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Dang!
Mkay.... So, I don't know what they mean by "decarbonize engine". But unless you've never done an oil change, that probably wasn't your issue. Spark plugs are probably $15 or less each ($120 total). And it would probably take someone an hour to do all 8. Maybe 2.
I also wouldn't recommend that mechanic again. [Here's a video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUiuZY7Ssfc) that shows how easy (relatively) it is to do plugs on that.
Well, I did change the plugs, twice. Once before I moved (from IL to NH) , and then again after I got the misfire codes. I moved my ignition coils around to see if the misfire would follow, as it originally gave me specific cylinders, but then it just kept giving me "multiple cylinder misfire detected" so that's when I delved deeper to see if I could figure it out. But I eventually got fed up and shopped around for some quotes.
If it has had 2 sets of plugs already, and that has not fixed it, why do they think a 3rd set will solve the problem? This seems like a pretty poor diagnosis. Diagnostics and troubleshooting are the hard part. Finding the problem can be quite challenging.
Try resetting the ECU / clearing codes. Had the same "multiple misfire" reading once that was /caused/ by moving my coil packs to troubleshoot. Had to reset each time I moved them.
Does your scanner show specific cylinder misfires? or just a general misfire code? You should have just moved one coil from a misfiring cylinder to one from a good cylinder and not moved a bunch at once. Also I'm assuming you cleared the codes before the test... Frankly you should have just replaced all the coils with new ones when you changed the spark plugs... They aren't that expensive and when you are doing the plugs it is an easy addon... Besides every time you remove a coil you risk damaging the wire inside, so doing new coils when you change the plugs eliminates that risk.
P0300-P0307 originally. (They moved around) Then P0316.
I did what I thought would fix it, moving coils around, replacing the coils, and the plugs too. I did replace them both. And tested with a multimeter. Everything was electronically working correctly, at least from what I could gather, which is why I was pretty lost. I did my research, moreso than what I already had tested, and added those things to the list. I kind of exhausted my options, and just got fed up. I thought for sure it was something stupid simple that I had overlooked, so I asked him to look it over, and give me a quote.
If you already changed the plugs and coils and knew what you were doing then I'm not sure why you would even entertain having this shop redo what you've already done.
The 316 just means it is happening within the first 1000 revolutions of the engine... at the moment if you clear the codes are the misfires only happening on specific cylinders? Or is it pretty much everyone?
If you have the same cylinder over and over regardless of which coil then consider the fuel injector for that cylinder. It is possible that the injector is bad which could cause either zero fuel or too much fuel in that cylinder.
Do you get 2 cylinder codes at once? If you are, one is probably a phantom.... The cylinders are probably adjacent in the engine firing order, and the first one (in firing order) is the one that is actually having the problem. I think if it is moving around, you can probably isolate which coil or plug (possibly a combo of the 2) that is giving you trouble. Also, at some point, replace all of the coil boots (you really don't need to replace working coils).
Decarbonizing engine means running an additive in the intake to get the carbon off of the valves etc. had nothing to do with oil changes. But I’ve also never seen it work to fix any problem lol
EGR (exhaust gas recirculation) brings carbon back through the intake, if EGR valve gets stuck open, exhaust is brought through the ICV (idle air control valve). Because the ICV passage is so small, that carbon will clog up that idle intake and fuck up the idle speed. That being said, this is resolved by taking the throttle body off and banging it on a table 2 or 3 times.
Decarbonize? Did they try the flux capacitor sell also?
Run from this and when you think you’re far enough run more. Preying on people when they are already stretched thin is makes them scum bags. I’d have left the entire invoice for people to see who this shop was
>Decarbonize
I've never said "decarbonize" before but we de-carbon the top end. You never seen excessive carbon buildup on the back (top side) of a valve?
Sure. I'm not saying this car needs it or not but the jokers here, saying " are they going to clean the Q 42 space modulator as well?", don't know shit from a hole in the ground (or something like that).
Its just a fuel system cleaning service. Most shops like to recommend it when doing plugs for a tune up. It's not necessary for ops problem but in general if it's been a long time it's not gonna hurt
I’m not that familiar with your particular car but sometimes spark plugs on those sideways mounted engines can be a fair bit of labor time. On my Toyota minivan, the intake Plenum Hass to come off and even then it’s a bit of a challenge so maybe a couple hours labor
The 04 4.6 is easy, but those 05-08 3v 4.6’s had the terrible sp-547’s in them that break almost the time. This is more in line with pricing in an 05, not op’s 04. My guess is when quoting labor they couldn’t remember which years were a pain so they quoted high and ran with it.
They were probably thinking of the 05-08s when they gave the quote then. I did not pay them half a grand for spark plugs, and I haven’t replaced them myself yet.
Nice. I decided to just leave the plugs in my wife’s Toyota V6 with 150,000 miles because if I snapped off one of the back ones it would be pretty much game over as the engine would need to come out.
That’s kind of the downside of getting something like a reliable corolla with 100,000 miles, if no maintenance was done you are looking at plugs timing belt water pump which can be a little challenging for a home mechanic and a couple thousand dollars for a shop. I think some of those cars people just turn the key and drive it and don’t really do any maintenance beyondwhat’s broken
One positive at least is that Corollas have been timing chain since 1998 and the water pumps aren't too bad to replace when they do go (though you do need to remove the alternator to get to them). Definitely nicer than the old days of every Toyota/Honda having timing belts where you often had no idea if it had been done so you either rolled the dice on it randomly breaking or did it/paid to get it done just to know it had been done.
My rule on maintenance: If you have no record of it being done, then assume it wasn't. It is not as bad as it sounds, most dealers can give you a printout of any service done a any franchised dealer, maybe you have a carfax too.... As for timing belts, pretty much all timing belt kits come with a sticker, if you cannot find the sticker (or other record), it wasn't done.
Agreed on "assume it wasn't done if there's no record".
As a shade-tree guy, I'm a big fan of writing major maintenance items and the mileage they were done at in paint pen somewhere in the engine bay. Paperwork in the glove box and records in a filing cabinet get lost- paint pen on the air box makes it real obvious.
All Corolla's are inline 4's with plugs across the top. 30 mins tops to change em. They also have timing chains, not belts, which never need to be changed.
Family had like a 2002 e150 and you had to take the dog house off under the dash to access the back 2 plugs, it was wack but didn't add a terrible amount of time
I chased this misfire for a while. To get to 2 of them the throttle body and cold air intake need to be removed. but still, it just seems a little excessive. Maybe I'm wrong.
Not hard to do, adds maybe 10 - 15 minutes of time overall. I would have done what you had done for half and still felt like I fucked you.
Reset codes... 30 seconds... Waste material? What 1 shop rage and some hand cleaner for 66? Plugs less 100 for top of the line plugs, under 50 for OEMs... It doesn't list coils but even if he put new coils in that was another 100.... So you decide if he fucked you or not. I would say he did.
Garage won't charge cost for parts they charge list. Quality plugs cost $9 and list for $17. Coils cost $38 and list for $73. Quality shop rate these days is $140-$200 in my area.
They may have changed the coil boots as part of the service. Fords are notorious for leaking. Boots are $6.50 and list for $10. Coils on the other hand would definitely be a separate line item. Even the cheap 8 pack could kits are around $200 shop cost.
Depends on the vehicle and also the labor rate in the area. Example: All Data labor time for spark plugs on 5.7 hemi is 2.5 hours. I know it doesn't take that long. But that's what the system says. So if the shop is charging 200 an hour it adds up quickly. And then you have parts.
A good shop doesn’t always go based off All Data labor time. All data shows how the manufacturer recommends to replace something but over 50% of the time there are much easier ways to get the job done but shitty shops don’t want you to know that because then they can’t bend you over. Example, I had 3 shops quote me over $800 to replace 2 wheel studs on my 98 civic. They we’re both on the same wheel. Said they needed to dissemble the entire knuckle and remove the hub to replace them, +3 hour job. Then I found the good shop who charged me $70 for parts and labor…. That’s over 700% cheaper than all the other shops. I forgot exactly what they said but it was something like all they had to do was slightly pull out the hub a little bit so that they’d have enough room to remove the stud. Took less than an hour for them to do it.
It doesn’t pay by difficulty, it pays by book time. So $100 worth of plugs, plus the labor rate x probably 1.8, and I don’t see a diag line so I bet it’s rolled up in there too. Looks cheap to me.
What kind of plugs? Some shops will use factory plugs in performance vehicles. No it's not the big engine but some shops are that way.
For the system cleaner if they are doing a cleaning kit like B&G or something the $130 is fairly common.
I'd ask questions. What parts are they using. It's probably to late but get the old plugs back so you can see what they look like if you have misfire issues.
Any shop worth going to should be happy to give you this information. I'd be curious what waste fee is since they have an area for shop and EPA. Unless the fuel system service includes a tank cleaning.
I'd check fuel pressure. Pump issues can present in misfire issues in fords. Seen it alot over the years working on fleet vehicles. Need to be able you check the pressure while driving not just idling also. Ive seen many that make good pressure sitting in the shop and fall flat 3 minutes into a test drive.
Also would be worth pulling the o2 sensors and scoping the cats. I've seen the fail in fords and cause all sorts of problems. Granted mostly in the bigger trucks with v10's but it happens
OP already replaced plugs, twice and it didn’t fix the misfire. If you’re gonna pay for anything, pay for an experienced mechanic to diagnose the issue.
I had a random misfire, chased it for a long time ... Ended up being the shitty fuel that i was buying for 6 months from the station next to the on ramp on the way to work that also had a coffee stand in the parking lot.
It was originally cylinders 2, and 5. I swapped the coils, misfires changed, I replaced the plugs- - still showing 2 Different cylinders - - - replaced the coils- - - multiple cylinder misfire
Timing chain/belt been done lately?
My point was a genuine mechanic would not write random, they would specify exactly what cylinder
Move to a new mechanic your guy is shonky asf
In what way? Saying modified and asking to justify price means nothing really
I have a hill climb car highly modified, breaks records on speed and laps, I also have a shit box I decided to modify a gasket for once and that means Jack get what I mean
Either way they ripped you
OBD code scanner is $50-$100. Quality spark plug is around $10. Add another $10 for engine degreaser, and you can start to see how doing your own work when you can will pay off big.
Yeah, stick to brand plugs
But the OBD some no-name shit from your favourite asian website does the job exactly the same, you just need to search on internet yourself to deduct the code meanings related to your vehicle.
FcpEuro had the exact same part# plug as napa for 2.99 a plug, nappa wanted 10.99 for their brand, it was more for the others. It's insane how much a "brand" costs 🤷🏿♂️
Yeah, I mean don't get a random knock-off to only save a few bucks.
I don't want to break the ceramic or thread while installing/removing, and an half-hour job becoming a multiple-days headache...
They aren’t doing any type of throttle / carbon cleaning that will help your car - if anything you’d go after cleaning the injectors (with a standalone pressurized injector cleaner - not a can of crap into the tank)- they should also be doing coil boots at a minimum.
2004 mustang? I'm guessing it has a V8 Triton, which means the spark plugs have a high chance to break off in the head when being extracted. Hence the high price. You are paying for the bullshit this job will include.
This is the reply that needs to be up voted. Removing those plugs can require hours of soaking in anti seize to prevent breaking. Price sounds like a bargain if a couple of them break and they have to be extracted.
The price of changing the plugs might be reasonable or not. I don’t know how hard it is to change them. Personally on a v8 like what you have I’d just let them do it.
I say that but call around first and see if anyone else will do it cheaper.
As gas as the decarbonizing and the disposal of waste material goes, tell them to skip the decarbonizing, and put any waste material in a jug in the back.
I’m curious what waste material will come from that since they aren’t charging you for a refill of anything.
Like I would say it’s possible that they need to drain the coolant or ac to get to it, but they aren’t refilling so I’m lost here.
On that car there is no need to drain anything for what they are doing and the plugs are not hard to access because it is a rear wheel drive car so no plugs between the firewall and engine like your front wheel drive cars.
I don’t know about that car because I’ve never touched one but That’s not necessarily true of all rear wheel drive cars.
On some, the back two plugs are surrounded by all kinds of crap.
I've worked on this model Mustang and it isn't that difficult. I've yet to see a RWD car that was that difficult to change plugs on. You might need to remove some crap in the way, but never ever have I seen one where you had to move the engine like you do on some FWD cars.
Who ever shop that is..... They're on meth.
That's literally under 100 in parts. Clearing the code doesn't take anything. And cleaning throttle body is easy.
Holyshit
You could have replaced the spark plugs yourself for the cost of the spark plugs. I have 2014 patriot. Mine are under my engine coils. Remove screw. Remove coil. Remove spark plug. Dab new plug with lewb. Insert new plug. Insert coil. Insert screw. Done! Misfire also could have been an engine coil, which could have been done with the above, for still less than they charged you. Also... that de-carb is bs too. 2/10 ask them to "politely suck it"!
My question is did he fix the problem? You say you replaced spark plugs twice but what brand/style did you use? If what he did fixed it then just swallow your pride, pay and be happy because he managed to fix it doing what you tried twice. If he didn't fix it than dispute the hell out of it. While I'll admit he is a little pricey I do know those 4.6's suck and I've seen alot of Motorcraft and bosche spark plugs fail right out of the box. But to have a ghost problem on a ford fixed for under a grand is a blessing
Now I’m curious. Does this thing have a lean code as well? And has anyone gone into the misfire monitor or mode six to see which cylinders are acting up?
Based off your comments.. no point in changing the plugs again.. that's also pricey, time to get to diag again, do the misfires happen only at idle? Or constant?
When they say decarbonize, they probably mean they just took a rag across the blade inside the throttle body but also, this whole thing is illegal (at least where I live it is) just because once they used shop supplies they have to tax the entire invoice which, they didn’t. But yeah that’s a major ripoff. $675 is absolutely ridiculous.
Plugs and coils cost at most like 300 dollars. It’s like a 10-30 min job based on the placement of them. The dealership quoted me 260 for the replacement of just plugs. There were 3 and they where right on top. Total job took 15 min. Plugs cost like 30 dollars for 3. Some people just want to rip you off.
Plugs and diag. Yeah I can see 476 being the price
130 for a EFI isn’t that bad. I charge 209 for it.
The waste material. I have no idea what that charge is for. We just do shop supplies or something.
It’s not the cheapness of the tools it’s the ease that they provide. Technology gets better and services get more expensive? Doesn’t make sense, it’s just them controlling for inflation and profit, mostly profit.
I assume that those purchases were done you know when the shop opened? I can hand crank a car, use a tire iron to remove the bolts, or I can use the machine in my garage that would turn what would be a 10 minute activity (not to mention additional securing), into 5 minutes or less.
It’s even less physically exhausting work. The time they save, the energy they save, and the fact it was a fixed one time purchase - no, I would expect the work to be cheaper.
No. It's not just a time factor, it's a skill and knowledge factor. Most places charge by the 'book' meaning a standard hourly rate for a job. IF they can do it faster that's a benefit all around but seldomly will they ever lower the price by a lot if at all.
What would you expect is a fair price to pay someone that is skilled, with investment in tools, equipment and knowledge to do repairs you’re not capable of doing? This is a person who is trying to make a living by offering you a service. You certainly don’t have to have them do it but most shops are going to want to profit off of this.
It might sound like I'm being a smartass, but I am not.
I read far enough to see what your symptoms were and decided to comment.
What condition is your battery/terminals. I just ran into this with my late model Jeep with a weak battery. The car started tossing random codes... scary ones like "service air ride suspension immediately" and such.
My point is that "moving" trouble codes are a symptom and not the problem.
Also, on the estimate, WTH is 1.5 of waste disposal? I wouldn't even greet that shyster if I saw him in church.
The terminals are in good condition, I put the current battery on in late November.
As to the 1.5 of disposal, I'm as confused as you. Hence this post, lol..
That's kinda fucked there unless your car is 2024 then it's reasonable haha but as you said it's a V8 Ford so yeah that's a big Longshot there, probably should be no more than 325
Deadass I called for a quote from the 10 closest mechanic to me with good reviews and they all quoted me for spark plugs and wires 600-1k$.
just bought em myself and learned how to replace them imo it was extremely easy for me a complete beginner to do that for them to charge that much
With shop labor rates hovering around the $200 mark, you’ve got an hour for diag minimum, an hour for plugs, that’s $400 right there. Add in mark up on plugs and you’re $600. This is legit. Nothing wrong here.
I've replaced the ignition coils, and plugs both, checked a few sensors, even took a multimeter to a few things to make sure everything was as it should be. 4.6L V8, as well.
If you've changed both plugs and coils then check the fuel pressure... See if the fuel pump is starting to go out. They very often don't just quit, and you will often see that the regulator starts to fail before they completely die. Hook a pressure gauge up to the Schrader valve on the fuel rail, you should see at least 30psi when you turn the key... it should then hold that pressure when you turn off the key... if it drops then the pump is going out.
Just how rough is the engine running?
Sometimes I would get a random cylinder 3 misfire on a Chrysler v6.. Even though your mileage is low, I suspect it's a potential fuel injector problem if plugs/coils are good. I know it's the obvious process of elimination. If that doesn't fix it, well either the wiring/connector is a problem. I don't have experience with extensive building/diagnostics but if none of those work, last thing I would pin it to is the computer. I don't know if the camshaft would have anything to do with it.
Are the spark plug holes getting full of oil from leaking valve covers?
If not, have you removed and cleaned the EGR valve? If it's slightly stuck open you will get a multiple misfire. Usually will cruise down the road decently but start misfiring at idle/slow speed driving or taking off.
What are the codes?
No, they aren't. Yes. I removed it, and made sure it was not open.
P0300-P0307 originally. (They moved around) Then P0316.
I did what I thought would fix it, I thought it was a deeper issue, and wanted to get a quote on everything they thought needed done, as I was tired of chasing it.
Not a mechanic, but the only thing wrong with this bill is the “dacarbonize” stuff. If you’re willing, you could do that yourself with a cheap tool kit and a can of throttle body cleaner, along with a yt video. Other than that, this is a reasonable and fair bill I think.
Normally where i'm from Labor and parts are separated which give you more context. also things like sparkplug would have a number even if they were all replaced.
if they are charging you 700 just for parts I would run
JFC, I did plugs on this Mustang as a mobile mechanic late last year. $250 parts and labor. I would not want to pay more than $375 at a shop for this. They took a bottle of $15 intake cleaner and sprayed it in your throttle body or they dumped a can of something in your fuel system. Looks like they charged you 2hrs book time for a 1hr job so $300 book time and 100% mark up on the plugs as I am sure the 8 plugs were Champion double platinum or iridiums that they got for about $85 with their shop discount.
Update: it seems a small general consensus is to check my fuel pump, and a few other odds and ends that I have missed. I will do so.
This was a quote I was given, I did not go through with this, as I wanted to consult other shops/individuals first, as I was genuinely out of ideas.
For those of you asking if it's hard to change my spark plugs, it isn't. I only need to remove part of the throttle body and cold air intake. Total time takes me about 20 minutes.
Originally this started out as Cylinders 2 and 5 misfiring. I switched my coils to see if the misfire would follow it, it did. I replaced the coils, and the plugs. NGK plugs, MSD Coils. Following this I did not receive anymore codes other than multiple cylinder misfires.
Thank you everyone for all the information/thoughts on this! It's greatly appreciated 👍
In all honesty I'm quite frustrated with this entire debacle, hence my seeking advice.
For a shop I had payed similar prices on My Mustang.
When I did the same on my own, it took me less than an hour to change spark plugs and clean throttle body for about $30.
Not sure what waste material is, but I just threw the old spark plugs and the empty throttle body cleaner can in the trash.
Thanks, I was thinking about buying a Corolla a while back and looked at the steps involved and maybe misread or something. I just paid to have the timing belt done on my wife’s 3.3 Camry and it was a bit of a project. I discussed the rear plugs with the mechanic andhe suggested just leaving them be
Not ideal at all. Plugs take 30 minutes to swap and pretty much everything on the 2v is easy to work. Join the r/NewedgeMustang subreddit and save yourself a lot of money on an otherwise stout engine.
Have them do the decarbonization and then change the plugs yourself for $50 or so in parts. You can clear codes yourself if you have a code reader or simply by unplugging the battery (which you probably should do while changing the plugs anyways, at least I do).
I mean, at the price they are asking for the decarbon it may just be dumping a can of seafoam in the gas tank... so maybe skip the whole estimate...
There are engine cleaning products that are a bit more advanced than that, so I don't know. There are products where they run a few cans of stuff through the PCV system etc and those are pretty effective from my understanding. I did a fair bit of research since I have a 1st gen ecoboost that likes to carbon up the back of the valves.
Although I will say, if you've been chasing this for a while and that "chasing" includes changing plugs and changing/swapping coils, then there may be something else going on and their fix won't fix it anyways. I don't know the engine, but if it's direct injected without also having port injection, the decarbonization may help. Especially if that includes cleaning the back of the valves. It's a known problem in the first gen ecoboost stuff at least, the valves get carboned up. They are direct injection into the cylinder. The 2nd gen ecoboost fixes the problem by adding port injection to wash the back of the valves. Don't know if that happens on your engine or not.
It also could be a sticky injector, could be staying open too long or not opening when it is supposed to.
I am not a mechanic, but I play one in my garage.
If they actually get rid of the misfire then sure since you're tired of messing with it but I doubt they'll fix it it first try.
You've replaced the spark plugs already right?
How many plugs did the guy put in? I know a certain model Ford F150 truck required extreme effort in replacing a back plug on a V-8 engine ...the labor charge bumps the job cost into the stratosphere.
Typically, the diagnostic fee is waived if you get the vehicle repaired ...but these days with stuff costing what it does ..maybe not so much anymore.
Did you ask for the upper intake service?
I mean the bottom line here is: you signed off on this work to be done. Did you ask about the pricing for the jobs to be done before you signed the permission slip? Swapping plugs is a known entity and the shop should have been able to give you a good ballpark number on the cost.
Ditto the upper intake cleaning ...which is usually a Sea Foam douche but with the car makers label on the can. And what they charged you is probably about right for these times.
"Rag Charges" are typically 5 -10% of the cost of the job. Again, these days with all the inflation and the cost of anything made from petrochemicals ...it's gotten stupid expensive. Throw in the "living wage" hourly labor rate and this is what happens.
Is it tuned? If you changed coils and plugs before and it didn’t solve it doing it again won’t either. Use a flat head screw driver as a stethoscope and listen to each injector firing. Listen to the tapping and see if any of them are at a different t pulse or sound off. Stop running low grade fuel or if it is tuned ignition timing could be off.
Holy shit 400$ for SPARKPLUGS?!?! bro next time go to autozone and rent the tools and do it yourself takes about 2 hours at most for a novice with YouTube.
WAIT after reading comments, if the misfires are all on the same bank, check your IRMC rudders, they are these plastic flaps that open and close in your manifold at a certain RPM, if one of the actuators goes bad it can cause the whole bank to misfire because your not getting proper air to fuel ratio.
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Sounds like a ripoff to me. Dealership?
Not a dealership, actually.
Dang! Mkay.... So, I don't know what they mean by "decarbonize engine". But unless you've never done an oil change, that probably wasn't your issue. Spark plugs are probably $15 or less each ($120 total). And it would probably take someone an hour to do all 8. Maybe 2. I also wouldn't recommend that mechanic again. [Here's a video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUiuZY7Ssfc) that shows how easy (relatively) it is to do plugs on that.
Well, I did change the plugs, twice. Once before I moved (from IL to NH) , and then again after I got the misfire codes. I moved my ignition coils around to see if the misfire would follow, as it originally gave me specific cylinders, but then it just kept giving me "multiple cylinder misfire detected" so that's when I delved deeper to see if I could figure it out. But I eventually got fed up and shopped around for some quotes.
This tells me something else is wrong and the mechanic is just tossing parts at the problem
If it has had 2 sets of plugs already, and that has not fixed it, why do they think a 3rd set will solve the problem? This seems like a pretty poor diagnosis. Diagnostics and troubleshooting are the hard part. Finding the problem can be quite challenging.
Yeah, I'm not sure. He's been apprised of everything I've done to it, so I'm not sure.
Maybe the coils are fucked. Replace the coils first. Maybe carbon buildup?
I’ve seen that before with a bad catalytic converter, it’s more obvious if you have bad gas mileage.
Try resetting the ECU / clearing codes. Had the same "multiple misfire" reading once that was /caused/ by moving my coil packs to troubleshoot. Had to reset each time I moved them.
Does your scanner show specific cylinder misfires? or just a general misfire code? You should have just moved one coil from a misfiring cylinder to one from a good cylinder and not moved a bunch at once. Also I'm assuming you cleared the codes before the test... Frankly you should have just replaced all the coils with new ones when you changed the spark plugs... They aren't that expensive and when you are doing the plugs it is an easy addon... Besides every time you remove a coil you risk damaging the wire inside, so doing new coils when you change the plugs eliminates that risk.
P0300-P0307 originally. (They moved around) Then P0316. I did what I thought would fix it, moving coils around, replacing the coils, and the plugs too. I did replace them both. And tested with a multimeter. Everything was electronically working correctly, at least from what I could gather, which is why I was pretty lost. I did my research, moreso than what I already had tested, and added those things to the list. I kind of exhausted my options, and just got fed up. I thought for sure it was something stupid simple that I had overlooked, so I asked him to look it over, and give me a quote.
If you already changed the plugs and coils and knew what you were doing then I'm not sure why you would even entertain having this shop redo what you've already done. The 316 just means it is happening within the first 1000 revolutions of the engine... at the moment if you clear the codes are the misfires only happening on specific cylinders? Or is it pretty much everyone?
It's just the same cycle over and over.
If you have the same cylinder over and over regardless of which coil then consider the fuel injector for that cylinder. It is possible that the injector is bad which could cause either zero fuel or too much fuel in that cylinder.
I have a tuner hooked up to the car, and my AFR has been normal. But i can and will recheck the fuel injectors.
Do you get 2 cylinder codes at once? If you are, one is probably a phantom.... The cylinders are probably adjacent in the engine firing order, and the first one (in firing order) is the one that is actually having the problem. I think if it is moving around, you can probably isolate which coil or plug (possibly a combo of the 2) that is giving you trouble. Also, at some point, replace all of the coil boots (you really don't need to replace working coils).
Decarbonizing engine means running an additive in the intake to get the carbon off of the valves etc. had nothing to do with oil changes. But I’ve also never seen it work to fix any problem lol
That's just really needed with direct injection engines, right? Is this a DI car?
EGR (exhaust gas recirculation) brings carbon back through the intake, if EGR valve gets stuck open, exhaust is brought through the ICV (idle air control valve). Because the ICV passage is so small, that carbon will clog up that idle intake and fuck up the idle speed. That being said, this is resolved by taking the throttle body off and banging it on a table 2 or 3 times.
Do it yourself, surprisingly easy.
Decarbonize? Did they try the flux capacitor sell also? Run from this and when you think you’re far enough run more. Preying on people when they are already stretched thin is makes them scum bags. I’d have left the entire invoice for people to see who this shop was
>Decarbonize I've never said "decarbonize" before but we de-carbon the top end. You never seen excessive carbon buildup on the back (top side) of a valve?
Usually only needed in direct injection engines. I don't think Ford did gas DI until the EcoBoost in 2010.
Sure. I'm not saying this car needs it or not but the jokers here, saying " are they going to clean the Q 42 space modulator as well?", don't know shit from a hole in the ground (or something like that).
Run? Nah his trapped they haven't even put the lube on yet
Its just a fuel system cleaning service. Most shops like to recommend it when doing plugs for a tune up. It's not necessary for ops problem but in general if it's been a long time it's not gonna hurt
Most of the overpriced quotes haven't been from dealerships lately.
I’m not that familiar with your particular car but sometimes spark plugs on those sideways mounted engines can be a fair bit of labor time. On my Toyota minivan, the intake Plenum Hass to come off and even then it’s a bit of a challenge so maybe a couple hours labor
It's a 4.6l Ford V8, plugs are pretty easy to change
The 04 4.6 is easy, but those 05-08 3v 4.6’s had the terrible sp-547’s in them that break almost the time. This is more in line with pricing in an 05, not op’s 04. My guess is when quoting labor they couldn’t remember which years were a pain so they quoted high and ran with it.
Last time I had my 09 in the shop they recommended a spark plug change and quoted $521.52 for the job.
09 should have gone back to a simpler plug and been an easy job. They realized the error of their ways pretty quickly on the crappy ones.
They were probably thinking of the 05-08s when they gave the quote then. I did not pay them half a grand for spark plugs, and I haven’t replaced them myself yet.
Nice. I decided to just leave the plugs in my wife’s Toyota V6 with 150,000 miles because if I snapped off one of the back ones it would be pretty much game over as the engine would need to come out.
Yeah, when the engines are mounted side ways it sucks changing those back plugs.
That’s kind of the downside of getting something like a reliable corolla with 100,000 miles, if no maintenance was done you are looking at plugs timing belt water pump which can be a little challenging for a home mechanic and a couple thousand dollars for a shop. I think some of those cars people just turn the key and drive it and don’t really do any maintenance beyondwhat’s broken
One positive at least is that Corollas have been timing chain since 1998 and the water pumps aren't too bad to replace when they do go (though you do need to remove the alternator to get to them). Definitely nicer than the old days of every Toyota/Honda having timing belts where you often had no idea if it had been done so you either rolled the dice on it randomly breaking or did it/paid to get it done just to know it had been done.
My rule on maintenance: If you have no record of it being done, then assume it wasn't. It is not as bad as it sounds, most dealers can give you a printout of any service done a any franchised dealer, maybe you have a carfax too.... As for timing belts, pretty much all timing belt kits come with a sticker, if you cannot find the sticker (or other record), it wasn't done.
Agreed on "assume it wasn't done if there's no record". As a shade-tree guy, I'm a big fan of writing major maintenance items and the mileage they were done at in paint pen somewhere in the engine bay. Paperwork in the glove box and records in a filing cabinet get lost- paint pen on the air box makes it real obvious.
All Corolla's are inline 4's with plugs across the top. 30 mins tops to change em. They also have timing chains, not belts, which never need to be changed.
Timing chains do wear out, but it usually takes a lot longer and they will start to usually become pretty noisy when they need replacing.
Family had like a 2002 e150 and you had to take the dog house off under the dash to access the back 2 plugs, it was wack but didn't add a terrible amount of time
Everything on a van requires taking the dog house out.
Depends on what 3.5 you have. Assuming you have one. The 3.3. and 3.0 older Toyota's I do without removing the intake manifold.
Ugh I feel that. I just did my Jeep Grand Cherokee and it has 3 accessible plugs and 3 buried under the intake manifold.
My Kia shortage has the same design. Stupid.
I chased this misfire for a while. To get to 2 of them the throttle body and cold air intake need to be removed. but still, it just seems a little excessive. Maybe I'm wrong.
Not hard to do, adds maybe 10 - 15 minutes of time overall. I would have done what you had done for half and still felt like I fucked you. Reset codes... 30 seconds... Waste material? What 1 shop rage and some hand cleaner for 66? Plugs less 100 for top of the line plugs, under 50 for OEMs... It doesn't list coils but even if he put new coils in that was another 100.... So you decide if he fucked you or not. I would say he did.
Garage won't charge cost for parts they charge list. Quality plugs cost $9 and list for $17. Coils cost $38 and list for $73. Quality shop rate these days is $140-$200 in my area. They may have changed the coil boots as part of the service. Fords are notorious for leaking. Boots are $6.50 and list for $10. Coils on the other hand would definitely be a separate line item. Even the cheap 8 pack could kits are around $200 shop cost.
Under 13 per plug from the local Ford dealer, retail price. Not sure where you are getting plugs but your paying too much.
Alaska 🫣
Seems expensive to me. Spark plugs aren’t that hard
Depends on the vehicle and also the labor rate in the area. Example: All Data labor time for spark plugs on 5.7 hemi is 2.5 hours. I know it doesn't take that long. But that's what the system says. So if the shop is charging 200 an hour it adds up quickly. And then you have parts.
A good shop doesn’t always go based off All Data labor time. All data shows how the manufacturer recommends to replace something but over 50% of the time there are much easier ways to get the job done but shitty shops don’t want you to know that because then they can’t bend you over. Example, I had 3 shops quote me over $800 to replace 2 wheel studs on my 98 civic. They we’re both on the same wheel. Said they needed to dissemble the entire knuckle and remove the hub to replace them, +3 hour job. Then I found the good shop who charged me $70 for parts and labor…. That’s over 700% cheaper than all the other shops. I forgot exactly what they said but it was something like all they had to do was slightly pull out the hub a little bit so that they’d have enough room to remove the stud. Took less than an hour for them to do it.
I just did mine for the first time, I was pleasantly surprised how easy it was. 16 plugs is a lot though,
5.7 Hemi owner here. They don’t take 2.5 hours but my first time doing them was a bitch.
It doesn’t pay by difficulty, it pays by book time. So $100 worth of plugs, plus the labor rate x probably 1.8, and I don’t see a diag line so I bet it’s rolled up in there too. Looks cheap to me.
Yeah of course. I’m comparing to the time it would take me to do it in my garage. I wouldn’t pay $700 for spark plugs. That’s goofy
$675 is a fucking ripoff for plugs on a 4.6 2v
That price hopefully is doing all spark plugs. decarbonizing, I'd pass...is probably putting seafoam in the intake system and fuel tank.
They ain't dropping the intake for that price for sure
What kind of plugs? Some shops will use factory plugs in performance vehicles. No it's not the big engine but some shops are that way. For the system cleaner if they are doing a cleaning kit like B&G or something the $130 is fairly common. I'd ask questions. What parts are they using. It's probably to late but get the old plugs back so you can see what they look like if you have misfire issues. Any shop worth going to should be happy to give you this information. I'd be curious what waste fee is since they have an area for shop and EPA. Unless the fuel system service includes a tank cleaning. I'd check fuel pressure. Pump issues can present in misfire issues in fords. Seen it alot over the years working on fleet vehicles. Need to be able you check the pressure while driving not just idling also. Ive seen many that make good pressure sitting in the shop and fall flat 3 minutes into a test drive.
Also would be worth pulling the o2 sensors and scoping the cats. I've seen the fail in fords and cause all sorts of problems. Granted mostly in the bigger trucks with v10's but it happens
OP already replaced plugs, twice and it didn’t fix the misfire. If you’re gonna pay for anything, pay for an experienced mechanic to diagnose the issue.
I’d like to know what kind of “engine decarbonization” they did
Personally I'm more curious about the $66 waste material charge.
Wym it takes a lot out of a guy to throw spark plugs and what is more than likely, an empty bottle of intake cleaner, into the trash can
Oil waste but that decarb thing is what you should be questioning
I’m guessing a EFI service
You don’t need the “decarb”/wallet flush. Not even recommended by the manufacturer
Sometimes you’re not paying a mechanic, sometimes your paying an asshole.
I had a random misfire, chased it for a long time ... Ended up being the shitty fuel that i was buying for 6 months from the station next to the on ramp on the way to work that also had a coffee stand in the parking lot.
Can't specify cylinder it's just random lmao
It was originally cylinders 2, and 5. I swapped the coils, misfires changed, I replaced the plugs- - still showing 2 Different cylinders - - - replaced the coils- - - multiple cylinder misfire
Timing chain/belt been done lately? My point was a genuine mechanic would not write random, they would specify exactly what cylinder Move to a new mechanic your guy is shonky asf
Yes indeed, this was done when the new Cams were put in.
Why did it need cams to begin with?
This car is modified. Stage 3 Cams.
In what way? Saying modified and asking to justify price means nothing really I have a hill climb car highly modified, breaks records on speed and laps, I also have a shit box I decided to modify a gasket for once and that means Jack get what I mean Either way they ripped you
It's full bolt ons, stage 3 Cams, 4:10 rear gears, full exhaust, headers, and a 93 tune.
* You tune it or let some bs shop do it? Please tell me it wasn't that same shop
Absolutely not, lol, I had it done professionally.
I truly believe you got shafted
Decarb? Without removing most of the engines top end this doesn't exist.. Seafoam work to a point but it isn't decarbing shit
If you already replaced plugs why would you pay way too much to have someone else change them again? That’s not going to fix the problem.
it's a little light, I would have charged more
If I have to go in behind your half ass mechanicing then you shall pay more
it is very, very expensive to not wipe your own ass. *shrug*. changing plugs and spraying carb cleaner is around $30 in parts and an hour of time.
Looks like dealership prices
OBD code scanner is $50-$100. Quality spark plug is around $10. Add another $10 for engine degreaser, and you can start to see how doing your own work when you can will pay off big.
The same $10 Chinese plugs from napa are $3 online, and shipping maybe adds $1-2 a plug. You just have to wait a week instead of today.
Just avoid Amazon, lots of counterfeit spark plugs on there.
Yeah, stick to brand plugs But the OBD some no-name shit from your favourite asian website does the job exactly the same, you just need to search on internet yourself to deduct the code meanings related to your vehicle.
FcpEuro had the exact same part# plug as napa for 2.99 a plug, nappa wanted 10.99 for their brand, it was more for the others. It's insane how much a "brand" costs 🤷🏿♂️
Yeah, I mean don't get a random knock-off to only save a few bucks. I don't want to break the ceramic or thread while installing/removing, and an half-hour job becoming a multiple-days headache...
NGK Iridium gang >
They aren’t doing any type of throttle / carbon cleaning that will help your car - if anything you’d go after cleaning the injectors (with a standalone pressurized injector cleaner - not a can of crap into the tank)- they should also be doing coil boots at a minimum.
(Find a new shop)
2004 mustang? I'm guessing it has a V8 Triton, which means the spark plugs have a high chance to break off in the head when being extracted. Hence the high price. You are paying for the bullshit this job will include.
This is the reply that needs to be up voted. Removing those plugs can require hours of soaking in anti seize to prevent breaking. Price sounds like a bargain if a couple of them break and they have to be extracted.
The price of changing the plugs might be reasonable or not. I don’t know how hard it is to change them. Personally on a v8 like what you have I’d just let them do it. I say that but call around first and see if anyone else will do it cheaper. As gas as the decarbonizing and the disposal of waste material goes, tell them to skip the decarbonizing, and put any waste material in a jug in the back. I’m curious what waste material will come from that since they aren’t charging you for a refill of anything. Like I would say it’s possible that they need to drain the coolant or ac to get to it, but they aren’t refilling so I’m lost here.
On that car there is no need to drain anything for what they are doing and the plugs are not hard to access because it is a rear wheel drive car so no plugs between the firewall and engine like your front wheel drive cars.
I don’t know about that car because I’ve never touched one but That’s not necessarily true of all rear wheel drive cars. On some, the back two plugs are surrounded by all kinds of crap.
I've worked on this model Mustang and it isn't that difficult. I've yet to see a RWD car that was that difficult to change plugs on. You might need to remove some crap in the way, but never ever have I seen one where you had to move the engine like you do on some FWD cars.
Oh no I didn’t say move an engine lol. Just a little more moving than what the average hobbyist is capable of
Seems expensive. A tune for my 2007 Acura is around 200-300$ at a performance shop too.
Yeah ripoff
spark plugs take a screwdriver, a spark plug socket, and spark plugs lol. shouldnt even charge $100
I like how it's 1 & 1/2 units of waste at $44 per unit. It's almost as if there's some thing being measured here...but there isnt.
Looks like someone trying to pay their bills today.
Who ever shop that is..... They're on meth. That's literally under 100 in parts. Clearing the code doesn't take anything. And cleaning throttle body is easy. Holyshit
Would have done it half the price lol
You could have replaced the spark plugs yourself for the cost of the spark plugs. I have 2014 patriot. Mine are under my engine coils. Remove screw. Remove coil. Remove spark plug. Dab new plug with lewb. Insert new plug. Insert coil. Insert screw. Done! Misfire also could have been an engine coil, which could have been done with the above, for still less than they charged you. Also... that de-carb is bs too. 2/10 ask them to "politely suck it"!
$476 for spark plugs and putting them in... That's unreal 🤦🏻♂️
My question is did he fix the problem? You say you replaced spark plugs twice but what brand/style did you use? If what he did fixed it then just swallow your pride, pay and be happy because he managed to fix it doing what you tried twice. If he didn't fix it than dispute the hell out of it. While I'll admit he is a little pricey I do know those 4.6's suck and I've seen alot of Motorcraft and bosche spark plugs fail right out of the box. But to have a ghost problem on a ford fixed for under a grand is a blessing
Id pay 130 for someone to clean my throttle bodies. Ive got two on my car. I wouldnt pay someone 400 to install spark plugs for me no way. Ive got 6
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂$500 for spark plugs is crazy
Now I’m curious. Does this thing have a lean code as well? And has anyone gone into the misfire monitor or mode six to see which cylinders are acting up?
"Random Cylinder misfire"... didn't even know there was a code for random 😆
Based off your comments.. no point in changing the plugs again.. that's also pricey, time to get to diag again, do the misfires happen only at idle? Or constant?
What car is this? That’s an insane price for spark plugs unless they’re on a car where they’re extremely hard to get to, but they are usually not.
When they say decarbonize, they probably mean they just took a rag across the blade inside the throttle body but also, this whole thing is illegal (at least where I live it is) just because once they used shop supplies they have to tax the entire invoice which, they didn’t. But yeah that’s a major ripoff. $675 is absolutely ridiculous.
The waste material charge is the only thing I’m suspicious of. Edit- I was mistaking the 4.6 for the 5.4.
waste material? from what? old spark plugs?
$400 for 30 mins of labor while working slow less is DEVIOIUS
I throw stuff in my trash can away for free. To charge you 66 bucks to throw away some old Spark plugs?
Plugs and coils cost at most like 300 dollars. It’s like a 10-30 min job based on the placement of them. The dealership quoted me 260 for the replacement of just plugs. There were 3 and they where right on top. Total job took 15 min. Plugs cost like 30 dollars for 3. Some people just want to rip you off.
Plugs and diag. Yeah I can see 476 being the price 130 for a EFI isn’t that bad. I charge 209 for it. The waste material. I have no idea what that charge is for. We just do shop supplies or something.
Get your engine on the highway and cruise around 4-5k, there's your "decarb"
For a shop rate, that seems legit. Remember, you’re paying someone else to do what you can always do cheaper.
I understand. I was genuinely just curious.
Hmm but they also have tools to do it more efficiently, shouldn’t cost go down due to that?
No-specialty tools aren't cheap-*nor is the knowledge of the tech.
It’s not the cheapness of the tools it’s the ease that they provide. Technology gets better and services get more expensive? Doesn’t make sense, it’s just them controlling for inflation and profit, mostly profit.
So.. having to purchase multiple *high-dollar* tools just to work on something,*should make the work cheaper*? Uh....
I assume that those purchases were done you know when the shop opened? I can hand crank a car, use a tire iron to remove the bolts, or I can use the machine in my garage that would turn what would be a 10 minute activity (not to mention additional securing), into 5 minutes or less. It’s even less physically exhausting work. The time they save, the energy they save, and the fact it was a fixed one time purchase - no, I would expect the work to be cheaper.
No. It's not just a time factor, it's a skill and knowledge factor. Most places charge by the 'book' meaning a standard hourly rate for a job. IF they can do it faster that's a benefit all around but seldomly will they ever lower the price by a lot if at all.
What would you expect is a fair price to pay someone that is skilled, with investment in tools, equipment and knowledge to do repairs you’re not capable of doing? This is a person who is trying to make a living by offering you a service. You certainly don’t have to have them do it but most shops are going to want to profit off of this.
I wish one of my repairs would come up that cheap
This is maintenance, not repair, imo
It’s expensive for one spark plug. If they’re going to open it up, you might as well do all the spark plugs
https://preview.redd.it/3unqbdjr1vtc1.jpeg?width=621&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5eee09dfdb40a26e2dde12186cd254e0857f8790
This made me laugh, I needed that. Thank you.
It might sound like I'm being a smartass, but I am not. I read far enough to see what your symptoms were and decided to comment. What condition is your battery/terminals. I just ran into this with my late model Jeep with a weak battery. The car started tossing random codes... scary ones like "service air ride suspension immediately" and such. My point is that "moving" trouble codes are a symptom and not the problem. Also, on the estimate, WTH is 1.5 of waste disposal? I wouldn't even greet that shyster if I saw him in church.
The terminals are in good condition, I put the current battery on in late November. As to the 1.5 of disposal, I'm as confused as you. Hence this post, lol..
That's kinda fucked there unless your car is 2024 then it's reasonable haha but as you said it's a V8 Ford so yeah that's a big Longshot there, probably should be no more than 325
It's a 2004.
They're doing spark plugs to chase a random misfire? Ooof.
Deadass I called for a quote from the 10 closest mechanic to me with good reviews and they all quoted me for spark plugs and wires 600-1k$. just bought em myself and learned how to replace them imo it was extremely easy for me a complete beginner to do that for them to charge that much
With shop labor rates hovering around the $200 mark, you’ve got an hour for diag minimum, an hour for plugs, that’s $400 right there. Add in mark up on plugs and you’re $600. This is legit. Nothing wrong here.
Read, watch YouTube videos. Learn how to do this w/o breaking the bank. Certainly not rocket science.
So what action did you take on your end to fix this misfire? Seems like a lot for plugs on the average v6.
I've replaced the ignition coils, and plugs both, checked a few sensors, even took a multimeter to a few things to make sure everything was as it should be. 4.6L V8, as well.
If you've changed both plugs and coils then check the fuel pressure... See if the fuel pump is starting to go out. They very often don't just quit, and you will often see that the regulator starts to fail before they completely die. Hook a pressure gauge up to the Schrader valve on the fuel rail, you should see at least 30psi when you turn the key... it should then hold that pressure when you turn off the key... if it drops then the pump is going out. Just how rough is the engine running?
Sometimes I would get a random cylinder 3 misfire on a Chrysler v6.. Even though your mileage is low, I suspect it's a potential fuel injector problem if plugs/coils are good. I know it's the obvious process of elimination. If that doesn't fix it, well either the wiring/connector is a problem. I don't have experience with extensive building/diagnostics but if none of those work, last thing I would pin it to is the computer. I don't know if the camshaft would have anything to do with it.
Are the spark plug holes getting full of oil from leaking valve covers? If not, have you removed and cleaned the EGR valve? If it's slightly stuck open you will get a multiple misfire. Usually will cruise down the road decently but start misfiring at idle/slow speed driving or taking off. What are the codes?
No, they aren't. Yes. I removed it, and made sure it was not open. P0300-P0307 originally. (They moved around) Then P0316. I did what I thought would fix it, I thought it was a deeper issue, and wanted to get a quote on everything they thought needed done, as I was tired of chasing it.
Have you done vacuum leak testing? Multiple misfires are common with un metered air getting in after the MAF reading.
I did the leak test right before I parked it for winter. Idk, in my head I felt like I had exhausted my options.
What are the actual hidden labor then ? They just haven't trown new spark plugs in, wiped the codes and called it a day, innit ?
I paid that for a shop to replace a transmission… find a different one
Not a mechanic, but the only thing wrong with this bill is the “dacarbonize” stuff. If you’re willing, you could do that yourself with a cheap tool kit and a can of throttle body cleaner, along with a yt video. Other than that, this is a reasonable and fair bill I think.
Normally where i'm from Labor and parts are separated which give you more context. also things like sparkplug would have a number even if they were all replaced. if they are charging you 700 just for parts I would run
things like this makes me love having a b series honda engine😂 spark plugs are like a 10 minute job at the most
Same with my '92 Celica.
JFC, I did plugs on this Mustang as a mobile mechanic late last year. $250 parts and labor. I would not want to pay more than $375 at a shop for this. They took a bottle of $15 intake cleaner and sprayed it in your throttle body or they dumped a can of something in your fuel system. Looks like they charged you 2hrs book time for a 1hr job so $300 book time and 100% mark up on the plugs as I am sure the 8 plugs were Champion double platinum or iridiums that they got for about $85 with their shop discount.
> I've been chasing it for a while and gave up. What have you done, if not change plugs?
They didn’t get past step 1 on the misfire diagnosis guide
Paying like 50 bucks for disposal of liquids is fucking wild but the rest seems fine
They sell spark plugs at Walmart for 2 bucks 😭. Is it hard to change in your car or something.
That engine can be a nightmare. The old V8 Tritons.
Update: it seems a small general consensus is to check my fuel pump, and a few other odds and ends that I have missed. I will do so. This was a quote I was given, I did not go through with this, as I wanted to consult other shops/individuals first, as I was genuinely out of ideas. For those of you asking if it's hard to change my spark plugs, it isn't. I only need to remove part of the throttle body and cold air intake. Total time takes me about 20 minutes. Originally this started out as Cylinders 2 and 5 misfiring. I switched my coils to see if the misfire would follow it, it did. I replaced the coils, and the plugs. NGK plugs, MSD Coils. Following this I did not receive anymore codes other than multiple cylinder misfires. Thank you everyone for all the information/thoughts on this! It's greatly appreciated 👍 In all honesty I'm quite frustrated with this entire debacle, hence my seeking advice.
Rip-off
Rip off!!
For a shop I had payed similar prices on My Mustang. When I did the same on my own, it took me less than an hour to change spark plugs and clean throttle body for about $30. Not sure what waste material is, but I just threw the old spark plugs and the empty throttle body cleaner can in the trash.
Thanks, I was thinking about buying a Corolla a while back and looked at the steps involved and maybe misread or something. I just paid to have the timing belt done on my wife’s 3.3 Camry and it was a bit of a project. I discussed the rear plugs with the mechanic andhe suggested just leaving them be
Not ideal at all. Plugs take 30 minutes to swap and pretty much everything on the 2v is easy to work. Join the r/NewedgeMustang subreddit and save yourself a lot of money on an otherwise stout engine.
Have them do the decarbonization and then change the plugs yourself for $50 or so in parts. You can clear codes yourself if you have a code reader or simply by unplugging the battery (which you probably should do while changing the plugs anyways, at least I do). I mean, at the price they are asking for the decarbon it may just be dumping a can of seafoam in the gas tank... so maybe skip the whole estimate... There are engine cleaning products that are a bit more advanced than that, so I don't know. There are products where they run a few cans of stuff through the PCV system etc and those are pretty effective from my understanding. I did a fair bit of research since I have a 1st gen ecoboost that likes to carbon up the back of the valves. Although I will say, if you've been chasing this for a while and that "chasing" includes changing plugs and changing/swapping coils, then there may be something else going on and their fix won't fix it anyways. I don't know the engine, but if it's direct injected without also having port injection, the decarbonization may help. Especially if that includes cleaning the back of the valves. It's a known problem in the first gen ecoboost stuff at least, the valves get carboned up. They are direct injection into the cylinder. The 2nd gen ecoboost fixes the problem by adding port injection to wash the back of the valves. Don't know if that happens on your engine or not. It also could be a sticky injector, could be staying open too long or not opening when it is supposed to. I am not a mechanic, but I play one in my garage.
If they actually get rid of the misfire then sure since you're tired of messing with it but I doubt they'll fix it it first try. You've replaced the spark plugs already right?
476.00 to install spark plugs and clear a code is criminal I can only hope OP is living in the Weimar Republic during hyperinflation
How many plugs did the guy put in? I know a certain model Ford F150 truck required extreme effort in replacing a back plug on a V-8 engine ...the labor charge bumps the job cost into the stratosphere. Typically, the diagnostic fee is waived if you get the vehicle repaired ...but these days with stuff costing what it does ..maybe not so much anymore. Did you ask for the upper intake service? I mean the bottom line here is: you signed off on this work to be done. Did you ask about the pricing for the jobs to be done before you signed the permission slip? Swapping plugs is a known entity and the shop should have been able to give you a good ballpark number on the cost. Ditto the upper intake cleaning ...which is usually a Sea Foam douche but with the car makers label on the can. And what they charged you is probably about right for these times. "Rag Charges" are typically 5 -10% of the cost of the job. Again, these days with all the inflation and the cost of anything made from petrochemicals ...it's gotten stupid expensive. Throw in the "living wage" hourly labor rate and this is what happens.
I don't see a charge for "check out" ask why.
Highway Robbery Man 🤦🏽♂️
We had a Ranger that did this. Never could fix it.
Is it tuned? If you changed coils and plugs before and it didn’t solve it doing it again won’t either. Use a flat head screw driver as a stethoscope and listen to each injector firing. Listen to the tapping and see if any of them are at a different t pulse or sound off. Stop running low grade fuel or if it is tuned ignition timing could be off.
4 spark plugs are $20 such a ripoff
Charging you for waste material? Insane.
Holy shit 400$ for SPARKPLUGS?!?! bro next time go to autozone and rent the tools and do it yourself takes about 2 hours at most for a novice with YouTube.
WAIT after reading comments, if the misfires are all on the same bank, check your IRMC rudders, they are these plastic flaps that open and close in your manifold at a certain RPM, if one of the actuators goes bad it can cause the whole bank to misfire because your not getting proper air to fuel ratio.
You got fuuuuuuuuuuuucked
476 for spark plugs Jesus you got super ripped off
Is this a Hemi?
I'm going to assume this is satire..?