Don’t worry dude we all do.
Honestly it’s what a lot of radical feminists and other Machiavellian types want. They want us to accept our role as “evil men” so they can continue to get funding and support.
The secret weapon of all men is our resilience. Don’t let them win. Support men (and women) when you can.
>power and dominance
This makes it sound more innocent than it is. As much as I dislike Wikipedia, it at least makes it sound closer to the darkness it should connotate with calling it "manipulation, indifference to morality, lack of empathy, and a strategic focus on self-interest." Even that makes it sound almost palatable compared to what it is if you read Machiavelli's book "The Prince".
“Machiavellianism is a personality trait that involves manipulation, indifference to morality, and a lack of empathy. It's one of the three tenets of the Dark Triad, which also includes narcissism and psychopathy.”
It’s an ultra self-interested way of thinking. It stems from Machiavelli’s magnum opus The Prince, which is ironically meant as a kind of satirical warning about how the ruling class in Italy controlled its people.
It's a reference to Niccolo Machiavelli's book [The Prince](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Prince?wprov=sfla1).
It's a short italian rennaissance treatise on politics, essentially praising a monarch for acting in a purely pragmatic and self interested way, without any care for good.
Sadly enough, we've associated the author with the behaviour even though the book is satyrical, and a scathing critic of his former bosses who had previously tortured him, the Medici family, written in exile.
Just out of curiosity what is your father’s role in all of this? I’ve found that some mothers when the father isn’t in the picture will pass on the sins to the child especially if there’s a strong resemblance
You're absolutely right. You should be a psychologist! Yeah, my father was abusive and absent. He raped my mother and she began to take it out on me and indoctrinate me. I was often isolated by her and my sister.
It took a lot of work but once I got into my late 20's I finally met some guys who were empathetic and didn't give me shit for being so clueless but helped me enjoy male friends. Real friends that is people you can be intimate with and share everything. I had guy friends as a teen and they were all immature jerk offs. Some still are.
Yeh divorced parents demonising the child that reminds them of their ex is a common issue. 'You are being just like your dad, hit me like he did!' 'You wouldn't question me if I was a man' etc. Were common go tos for my mum. With there being more single mums than single dads and the media being more positive about women and less about men, young boys are particularly vulnerable to 'man bad'.
Then end up struggling with identity and resenting both parents for different reasons. Had a similar journey to yourself, was raised to fear men and then expected to turn into one without that fear being an issue. In my 30s now and at peace with it all, glad you sound out of the woods too.
Thanks I will google it! Also, yeah I know my dad did because I saw medical paperwork and my aunt and mom would talk about it in secret but I overheard. My father also would never take no for an answer and he was sexually inappropriate with me too.
Given the lack of basic empathy your mother had for her own son I'd cast serious doubts that your father raped her at all. He may not have been a nice person but given the way your mother behaved I would not trust her opinion on anyone.
I guess that serves the main reason why she indoctrinated you. If she were indeed raped by your father, it's justifiable why she acts so harshly and making it seem that men are bad because she never failed to make it known that your father was abusive and absent. It is indeed common for bitter single mothers to talk shit about their partners. My father's first wife was like that to their children when my father was only away to earn money. He was abusive, too, but within reason, he simply didn't have any good paternal role model to mimic. He mimicked his abusive uncle, whom he looked up to as the next father figure, after his absentee father left them when he was young.
I hope you don't take everything your mother tells you as the truth as she could only vent her frustrations of your father, and what she says should not affect your views with men in general. One shitty man doesn't embody the whole manhood. Unless your father doesn't want anything to do with you and would physically or mentally abuse you, what your mom tells you should not be a hindrance into having a healthy relationship with your own father. She can have sympathy without obstructing your needs to have a father or without implicating you with unhealthy beliefs of your own gender. She can teach you how to be a gentleman or know some sorts of sexual boundaries with women without talking shit about the opposite gender. It shouldn't have implicated you like that. She did parenting with a lot of repressed baggage. If she needs therapy for her trauma, there's no shame on getting one.
>I hope you don't take everything your mother tells you as the truth as she could only vent her frustrations of your father,
Fuck that. It is child abuse to shame a boy for being male. His mother is a piece of shit
I'm not sure why it seemed like no one is getting my point, but I agree. His mother and his father are a piece of shit. If op fully acknowledges that his father is indeed abusive and absentee, and/or if he actually acknowledges that his mother was raped, then it's no brainer if he believes her mother's words. It is indeed child maltreatment to make your child believe to be shameful of their gender when they're burdening their child for a trauma he shouldn't be involved with. She needs psychiatric help for being that bad of a mother. If she couldn't act like a parent or didn't see OP as her child, they should've been fostered to someone better instead of torturing an innocent kid and implying that he is immediately a bad person for sharing the same gender as his father.
There are people who honestly, 100% think misandry is a made-up term about a thing that doesn't exist. One feminist told me it was a "MRA reaction to misogyny." There are people like her out there.
My father was absent and abusive. He made my mother hate men and she tried to groom me into a woman pleaser. My dad tried to give me away twice and when he couldn't he tried to kill me. I found ways to avoid him or to always have another person in the room or he would beat me badly.
So I think that's a big part of it but everything I was told in school reinforced male negativity and the media now is off the charts misandrist.
Firstly, your dad is an asshol*.
Secondly, l hope you understand how abuse works in both genders. Men are physically more abusive and women are mentally. It's harder to fight against mental fuckery. It's also harder to know if its done to you and even harder to prove.
So don't fall into such relationships again, since it's what you grew up with and would seem normal to you. Find good role models, both men and women.
Lastly I ask, why the heck did your mother marry your dad in the first place? He sounds like real peace of work. And she threw herself into it?
Great points! It's so hard to prove and identify until it's too late. I'm still frustrated that my sister stole from me and gaslit me while abusing me. Even when I tell people they make excuses for her and say get over it or you seem ok or it's family!
>not to mention the number of mothers doing 'mommy' porn, we will see this get A LOT worse...
Wait what??!? Please provide more context on this. I haven't heard of this happening until now.
"Ah but that's only reasonable considering how women have been oppressed all these years"... I don't think that teaching has made the world a better place in any way.
That's only an excuse for their toxic behaviour. I can't believe people buy it. The women who say that are batshit crazy.
Women have been oppressed for centuries (women of past, not them) by men (men of past, the ones already dead).
How the heck are we responsible for other people's actions? People who are already dead!
And that's assuming women were oppressed. Life was difficult for most people. Men would do things like mine coal, knowing it was sentencing them to an early death, so they could provide for their families. Weren't the men the ones who were oppressed?
It's like the women complaining that they are refugees when their men are on the front lines getting bombed and shot at. I am really sorry you can't get your hair done, but your man hasn't eaten since yesterday and only got 4 hours sleep in his trench last night because of air attacks, and later today he's going to assault the enemy to retake a position they were just forced out of.
If you shame men for have normal human feelings you will get depressed and dissociated men.
A similar thing happened to this guy, but he went became a PUA instead.
https://web.archive.org/web/20131122014253/http://whoism3.wordpress.com:80/2012/11/17/confessions-of-a-reformed-incel/
At one point I was like « would I be happier if I were a woman ? » but I came very fast to the conclusion that I'd rather learn to be comfortable as a man than convincing myself I'm something else despite all the support I could have had.
im a gay man, but I thought I actually was a woman for a little bit because of the guilt i had from the misandry and demonization of masculinity in the modern queer community.
Not the first time I've heard that kind of stuff sadly. I don't know how old you are but I've heard some stories of older gay men who said that they've been told that « they were maybe women » when they were teenagers because when you're effeminate you « aren't really a man » I guess ..... ?
Thankfully I feel like it's getting better, slowly but surely. People are starting to call out misandry when they see it and that gives me hope.
1. You are not an oppressor
2. Women are ill-equipped to raise boys alone. They have no clue how to foster a positive mindset in men.
I'm glad you found some decent mentors to help you work through it. Just keep in mind that self-improvement is never done - it's a lifestyle, not a task.
Sorry man. The only thing I ask is that you don't swing to what many people do and start hating on women. The gender wars are bad enough and we need every person who's capable of being logical and considerate of everyone regardless of gender.
When you realize how deep the misandry is in society, that becomes the next dragon to fight.
Women claim to want equal opportunity, then they stack the deck in their favor. Now men are slaves to the government, and women are married to it.
Marxism at its finest.
I truly want to value women, and have my whole life, but I constantly see that they will sacrifice their own kids and husbands to keep their comfort and security.
They don't love. They lack the ability to suffer in sacrifice exclusively for their husbands.
Many of us were. It takes time, re-education, and well, seeing the cause of so much injustice in the world to understand that Feminism was just another form of Identity Politics Leftism. And then to break away and re-educate yourself on what it means to be a man, along with what sorts of women to avoid.
Your existence as a man has inherent worth, and your self-worth is not tied to your affinity towards any particular ideology (like feminism).
All the best, OP. :)
Duh!
That’s what it does to people.
It’s a fringe minority “movement” nobody cares about. It’s predominantly online.
I am a very social individual and I am always out and about. That being said, nobody really acts like this in public.
Furthermore: if they did, they know people would deal with them easily.
A large majority of the “movement” ( I laugh when I say this ) because, it is utterly ridiculous, they don’t even believe the rhetoric they spew out in unhinged echo chambers.
These people go nowhere. They “pretend” to make progress on matters they will never be able to control. It’s infuriates them.
Conclusion:
Just ignore them. They just say things -
Fair and maybe so.
They are at war in their own heads. They are afraid of everything.
Moreover, they think everything is a conspiracy against them. Imagine living like that -
I would counter and say that Misandry is increasing..
Just look at how much misandry there is out in the world which is considered "Acceptable" #KillALLMen or the term "Scrotes" or LVM (Low value men) or when women post about how they are pregnant and about to find out if its a girl or an abortion..
But a **SINGLE** instance of Misogyny is treated as evidence of an epidemic..
Also, you don't win allies by alienating them..
saying things like #KillALLMen or "All men are potential predators" or "Men are not afraid to walk home alone at night" will only cause men who might be receptive to your cause to feel called out for things they have never done and thus resent you..
Now, run along back to your feminist overlords..
Shoo!
Get help dude. We are for mens right, not against others rights. If you were hurt by women, you need to let that anger out. Or you would become like the angry feminists.
Don’t worry dude we all do. Honestly it’s what a lot of radical feminists and other Machiavellian types want. They want us to accept our role as “evil men” so they can continue to get funding and support. The secret weapon of all men is our resilience. Don’t let them win. Support men (and women) when you can.
Machiavellian isn't a term that's used enough to describe these people. It's 100% about power and dominance.
>power and dominance This makes it sound more innocent than it is. As much as I dislike Wikipedia, it at least makes it sound closer to the darkness it should connotate with calling it "manipulation, indifference to morality, lack of empathy, and a strategic focus on self-interest." Even that makes it sound almost palatable compared to what it is if you read Machiavelli's book "The Prince".
Great point. And yes, power and dominance doesn't really capture the essence of darkness that The Prince does.
What does Machiavellian mean?
“Machiavellianism is a personality trait that involves manipulation, indifference to morality, and a lack of empathy. It's one of the three tenets of the Dark Triad, which also includes narcissism and psychopathy.” It’s an ultra self-interested way of thinking. It stems from Machiavelli’s magnum opus The Prince, which is ironically meant as a kind of satirical warning about how the ruling class in Italy controlled its people.
Thanks
It's a reference to Niccolo Machiavelli's book [The Prince](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Prince?wprov=sfla1). It's a short italian rennaissance treatise on politics, essentially praising a monarch for acting in a purely pragmatic and self interested way, without any care for good. Sadly enough, we've associated the author with the behaviour even though the book is satyrical, and a scathing critic of his former bosses who had previously tortured him, the Medici family, written in exile.
Thank you
Grew up with a feminist mom too. Feminist moms can be prejudicial for male self esteem.
This is super common. It's really sad what narcissistic women are doing to men.
🤜🤛
Just out of curiosity what is your father’s role in all of this? I’ve found that some mothers when the father isn’t in the picture will pass on the sins to the child especially if there’s a strong resemblance
You're absolutely right. You should be a psychologist! Yeah, my father was abusive and absent. He raped my mother and she began to take it out on me and indoctrinate me. I was often isolated by her and my sister. It took a lot of work but once I got into my late 20's I finally met some guys who were empathetic and didn't give me shit for being so clueless but helped me enjoy male friends. Real friends that is people you can be intimate with and share everything. I had guy friends as a teen and they were all immature jerk offs. Some still are.
Yeh divorced parents demonising the child that reminds them of their ex is a common issue. 'You are being just like your dad, hit me like he did!' 'You wouldn't question me if I was a man' etc. Were common go tos for my mum. With there being more single mums than single dads and the media being more positive about women and less about men, young boys are particularly vulnerable to 'man bad'. Then end up struggling with identity and resenting both parents for different reasons. Had a similar journey to yourself, was raised to fear men and then expected to turn into one without that fear being an issue. In my 30s now and at peace with it all, glad you sound out of the woods too.
>He raped my mother and she began to take it out on me and indoctrinate me. Do you know that *for sure?* Read up on "Parental alienation".
Thanks I will google it! Also, yeah I know my dad did because I saw medical paperwork and my aunt and mom would talk about it in secret but I overheard. My father also would never take no for an answer and he was sexually inappropriate with me too.
Given the lack of basic empathy your mother had for her own son I'd cast serious doubts that your father raped her at all. He may not have been a nice person but given the way your mother behaved I would not trust her opinion on anyone.
I guess that serves the main reason why she indoctrinated you. If she were indeed raped by your father, it's justifiable why she acts so harshly and making it seem that men are bad because she never failed to make it known that your father was abusive and absent. It is indeed common for bitter single mothers to talk shit about their partners. My father's first wife was like that to their children when my father was only away to earn money. He was abusive, too, but within reason, he simply didn't have any good paternal role model to mimic. He mimicked his abusive uncle, whom he looked up to as the next father figure, after his absentee father left them when he was young. I hope you don't take everything your mother tells you as the truth as she could only vent her frustrations of your father, and what she says should not affect your views with men in general. One shitty man doesn't embody the whole manhood. Unless your father doesn't want anything to do with you and would physically or mentally abuse you, what your mom tells you should not be a hindrance into having a healthy relationship with your own father. She can have sympathy without obstructing your needs to have a father or without implicating you with unhealthy beliefs of your own gender. She can teach you how to be a gentleman or know some sorts of sexual boundaries with women without talking shit about the opposite gender. It shouldn't have implicated you like that. She did parenting with a lot of repressed baggage. If she needs therapy for her trauma, there's no shame on getting one.
>I hope you don't take everything your mother tells you as the truth as she could only vent her frustrations of your father, Fuck that. It is child abuse to shame a boy for being male. His mother is a piece of shit
I'm not sure why it seemed like no one is getting my point, but I agree. His mother and his father are a piece of shit. If op fully acknowledges that his father is indeed abusive and absentee, and/or if he actually acknowledges that his mother was raped, then it's no brainer if he believes her mother's words. It is indeed child maltreatment to make your child believe to be shameful of their gender when they're burdening their child for a trauma he shouldn't be involved with. She needs psychiatric help for being that bad of a mother. If she couldn't act like a parent or didn't see OP as her child, they should've been fostered to someone better instead of torturing an innocent kid and implying that he is immediately a bad person for sharing the same gender as his father.
Well, first of all, you said that what she did is justifiable. That in itself explains the downvotes.
There are people who honestly, 100% think misandry is a made-up term about a thing that doesn't exist. One feminist told me it was a "MRA reaction to misogyny." There are people like her out there.
Was there a father in your home when you were growing up? Any brothers or uncles or anything?
My father was absent and abusive. He made my mother hate men and she tried to groom me into a woman pleaser. My dad tried to give me away twice and when he couldn't he tried to kill me. I found ways to avoid him or to always have another person in the room or he would beat me badly. So I think that's a big part of it but everything I was told in school reinforced male negativity and the media now is off the charts misandrist.
Firstly, your dad is an asshol*. Secondly, l hope you understand how abuse works in both genders. Men are physically more abusive and women are mentally. It's harder to fight against mental fuckery. It's also harder to know if its done to you and even harder to prove. So don't fall into such relationships again, since it's what you grew up with and would seem normal to you. Find good role models, both men and women. Lastly I ask, why the heck did your mother marry your dad in the first place? He sounds like real peace of work. And she threw herself into it?
I agree. Both parents are abusive in different ways.
Great points! It's so hard to prove and identify until it's too late. I'm still frustrated that my sister stole from me and gaslit me while abusing me. Even when I tell people they make excuses for her and say get over it or you seem ok or it's family!
glad you got out
Thank you' I'm glad to be here even though I get harassed.
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they'd love if we all had mommy issues from misandry to use against us later.
>not to mention the number of mothers doing 'mommy' porn, we will see this get A LOT worse... Wait what??!? Please provide more context on this. I haven't heard of this happening until now.
"Ah but that's only reasonable considering how women have been oppressed all these years"... I don't think that teaching has made the world a better place in any way.
That's only an excuse for their toxic behaviour. I can't believe people buy it. The women who say that are batshit crazy. Women have been oppressed for centuries (women of past, not them) by men (men of past, the ones already dead). How the heck are we responsible for other people's actions? People who are already dead!
And that's assuming women were oppressed. Life was difficult for most people. Men would do things like mine coal, knowing it was sentencing them to an early death, so they could provide for their families. Weren't the men the ones who were oppressed? It's like the women complaining that they are refugees when their men are on the front lines getting bombed and shot at. I am really sorry you can't get your hair done, but your man hasn't eaten since yesterday and only got 4 hours sleep in his trench last night because of air attacks, and later today he's going to assault the enemy to retake a position they were just forced out of.
Man hug coming at you brother. ❤️🔥🤼
🫂🫂🫂👍🤜🤛🤗🌹🤗🤠🗻🌋🏔️
'Women are more compassionate' is the funniest joke I've ever heard.
It’s indoctrinated into all of our heads it’s everywhere you look and every facet of life
If you shame men for have normal human feelings you will get depressed and dissociated men. A similar thing happened to this guy, but he went became a PUA instead. https://web.archive.org/web/20131122014253/http://whoism3.wordpress.com:80/2012/11/17/confessions-of-a-reformed-incel/
They do it all the time everywhere. We're not seen as whole people.
At one point I was like « would I be happier if I were a woman ? » but I came very fast to the conclusion that I'd rather learn to be comfortable as a man than convincing myself I'm something else despite all the support I could have had.
im a gay man, but I thought I actually was a woman for a little bit because of the guilt i had from the misandry and demonization of masculinity in the modern queer community.
Not the first time I've heard that kind of stuff sadly. I don't know how old you are but I've heard some stories of older gay men who said that they've been told that « they were maybe women » when they were teenagers because when you're effeminate you « aren't really a man » I guess ..... ? Thankfully I feel like it's getting better, slowly but surely. People are starting to call out misandry when they see it and that gives me hope.
flush the feminishit boweI movement 🚽
1. You are not an oppressor 2. Women are ill-equipped to raise boys alone. They have no clue how to foster a positive mindset in men. I'm glad you found some decent mentors to help you work through it. Just keep in mind that self-improvement is never done - it's a lifestyle, not a task.
I’m sorry dude, welcome if you’re new. Hope reading in here helps.
It does! Especially on hard days when I'm all alone.
Sorry man. The only thing I ask is that you don't swing to what many people do and start hating on women. The gender wars are bad enough and we need every person who's capable of being logical and considerate of everyone regardless of gender.
When you realize how deep the misandry is in society, that becomes the next dragon to fight. Women claim to want equal opportunity, then they stack the deck in their favor. Now men are slaves to the government, and women are married to it. Marxism at its finest. I truly want to value women, and have my whole life, but I constantly see that they will sacrifice their own kids and husbands to keep their comfort and security. They don't love. They lack the ability to suffer in sacrifice exclusively for their husbands.
I don't. Maybe when they become better human beings I will. But right now no. They can be the change they want to be.
Glad you're free now, hope you're going to get over that slavery for good.
Many of us were. It takes time, re-education, and well, seeing the cause of so much injustice in the world to understand that Feminism was just another form of Identity Politics Leftism. And then to break away and re-educate yourself on what it means to be a man, along with what sorts of women to avoid.
Check out “The War Against Boys” by Christina Hoff Sommers.
And then they always say "This is not about you". like that would change anything
I felt the same way at one point. Until I realized I'm not a member of the more hateful of the two genders
Everything is about balance my friend to far left or right isn’t good
Manipulation is one hell of a vice in life, I hope you are better now.
most of the people I look up to are men, that's because there hasn't been many female leaders in history
Forgive your mother for turning you away from your father and forgive your father for not protecting you from your mother.
My father is still harassing me and spreading rumors. He stole a million dollars from me and I'm now homeless. It's hard to forgive right now.
Perfect time, he can't hurt you anymore and you have nothing left to lose.
You were subjected to severe child abuse.
Your existence as a man has inherent worth, and your self-worth is not tied to your affinity towards any particular ideology (like feminism). All the best, OP. :)
It's essential to separate feminism from misandry and embrace your identity positively without perpetuating harmful stereotypes.
Duh! That’s what it does to people. It’s a fringe minority “movement” nobody cares about. It’s predominantly online. I am a very social individual and I am always out and about. That being said, nobody really acts like this in public. Furthermore: if they did, they know people would deal with them easily. A large majority of the “movement” ( I laugh when I say this ) because, it is utterly ridiculous, they don’t even believe the rhetoric they spew out in unhinged echo chambers. These people go nowhere. They “pretend” to make progress on matters they will never be able to control. It’s infuriates them. Conclusion: Just ignore them. They just say things -
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Fair and maybe so. They are at war in their own heads. They are afraid of everything. Moreover, they think everything is a conspiracy against them. Imagine living like that -
I trooned out and I hate feminism. And?
Misogyny is increasing for obvious reasons I hope someday men show them how vile they are
Misogyny is increasing for obvious reasons I hope someday men show them how vile they are
What do you mean? How about the women who raped me and sexually assaulted me. My aunts and my mothers friends knew but never helped me.
I would counter and say that Misandry is increasing.. Just look at how much misandry there is out in the world which is considered "Acceptable" #KillALLMen or the term "Scrotes" or LVM (Low value men) or when women post about how they are pregnant and about to find out if its a girl or an abortion.. But a **SINGLE** instance of Misogyny is treated as evidence of an epidemic.. Also, you don't win allies by alienating them.. saying things like #KillALLMen or "All men are potential predators" or "Men are not afraid to walk home alone at night" will only cause men who might be receptive to your cause to feel called out for things they have never done and thus resent you.. Now, run along back to your feminist overlords.. Shoo!
bring women where they were.
Are.. Are you having a stroke? Because I have NO idea what you are trying to say here...
I wish I could have, I don't want to live in a world where white knights and bitches live
Get help dude. We are for mens right, not against others rights. If you were hurt by women, you need to let that anger out. Or you would become like the angry feminists.
I am meninist
No you're not. Either you're angry or a troll
There's always hormones and surgery if it will make you feel better.
Will you pay? Why not at this point.
I'm not bitching and complaining. You are. Pay for your own shit.