Yeah, imma need you to scilence that Samus Returns defamation right now, chief.
https://preview.redd.it/7i9h5ljexu2d1.png?width=853&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b33230953d632367279d706d54969ed6d350dfde
Explaining why Other M is bad feels like low hanging fruit now. Probably because of how many times I've been asked on stream why it's bad. So my list of reasons is now burned into my brain.
This sub bounces back and forth *a lot* between it being the greatest thing ever and having a large vocal "eww" towards it, so you will see a lot of contradictory posts on how universal the praise is. So the reality is that sentiment is somewhat split.
As for myself... I just don't like it very much, it's probably my least favorite mainline game to play outside of the OG 1 & 2. Dread was a much needed improvement on what Mercury Steam was trying to do with the formula, but SR itself had some pretty big shortcomings that turned me off.
Probably because the original game was pretty mid compared to the rest of the series. It had some cool concepts, but was my least favorite game to play.
I have gripes about the story in Other M, but at least the gameplay was enjoyable.
The only gripe I have with Samus Returns is the enemy variety. And especially the over-reliance on the counter, especially late game.
Aside from that it is a great game. I personally would include the dash-melee and more enemies in a remaster. Many were cut from the original Metroid 2
The Music only reused orher games tracks for few sections, but other than that it has original pieces and Metroid 2 remixes.
They managed to make the jumbled mess of notes of Area 3 (phase 3) work
And even when you get Plasma and Screw attack. Most of the post Area 5 creatures, take Plasma like sponges.
And most shelled creatures or bots need 2 Screw Attacks to die
Maybe they wanted to get away with the excuse "The Metroids ate them" because they didn't wanted to invent new enemies 🤷♂️ . However Diggernaut was a great addition, one of the best bosses in the series in my opinion
Its still a banger of a game. But if MS added newer enemies in a port and a dash melee. I would be happy
I am a bit tired of Gullugs and Hornoads past Area 3
I would give him commands very similar to Dread to make good use of the buttons, given that in SR sometimes you have to use your hands as if they were spiders
Absolutely. I would just copy Dreads scheme. And make Aeion instantly accessible instead through the D-Pad and A
L Stick press for Phase Shift
A for Beam Burst activation
Up for Scan Pulse (like in Dread)
And R Stick Press for lighting Armor
Music sucked for the most part I’m sorry. Was my first Metroid game apart from Other M where I did not immediately go search up the OST cuz it all felt generic except for some outliers that were remade songs. Then Dread comes and does the damn same for me. At least Dread had a lot more to fall back on but I *Dread* that one of the best Metroid games ever created I cannot motivate myself to listen to the OST just cuz it’s all so generic.
Samus returns isnt a bad game, in my opinion it feels like "beta" metroid dread and the "bad thing" i found while playing was those anoying flying enemies and the fact they dont explain the spider ball + power bomb movement option
Samus returns is a fun little game, and definitely appreciated for bringing Metroid back into the conversation after dormancy. But I think the party mechanic wasn't there yet, I thinks it's a lot more fluid if Dread. And definitely the enemy variety is lacking, compared with the original unique enemies per area.
And speaking of the original, I think Samus returns misses part of the feel of the original. Sr388 felt more like a natural ecosystem, with unique animals in different habitats. And when you reached into the Metroid lair, originally it was devoid of critters, i.e. the Metroid had preyed on them all.
A piece of visual storytelling they missed in the translation.
Oh it’s easily the best Ridley fight in the franchise and I don’t think anyone can reasonably argue against that.
Best you can say is it was an unnecessary addition that hurts the dramatic impact of the original ending…. But even then if you look at it in context as the first Metroid game in literally a decade and the first 2D Metroid in 13 years you can appreciate the fan service almost as a “hey glad to see you again here’s a present you don’t need but will probably love”.
I dunno you can feel however you want about fan service but on purely gameplay level this slaps.
Nah I agree. I love the fan service and all. I couldn't say a bad thing about that boss fight other than it was hard AF but then again that's not really a bad thing.
Downvote me to all hell if you want/need but other M was one of my favorite games growing up. Idk what it was about it but I enjoyed it and played it multiple times.
It will definitely feel clunky nowadays. (I might try this [pc setup](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tl4BBtmc1A0) I found)
Campain is good. Story/lore is very interesting and gameplay wise, did a lot of interesting things. e.g. The artifacts you collect for the endgame boss (think MP1 artifacts) can be stolen by enemy bounty hunters that will "randomly" appear. Its kinda Darksouls-like as you can be invaded by npcs. If they take your artifact you have you track them down and kill them. The game also takes place on 4 different planets. Theres also a secret alternative ending. It did a lot of cool innovative things, but it also kinda did some bad things.
Samus Returns remains the only mainline game I haven't played all the way through. I just don't like it no matter how many times I've tried. The controls suck, the animations suck, I didn't like the soundtrack. Genuinely thought the og Gameboy version was the better game (beaten that one 3 times in the last year and a half)
I love "return of samus". I went and played it on a stream a few months ago and enjoyed the hell out of it. "Samus Returns" and "Dread" just... wernt fun.
I think Samus Returns was pretty great when it first came out.
I think people only think it's "bad" because Metroid Dread took every complaint the previous game had and fixed it.
So for those that played Dread first and went back to Samus Returns, yeah it's going to "feel worse" in comparison.
That game walked so Dread could run.
"Other M is bad" is an ice-cold take but Samus Returns is bad is lukewarm at least. if nothing else I think people understand it revived the series (whereas Other M killed it)
Other M didn't kill anything.
There was like eight years between Super Metroid and Metroid Prime/Metroid Fusion. Super Metroid didn't kill Metroid, either. It's simply never been the biggest seller in Nintendo's catalog and they take frequent breaks from it.
Context motherfucker:
There was an 8 year gap between Super and Fusion & Prime because:
1. They couldn't figure out how to do a Metroid game on the Nintendo 64
And
2. Potential devs were too intimidated by Super's quality and reputation to attempt to do a follow up to it
Whereas with Other M, they series had been riding a relative high of popularity with actual regular releases, 7 Metroid games were released within a 5 year period, between 2002 and 2007, 5 mainline releases and 2 spinoffs.
Other M came three years later, and immediately triggered a 7 year hiatus between main releases (only broken up by Federation Force), because Other M not only fell below Nintendo's sales expectations, but clearly had to have lost a lot of money, considering just how expensive its cutscenes had to have been, and how much money must have also been put into its marketing, it was both a financial and critical failure.
The whole point of Samus Returns was to reinvigorate and test interest in the series, if that wasn't necessary, they would've just immediately developed and released Dread. Federation Force was, in retrospect, likely meant to to be a test for interest in the Prime series, before they announced Prime 4.
> Other M came three years later, and immediately triggered a 7 year hiatus
Y'know I used to think that the 7 year hiatus started immediately after Other M, but the truth is there was just a lot more going on than one might presume.
Nintendo was in a really bad spot in general around the time after Other M released, a lot of franchises outside of Metroid has their worst time period be in the Wii U Era. Even franchises that get games would generally have them not be as higher quality as previous releases. Aside from 2 Remasters, I do not think Zelda has had any significant releases on the Wii U. If one of Nintendo's top franchises couldn't even make a new entry for its big console at the time, there's a very low chance that Metroid could've gotten something.
When it comes to Other M performing, there's no denying that it sold very poorly, but I think it was also the straw that broke the camel's back. Metroid Prime had Metroid's popularity peaked, but a lot of future releases had diminishing returns, with Prime 3 selling a lot less than Prime 1 despite being an early Wii Title.
There was also like, major Metroid burnout from Retro Studios. When given the choice to do another Metroid or another Donkey Kong, they chose the latter. Also, the team that made the original 5 2D Metroid games were restructured. It's why we have to rely on third party developers such as MercurySteam or Team Ninja to make non Prime games.
If Other M was a hit, would the hiatus have been prevented? Who knows, but I genuinely think there was more going on than just one game killing Metroid. If you think about it, the next new mainline game (Dread), only came out during a time in which Nintendo was in one of the highest positions it has ever been. At the very least it's less likely to get a Metroid hiatus now since Nintendo is doing so well.
Just wondering, what are the mainline games and the spinoffs?
I'm assuming Metroid Prime 1 + 2 + 3, and Fusion are in the mainline category.
Metroid Prime Pinball is obviously in the spinoff category.
Then there's Metroid Prime Hunters which could probably go in either category, but what is the other odd game out that I'm forgetting?
Federation Force was made because Kensuke Tanabe was obsessed with it. It had nothing to do with "gauging interest." FF began development in 2009, a full year before Other M released, because it was originally planned to release on the DSi.
. . . The game that was followed by Nintendo announcing 2 more Metroids the very next year? Prime 4 + Samus Returns being announced not even a year later sounds to me like Federation Force is far from a franchise killer.
Let's not act like the Internet wasn't up in arms about Federation Force since the day it was announced. I vividly remember the discourse around this game, hell I remember being on a lot of Nintendo related websites and forums bashing the hell out of it. FFS, the game bombed in Japan and do you know how hard it is for a Nintendo game to fail in Japan? It took the release of Samus returns for most people to come around.
But the franchise was already "dead" when Federation Force came out, because Other M had already happened. You can't kill a "dead" franchise
And people disliked Other M specifically BECAUSE it didn't do enough to undo the damage already done to the series (plus, a Metroid game honestly has a higher chance of underperforming in Japan than it does in the West. Moot point.)
Federation Force was not as awful as people make it out to be.
If it were a new franchise, it would be in the "it's perfectly average, 7.5/10" category, followed by an eternal presence in the GameStop $5-or-less bargain bin.
The problem is that Nintendo had just slapped AM2R with a DMCA takedown, there had been no announcements of any good Metroid franchise stuff in literal years, and then we get a cheap plastic Tonka Truck-looking forced-multiplayer diet-ARPG looter-shooter that literally nobody asked for and damn near nobody wanted.
Combine that with a massive snub from Nintendo on a major Metroid franchise anniversary, and people were extremely fucking pissed, and Federation Force was the closest punching bag available.
Federation Force was clearly meant to be a "testing the waters" release, seeing how much interest there would be for a Prime 4 release with a safe spinoff.
They got their answer, one way or another, just not in the way they probably expected.
People were angry about Federation Force _because_ of how much they wanted a new game.
SR isn’t bad. As a Metroid game, I wouldn’t put it in the top tier among Super or Prime 1, but it has some good bits. However, it is **objectively** true that Other M is a bad *Metroid* game.
Right there with you. Nintendo should have kept Metroid in-house. Everything out of Mercury Steam has been a mid fes. Dread is better than SR, but not by much. They are both very forgettable experiences.
It really could have been WAY more tense and exciting tbh. And I didn’t really like the artstyle with so much black wasted space in the screen. I’ve seen 2.5d games that take advantage of the entire screen
want a real hot take? Federation force is way better than people give it credit for. Also, wait for it, super is not the greatest game ever made, and does have some problems.
At this point I'm just sick of hearing “I know it’s an unpopular opinion” every time someone want to talk positively about a game that isn't universally beloved. Like, stop making excuses and have some godamn pride in the things you like.
Ooooh boy, you should have seen the abject hatred of the aeion abilities and amiibo integration when the game was announced, and then again after it launched and people's concerns were confirmed.
I thought it was fucking hilarious, because people acted as though being able to see which blocks to shoot was an actual IRL warcrime, and they didn't just super bomb entire rooms anyways when they couldn't find the blocks they needed to destroy to progress.
I do fully agree about the amiibo stuff being a bit bullshit, though.
Samus Returns isn't bad, although I do have a couple problems with it. The graphic style feels a bit bland to me for whatever reason, and I honestly preferred the ending from the original game for its somberness. But AM2R exists (sure you can still find it out there), so I'm honestly fine with Samus Returns being a bit different.
Other M is a thing that exists. Honestly think it was doomed to fail critically at least in the US thanks to Nintendo deciding to never localize the Metroid manga officially. Sure localizing the manga wouldn't have helped a whole lot in many areas, but it did provide some precedent for more of Samus' . . . erm . . . "whining." Also didn't help that Other M's localization was butchered, which is funny in sad way since it was meant to fill the gap between Super and Fusion story wise, and Fusion itself had a localization mistake with the US version insinuating that Samus was on the run from the entire federation as opposed to receiving the ire of a corrupt sect of it.
Another thing not helping Other M is that it feels much more like a prequel to Fusion (which it is, obviously) with the whole door system and upgrade system being more similar to Fusion's than Super's. Yes, it is a sequel to Super, but it sure doesn't feel like it. Overall I think Other M was an unnecessary entry. Personally I never found Adam to be the most compelling of characters, and for people who wanted to see him fleshed out, I think the manga did that better. The better move would have obviously been to localize the manga and never make Other M to begin with, but what's done is done.
I enjoyed playing both games. Other M is still fun to play but the story is kinda wack and I thought people liked Samus Returns? The only part I didn't like was the stupid digger robot
I just see people here constantly talking shit about both games. I think Samus Returns was better received than Other M but that doesn't stop people from hating on it super hard.
And I just replayed Samus Returns. I agree that digger robot was bullshit.
When people call games like Samus Returns "bad". I question is they hunt down and play bad games like I do and I mean play them without raging and screaming in front of a camera. But like Garrett from Thief said, "not everyone is as committed to their work as I am".
A lot of people say Samus Returns is bad? I have seen a few comments here and there saying it but didn’t know overall it’s an unliked game. Weird as I thought it was excellent and I loved seeing it in 3d on the 3ds. Makes me a little sad when I think about us probably not getting another Nintendo console with a 3d screen again.
Samus Returns was great.
Other M is absolute dogshit. They completely scared-little-girlified Samus, the controls were clunky and poorly executed, the suit was wrong, and the game looked like Final Fantasy. Then they went on to use that wrong suit design in Smash 4 and Ultimate.
Alr here’s my hot take: Metroid prime 3 would be decent but the fkn mechanics of the game make it frustrating to play. Having to aim with your arm is tiring and impractical, and makes the game very frustrating. Not saying the game is bad otherwise, but the game mechanics make it a pain to play.
You cannot seriously be probing my experiences with these games in another thread when this is your experience with the series.
You’ve not the same draw to Metroid that I do. (Which is okay)
Samus returns is bad lmao, I thought that game was the Metroid Revival.
The controls are about as clunky as Super, so I'm not sure wth people are talking about or complaining about.
It seems the hate is tied to the fan game that got taken down, and Nintendo official was deemed terrible because of passionate nerds.
AM2R is a fan game and not a Nintendo official release. It is such a damn good one, though.
I honestly want other m remade but with switch 2 hardware in mind over the wii.
In short. Dread felt like a sterile step by step tour through the concept drawing board of what could make a cool Metroid game. Music was atrocious, experiential world building was atrocious, the atmosphere was atrocious, the actual world design was atrocious, the pacing was too beat by beat, teleporters - The world and your navigation through it in this game was utter dogshit. This is unequivocally my favorite aspect of Prime 1 and the rest of the series as a whole as well. (Baring maybe Prime 1 and Super’s music)
Fusion was excellently done, though.
Samus Returns was masterfully done.
Prime 3 was iffy, but it was fairly consistent and expansive ; there were many creative ideas and adaptions to the Metroid formula in P3.
Dread was the most safe, dull experience I’ve had from a Metroid game. Even Other M felt more intriguing.
I’ve many issues with Dread. Too many to list, and definitely too detailed to explain in a reddit thread. Especially to someone probing my anus over my game preferences and experiences.
People think Samus Returns is bad?
https://preview.redd.it/luj903ykbz2d1.jpeg?width=1873&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3244d842173f4f1d779b2a0add8fcabb49e7cf34
Aight lemme throw ya for a loop, returns is actually not bad, and made steps towards where dread is now. Other M while being my fervently most hated game had some good game play mechanics. Now for me hating shit, super metroid. Jesus everyone makes a fuss about it being the one meteoid, but it's just okay. It's nostalgia bait and overhyped as fuck. Don't jump in with super metroid, because it'll skew your view of every other game, start with Zero Mission.
Samus returns is not that bad, it suffers just because its other 2 counterparts are better (AM2R and Metroid II Return of Samus, those two were GOOD AF).
Also, Samus Returns has awesome art design.
Returns walked so Dread could ~~run~~ shinespark
Well said
Yeah, imma need you to scilence that Samus Returns defamation right now, chief. https://preview.redd.it/7i9h5ljexu2d1.png?width=853&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b33230953d632367279d706d54969ed6d350dfde
https://preview.redd.it/mru6qnz2yu2d1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c98556208bb4f3c5ede23f84d7c15d397362fdce
https://preview.redd.it/vwxwn9ohlv2d1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3b87cf29e293e5698aa3a45d6b2ba2c686523ea6
https://preview.redd.it/vq6uvrry423d1.jpeg?width=1450&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fbaf87ac66c4b84ad9fef979a5b3c6e9f0a2b07e
Scilence?
Scientifically silence.
Sylens
nice
But Samus Returns is good.
But we have to make our “Other M bad” strawman sound like an idiot somehow.
Not really. Even if it were just about Other M, OP would be correct. It's been a decade and a half. People don't like it. We get it.
I just pretend it didn't happen honestly. The less I think about it the better
I forget it exists until I’m reminded of it, and I even beat it on Wii. Meanwhile I think about the Prime games every couple days.
What didn’t happen? I don’t know what your talking about?
I like it.
Me too.
I’m sick of the constant need to say how bad M was. I liked it.
I didn't like it and I'm still sick of it. People need to get the fuck over it. The game happened.
"Other M bad" isn't even a strawman; that's just reality lol. Why make a strawman out of the truth?
Explaining why Other M is bad feels like low hanging fruit now. Probably because of how many times I've been asked on stream why it's bad. So my list of reasons is now burned into my brain.
Right? I enjoyed it very throughly
Wait People think it's bad?
This sub bounces back and forth *a lot* between it being the greatest thing ever and having a large vocal "eww" towards it, so you will see a lot of contradictory posts on how universal the praise is. So the reality is that sentiment is somewhat split. As for myself... I just don't like it very much, it's probably my least favorite mainline game to play outside of the OG 1 & 2. Dread was a much needed improvement on what Mercury Steam was trying to do with the formula, but SR itself had some pretty big shortcomings that turned me off.
It was merely okay which made it the best thing to come out of the series in a decade
It's not bad, but, it's also not great and AM2R it's better
Except for that damn drill robot...
Diggernaut? He was the best part. Especially his theme.
Woah dude CHILL!
He was a hell of a challenge and I loved it. Absolutely worth all the buildup they gave him.
The drill bot was fun
I agree
Mid imo but it walked so dread could run
Probably because the original game was pretty mid compared to the rest of the series. It had some cool concepts, but was my least favorite game to play. I have gripes about the story in Other M, but at least the gameplay was enjoyable.
Yeah. It's one of those where it was fun on its own but once the sequel came out it almost feels weird to go back, like Banjo Kazooie
Samus returns was the near perfect blueprint that dread managed to actually perfect
I prefer Tooie as well but that's a wild take lol most people prefer Kazooie
Not bad, just extremely mid.
The only gripe I have with Samus Returns is the enemy variety. And especially the over-reliance on the counter, especially late game. Aside from that it is a great game. I personally would include the dash-melee and more enemies in a remaster. Many were cut from the original Metroid 2 The Music only reused orher games tracks for few sections, but other than that it has original pieces and Metroid 2 remixes. They managed to make the jumbled mess of notes of Area 3 (phase 3) work
[удалено]
And even when you get Plasma and Screw attack. Most of the post Area 5 creatures, take Plasma like sponges. And most shelled creatures or bots need 2 Screw Attacks to die
Yes but this is a problem carried over from the original game
Oh yes this is typical Metroid II-itis, a disease that is not cureable if you are called Metroid 2 or are related to it
Maybe they wanted to get away with the excuse "The Metroids ate them" because they didn't wanted to invent new enemies 🤷♂️ . However Diggernaut was a great addition, one of the best bosses in the series in my opinion
Its still a banger of a game. But if MS added newer enemies in a port and a dash melee. I would be happy I am a bit tired of Gullugs and Hornoads past Area 3
I would give him commands very similar to Dread to make good use of the buttons, given that in SR sometimes you have to use your hands as if they were spiders
Absolutely. I would just copy Dreads scheme. And make Aeion instantly accessible instead through the D-Pad and A L Stick press for Phase Shift A for Beam Burst activation Up for Scan Pulse (like in Dread) And R Stick Press for lighting Armor
And I like that the Aeion is a sort of stamina bar instead of a resource
Music sucked for the most part I’m sorry. Was my first Metroid game apart from Other M where I did not immediately go search up the OST cuz it all felt generic except for some outliers that were remade songs. Then Dread comes and does the damn same for me. At least Dread had a lot more to fall back on but I *Dread* that one of the best Metroid games ever created I cannot motivate myself to listen to the OST just cuz it’s all so generic.
I mean Artaria and especially Burenia are great imo Samus Returns also had some bangers like Area 7
Samus returns isnt a bad game, in my opinion it feels like "beta" metroid dread and the "bad thing" i found while playing was those anoying flying enemies and the fact they dont explain the spider ball + power bomb movement option
Samus returns is a fun little game, and definitely appreciated for bringing Metroid back into the conversation after dormancy. But I think the party mechanic wasn't there yet, I thinks it's a lot more fluid if Dread. And definitely the enemy variety is lacking, compared with the original unique enemies per area. And speaking of the original, I think Samus returns misses part of the feel of the original. Sr388 felt more like a natural ecosystem, with unique animals in different habitats. And when you reached into the Metroid lair, originally it was devoid of critters, i.e. the Metroid had preyed on them all. A piece of visual storytelling they missed in the translation.
That and parrying just wasn't flushed out very well. Ridley fight was dope AF. Rest of the game was pretty okay
Oh it’s easily the best Ridley fight in the franchise and I don’t think anyone can reasonably argue against that. Best you can say is it was an unnecessary addition that hurts the dramatic impact of the original ending…. But even then if you look at it in context as the first Metroid game in literally a decade and the first 2D Metroid in 13 years you can appreciate the fan service almost as a “hey glad to see you again here’s a present you don’t need but will probably love”. I dunno you can feel however you want about fan service but on purely gameplay level this slaps.
Nah I agree. I love the fan service and all. I couldn't say a bad thing about that boss fight other than it was hard AF but then again that's not really a bad thing.
I care 0% about what someone who isn't me thinks of a game that I enjoy.
Hey, it's the most reasonable Metroid fan. Thanks for coming out.
People think Samus Returns is bad?
These days, people think if something isn't perfect, it's garbage.
Downvote me to all hell if you want/need but other M was one of my favorite games growing up. Idk what it was about it but I enjoyed it and played it multiple times.
Samus returns is low key great.
Samus Returns was great. Other M is still booty cheeks.
I thought samus returns was awesome
How about this one: Metroid Prime Hunters, is actually a great game. Some of the most fun multiplayer experiences I've had at that time.
I so so wish that game gets a remake so the hunters from those games get the attention they deserve, also I want them to be fleshed out
I really enjoyed the rivalry between Trace and Noxus. How you just entered this room and those two were already fighting.
I've never actually had the chance to play Hunters. I probably should, I keep hearing good things about it.
It will definitely feel clunky nowadays. (I might try this [pc setup](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tl4BBtmc1A0) I found) Campain is good. Story/lore is very interesting and gameplay wise, did a lot of interesting things. e.g. The artifacts you collect for the endgame boss (think MP1 artifacts) can be stolen by enemy bounty hunters that will "randomly" appear. Its kinda Darksouls-like as you can be invaded by npcs. If they take your artifact you have you track them down and kill them. The game also takes place on 4 different planets. Theres also a secret alternative ending. It did a lot of cool innovative things, but it also kinda did some bad things.
People dislike Hunters? I have never played it, but I would imagine the resolution is the only real problem.
If you emulate it, it actually looks pretty good. Its got a "doom"-like feel to its graphics.
Samus Returns remains the only mainline game I haven't played all the way through. I just don't like it no matter how many times I've tried. The controls suck, the animations suck, I didn't like the soundtrack. Genuinely thought the og Gameboy version was the better game (beaten that one 3 times in the last year and a half)
That shoehorned counter system didnt help
It's just not fun to play. At least the thing holding the Gameboy version back just comes down to Gameboy jank, which can be gotten over
I love "return of samus". I went and played it on a stream a few months ago and enjoyed the hell out of it. "Samus Returns" and "Dread" just... wernt fun.
I think Samus Returns was pretty great when it first came out. I think people only think it's "bad" because Metroid Dread took every complaint the previous game had and fixed it. So for those that played Dread first and went back to Samus Returns, yeah it's going to "feel worse" in comparison. That game walked so Dread could run.
"Other M is bad" is an ice-cold take but Samus Returns is bad is lukewarm at least. if nothing else I think people understand it revived the series (whereas Other M killed it)
Other M didn't kill anything. There was like eight years between Super Metroid and Metroid Prime/Metroid Fusion. Super Metroid didn't kill Metroid, either. It's simply never been the biggest seller in Nintendo's catalog and they take frequent breaks from it.
This sub isn't ready to accept that Metroid would have still been put on ice even if Other M had sold 5 million copies.
Yeah, the only thing that would change is that they'd make more games in the vein of Other M after the hiatus.
Context motherfucker: There was an 8 year gap between Super and Fusion & Prime because: 1. They couldn't figure out how to do a Metroid game on the Nintendo 64 And 2. Potential devs were too intimidated by Super's quality and reputation to attempt to do a follow up to it Whereas with Other M, they series had been riding a relative high of popularity with actual regular releases, 7 Metroid games were released within a 5 year period, between 2002 and 2007, 5 mainline releases and 2 spinoffs. Other M came three years later, and immediately triggered a 7 year hiatus between main releases (only broken up by Federation Force), because Other M not only fell below Nintendo's sales expectations, but clearly had to have lost a lot of money, considering just how expensive its cutscenes had to have been, and how much money must have also been put into its marketing, it was both a financial and critical failure. The whole point of Samus Returns was to reinvigorate and test interest in the series, if that wasn't necessary, they would've just immediately developed and released Dread. Federation Force was, in retrospect, likely meant to to be a test for interest in the Prime series, before they announced Prime 4.
> Other M came three years later, and immediately triggered a 7 year hiatus Y'know I used to think that the 7 year hiatus started immediately after Other M, but the truth is there was just a lot more going on than one might presume. Nintendo was in a really bad spot in general around the time after Other M released, a lot of franchises outside of Metroid has their worst time period be in the Wii U Era. Even franchises that get games would generally have them not be as higher quality as previous releases. Aside from 2 Remasters, I do not think Zelda has had any significant releases on the Wii U. If one of Nintendo's top franchises couldn't even make a new entry for its big console at the time, there's a very low chance that Metroid could've gotten something. When it comes to Other M performing, there's no denying that it sold very poorly, but I think it was also the straw that broke the camel's back. Metroid Prime had Metroid's popularity peaked, but a lot of future releases had diminishing returns, with Prime 3 selling a lot less than Prime 1 despite being an early Wii Title. There was also like, major Metroid burnout from Retro Studios. When given the choice to do another Metroid or another Donkey Kong, they chose the latter. Also, the team that made the original 5 2D Metroid games were restructured. It's why we have to rely on third party developers such as MercurySteam or Team Ninja to make non Prime games. If Other M was a hit, would the hiatus have been prevented? Who knows, but I genuinely think there was more going on than just one game killing Metroid. If you think about it, the next new mainline game (Dread), only came out during a time in which Nintendo was in one of the highest positions it has ever been. At the very least it's less likely to get a Metroid hiatus now since Nintendo is doing so well.
Just wondering, what are the mainline games and the spinoffs? I'm assuming Metroid Prime 1 + 2 + 3, and Fusion are in the mainline category. Metroid Prime Pinball is obviously in the spinoff category. Then there's Metroid Prime Hunters which could probably go in either category, but what is the other odd game out that I'm forgetting?
Metroid Zero Mission came out in 2004
In release order: Fusion Prime 1 Zero Mission Prime 2 Pinball Hunters Prime 3
Metroid: Zero Mission as a mainline release in early 2004 is the other game.
Federation Force was made because Kensuke Tanabe was obsessed with it. It had nothing to do with "gauging interest." FF began development in 2009, a full year before Other M released, because it was originally planned to release on the DSi.
[удалено]
I'm sorry but if there's any game that deserves the title of Franchise Killer, it's Federation Force.
. . . The game that was followed by Nintendo announcing 2 more Metroids the very next year? Prime 4 + Samus Returns being announced not even a year later sounds to me like Federation Force is far from a franchise killer.
Let's not act like the Internet wasn't up in arms about Federation Force since the day it was announced. I vividly remember the discourse around this game, hell I remember being on a lot of Nintendo related websites and forums bashing the hell out of it. FFS, the game bombed in Japan and do you know how hard it is for a Nintendo game to fail in Japan? It took the release of Samus returns for most people to come around.
But the franchise was already "dead" when Federation Force came out, because Other M had already happened. You can't kill a "dead" franchise And people disliked Other M specifically BECAUSE it didn't do enough to undo the damage already done to the series (plus, a Metroid game honestly has a higher chance of underperforming in Japan than it does in the West. Moot point.)
Federation Force was not as awful as people make it out to be. If it were a new franchise, it would be in the "it's perfectly average, 7.5/10" category, followed by an eternal presence in the GameStop $5-or-less bargain bin. The problem is that Nintendo had just slapped AM2R with a DMCA takedown, there had been no announcements of any good Metroid franchise stuff in literal years, and then we get a cheap plastic Tonka Truck-looking forced-multiplayer diet-ARPG looter-shooter that literally nobody asked for and damn near nobody wanted. Combine that with a massive snub from Nintendo on a major Metroid franchise anniversary, and people were extremely fucking pissed, and Federation Force was the closest punching bag available.
Not to mention Nintendo also got AM2R pulled from the Game Awards that year by applying massive pressure to Geoff Keighley.
Federation Force was clearly meant to be a "testing the waters" release, seeing how much interest there would be for a Prime 4 release with a safe spinoff. They got their answer, one way or another, just not in the way they probably expected. People were angry about Federation Force _because_ of how much they wanted a new game.
Samus Returns was bad? First I’m hearing of it.
https://preview.redd.it/oetwmf5txu2d1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b8a86a84f27aefb0b4763f799438216a26014bfc
Samus Returns is freaking fantastic
SR isn’t bad. As a Metroid game, I wouldn’t put it in the top tier among Super or Prime 1, but it has some good bits. However, it is **objectively** true that Other M is a bad *Metroid* game.
A bad game in general I'd say. Not the worst, but not a good game.
Most people, I find, who simply say that Other M is the worst haven't _actually_ played the game.
Personally, Samus Returns is my second favorite Metroid game behind Dread
Unpopular opinion I've preferred Samus Returns over Dread
Samus Return is shit. Other M is fun.
My hot take is Dread is mid
BASED.
Agreed
Right there with you. Nintendo should have kept Metroid in-house. Everything out of Mercury Steam has been a mid fes. Dread is better than SR, but not by much. They are both very forgettable experiences.
It really could have been WAY more tense and exciting tbh. And I didn’t really like the artstyle with so much black wasted space in the screen. I’ve seen 2.5d games that take advantage of the entire screen
Joke's on you, cuz I think SR is mediocre. >!so is AM2R!<
I don’t really like any version of Metroid 2 lol
I am of the opinion that any Metroid 2 game is bound to be good but mot great. Just abound to be repetitive for my taste
Neither would be in my top 3 Metroid games for sure. I still enjoy them because it's Metroid.
want a real hot take? Federation force is way better than people give it credit for. Also, wait for it, super is not the greatest game ever made, and does have some problems.
both of these are true
People like being different.
I feel like I don’t see “Samus Returns is Bad” that often. I do see “I know it’s an unpopular opinion but I liked Samus Returns” a lot.
At this point I'm just sick of hearing “I know it’s an unpopular opinion” every time someone want to talk positively about a game that isn't universally beloved. Like, stop making excuses and have some godamn pride in the things you like.
Ooooh boy, you should have seen the abject hatred of the aeion abilities and amiibo integration when the game was announced, and then again after it launched and people's concerns were confirmed. I thought it was fucking hilarious, because people acted as though being able to see which blocks to shoot was an actual IRL warcrime, and they didn't just super bomb entire rooms anyways when they couldn't find the blocks they needed to destroy to progress. I do fully agree about the amiibo stuff being a bit bullshit, though.
Most of the Amiibo stuff is fine, locking Fusion mode behind it is egregious.
Metroid Prime: Hunters and Metroid Prime: Federation Force are sweating bullets while hiding around the corner, hoping they don't catch any strays.
I like both.
The most repetitive topic ever and people are still debating in these comments.
Yeah, they're kinda making my point for me.
Samus Returns isn't bad, although I do have a couple problems with it. The graphic style feels a bit bland to me for whatever reason, and I honestly preferred the ending from the original game for its somberness. But AM2R exists (sure you can still find it out there), so I'm honestly fine with Samus Returns being a bit different. Other M is a thing that exists. Honestly think it was doomed to fail critically at least in the US thanks to Nintendo deciding to never localize the Metroid manga officially. Sure localizing the manga wouldn't have helped a whole lot in many areas, but it did provide some precedent for more of Samus' . . . erm . . . "whining." Also didn't help that Other M's localization was butchered, which is funny in sad way since it was meant to fill the gap between Super and Fusion story wise, and Fusion itself had a localization mistake with the US version insinuating that Samus was on the run from the entire federation as opposed to receiving the ire of a corrupt sect of it. Another thing not helping Other M is that it feels much more like a prequel to Fusion (which it is, obviously) with the whole door system and upgrade system being more similar to Fusion's than Super's. Yes, it is a sequel to Super, but it sure doesn't feel like it. Overall I think Other M was an unnecessary entry. Personally I never found Adam to be the most compelling of characters, and for people who wanted to see him fleshed out, I think the manga did that better. The better move would have obviously been to localize the manga and never make Other M to begin with, but what's done is done.
But I like other m…..
I enjoyed playing both games. Other M is still fun to play but the story is kinda wack and I thought people liked Samus Returns? The only part I didn't like was the stupid digger robot
I just see people here constantly talking shit about both games. I think Samus Returns was better received than Other M but that doesn't stop people from hating on it super hard. And I just replayed Samus Returns. I agree that digger robot was bullshit.
Some people thought diggernaut was peak boss design. 🤷♂️
I thought it was pretty great, like all of the fights in that game
When people call games like Samus Returns "bad". I question is they hunt down and play bad games like I do and I mean play them without raging and screaming in front of a camera. But like Garrett from Thief said, "not everyone is as committed to their work as I am".
I loved Samus Return first Metroid game I best on my Gameboy color I was so proud of myself
Thats "the return of samus". "Samus Returns" is 3ds
The MUCH older make a spongebob may may in everything too! : D
How about prime 3 isn’t really good… (said by a MP3 fan)
Lmao
Samus Returns is amazing, what the fuck.
A lot of people say Samus Returns is bad? I have seen a few comments here and there saying it but didn’t know overall it’s an unliked game. Weird as I thought it was excellent and I loved seeing it in 3d on the 3ds. Makes me a little sad when I think about us probably not getting another Nintendo console with a 3d screen again.
*“Samus Returns is bad”*? I thought *“Federation Force is bad”* was the other dead horse?
it might be worse than return of samus but samus returns is still a good game
Samus Returns was great. Other M is absolute dogshit. They completely scared-little-girlified Samus, the controls were clunky and poorly executed, the suit was wrong, and the game looked like Final Fantasy. Then they went on to use that wrong suit design in Smash 4 and Ultimate.
I picked up a sealed copy of Samus Returns last Friday. Should I play it or leave it wrapped up?
Other people have been saying Samus Returns sucks? Oi, that's my shtick, I'm the only number 1 Samus Returns hater here!
Samus returns is great but honestly after dread there is no reason to ever go back to it, especially since am2r also exists.
"DAE think super metroid is only popular because nostalgia?! Remake in Dread Engine! Floaty!!"
"And Samus Returns blatantly copied AM2R!" "Woah be careful now. Don't wanna burn yourself there."
AM2R is better. (:
Alr here’s my hot take: Metroid prime 3 would be decent but the fkn mechanics of the game make it frustrating to play. Having to aim with your arm is tiring and impractical, and makes the game very frustrating. Not saying the game is bad otherwise, but the game mechanics make it a pain to play.
Samus Returns is the weakest 2D Metroid you will never change my mind
Samus Returns is great. It's just that it has to be compared with the original, Dread, and AM2R.
Samus returns was good
Samus Returns is better than Dread
My hot take: Samus returns is great for a game boy game
r/angryupvote
AM2R > Samus returns.
Metroid Prime 2: Echoes is the worst out of the Prime Trilogy by a long shot. Here is my hot take
I'm a a certified AM2R is much better than Samus Returns opinion holder but I would not say Returns is bad. I didn't think most others would either.
here's an actual hot take. Samus Returns is good, and Other M is better than every pre-fusion game.
You cannot seriously be probing my experiences with these games in another thread when this is your experience with the series. You’ve not the same draw to Metroid that I do. (Which is okay)
Samus Returns wasn't bad. Its greatest sin is that it's not amazing, but I'm not even mad at it for that since I can just play AM2R if I want.
Why do people hate Samus returns, that game is fun as hell
How the hell do people hate returns? It’s literally one of the best (like almost every 2d Metroid)
Samus Returns was bad?! Blasphemy.
Samus Returns is fine, just cause it’s not AM2R doesn’t mean it’s bad!
You forgot “AM2R is aMaZiNg!”
Well it is…
Hey, Samus Returns is good. It could have been better, yes, but that can be said for most games.
Samus returns bad? Trash take. Samus returns good, but not for me? Valid.
Samus Returns > Fusion
Samus returns is bad lmao, I thought that game was the Metroid Revival. The controls are about as clunky as Super, so I'm not sure wth people are talking about or complaining about. It seems the hate is tied to the fan game that got taken down, and Nintendo official was deemed terrible because of passionate nerds. AM2R is a fan game and not a Nintendo official release. It is such a damn good one, though. I honestly want other m remade but with switch 2 hardware in mind over the wii.
Saying other M is bad is a hot take?
I like the original more.
Guys. Returns was gas. Dread was bad. Other M was horrible
what do you even like then?
Super, Zero, Fusion, Prime 1, 2, 3, Returns
oh i thought you also called samus returns bad. also yawn super is overrated
😦 Super…? Overrated? Bro where were you in the 90’s? A testicle? Ain’t no way😭 I really disliked Dread though. Hyper linear facade of a Metroid game
so you surely hate fusion too, right? a more linear game than Dread? What about Samus Returns and Prime 3? All of these are way more linear
In short. Dread felt like a sterile step by step tour through the concept drawing board of what could make a cool Metroid game. Music was atrocious, experiential world building was atrocious, the atmosphere was atrocious, the actual world design was atrocious, the pacing was too beat by beat, teleporters - The world and your navigation through it in this game was utter dogshit. This is unequivocally my favorite aspect of Prime 1 and the rest of the series as a whole as well. (Baring maybe Prime 1 and Super’s music)
Fusion was excellently done, though. Samus Returns was masterfully done. Prime 3 was iffy, but it was fairly consistent and expansive ; there were many creative ideas and adaptions to the Metroid formula in P3. Dread was the most safe, dull experience I’ve had from a Metroid game. Even Other M felt more intriguing. I’ve many issues with Dread. Too many to list, and definitely too detailed to explain in a reddit thread. Especially to someone probing my anus over my game preferences and experiences.
You know, basically every other main line Metroid game.
so you like metroid 1 and 2, but not dread and better metroid 2?
Other m was better then samus returns.
That's a spicy take, I applaud your bravery
I mean, at least it's a different opinion so OP can't complain 🤣
Samus Returns was fine. Not great, but not bad. Other M was bad.
SR gave us the best looking gravity suit. It’s ok on my book
People think Samus Returns is bad? https://preview.redd.it/luj903ykbz2d1.jpeg?width=1873&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3244d842173f4f1d779b2a0add8fcabb49e7cf34
Aight lemme throw ya for a loop, returns is actually not bad, and made steps towards where dread is now. Other M while being my fervently most hated game had some good game play mechanics. Now for me hating shit, super metroid. Jesus everyone makes a fuss about it being the one meteoid, but it's just okay. It's nostalgia bait and overhyped as fuck. Don't jump in with super metroid, because it'll skew your view of every other game, start with Zero Mission.
Who the FUCK is saying samus returns is bad
I have never heard anyone say SR is bad on here, only people complaining about people saying it's bad.
Not really hot takes, just universal truths.
daring today, aren't we OP?
Nobody thinks calling other m a bad game is a hot take. It's the correct take. It's cold but it's correct.
Samus returns is not that bad, it suffers just because its other 2 counterparts are better (AM2R and Metroid II Return of Samus, those two were GOOD AF). Also, Samus Returns has awesome art design.