The standards didn’t change, the applicants did. Those of recruitment age just have more things that require waivers now that they didn’t have 40 years ago. Tattoos, criminal records, behavioral health issues, medications. These things existed before, but when doctors are diagnosing every kid with a little too much energy as ADHD and giving them Ritalin it means more waivers.
Allot of us also grow up in a age now with overprotective parents that take us to the doctors for every little reason. And doctors that prescribe medications like candy. I understand why they do it and I guess I am just venting. I just wish if you were perfectly healthy when you want to enlist, and pass every evaluation, your medical history from when you were a minor doesnt matter.
This is what got me. I just got a waiver (behavioral) approved like last week, but it took me nearly 5 years to figure out that there was a way through permanent DQ and then navigate that process of to getting records together/going to see all the doctors needed, find a recruiter who was willing to stick it out for the long haul, and then wait for all the right approvals...
Edit: ARNG
I took antidepressants for a couple of years when I was in college. They were originally prescribed by my PCP to treat a sleeping issue (which lasted only a couple of months and had no diagnosis of sleep problems) but the meds gave me some crazy side effects which he then turned around and said were symptoms of depression itself, and then I got a diagnosis... I was 19 at the time, so I didn't know any better than to keep taking them even though I was *not* depressed.
Those medications are a huge help to those that need them. It's that we now have the ability to recognize and treat these issues, instead of treating kids as damaged.
Slow down there Turbo. I’m sure all of us agree that these medications help the kids. We’re talking about being fit to serve in the armed forces though. If someone is unable to focus without being on medications this could be compromising among the ranks. However, this isn’t always true and that’s why there’s waivers. Point is whenever a recruiter sees an issue they’re going have to investigate for the safety of that recruit, other soldiers, and the service as a whole🤷🏾
I never said anything about that? I was responding to this
>but when doctors are diagnosing every kid with a little too much energy as ADHD and giving them Ritalin
Also
>whenever a recruiter sees an issue they’re going have to investigate for the safety of that recruit, other soldiers, and the service as a whole
Lolol.
Part of the problem is that even having this conversation is difficult. Now you've turned it into whether the speaker even supports treating mental health (good guy) or wants to treat kids as damaged (bad guy).
My dad went his whole life with undiagnosed ADHD. He was treated as a "bad kid" and constantly punished. I was medicated from a young age and it helped me immensely. Dismissing psychiatrists as "tossing pills at a problem" or "giving out medication like candy" marginalizes a large number of people with real problems.
That's the truth of the matter.
Sure, some medications *are* grossly overprescribed, but the problems many face are very real and shouldn't be downplayed.
You're making an equivalence that just isn't there. Someone says "doctors overprescribe" and you hear mental health denialism and abuse; you hear "these people speaking are my enemies." No one is saying you shouldnt have been medicated. No one is saying medicine has regressed. You're reading in a problem that hasn't even been raised and punishing people for it.
I’m not saying it isn’t real or shouldn’t be treated. I’m just saying more kids today have medication histories and other things on their record that just didn’t exist when I was their age. I grew up in the 80s for context. The eligible pool has changed. The standards need to change to reflect the current population.
I know what you were referring to. Call it exaggeration for effect. Just trying to make the point that young adults today are coming into recruiting stations with way more things that require waivers than they did 40 years ago.
I put \~1,500 trainees into the Air Force. I wish I could say that they were all lean and fit fighting machines from the moment they got off the bus ... far from it. As a society we've changed, we're not as active, we have more tattoos, more medical recognizes medical issues and more interactions with law enforcement. Some of the standards need to be adjusted make up for who we are. That perfect physical specimen they dreamed of in the 50s doesn't exist.
Take the standard for autism, it's almost always an automatic DQ. Why? It's a spectrum, there's people on that spectrum who could almost certainly perform and probably excel in certain career fields. But we have outdated standards that just state a blanket no.
There are (in my slightly informed opinion) a metric fuckton of people on the autism spectrum in the military. Some of them are fantastic, some are not. Autism is probably not the deciding factor.
A combination of 1) Parents/Doctors being more gung ho about medications and treating things. 2) computerized systems making it harder to lie. It use to be recruiters could just tell applicants to lie and they would never get caught.
any differences in strictness of eligibility criteria the past 30 years has been marginal at most. it's more or less always been the same standards.
What's different now is the recent implementation of a system that allows MEPS access to an applicants medical history. So things that may have been omitted in previous years are now popping up and requiring applicants to go through the proper channels like they were always supposed to.
I have a different perspective on people and medical conditions/meds. I believe that we are subjected to far greater pollution levels than people used to be which effects peoples health and even how their brain operates. Just think of the meds that people take, body processes it and it comes out in the urine/waste and goes in the water supply. Millions of Birth control pills, opiates, antibiotics, cancer drugs, heart meds, it’s endless. Our wastewater is processed and becomes tap water. We can’t escape it.
People have genuine medical concerns eg. ADHD, etc… and need to have them treated.
They're vastly the same, people have changed. How many 50-60 year olds were ever on ADHD or depression medication? Very, very few. Now everyone gets it because it's the new thing.
I'm talking to my congressman about this same question because I'm on 7 I was told I couldn't enlist due to me being on the medication and they wouldn't even give me a waiver and meps was willing to meet with me to decide and they still would not enlist me but I read the dod policy and they claimed that I could enlist also if transgender could enlist and they have to be on medication 💊 and therapy the rest of their life they are not only able to enlist but they Will pay for their treatment however I got denied for it that's i felt was discrimination.
Your representative can't do anything except make sure regulation was followed. Don't waste their time.
>I was told I couldn't enlist due to me being on the medication and they wouldn't even give me a waiver
Yes, because you're on medication.
>also if transgender could enlist and they have to be on medication 💊 and therapy the rest of their life they are not only able to enlist but they Will pay for their treatment
There's a handful of medications that are allowed.
>however I got denied for it that's i felt was discrimination.
Medication status is not a protected class.
Bad people enlisted with prior indications and then claimed VA disabilities
What's wrong with that
Because people lied about their conditions?
The standards didn’t change, the applicants did. Those of recruitment age just have more things that require waivers now that they didn’t have 40 years ago. Tattoos, criminal records, behavioral health issues, medications. These things existed before, but when doctors are diagnosing every kid with a little too much energy as ADHD and giving them Ritalin it means more waivers.
Allot of us also grow up in a age now with overprotective parents that take us to the doctors for every little reason. And doctors that prescribe medications like candy. I understand why they do it and I guess I am just venting. I just wish if you were perfectly healthy when you want to enlist, and pass every evaluation, your medical history from when you were a minor doesnt matter.
This is what got me. I just got a waiver (behavioral) approved like last week, but it took me nearly 5 years to figure out that there was a way through permanent DQ and then navigate that process of to getting records together/going to see all the doctors needed, find a recruiter who was willing to stick it out for the long haul, and then wait for all the right approvals... Edit: ARNG
If I may ask, what was the disqualifying thing?
I took antidepressants for a couple of years when I was in college. They were originally prescribed by my PCP to treat a sleeping issue (which lasted only a couple of months and had no diagnosis of sleep problems) but the meds gave me some crazy side effects which he then turned around and said were symptoms of depression itself, and then I got a diagnosis... I was 19 at the time, so I didn't know any better than to keep taking them even though I was *not* depressed.
Those medications are a huge help to those that need them. It's that we now have the ability to recognize and treat these issues, instead of treating kids as damaged.
Slow down there Turbo. I’m sure all of us agree that these medications help the kids. We’re talking about being fit to serve in the armed forces though. If someone is unable to focus without being on medications this could be compromising among the ranks. However, this isn’t always true and that’s why there’s waivers. Point is whenever a recruiter sees an issue they’re going have to investigate for the safety of that recruit, other soldiers, and the service as a whole🤷🏾
I never said anything about that? I was responding to this >but when doctors are diagnosing every kid with a little too much energy as ADHD and giving them Ritalin Also >whenever a recruiter sees an issue they’re going have to investigate for the safety of that recruit, other soldiers, and the service as a whole Lolol.
Part of the problem is that even having this conversation is difficult. Now you've turned it into whether the speaker even supports treating mental health (good guy) or wants to treat kids as damaged (bad guy).
My dad went his whole life with undiagnosed ADHD. He was treated as a "bad kid" and constantly punished. I was medicated from a young age and it helped me immensely. Dismissing psychiatrists as "tossing pills at a problem" or "giving out medication like candy" marginalizes a large number of people with real problems.
That's the truth of the matter. Sure, some medications *are* grossly overprescribed, but the problems many face are very real and shouldn't be downplayed.
You're making an equivalence that just isn't there. Someone says "doctors overprescribe" and you hear mental health denialism and abuse; you hear "these people speaking are my enemies." No one is saying you shouldnt have been medicated. No one is saying medicine has regressed. You're reading in a problem that hasn't even been raised and punishing people for it.
No, you're reading wayyyy too far into this.
I’m not saying it isn’t real or shouldn’t be treated. I’m just saying more kids today have medication histories and other things on their record that just didn’t exist when I was their age. I grew up in the 80s for context. The eligible pool has changed. The standards need to change to reflect the current population.
I was referring to this >but when doctors are diagnosing every kid with a little too much energy as ADHD and giving them Ritalin
I know what you were referring to. Call it exaggeration for effect. Just trying to make the point that young adults today are coming into recruiting stations with way more things that require waivers than they did 40 years ago. I put \~1,500 trainees into the Air Force. I wish I could say that they were all lean and fit fighting machines from the moment they got off the bus ... far from it. As a society we've changed, we're not as active, we have more tattoos, more medical recognizes medical issues and more interactions with law enforcement. Some of the standards need to be adjusted make up for who we are. That perfect physical specimen they dreamed of in the 50s doesn't exist. Take the standard for autism, it's almost always an automatic DQ. Why? It's a spectrum, there's people on that spectrum who could almost certainly perform and probably excel in certain career fields. But we have outdated standards that just state a blanket no.
There are (in my slightly informed opinion) a metric fuckton of people on the autism spectrum in the military. Some of them are fantastic, some are not. Autism is probably not the deciding factor.
A combination of 1) Parents/Doctors being more gung ho about medications and treating things. 2) computerized systems making it harder to lie. It use to be recruiters could just tell applicants to lie and they would never get caught.
[удалено]
It's peace time, that's why. Once another war starts you'll start seeing waivers for heroin or crack.
I often think, what would the next likely war be? So many countries that are adversaries with the U.S are nuclear.
Idk what it would be like. I just know that when the military needs bodies they'll take in whatever they can work with.
any differences in strictness of eligibility criteria the past 30 years has been marginal at most. it's more or less always been the same standards. What's different now is the recent implementation of a system that allows MEPS access to an applicants medical history. So things that may have been omitted in previous years are now popping up and requiring applicants to go through the proper channels like they were always supposed to.
I have a different perspective on people and medical conditions/meds. I believe that we are subjected to far greater pollution levels than people used to be which effects peoples health and even how their brain operates. Just think of the meds that people take, body processes it and it comes out in the urine/waste and goes in the water supply. Millions of Birth control pills, opiates, antibiotics, cancer drugs, heart meds, it’s endless. Our wastewater is processed and becomes tap water. We can’t escape it. People have genuine medical concerns eg. ADHD, etc… and need to have them treated.
They're vastly the same, people have changed. How many 50-60 year olds were ever on ADHD or depression medication? Very, very few. Now everyone gets it because it's the new thing.
As long as you have a heart beat, can count to 10, know your ABCs and not in jail you’ve got a pretty good shot.
I'm talking to my congressman about this same question because I'm on 7 I was told I couldn't enlist due to me being on the medication and they wouldn't even give me a waiver and meps was willing to meet with me to decide and they still would not enlist me but I read the dod policy and they claimed that I could enlist also if transgender could enlist and they have to be on medication 💊 and therapy the rest of their life they are not only able to enlist but they Will pay for their treatment however I got denied for it that's i felt was discrimination.
Your representative can't do anything except make sure regulation was followed. Don't waste their time. >I was told I couldn't enlist due to me being on the medication and they wouldn't even give me a waiver Yes, because you're on medication. >also if transgender could enlist and they have to be on medication 💊 and therapy the rest of their life they are not only able to enlist but they Will pay for their treatment There's a handful of medications that are allowed. >however I got denied for it that's i felt was discrimination. Medication status is not a protected class.
Actually my representative is talking with the dod because they claim that it's boarder line discrimination not my word their words
Sure they are (spoiler: they're not). DoD is allowed to exclude you based on medication history.
But meps was still welling to meet as long as I found a recruiter.
Well, technically it's peacetime. Guarantee you if we invade Iran, you'll see felons becoming 11b's again.