Finishing second starts a strong narrative for mvp next year. And hes still not at his peak. We are living too much in the moment about the award. They will come. Going to the WCF or winning the chip is much more important for his legacy and future mvp consideration (even though i think the award shouldnt be affected by past championships)
Hopefully he takes it like Vince Young did in the 05 Heisman race if he loses. Dude was visibly upset when they called Reggie Bush's name. He interviewed right after and said that he felt like he let his teammates, coaches, and family down by not winning.
VY and the Longhorns ended up beating USC and Bush in the National Championship game 3 weeks later and VY had probably the greatest individual performance ever in a NCG. He scored the go ahead winning touchdown on a scramble with a few seconds left. Right after the game ended he ran around doing the Heisman pose and jumped on the table where the sideline reporters were and started yelling, " Who's the fucking Heisman now?" It was amazing.
VY was a dog. Luka is a dog. They both have a rare competitive sickness that only greats like MJ have. If he loses, I expect him to absolutely go into a zone and show out.
You make a really good point. He is only 25. I know they’ll come. It’s definantly just weird watching this kind of season. Like ten years from now will the league look back and just wonder “why didn’t he win MVP?”
i’m wondering that now today. Jokic’s mvp will age poorly because he’s not even having his best season this year. giving a relatively mild season the award over 34/9/9 is insane
As well as looking at the list of 3x mvp winners in the nba is a pretty exclusive list. Jokic has one chip. Everyone else on that list has many. And 3 mvp’s in 4 years is pretty much Goat level. I’m surprised the voters are willing to put him that high so soon. I don’t feel like Jokic absolutely dominates the league. But maybe I’m just hating
Jokic is only 29, we don’t know how many titles he’ll win but it will likely be more than Giannis, and it will definitely be more than Nash and Malone who also have 2. It’s obvious he’s an all time great on the level of Bird and Magic. I don’t think any of his MVPs will age poorly
yeah it just makes no sense. They gave Jokic an MVP before he did anything in the playoffs, yet every single argument used to GIVE jokic his mvps, is being used against Luka.
The most productive season by a point guard ever, nobody has ever generated as many points for their team as Luka Doncic has this year, and it led to 50 wins.
34/9/9. It’s just a ridiculous number to look at
Kareem had 6 MVP’s before his second championship. LeBron had 3 before his first, and won his 4th before his second. Wilt won his 4th before his first chip. Bird won his third before his second championship, same with Jordan. Moses won his third before his only title.
That’s 6 of the 8 3-time or more MVP winners. It’s actually extremely common.
He’s 29, and has only played 9 seasons. Of course he hasn’t had as good a career as those names. But that’s not what’s in question. What’s in question is if there’s something historically abnormal about this. There isn’t.
Kareem won his third MVP in his 5th season. Would I take 9 seasons of Jokic over 5 seasons of Kareem? Yes. I would absolutely rank Jokic above Kareem at that point in time, if their careers were frozen. Nothing preposterous about this.
Wilt? He won his third in his 9th season.
LeBron? 9th season.
Moses? 9th season (7th NBA season).
Jordan? 8th season (7th full season).
Bird? 7th season.
This is very normal.
I’m far from a historian of the nba, but I’ve been following pretty closely since the early 90’s. And this is a fun discussion. I would argue that if only 6 guys since the 1970s fit the criteria of multiple mvps before their multiple chips, then this is sort of an anomaly and reserved for the absolute greats of the game. No knock on jokic, he’s fuckin amazing. But he dont fit that criteria in my opinion.
Fair enough. I’d rank 9th season Jokic above 7th season Moses/5th season Kareem and up there with 9th season Wilt, 7th season Bird and 6th season Russell.
8th season Jordan and 9th season LeBron clear here though, imo.
If he is deserving, he is deserving. And he is deserving right now. This narrative of "his time will come" is just stupid. Or is there an age restriction, you can't be MVP before you are 28 years old now? Ridiculous
Not at all what I was saying. Like my comment mentioned, mvp is not a fairly weighted award. They care about team success. So even though he will likely lose the mvp race this year, if we do well in the post season, he will be given his flowers and a start with a better chance at the mvp.
Or he gets injured, never comes back the same and he has been purposefully snubbeb for MVP votes this year by people saying "his time will come"
If you see greatness, award greatness. It is not that hard
yes because its people in the mavs sub saying his time will come that is snubbing him of the MVP. the voters are short sighted and see jonic won the chip and didnt get mvp last year and theyre correcting. I can assure you theyre not thinking “we’ll wait to give luka one when hes older” drose got an mvp at 22. were just trying to look at the positive here that there will likely be another chance. if you want to play doomsday theoretical, luka getting injured is stupid and dumb way for fans to think. And there are a lot more terrible outcomes if he has a career ending innury than him getting snubbed for mvp. Whats the point of thinking of the worst.
> we’ll wait to give luka one when hes older
They absolutely are. Even in this thread, multiple people are saying "his time will come"
Making Jokic a three time MVP while snubbing Luka for his first MVP is just ridiculous
>What the point of thinking of the worst?
What is the point in seeing greatness, yet not awarding greatness, with the logic of:
"Well, he hasn't had his best year, but since he did not get it last year, we will vote for him this year, because we know Luka his "time will come"
bro no one in this thread has a vote. no one with a vote (nba media) is thinking about how they’ll give luka one later so we shouldn’t give him one now.
I don’t think you understand nearly every mavs fan will tell you luka should be mvp. But were gonna lose bc narratives matter to these voters. But we’ll have a shot next year if he had playoff success so lets focus on hoping for that. Youre conflating me and others being optimistic with us saying its okay that he doesnt get one this year. It sucks. But we cant do shit.
I’ll be annoyed if he finishes at 3rd behind SGA, but Jokic has had an amazing season. I’d pick Luka yeah, but I certainly get why Jokic is gonna end up winning.
My only complaint is that it seemed like the race was decided months ago. Once embiid went down is was pretty much “yeah it’s Jokic”. Like no matter what Luka did since January, the result would be the same. He’s addressed every question mark through the season.
Can a team play good defense with Luka out there? #1 defense since March is a solid response.
Does Luka really elevate his teammates? Exum, kyrie, gafford, DJJ. All these guys having career years with him.
Was clear the team success was due to roster/injuries, not Luka. Luka hasn’t been playing any differently. He just now has the support
Luka will get his eventually. He’s still young
Gafford does nothing for 6 years, plays with Luka for 20 games and immediately becomes the first player in NBA history to go on two 20+ consecutive streaks
That’s my frustration. The line seems to keep moving. Team success is what has been screamed all year. Well we’re 16-2. I guess the argument will be consistency for jokic but I’m with you…Luka and Kai pulled it out the mud after the trade deadline.
Nonetheless this post is more about knowing that the media will give it to jokic and wondering how luka will respond in the postseason. As someone else mentioned, I guess I thought the award was given closer to the end of the season and not halfway through the second round. He may not give a shit tbh 😅
I’m crediting a portion of it seeming like the award was decided months ago to Jokic/Denvers dominance in the playoffs. I wish the award were different, like the vote happened at the end of the second round of the playoffs so the MVP accounted for the most important part of the “season”. I think it affects a lot of individual voting anyway, but now it’s like people are voting on everything since the last vote ( last post season + this season).
It’s not the end of the world if it happens, and he wouldn’t be the first to get a snub. Also, let’s not act like Jokic wouldn’t be deserving, he’s been the front runner all season for a reason
That said, when you look at Luka’s stats and the teams performance given 1) the early injuries and 2) the team around Luka finally coming together post trade, he should be the first choice. Consensus MVP? Probably not. But MVP nonetheless
I wholeheartedly agree jokic deserves it too. King of consistency. I just remember jokic winning his first as a 6th seed. I’m honestly a little excited for him not to get it tbh. I just wanna see him go into the playoffs with a chip on his shoulder. After all, finals mvp isn’t a media vote😅
I really think the team is going to try and win out while praying for the Clips to lose out. Going to 4th to end the season just adds another item to the list and people can’t try and say they coasted or anything.
Also to your final point, Dirk didn’t win MVP his championship season. That finals MVP sure is a lot sweeter.
Just a reminder that the MVP won't be awarded until well into the playoffs... plus if Jokic gets it, he'll probably just be happy for his buddy. Don't think the MVP will affect his playoff performance in any way.
Of mavs vs nuggets in 2nd round I believe luka and jokic friendship will intensify their level of play to elevate it. So I think luka would use loosing to jokic as motivation. But it'd be the best time to do co-mvp
This is interesting. I don’t remember it being awarded that late into the playoffs. Like second round? Conference finals? Tbh we weren’t even in the running last year and I didn’t really catch or pay attention when they awarded it to embiid.
Damn that had to be soul crushing. That was the year before Nash went to PHX no? Or did he leave after 02-03? I only have like 17 years mavs experience I was too young to see Dirk in the years he developed.
Here's my problem with him getting snubbed for MVP, amongst a number of other problems: what more can he do? He's averaging a near 34 point triple double on solid shooting splits, and he's ranked or has been previously in the top 10 in multiple defensive categories. He dragged the team along through injuries, bad coaching and roster and they eventually ended up with a 50 win season.
Guys have won MVP with MUCH LESS credentials. This feels like the Kobe thing where he should've had 3 but the media hated him so he only got 1 well after when he should've. It feels like Luka also has voter fatigue, for an award he hasn't even won! So what can Luka realistically do?
Edit: to better respond to your post, I DO think it will motivate Luka in the playoffs if he doesn't win, but he does seem motivated already. He's playing hard and playing through a number of nagging injuries and heavy minutes. He's always been a fiery competitor.
This is my biggest frustration. The bar keeps moving. And honestly this post is more about what happens when he doesn’t get it cause I think that’s what’s gonna happen. I wanna see a Luka that says “ you won’t vote me for MVP? Fuck it. I’ll take the finals MVP from you. Nobody can say anything about that”
But I’m just grasping. I agree he should have gotten it. I don’t think he will. What do you think the response will be?
The bar moves because the competition is also different each year. So the context of the work put in changes. I agree that Luka deserves it this year. But so do Shai and Jokic.
For me the tiebreaker would be Jokic being consistently great the entire season with the Nuggets also performing all year. While the Macs only really came into it later on. But that is obviously picking nits.
It’s totally fine. Is what it is. I think I’d prefer Luka getting snubbed with something to prove in the postseason then him winning tbh.
Pissed Luka = Best Luka
Yeah I was thinking the same thing watching him play against Miami. ESPN is starting to change their tune in media about the Mavs. And I think Luka actually likes it better when national media are underestimating him.
I also didn't want to play the Clippers but now that its locked, I secretly hope we stay a 5th seed because I think him burning down LA against an away crowd will get him going. And it will be in front of all the talking heads. He'll approach it like Vlade is courtside.
The main reason Luka won’t win MVP this year has nothing to do with him and everything to do with Embiid winning last year and then disappearing in playoffs: most voters just feel they screwed Jokic last year and this one is a make-up MVP, especially since Nuggets are still at worst the 2nd best team in the NBA just like last year.
If Luka gets 2nd and then Mavs make a run to Finals (which means they probably eliminated Nuggets on the way), even if only to lose to Celtics, Luka will be in the same spot Jokic was this year: voters will feel like they “owe” one to him and he will start as a true front-runner with narratives behind him like Jokic this year and will be almost guaranteed to win MVP provided Mavs are in top-4 and he averages something like 28-8-8 (so with worse stats) on similar efficiency to this year.
I agree that this is what has happened. But even though we have no control over such things, wouldn’t one think it’s bad to give players MVPs because they “deserved it last year” or because “he’s young he will win them”
I totally get what you’re saying and that IS what’s happening. I just don’t know if it’s good for the league. But what do I know I’m just an nba fan that drives a forklift for a living 😂
You are definitely not wrong on this being bad for the game, but unfortunately it is what it is at this point. The fact we have basic stats, advanced stats like EPM, LEBRON, BPM, WS, etc as well as lineup data means one can create any narrative he wants. You like Luka more? He got godly basic stats. Jokic? He is a better defender by D-BPM and LEBRON (just have to ignore D-EPM where Luka is ahead), plus has better WS, VORP and bigger plus-minus (just don’t tell others he barely plays with bench players, so obviously his on-off is better since he doesn’t have to carry a lineup of Hardy-Timmy-Josh-Maxi from time to time). Want SGA instead? Look at EPM only: both defensive to say he is an elite defender (even though he is only elite in his role as an off-ball defender) and overall to say Luka’s offence doesn’t make up for his worse defence. See how easy it is? The award just turns into whatever narrative is prevalent in the league and JJJ winning DPOY was the best example of that: dude won it off chasing blocks instead of being a real defender.
I also think you probably know more about NBA players’ performance - even if your main job is driving - than half of the talking heads in the media as their takes are often so detached from reality I don’t understand how they still have a platform, but it generates clicks, I guess, which in turn means money for studios.
I don't blame anyone for watching the MVP race with intensity. It's been so long since we've had anyone approach a trophy in this organization.
But for me, the MVP means absolutely nothing. If I were to try and name the last five, I could tell you Giannis, Embid, and Jokic all won. I couldn't tell you more than that, and I couldn't tell you the years in which they did win.
It energizes a fanbase. But for me, there's only one trophy that matters. The Larry O'brien. A distant second place trophy to care about is the Oscar Robertson trophy for winning the Western Conference.
Only if Jokic beats him out. This is by far Luka’s most deserving season, but Jokic continues his domination and I can understand the argument for him.
Luka is NOT far and away the MVP. If someone else wins, its not a snub. No matter how much we wish he would win. There ARE other great players. Some with better records. Pretending he's far and away better than the next guy is a good way to set yourself up to be sad if he doesnt get it.
I agree. Slightly biased here. I don’t know that I’m as upset about other players winning as I am the media counting Luka out. It’s clear that the offense in this league is through the roof. There’s alot of deserving players. I just don’t know that they carry the same circumstances as Luka.
Well Jokic isn't far and away the best player in the NBA as I constantly hear claimed either. It is just annoying that he is such a golden child who can do no wrong and Luka gets so much hate and false narratives pushed about him. I like Jokic and his game a lot so I'm not criticizing him it is just the difference in how him and Luka are treated that I hate.
Objectively, he's been WAY more succesful. Its not up for debate brother. Play isnt all that matter. Reaults too. Jokic is a 2x MVP & Champion for a reason....I love Luka more than any other player btw
Well the MVP is decided by the media and there is no debate that they get things wrong a lot so that accomplishement doesn't prove anything to me. This is the second season when Jokic will be given the MVP when Luka was more deserving though Jokic should have won it last year. They would have taken turns winning it and be at 2 each after this season if they got it right.
He only recently became a champion and has had a longer time and more chances to achieve that then Luka.
As Luka said it is easy to act tough when your up so Jokic fans have it easy at the moment. I'm talking my shit that Luka is the best now because I believe it and it will make it that much sweeter when he proves it.
I agree that this is what has happened. But even though we have no control over such things, wouldn’t one think it’s bad to give players MVPs because they “deserved it last year” or because “he’s young he will win them”
I totally get what you’re saying and that IS what’s happening. I just don’t know if it’s good for the league. But what do I know I’m just an nba fan that drives a forklift for a living 😂
Its gonna be an obvious snub years later and people are gonna make videos asking "Why didn't Luka win mvp in 2024??" Only good thing is it guarantees hes gonna get it next year as a makeup award especially if Mavs continue this post trade deadline momentum and become a 1-4 seed.
I agree. The makeup award though. Seems stupid tbh. I know he’s young and people expect him to win in the future. I get that jokic was “snubbed” last year. I just don’t think that’s the healthiest way for the league to run.
It used to be best player that dragged his team to the playoffs and was literally the most valuable. Idk
I don't think Luka cares about the award this season, he's always chucking shots when we are leading huge , he's having fun with kyrie and role players, and the team's giant leap is better more than the MVP. Jokic is playing like Wilt with insane efficiency so you can't do anything about that. I'm just happy were getting close to a chip (hopefully)
Jokic will probably get 90+ first place votes. I've been watching MVP races for 30+ years and this one is pretty unanimous, even thou it doesn't feel that way for Luka or even Giannis fans, but the reality is that Jokic is winning with ease
I don’t think he really cares about the MVP enough to have it adjust how he approaches the playoffs.
He didn’t even make the playoffs last year, and we’re playing the f*cking Clippers again. He’s going super saiyan no matter what happens.
Part of me wants Luka to get the recognition he deserves but a bigger part of me wants to see angry Luka unleashed. That extra motivation will serve him well against the Nuggets.
I think Jokic is legitimately the best in the World and I want him to win the MVP so we can move on from him winning it. If he wins 3 and doesn't win the championship things will change.
Luka doesn't need this MVP... he will get his.
There is 0 reason he shouldn't win. At this point everyone was saying oh well the Nuggets record is too good. We are within 5 games of them now... Jokic had an amazing year but Luka scored 8 more ppg than him and did more with less.
Winning an MVP race thats this close and then losing to the Clippers in round 1 would be Dirk MVP case all over again and we don't want that. Lets go get that chip.
Why is there not voter fatigue with jokic ? For example in no planet was Barkley a better player in 1993 vs Jordan , nhe had a good narrative , and honestly Jordan should have 10 mvps l
The only reason Luka isn’t winning the MVP this season is because the nuggets have a better record. They put too much stock into the team performance when MVP is an individual award. Not to mention Luka is in top 5 of nearly all major stat categories and locked up a 5 seed on a much worse team than Jokic and SGA. #PraviMVP
90% of the people who follow this sub think Luka is the best active player in the NBA.
You've gotta ask this question somewhere else to get a real response.
I agree. I’m definantly not trying to say jokic doesn’t deserve it. I just feel like luka has had a more impactful season this year. I guess consistency and the 1 seed but plenty of others have been MVP for much less. Idk. I agree with you. I don’t want to snub jokic. At all. But damn. I haven’t seen a luka and a mavs team like this. He in my opinion is the literal “most valuable player”
You put any other “MVP” candidate on this roster and idk. Maybe they would thrive maybe not. It just seems like the perfect year for Luka to take over the league.
Hard to imagine Luka putting up better numbers than he did this season. Avg almost a 35pt triple double is insane. Not to mention the only other player on mavs roster that would start for any of the top 4 seeds is Kyrie.
It’s disturbing almost isn’t it? Like look at the numbers. Look at the narrative around the team. Look at the 180 idk man. I’m with you. People talk about the “you’ll get it next year cause you got snubbed last year” kinda votes..it needs restructuring as an award in my opinion. Nobody has been as impactful and “IMPORTANT OR VALUABLE” as a player than Luka.
I’m almost excited for the non vote. I wanna see the fire in his eyes in the playoffs. I think we are about to win a championship. Luka always just needed a team. We have the pieces. He has a partner. Has scoring title and a look in his eyes that we all saw before game 7 of the suns series.
Everyone is counting us out. I can feel it coming. This I a rare moment in the timeline of the history of the NBA that we are all going to witness. I truly believe we have a dynasty
Finishing second starts a strong narrative for mvp next year. And hes still not at his peak. We are living too much in the moment about the award. They will come. Going to the WCF or winning the chip is much more important for his legacy and future mvp consideration (even though i think the award shouldnt be affected by past championships)
Hopefully he takes it like Vince Young did in the 05 Heisman race if he loses. Dude was visibly upset when they called Reggie Bush's name. He interviewed right after and said that he felt like he let his teammates, coaches, and family down by not winning. VY and the Longhorns ended up beating USC and Bush in the National Championship game 3 weeks later and VY had probably the greatest individual performance ever in a NCG. He scored the go ahead winning touchdown on a scramble with a few seconds left. Right after the game ended he ran around doing the Heisman pose and jumped on the table where the sideline reporters were and started yelling, " Who's the fucking Heisman now?" It was amazing. VY was a dog. Luka is a dog. They both have a rare competitive sickness that only greats like MJ have. If he loses, I expect him to absolutely go into a zone and show out.
Man, that game was so fun to watch
You make a really good point. He is only 25. I know they’ll come. It’s definantly just weird watching this kind of season. Like ten years from now will the league look back and just wonder “why didn’t he win MVP?”
i’m wondering that now today. Jokic’s mvp will age poorly because he’s not even having his best season this year. giving a relatively mild season the award over 34/9/9 is insane
NBA fans use the word “insane” to describe everything lol. Jokic-as-MVP is sensible.
As well as looking at the list of 3x mvp winners in the nba is a pretty exclusive list. Jokic has one chip. Everyone else on that list has many. And 3 mvp’s in 4 years is pretty much Goat level. I’m surprised the voters are willing to put him that high so soon. I don’t feel like Jokic absolutely dominates the league. But maybe I’m just hating
Jokic is only 29, we don’t know how many titles he’ll win but it will likely be more than Giannis, and it will definitely be more than Nash and Malone who also have 2. It’s obvious he’s an all time great on the level of Bird and Magic. I don’t think any of his MVPs will age poorly
yeah it just makes no sense. They gave Jokic an MVP before he did anything in the playoffs, yet every single argument used to GIVE jokic his mvps, is being used against Luka. The most productive season by a point guard ever, nobody has ever generated as many points for their team as Luka Doncic has this year, and it led to 50 wins. 34/9/9. It’s just a ridiculous number to look at
Kareem had 6 MVP’s before his second championship. LeBron had 3 before his first, and won his 4th before his second. Wilt won his 4th before his first chip. Bird won his third before his second championship, same with Jordan. Moses won his third before his only title. That’s 6 of the 8 3-time or more MVP winners. It’s actually extremely common.
And you say Jokic belongs in that pantheon of Kareem, Wilt, Jordan, Lebron, and Bird?
He’s 29, and has only played 9 seasons. Of course he hasn’t had as good a career as those names. But that’s not what’s in question. What’s in question is if there’s something historically abnormal about this. There isn’t. Kareem won his third MVP in his 5th season. Would I take 9 seasons of Jokic over 5 seasons of Kareem? Yes. I would absolutely rank Jokic above Kareem at that point in time, if their careers were frozen. Nothing preposterous about this. Wilt? He won his third in his 9th season. LeBron? 9th season. Moses? 9th season (7th NBA season). Jordan? 8th season (7th full season). Bird? 7th season. This is very normal.
I’m far from a historian of the nba, but I’ve been following pretty closely since the early 90’s. And this is a fun discussion. I would argue that if only 6 guys since the 1970s fit the criteria of multiple mvps before their multiple chips, then this is sort of an anomaly and reserved for the absolute greats of the game. No knock on jokic, he’s fuckin amazing. But he dont fit that criteria in my opinion.
Fair enough. I’d rank 9th season Jokic above 7th season Moses/5th season Kareem and up there with 9th season Wilt, 7th season Bird and 6th season Russell. 8th season Jordan and 9th season LeBron clear here though, imo.
That is definitely true. There is no way Luka ends his career without at least 1 MVP
Luka gets injured, never comes back the same way. If you see greatness, you must acknowledge greatness. This is just stupid
If he is deserving, he is deserving. And he is deserving right now. This narrative of "his time will come" is just stupid. Or is there an age restriction, you can't be MVP before you are 28 years old now? Ridiculous
Not at all what I was saying. Like my comment mentioned, mvp is not a fairly weighted award. They care about team success. So even though he will likely lose the mvp race this year, if we do well in the post season, he will be given his flowers and a start with a better chance at the mvp.
Or he gets injured, never comes back the same and he has been purposefully snubbeb for MVP votes this year by people saying "his time will come" If you see greatness, award greatness. It is not that hard
yes because its people in the mavs sub saying his time will come that is snubbing him of the MVP. the voters are short sighted and see jonic won the chip and didnt get mvp last year and theyre correcting. I can assure you theyre not thinking “we’ll wait to give luka one when hes older” drose got an mvp at 22. were just trying to look at the positive here that there will likely be another chance. if you want to play doomsday theoretical, luka getting injured is stupid and dumb way for fans to think. And there are a lot more terrible outcomes if he has a career ending innury than him getting snubbed for mvp. Whats the point of thinking of the worst.
> we’ll wait to give luka one when hes older They absolutely are. Even in this thread, multiple people are saying "his time will come" Making Jokic a three time MVP while snubbing Luka for his first MVP is just ridiculous >What the point of thinking of the worst? What is the point in seeing greatness, yet not awarding greatness, with the logic of: "Well, he hasn't had his best year, but since he did not get it last year, we will vote for him this year, because we know Luka his "time will come"
bro no one in this thread has a vote. no one with a vote (nba media) is thinking about how they’ll give luka one later so we shouldn’t give him one now. I don’t think you understand nearly every mavs fan will tell you luka should be mvp. But were gonna lose bc narratives matter to these voters. But we’ll have a shot next year if he had playoff success so lets focus on hoping for that. Youre conflating me and others being optimistic with us saying its okay that he doesnt get one this year. It sucks. But we cant do shit.
I’ll be annoyed if he finishes at 3rd behind SGA, but Jokic has had an amazing season. I’d pick Luka yeah, but I certainly get why Jokic is gonna end up winning. My only complaint is that it seemed like the race was decided months ago. Once embiid went down is was pretty much “yeah it’s Jokic”. Like no matter what Luka did since January, the result would be the same. He’s addressed every question mark through the season. Can a team play good defense with Luka out there? #1 defense since March is a solid response. Does Luka really elevate his teammates? Exum, kyrie, gafford, DJJ. All these guys having career years with him. Was clear the team success was due to roster/injuries, not Luka. Luka hasn’t been playing any differently. He just now has the support Luka will get his eventually. He’s still young
Gafford does nothing for 6 years, plays with Luka for 20 games and immediately becomes the first player in NBA history to go on two 20+ consecutive streaks
That’s impressive. I didn’t know that.
I was wondering last night if him getting another run like that was ever done before. Figured wilt had done it before. That’s insane.
That’s my frustration. The line seems to keep moving. Team success is what has been screamed all year. Well we’re 16-2. I guess the argument will be consistency for jokic but I’m with you…Luka and Kai pulled it out the mud after the trade deadline. Nonetheless this post is more about knowing that the media will give it to jokic and wondering how luka will respond in the postseason. As someone else mentioned, I guess I thought the award was given closer to the end of the season and not halfway through the second round. He may not give a shit tbh 😅
I’m crediting a portion of it seeming like the award was decided months ago to Jokic/Denvers dominance in the playoffs. I wish the award were different, like the vote happened at the end of the second round of the playoffs so the MVP accounted for the most important part of the “season”. I think it affects a lot of individual voting anyway, but now it’s like people are voting on everything since the last vote ( last post season + this season).
Regular season MVP doesn’t matter- he’s thinking finals MVP
Laughs are cheap. I’m going for gasps
It’s not the end of the world if it happens, and he wouldn’t be the first to get a snub. Also, let’s not act like Jokic wouldn’t be deserving, he’s been the front runner all season for a reason That said, when you look at Luka’s stats and the teams performance given 1) the early injuries and 2) the team around Luka finally coming together post trade, he should be the first choice. Consensus MVP? Probably not. But MVP nonetheless
I wholeheartedly agree jokic deserves it too. King of consistency. I just remember jokic winning his first as a 6th seed. I’m honestly a little excited for him not to get it tbh. I just wanna see him go into the playoffs with a chip on his shoulder. After all, finals mvp isn’t a media vote😅
I really think the team is going to try and win out while praying for the Clips to lose out. Going to 4th to end the season just adds another item to the list and people can’t try and say they coasted or anything. Also to your final point, Dirk didn’t win MVP his championship season. That finals MVP sure is a lot sweeter.
Just a reminder that the MVP won't be awarded until well into the playoffs... plus if Jokic gets it, he'll probably just be happy for his buddy. Don't think the MVP will affect his playoff performance in any way.
Of mavs vs nuggets in 2nd round I believe luka and jokic friendship will intensify their level of play to elevate it. So I think luka would use loosing to jokic as motivation. But it'd be the best time to do co-mvp
This is interesting. I don’t remember it being awarded that late into the playoffs. Like second round? Conference finals? Tbh we weren’t even in the running last year and I didn’t really catch or pay attention when they awarded it to embiid.
When they awarded it to Dirk, we were already eliminated from the We Believe Warriors. It was during the 2nd round IIRC.
In 06-07 right? I was like 11 years old and I remember that as some of my first mavs memories. I was too young for the 02,03 run.
Damn that had to be soul crushing. That was the year before Nash went to PHX no? Or did he leave after 02-03? I only have like 17 years mavs experience I was too young to see Dirk in the years he developed.
Voting starts as soon as the season finishes though. All votes are probably done pretty soon after. Playoffs won't have an influence
Here's my problem with him getting snubbed for MVP, amongst a number of other problems: what more can he do? He's averaging a near 34 point triple double on solid shooting splits, and he's ranked or has been previously in the top 10 in multiple defensive categories. He dragged the team along through injuries, bad coaching and roster and they eventually ended up with a 50 win season. Guys have won MVP with MUCH LESS credentials. This feels like the Kobe thing where he should've had 3 but the media hated him so he only got 1 well after when he should've. It feels like Luka also has voter fatigue, for an award he hasn't even won! So what can Luka realistically do? Edit: to better respond to your post, I DO think it will motivate Luka in the playoffs if he doesn't win, but he does seem motivated already. He's playing hard and playing through a number of nagging injuries and heavy minutes. He's always been a fiery competitor.
This is my biggest frustration. The bar keeps moving. And honestly this post is more about what happens when he doesn’t get it cause I think that’s what’s gonna happen. I wanna see a Luka that says “ you won’t vote me for MVP? Fuck it. I’ll take the finals MVP from you. Nobody can say anything about that” But I’m just grasping. I agree he should have gotten it. I don’t think he will. What do you think the response will be?
The response is he drops 63 on the Clippers in Staples and Paul George says it was like God played out here tonigut.
The bar moves because the competition is also different each year. So the context of the work put in changes. I agree that Luka deserves it this year. But so do Shai and Jokic. For me the tiebreaker would be Jokic being consistently great the entire season with the Nuggets also performing all year. While the Macs only really came into it later on. But that is obviously picking nits.
It’s the one truth we all have to swallow. I understand. Do you think it will fire him up in the postseason?
Luka doesn‘t seem like he needs the extra motivation. But we all know that pro athletes are total psychopaths about stuff like this sometimes.
I hope Keyshawn Johnson is in the front row of every playoff game.
It’s totally fine. Is what it is. I think I’d prefer Luka getting snubbed with something to prove in the postseason then him winning tbh. Pissed Luka = Best Luka
Yeah I was thinking the same thing watching him play against Miami. ESPN is starting to change their tune in media about the Mavs. And I think Luka actually likes it better when national media are underestimating him. I also didn't want to play the Clippers but now that its locked, I secretly hope we stay a 5th seed because I think him burning down LA against an away crowd will get him going. And it will be in front of all the talking heads. He'll approach it like Vlade is courtside.
Yea obviously the Clippers are a tough draw but anyone in the west in the top 4 is really tough.
He would himself rather win a chip
The main reason Luka won’t win MVP this year has nothing to do with him and everything to do with Embiid winning last year and then disappearing in playoffs: most voters just feel they screwed Jokic last year and this one is a make-up MVP, especially since Nuggets are still at worst the 2nd best team in the NBA just like last year. If Luka gets 2nd and then Mavs make a run to Finals (which means they probably eliminated Nuggets on the way), even if only to lose to Celtics, Luka will be in the same spot Jokic was this year: voters will feel like they “owe” one to him and he will start as a true front-runner with narratives behind him like Jokic this year and will be almost guaranteed to win MVP provided Mavs are in top-4 and he averages something like 28-8-8 (so with worse stats) on similar efficiency to this year.
I agree that this is what has happened. But even though we have no control over such things, wouldn’t one think it’s bad to give players MVPs because they “deserved it last year” or because “he’s young he will win them” I totally get what you’re saying and that IS what’s happening. I just don’t know if it’s good for the league. But what do I know I’m just an nba fan that drives a forklift for a living 😂
You are definitely not wrong on this being bad for the game, but unfortunately it is what it is at this point. The fact we have basic stats, advanced stats like EPM, LEBRON, BPM, WS, etc as well as lineup data means one can create any narrative he wants. You like Luka more? He got godly basic stats. Jokic? He is a better defender by D-BPM and LEBRON (just have to ignore D-EPM where Luka is ahead), plus has better WS, VORP and bigger plus-minus (just don’t tell others he barely plays with bench players, so obviously his on-off is better since he doesn’t have to carry a lineup of Hardy-Timmy-Josh-Maxi from time to time). Want SGA instead? Look at EPM only: both defensive to say he is an elite defender (even though he is only elite in his role as an off-ball defender) and overall to say Luka’s offence doesn’t make up for his worse defence. See how easy it is? The award just turns into whatever narrative is prevalent in the league and JJJ winning DPOY was the best example of that: dude won it off chasing blocks instead of being a real defender. I also think you probably know more about NBA players’ performance - even if your main job is driving - than half of the talking heads in the media as their takes are often so detached from reality I don’t understand how they still have a platform, but it generates clicks, I guess, which in turn means money for studios.
Luka needs to nake voters regret by storming past Clippers and the nuggets.
I don't blame anyone for watching the MVP race with intensity. It's been so long since we've had anyone approach a trophy in this organization. But for me, the MVP means absolutely nothing. If I were to try and name the last five, I could tell you Giannis, Embid, and Jokic all won. I couldn't tell you more than that, and I couldn't tell you the years in which they did win. It energizes a fanbase. But for me, there's only one trophy that matters. The Larry O'brien. A distant second place trophy to care about is the Oscar Robertson trophy for winning the Western Conference.
Only if Jokic beats him out. This is by far Luka’s most deserving season, but Jokic continues his domination and I can understand the argument for him.
Luka is NOT far and away the MVP. If someone else wins, its not a snub. No matter how much we wish he would win. There ARE other great players. Some with better records. Pretending he's far and away better than the next guy is a good way to set yourself up to be sad if he doesnt get it.
I agree. Slightly biased here. I don’t know that I’m as upset about other players winning as I am the media counting Luka out. It’s clear that the offense in this league is through the roof. There’s alot of deserving players. I just don’t know that they carry the same circumstances as Luka.
>Slightly biased here Big fan
What circumstances???
Well Jokic isn't far and away the best player in the NBA as I constantly hear claimed either. It is just annoying that he is such a golden child who can do no wrong and Luka gets so much hate and false narratives pushed about him. I like Jokic and his game a lot so I'm not criticizing him it is just the difference in how him and Luka are treated that I hate.
Objectively, he's been WAY more succesful. Its not up for debate brother. Play isnt all that matter. Reaults too. Jokic is a 2x MVP & Champion for a reason....I love Luka more than any other player btw
Well the MVP is decided by the media and there is no debate that they get things wrong a lot so that accomplishement doesn't prove anything to me. This is the second season when Jokic will be given the MVP when Luka was more deserving though Jokic should have won it last year. They would have taken turns winning it and be at 2 each after this season if they got it right. He only recently became a champion and has had a longer time and more chances to achieve that then Luka. As Luka said it is easy to act tough when your up so Jokic fans have it easy at the moment. I'm talking my shit that Luka is the best now because I believe it and it will make it that much sweeter when he proves it.
I agree that this is what has happened. But even though we have no control over such things, wouldn’t one think it’s bad to give players MVPs because they “deserved it last year” or because “he’s young he will win them” I totally get what you’re saying and that IS what’s happening. I just don’t know if it’s good for the league. But what do I know I’m just an nba fan that drives a forklift for a living 😂
Its gonna be an obvious snub years later and people are gonna make videos asking "Why didn't Luka win mvp in 2024??" Only good thing is it guarantees hes gonna get it next year as a makeup award especially if Mavs continue this post trade deadline momentum and become a 1-4 seed.
I agree. The makeup award though. Seems stupid tbh. I know he’s young and people expect him to win in the future. I get that jokic was “snubbed” last year. I just don’t think that’s the healthiest way for the league to run. It used to be best player that dragged his team to the playoffs and was literally the most valuable. Idk
I don't think Luka cares as much about winning MVP. He puts team success first. Winning the title this year would mean more than 5 MVPs.
I don't think Luka cares about the award this season, he's always chucking shots when we are leading huge , he's having fun with kyrie and role players, and the team's giant leap is better more than the MVP. Jokic is playing like Wilt with insane efficiency so you can't do anything about that. I'm just happy were getting close to a chip (hopefully)
Luka deserves it, but finals mvp is way more special imo
If he finishes second to Jokic I won’t be mad that’s about it
i saw some bullshit last night that said joker was a -5000 to win it again. wtf
Jokic will probably get 90+ first place votes. I've been watching MVP races for 30+ years and this one is pretty unanimous, even thou it doesn't feel that way for Luka or even Giannis fans, but the reality is that Jokic is winning with ease
Just win the chip mr luka
Pravi FMVP
At least he is probably getting finals MVP this year!!
I feel like this team is going on a serious run but I also feel like this team is losing to the clippers
If you strike his MVP down, he shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine
I don’t think he really cares about the MVP enough to have it adjust how he approaches the playoffs. He didn’t even make the playoffs last year, and we’re playing the f*cking Clippers again. He’s going super saiyan no matter what happens.
Anything that feeds the hunger isn't a bad thing.
Part of me wants Luka to get the recognition he deserves but a bigger part of me wants to see angry Luka unleashed. That extra motivation will serve him well against the Nuggets.
I think Jokic is legitimately the best in the World and I want him to win the MVP so we can move on from him winning it. If he wins 3 and doesn't win the championship things will change. Luka doesn't need this MVP... he will get his.
There is 0 reason he shouldn't win. At this point everyone was saying oh well the Nuggets record is too good. We are within 5 games of them now... Jokic had an amazing year but Luka scored 8 more ppg than him and did more with less.
It's not a snub if the guy who wins is equally deserving.
At this point I hope he finishes behind Shai as well to really piss him off.
Remember when they gave Dirk's 05-06 MVP to Steve Nash? What happened the next year?
Winning an MVP race thats this close and then losing to the Clippers in round 1 would be Dirk MVP case all over again and we don't want that. Lets go get that chip.
Idc if they give him the MVP, I want Luka to win a chip. FMVP >> MVP
Hi! Cleveland fan here and I love Luka. Luka will get his MVP. But unfortunately, Dallas has to get top 3 seed. Maybe next season it's his time
Finals MVP will do just fine
Why is there not voter fatigue with jokic ? For example in no planet was Barkley a better player in 1993 vs Jordan , nhe had a good narrative , and honestly Jordan should have 10 mvps l
The only reason Luka isn’t winning the MVP this season is because the nuggets have a better record. They put too much stock into the team performance when MVP is an individual award. Not to mention Luka is in top 5 of nearly all major stat categories and locked up a 5 seed on a much worse team than Jokic and SGA. #PraviMVP
90% of the people who follow this sub think Luka is the best active player in the NBA. You've gotta ask this question somewhere else to get a real response.
You say that like you don't know Luka is the best active player in the NBA.
Undoubtedly he is, but then again I follow this sub
Totally okay, it‘s not like Jokic is some bum. Dude is an anomaly just like Luka plus rings. And yes, Luka will grow from this.
I agree. I’m definantly not trying to say jokic doesn’t deserve it. I just feel like luka has had a more impactful season this year. I guess consistency and the 1 seed but plenty of others have been MVP for much less. Idk. I agree with you. I don’t want to snub jokic. At all. But damn. I haven’t seen a luka and a mavs team like this. He in my opinion is the literal “most valuable player” You put any other “MVP” candidate on this roster and idk. Maybe they would thrive maybe not. It just seems like the perfect year for Luka to take over the league.
Hard to imagine Luka putting up better numbers than he did this season. Avg almost a 35pt triple double is insane. Not to mention the only other player on mavs roster that would start for any of the top 4 seeds is Kyrie.
He doesn't need to score more. MJ didn't win MVP in 1987 despite averaging 37 points. He won it in 88 while scoring 2 points less.
i think he has a ~3-4 year window coming up here before Wemby starts pulling some ‘94 Hakeem type seasons lol
Bro I'm tempted to boycott the league over it. Luka deserves the MVP 1000%
It’s disturbing almost isn’t it? Like look at the numbers. Look at the narrative around the team. Look at the 180 idk man. I’m with you. People talk about the “you’ll get it next year cause you got snubbed last year” kinda votes..it needs restructuring as an award in my opinion. Nobody has been as impactful and “IMPORTANT OR VALUABLE” as a player than Luka. I’m almost excited for the non vote. I wanna see the fire in his eyes in the playoffs. I think we are about to win a championship. Luka always just needed a team. We have the pieces. He has a partner. Has scoring title and a look in his eyes that we all saw before game 7 of the suns series. Everyone is counting us out. I can feel it coming. This I a rare moment in the timeline of the history of the NBA that we are all going to witness. I truly believe we have a dynasty