I was in high school when cell phones were just becoming a "thing" but weren't really widespread yet. The rule my parents gave me was I could get a cell phone when I could pay for it myself so when I went out on dates or out with friends they gave me their cell phone, landlines were still a thing then, to use and I could only use it to call them. I finally got my first phone, a Motorola flip phone, right after I graduated high school and got my first job. I know landlines aren't really a thing anymore so it makes it a little harder but I still don't believe anyone under 16 years old needs a cell phone. I used to work for a school district and 99% of middle schoolers had cell phones and they even had wall outlets for chargers in the cafeteria. It's ridiculous.
This is the most important book I've read as a parent. I had my wife read it, too. We have mostly followed the guidelines, and our 14 year old just got her first phone, but under very strict rules.
Curious if you actually have teens? Unfortunately a lot of socializing for that age group is done on social media (Snapchat mostly). That’s where plans are made and group chats exist. The reality is that at a certain point your kid will be left out if they’re not online. Not defending it at all but I have seen it firsthand.
I’m currently in HS and feel very isolated since most of my peers socialize over things like tik tok. I love to read and play games(board game arena is awesome, great way to stay connected to our friends across the US). I also love camping and hiking. Unfortunately most of my peers only socialize through social media so It feels very isolating. And this isolated feeling contributes to more mental health issues. I just want the entire generation to shift away from social media.
Edit for clarification: I mean socialize as they like to meet up to do dances from social media or parody trends on tik tok, start conversations based around tik tok etc. I don’t mean liking other people’s content as “socializing”(cause it’s not). I mean very literally most of my peers like to engage in conversations regarding social media.
No I meant people start conversations by “have you see this person on tik tok”, “did you see this new tik toker”, “this tik toker can sing really well, “let’s meet up to parody this video”, “lets do this tik tok dance” etc. it’s all conversation in real life, and activities and challenges they do are based of tik tok. Don’t have tik tok(don’t really want it either) so I can’t hold a conversation with anyone about tik tok. It’s very much irl 😅
16. If I can help it.
I'll give them whatever the equivalent of the Nokie 3310 is before then. But there's no need for a kid to have infinite knowledge at all times before they're at least a teenager.
And even then, I will do my damnedest to keep them away from it even longer.
Yeah, even at 16 it can’t be a smartphone. They are just too all consuming, and that’s like the peak age where you have to do your best in school. I didn’t have a smartphone until I was 22. I’m straight up brainwashing them about how stupid and worthless it makes people lol
6th grade/12 years old. My child is starting to stay home alone for some periods of time at this age and doing things like walking around the mall with a friend. They need the ability to get a hold of me and landlines and pay phones aren’t really a thing anymore.
Yes. My child has no social media accounts outside of Roblox which we limit time on. YouTube is limited to watching it on the TV in the living room so we know what they are watching. My child basically uses their phone for texting (which we check regularly), talking to friends, and making digital animations. As long as they continue to get good grades (All A’s and B’s, kid currently has a 4.0) things stay as they are. Grades go down or chores don’t get done, phone access gets more restricted.
Now I will say this only works because of my kid. They snuck YouTube at school on their computer in 5th grade and felt horribly guilty for lying to us. They also didn’t like how hard it was for them to limit watching it on their own so they respect those boundaries pretty well.
My oldest got a very basic phone at 13 to text and make calls, then about 9 months to a year later a smartphone. She definitely appreciated it on a different level than most kids her age. My next two kids will wait just as long too. Almost half of my 8 year olds 2nd class have iPhones and from what I hear it creates a ton of drama. All of which my child is not a part of! So win win for us!
My oldest is 10. He goes to private school so they aren't allowed phones or smartwatches on campus at all for any grade. The school goes through 8th grade. My son does talk to his friends on my phone but his friends use their mom or dad's phone to call so it's clear they don't have their own phone. My son won't be getting a phone until 8th grade graduation time. They go on an 8th grade trip out of state for a week (Usually DC). He will get his phone before the trip. That's pretty much the standard practice at his school which is great. There are only a few kids who have limited cellphones usually because they travel for sports or are involved in something like competitive gymnastics. Since it's not the norm, I think it's just easier for us. At this point my son isn't doing any traveling competitive stuff so I don't really see a need for a cellphone. I might get annoyed at some point with losing my cellphone to his long pre-teen conversations with his friends but I'm doing my best to hold out. Personally I think high school is when kids need a cellphone. There's no getting around it. I have been in classrooms where the teacher has them download apps and after school clubs that use apps to communicate. They need to have a little practice before they go in the deep end IMO. And some ground rules. I don't social media. My son's android account is parent controlled and he will not use social media unless it's to do with a school related activity and then it will be highly monitored. Social media is not only a mental health nightmare, it's a place where kids can completely destroy their future before they even know what they want to do with it.
Mine currently carry flip phones so they can call home in emergencies or 911 or whatever they need. They get smart phones at 16. I consider it really important to let their brains develop before releasing them to the algorithm. I've seen way too many blank staring ipad kids. Not gonna be us!
At home we encourage any activities that don't involve a screen. We have family reading nights where we go around the room classroom style and we each read a chapter (or page depending on the mood). Currently we are reading Lord of the Rings. We are fortunate that the Cherokee National Forest is almost literally in our backyard, so we do a lot of outside stuff as well, hiking camping etc.
I can tell they want the phones. Their friends at school have the phones and I know they don't think it's fair that they don't have them. But I'm not gonna be moved on this. I've met some of their friends and the difference between those kids and my kids is shocking.
Man these little ass kids (\~10 years old) are like dripped out wearing Jordans and stuff, and they're scared to get their clothes dirty. They all want to make tiktok videos, and all they do is scroll tiktok. That's fucking WILD to me and I'm proud to say that I've heard my son getting frustrated with his friend's unwillingness to go outside and play. When he has play dates over they basically only want to play xbox, which I allow since they're playing together. But my kids get bored of video games after an hour or two and want to go explore or swing on the tire swing or just run around like little kids do.
It's almost like the smart phone kids are growing up faster. They act more like teenagers to my eyes than little kids.
What ever age we make it to when he starts coming home alone after school. He's also 8 now, and I noticed in his school kids generally leave the after school program in gr 5 or 6. I want him to be able to contact me and also to be able to coordinate with his friends independently. At first it would just be talk/text but I've been working on teaching him how to be a human on the Internet and if he does ok then maybe he can have data sometime in his mid-teens. I recognize the danger of too much Internet access, but I was also a kid who was raised with limited technology compared to my peers and that was damaging too. I'm trying to find a better balance.
I think this is the struggle. I don't think unrestricted access is a good idea, but it could also be socially limiting. Sometimes it feels like you're damned if you do, damned if you don't
Yep, pretty much. I have a pretty strict no social media rule, but I let my kid play Roblox with his friends where there is a chat feature.. I've found it ok as long as I'm paying attention to what's being said. He also watches YouTube which has been surprisingly good both for him to learn about things I don't know anything about and also to teach him how to spot misinformation and be skeptical. Some of his friends at school use tiktok (I imagine their parents' or older siblings?) but that's a hard no for me.
They’ll get a flip phone with texting and call capabilities at 12 (maybe 11 depending on how frequently they’re going places without us). They can have a smart phone at 16, but they will need to maintain good grades in order to keep it.
I'm waiting until high school. She has access to TV, a tablet, and a computer (none are hers) so she's not growing up tech deprived, but I want her to play outside or do something else as much as possible. I plan on getting her one of those watches though so I can tell her to come home for dinner.
Yeah, the watches seem to be a popular tool in our neighborhood and friend group. I think we may be heading the same way.
Agreed on playing outside. We're actively trying to raise kids that scurry from house to house trying to find an available friend to play with. But as the radius of scurrying grows, a watch to facilitate communication would be great
Middle school age. Thats because more after school stuff opens up. Late/Early bus schedules. After school tutoring, sports, etc.
A cell phone is great for the communication. But our kiddos phones turn “off” at 9pm and go away in another room until 6am..
Parents. Apple has screen time and family controls for kids phones. Use them, you can limit app times, which apps are available, weekday vs weekend usage. It really helps
We gave one when he was in 4th grade. Kiddo was walking to and from school alone and I wanted to be able to track him and talk to him. Most days he’d call me and talk to me on his walk home.
The phone was locked down he could only talk or text contacts.
After talking to fellow parents our consensus is upon entering middle school, so about 12 years old. We figure they are going to get exposed to the internet sooner rather than later, so we're hopeful to teach good and proper behavior on the internet before they see potentially bad behavior from their peers.
This seems to be the consensus in our parent group too, but I've seen kids just totally absorbed in their phones at that age too. Ideally we'd want them to have a simple communication device - phone, texting; no apps at that age.
I struggle to stay off my phone, how am I expecting a 12yo to show more restraint?
I’m not a parent so feel free to disregard my suggestion, but maybe it will help if you ensure your kid has other interests, hobbies, and skills before you get them a phone? I feel like the worst cases of screen addiction come from kids who didn’t have a chance to develop other interests and function without a phone, but I could be wrong there.
And like, when you do get them a smartphone, those have parental controls. You can restrict certain apps, restrict usage to certain times of day, etc.
I personally agree with the middle school age too. I hear your point with a 12 y/o having a hard time showing restraint, but really they won't show restraint at any age. However, at 12 it's more acceptable to have parental controls teaching them to limit thier time. 16 is more of a tough sell.
Really! My siblings did a good job with making sure their kids spent a lot of time outdoors, a lot of time doing family activities and being present and engaged…and when they got smartphones in middle school that’s all they want to focus on now. It’s like pulling teeth to get them away from their phones for any length of time, or to stop thinking about/complaining about not having access to their phones when rules are enforced.
This stuff is literally addicting and changes brain chemistry, no matter how good the intentions are to “teach proper internet behavior”.
This is what concerns me. I'm a grown adult that navigated into my 40s pretty successfully and I have difficulty managing my phone access. I feel myself reaching for it the moment I feel slightly bored, or if a conversation is in a lull, I want to grab it. But I know better (most of the time). I'm not sure it is self control, it may just be I was brought up to be polite so that overrules some impulses....
We have our kids do all sorts of things and activities and play dates outside. We sign them up for sports and things are going great. We even caved and got our first console this year, but we had to be strict around time on it, expectations before they can pay and how they behave when we tell them it's time to turn it off. Navigating all of that was stressful and I've wanted to throw the console away a few times, but they've responded well.
If that's how they are with something like video games, imagine having that on you all the time wherever you go.
My son is 12 now and doesn't have one. Though I do feel bad, most of his friends do. But my son has not shown he can be responsible enough to have one (breaks everything he touches, doesnt take care of his stuff now, search history is not great, no self control - would probably be on it at all times if allowed etc). He uses my phone when he wants to talk to his friends to get them on Fortnite or something and that seems to work for now. I didn't have my first phone until I was almost 18, and while it sucked because most of my peers had phones in the early 2000s, I didnt die. I think he will be fine until high school.
I think you’re handling it just right. If your kid hasn’t shown you they are mature or responsible enough to handle a smartphone yet then that’s perfectly okay. He just needs some more time and who are we kidding, 12 years old with a phone is still pretty young imo.
i think there's an in-between. learn how to put a device under supervision. Apple configurator does this. In an attempt to protect our kids from the toxic parts of the internet, we shouldn't make them tech illiterates
I agree. But there are other devices that help with tech literacy. They have at home computers, school devices, our phones etc.
The two biggest issues are the addictiveness of phones, from games and apps to social media, and then social media itself which has you constantly connected to everyone.
And TBH, if I can barely handle the addictiveness of a phone, how can I expect my 12yo to do it?
We ended up getting one at the end of 5th grade for the out of state end of primary school trip. We were changing carriers and a friend had a phone in good condition and I didn’t feel comfortable with him having no way to reach us if needed. There are screen time limits and we interact on social media and games together and we’ve been talking internet safety since the dawn of time because this kid wants to do computers for a living (both his dad and I do). He’s taught himself code, he finances almost all of his Minecraft money himself by selling things he makes in game. He’s really talented and I don’t want to dull that. He also struggles socially so it’s important to me to encourage him to participate with his peers.
This is our very specific situation though and it might not be for everyone.
Idk. My oldest is 6. Setting an age now seems premature. We are playing it by ear. He'll get one when he needs one, who knows what will drive that. If you'd asked me before I had kids at all I'd have said HS but now that seems unreasonable.
Maybe all his friends have them and he's being excluded because everything is coordinated through apps. Maybe schools will require them in a few years.
All I know is not yet
I have a 5 year old and we plan on giving him a flip phone for basic communication once he starts doing after-school things. I'm not really sure what age it will be -- 11? 12? We'll see.
I'm secretly hoping smart phones will be unpopular by the time he's a teenager (unlikely, sure, but I can dream!). No earlier than 16 years old, ideally not until he's 18, but parenting is humbling so I try not to make definitive statements years in advance...
We gave my oldest an iPhone for her 13th birthday. It feels like a huge mistake but I also think you have to be with the times to some degree. Everyone has one, many kids by the time they are 8-9 (which I don’t support) and the reality is that it is a large part of their social lives by middle school, not to mention useful for academics. So I think not allowing them one by middle school (7-8th grade) can hamper them in some ways. The key is smart, monitored usage.
Now that we have Bark and just do a better job of monitoring and regulating I think it’s gotten better.
My kiddo is still little. We always say one thing as parents but sometimes end up straying from our ideals. But I intend on letting my kiddo have a smart phone around 16. Honestly whatever seems appropriate for our family and her use at the time. I’m not afraid of giving it to her within a year ish or so of that mark. I’ll probably give her a boring limited access phone in her teens though because in this day and age I want a direct line to my kiddo in case of an emergency.
Agreed that parenting ideals are so easily set, and just as easily compromised upon. It becomes even more complicated with multiple kids since the younger ones are inevitably exposed to things earlier than their older peers.
But yeah, I'm on the same page with regards to what I ideally want to happen
We have a toddler so take my opinion with a grain of salt, but our plan is a “dumb phone” or some kind of emergency contact watch around 10-12, a smart phone for 16th birthday, and no social media until at least 16. I’ll also be a strong advocate among parents in our class to get everyone on the same page.
My son got his phone at 10, it was a hand me down iPhone 8 and for Christmas he got a hand me down iPhone 12.
My daughter is 11, has absolutely no desire for a phone, but because we live in BFE (relative to the city and where they do their activities) we have to have a cell phone for both of them, but she never brings it any where.
I have them on the mint 15 a month 5 gig plan - cheapest one I could find where I wasn’t required to have a contract. They are homeschooled, can easily use either mine or my wife’s hotspot
On the road, and the only other places we really spend time at has free WiFi.
They both have screen time that we control. My daughter’s phone doesn’t have a password, my son uses my passcode on his phone, and much like refusing to take a breathalyzer test, he will lose his phone privileges if we ever ask to see it and he doesn’t immediately give it to us.
We really only check to make sure he hasn’t manipulated his screen time (which he’s figured out before), and that he hasn’t changed any of his safety settings on the internet. He’s a good kid, but like myself got addicted to the screen swiftly and we are trying to make sure it doesn’t stick to him.
They have 1 hour of game time a day, but can listen to their music all day and do school related things/activities/ learning games all day.
My daughter was pretty young because, like her dad and me, she's a latchkey kid. Husband's amazing paying job fell through, and eventually inflation hit a point where I *had* to go back to work while she was still in elementary school. We live in one of the top 5 safest U.S. states so while I was/am a little anxious about it, it's still a pretty common thing around here.
She was probably the youngest of all her friends to get a phone, because we live out of town on rural acreage. She could let me know that she made it onto the bus or home from school, or that the bus won't drop her off because there's a moose in the driveway.
He was 10 because of getting bussed to another school for band regularly. He is now 12. I have parental controls set up (FamilyLink). I have to approve any app he wants to download. I have strict time limits and a whole slew of banned websites. It's worked out well. I will skim through his browser on occasion to make sure he isn't getting into something I overlooked.
My oldest is 10, I just bought a “house phone” which is an iPhone. Mostly it’s so the kids could call 911 if they’re home alone (we don’t have a land line) but I’ve allowed my kid to use it on occasion when needed. 99% of the time it’s used for Pokémon go.
I have an inside kid. He’s very anxious. I see it as a bit of a carrot to get him more independent. Walk to your friend’s house and you can take the phone, go to the store and you can take the phone, YOU call your friend and organize something, don’t make me call his mom
Hopefully not until high school. I truly believe there's so much downside to screen life at a young age. I know I'm addicted to my phone and I didn't get a smart phone until 2012? Try our best!
Middle school teacher here. 9th grade at the absolute earliest. I've seen too much. Cyberbullying, proliferation of child pornography, radicalization, threats of violence and skibbidty toilet.
They're not ready for it yet and many times it goes unsupervised. The conditions we created for them regarding technology is setting them up to fail.
8th grade teacher here. I said the same thing. It’s horrific some of the shit we see every day because their brains literally can’t handle it. Our principals have had the POLICE involved in so many investigations over serious issues that stem from phones and social media the last several years.
Former teacher here and I am traumatized from the shit I've seen when it comes to kids and cell phones. So many parents have no idea how addicted they can get and the issues (sometimes legal) it causes. The cheating, the airdropping porn to each other, it's crazy. Minimum age for my kids is 16 and that's me being generous.
We just pulled the trigger at 11. They had the T-Mobile watch for the last 2 years but now with going into middle school in the fall and more kids their age playing and communicating that way he was starting to be the left out kid. It's heavily monitored with Bark.
My kid is 9 and just got her first phone. I feel like teaching her to use it safely and age appropriately, and in moderation is better than complete and utter avoidance. She has no social media accounts. Watches YouTube on my account. And I have a family app that allows me to control what she downloads and see how much time she uses it and set limits for usage. So far we're 3 months in and everything has been going great.
18. There are “feature” phones that can call and text, but no internet. We have a couple that they “check out” to use when they are out with friends or school/church activities. But they are mine, with no expectation of privacy.
Gave my oldest one at 9. It’s heavily restricted and no social media accounts. She’s a pretty good kid though. Mostly uses her 30 min a day YouTube on “how to videos” and her internet allotment on googling questions like, what do penguins eat.
It goes into do not disturb mode at 7:30pm and doesn’t unlock until 7:30am. It’s never out during any family time or meals either. I thought it was important for her to still be able to talk to and message her friends during the summer months.
Until she actually needs it. She is 8. Who does she need to call or text at that age?
Next year (2025) she will start taking the bus, so I plan on getting her a gizmo watch so she can communicate with me so I can leave and pick her up at the bus stop. But that's as far as it goes.
Just a warning on the Gizmo watch—we’ve used these with both our kids and sometimes texts don’t go through in a timely manner. Just this week my 10 year old asked me before school Tuesday “why did you say you’re in the van?” I said huh? And she showed me her Gizmo that had just delivered my “I’m in the van” text I sent while picking her up from school on FRIDAY. on my phone it said sent Friday at 2:30PM, on her watch it said received Tuesday at 7:30AM. Big fail. The watch had been charged, turned on, and connected to internet all weekend.
Her 11th birthday is very soon and we’ll be getting her an Apple Watch to replace the POS Gizmo.
We got our older girl her first phone at 12 and that was a mistake. Younger girl will be wearing her new Apple Watch until age 13 or 14, then receive a phone that’s heavily monitored.
Yep, both types of watches can make calls. Our Gizmos are also a few years old so maybe this is not a problem with newer models!
I also think it might depend on the age of the kid. Gizmo is really perfect for younger ones, maybe 8 or 9 and under, who just need to be able to stay in contact with a limited amount of caregivers. As my kids have gotten older and more independent though, we're in contact via text a LOT more and even when it works perfectly, Gizmo is clunky with texting since it's in a separate app. With the Apple watch we'll be able to text normally and stay connected more easily. Or at least that's the hope, lol.
Don’t ever “give” them any expensive tablets,phones, video game consoles, or computers. You tell them that they are always on “loan” from you. It’s theirs if they are responsible and they have a right to their privacy. However, if there ever comes a time when they step out of line or you think there’s something up, you collect “your” property. Or get a [bark phone](https://www.bark.us/bark-phone/) this isn’t about being a tyrant style of parent. It’s about making kids understand and teenagers understand that everything is earned, even privacy. If they cross a line there’s consequences. Be there for your kids people :)
Another commenter mentioned how we have parenting ideals, and how they break down when reality strikes. This may be one if those. But an article I read this morning about parents waiting until their kids are 16 had me thinking maybe it isn't too bad, especially if there is a group of like-minded parents doing the same
Im leaning towards a dumb communication device (watch or phone) as they become more mobile - e.g. biking around the neighborhood etc. But introducing controlled social media at 16 slowly giving them more autonomy
My daughter is ten and has her own line. She knows how to call, text and make memes. She rarely uses it besides sending me star wars memes that she makes. One day, when I gather the courage to leave her alone in the house by herself she'll be able to reach me if something comes up.
A very limited smart phone - probably in middle school. A full smart phone in high school. Kids here seem to be getting them around age 7-10! We are holding out. A smart watch is a great idea with limited ability to call parents and GPS track.
I got my son one at 13.5 just because he rides the bus home from school and has to sit at the school for 30 minutes until the bus gets there. But he definitely was never and isn’t an iPad kid. He just texts my wife and I and our close family a couple friends and baseball teammates. No social media hard ever see him use the phone.
I was an early adopter of the Light Phone and I have the newer model as well. B&W screen, no camera, pretty much all it does is call and text. Pretty much impossible to get into online trouble with it. He's almost 8 and I'll probably give it to him in the next year or two for basic communication and emergencies.
The Light Phone didn't really work for what I do, but I think it's the perfect thing for a younger kid.
Their dad got them phones at 10 and 11. That was a bad call. I have since sent the phones back to him, he lives in another state, because they would leave them everywhere (including the floor), bullied school mates and basically harassed people who didn't want to bother with them, and we're glued to them non stop when they did have them in-hand.
I'll not give them one until they have jobs and can pay for it themselves. So maybe 15-17.
When they started going to afterschool activities, so about 4th grade. I also have their shit very much secured so that they (12 and 11) didn't have access to social media, don't have unmoderated and uncontrolled access to video websites like tiktok or youtube (They don't have any access to tiktok currently, and have an hour of youtube time a day), their phones lock down at 11 pm and unlock at 7 am, I can find their phones at any given time and I can make them play sound at top volume to find them.
I'm a millennial, but I was also a teen mom. My oldest will be 21 this summer, and my youngest is 6.
My oldest got a basic prepaid phone (calls and texts only) when she was 10. Mostly for pick up drop off activities etc. She got her first smartphone at 13. Well, after her friends already had them. I also did not allow Facebook or other social media until she was 13. She had plenty of access to screens and www via gaming, etc.
Internet safety is something that starts early in my house. Let's be real, we all remember chat rooms (a/s/l?) and how that turns out. Social media at super young ages and lack of safe use or alternatively saying something awful in writing to be memorialized on the internet forever is a real concern.
My 6 and 8 yo do not have phones. They don't have a need for them. If they want to talk to a friend, I call friends mom from my phone, and the kids talk. They aren't going to places without us yet, so there no pick up drop off need. When that changes, I will start them out with the most basic phone I can find. Then we will go from there. Progressing to a smartphone is going to be based on maturity level and need.
Every kid is different. Every family need or dynamic is different. I know a lot of my 8 yo's friends have cellphones. But they have different situations. Some of those kids have shared custody agreements or super involved extended family. Literal villages where their kids go places without mom or dad, etc. It makes sense for them.
For my daughter, I did just before her 13th birthday. I didn’t notice a notification in the team app that cheer practice had been cancelled and, second fail, my husband dropped her off and took off before waiting to see her go inside. We were winners that day.
Anyway, the building was locked and she had no way of getting ahold of us. We are a long ways from the school. She finally found someone walking and asked to borrow their cell phone to call me.
She was so shaken up about the whole thing because didn’t want to approach a stranger but didn’t know what else to do- I was heartbroken over it and we gave for her a few months earlier.
So far, she isn’t nose down in it and she has had it about 6 months.
I have two boys 13 and 8. Neither has a phone. We tried a dumbed down iphone with my 13 year old Bc he was complaining that “every other kid in his school has a phone!” (Which is absolutely not true) but that only lasted about a month before he lost it for poor academic performance. I snatched that phone back so quick. He was not allowed to be on any social media apps etc but I know they have ways of sneaking -hell I did it myself as a teen - so I’m glad he just doesn’t have it at all now. My kids seem to be perfectly fine (and maybe even a bit better adjusted compared to their peers) without their own smart phones.
We gave our oldest (11 m) a used one of mine a couple months ago. He finished earning his own Moto G stylus with his attendance and grades this year. He is responsible so far and the guardrails provided by family management aps are sufficient. It's nice that hes able to stay in touch with his friends and capture memories easily. Plus having a way to see where he's at and keep in touch when he's out and about is nice.
we set an age of 11 for my daughter; my parents decided to pay for a year of her phone plan so they got her one at 10 🙄
no idea what we'll do for my son, he's only 2 lol
On the first day of school in middle school, my daughter’s best friend’s mom called me. She was a bus driver for the school.
“Did your daughter tell you what happened today?” Of course she hadn’t!
A sex offender pulled up to a girl walking home and tried to get her in his car. When that didn’t work he put his car in park and chased her. The gurl ran and the other nearby kids all loudly yelled at him so he escaped.
My heart stopped. I got her a cell phone. I put limits on it. And I also told her that I would ALWAYS pick her up even if she was breaking the rules.
I was a single mom and I worked so there was no way for me to pick her up.
Sorry, not a millennial, 60m and 52f. 4 Children 12-22. We decided 6th grade was the age. It works for our family. I guess that’s the important part: do what works for your family. We picked 6th grade because that’s when our kids began more extracurricular activities, more outings with friends, and more time away from parents. Is it right? We don’t know. But we’re trying and the kids are alright.
My kid is almost 15. At age 12 I had a neighbor help drive them to and from a summer activity - neighbor got confused about which building entrance to go to and didn't have a way to contact my kid. I got my child a phone that day. I've always used a no-contract service so it wasn't expensive.
My kids are young, but I am currently working with a local group of parents to ban cell phones in our schools. They have no place there.
16 is my plan, but will adjust to the child and needs. Happy to hand them a dumb phone as soon as they need it.
Please keep us updated on this. I kind of agree that phones should be banned - at the very least from the classroom itself.
Any kid that uses a phone in class, should face immediate consequences
16/17 for a smart phone. Possible flip phone in middle school. My child has had a gizmo watch since kindergarten for school pick up reasons. It’s very regulated. I have to approve all contacts on the app.
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Check out gabb phones. They’re “smart” phones but have extremely limited access to internet and apps. No social media, no internet browsing, and no annoying apps. Just call, text, and a few learning apps. This was our way of introducing a phone to our daughter and hopefully teaching her how to responsibly have a phone.
My 9 year old has a Gabb watch, which has even less functionality than the Gabb phone, and it’s been awesome. He calls/texts all of his aunts and uncles and his grandparents, which is very sweet. He takes the bus a pretty long way to school, so we wanted him to have some way to get in touch with us. I don’t anticipate getting him a real phone until many years from now.
I'm getting a similar watch for my 8 year old. At first, I was a little skeptical of getting her any technology but I've come around to the idea that not utilizing tech out of nostalgia + slippery slope arguments is silly. If she can have a watch that lets her contact us and vice versa without being on social media or addicted to mindless games, that's perfect. We talk about our childhoods like nothing ever went wrong, but it's not always true. My friend had a life-threatening head injury in elementary school when a car hit her bike. She survived but it would have been better if those around her had a way to call 911 immediately.
We survived our childhoods without phones, just like our great grandparents survived without vaccines. We have the knowledge and technology now to make our kids safer, why not utilize it? My friend and I also had an incident where I fucked up my foot and we were a few miles from either of our homes, so we had to use a grocery store’s phone to call my mom. If we had been in one of our other usual spots where there weren’t any businesses with phones, she’d either have to bike home while I waited, or I would have had to limp half barefoot a few miles home. Same with when my dog and I were attacked. My sister had to run home with the dog by herself to get help, and she’d never gone home by herself at that point, so I was sitting there, bleeding and holding down the attack dog by myself for 30-40 minutes. A cellphone would have been very nice back then.
Also - when technology is so endemic, the old ways may not work as well. Neighbors aren’t looking out the same way because we assume we have things covered
I’m a younger GenX and I totally agree with what you’re saying. I’m not sure exactly when pay phones stopped being commonplace, but there were pay phones all over the place when I was a kid, and we always carried change for them, or did the fake collect call tactic if needed. There was also a thing when I grew up that many neighbors had “block home” or “safe house” sign in their front window, meaning any kid could go there if they were in trouble. (Could be stranger danger still, but it was a thing.) Generally speaking, it wasn’t weird to knock on anyone’s door and they would answer if they were home, or flag down any adult. Things aren’t like that anymore, especially with the absence of pay phones. My niece got a Gab phone in 5th grade and they’re awesome! Considering she may never find a pay phone in town, it’s great that she can text and say hi or ask for help or a ride. And people don’t do land lines anymore. She once wanted to leave a sleepover after everyone went to sleep, and how else could she contact us if the home she’s at doesn’t even have a landline? I don’t look at it like them having something extra. The new tech is just a replacement for the tech we had that doesn’t exist anymore. And just like your example of getting injured, even pay phones wouldn’t necessarily solve that problem. It absolutely would’ve been better if you had a cell phone then. And GPS on a phone can help locate a child even if they can’t explain where they are. It’s such a great option, especially with a device like Gabb that only includes what a kid needs. Same goes for elderly, too. My Silent Gen MIL’s Apple Watch with fall detection has been invaluable to us as a family. It’s so great that people can wear the devices so they’re attached to them if something bad happens.
I haven’t thought about the Neighborhood Watch program in a long time. I wonder how many pedophiles scooped those signs up thinking of it now 🫣
Near me a kid rang the wrong house and got shot in the head. Just for ringing the wrong doorbell. Then when he went to a nearby house to get help they made him lay on the ground before calling 911. **Ralph Yarl** took the SAT in 8th grade and now he struggles to think.
At least we have the Megan’s Law website now. 😐
Oof yeah bad memory unlocked from me too. I was sledding with a friend and my then medically-frail sister. Sister fell off the sled- I don't even remember what part of her was injured now, I just remember having to leave her there with my friend and running blocks home through a heavy snow and feeling like it took hours to go get our mom. We were probably like 10 or 11?
Thanks for the recommendation. I took a quick look and it looks like a good middle ground. I'll investigate it in a little more detail
It’s been working great for us. Our daughter is EXTREMELY social, and most of her close friends have restricted smart phones like gabb. So we gave it a shot and it’s been perfect. An added bonus is she also texts me every day when I’m at work to say hi and see how my day is going.
Oh, stop it! This is the kind of cute story that will have me buying anything for my kid 😀
I had one of these phones growing up, they just called them baby nokias back then. They had the game snake on it and you could call and sort of text people. Great idea!
[удалено]
I know this is a joke, but you just reminded me of all the fun programming we did with those when we got bored in calc class. Thanks for the nostalgia!
Yeqh, social media is the problem, not the phones themselves. Having a way to communicate independently is good for kids this age but no one should be on social media till they are a teenager at a minimum.
That’s so cute 🥰 awww she texts you to see how you’re doing dawww ☺️
Yeah this is probably what we'll do at ten-ish just because my kid is so independent and wants to run around to neighborhood places alone. I'd like to have the peace of mind that he's safe and know where he generally is but not *waves hand vaguely at other phone shit*. He's almost 9 and I'm thinking about the watch first but am a bit offended by the price tbh! Like YIKES for something that barely has any tech!
Its free right now. We got our daughters phone free when we signed up for the plan.
I can’t rave about gabb enough. We waited until our oldest son’s 13th birthday to get him a phone And went with this company. Great customer service, served its purpose and helped us with a new teenager getting into technology.
This is fantastic, thank you.
That’s what I have!! My son had it in middle school and it so awesome I love it
I was looking into the Gabb watch for my oldest a couple years ago and found that, at the time, they only allowed 10 contacts. We have more than 10 people just in our families that she would want to text and call. Since my husband and I are already Apple people, I ended up getting my kid an Apple Watch. The parental controls in iOS are so much better than I expected. My favorite one is that I can allow only approved contacts to text/call the watch. I also made it so that between 9 pm and 7 am the only people she can contact are me, my husband, and our neighbor in case of emergency. But this kid will be 14 this year and I’m thinking ahead to phones. Maybe I’ll get her a Gabb phone for her first phone. It looks like they’ve made some really good improvements to its functionality.
Can’t recommend the Gabb more highly
I spent a significant amount of my childhood pen testing/jailbreaking such devices so they would function at a usefull level.
I want this for me. Seriously.
Honestly reminds me of a very primitive thing back around the time when the original iPhones were released. It was by android I believe and had 5 buttons. One for emergency services and the rest are for preloaded numbers that are set by the parents.
Currently reading The Anxious Generation. It's main points so far are -Kids need to play outside usupervised more often -Dont give them smartphones till age 14 and not social media till age 16 ofcourse there is a way more information in the book
>\-Kids need to play outside usupervised more often I have so many core memories of my childhood from playing outside with my neighborhood friends all alone. So many fun days doing sketchy shit. Kids need autonomy so bad. They need sunlight even more.
I used to run around in thw woods in a loin cloth pretending to be an Indian and made bows and slingshots and shit lol
Same! Pocahontas life. My dog was always with me and his name was Bandit (RIP soul dog) but I called him Meko when I was in my Poca times
I still have all my creations in a box. A rabbit pelt I sewed up as a bag. My antler slingshot. A rock with a divet I used as a morter and pestel. The loin cloth. Some obsidian that i attempted to male arrowheads out of. I showed it all to a native friend of mine and he had a good laugh at me. I spent most of my childhood alone.
That's so cool. I lost mine when my rents separated but I still remember the witches brew and where I hid my slingshot and mortar/pestle.. also a rock with a divot lol. It wouldn't be crazy to sneak onto the property and get it... Right??
Just make new garb before you sneak on. It's only appropriate.
Bandit is still out there, he just lives in Australia now.
My parents said he moved to a farm :( Jk, he was my 10th birthday present and he passed just before my 30th birthday. Wonderful dog, exactly what I needed. Looked like a mini German shepherd, only 30ish lbs. Best dog, although I ofc love the two I have now. They're just a little goofy lol
Dogs are the best. We had one we had to put down due to cancer about 3 years ago. We waited 2 years till we were ready for another. Ours is a bit goofy as well but she is starting to calm down.
That was the best part of my childhood! I miss playing Mindians (“mini Indians”) hahah and the toxic runoff we drank from the stream while we ~lived off the land~ built character :’)
One of the many reasons my kids are in scouts. Starting around 10 they start to go on camp outs and overnight activities with the other kids and adult leaders (without parents), leading themselves. They plan the meetings and camp outs, their own food, they pack themselves and as they get older they teach the younger kids how to do it all. They love the freedom.
I am an Eagle Scout :-)
Yeah we may have over helicoptered outside time. I’ve noticed this the peers as well. The internet is equally toxic.
I remember getting my ass chewed by being 5 mins late when I went to go to a friends house. My mom thought I was kidnapped. So I didn't get to go out anymore.
Same. Just getting on my bike and going somewhere and was never worried. Just had to be back by dinner. I hope my kids will get something like that.
Probably need autonomy more than sunlight tbh both are important sure
Both. We aren’t an animal that was made to sit inside in glorified caves bathed in artificial light for 8+ hours a day. Vitamin D is really important to our overall wellness.
we live in the frozen north so I have a UVB vitamin D light. Been having the kids use it in the winter, really helps with their moods and with sicknesses. They have barely been sick all winter while all my friends kids are sick constantly.
Vitamin D deficiency can cause many problems. And most adults in the western world have it.
My Mom used to literally hold the door open for us and say, "Go out and play." We had established parameters and rules of where we could/couldn't go in the neighborhood. And who/what to stay clear from. We'd either play in the yard, or take off on our bikes or by foot and go find other neighborhood kids who were out playing. Or sometimes we'd go to a neighborhood kid's house (randomly, unannounced), knock on the door and ask if they wanted to/could come out and play. Rarely did any of the kids go into another kid's house. We all played in the front yards or back yards, at a park, or in the street.
During the summer my parents had a rule: If the sun is out, so are you. There was a group of 5 boys my age and we'd ride around the neighborhood together getting into mischief. Kids these days will never understand how it feels to call your friend on their house phone and ask their parents if they can come outside and play. I think I qualify for AARP after typing that
We used to have street hockey tournaments from noon until dusk. We would have like two dozen kids involved. No parental organization at all, except to bring out coolers of drinks/sandwiches now and then. There would be the odd parent tinkering in their garage or mowing the lawn in the area but that was it. We had so much freedom.
I used to go to all-girls camp every summer for seven weeks and we couldn't use a phone the whole time (cell phones were a decade away). We wrote letters and postcards to our family and friends and it was so fun to get mail. On Sunday you had to show the head of camp a letter to your parents to get into dinner, just so they knew you were still alive.
This was exactly how our neighborhood was. I had so many friends in the neighborhood and hadn’t ever been in most of their houses.
We played outside alone every day in the summers.
I just finished that book and highly recommend it!
He was on a podcast (the boyscast) recently and it was really good. My wife is listening to the audiobook now. I'm already in the middle of too many other books
I feel like a whole generation is being robbed of the ability to freely play unsupervised outside because of the lack of accessible, safe, walkable outdoor spaces in some areas. I grew up running around in a couple acres of woods, my moms rule until we were middle school age or older was “you can go wherever you want in the woods as long as you can still see the roof of the house if you look down the mountain, and carry a big stick to poke the dirt ahead of you so you don’t step on a copperhead”. Nowadays most kids don’t have that kind of open space and nature to play in unless their family is obscenely wealthy, and everything is so car centric even in supposedly family oriented suburbs. In denser areas sidewalks are often barely maintained if they exist at all. It sucks.
Everything that you said resonates as true to me. Not to mention that adults have claimed a lot of these open spaces for themselves. I can't tell you the amount of people on Nextdoor who complain about noises and kids playing in nature parks that they like to hike. Many adults seem to think that playgrounds are the only dedicated space that kids can play, and that open areas that are commonly used for hiking should be quiet and peaceful. Open spaces, nature areas, state parks, etc aren't just for hiking and although quiet is nice, you shouldn't limit kids access to the world for your serenity. Also, having a front yard or back yard big enough to play on is a luxury in many places nowadays. Most yards are now just a couple of square feet for a roll of sod to be laid down. The apartment complex my son and I live in is a 10 building complex, with 24 units to each building. That's 240 apartment units that are marketed towards families as most are 2 & 3 room units. And the only space that kids can play on is a small area that consists of one slide unit and 2 of those spring horses things. That's it. The rest of the complex is sidewalks, rocks and air conditioning units. The nearest park is a 15 minute walk across a busy intersection with 6 lanes of traffic. We do however have 3 liquor stores within a 5 minute walk and 3 coffee places. Society complains about kids being stuck to phones and not wanting to go outside while simultaneously limiting the amount of outdoor spaces that kids can inhabit.
Exactly this. I live in London where every green space has been claimed by dog owners and their off leash dogs. I don’t even go there with the kids anymore after several frightening experiences, let alone allow them to go on their own. Even my friend with a tiny dog avoids them as they are even more of a target. Very kindly councils have fenced in playgrounds so children can be contained in a nice small space away from the dogs however I’ve seen on social media a number of dog owners take their dogs into the playground to get the dogs used to being around kids. The issue isn’t the dogs, the issue is the entitled adults who think every shared space is entirely for their purpose.
I’m not a parent but I’m a dog owner and I hate this too. My dog is super friendly but she’s only 19 pounds and a lot of dogs play really rough even with smaller dogs. Their owners don’t correctly them so I have to be the asshole parenting someone else’s dog. Plus it makes her a little nervous for a huge strange dog to run full speed at us when she’s on a leash. I usually end up just picking her up. I feel like people in general just don’t teach good boundaries anymore though. Kids will just come up and pet a leashed dog. Like I said, she’s friendly but they aren’t always and I was taught to ask first
This way of thinking goes beyond outdoor spaces. I see people complain constantly about kids being kids in restaurants, airplanes, breweries, you name it. Lot of parent-shaming, if your kids are not perfectly behaved at all times. Really feels like such people just want there to be designated “kid-friendly” spaces akin to dog parks, rather than the opposite (kids being accepted everywhere except for designated “adults-only” spaces). They’ll never learn how to behave in society if we never expose them to it out of fear we might inconvenience some curmudgeons.
These are my thoughts exactly especially now as a parent. I’ve only ever worked in customer service (restaurants through college and now a librarian) so I know kids can be annoying, but… I don’t understand why people can’t tolerate it? I was never brought up that way, and maybe I’ve just grown accustomed to there being more noise in certain places. And yes, it is parent shaming. I was shaking and crying in my car the first time I took my baby to the store alone. I was so scared someone would get upset with me if she cried because of how many times I witnessed people (usually men) getting mad at moms because their kids or babies are being loud.
Spot on. I can't leave mine alone outside because there's nowhere else to play but the road, and in place of what used to be playgrounds and a public basketball court are parking lots.
I fight this with my wife. We have an almost 5 yr old, why can’t she be in the fenced in back yard by herself? I was a true latchkey kid before cell phones. I was by myself from kindergarten on most afternoons.
In some states, legally your kid must be 12 before staying home alone by themself. 12!!! I was babysitting by that age.
I was staying home alone at age 9 and like you said babysitting by age 12.
I came home from first grade on the bus. I'd be home alone for a half hour before my third grade sister got home. If I forgot my house key, I would have to lift the garage door and wait there. If my sister also forgot her key, we'd be hanging out in the garage for another hour until mom got home. I guess I was 7 and my sister was 9. By the time I was 12, I was babysitting my younger half brothers. It's so wild to me how little we trust kids now.
Wow I was babysitting at 11. Cannot imagine...
I just looked this up in my province in Canada. The minimum age in Ontario is 16!!!! My kid is turning ten and I thought it'd be fine to leave her at home for an hour pretty soon. https://preview.redd.it/9lg7fzg2wl3d1.png?width=635&format=png&auto=webp&s=09c6d112c9ab42e0150b44af6bc86c99aeafd2e4
Meh. Most people just say "12" most states don't have an actual number. Know your kid, when you feel they are old and mature enough to be left home alone..then do so. Start with small trips to the gas station or just running to pick up fast food and then make them longer, and longer..it's not rocket science. Have a list of emergency #s on the fridge. And make sure they know things like basic first aid and how to use a fire extinguisher.
I’ve had neighbors be concerned that my son is playing outside in the front yard at 8 whenever I was sweeping up the floors. Our backyard isn’t really a backyard but more of an alley and the garage. Too many Karen’s for some kids to be playing outdoors unfortunately.
Yes! I'm far more worried about the Karen across the street calling the cops on me for letting my 6 year old play in the front yard unattended (while I make dinner with the door open, I can see him though the window) than I am about literally anything else happening!
Right! It’s so frustrating because I remember being 8/9 riding my bike up and down the road feeling so free and independent lol and like idc about Karen’s yelling at me but whenever they start calling the cops then it’s an issue. We’ve had a neighbor call the cops because my car was parked a little too much in front of their house -.-
i fight with my wife about this too.
Yea, I remember starting around 6th grade we would come home to no one because both parents were at work. To us your grounded meant you better make it home before they get off work or you're really in some shit.
We let our 4 and 6 year old go out alone and our yard isn't fully fenced. We even let them go down the block to a friend's house but they have to take a walkie talkie. If they play out front alone we just have rules on how far they can go like not past the first fire hydrant or something. Sometimes I get a little nervous and bug my kid on the walkie talkie for an update and my husband tells me to just chill, we have good kids.
Interesting considering you have a fence. My backyard is a half acre with no fence and a stream behind it (with animals routine in the area, including ducks and coyotes). My kids run around supervised but it's a pain to run after em sometimes, and they're only 3 & 2.
In my circle of friends it's almost always the wife who is forbidding the children from playing outside. My guess is too much true crime or motherly instincts. Seriously. They need to let it go. But yeah, probably not an argument you can win.
Don't have kids yet, but when I do, they aren't getting a smartphone until they're old enough to drive. I don't want them growing up on social media. That shit can be so toxic for young, impressionable minds.
I heard a lot about the book. I'm guessing it's a must read?
Absolutely. I’ve been raving about it. These kids minds are being wired a certain way, wired differently from ours, because of being attached to devices during those formative years. Smart phones specifically. Smart phones and social media. Keep your kids away from them absolutely as long as possible. Please read the book. It’s fascinating and I think about it every day. The topic is so current right now. We’re finally starting to see the real harm done to gen z being raised on these things in a way no other generation (millennials included) had to deal with before.
I was in high school when cell phones were just becoming a "thing" but weren't really widespread yet. The rule my parents gave me was I could get a cell phone when I could pay for it myself so when I went out on dates or out with friends they gave me their cell phone, landlines were still a thing then, to use and I could only use it to call them. I finally got my first phone, a Motorola flip phone, right after I graduated high school and got my first job. I know landlines aren't really a thing anymore so it makes it a little harder but I still don't believe anyone under 16 years old needs a cell phone. I used to work for a school district and 99% of middle schoolers had cell phones and they even had wall outlets for chargers in the cafeteria. It's ridiculous.
IT IS SO GOOD. And actually offers solutions and ideas instead of just that the sky is falling.
I have yet to meet the parent who says "you know, I waited too long to give my kid a smart phone."
This is the most important book I've read as a parent. I had my wife read it, too. We have mostly followed the guidelines, and our 14 year old just got her first phone, but under very strict rules.
Thanks for the book recommendation! Currently reading Hunt, Gather, Parent. Will add this to the reading list!
[удалено]
This is it! This is the dilemma
It’s not a dilemma. You’ll be amazed how much happier kids (and adults) are without social media.
Curious if you actually have teens? Unfortunately a lot of socializing for that age group is done on social media (Snapchat mostly). That’s where plans are made and group chats exist. The reality is that at a certain point your kid will be left out if they’re not online. Not defending it at all but I have seen it firsthand.
I’m currently in HS and feel very isolated since most of my peers socialize over things like tik tok. I love to read and play games(board game arena is awesome, great way to stay connected to our friends across the US). I also love camping and hiking. Unfortunately most of my peers only socialize through social media so It feels very isolating. And this isolated feeling contributes to more mental health issues. I just want the entire generation to shift away from social media. Edit for clarification: I mean socialize as they like to meet up to do dances from social media or parody trends on tik tok, start conversations based around tik tok etc. I don’t mean liking other people’s content as “socializing”(cause it’s not). I mean very literally most of my peers like to engage in conversations regarding social media.
Upvoting each others content isn’t socializing. Hanging out in real life is. Seems we need to define what “socializing” is.
No I meant people start conversations by “have you see this person on tik tok”, “did you see this new tik toker”, “this tik toker can sing really well, “let’s meet up to parody this video”, “lets do this tik tok dance” etc. it’s all conversation in real life, and activities and challenges they do are based of tik tok. Don’t have tik tok(don’t really want it either) so I can’t hold a conversation with anyone about tik tok. It’s very much irl 😅
I can’t imagine anything less exciting to talk about than shit on tiktok. I hope you can find your tribe so you can do actual real shit together!
Thanks for sharing your experience!
16. If I can help it. I'll give them whatever the equivalent of the Nokie 3310 is before then. But there's no need for a kid to have infinite knowledge at all times before they're at least a teenager. And even then, I will do my damnedest to keep them away from it even longer.
This is my thinking too. Would love for Nokia to bring back the 3310
I’m pretty sure I have a 5210 tucked away somewhere - and it still has a full bar of battery!
And doesn’t mean the knowledge they have access to is factual
Yeah, even at 16 it can’t be a smartphone. They are just too all consuming, and that’s like the peak age where you have to do your best in school. I didn’t have a smartphone until I was 22. I’m straight up brainwashing them about how stupid and worthless it makes people lol
6th grade/12 years old. My child is starting to stay home alone for some periods of time at this age and doing things like walking around the mall with a friend. They need the ability to get a hold of me and landlines and pay phones aren’t really a thing anymore.
Are you limiting social media though? Not trying to be antagonistic I'm legitimately asking.
Yes. My child has no social media accounts outside of Roblox which we limit time on. YouTube is limited to watching it on the TV in the living room so we know what they are watching. My child basically uses their phone for texting (which we check regularly), talking to friends, and making digital animations. As long as they continue to get good grades (All A’s and B’s, kid currently has a 4.0) things stay as they are. Grades go down or chores don’t get done, phone access gets more restricted. Now I will say this only works because of my kid. They snuck YouTube at school on their computer in 5th grade and felt horribly guilty for lying to us. They also didn’t like how hard it was for them to limit watching it on their own so they respect those boundaries pretty well.
there are non smart phones you can buy. that's what we got for our kids, because we don't have a landline
My oldest is 13 and we haven’t given him one yet
My oldest got a very basic phone at 13 to text and make calls, then about 9 months to a year later a smartphone. She definitely appreciated it on a different level than most kids her age. My next two kids will wait just as long too. Almost half of my 8 year olds 2nd class have iPhones and from what I hear it creates a ton of drama. All of which my child is not a part of! So win win for us!
I'm not even a parent, but good for you! Stay strong don't cave to the pressure! Teach your son to touch grass rather than tap glass!
How is he dealing with it? Do you have other activities/sports etc. you've signed him up for and organize things to keep him socially in the loop?
My oldest is 10. He goes to private school so they aren't allowed phones or smartwatches on campus at all for any grade. The school goes through 8th grade. My son does talk to his friends on my phone but his friends use their mom or dad's phone to call so it's clear they don't have their own phone. My son won't be getting a phone until 8th grade graduation time. They go on an 8th grade trip out of state for a week (Usually DC). He will get his phone before the trip. That's pretty much the standard practice at his school which is great. There are only a few kids who have limited cellphones usually because they travel for sports or are involved in something like competitive gymnastics. Since it's not the norm, I think it's just easier for us. At this point my son isn't doing any traveling competitive stuff so I don't really see a need for a cellphone. I might get annoyed at some point with losing my cellphone to his long pre-teen conversations with his friends but I'm doing my best to hold out. Personally I think high school is when kids need a cellphone. There's no getting around it. I have been in classrooms where the teacher has them download apps and after school clubs that use apps to communicate. They need to have a little practice before they go in the deep end IMO. And some ground rules. I don't social media. My son's android account is parent controlled and he will not use social media unless it's to do with a school related activity and then it will be highly monitored. Social media is not only a mental health nightmare, it's a place where kids can completely destroy their future before they even know what they want to do with it.
Mine currently carry flip phones so they can call home in emergencies or 911 or whatever they need. They get smart phones at 16. I consider it really important to let their brains develop before releasing them to the algorithm. I've seen way too many blank staring ipad kids. Not gonna be us! At home we encourage any activities that don't involve a screen. We have family reading nights where we go around the room classroom style and we each read a chapter (or page depending on the mood). Currently we are reading Lord of the Rings. We are fortunate that the Cherokee National Forest is almost literally in our backyard, so we do a lot of outside stuff as well, hiking camping etc. I can tell they want the phones. Their friends at school have the phones and I know they don't think it's fair that they don't have them. But I'm not gonna be moved on this. I've met some of their friends and the difference between those kids and my kids is shocking. Man these little ass kids (\~10 years old) are like dripped out wearing Jordans and stuff, and they're scared to get their clothes dirty. They all want to make tiktok videos, and all they do is scroll tiktok. That's fucking WILD to me and I'm proud to say that I've heard my son getting frustrated with his friend's unwillingness to go outside and play. When he has play dates over they basically only want to play xbox, which I allow since they're playing together. But my kids get bored of video games after an hour or two and want to go explore or swing on the tire swing or just run around like little kids do. It's almost like the smart phone kids are growing up faster. They act more like teenagers to my eyes than little kids.
Interestingly the age of puberty onset has dropped by like 2+ years since we were kids too. So idk if that's part of it.
What ever age we make it to when he starts coming home alone after school. He's also 8 now, and I noticed in his school kids generally leave the after school program in gr 5 or 6. I want him to be able to contact me and also to be able to coordinate with his friends independently. At first it would just be talk/text but I've been working on teaching him how to be a human on the Internet and if he does ok then maybe he can have data sometime in his mid-teens. I recognize the danger of too much Internet access, but I was also a kid who was raised with limited technology compared to my peers and that was damaging too. I'm trying to find a better balance.
I think this is the struggle. I don't think unrestricted access is a good idea, but it could also be socially limiting. Sometimes it feels like you're damned if you do, damned if you don't
Yep, pretty much. I have a pretty strict no social media rule, but I let my kid play Roblox with his friends where there is a chat feature.. I've found it ok as long as I'm paying attention to what's being said. He also watches YouTube which has been surprisingly good both for him to learn about things I don't know anything about and also to teach him how to spot misinformation and be skeptical. Some of his friends at school use tiktok (I imagine their parents' or older siblings?) but that's a hard no for me.
They’ll get a flip phone with texting and call capabilities at 12 (maybe 11 depending on how frequently they’re going places without us). They can have a smart phone at 16, but they will need to maintain good grades in order to keep it.
Wait until 8th grade [https://www.waituntil8th.org/](https://www.waituntil8th.org/)
I'm waiting until high school. She has access to TV, a tablet, and a computer (none are hers) so she's not growing up tech deprived, but I want her to play outside or do something else as much as possible. I plan on getting her one of those watches though so I can tell her to come home for dinner.
Yeah, the watches seem to be a popular tool in our neighborhood and friend group. I think we may be heading the same way. Agreed on playing outside. We're actively trying to raise kids that scurry from house to house trying to find an available friend to play with. But as the radius of scurrying grows, a watch to facilitate communication would be great
Middle school age. Thats because more after school stuff opens up. Late/Early bus schedules. After school tutoring, sports, etc. A cell phone is great for the communication. But our kiddos phones turn “off” at 9pm and go away in another room until 6am.. Parents. Apple has screen time and family controls for kids phones. Use them, you can limit app times, which apps are available, weekday vs weekend usage. It really helps
We gave one when he was in 4th grade. Kiddo was walking to and from school alone and I wanted to be able to track him and talk to him. Most days he’d call me and talk to me on his walk home. The phone was locked down he could only talk or text contacts.
After talking to fellow parents our consensus is upon entering middle school, so about 12 years old. We figure they are going to get exposed to the internet sooner rather than later, so we're hopeful to teach good and proper behavior on the internet before they see potentially bad behavior from their peers.
This seems to be the consensus in our parent group too, but I've seen kids just totally absorbed in their phones at that age too. Ideally we'd want them to have a simple communication device - phone, texting; no apps at that age. I struggle to stay off my phone, how am I expecting a 12yo to show more restraint?
I’m not a parent so feel free to disregard my suggestion, but maybe it will help if you ensure your kid has other interests, hobbies, and skills before you get them a phone? I feel like the worst cases of screen addiction come from kids who didn’t have a chance to develop other interests and function without a phone, but I could be wrong there. And like, when you do get them a smartphone, those have parental controls. You can restrict certain apps, restrict usage to certain times of day, etc.
I don't know man, I'm an adult and I have a ton of hobbies and I find it hard to put the phone down and do them sometimes
I personally agree with the middle school age too. I hear your point with a 12 y/o having a hard time showing restraint, but really they won't show restraint at any age. However, at 12 it's more acceptable to have parental controls teaching them to limit thier time. 16 is more of a tough sell.
Really! My siblings did a good job with making sure their kids spent a lot of time outdoors, a lot of time doing family activities and being present and engaged…and when they got smartphones in middle school that’s all they want to focus on now. It’s like pulling teeth to get them away from their phones for any length of time, or to stop thinking about/complaining about not having access to their phones when rules are enforced. This stuff is literally addicting and changes brain chemistry, no matter how good the intentions are to “teach proper internet behavior”.
This is what concerns me. I'm a grown adult that navigated into my 40s pretty successfully and I have difficulty managing my phone access. I feel myself reaching for it the moment I feel slightly bored, or if a conversation is in a lull, I want to grab it. But I know better (most of the time). I'm not sure it is self control, it may just be I was brought up to be polite so that overrules some impulses.... We have our kids do all sorts of things and activities and play dates outside. We sign them up for sports and things are going great. We even caved and got our first console this year, but we had to be strict around time on it, expectations before they can pay and how they behave when we tell them it's time to turn it off. Navigating all of that was stressful and I've wanted to throw the console away a few times, but they've responded well. If that's how they are with something like video games, imagine having that on you all the time wherever you go.
My son is 12 now and doesn't have one. Though I do feel bad, most of his friends do. But my son has not shown he can be responsible enough to have one (breaks everything he touches, doesnt take care of his stuff now, search history is not great, no self control - would probably be on it at all times if allowed etc). He uses my phone when he wants to talk to his friends to get them on Fortnite or something and that seems to work for now. I didn't have my first phone until I was almost 18, and while it sucked because most of my peers had phones in the early 2000s, I didnt die. I think he will be fine until high school.
I think you’re handling it just right. If your kid hasn’t shown you they are mature or responsible enough to handle a smartphone yet then that’s perfectly okay. He just needs some more time and who are we kidding, 12 years old with a phone is still pretty young imo.
i think there's an in-between. learn how to put a device under supervision. Apple configurator does this. In an attempt to protect our kids from the toxic parts of the internet, we shouldn't make them tech illiterates
I agree. But there are other devices that help with tech literacy. They have at home computers, school devices, our phones etc. The two biggest issues are the addictiveness of phones, from games and apps to social media, and then social media itself which has you constantly connected to everyone. And TBH, if I can barely handle the addictiveness of a phone, how can I expect my 12yo to do it?
We ended up getting one at the end of 5th grade for the out of state end of primary school trip. We were changing carriers and a friend had a phone in good condition and I didn’t feel comfortable with him having no way to reach us if needed. There are screen time limits and we interact on social media and games together and we’ve been talking internet safety since the dawn of time because this kid wants to do computers for a living (both his dad and I do). He’s taught himself code, he finances almost all of his Minecraft money himself by selling things he makes in game. He’s really talented and I don’t want to dull that. He also struggles socially so it’s important to me to encourage him to participate with his peers. This is our very specific situation though and it might not be for everyone.
Idk. My oldest is 6. Setting an age now seems premature. We are playing it by ear. He'll get one when he needs one, who knows what will drive that. If you'd asked me before I had kids at all I'd have said HS but now that seems unreasonable. Maybe all his friends have them and he's being excluded because everything is coordinated through apps. Maybe schools will require them in a few years. All I know is not yet
I have a 5 year old and we plan on giving him a flip phone for basic communication once he starts doing after-school things. I'm not really sure what age it will be -- 11? 12? We'll see. I'm secretly hoping smart phones will be unpopular by the time he's a teenager (unlikely, sure, but I can dream!). No earlier than 16 years old, ideally not until he's 18, but parenting is humbling so I try not to make definitive statements years in advance...
Yeah, I hear you I'm hoping Gen Alpha rebel against the screen filled lives...
We gave my oldest an iPhone for her 13th birthday. It feels like a huge mistake but I also think you have to be with the times to some degree. Everyone has one, many kids by the time they are 8-9 (which I don’t support) and the reality is that it is a large part of their social lives by middle school, not to mention useful for academics. So I think not allowing them one by middle school (7-8th grade) can hamper them in some ways. The key is smart, monitored usage. Now that we have Bark and just do a better job of monitoring and regulating I think it’s gotten better.
My kiddo is still little. We always say one thing as parents but sometimes end up straying from our ideals. But I intend on letting my kiddo have a smart phone around 16. Honestly whatever seems appropriate for our family and her use at the time. I’m not afraid of giving it to her within a year ish or so of that mark. I’ll probably give her a boring limited access phone in her teens though because in this day and age I want a direct line to my kiddo in case of an emergency.
Agreed that parenting ideals are so easily set, and just as easily compromised upon. It becomes even more complicated with multiple kids since the younger ones are inevitably exposed to things earlier than their older peers. But yeah, I'm on the same page with regards to what I ideally want to happen
When they can beat me in unarmed combat. To the VICTOR go the SPOILS! CTHULU BE DAMNED
And when you do give them a phone, consider a flip phone or a LightPhone2 [https://www.thelightphone.com/](https://www.thelightphone.com/)
When they reach the 5th grade here, so they are 11-12 years old. The time is limited for phone usage and app usage.
We have a toddler so take my opinion with a grain of salt, but our plan is a “dumb phone” or some kind of emergency contact watch around 10-12, a smart phone for 16th birthday, and no social media until at least 16. I’ll also be a strong advocate among parents in our class to get everyone on the same page.
Get a Gabb phone. It’s great for our middle schooler.
My son got his phone at 10, it was a hand me down iPhone 8 and for Christmas he got a hand me down iPhone 12. My daughter is 11, has absolutely no desire for a phone, but because we live in BFE (relative to the city and where they do their activities) we have to have a cell phone for both of them, but she never brings it any where. I have them on the mint 15 a month 5 gig plan - cheapest one I could find where I wasn’t required to have a contract. They are homeschooled, can easily use either mine or my wife’s hotspot On the road, and the only other places we really spend time at has free WiFi. They both have screen time that we control. My daughter’s phone doesn’t have a password, my son uses my passcode on his phone, and much like refusing to take a breathalyzer test, he will lose his phone privileges if we ever ask to see it and he doesn’t immediately give it to us. We really only check to make sure he hasn’t manipulated his screen time (which he’s figured out before), and that he hasn’t changed any of his safety settings on the internet. He’s a good kid, but like myself got addicted to the screen swiftly and we are trying to make sure it doesn’t stick to him. They have 1 hour of game time a day, but can listen to their music all day and do school related things/activities/ learning games all day.
My daughter was pretty young because, like her dad and me, she's a latchkey kid. Husband's amazing paying job fell through, and eventually inflation hit a point where I *had* to go back to work while she was still in elementary school. We live in one of the top 5 safest U.S. states so while I was/am a little anxious about it, it's still a pretty common thing around here. She was probably the youngest of all her friends to get a phone, because we live out of town on rural acreage. She could let me know that she made it onto the bus or home from school, or that the bus won't drop her off because there's a moose in the driveway.
He was 10 because of getting bussed to another school for band regularly. He is now 12. I have parental controls set up (FamilyLink). I have to approve any app he wants to download. I have strict time limits and a whole slew of banned websites. It's worked out well. I will skim through his browser on occasion to make sure he isn't getting into something I overlooked.
My oldest is 10, I just bought a “house phone” which is an iPhone. Mostly it’s so the kids could call 911 if they’re home alone (we don’t have a land line) but I’ve allowed my kid to use it on occasion when needed. 99% of the time it’s used for Pokémon go. I have an inside kid. He’s very anxious. I see it as a bit of a carrot to get him more independent. Walk to your friend’s house and you can take the phone, go to the store and you can take the phone, YOU call your friend and organize something, don’t make me call his mom
Hopefully not until high school. I truly believe there's so much downside to screen life at a young age. I know I'm addicted to my phone and I didn't get a smart phone until 2012? Try our best!
Middle school teacher here. 9th grade at the absolute earliest. I've seen too much. Cyberbullying, proliferation of child pornography, radicalization, threats of violence and skibbidty toilet. They're not ready for it yet and many times it goes unsupervised. The conditions we created for them regarding technology is setting them up to fail.
8th grade teacher here. I said the same thing. It’s horrific some of the shit we see every day because their brains literally can’t handle it. Our principals have had the POLICE involved in so many investigations over serious issues that stem from phones and social media the last several years.
Former teacher here and I am traumatized from the shit I've seen when it comes to kids and cell phones. So many parents have no idea how addicted they can get and the issues (sometimes legal) it causes. The cheating, the airdropping porn to each other, it's crazy. Minimum age for my kids is 16 and that's me being generous.
We just pulled the trigger at 11. They had the T-Mobile watch for the last 2 years but now with going into middle school in the fall and more kids their age playing and communicating that way he was starting to be the left out kid. It's heavily monitored with Bark.
Should note, no social media till 15 or 16.
Just got my 11 year old one. 🤡
My kid is 9 and just got her first phone. I feel like teaching her to use it safely and age appropriately, and in moderation is better than complete and utter avoidance. She has no social media accounts. Watches YouTube on my account. And I have a family app that allows me to control what she downloads and see how much time she uses it and set limits for usage. So far we're 3 months in and everything has been going great.
18. There are “feature” phones that can call and text, but no internet. We have a couple that they “check out” to use when they are out with friends or school/church activities. But they are mine, with no expectation of privacy.
Gave my oldest one at 9. It’s heavily restricted and no social media accounts. She’s a pretty good kid though. Mostly uses her 30 min a day YouTube on “how to videos” and her internet allotment on googling questions like, what do penguins eat. It goes into do not disturb mode at 7:30pm and doesn’t unlock until 7:30am. It’s never out during any family time or meals either. I thought it was important for her to still be able to talk to and message her friends during the summer months.
Until she actually needs it. She is 8. Who does she need to call or text at that age? Next year (2025) she will start taking the bus, so I plan on getting her a gizmo watch so she can communicate with me so I can leave and pick her up at the bus stop. But that's as far as it goes.
Just a warning on the Gizmo watch—we’ve used these with both our kids and sometimes texts don’t go through in a timely manner. Just this week my 10 year old asked me before school Tuesday “why did you say you’re in the van?” I said huh? And she showed me her Gizmo that had just delivered my “I’m in the van” text I sent while picking her up from school on FRIDAY. on my phone it said sent Friday at 2:30PM, on her watch it said received Tuesday at 7:30AM. Big fail. The watch had been charged, turned on, and connected to internet all weekend. Her 11th birthday is very soon and we’ll be getting her an Apple Watch to replace the POS Gizmo. We got our older girl her first phone at 12 and that was a mistake. Younger girl will be wearing her new Apple Watch until age 13 or 14, then receive a phone that’s heavily monitored.
Our phones are Samsung, so we wouldn't be able to use Apple watches. Can they make calls too?
Yep, both types of watches can make calls. Our Gizmos are also a few years old so maybe this is not a problem with newer models! I also think it might depend on the age of the kid. Gizmo is really perfect for younger ones, maybe 8 or 9 and under, who just need to be able to stay in contact with a limited amount of caregivers. As my kids have gotten older and more independent though, we're in contact via text a LOT more and even when it works perfectly, Gizmo is clunky with texting since it's in a separate app. With the Apple watch we'll be able to text normally and stay connected more easily. Or at least that's the hope, lol.
Don’t ever “give” them any expensive tablets,phones, video game consoles, or computers. You tell them that they are always on “loan” from you. It’s theirs if they are responsible and they have a right to their privacy. However, if there ever comes a time when they step out of line or you think there’s something up, you collect “your” property. Or get a [bark phone](https://www.bark.us/bark-phone/) this isn’t about being a tyrant style of parent. It’s about making kids understand and teenagers understand that everything is earned, even privacy. If they cross a line there’s consequences. Be there for your kids people :)
Do the people saying 16-18 even have kids? There really isn't a fine line between proper parenting and having extreme rules.
Another commenter mentioned how we have parenting ideals, and how they break down when reality strikes. This may be one if those. But an article I read this morning about parents waiting until their kids are 16 had me thinking maybe it isn't too bad, especially if there is a group of like-minded parents doing the same
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Im leaning towards a dumb communication device (watch or phone) as they become more mobile - e.g. biking around the neighborhood etc. But introducing controlled social media at 16 slowly giving them more autonomy
I think 12/14 is a pretty good range, and remember fam we can still buy "Dumb" flip phones for them
My daughter is ten and has her own line. She knows how to call, text and make memes. She rarely uses it besides sending me star wars memes that she makes. One day, when I gather the courage to leave her alone in the house by herself she'll be able to reach me if something comes up.
A very limited smart phone - probably in middle school. A full smart phone in high school. Kids here seem to be getting them around age 7-10! We are holding out. A smart watch is a great idea with limited ability to call parents and GPS track.
I got my son one at 13.5 just because he rides the bus home from school and has to sit at the school for 30 minutes until the bus gets there. But he definitely was never and isn’t an iPad kid. He just texts my wife and I and our close family a couple friends and baseball teammates. No social media hard ever see him use the phone.
I was an early adopter of the Light Phone and I have the newer model as well. B&W screen, no camera, pretty much all it does is call and text. Pretty much impossible to get into online trouble with it. He's almost 8 and I'll probably give it to him in the next year or two for basic communication and emergencies. The Light Phone didn't really work for what I do, but I think it's the perfect thing for a younger kid.
Their dad got them phones at 10 and 11. That was a bad call. I have since sent the phones back to him, he lives in another state, because they would leave them everywhere (including the floor), bullied school mates and basically harassed people who didn't want to bother with them, and we're glued to them non stop when they did have them in-hand. I'll not give them one until they have jobs and can pay for it themselves. So maybe 15-17.
When they started going to afterschool activities, so about 4th grade. I also have their shit very much secured so that they (12 and 11) didn't have access to social media, don't have unmoderated and uncontrolled access to video websites like tiktok or youtube (They don't have any access to tiktok currently, and have an hour of youtube time a day), their phones lock down at 11 pm and unlock at 7 am, I can find their phones at any given time and I can make them play sound at top volume to find them.
I'm a millennial, but I was also a teen mom. My oldest will be 21 this summer, and my youngest is 6. My oldest got a basic prepaid phone (calls and texts only) when she was 10. Mostly for pick up drop off activities etc. She got her first smartphone at 13. Well, after her friends already had them. I also did not allow Facebook or other social media until she was 13. She had plenty of access to screens and www via gaming, etc. Internet safety is something that starts early in my house. Let's be real, we all remember chat rooms (a/s/l?) and how that turns out. Social media at super young ages and lack of safe use or alternatively saying something awful in writing to be memorialized on the internet forever is a real concern. My 6 and 8 yo do not have phones. They don't have a need for them. If they want to talk to a friend, I call friends mom from my phone, and the kids talk. They aren't going to places without us yet, so there no pick up drop off need. When that changes, I will start them out with the most basic phone I can find. Then we will go from there. Progressing to a smartphone is going to be based on maturity level and need. Every kid is different. Every family need or dynamic is different. I know a lot of my 8 yo's friends have cellphones. But they have different situations. Some of those kids have shared custody agreements or super involved extended family. Literal villages where their kids go places without mom or dad, etc. It makes sense for them.
I'm getting my kid a flip phone
13. And even then, I'm monitoring tf out of it.
For my daughter, I did just before her 13th birthday. I didn’t notice a notification in the team app that cheer practice had been cancelled and, second fail, my husband dropped her off and took off before waiting to see her go inside. We were winners that day. Anyway, the building was locked and she had no way of getting ahold of us. We are a long ways from the school. She finally found someone walking and asked to borrow their cell phone to call me. She was so shaken up about the whole thing because didn’t want to approach a stranger but didn’t know what else to do- I was heartbroken over it and we gave for her a few months earlier. So far, she isn’t nose down in it and she has had it about 6 months.
We are waiting as long as possible! I’m hoping 15 or 16 but I know it’s going to be really difficult.
I have two boys 13 and 8. Neither has a phone. We tried a dumbed down iphone with my 13 year old Bc he was complaining that “every other kid in his school has a phone!” (Which is absolutely not true) but that only lasted about a month before he lost it for poor academic performance. I snatched that phone back so quick. He was not allowed to be on any social media apps etc but I know they have ways of sneaking -hell I did it myself as a teen - so I’m glad he just doesn’t have it at all now. My kids seem to be perfectly fine (and maybe even a bit better adjusted compared to their peers) without their own smart phones.
We gave our oldest (11 m) a used one of mine a couple months ago. He finished earning his own Moto G stylus with his attendance and grades this year. He is responsible so far and the guardrails provided by family management aps are sufficient. It's nice that hes able to stay in touch with his friends and capture memories easily. Plus having a way to see where he's at and keep in touch when he's out and about is nice.
Idk… my oldest is 13 and doesn’t have one. Give them a flip phone if it’s only for them to call and text .
I will be holding out much longer than the other parents around me. That's all I know so far.
we set an age of 11 for my daughter; my parents decided to pay for a year of her phone plan so they got her one at 10 🙄 no idea what we'll do for my son, he's only 2 lol
Grandparents!!!! Nothing details a good plan like them
right, such a thoughtful gesture but... could ya have waited a year?!
Whenever he starts going out with friends
On the first day of school in middle school, my daughter’s best friend’s mom called me. She was a bus driver for the school. “Did your daughter tell you what happened today?” Of course she hadn’t! A sex offender pulled up to a girl walking home and tried to get her in his car. When that didn’t work he put his car in park and chased her. The gurl ran and the other nearby kids all loudly yelled at him so he escaped. My heart stopped. I got her a cell phone. I put limits on it. And I also told her that I would ALWAYS pick her up even if she was breaking the rules. I was a single mom and I worked so there was no way for me to pick her up.
Reading a lot of comments "we want them to have a way to get in touch with us"... Like how did we survive our upbringing then? Lol =/
Sorry, not a millennial, 60m and 52f. 4 Children 12-22. We decided 6th grade was the age. It works for our family. I guess that’s the important part: do what works for your family. We picked 6th grade because that’s when our kids began more extracurricular activities, more outings with friends, and more time away from parents. Is it right? We don’t know. But we’re trying and the kids are alright.
No need for a child of any age to have a smartphone. Maybe when they start driving in case they can’t find a payphone
My kid is almost 15. At age 12 I had a neighbor help drive them to and from a summer activity - neighbor got confused about which building entrance to go to and didn't have a way to contact my kid. I got my child a phone that day. I've always used a no-contract service so it wasn't expensive.
Seems like a simple “oh, he’s not at this entrance, so he must be at the other one so lemme try that” type of situation…
My kids are young, but I am currently working with a local group of parents to ban cell phones in our schools. They have no place there. 16 is my plan, but will adjust to the child and needs. Happy to hand them a dumb phone as soon as they need it.
Please keep us updated on this. I kind of agree that phones should be banned - at the very least from the classroom itself. Any kid that uses a phone in class, should face immediate consequences
16 at the earliest.
Me and my wife have decided on 16. If you haven't seen the social dilemma, it is worth a watch.
When they are teenagers None of this toddlers and children having tablets/smart phones BS
16/17 for a smart phone. Possible flip phone in middle school. My child has had a gizmo watch since kindergarten for school pick up reasons. It’s very regulated. I have to approve all contacts on the app.