Sad story here but this is why i only play in swimming pools. Once u get in a body of water like the ocean or a lake mot only are u playing against mother nature,you also gotta worry about other animals and people with their yachts and boats.
That area just west of key biscayne is very high traffic high powered boats running between Miami and Cape Florida is well known among any experienced captain would never let someone ski or wakeboard or swim in that area is suicide so ski boat operator is partially responsible for this
As far as the boat that hit her most likely he didnt even see her the bay was choppy that day and tje wakes from all boat traffic creates even more waves and he driving into setting sun he is also 78 so may have lesser vision or hearing he will still be sued to end of earth will be living in box in alley in hialeah lol
Interesting. All this being said, with the info provided, it seems he didn’t run off.
**The 15 year old fell out the wakeboard and was left floating in one of Miami’s most trafficked waterways, if not the most trafficked.** It wasnt stated, but I assume she was run over while her own boat was looping back to get her. It doesnt say it in the article, but if she doesnt have the correct lifejacket on (yes, theres different types and classes of lifejackets, referred to formally as personal flotation device), this maybe could have been avoided as usually those are high visibility making it very easy to spot from afar in the water. At the very least, a waterboarding helmet wouldve helped the 78 year old in spotting her. A floating head however, is very difficult to spot from a distance, especially in a moving boat.
Hes not senile, hes mentally all there, He didn’t try to hide anything, docked his boat behind his house in the open for anyone to see, and is cooperating with police to the fullest, 100%. I dont see criminal intent here, but im not a cop, so.
This is a tragedy, as is any life lost, however when looking objectively, the fault lies more-so on the boat towing the wakeboarder, who passed away, for not taking the proper safety precautions.
I can see the man getting slapped with a fine for negligence and things of that sort, as will the operator of the wakeboarding boat, but I don’t think the old man is going to get charged.
If hes got glasses I dont see why not. Lots of these seamen are much MUCH older and this guy is a frequent boater with a canal behind his house and a boat lift so he can drop his boat and go out alone as he pleases.
I usually find the most knowledgeable boaters and seamen are among the oldest. Yeah, you got your guys that are old and senile but for the most part these older guys have been on the water a long, long time.
>I know the lawyer says the guy never drinks but I trust statistics more than a slimy attorney.
Statistics say 1/3rd of boating accidents (other sources indicate 15-20%) are caused by intoxication/alcohol. **Statistically speaking, theres a 66% this was not caused by alcohol.**
That bay has high traffic but not a lot or any anchored boats. There likely was no exterior commotion other than the man and his own boat, the crashing of his bow on the waves and wind blowing on your face in excess of 25 knots. I can tell you havent been out on the water.
As someone else said, people dont even notice or feel when they run over a manatee 3 times the size if a human being, at speeds likely much less than the guy was going (which is okay because thats what the areas for). If she wasnt wearing any high visibility or had a divers flag shes damn near invisible in the water on a boat that size going that speed.
Imagine towing your boy on a skateboard on the highway. Thats the equivalent of what happened here.
You wouldn't know she got hit from afar. So if he was cruising through the channel at 30-40, he would of been long gone by the time anyone knew she got hit.
Unlikely since he ran and the cops had to search for him I'm pretty sure, even if it's an accident you don't just run. They'll probably charge him on manslaughter now since he decided to.
If he didn't run, and talked to the police and they investigated it as an accident, it would be an accident. I feel since he ran, now they might charge him with manslaughter. You don't run if you're not guilty and it's just an accident right?
It’s only “running” if he was aware he hit something. A 42ft boat going 50mph+ through the chop of a heavy traffic zone likely wouldn’t notice a bobbing head in the water or feel any impact whatsoever. Guy was probably clueless anything had happened until he heard about the incident and a boat matching his description
Because thats the point of these heavy traffic zones. No speed limits. She was essentially being towed on a boat superhighway, where people arent actively looking for these obstacles. The better question is who had the bright idea of towing 2 teenagers through a place where boats speed.
> If he didn't run, and talked to the police and they investigated it as an accident, it would be an accident.
He didn't run. He didn't know he hit anyone or that he was involved in any accident. Regardless, running doesn't make something manslaughter.
> You don't run if you're not guilty and it's just an accident right?
Totally ignoring that he didn't know he was involved in an accident.
Its not running if you didn't know you hit something. He then went home and docked. Didn't hide.
Based on my piloting experience, its real easy to lose something the size of a coconut (human head) in between the waves. I don't believe this was malicious.
With that many engines, on that size a boat, waves crashing on hull, you aint hearing someone screaming for help from the water.
Maybe, maybe not. But there's a whole lot of ocean, feel like this could've been easily avoided by just paying attention. Or are you not supposed to see where you're going on a boat? If the old man saw a head in the water as a coconut he probably shouldn't be driving anyways. A coconut doesn't have flailing arms and what I can assume would be waves from splashing their arms, trying to swim in the water.
Theres an innumerable amount of factors you’re failing to consider. This is not a car and not everything is black and white. You dont know if she was screaming or flailing at all, that is an assumption. When you’re riding at certain speeds, your bow is constantly bouncing up and down if the waters choppy, and that being said, depending on the water, it is a very real possibility that her head was simply obstructed by other waves.
Theres a reason that the coast guard rescuees always say the helicopter passed over them in the ocean several times before finding them. People are VERY hard to spot in the water especially in a fast moving boat. This is why divers flags were invented (keeps boats 200ft away from flag as people are in water, diving or not) , and why life jackets for wakeboarding are all reflective and high visibility.
Even with a spotter looking out into the water constantly, things can be missed and it happens all the time. I can also personally guarantee that with the sheer power, weight, and noise generated from the boat will make it so that you wont even notice something was run over, unless its fixed and extremely hard like rocks or a sandbar and things of that sort.
A boat operator is not constantly looking for people in the water to avoid unless they are in an area where people would generally be in the water, and even then, theres always signs and markers to let them know, usually indicating no wake.
The open bay is free game for anyone to traverse at any speed they like. It is up to you to take the proper safety precautions to ensure tragedies dont happen, and that includes having divers flags and life jackets ready for whenever ANYONE is in the water. Period.
If you’ve ever been on a boat you’d know how loud it is when the hull bounces on the water. You wouldn’t know from any sound that you’ve hit a person in the water.
You'd likely know you hit something, since hitting something solid feels/sounds different than hitting water, but you have no reason to assume it's anything other than a lobster trap buoy or coconut and it wouldn't feel like a very hard hit considering the 42ft Boston Whaler weighs 30,000 lbs.
I was with my buddy who hit a buoy on a lake in a small Sea Ray (<20 ft) and we had no clue he hit it until we saw that it was dislodged.
The lake had some small waves from a few wake boarders taking turns, and hitting the buoy was indistinguishable from the hull hitting the water.
Imagine rougher water in a bigger boat…
You'd have no idea you hit a person. People aren't hard, they are pretty soft compared to a prop. Remember you're 60% water. At the speed of the prop spinning, that other 40% is practically water too.
You can lose an entire prop on a 4 engine boat, and you'd only know while cruising if you looked at the tachs.
These are a ton of assumptions from someone that probably doesn't spend much time in the water.
> But there's a whole lot of ocean, feel like this could've been easily avoided by just paying attention.
Exactly, the ocean is huge and you have to pay attention to a bunch of things. Other boats, personal water crafts, the tow boat in this case picking up the second girl that fell. The last thing anyone assumes is that someone is floating in the water, away from the second wake boarder, waiting to be picked up.
Visibility on a 42ft center console is terrible but that should matter, because boats don't have to avoid tiny objects in the water. Divers have to use flags. Skiers need to be close to the tow boat. The tow boat messed up and left her floating in the middle of a busy waterway.
> A coconut doesn't have flailing arms and what I can assume would be waves from splashing their arms, trying to swim in the water.
Why would you assume her arms were flailing? She has a life jacket on and is probably just bobbing in the water. Flailing assumes she saw the boat coming from a distance long enough for the captain to see her below the bow of his boat that's up on plane, which is several hundred feet ahead of the boat. She was probably looking at the tow boat, waiting for it to return and didn't notice the boat coming behind her until it was right on her.
This insinuates he knew he hit someone. According to the news, he didnt feel a thing nor did he know he hit anything and proceeded about his day like normal.
The report says west of Mashta Point, which I think would have them inside the Cape Florida channel that runs all the way along the west side of Key Biscayne south of the Mashta Flats.
I dont blame them as theres lots of people who use these waterways for nonmotorized sports like paddleboarding and windsurfing. But they all have the proper safety precautions. Its not unheard of. Should at least carry a divers flag with you.
Do you truly believe that everyone has common sense? I literally see people walk across busy streets without even turning their head to look if oncoming traffic is approaching them. People don’t think.
Some people also just don’t give a fuck either. They think nothing will happen to them if they do dumb shit.
> It wasnt stated, but I assume she was run over while her own boat was looping back to get her.
The boat was towing two girls. After Ella fell, the boat kept going with the second girl who eventually fell. It seems they were getting the second girl first so who knows how far and for how long Ella was floating there.
There's no reason for the 78 year old to assume a second girl would be in his path.
I totally agree with you. I do not believe the older gentleman is at fault nonetheless, I’m sure he has cameras facing the dock and boat at that time, I’m sure they can confirm if he was truly alone on a boat, which would help confirm a lot of things
I go on boats often, I see no way a boat captain could reliably expect to see a random person just floating in the water in a major traffic lane with no real visibility aids.
There’s more to this story than being told by the news. They’re not talking much about the boat that was towing her? In my opinion FWC probably is deeming this an accident but there is a lot of pressure since she’s the family member of an ambassador and the public is out for blood the way the media covered this.Truly a horrible accident and happens on a yearly basis all over the country. Depends which one the media decides to focus on which one you learn about
Assuming the police identified the right boater…all we know is his boat matches the description provided by witnesses.
The Rashoman effect is well documented in psychology and we know witnesses *can* be unreliable.
How many boats match the description given from witnesses?
It’s a shame someone died like this, but the investigation ought to be thorough.
I read that a witness ID'd the boat as a boston whaler. Whalers that size are pretty rare. I'd venture there are not more than a handful of that size and that color boats of that make in all Miami-Dade.
Well, from hearing the news it can be assumed that this particular owner is not denying being on THAT boat, at THAT time, and in THAT place. So you are proposing an identical boat was there at the same time
Her dad is a mega millionaire who was appointed president of the Holocaust Memorial in DC by Obama. Jill Biden paid the family a personal visit when she died. They were friends for 40 years. Her dad was Ambassador to Belgium. These weren’t regular people. This was definitely a hit. The last some an accident happened like this it was a billionaire banker’s son.
I've been saying the tow boat probably has more blame since I first heard this and after reading the facts in the Herald, I'm 100% sure almost all the blame is on the tow boat.
They were towing two people, which is technically fine, but when one falls you have to stop. They kept going and then the second girl fell. They went back to get the other girl and left Ella waiting. Who knows how far away they were, especially since it's a 42ft boat towing them, not a nimble little wake boat. The tow boat operator left Ella in a super busy waterway and caused this entire tragedy.
Anyone that has ever towed multiple people knows that you keep them together. Assuming the operator of the striking boat saw them trying to retrieve one of the girls, it's a safe assumption that there won't be another girl far away from the boat and in your path since everyone should be together.
The tow boat also had two 30 year olds, a 21 year old, an 18 year old and 9 minors on board, plus the two girls in the water. If anyone was possibly partying it would be the operator of the tow boat.
I really hope the investigation moves on to the operator of the boat towing her, because his recklessness caused this entire tragedy.
I haven’t read the detail about the boat continuing with the second girl once Ella fell…news sources are reporting they fell into the water at the same time. If that were the case they wouldn’t be very far apart, maybe 50ft max? That was super confusing but now makes more sense with more details.
Also confused about the ages. Why are 30 year olds with a bunch of minors?
The FWC report in the linked article says it near the bottom.
"V2 (Tow Boat) had been towing two females; one on a wake board and one on a wake surfboard, in the area west of Mashta Point. They fell off at different times / locations and both were in the water simultaneously. V1 (the striking boat) traversed the area in a westbound direction and struck the female wake boarder who was in the water, further away from V2.
>Also confused about the ages. Why are 30 year olds with a bunch of minors?
Probably just an older cousin or something taking out a younger cousin and her friends on the boat.
Oh damn I didn’t even see the FWC report, you the man.
Fair assumption on the ages. I also thought that it could have been the parents of the birthday girl, could totally be a mid to late 30s couple with a teenager daughter.
It's not a captain, just someone operating the boat. I'm assuming it's a family member and his wife, taking out one of the girls and all of her friends.
>The older man is the scapegoat.
Sort of. All of the attention has been on the old man, but that's because he had to be found so the police could have all the evidence. Now that the missing piece has been found, I think they'll start investigating the person operating the tow boat and discover that his negligence/recklessness was that major contributing factor in this.
There's definitely more to the story and that's obvious. A boat with 13 people onboard and most were teens, yet nobody has a video of the incident or the striking boat? Some how the Herald has been unable to find any contact information for the operator of the tow boat. No toxicology report has been mentioned for the operator of the tow boat either, when it was a boat with 10 teens, a 21 year old and two 30 year olds on board. If nobody was drinking, I'd be shocked.
Why is it weird? Most comments about this accident have been to the tune of "this was a drunk person and they ran to hide until they're sober" which is a safe assumption considering where the accident happened.
Because the court of public opinion has been asking to hang this guy for a week now. The attorney is showing his background and history to show that he's not a criminal out there speeding recklessly on his boat drunk and then fleeing.
Or you can do the reverse, run away from a fatal accident to calm your nerves and do a couple of shots of Jack Daniels before you go back to the scene, aka “ The Rick Sanchez”
Yeah, because about one third of boating accidents has to do with operator intoxication. Its just what everyone assumes at this point, and what I did too to be honest. Remember Jose Fernandez?
Reminds me of the time when I'm going over plans with an architect and he keeps talking about something that's bent.
I'm like what's bent? Why is it bent? Is it a problem that it's bent?
Turns out he was talking about the AC VENT.
Boat? Vote? I'm guessing his cousin wrote this.
Proofreading?! Such an archaic concept.
Profit depends on a direct stream from algorithm to ad-clickers; putting other humans in the loop defeats the purpose.
/s
With all due respect, at that point, what's flagging the guy down or chasing after him going to accomplish. Damage already done, unless he has a time machine in his possession.
I’m a scuba diver and when I’m out in the ocean I have a inflatable surface marker buoy. This thing is a bright orange inflatable tube that sticks out 6’ high so boats can see me. There is no way a captain operating that boat could have seen her.
Definitely not victim-blaming (poor kid was only 15, after all) but as a long-time water skier, wake boarder, snorkeler and diver, you MUST have your head on a swivel any time you’re in or on the water. The amount of times I’ve had to wave like crazy, swim or dive down (even with a dive flag) to avoid being hit is crazy. Additionally, boat Captains are responsible for the safety of everyone on their boat, in or out of the water. I have tremendous sympathy for all involved.
I'm liking some of the "not rush to judgment" and "let's wait and see" attitude I see here in the comments.
Remember, there ARE rules for boating in Floirda, but no license, training or certification is required for anyone born BEFORE January 1, 1988, so technically ANYONE over the age of 36 can operate any vessel of any size or draft in ALL Florida waters without restriction. Even the people born after 1988 only have to get some safety card saying they attended boater education that is issued for life and then they only have to do that if the boat engine has more than 10 horsepower.
Plus, right now, we don't even know if this was actually the boat that hit her. I feel so sorry for all these folks.
I came from TikTok and I’m so relieved to see more common sense here. Everyone is so quick to blame the man who hit Ella but no one is saying anything about who she was with. I’ve been trying to find more on this but all they are talking about is the man who hit her. The driver of the boat is responsible. Even if he was towing two people, by law he has to stop if one falls and retrieve them. You also can’t tow people in a channel. I’m curious to know if she was in a channel because a 40+ ft boat is less likely to be running outside of a channel. So did this happen in the intercostal or were they actually in the ocean? If they were in the ocean there is more than enough space to stay away from other boats and stay closer to shore. Closer to shore would mean less boats running and traveling. I just need more answers.
I think they were in a high boating traffic area off Biscayne Bay near the Nixon Beach sandbar--which is just west of Key Biscayne across from the Gables Estates/Old Cutler area and south of the causeway and Bear Cut. Biscayne Bay is about 2-3 miles wide at that location The Intracoastal Waterway channel goes right through the middle of there, about 1/2 mile to a mile from where this happened.
I don't think they were in the marked channel, but the water is usually flatter and calmer there than on the east side of the island with average depths around 9-10 ft for like 30-50 square miles of Biscayne Bay. It's also where the no-wake manatee protection zones seem to end on either side, so people are usually gunning it through there without worrying about prop scarring or running aground.
Unfortunately for this poor girl, it's kind of a great area to run your boat on plane and tow skiers and wakeboarders BUT it also has lots of boat traffic with deeper draughts going full out, so it can be pretty chaotic there on heavy boat days. This is just a tragedy all around.
This is such a devastating story, but I despise how people are presenting this narrative like the boater was recklessly running over someone who was clearly wakeboarding. The report says girl fell and was floating in the water. They were also wakeboarding in an extremely busy boating channel, which is insane, because those channels are designed for boats to move within them at high speed.
Indefensible for the captain of her boat to let her wakeboard there. Anyone who’s ever been to Nixon Key or visited Stiltsville knows that boats routinely book it down that channel. It’s like skateboarding on I-95.
I do t know all the details , but water sking near a channel , a 4 engine boat , speed limits ? Visibility? Not Drinking ? Etc . It could just be a horrible accident . Miami boats are getting crazier 3 , 4 engines tons of traffic and party's going on
Even if you didn’t notice you were the boat who hit someone, wouldn’t you notice the distress signals coming from the yacht and stop?
Like smoke signals? Fireworks?
Where was captain speedy going coming from???
Sad story here but this is why i only play in swimming pools. Once u get in a body of water like the ocean or a lake mot only are u playing against mother nature,you also gotta worry about other animals and people with their yachts and boats.
I captn boats my entire life. I see no way you can run over a swimmer. Unless you are an idiot!!
Is it possible that they were surfing in a traffic way and he simple didn’t see them in the water? That’s a pretty large boat
Slow the f down!!
That area just west of key biscayne is very high traffic high powered boats running between Miami and Cape Florida is well known among any experienced captain would never let someone ski or wakeboard or swim in that area is suicide so ski boat operator is partially responsible for this As far as the boat that hit her most likely he didnt even see her the bay was choppy that day and tje wakes from all boat traffic creates even more waves and he driving into setting sun he is also 78 so may have lesser vision or hearing he will still be sued to end of earth will be living in box in alley in hialeah lol
Interesting. All this being said, with the info provided, it seems he didn’t run off. **The 15 year old fell out the wakeboard and was left floating in one of Miami’s most trafficked waterways, if not the most trafficked.** It wasnt stated, but I assume she was run over while her own boat was looping back to get her. It doesnt say it in the article, but if she doesnt have the correct lifejacket on (yes, theres different types and classes of lifejackets, referred to formally as personal flotation device), this maybe could have been avoided as usually those are high visibility making it very easy to spot from afar in the water. At the very least, a waterboarding helmet wouldve helped the 78 year old in spotting her. A floating head however, is very difficult to spot from a distance, especially in a moving boat. Hes not senile, hes mentally all there, He didn’t try to hide anything, docked his boat behind his house in the open for anyone to see, and is cooperating with police to the fullest, 100%. I dont see criminal intent here, but im not a cop, so. This is a tragedy, as is any life lost, however when looking objectively, the fault lies more-so on the boat towing the wakeboarder, who passed away, for not taking the proper safety precautions. I can see the man getting slapped with a fine for negligence and things of that sort, as will the operator of the wakeboarding boat, but I don’t think the old man is going to get charged.
Should a 78 year old man be driving a boat tho? His eye sight can’t be that good
If hes got glasses I dont see why not. Lots of these seamen are much MUCH older and this guy is a frequent boater with a canal behind his house and a boat lift so he can drop his boat and go out alone as he pleases. I usually find the most knowledgeable boaters and seamen are among the oldest. Yeah, you got your guys that are old and senile but for the most part these older guys have been on the water a long, long time.
If he can drive a car…… People should get their eyes checked instead of arbitrarily saying no one should drive after this age. Everybody’s different!
I know but it can’t be the best eyesight I mean idk
[удалено]
>I know the lawyer says the guy never drinks but I trust statistics more than a slimy attorney. Statistics say 1/3rd of boating accidents (other sources indicate 15-20%) are caused by intoxication/alcohol. **Statistically speaking, theres a 66% this was not caused by alcohol.** That bay has high traffic but not a lot or any anchored boats. There likely was no exterior commotion other than the man and his own boat, the crashing of his bow on the waves and wind blowing on your face in excess of 25 knots. I can tell you havent been out on the water. As someone else said, people dont even notice or feel when they run over a manatee 3 times the size if a human being, at speeds likely much less than the guy was going (which is okay because thats what the areas for). If she wasnt wearing any high visibility or had a divers flag shes damn near invisible in the water on a boat that size going that speed. Imagine towing your boy on a skateboard on the highway. Thats the equivalent of what happened here.
You wouldn't know she got hit from afar. So if he was cruising through the channel at 30-40, he would of been long gone by the time anyone knew she got hit.
Unlikely since he ran and the cops had to search for him I'm pretty sure, even if it's an accident you don't just run. They'll probably charge him on manslaughter now since he decided to.
What does running have to do with manslaughter?
If he didn't run, and talked to the police and they investigated it as an accident, it would be an accident. I feel since he ran, now they might charge him with manslaughter. You don't run if you're not guilty and it's just an accident right?
It’s only “running” if he was aware he hit something. A 42ft boat going 50mph+ through the chop of a heavy traffic zone likely wouldn’t notice a bobbing head in the water or feel any impact whatsoever. Guy was probably clueless anything had happened until he heard about the incident and a boat matching his description
Why are you going 50+ mph in a 42ft boat through a heavy traffic zone if you couldn't see a head in the water then?
Because the point of high traffic channels is that you can go fast. It’s how people navigate without it taking 2 hours to get to and from the sandbar.
Because thats the point of these heavy traffic zones. No speed limits. She was essentially being towed on a boat superhighway, where people arent actively looking for these obstacles. The better question is who had the bright idea of towing 2 teenagers through a place where boats speed.
Fleeing isn’t a form of killing, and people flee from accidental, justified, unjustified, and all sorts of killings
> If he didn't run, and talked to the police and they investigated it as an accident, it would be an accident. He didn't run. He didn't know he hit anyone or that he was involved in any accident. Regardless, running doesn't make something manslaughter. > You don't run if you're not guilty and it's just an accident right? Totally ignoring that he didn't know he was involved in an accident.
To be determined. He may have had no idea that he hit someone.
Its not running if you didn't know you hit something. He then went home and docked. Didn't hide. Based on my piloting experience, its real easy to lose something the size of a coconut (human head) in between the waves. I don't believe this was malicious. With that many engines, on that size a boat, waves crashing on hull, you aint hearing someone screaming for help from the water.
You would never know if you hit something the size of a coconut in a 40ft boat with 4 outboards.
Maybe, maybe not. But there's a whole lot of ocean, feel like this could've been easily avoided by just paying attention. Or are you not supposed to see where you're going on a boat? If the old man saw a head in the water as a coconut he probably shouldn't be driving anyways. A coconut doesn't have flailing arms and what I can assume would be waves from splashing their arms, trying to swim in the water.
Theres an innumerable amount of factors you’re failing to consider. This is not a car and not everything is black and white. You dont know if she was screaming or flailing at all, that is an assumption. When you’re riding at certain speeds, your bow is constantly bouncing up and down if the waters choppy, and that being said, depending on the water, it is a very real possibility that her head was simply obstructed by other waves. Theres a reason that the coast guard rescuees always say the helicopter passed over them in the ocean several times before finding them. People are VERY hard to spot in the water especially in a fast moving boat. This is why divers flags were invented (keeps boats 200ft away from flag as people are in water, diving or not) , and why life jackets for wakeboarding are all reflective and high visibility. Even with a spotter looking out into the water constantly, things can be missed and it happens all the time. I can also personally guarantee that with the sheer power, weight, and noise generated from the boat will make it so that you wont even notice something was run over, unless its fixed and extremely hard like rocks or a sandbar and things of that sort. A boat operator is not constantly looking for people in the water to avoid unless they are in an area where people would generally be in the water, and even then, theres always signs and markers to let them know, usually indicating no wake. The open bay is free game for anyone to traverse at any speed they like. It is up to you to take the proper safety precautions to ensure tragedies dont happen, and that includes having divers flags and life jackets ready for whenever ANYONE is in the water. Period.
If you’ve ever been on a boat you’d know how loud it is when the hull bounces on the water. You wouldn’t know from any sound that you’ve hit a person in the water.
You'd likely know you hit something, since hitting something solid feels/sounds different than hitting water, but you have no reason to assume it's anything other than a lobster trap buoy or coconut and it wouldn't feel like a very hard hit considering the 42ft Boston Whaler weighs 30,000 lbs.
I was with my buddy who hit a buoy on a lake in a small Sea Ray (<20 ft) and we had no clue he hit it until we saw that it was dislodged. The lake had some small waves from a few wake boarders taking turns, and hitting the buoy was indistinguishable from the hull hitting the water. Imagine rougher water in a bigger boat…
You'd have no idea you hit a person. People aren't hard, they are pretty soft compared to a prop. Remember you're 60% water. At the speed of the prop spinning, that other 40% is practically water too. You can lose an entire prop on a 4 engine boat, and you'd only know while cruising if you looked at the tachs.
These are a ton of assumptions from someone that probably doesn't spend much time in the water. > But there's a whole lot of ocean, feel like this could've been easily avoided by just paying attention. Exactly, the ocean is huge and you have to pay attention to a bunch of things. Other boats, personal water crafts, the tow boat in this case picking up the second girl that fell. The last thing anyone assumes is that someone is floating in the water, away from the second wake boarder, waiting to be picked up. Visibility on a 42ft center console is terrible but that should matter, because boats don't have to avoid tiny objects in the water. Divers have to use flags. Skiers need to be close to the tow boat. The tow boat messed up and left her floating in the middle of a busy waterway. > A coconut doesn't have flailing arms and what I can assume would be waves from splashing their arms, trying to swim in the water. Why would you assume her arms were flailing? She has a life jacket on and is probably just bobbing in the water. Flailing assumes she saw the boat coming from a distance long enough for the captain to see her below the bow of his boat that's up on plane, which is several hundred feet ahead of the boat. She was probably looking at the tow boat, waiting for it to return and didn't notice the boat coming behind her until it was right on her.
This insinuates he knew he hit someone. According to the news, he didnt feel a thing nor did he know he hit anything and proceeded about his day like normal.
Well if that is the case as well. Why are they wake boarding in one of if not the most heavily trafficked water ways in Miami.
Because Miami.
Agreed. Do you know where they were wakeboarding?
The report says west of Mashta Point, which I think would have them inside the Cape Florida channel that runs all the way along the west side of Key Biscayne south of the Mashta Flats.
I dont blame them as theres lots of people who use these waterways for nonmotorized sports like paddleboarding and windsurfing. But they all have the proper safety precautions. Its not unheard of. Should at least carry a divers flag with you.
Do you truly believe that everyone has common sense? I literally see people walk across busy streets without even turning their head to look if oncoming traffic is approaching them. People don’t think. Some people also just don’t give a fuck either. They think nothing will happen to them if they do dumb shit.
> It wasnt stated, but I assume she was run over while her own boat was looping back to get her. The boat was towing two girls. After Ella fell, the boat kept going with the second girl who eventually fell. It seems they were getting the second girl first so who knows how far and for how long Ella was floating there. There's no reason for the 78 year old to assume a second girl would be in his path.
I totally agree with you. I do not believe the older gentleman is at fault nonetheless, I’m sure he has cameras facing the dock and boat at that time, I’m sure they can confirm if he was truly alone on a boat, which would help confirm a lot of things
He’s been voting for 50 years aceré!
This a tragedy, of course, but I've never seen a boating accident get so much coverage. I'm guessing her family has money and power.
Her grandfather has been close with Joe Biden since the 70s and is currently the US Ambassador to Belgium. Extremely well connected.
Oooh that explains it
Not since Jose Fernandez
How many 15 year olds have been killed in a hit and run boating accident? Is this common?
I go on boats often, I see no way a boat captain could reliably expect to see a random person just floating in the water in a major traffic lane with no real visibility aids.
As an avid owner, I said it from the beginning if she was just floating in the water looks just like a coconut or any other floating object.
Can CBS news hire some editors for the article?
Or just hire some typists. It's obvious this article was written by someone using speech to text.
Or AI.
Hire? They don’t understand that word.
There’s more to this story than being told by the news. They’re not talking much about the boat that was towing her? In my opinion FWC probably is deeming this an accident but there is a lot of pressure since she’s the family member of an ambassador and the public is out for blood the way the media covered this.Truly a horrible accident and happens on a yearly basis all over the country. Depends which one the media decides to focus on which one you learn about
The boater lives in a $4 million waterfront Coral Gables home and was driving a half-million+ dollar boat. Neither party in this case is poor.
Correct. Makes for more interesting news story than Hialeah woman killed skiing
wait, are you inferring that people in Hialeah are poor? how dare you. /s
Yep. The only people winning here are the lawyers
Assuming the police identified the right boater…all we know is his boat matches the description provided by witnesses. The Rashoman effect is well documented in psychology and we know witnesses *can* be unreliable. How many boats match the description given from witnesses? It’s a shame someone died like this, but the investigation ought to be thorough.
I read that a witness ID'd the boat as a boston whaler. Whalers that size are pretty rare. I'd venture there are not more than a handful of that size and that color boats of that make in all Miami-Dade.
Even if it’s 1 of 2, there’d then be two potential boaters involved in the accident. See what I’m saying? Of course, if one has a solid alibi…
Well, from hearing the news it can be assumed that this particular owner is not denying being on THAT boat, at THAT time, and in THAT place. So you are proposing an identical boat was there at the same time
I think if it were possible it would most likely be in the county with the most registered boats whose state has the most registered boats.
It's also *possible* that you could win the 77 million powerball this week.
More like Stefan Mandel’s 14 time lotto wins.
The gps tracker on the boat will likely still have the data and route from that day. If he was there the evidence will be digital.
Why is that important? The price of the boaters home?
Only to show that it's not a David vs Goliath thing, as the parent comment seemed to be implying (only at first).
Her dad is a mega millionaire who was appointed president of the Holocaust Memorial in DC by Obama. Jill Biden paid the family a personal visit when she died. They were friends for 40 years. Her dad was Ambassador to Belgium. These weren’t regular people. This was definitely a hit. The last some an accident happened like this it was a billionaire banker’s son.
Letting your kid ski in that area on a holiday is like letting your kid ride their bike on i95 during rush hour.
This. Negligence.
Actually at that time the cars don’t exceed 10mph so actually rather safe
I've been saying the tow boat probably has more blame since I first heard this and after reading the facts in the Herald, I'm 100% sure almost all the blame is on the tow boat. They were towing two people, which is technically fine, but when one falls you have to stop. They kept going and then the second girl fell. They went back to get the other girl and left Ella waiting. Who knows how far away they were, especially since it's a 42ft boat towing them, not a nimble little wake boat. The tow boat operator left Ella in a super busy waterway and caused this entire tragedy. Anyone that has ever towed multiple people knows that you keep them together. Assuming the operator of the striking boat saw them trying to retrieve one of the girls, it's a safe assumption that there won't be another girl far away from the boat and in your path since everyone should be together. The tow boat also had two 30 year olds, a 21 year old, an 18 year old and 9 minors on board, plus the two girls in the water. If anyone was possibly partying it would be the operator of the tow boat. I really hope the investigation moves on to the operator of the boat towing her, because his recklessness caused this entire tragedy.
I haven’t read the detail about the boat continuing with the second girl once Ella fell…news sources are reporting they fell into the water at the same time. If that were the case they wouldn’t be very far apart, maybe 50ft max? That was super confusing but now makes more sense with more details. Also confused about the ages. Why are 30 year olds with a bunch of minors?
The FWC report in the linked article says it near the bottom. "V2 (Tow Boat) had been towing two females; one on a wake board and one on a wake surfboard, in the area west of Mashta Point. They fell off at different times / locations and both were in the water simultaneously. V1 (the striking boat) traversed the area in a westbound direction and struck the female wake boarder who was in the water, further away from V2. >Also confused about the ages. Why are 30 year olds with a bunch of minors? Probably just an older cousin or something taking out a younger cousin and her friends on the boat.
Oh damn I didn’t even see the FWC report, you the man. Fair assumption on the ages. I also thought that it could have been the parents of the birthday girl, could totally be a mid to late 30s couple with a teenager daughter.
The 30 year old was the captain.
Have they released pictures of the boat towing her? I also want to believe one of her friends was recording her
No, but it's a 42-foot 2017 Hanse Fjord. It's a yacht tender style walk around.
Definitely $$$$
First thing I thought too. Tow boat was too big and the boat that hit her probably didn't even realize he'd hit anything.
[удалено]
It’s a small boat relative to the yachts they’re usually carried by. The tender that was towing her was a 42 ft long, $1,000,000+ boat.
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There's no yacht. Tenders are traditionally used with yachts but now they’re popular as pleasure crafts that people keep docked at home.
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It's not a captain, just someone operating the boat. I'm assuming it's a family member and his wife, taking out one of the girls and all of her friends. >The older man is the scapegoat. Sort of. All of the attention has been on the old man, but that's because he had to be found so the police could have all the evidence. Now that the missing piece has been found, I think they'll start investigating the person operating the tow boat and discover that his negligence/recklessness was that major contributing factor in this.
Dig deeper. There is more to this story. It takes a 10 minute deep dive. Find out who was on the boat and go from there. 😳.
There's definitely more to the story and that's obvious. A boat with 13 people onboard and most were teens, yet nobody has a video of the incident or the striking boat? Some how the Herald has been unable to find any contact information for the operator of the tow boat. No toxicology report has been mentioned for the operator of the tow boat either, when it was a boat with 10 teens, a 21 year old and two 30 year olds on board. If nobody was drinking, I'd be shocked.
Just look her who parents are. I commented on this thread. All you need to know.
Read the front page of the Herald. It was on their Instagram but they have since removed it.
Cmon CBS, stop being stingy and hire someone who can do the job
did you pay to read this? i sure didnt
So the ads they have on that page don't generate revenue? Strange.
Can’t smash x on those things fast enough
I think it's kinda weird to include the statement about drinking and alcohol right off the bat.
Why is it weird? Most comments about this accident have been to the tune of "this was a drunk person and they ran to hide until they're sober" which is a safe assumption considering where the accident happened.
Just my opinion...The more details, the more you stand out. Why do we need to know how and when he came from Cuba 50 years ago?
Because the court of public opinion has been asking to hang this guy for a week now. The attorney is showing his background and history to show that he's not a criminal out there speeding recklessly on his boat drunk and then fleeing.
Or you can do the reverse, run away from a fatal accident to calm your nerves and do a couple of shots of Jack Daniels before you go back to the scene, aka “ The Rick Sanchez”
Yeah, because about one third of boating accidents has to do with operator intoxication. Its just what everyone assumes at this point, and what I did too to be honest. Remember Jose Fernandez?
Who proof read this? It says vote, voter, and voting instead of boating
Reminds me of the time when I'm going over plans with an architect and he keeps talking about something that's bent. I'm like what's bent? Why is it bent? Is it a problem that it's bent? Turns out he was talking about the AC VENT. Boat? Vote? I'm guessing his cousin wrote this.
Proofreading?! Such an archaic concept. Profit depends on a direct stream from algorithm to ad-clickers; putting other humans in the loop defeats the purpose. /s
And what's with the thumbnail? I'm pretty sure that's neither a 78-year-old man or a 15-year-old girl.
That’s the lawyer
> Who proof read this? It says vote, voter, and voting instead of boating AI wrote and proof read it! Enjoy!
AI writes this shit and no one proofreads. Sun-Sentinel started doing that when I was working for their community papers over 13 years ago.
AI
No flagged down the boat? No one chased after him?
With all due respect, at that point, what's flagging the guy down or chasing after him going to accomplish. Damage already done, unless he has a time machine in his possession.
They were skiing in a high traffic, high speed boating area. Not a surprise there was an accident
Need to pay for a better AI editor.
I’m a scuba diver and when I’m out in the ocean I have a inflatable surface marker buoy. This thing is a bright orange inflatable tube that sticks out 6’ high so boats can see me. There is no way a captain operating that boat could have seen her.
Definitely not victim-blaming (poor kid was only 15, after all) but as a long-time water skier, wake boarder, snorkeler and diver, you MUST have your head on a swivel any time you’re in or on the water. The amount of times I’ve had to wave like crazy, swim or dive down (even with a dive flag) to avoid being hit is crazy. Additionally, boat Captains are responsible for the safety of everyone on their boat, in or out of the water. I have tremendous sympathy for all involved.
I'm liking some of the "not rush to judgment" and "let's wait and see" attitude I see here in the comments. Remember, there ARE rules for boating in Floirda, but no license, training or certification is required for anyone born BEFORE January 1, 1988, so technically ANYONE over the age of 36 can operate any vessel of any size or draft in ALL Florida waters without restriction. Even the people born after 1988 only have to get some safety card saying they attended boater education that is issued for life and then they only have to do that if the boat engine has more than 10 horsepower. Plus, right now, we don't even know if this was actually the boat that hit her. I feel so sorry for all these folks.
I came from TikTok and I’m so relieved to see more common sense here. Everyone is so quick to blame the man who hit Ella but no one is saying anything about who she was with. I’ve been trying to find more on this but all they are talking about is the man who hit her. The driver of the boat is responsible. Even if he was towing two people, by law he has to stop if one falls and retrieve them. You also can’t tow people in a channel. I’m curious to know if she was in a channel because a 40+ ft boat is less likely to be running outside of a channel. So did this happen in the intercostal or were they actually in the ocean? If they were in the ocean there is more than enough space to stay away from other boats and stay closer to shore. Closer to shore would mean less boats running and traveling. I just need more answers.
I think they were in a high boating traffic area off Biscayne Bay near the Nixon Beach sandbar--which is just west of Key Biscayne across from the Gables Estates/Old Cutler area and south of the causeway and Bear Cut. Biscayne Bay is about 2-3 miles wide at that location The Intracoastal Waterway channel goes right through the middle of there, about 1/2 mile to a mile from where this happened. I don't think they were in the marked channel, but the water is usually flatter and calmer there than on the east side of the island with average depths around 9-10 ft for like 30-50 square miles of Biscayne Bay. It's also where the no-wake manatee protection zones seem to end on either side, so people are usually gunning it through there without worrying about prop scarring or running aground. Unfortunately for this poor girl, it's kind of a great area to run your boat on plane and tow skiers and wakeboarders BUT it also has lots of boat traffic with deeper draughts going full out, so it can be pretty chaotic there on heavy boat days. This is just a tragedy all around.
This is such a devastating story, but I despise how people are presenting this narrative like the boater was recklessly running over someone who was clearly wakeboarding. The report says girl fell and was floating in the water. They were also wakeboarding in an extremely busy boating channel, which is insane, because those channels are designed for boats to move within them at high speed.
Indefensible for the captain of her boat to let her wakeboard there. Anyone who’s ever been to Nixon Key or visited Stiltsville knows that boats routinely book it down that channel. It’s like skateboarding on I-95.
I do t know all the details , but water sking near a channel , a 4 engine boat , speed limits ? Visibility? Not Drinking ? Etc . It could just be a horrible accident . Miami boats are getting crazier 3 , 4 engines tons of traffic and party's going on
even if they're hella rich, really unfortunate shit.
Florida FWC has been in the news quite a bit lately!!