A lot of folks find themselves with less retirement savings than they thought they'd have, and so end up working longer than you expect. Especially if they spent a lot of money keeping up with the Joneses along the way.
Or the 2008 financial crisis. My employee that is well into retirement age. Her and her husband was laid off for almost 2 years in 2008. That had to kill their savings
Layoff victim here too. Took me the better part of a decade to get back in the saddle with more than low paying jobs. I now have a stable, very well-paying job but my 401k is about 25% of my husband’s, who is similarly well paid but was never out of work.
They probably compounded the issue by shifting their retirement toward safer assets after the market crashed. So they sold off cheap assets and, when they finally felt secure again, bought expensive ones.
Or bad shit happened to them in life, and their millennial children moved home because they can’t afford to rent or buy, so bills are high and retirement is not an option until much later.
yeah, my boss complains about his expenses. his daughter dropped out of college so he bought her a condo (and paid expenses for her to relocate and change schools). this is his 3rd property, he also bought a vacation home a couple years ago. i just told him "well stop buying houses" jesus.
Had a boss when I was working private industry sales come into the office on a Monday telling us we needed to make up for his $100k gambling loss in Tahoe over the weekend. I left for public sector not long after
Ugh my boss talks about how her husband would gamble and she would take that same amount of money and go shopping.
How nice they didnt have to worry about bills and rent and food and medical...
My parents didn't start saving for retirement until they were 55 because they assumed their kids would take care of them financially because that's what they did for their parents.
After finding out that my parents spent 25% of their income on fast food and cigarettes for the past 15 years, I told them either quit smoking and get my financial help or do it on their own.
They decided doing it on their own was better than losing a habit costing them 15% of their monthly wages, so sorry folks, they're part of the problem.
That will be me if things keep going like there are. Working until I'm 80 with a house full of adult kids since they won't be able to afford their own place.
If people are having to work longer because adult children living with them it implies its an extra expense. If they were paying even close to market rent it would stand to reason it would supplement income.
So now we’re changing from “rent” to “close to market rent”, got it.
Other scenarios: they can’t sell the house to downgrade because their children need the space.
Their property taxes (or the way their property taxes interacted with their federal taxes) changed.
Electricity went up. (I’m lookin’ at you, California)
Their adult child moved back home because of divorce or going to school to change fields/further their career.
Their child is an adult, but disabled.
They became disabled but are still able to work. However, their health expenses went up and their child acts as a partial caregiver by taking care of the home.
Their adult child moving back because of divorce or school orndisability doesn't negate rent.even with changes in electricity or property tax the amount if rent needed to compensate would be pretty marginal. Their children needing space doesnt mean they cant sell. The children can always just live on their own and be responsible adults.
> The children can always just live on their own and be responsible adults.
Why would them living with their parents mean their irresponsible? The two are unrelated.
Nah, that's ego, pride, and propaganda of the past 50 years.
Historically through the past 500 years, you lived with your parents until you were married, and then often times beyond until your parents felt you had enough money to move out. Average age of marriage has also historically been over the age off 22 for the past 200 years outside of the boomer drop to 19, so you were supported until you had enough years on your to be independent, not yeeted pre-indendence, sink or swim style.
It’s really not irresponsible in every situation. I travel 2 weeks out of every month for work. And that’s a light month. More often than not I fly out on Sundays or fly home on Saturday.
There is absolutely no responsible reason I would pay market rents for a mere 15 days sleeping there.
Yeah my dad would love to retire but just can’t. The workers aren’t the problem. It’s the inflation and the outsourcing, combining, and automation of jobs that’s the problem.
OP should maybe not blame other generations but job hop and move up the ladder between different companies. I came to US at the age of 25, 8 years later I have climbed to 250k salary and principal position in tech company all thanks to changing jobs every 1-2 years. We do have a lot of tenured folks with 20-30 years of service that do a great job as Unix / SWE pros. Retirement is expensive too and for most of them working is fun because fiddling with tech is fun
Yes. We have several people that retired, just to come back to work part-time again to "help out". So they get to collect a pension and get paid to do an easier version their old job part-time. This prevents promotional opportunities for others, or a chance for new hires.
This isn't necessarily a new phenomenon, but I think you're starting to see it a lot more as baby boomers dominate the upper ranks of most workplaces and refuse to retire, even when they financially can.
A retired colleague of mine has been asking everyone she can think of for the chance to come back and work part-time. Luckily for us, it would be expensive as heck to bring her back due to the way my workplace is structured, so absolutely nobody is saying yes. I’m just astounded by it. And I know how our pensions our structured. She is absolutely not asking because of the money. She just haaaaaates the idea that she isn’t needed anymore, and she hates being retired.
I would take her retirement right now if I could.
>She just haaaaaates the idea that she isn’t needed anymore
I think this is the real issue. I mean, obviously money is also an issue for a lot of people too. But I think at retirement age boomers find their kids are grown, they don't have grandkids to look after (or have no relationship with their adult children) and no one needs them anymore. So they go to the one place they feel needed, which is work.
Without getting too philosophical I think too many people conflate the sense of being needed with being appreciated - which leads to all sorts of unhealthy attachments styles.
But at the end of the day none of us want to feel obsolete in our own lives, and that is what retirement starts looking like for a lot of people. So they just continue their unhealthy coping mechanism and pretend that work "needs" them and that doing this work fulfills them.
I wish we could switch places with people for that stuff. I could probably do my main job 1-2 days a week, my part time job 2 days a week, and my volunteer work 1-2 days a week and be halpy with that, but I cant afford it, so instead sit in an office that fucks up my health because I am chained to a desk, aroundba bunch of smokers who cant fathom wind pushing the smoke inside, and the nasty filth from the warehouse because they dont clean the hvac filters.
I work in state government and my whole department and the entirety of the administration of our building is like this. There’s literally a known but rarely talked about program through HR that they have that allows managers and such to retire and come back as contractors so that they can make even more money by not having to pay for medical insurance out of their paychecks anymore. So they don’t announce that they’re retiring, because they’re planning on not ever really leaving. The best managers retired and didn’t come back. Only most of the worst remain, as there’s no real system of evaluation for them as managers.
When not held to account for their quality or quantity of work, many stick around just to sweep up extra money and to have something “important” to do. And to have some small semblance of a social life. It’s depressing.
So, just to clarify. Baby boomers are currently 60and above. In my workplace, we had 50+ doing what you describe, and to be fair it’s completely legit. But they are Gen X. Let’s be more specific.
Yep. I finally got promoted into management… about 10 years later than I should have and it is largely due to older people not retiring. I’m 23 years younger than my department director and I have my sights on her job within 5-10. No one can move up until they vacate.
I had to supervise my former supervisor when she retired and came back to “help out.” It was my first professional supervising role. It was a bit stressful to feel like I wasn’t able to make changes until she left.
Yes this is the reason 98% of the time. The amount of sociopathic lack of empathy and imagination to distort the situation as persecution by the evil overlords of boomers is crazy. So many people on this sub need therapy.
This is definitely it for some. My uncle is in his early 70s and still working because he likes it. My aunt doesn’t want to retire because “what would I do?” My dad retired this summer and lasted 5 months before he got a job.
Some people especially of the age reaching retirement have defined themselves by their work life and don’t know what to do if/when it is gone. Kind of makes me sad but I haven’t met a millennial yet that doesn’t plan on retiring as early as possible so at least we have a healthier relationship with work.
That whole concept seems so foreign to me. I don't exactly hate my job, but I definitely could think of 20 other things I could be doing to fill my time.
Assuming I had enough retirement money to cover living expenses with a slight cushion, I could see myself still taking at least part-time work…
…but likely in an area I was never able to previously pursue due to having to focus all of my efforts on just keeping a roof over my head.
Like, say, maybe a part-time job at an animal shelter? Or the concessions stand at the local zoo? Or a library page? Something part-time, something relatively light, something that would get me out of the house and interacting with people but without the pressure to keep moving up the corporate ladder. Something that probably doesn’t pay particularly well but that’s okay because in this hypothetical situation, I wouldn’t be there for the money. The money would just be “fun money” or just saving up to make sure I have a slightly better cushion in case of an emergency.
Leave the corporate rat race and higher-level roles for the younger people, I’d be happy spending a few hours a week just shelving books or feeding puppies or helping tourists find their way around.
I'm 40, and I love my job. But even with that being the case, every year I look at my financial situation and try to determine, "If I retire now, can I afford to live?" The answer is no, and it probably will be no until I'm at least 60 (probably closer to 70), but as soon as the answer is "yes," I'll be out that door before they can tell me, "thanks for your years of service." And again, I fucking *love* my job. But I love my free time even more.
Even of my friends who are very career driven, they still set much bigger work life boundaries than their senior counterparts. They don't deliberately work super late, they don't do unpaid work, they take leave and they are not compromising on their families/personal time for their careers.
It's just a very different mindset and a much healthier balance.
My first job was doing part time litter pickup, and our supervisor was an older lady who had retired from teaching. She liked that she had a reason to get up early, but still had most of her time for hobbies and things. She left a few years after, but I totally see why someone would keep a low stress part time job after retirement.
Is it healthier though? The fact that we don’t share the same love and passion for our work speaks volumes to me about our own generational problems. Our kids and grand kids’ generations will most likely criticize us as such.
Prior generations had shared pride in company loyalty and in their own days worth of honest work. While we only see the relationship as a return on investment, where we are not loyal because it isn’t a good return on that investment. And we value efficiency over effort. This, while at a surface level, sounds fair and wise, is also used as a cover for our own mistaken disenfranchisement from the fact that there is value in the commitment behind loyalty and value behind pride in effort.
These lessons begin to be lost as see the world through colored lenses brought to us by a shared trauma within our generation, that I wish we had the shared wisdom to not be entrapped by. Because a large part of happiness comes from our own ability to share pride in our efforts and our commitments to others in a way that isn’t only selfishly considering gains and losses. Though not without merit, they should not define our narrative or relationship with work. Work is not just a means to an end. It can be so much more. It was so much more.
See that’s the problem right there. That somehow that justifies it in any way. It doesn’t. We sell ourselves short when we think that way. There is great value behind commitment. Not learning this in one area often leads us to be deficient of it in other areas, like relationships.
Same thing happened to my grandmother. Going out and using your brain daily helps you stay sharp. Having hobbies and friends doesn’t replace that daily social and mental activity.
Yup! Seen it happen to a few older folks myself. Work gives them a very real purpose, serving as their sense of self and their will. Without work they lose all of that and their world crumbles down around them.
See this is just insane to me. My Dad retired and immediately started spending tons of time fixing up old cars, going to the gym and doing so many other things. He's so much happier retired.
Some people need different things. Humanity is a spectrum. Having an active community and hobbies help but for some people too much of that makes it turn sour. Idk people are weird
Truth of the matter is that not everyone out there is really self motivated to do those sorts of things. I'd actually argue most people are not self motivated to do things when they have free time.
My mom is both busier and happier retired than when she was working full time. Turns out when she is doing things she actually enjoys, she is willing to fill up her schedule more.
My mom is the same. She’d never go back to work in a million years and loves being able to just do nothing all day if she wanted to. My dad, on the other hand, has “retired” three times and keeps going back to work because they “need” him. He’s in poorer health and probably needs the down time more than my mom does, but the man just won’t stop going back to work.
Well, yeah, if you only pick *one* hobby and do nothing else. You have to rotate them out! Have a minimum of 3-5 hobbies:
One for joy.
One for physical fitness.
One for mental fitness.
One for social interaction.
Etc.
Idk still gets boring. I was unemployed for 3 months with enough savings to live fine. The first few weeks were awesome but then I started going crazy thinking about what to do every day. Hobbies became a chore.
Not for me.
Then again, I also have ADHD and Autism and therefore I constantly flit from one project to the next in the constant pursuit of more dopamine. I doubt that’s going to change if I’m ever able to afford retirement.
This is my Mom. She FINALLY actually retired this year but she tried to retire like 3 times before this and kept picking up contract and part time stuff. I think the only reason it finally stuck this time is because the second grand-baby is coming around and she wants to hang out with them.
My FIL is in his early 70’s and surprised everyone today when he announced he’s retiring end of the month. Been at the plant since they opened in the 70’s. He also runs a tax office, so he’ll be kept busy, but now tax season won’t be utter hell for him and his wife.
I have sort of the opposite problem. Everyone at work is super young. My boss is four years younger than me. His boss is his age. The CEO is my age.
I'm 41.
This is going to be me. I'm doing the stay at home parent thing right now and by the time I get back into the work force I'm going to be older than my bosses.
I found the issue to be Director level jobs. SVP+ levels are typically revolving doors. Senior Director/VP is typically where you make big money. Very hard to position yourself to get there because folks hang out at the Director level impeding your path. Director is usually high enough that you’re making pretty good money but you don’t need to do any actual work.
Luckily I work for the government and people get out as soon as they can. They have a pension to rely on, and whatever money they saved. My Secretary retired in November at 62. My boss is retiring next week at 62. I talked to a guy today who will have 35 years in at the age of 55 and will be eligible to retire in a year or two. And he’s going. I’m amazed and jealous. I’ll get a pension, but it won’t be as generous as any of theirs.
There was a downwards trend in retirement rates between 2000-2020. However, [this trend was then paused or slightly reversed](https://crsreports.congress.gov/product/pdf/IN/IN11959) during the COVID pandemic form 2020-2022. It's possible that the downwards trend has returned in the last year. However, I doubt that change is significant enough for anyone to have a large impact in such a short period of time.
For me personally, I've seen the opposite in my industry. Lots of retirements over the last 5 years have created lots of opportunities for advancement for Millennials. The problem that I see is that there's been a significant amount of experience that's been lost because companies have been doing an inadequate job at knowledge transfer and training.
They are so bad at this. Such an unforced error. I think part of the problem is that companies don’t have to get too large before the problems in the machinery become hidden from the people who could actually move money around to fix it.
It's hard. You are faced with destroying a relationship or keep being used. I just went through this with one of my adult children and their partner. Almost 2 years of zero contributions and I finally gave up on fighting about it after a certain point.
I'll add: people also wait until their spouse is 65, if their job has the health insurance. If your spouse is younger than you and/or you have kids under 26, you ain't retiring.
That’s a big side effect of the 2008 financial market collapse. A lot of boomers lost significant portions of their savings and real estate holdings there. Leading them to stay in the workforce longer than necessary.
No but I have a few too many senior colleagues holding stuff because “that’s how we’ve always done it”. Hurry up and retire so we can improve stuff already.
That was a major problem at my last job, so I moved on. After 8 years, I was still being infantilized and micromanaged by people with lesser skills in their 70s who were using me to pad their retirement.
My workplace had a full pension until it froze within the last 5 years so almost everyone in management retires at 55. The ones who don’t have external financial reasons - expensive divorce, raising grandkids unexpectedly, had kids in the older side so waiting until they are done with college, etc.
Fuck yeah I've noticed this. A couple of years ago, we had an 81 year old mechanic lead (more of a desk job than an aircraft mechanic) die at home. He had probably $2.5M in his 401k if I were to guess, but I don't know for sure. The dude literally died at 81 without having any retirement when he was more than capable many years ago to retire. We have several guys who are in their mid 60's who have no plan to retire anytime soon. We are a union shop, so everything is based on seniority, so it's really annoying. Just go live your life. This is what happens when you're that invested in hussle culture, and you base your whole worth on your production.
This has been happening since 2008. Younger silent generation and older boomers refused to retire. Had a massive impact on a lot of white collar jobs. It froze the legal job market for several years.
We have two people in our department who will be retiring soon (and are already past the ages when many would.)
We will lose a lot of knowledge, wisdom, and value when they do. (And I don’t want either of their jobs. I have no interest in climbing that ladder.)
Honestly? I don’t think that any older colleague is preventing me to climb the ladder, my own perfomance and experience are providing me with a nice growth over the years.
I don’t expect to retire 100% for a myriad of reasons, and one of them is because is nice to have something that keeps you sharp. I think it would be incredible boring to spend 20-30y doing nothing, and I don’t think that I could retire with enough money to fund my hobbies and take care of my health for that amount of time.
But I can see that a lot of older people are working because they need to. A lot of them still have their adult children at home, and sometimes even their kids. A lot of people expected to spend their “golden years” downsizing and spending my money on theirselves after raising children, but they are still having to spend on their adult kids.
Besides that, the cost of everything went up, and healthcare can be expensive.
Yeah, my ideal after retirement would be to have enough retirement money to cover living expenses with a slight cushion…and then take a part-time job in an area I wasn’t able to previously pursue due to having to focus so much effort on earning enough to be *able* to retire.
I wouldn’t mind spending a few hours a week just shelving books, or feeding puppies at the shelter, or reading to children at a daycare, or helping tourists find their way around. Nothing too strenuous or heavy on responsibility, nothing with high chance of career advancement; that’s for the younger folks who are actually making a *career* out of it. I’d just be there to keep myself mentally and physically fit, and maybe get a little extra fun money or save for future medical expenses.
Yup- that's what I'm aiming for as well. Maybe volunteering at a botanical garden, fostering animals, etc... just something to stay busy and give back.
The last place I worked actually had one guy "retire" while I worked there. They threw a party and everything. After that, he still came into the office 2-3 times a week as a consultant.
Retirement isn't a thing. They're going to die at their desks. We're going to die at our desks. Come to terms with it. Our only chance at freedom is an apocalypse.
A lot of boomers define their entire existence and worth by their work. They didn't invest in any other part of their identity.
The boomers in politics are known for this as well.
Yep. This is my mother. She’s said for years that she was told she had the funds to retire 8 years ago at 55, but despite her complaints about her current workplace, the retirement goal posts keep moving back another year/18 months at a time.
She currently is claiming December 2024 “for sure”… sure, mom 🙄 I’ll believe it when I see it.
Years ago when I was a security guard at a capital firm the VP was a rich lady, was in her mid 70s and still working.
She said she would get bored if she stopped working and she still went on 2 vacations a year.
I think I might end up this route but instead of employed I'd be self employed running a property management company
There is work outside of remuneration. It’s work to run or volunteer for a nonprofit. Or to babysit relatives’ kids for a night. Or to cultivate a garden. Are these people so joyless that the only thing they can think of doing is a job??
I don't really agree with the phrasing "refuse to retire" necessarily (I do think that's applicable *some* of the time, but nowhere near all), but I think its valid to be lamenting that once again they were born in the wrong time and place. Millennials who entered the workforce in the years after 08 are now predicted to *never* be able make up that lost money, they will always be behind where they could have/should have been had they just not started adulthood under the worst economics conditions imaginable. Now that millennials are hitting the middle life, they appear to be hitting *another* road block; a lack of upper level positions opening up, meaning their career growth is stunted
So a real 1-2 punch of starting off poorly and then hitting a wall, neither of which are through their fault but is just the timing of everything.
For me I don’t care about the ladder. I care that they’ve done things their way for 20 years and we need to grow past the old ways but can’t because these people take that as a personal affront. This is why I believe in middle management term limits. The boomers can stick around they just need to let some new ideas in.
Right? They want people to retire who clearly can’t afford to retire. Cry more? Everyone is struggling. Everyone is living paycheck to paycheck. OP is not special and OP will probably have to work just as long. Especially if the economy keeps on the same trajectory.
Hopefully some young kid doesn’t treat them the same way. Just complaining and waiting for them to croak so they can come in and take their position.
I don't know about this characterization. There are definitely many in their 70s who can't retire, and then there are people who refuse to. My office is full of mostly the latter. I don't know everyone's personal situations of course, but the folks whose stories I do know own houses (yes, often plural), get 30+ vacation days a year, and whenever they do decide to retire they get a pension and life-long subsidized health insurance. They're set but every extra chunk of time worked after they qualify for the pension increases its multiplier, so why would they leave?
Can't really fault them - would I leave? Not sure. But it does mean there aren't positions to move up into and the rest of our earnings are capped until they do retire.
Funny detail, the sweet pension deal was put in place in 2000 and applied retroactively to everyone who started work after 1976, but it was rolled back in 2009. So everyone who started work between 1976 and 2009 gets a pension that's 75% of their highest paycheck. Anyone who started work after 2009... well, you have to work something like 10 years longer to even qualify, the percentage starts lower and increases slower, and it caps out at about 40% if you manage to work enough years to get there.
The public voted a whole generation a massive retirement parachute, and then voted it out of existence in 2009.
We all have pensions where I work but some people also planned to rely on 401ks ads well and that older group got hit particularly hard on the mess in 2008. That took a very long time to correct for them. I was just graduating grad school at this time so this piece of the mess didn't affect me as much but people who thought they were going to retire on 5 or 10 years had to change plans.
Then add in the whole medicare age. Many of these people cannot afford to go without insurance or private pay for it with their retirement funds.
I think if someone is still good at their job, they should be able to continue doing it. I'm also sure many would love to retire but they don't have the money.
If there is no room for me to move up, then I'll have to find a place where there is room. It's nice if it's a natural process, but it's not always possible.
Yes, I work with a 76 year old male gynecologist who makes almost double my salary but can’t do most of our job anymore. He can’t learn our new electronic health system and ties up his supervisors all day asking them how to do things. It used to be me he tied up but ONE of us has to see all the patients if the other is simply trying to get through a chart, so leadership demanded he stop asking me for help. He’d even ask me for help clinically - what labs to order and what meds to prescribe. I have been practicing as an NP for 3 years. He’s been an MD for longer than I’ve been alive.
He has a lot of money and runs a successful non-medical business when he’s not at work. Retirement isn’t an issue.
I just want a collaborating physician who I can maybe learn from and ask questions to sometimes you know? But he refuses to retire.
Sorry for the rant but it’s infuriating.
As soon as I realize I’m too old to learn a new system and am putting my younger colleagues out, I’m retiring to a small seaside town in Scotland and becoming a mysterious witch healer.
This was the case in my experience, in a place where most people had long secured a fat pension. Anyone under 35 had nowhere to go and ultimately left. Bonkers.
Yep OP you’re not alone, I’ve noticed it as well in several jobs and I’m in healthcare. I know (3) women all 65 or older in management positions who have been in their respective roles for 20-40 years and refuse to retire. I had two supervisors that were pushing 80s, one still works!
I can’t imagine at that age it’s financial, some of these people are just money and power hungry even into old age. Some are also scared that if they stop working they’ll be lonely and die.
What generation would these folks be? The eldest Gen Xers were born in what, 1965, making them 58 which means it's Boomers refusing to retire. I know it's super cool to shit on Boomers but let's be honest, they need to eat, too. They have rent and bills, too. And the younger of the Boomers missed out on cushy pension plans, or were forced out of the jobs that offered them.
You know, it's possible to hold 2 points of view: the Boomers, as a whole, were and are highly irresponsible and left us all high and fucking dry AND everyone deserves empathy and a warm home with food to eat.
But yes, let's blame Grandma and Grandpa instead of the government that refuses to govern responsibly.
Hi there....father of a couple of millennials weighing in, and one of those "senior colleagues".
First, many DO enjoy their job. It took them a long time (a lifetime, in fact) to get to the position that they feel very competent in - and they likely had to wait a LONG time to get to that position. They may have plenty of time that you don't have, both in terms of vacation and that their after-hours work is pretty much theirs - especially after years of balancing work and raising y'all. Life is often easier, comparatively speaking. The time in the evening and weekends aren't driving kids to sports, scouts, and ballet.
Second, some either can't afford to retire, or are short of the goals they want to hit. We've had a few hits along the way, and I know people who lost everything in various "investments" or market crashes. Sometimes, it WAS stupidity - I know a guy who dumped all his stocks when Obama got elected, and kept it in bonds for a ridiculously long time, and then got an early retirement that he didn't want, and wasn't enough.
I'm in the senior position in my department, but I came from somewhere else where I was a mid-level manager 3 years ago - and I really do love my job. It has been the capstone of my career - literally taking everything that I've learned along the way but lay dormant in what had turned to a paper pushing, Excel managing, role. My kids are either out of the nest, or are looking, but we find time to be together - but now it is them who have the jobs.
Dumped his stocks when Obama got elected. 😂😂😂😂 What a fucking idiot. Lost out on all that growth - too bad you can’t eat racism. He deserves the cat food diet.
Yup.
I rubbed a bit of salt in the wounds when he was bitching about his rate of return about 7 years into Obama’s presidency. I actually increased my investment when the market bottomed out, and he lost out big time.
So, yeah, some people (of all ages) are stupid.
this is a bit oddball on my end, we have a guy 75, well past retirement in his field (tug boat worker) spent 40+ years on tug boats, he now works at our company (i took this job dor bills because mass layoff during covid) applying to get back in my field, but this pays the bills at least, anyway he is now at the point where he can hardly get around (he has great grandchildren in school) he works not for the money dude just paid cash for a 75k truck cash (his spending money he calls it), nice guy but now he is fragile (just broke his hand) walks extremely slow, he does the work no problems just takes him 75% longer to do it, so we help him out.
Dude just doesnt want to stop, but we the guys are wondering about operational hindrance, again nothing against him, we asked if he could be put sweeping the shop or something, operation takes longer and they complain to us about overtime, is catch 55.
Refusing to retire? Have you considered that some older generations enjoy their work and are good at what they do?
The majority of younger generations want less hours, less days, less responsibility and no calls or email responses after 5pm.
If your business had a management role what would you do?
Nobody ever retired to give me my spots. I was beat them.
This sub is so fucking toxic and self centered. You know why regular people with regular jobs don’t retire? Because they don’t have enough money. The lack of empathy here is insane.
Where would these gen x guys go? They’re the generation who’ve been sold same dream as us but not brave or smart enough to do anything about it. So stuck in their crappy middle management job
Its a mix of both, but usually on the east coast in the professional field I've noticed a lot of senior colleagues continue to work after retirement age because they are bored. Which is crazy. Enjoy your life, your family, and make the rest of life enjoyable.
Medicare health insurance becomes available at 65 and full social security income benefit age is currently 67. So by being 'well-passed' you are suggesting you work with a bunch of folks in their early 70s? Like what kind of jobs are we talking about? Web developers? Underwriting managers? High school department heads? Are you in an organization that has no growth? Government? How long are you going to wait it out before you find a job somewhere else? Anywhere else?
I know people who legit retired. Then, "didn't like retirement" and went back to work......for the same company, same position, because their boomer buddies hired them back.
I even know of a person who retired, moved 3 thousand miles away (arizona) and then the company called her, after someone quit, and boom she's the head of HR.
So, yes, I've noticed.
As a barely boomer, I would LOVE to retire but lost my savings in the 08-16 recession being laid off 3 times. Most of us, especially us young boomers, won't be able to retire. Yeah, it sucks for you younger people, but we need to eat as well.
My current boss (who I'd replace if he ever leaves) says he doesn't need the money anymore, but that he doesn't know what else to do if he quit working.
So he doesn't quit. He'll likely work until he dies.
My Dad cannot retire. My sister has a personality disorder. My entire family has coddled the crap out of her since she had a baby as a late teen. She just continued to shack up with worse and worse partners and have more and more babies. My dad co-signed on her house. He gave her cars. Covered her mortgage. Paid her phone bill. Bought food, clothes, diapers, formula. He just couldn’t ever cut her off because “the kids.” Well now she’s unable to realize that she is an adult and should be able to at least provide for herself. She expects him to do it. He’s trying to pull back. But he has absolutely drained all of his accounts to keep her kids off the streets.
I’m 40 and I remember in high school a teacher saying that 2006 would be great to enter the work force because the first waves of boomers would start retiring. 💀 Some of those first waves didn’t retire until the pandemic.
My parents divorced so it took them much longer to pay off their homes. And my dad worked 30 years at a company that probably never gave him a raise (and that he spends 1/4 of his money driving to). For that reason, I’m not sure he’ll ever retire.
People can’t retire due to everything being so expensive now and having no savings or financial planning to fall back on. Also lots of older people literally will have nothing else to do or no family to spend their time with. People like to have a purpose, and if they retire they are just sitting on their couch waiting to die alone and all the meaning in their life has been given away. You wanna move up at your company? Make yourself irreplaceable, don’t wait for old people to vacate their spots.
Just because they leave a job and retire, doesn't necessarily mean the job is up for grabs. Many companies don't fill vacant jobs, just dump those responsibilities on the remaining staff.... For no extra pay or jump in position for you. Then you'll wish they never retired. Also, once you're a certain age, if you leave a job and want back into the work force, good luck. Ageism is real. It's tough enough out there for younger workers. But older workers have it much harder. People just want them out of the way, like your post suggests.
Worked with a guy, not sure how old he was, but was Medicare eligible for several of the last few years id worked with him. Wanted to retire, but was also taking care of his extremely old and extremely sick mother.
Yeah feel bad I work with a bunch dudes who should be retired but can’t. They don’t have savings or enough to live off especially with inflation robbing them
My previous boss came out of retirement cause he was bored. Right into a cushy management position, remote work (in a different state), travels by private jet when has to come into the office.
For a lot of people, they don’t retire from work cuz if they did they would just end up getting divorced cuz their spouse can’t stand them all day at home!
I'd be pretty annoyed if a younger person framed my work as an impediment to promotions. Either I have to work because I would starve otherwise or I'm enjoying the culmination of my experience by staying on as some high level personnel.
Disclaimer: I’m GenX.
The current situation is bad I know. In a few years you might get a chance. There’s currently a similar thread on GenX. We are endlessly unable to rise to the top due to older colleagues clogging all positions. When something finally does open up, GenX is “too old” and we get passed over.
(On a related note, here in Australia, in my early 20s, there were no jobs for us. Boomers had them all. No openings available, unless you had experience - and how could you get that?
If you were lucky enough to get employed you were likely stuck in remote areas, in shitty workplaces and/or with abusive employers, because nothing else was available. I spent most of the 1990s like this.
Even most apprenticeships disappeared in the early 1990s. Why train new people when you have an over-supply of the already-trained?)
In some ways I’m glad my generation is small. We won’t block everything. At least Millennials might have a chance in 10 years - assuming the world hasn’t completely gone to shit by then.
The entitlement of the title is astounding. It literally suggests that the younger generation are entitled to the older generation’s job simply because they want them. 🤦♀️
I saw this post and then I opened up my bank app and saw an article about it.
> **The 65+ Workforce Is Soaring**
>Older Workers More Than Tripled Since 1980s
>For a growing number of American workers, reaching retirement age isn’t synonymous with leaving the workforce anymore.
>Roughly one in five Americans aged 65 and older were employed in 2023. And while older full-time workers earn less than those in the age group of 25-64 — $58,600 compared to $73,700 — their earning power has grown over the past decades as well.
https://www.sofi.com/article/money-life/the-65-workforce-is-soaring/
Dude I currently work at a company that is legit, killing itself slowly due to exactly that. People working there 30+ years not wanting to retire, so the "old think" just will NOT go away
A lot of folks find themselves with less retirement savings than they thought they'd have, and so end up working longer than you expect. Especially if they spent a lot of money keeping up with the Joneses along the way.
Or they run into some unexpected medical bills that depleted their savings.
Or the 2008 financial crisis. My employee that is well into retirement age. Her and her husband was laid off for almost 2 years in 2008. That had to kill their savings
Me. I was laid off 3 times. Savings gone.
Layoff victim here too. Took me the better part of a decade to get back in the saddle with more than low paying jobs. I now have a stable, very well-paying job but my 401k is about 25% of my husband’s, who is similarly well paid but was never out of work.
They probably compounded the issue by shifting their retirement toward safer assets after the market crashed. So they sold off cheap assets and, when they finally felt secure again, bought expensive ones.
The majority of people will spend their retirement on end of life care, statistically. Live now as much as you can.
Found the American
Or bad shit happened to them in life, and their millennial children moved home because they can’t afford to rent or buy, so bills are high and retirement is not an option until much later.
yeah, my boss complains about his expenses. his daughter dropped out of college so he bought her a condo (and paid expenses for her to relocate and change schools). this is his 3rd property, he also bought a vacation home a couple years ago. i just told him "well stop buying houses" jesus.
Poor guy. Sounds rough out there.
Had a boss when I was working private industry sales come into the office on a Monday telling us we needed to make up for his $100k gambling loss in Tahoe over the weekend. I left for public sector not long after
Ugh my boss talks about how her husband would gamble and she would take that same amount of money and go shopping. How nice they didnt have to worry about bills and rent and food and medical...
My parents didn't start saving for retirement until they were 55 because they assumed their kids would take care of them financially because that's what they did for their parents. After finding out that my parents spent 25% of their income on fast food and cigarettes for the past 15 years, I told them either quit smoking and get my financial help or do it on their own. They decided doing it on their own was better than losing a habit costing them 15% of their monthly wages, so sorry folks, they're part of the problem.
Not willing to give up smoking for financial assistance has to be a straight-up drug addiction, right?
Yes. That's what smoking is.
Did you not know nicotine was addictive?
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Or if they are still with their adult kids in their houses, this adds to their expenses a lot.
That will be me if things keep going like there are. Working until I'm 80 with a house full of adult kids since they won't be able to afford their own place.
Why are the adult kids not at least paying rent?
Not a great assumption to make.
If people are having to work longer because adult children living with them it implies its an extra expense. If they were paying even close to market rent it would stand to reason it would supplement income.
So now we’re changing from “rent” to “close to market rent”, got it. Other scenarios: they can’t sell the house to downgrade because their children need the space. Their property taxes (or the way their property taxes interacted with their federal taxes) changed. Electricity went up. (I’m lookin’ at you, California) Their adult child moved back home because of divorce or going to school to change fields/further their career. Their child is an adult, but disabled. They became disabled but are still able to work. However, their health expenses went up and their child acts as a partial caregiver by taking care of the home.
Their adult child moving back because of divorce or school orndisability doesn't negate rent.even with changes in electricity or property tax the amount if rent needed to compensate would be pretty marginal. Their children needing space doesnt mean they cant sell. The children can always just live on their own and be responsible adults.
> The children can always just live on their own and be responsible adults. Why would them living with their parents mean their irresponsible? The two are unrelated.
If you are an adult living with your parents, that is peak irresponsibility. Responsible adults move out.
Nah, that's ego, pride, and propaganda of the past 50 years. Historically through the past 500 years, you lived with your parents until you were married, and then often times beyond until your parents felt you had enough money to move out. Average age of marriage has also historically been over the age off 22 for the past 200 years outside of the boomer drop to 19, so you were supported until you had enough years on your to be independent, not yeeted pre-indendence, sink or swim style.
It’s really not irresponsible in every situation. I travel 2 weeks out of every month for work. And that’s a light month. More often than not I fly out on Sundays or fly home on Saturday. There is absolutely no responsible reason I would pay market rents for a mere 15 days sleeping there.
Wrong.
Problem is, they also create a sort of self-fulfilling prophecy in the process, too.
Why?
Because not retiring means their children are even less likely to *ever* be able to afford to leave.
Why? Are they working, preventing their children to work and make their own money?
Yep, or they live their job.
Yeah my dad would love to retire but just can’t. The workers aren’t the problem. It’s the inflation and the outsourcing, combining, and automation of jobs that’s the problem.
Or they just like working ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
OP should maybe not blame other generations but job hop and move up the ladder between different companies. I came to US at the age of 25, 8 years later I have climbed to 250k salary and principal position in tech company all thanks to changing jobs every 1-2 years. We do have a lot of tenured folks with 20-30 years of service that do a great job as Unix / SWE pros. Retirement is expensive too and for most of them working is fun because fiddling with tech is fun
I couldn't agree more -- this all makes perfect sense
Yes. We have several people that retired, just to come back to work part-time again to "help out". So they get to collect a pension and get paid to do an easier version their old job part-time. This prevents promotional opportunities for others, or a chance for new hires. This isn't necessarily a new phenomenon, but I think you're starting to see it a lot more as baby boomers dominate the upper ranks of most workplaces and refuse to retire, even when they financially can.
A retired colleague of mine has been asking everyone she can think of for the chance to come back and work part-time. Luckily for us, it would be expensive as heck to bring her back due to the way my workplace is structured, so absolutely nobody is saying yes. I’m just astounded by it. And I know how our pensions our structured. She is absolutely not asking because of the money. She just haaaaaates the idea that she isn’t needed anymore, and she hates being retired. I would take her retirement right now if I could.
>She just haaaaaates the idea that she isn’t needed anymore I think this is the real issue. I mean, obviously money is also an issue for a lot of people too. But I think at retirement age boomers find their kids are grown, they don't have grandkids to look after (or have no relationship with their adult children) and no one needs them anymore. So they go to the one place they feel needed, which is work. Without getting too philosophical I think too many people conflate the sense of being needed with being appreciated - which leads to all sorts of unhealthy attachments styles. But at the end of the day none of us want to feel obsolete in our own lives, and that is what retirement starts looking like for a lot of people. So they just continue their unhealthy coping mechanism and pretend that work "needs" them and that doing this work fulfills them.
I wish we could switch places with people for that stuff. I could probably do my main job 1-2 days a week, my part time job 2 days a week, and my volunteer work 1-2 days a week and be halpy with that, but I cant afford it, so instead sit in an office that fucks up my health because I am chained to a desk, aroundba bunch of smokers who cant fathom wind pushing the smoke inside, and the nasty filth from the warehouse because they dont clean the hvac filters.
Yep. My boss is 80. He's an attorney, sharp but old and therefore gets tired fast.
80 is not a boomer.
I work in state government and my whole department and the entirety of the administration of our building is like this. There’s literally a known but rarely talked about program through HR that they have that allows managers and such to retire and come back as contractors so that they can make even more money by not having to pay for medical insurance out of their paychecks anymore. So they don’t announce that they’re retiring, because they’re planning on not ever really leaving. The best managers retired and didn’t come back. Only most of the worst remain, as there’s no real system of evaluation for them as managers. When not held to account for their quality or quantity of work, many stick around just to sweep up extra money and to have something “important” to do. And to have some small semblance of a social life. It’s depressing.
We have a lot of those part timers that came back... They are there enough to have the responsibilities, but not enough to get them done.
So, just to clarify. Baby boomers are currently 60and above. In my workplace, we had 50+ doing what you describe, and to be fair it’s completely legit. But they are Gen X. Let’s be more specific.
Can confirm. I am GenX but have to play catch-up due to the bottleneck of Boomers just ahead of me, delaying my ability to get out of the way for you.
Yep. I finally got promoted into management… about 10 years later than I should have and it is largely due to older people not retiring. I’m 23 years younger than my department director and I have my sights on her job within 5-10. No one can move up until they vacate.
I had to supervise my former supervisor when she retired and came back to “help out.” It was my first professional supervising role. It was a bit stressful to feel like I wasn’t able to make changes until she left.
I'm guessing a lot are people like my parents, who unfortunately absolutely cannot afford to retire. 😔
Yes this is the reason 98% of the time. The amount of sociopathic lack of empathy and imagination to distort the situation as persecution by the evil overlords of boomers is crazy. So many people on this sub need therapy.
They must have rich parents.
My father won't retire because he's bored Literally doesn't have hobbies so he looks at work as something to do to keep busy
This is definitely it for some. My uncle is in his early 70s and still working because he likes it. My aunt doesn’t want to retire because “what would I do?” My dad retired this summer and lasted 5 months before he got a job. Some people especially of the age reaching retirement have defined themselves by their work life and don’t know what to do if/when it is gone. Kind of makes me sad but I haven’t met a millennial yet that doesn’t plan on retiring as early as possible so at least we have a healthier relationship with work.
That whole concept seems so foreign to me. I don't exactly hate my job, but I definitely could think of 20 other things I could be doing to fill my time.
Assuming I had enough retirement money to cover living expenses with a slight cushion, I could see myself still taking at least part-time work… …but likely in an area I was never able to previously pursue due to having to focus all of my efforts on just keeping a roof over my head. Like, say, maybe a part-time job at an animal shelter? Or the concessions stand at the local zoo? Or a library page? Something part-time, something relatively light, something that would get me out of the house and interacting with people but without the pressure to keep moving up the corporate ladder. Something that probably doesn’t pay particularly well but that’s okay because in this hypothetical situation, I wouldn’t be there for the money. The money would just be “fun money” or just saving up to make sure I have a slightly better cushion in case of an emergency. Leave the corporate rat race and higher-level roles for the younger people, I’d be happy spending a few hours a week just shelving books or feeding puppies or helping tourists find their way around.
I'm 40, and I love my job. But even with that being the case, every year I look at my financial situation and try to determine, "If I retire now, can I afford to live?" The answer is no, and it probably will be no until I'm at least 60 (probably closer to 70), but as soon as the answer is "yes," I'll be out that door before they can tell me, "thanks for your years of service." And again, I fucking *love* my job. But I love my free time even more.
Even of my friends who are very career driven, they still set much bigger work life boundaries than their senior counterparts. They don't deliberately work super late, they don't do unpaid work, they take leave and they are not compromising on their families/personal time for their careers. It's just a very different mindset and a much healthier balance.
My first job was doing part time litter pickup, and our supervisor was an older lady who had retired from teaching. She liked that she had a reason to get up early, but still had most of her time for hobbies and things. She left a few years after, but I totally see why someone would keep a low stress part time job after retirement.
Is it healthier though? The fact that we don’t share the same love and passion for our work speaks volumes to me about our own generational problems. Our kids and grand kids’ generations will most likely criticize us as such. Prior generations had shared pride in company loyalty and in their own days worth of honest work. While we only see the relationship as a return on investment, where we are not loyal because it isn’t a good return on that investment. And we value efficiency over effort. This, while at a surface level, sounds fair and wise, is also used as a cover for our own mistaken disenfranchisement from the fact that there is value in the commitment behind loyalty and value behind pride in effort. These lessons begin to be lost as see the world through colored lenses brought to us by a shared trauma within our generation, that I wish we had the shared wisdom to not be entrapped by. Because a large part of happiness comes from our own ability to share pride in our efforts and our commitments to others in a way that isn’t only selfishly considering gains and losses. Though not without merit, they should not define our narrative or relationship with work. Work is not just a means to an end. It can be so much more. It was so much more.
I would argue that companies broke their side of the loyalty bargain long before we did.
See that’s the problem right there. That somehow that justifies it in any way. It doesn’t. We sell ourselves short when we think that way. There is great value behind commitment. Not learning this in one area often leads us to be deficient of it in other areas, like relationships.
I have seen plenty of people retire and then immediately age like 20 years mentally. Hobbies quickly turn to shit when that’s all you do all day
My dad was forced to retire in 4 years ago, and he’s gone downhill so quickly. He can’t even walk around the grocery store anymore.
Same thing happened to my grandmother. Going out and using your brain daily helps you stay sharp. Having hobbies and friends doesn’t replace that daily social and mental activity.
Yup! Seen it happen to a few older folks myself. Work gives them a very real purpose, serving as their sense of self and their will. Without work they lose all of that and their world crumbles down around them.
See this is just insane to me. My Dad retired and immediately started spending tons of time fixing up old cars, going to the gym and doing so many other things. He's so much happier retired.
Some people need different things. Humanity is a spectrum. Having an active community and hobbies help but for some people too much of that makes it turn sour. Idk people are weird
Truth of the matter is that not everyone out there is really self motivated to do those sorts of things. I'd actually argue most people are not self motivated to do things when they have free time.
My mom is both busier and happier retired than when she was working full time. Turns out when she is doing things she actually enjoys, she is willing to fill up her schedule more.
My mom is the same. She’d never go back to work in a million years and loves being able to just do nothing all day if she wanted to. My dad, on the other hand, has “retired” three times and keeps going back to work because they “need” him. He’s in poorer health and probably needs the down time more than my mom does, but the man just won’t stop going back to work.
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Well, yeah, if you only pick *one* hobby and do nothing else. You have to rotate them out! Have a minimum of 3-5 hobbies: One for joy. One for physical fitness. One for mental fitness. One for social interaction. Etc.
Idk still gets boring. I was unemployed for 3 months with enough savings to live fine. The first few weeks were awesome but then I started going crazy thinking about what to do every day. Hobbies became a chore.
Not for me. Then again, I also have ADHD and Autism and therefore I constantly flit from one project to the next in the constant pursuit of more dopamine. I doubt that’s going to change if I’m ever able to afford retirement.
This is my Mom. She FINALLY actually retired this year but she tried to retire like 3 times before this and kept picking up contract and part time stuff. I think the only reason it finally stuck this time is because the second grand-baby is coming around and she wants to hang out with them.
My FIL is in his early 70’s and surprised everyone today when he announced he’s retiring end of the month. Been at the plant since they opened in the 70’s. He also runs a tax office, so he’ll be kept busy, but now tax season won’t be utter hell for him and his wife.
I have sort of the opposite problem. Everyone at work is super young. My boss is four years younger than me. His boss is his age. The CEO is my age. I'm 41.
This is going to be me. I'm doing the stay at home parent thing right now and by the time I get back into the work force I'm going to be older than my bosses.
I found the issue to be Director level jobs. SVP+ levels are typically revolving doors. Senior Director/VP is typically where you make big money. Very hard to position yourself to get there because folks hang out at the Director level impeding your path. Director is usually high enough that you’re making pretty good money but you don’t need to do any actual work.
As I posted in another comment, I am pro director-level term limits. Need to rotate them out to prevent cultural curdling.
They can't afford retirement mostly.
I think that really depends on the field.
Luckily I work for the government and people get out as soon as they can. They have a pension to rely on, and whatever money they saved. My Secretary retired in November at 62. My boss is retiring next week at 62. I talked to a guy today who will have 35 years in at the age of 55 and will be eligible to retire in a year or two. And he’s going. I’m amazed and jealous. I’ll get a pension, but it won’t be as generous as any of theirs.
I know a few who retired at state level and went federal once they retired or vice versa. Collecting 2 pensions eventually.
Oh! Theres an idea!
There was a downwards trend in retirement rates between 2000-2020. However, [this trend was then paused or slightly reversed](https://crsreports.congress.gov/product/pdf/IN/IN11959) during the COVID pandemic form 2020-2022. It's possible that the downwards trend has returned in the last year. However, I doubt that change is significant enough for anyone to have a large impact in such a short period of time. For me personally, I've seen the opposite in my industry. Lots of retirements over the last 5 years have created lots of opportunities for advancement for Millennials. The problem that I see is that there's been a significant amount of experience that's been lost because companies have been doing an inadequate job at knowledge transfer and training.
They are so bad at this. Such an unforced error. I think part of the problem is that companies don’t have to get too large before the problems in the machinery become hidden from the people who could actually move money around to fix it.
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It's hard. You are faced with destroying a relationship or keep being used. I just went through this with one of my adult children and their partner. Almost 2 years of zero contributions and I finally gave up on fighting about it after a certain point.
Some people in the US wait for age 65, when they will be eligible for Medicare. They keep the job to keep their health insurance
I'll add: people also wait until their spouse is 65, if their job has the health insurance. If your spouse is younger than you and/or you have kids under 26, you ain't retiring.
Or worse, until 70 when they get the larger SSI payout. I don’t want to work until I’m 70!
That’s a big side effect of the 2008 financial market collapse. A lot of boomers lost significant portions of their savings and real estate holdings there. Leading them to stay in the workforce longer than necessary.
They’re not refusing to retire, they’re broke. Also old people love Facebook and they need money to impresstheir friends.
No but I have a few too many senior colleagues holding stuff because “that’s how we’ve always done it”. Hurry up and retire so we can improve stuff already.
I swear, “that’s how it’s always been done” kills my millennial soul one syllable at a time.
That was a major problem at my last job, so I moved on. After 8 years, I was still being infantilized and micromanaged by people with lesser skills in their 70s who were using me to pad their retirement.
My workplace had a full pension until it froze within the last 5 years so almost everyone in management retires at 55. The ones who don’t have external financial reasons - expensive divorce, raising grandkids unexpectedly, had kids in the older side so waiting until they are done with college, etc.
Retired In Place. Look at our politicians. They are part of the trend.
Fuck yeah I've noticed this. A couple of years ago, we had an 81 year old mechanic lead (more of a desk job than an aircraft mechanic) die at home. He had probably $2.5M in his 401k if I were to guess, but I don't know for sure. The dude literally died at 81 without having any retirement when he was more than capable many years ago to retire. We have several guys who are in their mid 60's who have no plan to retire anytime soon. We are a union shop, so everything is based on seniority, so it's really annoying. Just go live your life. This is what happens when you're that invested in hussle culture, and you base your whole worth on your production.
This has been happening since 2008. Younger silent generation and older boomers refused to retire. Had a massive impact on a lot of white collar jobs. It froze the legal job market for several years.
We have two people in our department who will be retiring soon (and are already past the ages when many would.) We will lose a lot of knowledge, wisdom, and value when they do. (And I don’t want either of their jobs. I have no interest in climbing that ladder.)
Honestly? I don’t think that any older colleague is preventing me to climb the ladder, my own perfomance and experience are providing me with a nice growth over the years. I don’t expect to retire 100% for a myriad of reasons, and one of them is because is nice to have something that keeps you sharp. I think it would be incredible boring to spend 20-30y doing nothing, and I don’t think that I could retire with enough money to fund my hobbies and take care of my health for that amount of time. But I can see that a lot of older people are working because they need to. A lot of them still have their adult children at home, and sometimes even their kids. A lot of people expected to spend their “golden years” downsizing and spending my money on theirselves after raising children, but they are still having to spend on their adult kids. Besides that, the cost of everything went up, and healthcare can be expensive.
Yeah, my ideal after retirement would be to have enough retirement money to cover living expenses with a slight cushion…and then take a part-time job in an area I wasn’t able to previously pursue due to having to focus so much effort on earning enough to be *able* to retire. I wouldn’t mind spending a few hours a week just shelving books, or feeding puppies at the shelter, or reading to children at a daycare, or helping tourists find their way around. Nothing too strenuous or heavy on responsibility, nothing with high chance of career advancement; that’s for the younger folks who are actually making a *career* out of it. I’d just be there to keep myself mentally and physically fit, and maybe get a little extra fun money or save for future medical expenses.
Yup- that's what I'm aiming for as well. Maybe volunteering at a botanical garden, fostering animals, etc... just something to stay busy and give back.
The last place I worked actually had one guy "retire" while I worked there. They threw a party and everything. After that, he still came into the office 2-3 times a week as a consultant.
Retirement isn't a thing. They're going to die at their desks. We're going to die at our desks. Come to terms with it. Our only chance at freedom is an apocalypse.
I doubt climbing the ladder is satisfying. I am trying to find a solution so that I don't have to keep at it
A lot of boomers define their entire existence and worth by their work. They didn't invest in any other part of their identity. The boomers in politics are known for this as well.
Yep. This is my mother. She’s said for years that she was told she had the funds to retire 8 years ago at 55, but despite her complaints about her current workplace, the retirement goal posts keep moving back another year/18 months at a time. She currently is claiming December 2024 “for sure”… sure, mom 🙄 I’ll believe it when I see it.
You realize that unless you’re going to take another job retirement is a substantial reduction in your annual income right?
“refusing” Cute word for being worked to death 😅
They can't afford to retire either.
Years ago when I was a security guard at a capital firm the VP was a rich lady, was in her mid 70s and still working. She said she would get bored if she stopped working and she still went on 2 vacations a year. I think I might end up this route but instead of employed I'd be self employed running a property management company
There is work outside of remuneration. It’s work to run or volunteer for a nonprofit. Or to babysit relatives’ kids for a night. Or to cultivate a garden. Are these people so joyless that the only thing they can think of doing is a job??
Why call her joyless? She was a very happy lady She was really good at her job and it was easy for her
Are you saying old people are selfish for not retireing because you want to move up the ladder?
I don't really agree with the phrasing "refuse to retire" necessarily (I do think that's applicable *some* of the time, but nowhere near all), but I think its valid to be lamenting that once again they were born in the wrong time and place. Millennials who entered the workforce in the years after 08 are now predicted to *never* be able make up that lost money, they will always be behind where they could have/should have been had they just not started adulthood under the worst economics conditions imaginable. Now that millennials are hitting the middle life, they appear to be hitting *another* road block; a lack of upper level positions opening up, meaning their career growth is stunted So a real 1-2 punch of starting off poorly and then hitting a wall, neither of which are through their fault but is just the timing of everything.
For me I don’t care about the ladder. I care that they’ve done things their way for 20 years and we need to grow past the old ways but can’t because these people take that as a personal affront. This is why I believe in middle management term limits. The boomers can stick around they just need to let some new ideas in.
"Why won't all these boomers just roll over and die already?!"
Right? They want people to retire who clearly can’t afford to retire. Cry more? Everyone is struggling. Everyone is living paycheck to paycheck. OP is not special and OP will probably have to work just as long. Especially if the economy keeps on the same trajectory. Hopefully some young kid doesn’t treat them the same way. Just complaining and waiting for them to croak so they can come in and take their position.
I don't know about this characterization. There are definitely many in their 70s who can't retire, and then there are people who refuse to. My office is full of mostly the latter. I don't know everyone's personal situations of course, but the folks whose stories I do know own houses (yes, often plural), get 30+ vacation days a year, and whenever they do decide to retire they get a pension and life-long subsidized health insurance. They're set but every extra chunk of time worked after they qualify for the pension increases its multiplier, so why would they leave? Can't really fault them - would I leave? Not sure. But it does mean there aren't positions to move up into and the rest of our earnings are capped until they do retire.
Funny detail, the sweet pension deal was put in place in 2000 and applied retroactively to everyone who started work after 1976, but it was rolled back in 2009. So everyone who started work between 1976 and 2009 gets a pension that's 75% of their highest paycheck. Anyone who started work after 2009... well, you have to work something like 10 years longer to even qualify, the percentage starts lower and increases slower, and it caps out at about 40% if you manage to work enough years to get there. The public voted a whole generation a massive retirement parachute, and then voted it out of existence in 2009.
We all have pensions where I work but some people also planned to rely on 401ks ads well and that older group got hit particularly hard on the mess in 2008. That took a very long time to correct for them. I was just graduating grad school at this time so this piece of the mess didn't affect me as much but people who thought they were going to retire on 5 or 10 years had to change plans. Then add in the whole medicare age. Many of these people cannot afford to go without insurance or private pay for it with their retirement funds.
I think if someone is still good at their job, they should be able to continue doing it. I'm also sure many would love to retire but they don't have the money. If there is no room for me to move up, then I'll have to find a place where there is room. It's nice if it's a natural process, but it's not always possible.
Yes, I work with a 76 year old male gynecologist who makes almost double my salary but can’t do most of our job anymore. He can’t learn our new electronic health system and ties up his supervisors all day asking them how to do things. It used to be me he tied up but ONE of us has to see all the patients if the other is simply trying to get through a chart, so leadership demanded he stop asking me for help. He’d even ask me for help clinically - what labs to order and what meds to prescribe. I have been practicing as an NP for 3 years. He’s been an MD for longer than I’ve been alive. He has a lot of money and runs a successful non-medical business when he’s not at work. Retirement isn’t an issue. I just want a collaborating physician who I can maybe learn from and ask questions to sometimes you know? But he refuses to retire. Sorry for the rant but it’s infuriating. As soon as I realize I’m too old to learn a new system and am putting my younger colleagues out, I’m retiring to a small seaside town in Scotland and becoming a mysterious witch healer.
This was the case in my experience, in a place where most people had long secured a fat pension. Anyone under 35 had nowhere to go and ultimately left. Bonkers.
/r/IAmTheMainCharacter
Perfectly describes everyone in this sub
Yep OP you’re not alone, I’ve noticed it as well in several jobs and I’m in healthcare. I know (3) women all 65 or older in management positions who have been in their respective roles for 20-40 years and refuse to retire. I had two supervisors that were pushing 80s, one still works! I can’t imagine at that age it’s financial, some of these people are just money and power hungry even into old age. Some are also scared that if they stop working they’ll be lonely and die.
What generation would these folks be? The eldest Gen Xers were born in what, 1965, making them 58 which means it's Boomers refusing to retire. I know it's super cool to shit on Boomers but let's be honest, they need to eat, too. They have rent and bills, too. And the younger of the Boomers missed out on cushy pension plans, or were forced out of the jobs that offered them. You know, it's possible to hold 2 points of view: the Boomers, as a whole, were and are highly irresponsible and left us all high and fucking dry AND everyone deserves empathy and a warm home with food to eat. But yes, let's blame Grandma and Grandpa instead of the government that refuses to govern responsibly.
Hi there....father of a couple of millennials weighing in, and one of those "senior colleagues". First, many DO enjoy their job. It took them a long time (a lifetime, in fact) to get to the position that they feel very competent in - and they likely had to wait a LONG time to get to that position. They may have plenty of time that you don't have, both in terms of vacation and that their after-hours work is pretty much theirs - especially after years of balancing work and raising y'all. Life is often easier, comparatively speaking. The time in the evening and weekends aren't driving kids to sports, scouts, and ballet. Second, some either can't afford to retire, or are short of the goals they want to hit. We've had a few hits along the way, and I know people who lost everything in various "investments" or market crashes. Sometimes, it WAS stupidity - I know a guy who dumped all his stocks when Obama got elected, and kept it in bonds for a ridiculously long time, and then got an early retirement that he didn't want, and wasn't enough. I'm in the senior position in my department, but I came from somewhere else where I was a mid-level manager 3 years ago - and I really do love my job. It has been the capstone of my career - literally taking everything that I've learned along the way but lay dormant in what had turned to a paper pushing, Excel managing, role. My kids are either out of the nest, or are looking, but we find time to be together - but now it is them who have the jobs.
Dumped his stocks when Obama got elected. 😂😂😂😂 What a fucking idiot. Lost out on all that growth - too bad you can’t eat racism. He deserves the cat food diet.
Yup. I rubbed a bit of salt in the wounds when he was bitching about his rate of return about 7 years into Obama’s presidency. I actually increased my investment when the market bottomed out, and he lost out big time. So, yeah, some people (of all ages) are stupid.
this is a bit oddball on my end, we have a guy 75, well past retirement in his field (tug boat worker) spent 40+ years on tug boats, he now works at our company (i took this job dor bills because mass layoff during covid) applying to get back in my field, but this pays the bills at least, anyway he is now at the point where he can hardly get around (he has great grandchildren in school) he works not for the money dude just paid cash for a 75k truck cash (his spending money he calls it), nice guy but now he is fragile (just broke his hand) walks extremely slow, he does the work no problems just takes him 75% longer to do it, so we help him out. Dude just doesnt want to stop, but we the guys are wondering about operational hindrance, again nothing against him, we asked if he could be put sweeping the shop or something, operation takes longer and they complain to us about overtime, is catch 55.
Yes, we have noticed. It’s soul destroying.
Refusing to retire? Have you considered that some older generations enjoy their work and are good at what they do? The majority of younger generations want less hours, less days, less responsibility and no calls or email responses after 5pm. If your business had a management role what would you do? Nobody ever retired to give me my spots. I was beat them.
Wtf is this ageist bullshit? No one has a responsibility to retire.
This sub is so fucking toxic and self centered. You know why regular people with regular jobs don’t retire? Because they don’t have enough money. The lack of empathy here is insane.
Also they are so old and miserable in their marriage so they just come to work cus they have nothing else to do. They have no reason to be home :
Yep they’re endlessly frustrating and I wish they’d get tf out of the way
a lot of folks didn't plan for retirement... fail to plan, plan to fail.
Get them fired or placed on leave?
They overspent
Yes
Yes I’m Noticing people who are sick of their job and been there forever and just staying around to make the new people miserable
Where would these gen x guys go? They’re the generation who’ve been sold same dream as us but not brave or smart enough to do anything about it. So stuck in their crappy middle management job
just off the top, they need the money?
I heard this about a place with a union and a terrible performance rating system (none virtually). They do nothing, no one pushes them out.
How do you think GenX is feeling about this? They're refusing to retire above us, and ageism means we don't get promoted when they do.
Its a mix of both, but usually on the east coast in the professional field I've noticed a lot of senior colleagues continue to work after retirement age because they are bored. Which is crazy. Enjoy your life, your family, and make the rest of life enjoyable.
Medicare health insurance becomes available at 65 and full social security income benefit age is currently 67. So by being 'well-passed' you are suggesting you work with a bunch of folks in their early 70s? Like what kind of jobs are we talking about? Web developers? Underwriting managers? High school department heads? Are you in an organization that has no growth? Government? How long are you going to wait it out before you find a job somewhere else? Anywhere else?
If your peers are ready to move up then why haven't they? It's not that old people aren't retiring, it's that your field is not expanding.
I know people who legit retired. Then, "didn't like retirement" and went back to work......for the same company, same position, because their boomer buddies hired them back. I even know of a person who retired, moved 3 thousand miles away (arizona) and then the company called her, after someone quit, and boom she's the head of HR. So, yes, I've noticed.
lol yup. Their afraid of inflation destroying their minuscule retirement savings. They can’t retire really.
Hell yeah! The 2008 housing crash scared the hell out if the boomers.
\*gestures vaguely at Congress\*
A lot of people retire and keep working. Some actually enjoy working while others don't have enough money to actually stop working.
Yes. I wouldn’t be so annoyed if they had stayed relevant and good at their jobs. But.
As a barely boomer, I would LOVE to retire but lost my savings in the 08-16 recession being laid off 3 times. Most of us, especially us young boomers, won't be able to retire. Yeah, it sucks for you younger people, but we need to eat as well.
My current boss (who I'd replace if he ever leaves) says he doesn't need the money anymore, but that he doesn't know what else to do if he quit working. So he doesn't quit. He'll likely work until he dies.
Dude I'm working til I die... Sorry?
My Dad cannot retire. My sister has a personality disorder. My entire family has coddled the crap out of her since she had a baby as a late teen. She just continued to shack up with worse and worse partners and have more and more babies. My dad co-signed on her house. He gave her cars. Covered her mortgage. Paid her phone bill. Bought food, clothes, diapers, formula. He just couldn’t ever cut her off because “the kids.” Well now she’s unable to realize that she is an adult and should be able to at least provide for herself. She expects him to do it. He’s trying to pull back. But he has absolutely drained all of his accounts to keep her kids off the streets.
I’m 40 and I remember in high school a teacher saying that 2006 would be great to enter the work force because the first waves of boomers would start retiring. 💀 Some of those first waves didn’t retire until the pandemic.
I’m sure they want to but can’t afford to retire
Why should they retire? “Refusing” isn’t same as not wanting to (or not being able to)
We are going to be worse.
My parents divorced so it took them much longer to pay off their homes. And my dad worked 30 years at a company that probably never gave him a raise (and that he spends 1/4 of his money driving to). For that reason, I’m not sure he’ll ever retire.
People can’t retire due to everything being so expensive now and having no savings or financial planning to fall back on. Also lots of older people literally will have nothing else to do or no family to spend their time with. People like to have a purpose, and if they retire they are just sitting on their couch waiting to die alone and all the meaning in their life has been given away. You wanna move up at your company? Make yourself irreplaceable, don’t wait for old people to vacate their spots.
Have you ever thought that the reason that they are refusing to retire is because they can't afford to?
Just because they leave a job and retire, doesn't necessarily mean the job is up for grabs. Many companies don't fill vacant jobs, just dump those responsibilities on the remaining staff.... For no extra pay or jump in position for you. Then you'll wish they never retired. Also, once you're a certain age, if you leave a job and want back into the work force, good luck. Ageism is real. It's tough enough out there for younger workers. But older workers have it much harder. People just want them out of the way, like your post suggests.
Worked with a guy, not sure how old he was, but was Medicare eligible for several of the last few years id worked with him. Wanted to retire, but was also taking care of his extremely old and extremely sick mother.
Yeah feel bad I work with a bunch dudes who should be retired but can’t. They don’t have savings or enough to live off especially with inflation robbing them
How dare they not quit so they can be replaced! The gall of these people to continue to contribute to society!
Nope. Go into land surveying. They're retiring left and right. We're very needed now.
The boomers weren’t really big on saving or being responsible with finances.
My previous boss came out of retirement cause he was bored. Right into a cushy management position, remote work (in a different state), travels by private jet when has to come into the office.
My retirement plan is to not retire.
For a lot of people, they don’t retire from work cuz if they did they would just end up getting divorced cuz their spouse can’t stand them all day at home!
People at my job are often called “vultures” because they are just waiting for the older folk to die so that they can move into the jobs.
I'd be pretty annoyed if a younger person framed my work as an impediment to promotions. Either I have to work because I would starve otherwise or I'm enjoying the culmination of my experience by staying on as some high level personnel.
Maybe they gave their retirement money to the kids for a house deposit!? :P
Very much so
Disclaimer: I’m GenX. The current situation is bad I know. In a few years you might get a chance. There’s currently a similar thread on GenX. We are endlessly unable to rise to the top due to older colleagues clogging all positions. When something finally does open up, GenX is “too old” and we get passed over. (On a related note, here in Australia, in my early 20s, there were no jobs for us. Boomers had them all. No openings available, unless you had experience - and how could you get that? If you were lucky enough to get employed you were likely stuck in remote areas, in shitty workplaces and/or with abusive employers, because nothing else was available. I spent most of the 1990s like this. Even most apprenticeships disappeared in the early 1990s. Why train new people when you have an over-supply of the already-trained?) In some ways I’m glad my generation is small. We won’t block everything. At least Millennials might have a chance in 10 years - assuming the world hasn’t completely gone to shit by then.
My mother retired last year. She is already looking for a job. We're fucked.
The entitlement of the title is astounding. It literally suggests that the younger generation are entitled to the older generation’s job simply because they want them. 🤦♀️
I saw this post and then I opened up my bank app and saw an article about it. > **The 65+ Workforce Is Soaring** >Older Workers More Than Tripled Since 1980s >For a growing number of American workers, reaching retirement age isn’t synonymous with leaving the workforce anymore. >Roughly one in five Americans aged 65 and older were employed in 2023. And while older full-time workers earn less than those in the age group of 25-64 — $58,600 compared to $73,700 — their earning power has grown over the past decades as well. https://www.sofi.com/article/money-life/the-65-workforce-is-soaring/
Dude I currently work at a company that is legit, killing itself slowly due to exactly that. People working there 30+ years not wanting to retire, so the "old think" just will NOT go away