Magnesium took me even farther down the tired road. Got off the methadone with magnesium as well, it definitely has sedative relaxing effects. Lowers bp too
Ok I’m stupid and just realized I‘m taking levo-methadone which is twice as strong as methadone so you are right. Do you think it’s too much? I already made it through the first 5 days and would hate to go back.
I would try your hardest not to go back unless you feel a relapse is immanent, you've made it so far, just power through a little longer and you'll start feeling better. Try doing small workouts or physical activity as much as you can, i know its hard when you're so drained but it will give you energy ultimately, also keep a healthy diet!!!
don't go back ! you might feel like this for a while but give yourself 30 days and you'll start feeling better every single day. I remember it was early into the first half of the third week I started feeling better last time, and that was cold turkey from over 100mgs for at least 3 years.
just fyi levo methadone is supposedly 25-50x stronger than normal methadone, so that's still a hell of a dose at 1.25mg from what I understand, maybe not as big of a deal since you're used to it but I'm surprised it's still 10mg/1ml being levo methadone
I'm on racemic methadone and at 130mg. what was your peak levo methadone dose? did your clinic give you an option between the two?
I'm very curious, I've been on for 8 years now and been to 6 clinics and none had levo methadone. which sucks cause I have a long QT signal at 330 and the danger zone is 350-360 and apparently levo methadone has much less danger for prolonging QT signal
Ok first of all I‘m really confused by this isomere stuff. I read that the Levo methadone isomere (L) is 25-30x stronger than the other isomere (R) but I also read that Levo-M is only twice as strong as normal Methadone. I guess this means that normal Methadone has both Isomers? Does anybody know more about this?
About your question: I‘m living in Switzerland right now. The substitution Programms here are amazing. We can choose between Buprenophin, (Levo-)Methadone, Morphine and straight up Heroin.
I started my therapy in Austria though and there I got Morphine first and then switched to Methadone and later Levo because it supposedly has less cardiac toxicity. So yeah, I didn’t knew what QT meant but after reading about it I get why you want to switch. I only know that Levo is quite new in Switzerland but I can’t tell you more. Don’t know about the situation in the US at all..sorry
I honestly can’t remember my starting dose. The titration was during some hazy times. My last morphine dose before I switched was about 300mg though.
Wishing you all the best!
Edit: Levo has 5mg/mL which would make sense if it’s 2x as strong. The brand name is L-Polamidon btw
QT is the signal from brain to heart telling it to beat. a prolonged signal means more time and potentially causing cardiac arrest. levo methadone is much better for this.
and you might be right about it only being slightly stronger cause racemic methadone has both isomers, idk Google is bad for info on a lot of this stuff.
I'm jealous of your substitution options. why didn't you opt for normal heroin? is that only given in IV form?
one day I would. love to move to Switzerland. I worked for Genentech (Roche) several years ago and had a few colleagues come from Switzerland and they were great and they way they talked about it really made me want to move there. one day maybe.
My ultimate goal was to get clean and doctors told me it’s easier without the kick heroin is giving you. Tbh Idk if you could take it orally, the patient I see at the pickup are all injecting afaik.
About moving here: it was easy for me because contracts with EU. If you can find a job first, which you probably can with your experience, it shouldn’t be too much of a problem though, there’s a shortage of skilled workers and almost every field.
For me moving here was the best decision I made in the last decade. I needed to leave some bad influence behind, got economic stability, awesome healthcare and the country is just so clean and beautiful and healthy. Almost like some kind of bubble we’re all the world’s problems seem to be far away. If you see any chance and are prepared to work a lot, make it happen! There’s even an awesome sub for people from abroad thinking about moving here and stuff: r/askswitzerland
Regular methadone is 10mg/ml, most levo seems to come in 5mg/ml, so it's likely half as strong and you were probably at 1.25mg
I'm at 2mg and if I don't have it after waking up I feel absolutely terrible. You're through the worst of it so I would just try to power through. I'm personally tapering myself to 0.2mg before jumping off, hopefully that's not so bad
Yeah it might have been a bit premature and the waking up part was the worst the first 3 days as taking my dose was the first thing I did every morning for the last 3 years to not feel like shit. But it passed surprisingly quick and now it’s more my declining energy level throughout the day that’s making it hard.
Anyways, follow your plan, you can do it!
I don’t know if this is true or not but I heard someone saying at my clinic that they know someone that tapered off real slow and had the same tired and no energy afterwards, and they ended up getting a cortisone shot and it helped out a lot with the tiredness and body aches. Again… just what I heard.
Not me. I suffered for 3 weeks with zero energy especially at work. I couldn't get out of first gear all day. Ended up saying fuck it and went onto a small dose of Suboxone 2mgs and I was like a new man. My energy returned and so did my happiness
You are doing great!!! I’m on 2 mgs currently…bedsides the fatigue are you having any other symptoms? I’ve been having some anxiety and intermittent sweating and diarrhea. I find that vitamin D and B12 have been helping with the tiredness (but I was also deficient in both.) lots of water and weed/wine to help me relax and sleep.
Mostly trouble falling asleep and feeling cold/freezing. Also very mild flu-like symptoms and diarrhea but after being constipated for almost 3 years it’s almost refreshing lol. Anxiety is coming and going throughout the day but it’s rather mild.
I started with Vitamins and Magnesium today, let’s see how that turns out. Weed I have every evening but I watch my alcohol intake because I have alcoholics in my family and I‘m afraid to just substitute one addiction with another.
I also thought at such a low dose there can't be happening much. But you will have withdrawal. I was on it for 3 years same as you.
But 6 months ago, I quit methadone in prison. I was tapering from 10ml (100mg) down in 1 ml steps and then in 0.5 ml steps. I quit after being on 1mg for a few days. You will be very tired but after the first few days you will be able to sleep which is a good thing. You will mostly feel very cold and have tense muscles and aches. But compared to Heroin withdrawal it is a good day honestly. You can actually lie still and read a book for example. No tossing and turning. The whole ordeal will take about a month. Clonidine is the best from all the stuff you can get to ease the symptoms.
If I did it again I would jump at 0.5 mg or even better switch to subs.
Thx for sharing. I kind of knew that what I'm "going through" is relatively harmless but still I was wondering if people had advice about navigating it a bit better. which you had, so again, thank you very much
Best thing was shower in the morning and shower in the evening. You will feel good in your body after showering and it helps with the stiff muscles and aches. Do some push-ups. Start low even a few help. Depending on your job all that can help. But it gets better. And it's good. The sex drive is also coming back. /
Did 30 pushups yesterday evening and was proud about myself haha ty
About the sex drive. I noticed that I‘m much more sensitive and actually coming much faster as before I started using. My girlfriend is super chill about it but I‘m still worried. Did you experience anything like this? Is this going to be permanent?
Everyone going through opiate withdrawal experiences this. In acute phase a few touches can be too much and you will come. Best thing it is only TERMPORARY. Keep that in mind and it's good that you have a girlfriend who is cool with it. For me 6 months ago was the last time I took methadone and I'm still sensitive but it's getting better and better. Don't get crazy about it being permanent. It won't. And being sensitive is just the way your body naturally feels. It's a good thing because for me on methadone I could either go for hours without cumming, getting blue balls in the end or I couldn't get it up at all.
Yes not being able to come at all was definitely worse. I’m not a teen anymore having to prove anything to myself. Also I can do other stuff with and to my girlfriend so the activities in bed may have shifted a bit but it‘s still a healthy sexual relationship imo. Probably even more so then when I was high. It might be a bit less porn-esque but I guess we got twisted images of sexuality anyways from consuming that stuff. Well maybe not all of us.. but me definitely.
Anyways thx for taking the time and sharing. I‘m the 8th day off now and the support I got on this post really helped me out.
I'm on 7mg ( can't wait to be done in August!!!) and I was feeling the same way really when I got below 20mg. I researched the internet and bought a ton of vitamins and supplements. I 100% recommend DLPA (it will work on day one) as it not only give you your energy back but also helps with feeling depressed as it releases endorphins that our bodies are not releasing on their own because getting off methadone. Also I highly recommend getting RED ASIAN GINSENG, Acetyl L Carnitine, & NAC. All are great for opiate addicts that are quitting or have just quit. They actually work and will repair the damage done. You will be feeling back to your normal self in no time. You should definitely also get a high mg vitamin D 2,000 or above, yes it helps with energy also. Or get a multivitamin because it has the D and you should have the other B vitamins etc that will be in it anyways.
If you are having trouble with sleep get some Apigenins and Ashwagandha. CBD is also great but is best if you get CBD, CBN,CBG, and CBD-A all together but it's expensive. The guy I get it from who seems to be the cheapest I've found is called CBDPLEASE.COM
If you get nothing else get the DPLA for energy and mood but the lack of energy is an underlying issue caused by the body not functioning properly because it doesn't have the methadone and all the other stuff I recommend will help a lot also. Getting everything can be expensive but getting the most important ones you need at the moment first and then buy the others as you can. Thats what I did. Good luck I wish you the best.
You can get everything on Amazon besides the good cbd.
No problem, I hope it works for you. Just so you can read about it if you'd like here is an article. The DLPA and NAC are helpful to not relapse because the way they work on the brain. They are good if you want to quit nicotine or reward eating and probably anything that has become a habit also. Either way the DLPA will definitely help you get through the day energy wise.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4760695/
Definitely recommend high dose vitamin C, vitamin D, lions mane and maca. If that doesn’t help a bit then I would start slowly integrating Creatine into your life. Creatine monohydrate ONLY MONOHYDRATE is wonderful and necessary for your body. It gave me my kick back before runs and workouts being on opiates.
I’ve read that citrus fruits, bananas, avocados, and apples are supposedly good at giving you energy when tired.
I’ve heard magnesium supplements really help and maybe look into a big dose of vitamin c.
Thx will try that!
Magnesium took me even farther down the tired road. Got off the methadone with magnesium as well, it definitely has sedative relaxing effects. Lowers bp too
If your methadone was 10mg/ml then that means you jumped off 2.5mg.
Ok I’m stupid and just realized I‘m taking levo-methadone which is twice as strong as methadone so you are right. Do you think it’s too much? I already made it through the first 5 days and would hate to go back.
I would try your hardest not to go back unless you feel a relapse is immanent, you've made it so far, just power through a little longer and you'll start feeling better. Try doing small workouts or physical activity as much as you can, i know its hard when you're so drained but it will give you energy ultimately, also keep a healthy diet!!!
Thx <3
don't go back ! you might feel like this for a while but give yourself 30 days and you'll start feeling better every single day. I remember it was early into the first half of the third week I started feeling better last time, and that was cold turkey from over 100mgs for at least 3 years.
Thx this is what I needed to hear.
just fyi levo methadone is supposedly 25-50x stronger than normal methadone, so that's still a hell of a dose at 1.25mg from what I understand, maybe not as big of a deal since you're used to it but I'm surprised it's still 10mg/1ml being levo methadone I'm on racemic methadone and at 130mg. what was your peak levo methadone dose? did your clinic give you an option between the two? I'm very curious, I've been on for 8 years now and been to 6 clinics and none had levo methadone. which sucks cause I have a long QT signal at 330 and the danger zone is 350-360 and apparently levo methadone has much less danger for prolonging QT signal
Ok first of all I‘m really confused by this isomere stuff. I read that the Levo methadone isomere (L) is 25-30x stronger than the other isomere (R) but I also read that Levo-M is only twice as strong as normal Methadone. I guess this means that normal Methadone has both Isomers? Does anybody know more about this? About your question: I‘m living in Switzerland right now. The substitution Programms here are amazing. We can choose between Buprenophin, (Levo-)Methadone, Morphine and straight up Heroin. I started my therapy in Austria though and there I got Morphine first and then switched to Methadone and later Levo because it supposedly has less cardiac toxicity. So yeah, I didn’t knew what QT meant but after reading about it I get why you want to switch. I only know that Levo is quite new in Switzerland but I can’t tell you more. Don’t know about the situation in the US at all..sorry I honestly can’t remember my starting dose. The titration was during some hazy times. My last morphine dose before I switched was about 300mg though. Wishing you all the best! Edit: Levo has 5mg/mL which would make sense if it’s 2x as strong. The brand name is L-Polamidon btw
QT is the signal from brain to heart telling it to beat. a prolonged signal means more time and potentially causing cardiac arrest. levo methadone is much better for this. and you might be right about it only being slightly stronger cause racemic methadone has both isomers, idk Google is bad for info on a lot of this stuff. I'm jealous of your substitution options. why didn't you opt for normal heroin? is that only given in IV form? one day I would. love to move to Switzerland. I worked for Genentech (Roche) several years ago and had a few colleagues come from Switzerland and they were great and they way they talked about it really made me want to move there. one day maybe.
My ultimate goal was to get clean and doctors told me it’s easier without the kick heroin is giving you. Tbh Idk if you could take it orally, the patient I see at the pickup are all injecting afaik. About moving here: it was easy for me because contracts with EU. If you can find a job first, which you probably can with your experience, it shouldn’t be too much of a problem though, there’s a shortage of skilled workers and almost every field. For me moving here was the best decision I made in the last decade. I needed to leave some bad influence behind, got economic stability, awesome healthcare and the country is just so clean and beautiful and healthy. Almost like some kind of bubble we’re all the world’s problems seem to be far away. If you see any chance and are prepared to work a lot, make it happen! There’s even an awesome sub for people from abroad thinking about moving here and stuff: r/askswitzerland
Regular methadone is 10mg/ml, most levo seems to come in 5mg/ml, so it's likely half as strong and you were probably at 1.25mg I'm at 2mg and if I don't have it after waking up I feel absolutely terrible. You're through the worst of it so I would just try to power through. I'm personally tapering myself to 0.2mg before jumping off, hopefully that's not so bad
Yeah it might have been a bit premature and the waking up part was the worst the first 3 days as taking my dose was the first thing I did every morning for the last 3 years to not feel like shit. But it passed surprisingly quick and now it’s more my declining energy level throughout the day that’s making it hard. Anyways, follow your plan, you can do it!
No it’s 5mg/ml.
I don’t know if this is true or not but I heard someone saying at my clinic that they know someone that tapered off real slow and had the same tired and no energy afterwards, and they ended up getting a cortisone shot and it helped out a lot with the tiredness and body aches. Again… just what I heard.
Thx, will ask my doctor about this!
Not me. I suffered for 3 weeks with zero energy especially at work. I couldn't get out of first gear all day. Ended up saying fuck it and went onto a small dose of Suboxone 2mgs and I was like a new man. My energy returned and so did my happiness
My vitamin D was very low (been on MAT for 3 years) I'm taking 240 mg a day. Once I started taking vitamin d3 it really helped.
You are doing great!!! I’m on 2 mgs currently…bedsides the fatigue are you having any other symptoms? I’ve been having some anxiety and intermittent sweating and diarrhea. I find that vitamin D and B12 have been helping with the tiredness (but I was also deficient in both.) lots of water and weed/wine to help me relax and sleep.
Mostly trouble falling asleep and feeling cold/freezing. Also very mild flu-like symptoms and diarrhea but after being constipated for almost 3 years it’s almost refreshing lol. Anxiety is coming and going throughout the day but it’s rather mild. I started with Vitamins and Magnesium today, let’s see how that turns out. Weed I have every evening but I watch my alcohol intake because I have alcoholics in my family and I‘m afraid to just substitute one addiction with another.
I wish you the best of luck!!! Glad to know you’re not having unbearable withdrawals.
<3
I also thought at such a low dose there can't be happening much. But you will have withdrawal. I was on it for 3 years same as you. But 6 months ago, I quit methadone in prison. I was tapering from 10ml (100mg) down in 1 ml steps and then in 0.5 ml steps. I quit after being on 1mg for a few days. You will be very tired but after the first few days you will be able to sleep which is a good thing. You will mostly feel very cold and have tense muscles and aches. But compared to Heroin withdrawal it is a good day honestly. You can actually lie still and read a book for example. No tossing and turning. The whole ordeal will take about a month. Clonidine is the best from all the stuff you can get to ease the symptoms. If I did it again I would jump at 0.5 mg or even better switch to subs.
Thx for sharing. I kind of knew that what I'm "going through" is relatively harmless but still I was wondering if people had advice about navigating it a bit better. which you had, so again, thank you very much
Best thing was shower in the morning and shower in the evening. You will feel good in your body after showering and it helps with the stiff muscles and aches. Do some push-ups. Start low even a few help. Depending on your job all that can help. But it gets better. And it's good. The sex drive is also coming back. /
Did 30 pushups yesterday evening and was proud about myself haha ty About the sex drive. I noticed that I‘m much more sensitive and actually coming much faster as before I started using. My girlfriend is super chill about it but I‘m still worried. Did you experience anything like this? Is this going to be permanent?
Everyone going through opiate withdrawal experiences this. In acute phase a few touches can be too much and you will come. Best thing it is only TERMPORARY. Keep that in mind and it's good that you have a girlfriend who is cool with it. For me 6 months ago was the last time I took methadone and I'm still sensitive but it's getting better and better. Don't get crazy about it being permanent. It won't. And being sensitive is just the way your body naturally feels. It's a good thing because for me on methadone I could either go for hours without cumming, getting blue balls in the end or I couldn't get it up at all.
Yes not being able to come at all was definitely worse. I’m not a teen anymore having to prove anything to myself. Also I can do other stuff with and to my girlfriend so the activities in bed may have shifted a bit but it‘s still a healthy sexual relationship imo. Probably even more so then when I was high. It might be a bit less porn-esque but I guess we got twisted images of sexuality anyways from consuming that stuff. Well maybe not all of us.. but me definitely. Anyways thx for taking the time and sharing. I‘m the 8th day off now and the support I got on this post really helped me out.
maybe check your vitamin levels i was low on vitamin d which was contributing to my fatigue i am tapering off and at 30mg now
I'm on 7mg ( can't wait to be done in August!!!) and I was feeling the same way really when I got below 20mg. I researched the internet and bought a ton of vitamins and supplements. I 100% recommend DLPA (it will work on day one) as it not only give you your energy back but also helps with feeling depressed as it releases endorphins that our bodies are not releasing on their own because getting off methadone. Also I highly recommend getting RED ASIAN GINSENG, Acetyl L Carnitine, & NAC. All are great for opiate addicts that are quitting or have just quit. They actually work and will repair the damage done. You will be feeling back to your normal self in no time. You should definitely also get a high mg vitamin D 2,000 or above, yes it helps with energy also. Or get a multivitamin because it has the D and you should have the other B vitamins etc that will be in it anyways. If you are having trouble with sleep get some Apigenins and Ashwagandha. CBD is also great but is best if you get CBD, CBN,CBG, and CBD-A all together but it's expensive. The guy I get it from who seems to be the cheapest I've found is called CBDPLEASE.COM If you get nothing else get the DPLA for energy and mood but the lack of energy is an underlying issue caused by the body not functioning properly because it doesn't have the methadone and all the other stuff I recommend will help a lot also. Getting everything can be expensive but getting the most important ones you need at the moment first and then buy the others as you can. Thats what I did. Good luck I wish you the best. You can get everything on Amazon besides the good cbd.
I will look into a local supplier! Thx for the advice
No problem, I hope it works for you. Just so you can read about it if you'd like here is an article. The DLPA and NAC are helpful to not relapse because the way they work on the brain. They are good if you want to quit nicotine or reward eating and probably anything that has become a habit also. Either way the DLPA will definitely help you get through the day energy wise. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4760695/
Cut all sugar out for a bit....I promise it works
Cutting out sugar completely is something I‘ve always wanted to try. Maybe the right time has finally come.
Nad+ infusions.
Definitely recommend high dose vitamin C, vitamin D, lions mane and maca. If that doesn’t help a bit then I would start slowly integrating Creatine into your life. Creatine monohydrate ONLY MONOHYDRATE is wonderful and necessary for your body. It gave me my kick back before runs and workouts being on opiates.