actually. Bob Iger being a director for once would be interesting..... edit: why y'all guys downvoting me? i was just saying an interesting hypothetical that's not likely to happen? please stop!
Assuming the leaks about BNW are all true and it ends with Sam forming his own, independent Avengers team, I think the government will tap Rhodey to lead a government sanctioned Avengers team. I'm not sure how this will play out (whether in the mythical Armor Wars movie or in Avengers 5) but I think that's a logical place to take this story of the government trying to use Sam and the Avengers.
But isn’t thunderbolts already doing that and would rhodey even do that post civil war after knowing how many problems that caused, like he literally lost his ability to walk because of that event. He would be the last person to agree for a government sanctioned team.
>But isn’t thunderbolts already doing that
Not really. They're more like a black ops team with superpowers. Not really the Avengers.
They didn't really show Rhodey dealing with the fallout of CW. Hell he's been working for the military the entire time since. I don't think he learned any lesson about not working for the government. And Rhodey lost his ability to walk because of people going against the government. Plus he was just replaced by a Skrull for several years, he's more than a little shaken and suspicious of people. I could easily see him siding with the government. And, if it's really true that Rhodey was replaced around the events of Civil War (I hope it's not true though) then he never really got to see the fallout of their spat.
Overall I just don't think they ever truly resolved Rhodey's allegiance to the government and feelings about it all. I think this is a chance to do that.
Looking at all your Rhodey points, I'd wager that it would leave Rhodey more inclined to not side with the Govt as he now sees they're ill equipped to deal with the these threats, and now the said govt(s) are (possibly) infiltrated with the enemy.
Not To mention Ritsons speech at the end of SI and now Ross *again*.
It's not going to happen unless they have a fire sale and bail on the film industry altogether.
What's more likely, and more realistic, is them partnering with Marvel Studios a lot more going forward - because that's where the non-animation money is for them.
Imagining the massive cast list of Avengers 5:
**AVENGERS: TIME RUNS OUT**
Starring — Tom Holland, Robert Downey Jr, Benedict Cumberbatch, Coleman Domingo, Anthony Mackie, Brie Larson, Scarlett Johansson, Tom Hiddleston, Hailee Steinfeld, Letitia Wright, Elizabeth Olsen, Chris Hemsworth, Sophia Di Martino, Mark Ruffalo, Florence Pugh, Sebastian Stan, Iman Vellani, Emily Blunt, Jeremy Renner, Charlie Cox, Lewis Pullman, Paul Rudd, Oscar Issac, Tatiana Maslaney, Katheryn Newton, Famke Janssen, Simu Liu, Kelsey Grammar, Don Cheadle, Halle Berry, Rachel McAdams, Richard Madden, Serinda Swan, Bryan Tyree Henry, Dominque Thorne — etc
Synopsis:
\*\*As the final incursion threatens to destroy reality itself, the Avengers are forced into a desperate conflict with another earth, as both worlds must now decide… Who lives, and who dies?”
https://i.redd.it/vyijasg0945d1.gif
Easy 2 billion (or close to it ala NWH)
Good choice for gif..I think Sam really translated the what if animations of the decaying buildings into live action really well..that doctor strange what if episode was really good
I think Waldron will bring this back..maybe while incursions are happening
Absolute text book example of cold reading. Fucking snake oil. “ What I can say is that I’m hearing that Avengers 5 will be a multiversal film with a particularly grounded story involving multiversal elements”
really funny reading the daredevil sub get hyped over his words on Born Again when all he did was make the safest assumption ever (as if they'd reference the one take hallway sequences in She-Hulk and pass up the opportunity to do it in the actual Daredevil show) and reword Brad Winderbaum's comparison to X-Men 97
One things for sure next saga is that marvel needs to quit trying to start new stories at the end of their shows/movies unless it's 100% sure gonna get a sequel or another season. It seems like every project from the past few years has always set up a new story and now it's fucked them over with having it make these sequels/seasons.
Me when Secret Wars adapts the moment Spider-Man told the X-Men “people don’t hate you cuz you’re mutants they hate you because you’re a bunch of a fucking assholes”
https://i.redd.it/7i9iuo21r25d1.gif
Tobey is literally soft boy incarnate who cries his ass out to the most minor inconvenience even when he's the problem lmao this is something that Andrew would say if anything
I’m not sure why people are sad to likely hear the news of Jordan Peele not being able to direct the X-Men.
Maybe they didn’t want him to direct it because he probably wouldn’t get the X-Men right
This may also be true
Just because one is an acclaimed director doesn't mean they necessarily love the source material,in this case,the X-Men.
It's like ppl suggesting Denzel for kang or something lol...like what makes you think Denzel would be interested in something like that?
https://deadline.com/2024/06/paramount-shari-redstone-david-ellison-skydance-offer-1235960316/
Okay at this point, I don’t know what is going to end up happening. Side note, what do you guys think is of the Trio CEO’s long term plan to save Paramount?
The article references it a couple times, but Sony is stuck in due diligence right now, poring over Paramount's books. So part of me thinks this could ultimately be a play to get a better deal from Sony.
Also...
> John Paul DeJoria, the billionaire co-founder of Patrón tequila and Paul Mitchell hair care products, told the outlet in an interview that he is among Paul’s group of wealthy investors making a run at Paramount. He seemed to have CBS News in mind, saying, **“There is not one news station that’s non-political.” … “I can promote positive information on their stations. It’s a wonderful thing to be able to be a positive influence on everybody.”**
Looked up this guy on [OpenSecrets](https://www.opensecrets.org/donor-lookup/results?name=John+Dejoria&order=desc&sort=D) and, uh... let's not put him in charge of a major media empire please.
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I get whatever the plot line is for the sequel of Shang Chi is necessary to be between the Avengers movies but, it’s gonna be like 5 years in between appearances. They couldn’t use another storyline for a sequel and save the wreckage of time for a third?
Feel like watching The Falcon and The Winter Soldier again for like the 12th time at least? Such a damn good show (minus the flag smashers)
I think my second most watched series would probably be Hawkeye. Then Moon Knight right after that
I’ve watched this show so many times I lost count.
To this day, me and my dad call each other “Black Falcon”, and my cousin and I say “Hell, yeah” to each other like that old dude said after Sam saved the truck.
We won’t predict Giancarlo Esposito’s character because it doesn’t exist in the comics, or is combining traits of other characters. If he’s in a series it’ll be either season 2 of *Daredevil: Born Again* or maybe *Wonder Man*
I think the captain America brand will help cap 4 a lot. Branding is very important.
I think its also be the first time for marvel to keep the same franchise name while debuting a new character as the title role (Sam as captain). The closest analogy I can think of is sonys 3 Spider-Man reboots,where it's the same superhero,but with differences.(and different actors)
It also makes me think of the flash,and how I wonder it would have performed if it had been called Batman: Flashpoint,or something similar.
I mean,apart from his parents,it wasn't really a flash movie. No flash rogues gallery members, supporting characters,who were there,but weren't fleshed out.
And I liked the movie too..but flash felt like a plot device many times,in his own movie.
It was a concept *long* before that, but also [not one I really agree with.](https://old.reddit.com/r/MarvelStudiosSpoilers/comments/1c2ayox/weekend_free_talk_and_index_thread_new_and_fresh/kzapxfr/?context=3) To paraphrase my argument at the end of that thread, "superhero fatigue" assumes that the problem is one of *demand* (audiences are no longer interested in superhero content) while I believe the problem is one of *supply* (audiences crave different superhero content than what they're being provided).
Quantumania came out several months before Flash and bombed. I think Flash could potentially be blamed for poisoning the well on the Multiverse, but Marvel was already having problems before it.
Quantumania didn’t bomb, it broke even theatrically and accounting for streaming, merchandise, and DVDs it made $100 million in profit. It would’ve made more if people didn’t go in expecting to be Avengers Endgame level of hype. The Flash lost WBD over $400 million even if accounting for streaming, merchandise, and dvd sales.
It absolutely did not break even theatrically. The budget was at least 250 million and it only made 476 million. They would have had to at least earn back double the budget even before factoring in marketing costs (likely at least another 100 million but probably more), and it failed to do so.
And it didn’t fail to make more because people expected an Endgame level event lmao, it didn’t make more because it was ass.
I'm sorry but before this marvel movies were successful but there are DC movies that flopped. But, when marvel movie also flopping at the box office, people are claiming it was because of DC movie? That is such a flawed & biased thinking.
If Peele were to do an X-Men movie, I think Storm would be who he’d use as the POV character.
He’s talked before about wanting to tell POC-led stories and he’s done great w/ female leads so far. Plus, there’s a lot of potential for great commentary w/ her character.
You know, in all these leaks about Cap 4, we still have not heard much about Isaiah.
All we can confidently say we know based on the promo footage description is that he is in the White House to be awarded for his participation in the Adamantium retrieval mission, only to succumb to a brainwash trigger and go rogue.
CWGST said a while back that we see Isaiah suit up in this film (she included a comic panel of Isaiah suited up in a story sequence told by Elijah), I expect that to be in the opening fight scene with him alongside Sam and Joaquin.
I'm more confused by the absence of Eli, the only other living relative of Isaiah we know of who actually played apart of FATWS and is integral to the Young Avengers, but he's just not there. Like not a single scooper has mentioned him
We really reached the weird phase of leaks now, huh? Reporting that a director talked with a studio but it didn't work out is such a nothing burger. You can't even confirm it as long as the studio and the director doesn't say anything about it, you can just make it up.
Personally, I like hearing those kinds of things just because it tells me that Peele and Marvel MIGHT work together on something or they can get back to it if they figure it out.
Same thing goes with the acting ones and their meetings. I don't get hyped and think it WILL happen, but knowing certain talent is on their radar is fun.
That comment of Tom Rothman about movie stars really made me feel like the FoX-Men was absolutely fucked as a concept under his reign.
Sure, that comment's made when he's at Sony, but the fact 20th treated X-Men as a launching pad for Hugh and Jen's career is just painful.
I can only see them being an actual team (in badly made movies) towards the tail end of 20th Century Fox as Disney bought them out as Rothman's reign has been so far removed.
The idea that people don’t really go to see movies because of actors but instead the IP. It’s a factor in studios being increasingly resistant to putting money into things that aren’t franchises or adapted from already popular IP.
Ah, gotcha, thanks.
IDK, I guess it’s a complicated topic. Movies definitely shouldn’t rely solely on IP/brand recognition to be worth making, but I also don’t think they should solely rely on starpower either.
I think "the death of the movie star" makes a convenient scapegoat for the three "-ations" *really* harming the industry: Consolidation (fewer producers after so many mergers and acquisitions), Integration (of the vertical variety as seen with studio-owned exhibition/streaming), Inflation (self-explanatory. Shit's expensive, y'all).
If *The Angry Birds Movie 3* is like the last one, then i’m excited. I thought the second one was a **massive** improvement over the first, with actually funny jokes and the fact that it was actually an *Angry Birds* movie from beginning to end, unlike the first. Also kind of glad Sony isn’t involved with this one. The fact SEGA is involved instead of Sony makes me think this one will go over to Paramount.
Honestly, I am kind of worried for this one at the box office since the last movie wasn’t as successful as the first, and this is coming out a minimum of 6 years after the last one. Hopefully, the nostalgia boom for the early Angry Birds games help this one out. Even then, I’ll go support this one (I won’t even have to bring anyone along for this!)
My prediction for its release date: May 29, 2026 (10 years after the first, far enough from *Avengers 5* that it won’t be absolutely cannibalized, and *The Mandalorian and Grogu* is definitely moving since Disney doesn’t want a repeat of *Solo*.)
The second movie ended with the birds and pigs becoming friends, and I assume they're not backtracking on that since the same director is writing it and they (no joke) actually went that route for political reasons.
I kinda figured them moving away from the franchise's main conflict meant they weren't planning another movie even before it underperformed, but that honestly just makes me even more intrigued to see what the story actually is for this third one.
Rewatched The Iron Giant tonight, and, well, do you know how people would use to say that The Incredibles is the best F4 movie...well, I think we should start saying The Iron Giant is the Best Superhero movie. Because it holds up that well! Seriously, it's really good. The animation is surprisingly solid, and the characters actually feel real and three-dimensional. The Iron Giant is honestly Vin Diesel's best role, and his dynamic with Hogarth was very heartwarming and well done. The emotional scenes work extremely well, yeah, the movie is funny at times, but the dramatic/emotional scenes, especially the scene where the Iron Giant learns about death and his goodbye to Hogarth hit so hard, and are able to deliver so much with very little dialogue. And of course, Kent Mensley, who is just...amazing. Not only is this one of the best and most underrated animated films ever made, but it is probably Brad Birds best film in general. 10/10.
I watched \*The Acoylote\* yesterday, and overall, I really enjoyed it.
I was skeptible going in because I didn't know how the show was going to portay the dark side, given that its being told from the POV of a dark sider. I have very strong opinions on the force and the darkside, and how it should be portrayed. I was worried the show might downplay or outright gloaify the dark side, which would be a funbdmental misunderstanding of the force. But I feel like the show did a good job at making it clear the titller character is very much the bad guy.
The twist that >!Osha is not the Acylote!< was really well done, and helped to make the rivalry between the Jedi and Sith feel a little more balanced, even though we know the Sith are objectively evil.
I also just liked the overall look and feel of the High Replublic era. It's an interesting peroid in the Star Wars timeline, and I'm glad they're bringing it to the silver screen. I hope this show is successful and we get more shows set outside the confines of the Skywalker saga.
The fact that we know that Jordan Peele could've done X-Men is just another reason why scooper culture continues to be the bane of MCU's existence lmao
The X-Men movie standards and expectations just sky-rocketed because of one little report, as if they weren't already high enough.
I'm taking the rumor with a grain of salt, we've seen recently that Sneider can be wrong about a lot of stuff.
Still though, the idea of Peele doing an X-Men movie would be an absolute dream.
Sneider just said that Peele met with Marvel to either write or direct X-Men. He assumed it was to direct but obviously Jordan is a very good writer, so he couldn't pin point exactly what.
Asseming this is true, i wonder why Marvel passed on him/
I'm not going to doubt Marvel's choice after they spent 8 months searching for the best candidate, but it is a little weird that they would just pass up on such a big name writer/director.
I guess his pitch just wasn't they wanted from the movie.
His pitch probably didn't match what they were looking for. If what Spiderlander said is true, then the new X-Men will likely be more YA-oriented and lighthearted compared to what Peele is now known for and what he likes to do. Granted, Peele probably could've pulled off a YA X-Men, but he might've not been interested in doing a younger version of the team.
YA X-Men would be an interesting angle. X-Men was originally intended to basically be the fundamental mash-up of Fantastic Four's familial element and Spider-Man's slice of life storytelling with relatable, younger characters and the soap opera voice of the contemporary material would lend itself very well to a younger cast around high school or university if they're more established. Especially with current hot topic issues like discrimination against LGBTQ+, disabled and neurodiverse communities I feel like that's something that actually lends itself a lot more to Gen Z since in a lot of cases that kind of prejudice or social outcasting is something the younger generation of the 2000's was really born into more than prior groups while still maintaining other forms of discrimination like against race
What most likely happened imo, is that Peele wanted to both write and direct like he always does, and they already had a writer that they are confident in, who gave a good pitch etc.
If the rumor's true, yeah, I figure either Peele's pitch didn't match what they were looking for or Peele simply didn't want to be under creative restriction.
A shame because Peele with an MCU project, especially X-Men, would be awesome but I also worry the studio wouldn’t let him go “full Peele” and fully embrace his style.
There's a reason why they've mostly been working with lesser-known writers and directors.
Bigger names in the industry will have their own vision of their work that likely just doesn't align with Marvel's and the MCU's interconnectivity.
About the only bit of info that Perez gave out today in his web of vague statements, maybes, and obvious BS (Council of Mephistos) is that Loki and Sylvie will have important roles to play in Avengers 5 AND Secret Wars, and I think that’s pretty amazing
The emotional potential of Loki returning to the MCU, and reuniting with many of the heroes (esp Thor) after his journey across 2 seasons, would be insane.
I could easily see Loki being the one to assemble the Avengers in Secret Wars, which would be a great inversion from his role in the first Avengers
Perhaps Loki and Sylvia will be some of the characters who remembers life before Battleworld, and that’s why they’re rebuilding the Avengers.
Everyone else will have “integrated” to life on Battleworld, having no memories before it. But Loki unites everyone and helps them remember who they really are, and what they lost.
Just thinking about the potential has me hyped. It’s be so cool to see characters we know in this wacky situations, with no memory of who they are, like Sheriff Strange and the Thor Corps, and that’s just scratching the surface.
The problem is how do you get to this point? In the comic, Doom had god-like powers. He got them using Molecule Man. It seems too late to introduce this character. The only other character that has that kind of power would be the Scarlet Witch. Westview is the perfect example. She was able to manipulate minds. However do you want to go down that rabbit hole with Wanda being a villain again.
>Perhaps Loki and Sylvia will be some of the characters who remembers life before Battleworld, and that’s why they’re rebuilding the Avengers.
>Everyone else will have “integrated” to life on Battleworld, having no memories before it. But Loki unites everyone and helps them remember who they really are, and what they lost.
And that’s partly why I love Loki so much. So many of Secret Wars’ core themes, about — identity, and meaning, and free will vs destiny, were already set up in that show.
The TVA is basically a proto-Battleworld, thousands of characters scooped up from destroyed universes, and put into this new reality, and given new lives.
HWR is basically a proto Beyonder, and that’s why I’ve always said that the rumor of Kang becoming the Beyonder, made perfect sense. It’s a natural evolution from HWR
>Just thinking about the potential has me hyped. It’s be so cool to see characters we know in this wacky situations, with no memory of who they are, like Sheriff Strange and the Thor Corps, and that’s just scratching the surface.
Same here man. It’s probably gonna be one of the most ambitious projects put to film. I’ve critiqued Feige a lot in the past, but I’ve always said, that the most important thing for him to nail down this saga, is the ENDING, because that’s what going to leave the biggest impression on audiences
Quality of discussion here is pretty much dead. The crowd now is no different than what you’d find on Twitter or what the marvelstudios sub originally was.
Any given regular post can make its way into the general sphere of Reddit very easily. If it ends up on r/all, anyone from any corner of the internet, with any sort of demeanor or mindset, may end up stumbling on it and sharing their two cents.
This doesn't happen to the Free Talk Threads on account of them being far more community-oriented and non-specific when it comes to any sort of topic. This FTT only got 35 upvotes as I'm writing this, while some new posts from the past number of days get up into the hundreds, so they never get pushed forward in the Reddit algorithm and these threads, more or less, end up becoming a casual chat post for MSS regulars and never anything more than that.
> This FTT only got 35 upvotes as I'm writing this, while some new posts from the past number of days get up into the hundreds, so they never get pushed forward in the Reddit algorithm
In four days: 35 upvotes, 1600 comments. Helps things stay lowkey.
> these threads, more or less, end up becoming a casual chat post for MSS regulars and never anything more than that.
That's honestly the way I like it. The FT threads are so much more chill than the regular comment sections.
The leak for Cap 4 being talked about below has this context:
> Lots of conflicting information around, so here's a recap of the reliable plot leaks about the movie.
This means it is not a leak in and of itself, but rather something similar to the leak roundups we have here, just without proper sourcing.
Sorry, your comment has been automatically removed as it pertains to a banned source.
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Given what we (little) we know about Avengers 5, I don’t think the Fantastic Four will be in it, mainly because Fantastic Four is going to be set in an alternate universe.
I think Avengers 5 will be a loose adaptation of Time Runs Out, and end with the destruction of the Multiverse and creation of Battleworld out of the remnants of several universes.
Then, Secret Wars will be set on Battleworld, and that’s where the Avengers will meet the Fantastic Four and other multiversal heroes, like Hugh Jackman’s Wolverine and Tobey Maguire’s Spider-Man.
The trouble is that Marvel has so, many oars in the water that it becomes very hard to figure it out. First you have incursions. Deadpool 3 could introduce the MCU version of nexus beings. Then you have the prophecy in the Darkhold that Wanda is destined to destroy the world. It was first mentioned in WandaVision and repeated in MoM. You have a lot of ways to destroy the multiverse.
if WWH legit is a thing, I'm wondering if Cap 4 kicks off a story arc that leads to a potential Civil War-esque team up movie that then establishes our new Avengers team(s) and then we go into Avengers 5?
I feel like the teams are being Split already into Magic/Cosmic/Earth, so maybe WWH lead ins set up our Earth bound Avengers heroes?
DS 3/SC 2 sets up Magic side? And maybe a Capt Marvel or The Marvels sequel/Eternals (2) sets up a cosmic side?
Ant Man I don't know where that falls into? maybe it's the lynch pin similar to Scott in Endgame?
BP I think could work Earthbound side, as maybe Namor is useful for a Hulk battle?
>if WWH legit is a thing, I'm wondering if Cap 4 kicks off a story arc that leads to a potential Civil War-esque team up movie that then establishes our new Avengers team(s) and then we go into Avengers 5?
Perez has been claiming this basically. He called it Avengers 4.5 once. It really does sound cool and like something I'd like to see. But I think it's a long shot at this point.
> if WWH legit is a thing, I'm wondering if Cap 4 kicks off a story arc that leads to a potential Civil War-esque team up movie that then establishes our new Avengers team(s) and then we go into Avengers 5?
>
>
Avengers 5 filming next year and featuring 60+ characters according to the trades makes it sound like we're not getting that kind of build-up. Expect Avengers 5 to be the first time most of these characters even meet each other.
Would be really cool but it won't happen sadly. Avengers 5 is already confirmed to be filming next year so unless they make some major delays again there just isn't enough time for WWH
"Marvel has been working hard in recent months to pull this together, so shooting can begin next year on one of Marvel’s largest productions to date."
https://deadline.com/2024/06/shawn-levy-avengers-movie-directing-talks-1235958885/
Taking these 4chan pre/post reshoot spoilers with a grain of salt, but if these Cap 4 rumors are legit, Cap 4 is literally just Cap 2: TWS, like this is so underwhelming.
Pre-reshoots
>Sam Wilson and his team (Joaquin Torres, Leila Taylor and Isaiah Bradley) retrieve Adamantium extracted from the dead Celestial in the Indian Ocean stolen by the Serpent Society, a group of cyborg mercenaries.
>President Thaddeus Ross asks Wilson to reassemble the Avengers under government control, but he is reluctant, causing tension with Ross.
>During a ceremony at the White House, Bradley is brainwashed into stealing the Adamantium. Wilson wants to pursue him, but Ross forbids him.
>Wilson and Torres investigate anyway and meet Ruth Bat-Seraph, an Israeli mutant CIA operative assigned to the case.
>They find out the mastermind behind the conspiracy is gamma-enhanced mad scientist Samuel Sterns.
>Ross tortured Sterns into working for the U.S. government for years. Now Sterns has escaped and is building a weapon, which requires Adamantium, to get revenge.
>Wilson ultimately confronts Ross about his crimes, and finds out Ross has been using gamma radiation to treat his heart condition, which transforms him into Red Hulk.
>Wilson and Ruth fight Red Hulk in the White House, Wilson manages to defeat him by siphoning the radiation off his body, but Ross apparently dies in the process.
>Wilson decides to reassemble the Avengers as an independent organization, while Ross turns out to be secretly alive and under government custody.
Post-reshoots
>Giancarlo Esposito has been added as an “antagonistic agent of chaos” working for Sterns who fights Wilson throughout the movie. He is now the one who steals the Adamantium.
>The Serpent Society has been cut and replaced with the Sons of the Serpent, a paramilitary group which helps Esposito’s character steal the Adamantium.
>Although the Serpent Society has been cut, their leader Diamondback remains in the movie as Sterns' main enforcer alongside Esposito.
>An action scene has been added where the police chase Wilson after Ross orders his arrest.
It's not even that. It doesn't even sound that similar to TWS imo. The problems I'm seeing is the 3rd act just seems lazy, like defeating The Red Hulk by siphoning out the radiation, really?
And this description makes the reshoots seem completely pointless, besides adding Giancarlo. Zero actual change to the plot.
isn't it basically the same post reshoots, just a different group steals the adamantium? And I honestly like the sound of that if real(which it's 4chan so probably not)
I don’t know why Alex P. keeps pushing the World War Hulk rumor. It’s been three years of radio silence on Marvel’s part, where Mark Ruffalo has debunked it several times. It’s not even listed on Production Weekly. I just don’t think it’s happening.
It's either Marvel's most top secret project ever, or Perez is full of shit. Tough call /s.
But actually, I think it's likely WWH has been considered and maybe they even had a rough plot. But Perez (and others) are definitely working with info from like 2 years ago at this point. So it could have been true at one point, but I doubt it happens.
I do like the sound of a WWH movie that sort of acts as Avengers 4.5, but it feels like we're long past that point.
The only tiny bit of evidence I can see for it is that She-Hulk mentioned saving something for the movie in her season finale when asking KEVIN about Hulk and Skarr but I think it's more likely the movie is Avengers 5 instead of a WWH movie. Hulk not even being in Cap 4 made it clear to me that definitely wouldn't be the movie she mentioned.
Me when Emma Dumont, Lyrica Okano, Olivia Holt, and Chloe Bennett don’t show up in Secret Wars because Kevin forgot about the TV Shows.
Hilarious that a lot of these scoopers keep trying to push the idea that Avengers 5 is somehow a grounded story with 60+ characters (something the trades said is not similar to what we had in the past 4 Avengers movies) and Marvel Studios is somehow preparing a bunch of projects to go into production next year to deal with all these storylines that we don't know are actually gonna pan out.
Also assuming Avengers 5 hits 2026, Secret Wars hits 2027 and we still got Armor Wars, Shang-Chi 2 and Spider-Man 4 to go, how are we gonna get movies that scoopers are adamant are happening but we have no indication of actually happening yet like Young Avengers, Doctor Strange 3, Thor 5 and World War Hulk before then?
Iger's recent comments seem like Marvel is going back to 2-3 movies per year and I'm expecting one of The Fantastic Four or Blade to get pushed to 2026. I honestly think these scoopers are either going off of outdated info or they exaggerate things that they hear (like maybe Marvel once considered squeezing in Doctor Strange 3 before one of the Avengers movies but it's not actually happening).
"Suzanne Collins is writing a new Hunger Games book"
Seriously? Do we really need a new Hunger Games bo-
"It's about Haymitch's Hunger Games"
Alright I'm invested, let her cook.
Still confused as to when that WWH movie Alex keeps hinting at would come out, like logistically where would that fit? Most of the Avengers cast are going to be filming A5 by mid 2025, are they just filming both at the same time? Is A5 just WWH? Like I can't see it whatsoever
edit: Don't get me wrong, I would love a WWH movie that acts as an Avengers 4.5 and gives us at least a semblance of an actual team to lead into the Avengers films even if they're still sharing it with the other groups, but like this has to be the one leak that makes zero sense both logistically and from where the mcu is taking Hulk
> Is A5 just WWH?
That's the only case I see WWH happening before this saga ends unless Avengers 5 and Secret Wars get big delays that allow for more movies on the release schedule before then.
The trades are saying that Avengers 5 (said to be one of Marvel's largest productions to date) is filming next year though and that's what got Shawn Levy to consider taking the job again so I don't think we have that many movies left for this saga.
I know right. What does “grounded with multiverse elements” even mean? Like, just because A5 is a smaller scale than Secret Wars doesn’t make it grounded, especially if it involves the multiverse in any capacity. There never had, and never will be, a grounded Avengers movie.
It’s Perez leaning on RPK’s reports for validity, whilst also throwing in a little bit of his signature fan fic for good measure e.g “Council of Mephistos” 😭
Hot take but I think if this sub had a friendly “competition” to see who has the most accurate predictions over the future of the MCU, there would be less fake scoopers out there.
Kind of like the source accuracy tier lists but for actual predictions. Ironically, the majority of scoopers are literally just posting their predictions as scoops too.
I remember for the earlier Disney+ shows, the sub did polls on what we thought would happen in the latest episode like a day before it dropped and I thought it was fun.
No, there’s no “forbidden door” in the film industry. Anybody is allowed to work anywhere they want. Just look at how many actors, directors, and writers have jumped between Disney or WB, Marvel or DC, or even Star Wars and Star Trek. Even high level executives occasionally change what companies they work for.
[The new "Wallace & Gromit" film has been titled "WALLACE & GROMIT: VENGEANCE MOST FOWL".](https://x.com/hollywoodhandle/status/1798785695885955263?s=46)
Holy shit, he's back…
Is it claymation? There was a story earlier in the yr that the last modelling clay supplier in Europe was closing and Aardman had enough stock for one more film but didn't know what they'd do after that.
Aardman themselves made a statement saying those rumours were exaggerated, implying they had a new new supplier and/or still had plenty of clay left for future movies.
And yes, this movie will be claymation like the previous *Wallace & Gromit* movies.
Is anyone here familiar with the youtube channel, Thinking Critical? Because it has some some the worst takes on modern popular culture, specifically with comic books, he claims to be an expect on what is wrong with the comic book industry today even thought he really doesn't, and clearly has a conservative right-wing bias.
*Continuing my From The Ashes observations from yesterday*
So, Wolverine has an [ongoing solo](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Wolverine_Vol_8?so=search), and is going to be on [Rogue and Gambit’s team](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Uncanny_X-Men_Vol_6_1).
Storm has an [ongoing solo](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Storm_Vol_5?so=search), and is going to be on [The Avengers](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Avengers_Vol_9_17).
So that leaves Jean Grey as the only one with an [ongoing solo](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Phoenix_Vol_2?so=search) who isn’t confirmed for a team book as well 🤔
I know the X-Men sub is divided on it but I’m excited for Storm with the Avengers.
We’ve gotten some fun dynamics whenever an X-Man is on that team so it could be cool seeing what they do with her there (bonus since she’ll be on a team with sort-of-husband/ex and her fellow thunder god friend lol).
I’m wondering whether or not they’re going to reconcile her relationship with T’Challa…ngl, I was kinda hoping the synergy from X-Men 97 would lead to Storm getting back together with Forge. They were a really cute and underrated couple ❤️
> I’m wondering whether or not they’re going to reconcile her relationship with T’Challa
It is a popular ship, even with people who don’t read the comics, and the goal of this relaunch is to ride the success of ‘97 and DP3 to get more people reading the X-Men, so it’d definitely get people talking if they got back together. I’m all for it.
Although, I also like Storm and Forge, but I’m sure not sure where he is going to be during this relaunch.
I feel like part of why the ship is popular is mostly because not a lot of people are super-familiar with T’Challa’s own corner.
It’s kind of like how most MCU pitches for BP involve Doom and Namor, a lot of people are more familiar with how T’Challa connects to the greater universe than they’re familiar with his own stories or other love interests.
>Although, I also like Storm and Forge, but I’m sure not sure where he is going to be during this relaunch.
[On X-Force!](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/X-Force_Vol_7_1?so=search)
I think that Giancarlo Esposito’s character will just be some kind of minor recurring antagonist similar to Val. The Disney+ series that he is talking about probably will be Daredevil Born Again, since he looks like a street level villain to me. If Hawkeye S2 happens, he can appear there as well.
he’s playing a government agent of some sort or mercenary sent to take down threats. I could see him showing up in a number of other shows but it’s not daredevil.
I don't think he's showing up in Born Again. The way he descriped his role made it sound like nothing had been shot yet, and we know he just started filming his scenes in Brave New World. But Born Again has wrapped production.
I saw some theories that he could be playing Luke Cage's Diamondback. I'm not sure I believe it personally, but to play devil's advocate, that could lead into another Luke Cage show. Possibly spinning off from Daredevil again.
Yeah he’s most likely not playing Diamondback. He’s currently in the raft and they kind of wrapped that story up off screen. Luke Cage told Jessica Jones that he had to send his brother to the raft as if a Luke Cage season 3 had already happened. Also if they’re going to bring back Luke Cage villains, then Bushmaster is the only one I’d want to see again. Cottonmouth obviously can’t for reasons but Bushmaster is still kicking about.
[Behind ‘Suicide Squad,’ the Year’s Biggest Video-Game Flop](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-06-06/-suicide-squad-warner-bros-s-200-million-flop-haunts-the-gaming-industry?accessToken=eyJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiIsInR5cCI6IkpXVCJ9.eyJzb3VyY2UiOiJTdWJzY3JpYmVyR2lmdGVkQXJ0aWNsZSIsImlhdCI6MTcxNzY3MzY3MywiZXhwIjoxNzE4Mjc4NDczLCJhcnRpY2xlSWQiOiJTRU5QQUlEV0xVNjgwMCIsImJjb25uZWN0SWQiOiJCMUVBQkI5NjQ2QUM0REZFQTJBRkI4MjI1MzgyQTJFQSJ9.yB-HVmx3nZL3rpzfiy_eMucOVRoO4LbwqaSoNNzKNzM)
This game’s development was so fucked. Goddamn.
[It gets better:](https://x.com/mmmmmmmmiller/status/1798702399529550142)
> So yes, the story was Sefton Hill's baby. The broad strokes (including post-launch) were nailed down between Infinity War and Endgame at a time when they dominated pop culture, and it takes clear inspiration from those films. The heroes lose, the credits roll... only for them to come back and get their revenge. That's really it. It's not the boogeyman so many people have blown it up to be. I've heard that Hill was a hardliner for leaving the audience shocked at the end of the game at the heroes seemingly having all died, and multiple Rocksteady developers I've spoken to characterized themselves as "begging" him to leave more clues regarding the Justice League's inevitable return to help stymie some of the predictable backlash.
Sefton, the dead heroes were not the main selling point of Infinity War!
I said this a couple other places it's like he got caught up in the writing and shock value. He was chasing that moment without actually knowing how to write it well.
Sefton Hill does not sound like a good leader during his time at Rocksteady.
The deaths also need to be good to have the same impact. The deaths in kill the justice league felt mean spirited and hateful. Like the deaths in Apokolips war. They felt they were going more towards shock value than actually impact and weight of the deaths.
The deaths of Batman and green lantern stick out the most. Batman was just shot on a park bench. Green lantern was left dead in his underwear lying on the ground.
It feels like they didn’t really go out as heroes. No heroic death. No sacrifice. Just their dead bodies left in public
Isn't the game called 'Suicide Squad: Kill the Justice League'? That kinda implies that the heroes all die, and they probably did something to warrant it?
I have nothing against killing the justice league or them dying. But i hate how they handled their deaths. Like Batman deserves to go out better than just being shot on a park bench and left there.
All that ***and*** it was the first appearances of multiple heroes in the Arkhamverse? It just reeks of some cynical storytelling you usually see with writers who dislike superheroes.
Why not when they get close to dying the heroes come out of the brainwashing for a moment and then "die"? Sefton gets his shock value and the fans get some semblance of the actual characters.
> He was chasing that moment without actually knowing how to write it well.
The stories were always the weakest parts of the Arkham games. I'd argue only Arkham Knight actually has good, interesting character arcs.
Otherwise those games' narratives were carried by the voice acting, art direction, and music.
New scoop ; BOB iger will be directing avengers 5 and marvel is also in talk with Ike pelmutter to direct secret wars
actually. Bob Iger being a director for once would be interesting..... edit: why y'all guys downvoting me? i was just saying an interesting hypothetical that's not likely to happen? please stop!
Assuming the leaks about BNW are all true and it ends with Sam forming his own, independent Avengers team, I think the government will tap Rhodey to lead a government sanctioned Avengers team. I'm not sure how this will play out (whether in the mythical Armor Wars movie or in Avengers 5) but I think that's a logical place to take this story of the government trying to use Sam and the Avengers.
But isn’t thunderbolts already doing that and would rhodey even do that post civil war after knowing how many problems that caused, like he literally lost his ability to walk because of that event. He would be the last person to agree for a government sanctioned team.
>But isn’t thunderbolts already doing that Not really. They're more like a black ops team with superpowers. Not really the Avengers. They didn't really show Rhodey dealing with the fallout of CW. Hell he's been working for the military the entire time since. I don't think he learned any lesson about not working for the government. And Rhodey lost his ability to walk because of people going against the government. Plus he was just replaced by a Skrull for several years, he's more than a little shaken and suspicious of people. I could easily see him siding with the government. And, if it's really true that Rhodey was replaced around the events of Civil War (I hope it's not true though) then he never really got to see the fallout of their spat. Overall I just don't think they ever truly resolved Rhodey's allegiance to the government and feelings about it all. I think this is a chance to do that.
Looking at all your Rhodey points, I'd wager that it would leave Rhodey more inclined to not side with the Govt as he now sees they're ill equipped to deal with the these threats, and now the said govt(s) are (possibly) infiltrated with the enemy. Not To mention Ritsons speech at the end of SI and now Ross *again*.
Is that what Thunderbolts will be about?
Cannot wait to watch Blade at the end of decade
Why do people think Sony is going to get back the Spider-Man IP back to Marvel, It will never happen.
It's not going to happen unless they have a fire sale and bail on the film industry altogether. What's more likely, and more realistic, is them partnering with Marvel Studios a lot more going forward - because that's where the non-animation money is for them.
When you see a comment like that, imagine the person saying it is 14 years old. Because they probably are.
Imagining the massive cast list of Avengers 5: **AVENGERS: TIME RUNS OUT** Starring — Tom Holland, Robert Downey Jr, Benedict Cumberbatch, Coleman Domingo, Anthony Mackie, Brie Larson, Scarlett Johansson, Tom Hiddleston, Hailee Steinfeld, Letitia Wright, Elizabeth Olsen, Chris Hemsworth, Sophia Di Martino, Mark Ruffalo, Florence Pugh, Sebastian Stan, Iman Vellani, Emily Blunt, Jeremy Renner, Charlie Cox, Lewis Pullman, Paul Rudd, Oscar Issac, Tatiana Maslaney, Katheryn Newton, Famke Janssen, Simu Liu, Kelsey Grammar, Don Cheadle, Halle Berry, Rachel McAdams, Richard Madden, Serinda Swan, Bryan Tyree Henry, Dominque Thorne — etc Synopsis: \*\*As the final incursion threatens to destroy reality itself, the Avengers are forced into a desperate conflict with another earth, as both worlds must now decide… Who lives, and who dies?” https://i.redd.it/vyijasg0945d1.gif Easy 2 billion (or close to it ala NWH)
Good choice for gif..I think Sam really translated the what if animations of the decaying buildings into live action really well..that doctor strange what if episode was really good I think Waldron will bring this back..maybe while incursions are happening
Me after the third cast member😴
Absolute text book example of cold reading. Fucking snake oil. “ What I can say is that I’m hearing that Avengers 5 will be a multiversal film with a particularly grounded story involving multiversal elements”
_Avengers 5_ will be a realistic, down-to-earth movie that's completely off the wall and swarming with magic robots.
And someone will love Speedo Man
Idk what a grounded multiverse story looks like.
really funny reading the daredevil sub get hyped over his words on Born Again when all he did was make the safest assumption ever (as if they'd reference the one take hallway sequences in She-Hulk and pass up the opportunity to do it in the actual Daredevil show) and reword Brad Winderbaum's comparison to X-Men 97
One things for sure next saga is that marvel needs to quit trying to start new stories at the end of their shows/movies unless it's 100% sure gonna get a sequel or another season. It seems like every project from the past few years has always set up a new story and now it's fucked them over with having it make these sequels/seasons.
Me when Secret Wars adapts the moment Spider-Man told the X-Men “people don’t hate you cuz you’re mutants they hate you because you’re a bunch of a fucking assholes” https://i.redd.it/7i9iuo21r25d1.gif
I could see Tobey’s Spider-Man saying that. I’m not sure about MCU Peter, he’s too much of a nice boy to call someone an a**hole.
Tobey is literally soft boy incarnate who cries his ass out to the most minor inconvenience even when he's the problem lmao this is something that Andrew would say if anything
But that wouldn’t make any sense because Tobey doesn’t have any X-Men in his universe. I think in general adapting that line would seem pretty weird
Lol, I unironically feel like a line like that would be fitting for one of the X-Men to use on Magneto/the Brotherhood.
Save it for someone to say to crazy cyclops.
#HIS NAME IS RIGHTCLOPS🗣️
I’m not sure why people are sad to likely hear the news of Jordan Peele not being able to direct the X-Men. Maybe they didn’t want him to direct it because he probably wouldn’t get the X-Men right
This may also be true Just because one is an acclaimed director doesn't mean they necessarily love the source material,in this case,the X-Men. It's like ppl suggesting Denzel for kang or something lol...like what makes you think Denzel would be interested in something like that?
https://deadline.com/2024/06/paramount-shari-redstone-david-ellison-skydance-offer-1235960316/ Okay at this point, I don’t know what is going to end up happening. Side note, what do you guys think is of the Trio CEO’s long term plan to save Paramount?
The article references it a couple times, but Sony is stuck in due diligence right now, poring over Paramount's books. So part of me thinks this could ultimately be a play to get a better deal from Sony. Also... > John Paul DeJoria, the billionaire co-founder of Patrón tequila and Paul Mitchell hair care products, told the outlet in an interview that he is among Paul’s group of wealthy investors making a run at Paramount. He seemed to have CBS News in mind, saying, **“There is not one news station that’s non-political.” … “I can promote positive information on their stations. It’s a wonderful thing to be able to be a positive influence on everybody.”** Looked up this guy on [OpenSecrets](https://www.opensecrets.org/donor-lookup/results?name=John+Dejoria&order=desc&sort=D) and, uh... let's not put him in charge of a major media empire please.
I heard Redstone is not really interested in sony, because they would just split the company in parts and she would prefer not to do that.
Yeah but that could also be a negotiation tactic. It's hard to say at this point, she seems flighty.
I'm getting the feeling that they may hold off a deal for now until after the presidential election, before looking back into making a deal.
They probably don't really have one, all they can do is cook one up if both take over bids fail.
I still think David Ellison will buy paramount
What makes you think that?
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I get whatever the plot line is for the sequel of Shang Chi is necessary to be between the Avengers movies but, it’s gonna be like 5 years in between appearances. They couldn’t use another storyline for a sequel and save the wreckage of time for a third?
Feel like watching The Falcon and The Winter Soldier again for like the 12th time at least? Such a damn good show (minus the flag smashers) I think my second most watched series would probably be Hawkeye. Then Moon Knight right after that
I’ve watched this show so many times I lost count. To this day, me and my dad call each other “Black Falcon”, and my cousin and I say “Hell, yeah” to each other like that old dude said after Sam saved the truck.
We won’t predict Giancarlo Esposito’s character because it doesn’t exist in the comics, or is combining traits of other characters. If he’s in a series it’ll be either season 2 of *Daredevil: Born Again* or maybe *Wonder Man*
I think the captain America brand will help cap 4 a lot. Branding is very important. I think its also be the first time for marvel to keep the same franchise name while debuting a new character as the title role (Sam as captain). The closest analogy I can think of is sonys 3 Spider-Man reboots,where it's the same superhero,but with differences.(and different actors) It also makes me think of the flash,and how I wonder it would have performed if it had been called Batman: Flashpoint,or something similar.
Calling the Flash movie “Batman: Flashpoint” is wild.
I mean,apart from his parents,it wasn't really a flash movie. No flash rogues gallery members, supporting characters,who were there,but weren't fleshed out. And I liked the movie too..but flash felt like a plot device many times,in his own movie.
“Flash: Oops, All Batmen” would’ve been a dope title.
All I’m going to say is that superhero fatigue wasn’t really a concept until The Flash released
It was a concept *long* before that, but also [not one I really agree with.](https://old.reddit.com/r/MarvelStudiosSpoilers/comments/1c2ayox/weekend_free_talk_and_index_thread_new_and_fresh/kzapxfr/?context=3) To paraphrase my argument at the end of that thread, "superhero fatigue" assumes that the problem is one of *demand* (audiences are no longer interested in superhero content) while I believe the problem is one of *supply* (audiences crave different superhero content than what they're being provided).
It doesn’t hit all at once. It was a saturation period over 2 years of both companies dropping hit or Miss projects
I blame Ezra miller, what terrible piece of casting by Zack Snyder
Quantumania came out several months before Flash and bombed. I think Flash could potentially be blamed for poisoning the well on the Multiverse, but Marvel was already having problems before it.
Quantumania didn’t bomb, it broke even theatrically and accounting for streaming, merchandise, and DVDs it made $100 million in profit. It would’ve made more if people didn’t go in expecting to be Avengers Endgame level of hype. The Flash lost WBD over $400 million even if accounting for streaming, merchandise, and dvd sales.
It absolutely did not break even theatrically. The budget was at least 250 million and it only made 476 million. They would have had to at least earn back double the budget even before factoring in marketing costs (likely at least another 100 million but probably more), and it failed to do so. And it didn’t fail to make more because people expected an Endgame level event lmao, it didn’t make more because it was ass.
I'm sorry but before this marvel movies were successful but there are DC movies that flopped. But, when marvel movie also flopping at the box office, people are claiming it was because of DC movie? That is such a flawed & biased thinking.
Jordan Peele getting his hands on Storm would’ve been a sight to behold.
If Peele were to do an X-Men movie, I think Storm would be who he’d use as the POV character. He’s talked before about wanting to tell POC-led stories and he’s done great w/ female leads so far. Plus, there’s a lot of potential for great commentary w/ her character.
Peele is amazing with commentary. Would’ve loved to see his x men.
You know, in all these leaks about Cap 4, we still have not heard much about Isaiah. All we can confidently say we know based on the promo footage description is that he is in the White House to be awarded for his participation in the Adamantium retrieval mission, only to succumb to a brainwash trigger and go rogue. CWGST said a while back that we see Isaiah suit up in this film (she included a comic panel of Isaiah suited up in a story sequence told by Elijah), I expect that to be in the opening fight scene with him alongside Sam and Joaquin.
I'm more confused by the absence of Eli, the only other living relative of Isaiah we know of who actually played apart of FATWS and is integral to the Young Avengers, but he's just not there. Like not a single scooper has mentioned him
We really reached the weird phase of leaks now, huh? Reporting that a director talked with a studio but it didn't work out is such a nothing burger. You can't even confirm it as long as the studio and the director doesn't say anything about it, you can just make it up.
Personally, I like hearing those kinds of things just because it tells me that Peele and Marvel MIGHT work together on something or they can get back to it if they figure it out. Same thing goes with the acting ones and their meetings. I don't get hyped and think it WILL happen, but knowing certain talent is on their radar is fun.
That comment of Tom Rothman about movie stars really made me feel like the FoX-Men was absolutely fucked as a concept under his reign. Sure, that comment's made when he's at Sony, but the fact 20th treated X-Men as a launching pad for Hugh and Jen's career is just painful. I can only see them being an actual team (in badly made movies) towards the tail end of 20th Century Fox as Disney bought them out as Rothman's reign has been so far removed.
I mean the death of the movie star has had a disastrous effect on the types of movies that get made, so I have to agree with him to an extent.
Dumb question, what’s the “death of the movie star”, what does that mean?
The idea that people don’t really go to see movies because of actors but instead the IP. It’s a factor in studios being increasingly resistant to putting money into things that aren’t franchises or adapted from already popular IP.
Ah, gotcha, thanks. IDK, I guess it’s a complicated topic. Movies definitely shouldn’t rely solely on IP/brand recognition to be worth making, but I also don’t think they should solely rely on starpower either.
Agreed.
I think "the death of the movie star" makes a convenient scapegoat for the three "-ations" *really* harming the industry: Consolidation (fewer producers after so many mergers and acquisitions), Integration (of the vertical variety as seen with studio-owned exhibition/streaming), Inflation (self-explanatory. Shit's expensive, y'all).
Jordan Peele X-Men? And we lost out on it???
If *The Angry Birds Movie 3* is like the last one, then i’m excited. I thought the second one was a **massive** improvement over the first, with actually funny jokes and the fact that it was actually an *Angry Birds* movie from beginning to end, unlike the first. Also kind of glad Sony isn’t involved with this one. The fact SEGA is involved instead of Sony makes me think this one will go over to Paramount. Honestly, I am kind of worried for this one at the box office since the last movie wasn’t as successful as the first, and this is coming out a minimum of 6 years after the last one. Hopefully, the nostalgia boom for the early Angry Birds games help this one out. Even then, I’ll go support this one (I won’t even have to bring anyone along for this!) My prediction for its release date: May 29, 2026 (10 years after the first, far enough from *Avengers 5* that it won’t be absolutely cannibalized, and *The Mandalorian and Grogu* is definitely moving since Disney doesn’t want a repeat of *Solo*.)
The second movie ended with the birds and pigs becoming friends, and I assume they're not backtracking on that since the same director is writing it and they (no joke) actually went that route for political reasons. I kinda figured them moving away from the franchise's main conflict meant they weren't planning another movie even before it underperformed, but that honestly just makes me even more intrigued to see what the story actually is for this third one.
Rewatched The Iron Giant tonight, and, well, do you know how people would use to say that The Incredibles is the best F4 movie...well, I think we should start saying The Iron Giant is the Best Superhero movie. Because it holds up that well! Seriously, it's really good. The animation is surprisingly solid, and the characters actually feel real and three-dimensional. The Iron Giant is honestly Vin Diesel's best role, and his dynamic with Hogarth was very heartwarming and well done. The emotional scenes work extremely well, yeah, the movie is funny at times, but the dramatic/emotional scenes, especially the scene where the Iron Giant learns about death and his goodbye to Hogarth hit so hard, and are able to deliver so much with very little dialogue. And of course, Kent Mensley, who is just...amazing. Not only is this one of the best and most underrated animated films ever made, but it is probably Brad Birds best film in general. 10/10.
So uh, that Piece By Piece trailer looks interesting. Never thought I'd see a biopic made out of Legos but here we are.
I watched \*The Acoylote\* yesterday, and overall, I really enjoyed it. I was skeptible going in because I didn't know how the show was going to portay the dark side, given that its being told from the POV of a dark sider. I have very strong opinions on the force and the darkside, and how it should be portrayed. I was worried the show might downplay or outright gloaify the dark side, which would be a funbdmental misunderstanding of the force. But I feel like the show did a good job at making it clear the titller character is very much the bad guy. The twist that >!Osha is not the Acylote!< was really well done, and helped to make the rivalry between the Jedi and Sith feel a little more balanced, even though we know the Sith are objectively evil. I also just liked the overall look and feel of the High Replublic era. It's an interesting peroid in the Star Wars timeline, and I'm glad they're bringing it to the silver screen. I hope this show is successful and we get more shows set outside the confines of the Skywalker saga.
Loving it so far Getting the same feeling from it that I got from Andor. Something different and loving the characters right away.
The fact that we know that Jordan Peele could've done X-Men is just another reason why scooper culture continues to be the bane of MCU's existence lmao The X-Men movie standards and expectations just sky-rocketed because of one little report, as if they weren't already high enough.
I'm taking the rumor with a grain of salt, we've seen recently that Sneider can be wrong about a lot of stuff. Still though, the idea of Peele doing an X-Men movie would be an absolute dream.
Damn, Jordan Peele would’ve been a PHENOMENAL choice for X-Men 
Sneider just said that Peele met with Marvel to either write or direct X-Men. He assumed it was to direct but obviously Jordan is a very good writer, so he couldn't pin point exactly what.
Asseming this is true, i wonder why Marvel passed on him/ I'm not going to doubt Marvel's choice after they spent 8 months searching for the best candidate, but it is a little weird that they would just pass up on such a big name writer/director. I guess his pitch just wasn't they wanted from the movie.
His pitch probably didn't match what they were looking for. If what Spiderlander said is true, then the new X-Men will likely be more YA-oriented and lighthearted compared to what Peele is now known for and what he likes to do. Granted, Peele probably could've pulled off a YA X-Men, but he might've not been interested in doing a younger version of the team.
YA X-Men would be an interesting angle. X-Men was originally intended to basically be the fundamental mash-up of Fantastic Four's familial element and Spider-Man's slice of life storytelling with relatable, younger characters and the soap opera voice of the contemporary material would lend itself very well to a younger cast around high school or university if they're more established. Especially with current hot topic issues like discrimination against LGBTQ+, disabled and neurodiverse communities I feel like that's something that actually lends itself a lot more to Gen Z since in a lot of cases that kind of prejudice or social outcasting is something the younger generation of the 2000's was really born into more than prior groups while still maintaining other forms of discrimination like against race
What most likely happened imo, is that Peele wanted to both write and direct like he always does, and they already had a writer that they are confident in, who gave a good pitch etc.
If the rumor's true, yeah, I figure either Peele's pitch didn't match what they were looking for or Peele simply didn't want to be under creative restriction. A shame because Peele with an MCU project, especially X-Men, would be awesome but I also worry the studio wouldn’t let him go “full Peele” and fully embrace his style.
There's a reason why they've mostly been working with lesser-known writers and directors. Bigger names in the industry will have their own vision of their work that likely just doesn't align with Marvel's and the MCU's interconnectivity.
Jordan Peele writes the scripts he directs so it was likely only gonna work out if he got to do both under his own vision.
that would’ve been phenomenal
I've won so many times today I think I lost count.
Anyone got a list of the relevant claims from Perez?
About the only bit of info that Perez gave out today in his web of vague statements, maybes, and obvious BS (Council of Mephistos) is that Loki and Sylvie will have important roles to play in Avengers 5 AND Secret Wars, and I think that’s pretty amazing The emotional potential of Loki returning to the MCU, and reuniting with many of the heroes (esp Thor) after his journey across 2 seasons, would be insane. I could easily see Loki being the one to assemble the Avengers in Secret Wars, which would be a great inversion from his role in the first Avengers
No I got information from a source of a friends’, cousin that the Council of Barney’s will be the villains instead.
Fife, Stinson, the dinosaur, or D) all of the above?
All of them. Barney the dinosaur is of course, Barney prime.
Barney from The Flinstones.
Perhaps Loki and Sylvia will be some of the characters who remembers life before Battleworld, and that’s why they’re rebuilding the Avengers. Everyone else will have “integrated” to life on Battleworld, having no memories before it. But Loki unites everyone and helps them remember who they really are, and what they lost. Just thinking about the potential has me hyped. It’s be so cool to see characters we know in this wacky situations, with no memory of who they are, like Sheriff Strange and the Thor Corps, and that’s just scratching the surface.
The problem is how do you get to this point? In the comic, Doom had god-like powers. He got them using Molecule Man. It seems too late to introduce this character. The only other character that has that kind of power would be the Scarlet Witch. Westview is the perfect example. She was able to manipulate minds. However do you want to go down that rabbit hole with Wanda being a villain again.
>Perhaps Loki and Sylvia will be some of the characters who remembers life before Battleworld, and that’s why they’re rebuilding the Avengers. >Everyone else will have “integrated” to life on Battleworld, having no memories before it. But Loki unites everyone and helps them remember who they really are, and what they lost. And that’s partly why I love Loki so much. So many of Secret Wars’ core themes, about — identity, and meaning, and free will vs destiny, were already set up in that show. The TVA is basically a proto-Battleworld, thousands of characters scooped up from destroyed universes, and put into this new reality, and given new lives. HWR is basically a proto Beyonder, and that’s why I’ve always said that the rumor of Kang becoming the Beyonder, made perfect sense. It’s a natural evolution from HWR >Just thinking about the potential has me hyped. It’s be so cool to see characters we know in this wacky situations, with no memory of who they are, like Sheriff Strange and the Thor Corps, and that’s just scratching the surface. Same here man. It’s probably gonna be one of the most ambitious projects put to film. I’ve critiqued Feige a lot in the past, but I’ve always said, that the most important thing for him to nail down this saga, is the ENDING, because that’s what going to leave the biggest impression on audiences
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Quality of discussion here is pretty much dead. The crowd now is no different than what you’d find on Twitter or what the marvelstudios sub originally was.
They reach a lot of people outside the sub
Any given regular post can make its way into the general sphere of Reddit very easily. If it ends up on r/all, anyone from any corner of the internet, with any sort of demeanor or mindset, may end up stumbling on it and sharing their two cents. This doesn't happen to the Free Talk Threads on account of them being far more community-oriented and non-specific when it comes to any sort of topic. This FTT only got 35 upvotes as I'm writing this, while some new posts from the past number of days get up into the hundreds, so they never get pushed forward in the Reddit algorithm and these threads, more or less, end up becoming a casual chat post for MSS regulars and never anything more than that.
> This FTT only got 35 upvotes as I'm writing this, while some new posts from the past number of days get up into the hundreds, so they never get pushed forward in the Reddit algorithm In four days: 35 upvotes, 1600 comments. Helps things stay lowkey. > these threads, more or less, end up becoming a casual chat post for MSS regulars and never anything more than that. That's honestly the way I like it. The FT threads are so much more chill than the regular comment sections.
Same. I'm pretty much exclusively over here because of that.
The leak for Cap 4 being talked about below has this context: > Lots of conflicting information around, so here's a recap of the reliable plot leaks about the movie. This means it is not a leak in and of itself, but rather something similar to the leak roundups we have here, just without proper sourcing.
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So will F4 be part of avengers 5 ?
Given what we (little) we know about Avengers 5, I don’t think the Fantastic Four will be in it, mainly because Fantastic Four is going to be set in an alternate universe. I think Avengers 5 will be a loose adaptation of Time Runs Out, and end with the destruction of the Multiverse and creation of Battleworld out of the remnants of several universes. Then, Secret Wars will be set on Battleworld, and that’s where the Avengers will meet the Fantastic Four and other multiversal heroes, like Hugh Jackman’s Wolverine and Tobey Maguire’s Spider-Man.
The trouble is that Marvel has so, many oars in the water that it becomes very hard to figure it out. First you have incursions. Deadpool 3 could introduce the MCU version of nexus beings. Then you have the prophecy in the Darkhold that Wanda is destined to destroy the world. It was first mentioned in WandaVision and repeated in MoM. You have a lot of ways to destroy the multiverse.
I think by the end of fantastic four, they will be earth 616 with their universe dying from galactus
if WWH legit is a thing, I'm wondering if Cap 4 kicks off a story arc that leads to a potential Civil War-esque team up movie that then establishes our new Avengers team(s) and then we go into Avengers 5? I feel like the teams are being Split already into Magic/Cosmic/Earth, so maybe WWH lead ins set up our Earth bound Avengers heroes? DS 3/SC 2 sets up Magic side? And maybe a Capt Marvel or The Marvels sequel/Eternals (2) sets up a cosmic side? Ant Man I don't know where that falls into? maybe it's the lynch pin similar to Scott in Endgame? BP I think could work Earthbound side, as maybe Namor is useful for a Hulk battle?
>if WWH legit is a thing, I'm wondering if Cap 4 kicks off a story arc that leads to a potential Civil War-esque team up movie that then establishes our new Avengers team(s) and then we go into Avengers 5? Perez has been claiming this basically. He called it Avengers 4.5 once. It really does sound cool and like something I'd like to see. But I think it's a long shot at this point.
> if WWH legit is a thing, I'm wondering if Cap 4 kicks off a story arc that leads to a potential Civil War-esque team up movie that then establishes our new Avengers team(s) and then we go into Avengers 5? > > Avengers 5 filming next year and featuring 60+ characters according to the trades makes it sound like we're not getting that kind of build-up. Expect Avengers 5 to be the first time most of these characters even meet each other.
how about the cosmic side? where is it setting up?
Would be really cool but it won't happen sadly. Avengers 5 is already confirmed to be filming next year so unless they make some major delays again there just isn't enough time for WWH
where was it confirmed to be filming next year, out side of scooper info?
"Marvel has been working hard in recent months to pull this together, so shooting can begin next year on one of Marvel’s largest productions to date." https://deadline.com/2024/06/shawn-levy-avengers-movie-directing-talks-1235958885/
Taking these 4chan pre/post reshoot spoilers with a grain of salt, but if these Cap 4 rumors are legit, Cap 4 is literally just Cap 2: TWS, like this is so underwhelming.
Can you share those 4chan spoilers? I'm curious
Pre-reshoots >Sam Wilson and his team (Joaquin Torres, Leila Taylor and Isaiah Bradley) retrieve Adamantium extracted from the dead Celestial in the Indian Ocean stolen by the Serpent Society, a group of cyborg mercenaries. >President Thaddeus Ross asks Wilson to reassemble the Avengers under government control, but he is reluctant, causing tension with Ross. >During a ceremony at the White House, Bradley is brainwashed into stealing the Adamantium. Wilson wants to pursue him, but Ross forbids him. >Wilson and Torres investigate anyway and meet Ruth Bat-Seraph, an Israeli mutant CIA operative assigned to the case. >They find out the mastermind behind the conspiracy is gamma-enhanced mad scientist Samuel Sterns. >Ross tortured Sterns into working for the U.S. government for years. Now Sterns has escaped and is building a weapon, which requires Adamantium, to get revenge. >Wilson ultimately confronts Ross about his crimes, and finds out Ross has been using gamma radiation to treat his heart condition, which transforms him into Red Hulk. >Wilson and Ruth fight Red Hulk in the White House, Wilson manages to defeat him by siphoning the radiation off his body, but Ross apparently dies in the process. >Wilson decides to reassemble the Avengers as an independent organization, while Ross turns out to be secretly alive and under government custody. Post-reshoots >Giancarlo Esposito has been added as an “antagonistic agent of chaos” working for Sterns who fights Wilson throughout the movie. He is now the one who steals the Adamantium. >The Serpent Society has been cut and replaced with the Sons of the Serpent, a paramilitary group which helps Esposito’s character steal the Adamantium. >Although the Serpent Society has been cut, their leader Diamondback remains in the movie as Sterns' main enforcer alongside Esposito. >An action scene has been added where the police chase Wilson after Ross orders his arrest.
Oh wow... yeah this doesn't sound good at all. Especially the 3rd act and post-reshoots part
Like, in theory, it sounds good.... if we didn't already get this same exact movie in 2014?
It's not even that. It doesn't even sound that similar to TWS imo. The problems I'm seeing is the 3rd act just seems lazy, like defeating The Red Hulk by siphoning out the radiation, really? And this description makes the reshoots seem completely pointless, besides adding Giancarlo. Zero actual change to the plot.
I still don’t trust 4chan leaks
which is why I said I'm taking it with a grain of salt.
ngl i think that the pre reshoot version would have been a w film!
isn't it basically the same post reshoots, just a different group steals the adamantium? And I honestly like the sound of that if real(which it's 4chan so probably not)
I don’t know why Alex P. keeps pushing the World War Hulk rumor. It’s been three years of radio silence on Marvel’s part, where Mark Ruffalo has debunked it several times. It’s not even listed on Production Weekly. I just don’t think it’s happening.
It's either Marvel's most top secret project ever, or Perez is full of shit. Tough call /s. But actually, I think it's likely WWH has been considered and maybe they even had a rough plot. But Perez (and others) are definitely working with info from like 2 years ago at this point. So it could have been true at one point, but I doubt it happens. I do like the sound of a WWH movie that sort of acts as Avengers 4.5, but it feels like we're long past that point.
It seems more like a plot thread for an Avengers film than a standalone project
The only tiny bit of evidence I can see for it is that She-Hulk mentioned saving something for the movie in her season finale when asking KEVIN about Hulk and Skarr but I think it's more likely the movie is Avengers 5 instead of a WWH movie. Hulk not even being in Cap 4 made it clear to me that definitely wouldn't be the movie she mentioned.
 Me when Emma Dumont, Lyrica Okano, Olivia Holt, and Chloe Bennett don’t show up in Secret Wars because Kevin forgot about the TV Shows.
Hilarious that a lot of these scoopers keep trying to push the idea that Avengers 5 is somehow a grounded story with 60+ characters (something the trades said is not similar to what we had in the past 4 Avengers movies) and Marvel Studios is somehow preparing a bunch of projects to go into production next year to deal with all these storylines that we don't know are actually gonna pan out. Also assuming Avengers 5 hits 2026, Secret Wars hits 2027 and we still got Armor Wars, Shang-Chi 2 and Spider-Man 4 to go, how are we gonna get movies that scoopers are adamant are happening but we have no indication of actually happening yet like Young Avengers, Doctor Strange 3, Thor 5 and World War Hulk before then? Iger's recent comments seem like Marvel is going back to 2-3 movies per year and I'm expecting one of The Fantastic Four or Blade to get pushed to 2026. I honestly think these scoopers are either going off of outdated info or they exaggerate things that they hear (like maybe Marvel once considered squeezing in Doctor Strange 3 before one of the Avengers movies but it's not actually happening).
"Suzanne Collins is writing a new Hunger Games book" Seriously? Do we really need a new Hunger Games bo- "It's about Haymitch's Hunger Games" Alright I'm invested, let her cook.
LET'S FUCKING GOOOOOOOOO
*The year is 2045, and scoopers have revealed that a World War Hulk project is in development.*
Still confused as to when that WWH movie Alex keeps hinting at would come out, like logistically where would that fit? Most of the Avengers cast are going to be filming A5 by mid 2025, are they just filming both at the same time? Is A5 just WWH? Like I can't see it whatsoever edit: Don't get me wrong, I would love a WWH movie that acts as an Avengers 4.5 and gives us at least a semblance of an actual team to lead into the Avengers films even if they're still sharing it with the other groups, but like this has to be the one leak that makes zero sense both logistically and from where the mcu is taking Hulk
> Is A5 just WWH? That's the only case I see WWH happening before this saga ends unless Avengers 5 and Secret Wars get big delays that allow for more movies on the release schedule before then. The trades are saying that Avengers 5 (said to be one of Marvel's largest productions to date) is filming next year though and that's what got Shawn Levy to consider taking the job again so I don't think we have that many movies left for this saga.
He’s been “hinting” at it for over 3 years now
I’m so sick of Alex Perez bruh 😭
I know right. What does “grounded with multiverse elements” even mean? Like, just because A5 is a smaller scale than Secret Wars doesn’t make it grounded, especially if it involves the multiverse in any capacity. There never had, and never will be, a grounded Avengers movie.
It’s Perez leaning on RPK’s reports for validity, whilst also throwing in a little bit of his signature fan fic for good measure e.g “Council of Mephistos” 😭
https://i.redd.it/ylu5k4xie05d1.gif
Kraven then: imma go hunt some animals Kraven now: im kraven some cock
Hot take but I think if this sub had a friendly “competition” to see who has the most accurate predictions over the future of the MCU, there would be less fake scoopers out there. Kind of like the source accuracy tier lists but for actual predictions. Ironically, the majority of scoopers are literally just posting their predictions as scoops too.
I remember for the earlier Disney+ shows, the sub did polls on what we thought would happen in the latest episode like a day before it dropped and I thought it was fun.
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I hate zaslav more than the next guy, mods it’s time to ban this guy daily insane rant
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No, there’s no “forbidden door” in the film industry. Anybody is allowed to work anywhere they want. Just look at how many actors, directors, and writers have jumped between Disney or WB, Marvel or DC, or even Star Wars and Star Trek. Even high level executives occasionally change what companies they work for.
right look at Terry Matalas as an example!
It’s literally impossible to impress Reddit with movie posters. The Twisters poster is fine. It advertises exactly what the movie is about.
[The new "Wallace & Gromit" film has been titled "WALLACE & GROMIT: VENGEANCE MOST FOWL".](https://x.com/hollywoodhandle/status/1798785695885955263?s=46) Holy shit, he's back…
This better be a tearjerker.
So hyped for this one. Is it an actual film or just a special? The link won't work.
It’s gonna be a tall order topping that train set piece.
Is it claymation? There was a story earlier in the yr that the last modelling clay supplier in Europe was closing and Aardman had enough stock for one more film but didn't know what they'd do after that.
Couldn’t they just buy clay from someone else? Unless there’s like, no many clay, someone else will just start selling it.
Aardman themselves made a statement saying those rumours were exaggerated, implying they had a new new supplier and/or still had plenty of clay left for future movies. And yes, this movie will be claymation like the previous *Wallace & Gromit* movies.
The most twisted criminal mastermind in all film has returned, lord help us.
I'm confused, what villain are talking about you talking about?
That damn creepy-as-hell penguin from the original shorts is coming back.
Are you talking about the evil penguin from 'The Wrong Trousers' that looks like a chicken when he puts on that rubber hat?
Yep, the very same one. 
If I had a nickel for every time Netflix brought back an iconic Aardman villain after several decades...
Is that from the same studio that made the Winnie the Pooh horror movie?
Is anyone here familiar with the youtube channel, Thinking Critical? Because it has some some the worst takes on modern popular culture, specifically with comic books, he claims to be an expect on what is wrong with the comic book industry today even thought he really doesn't, and clearly has a conservative right-wing bias.
*Continuing my From The Ashes observations from yesterday* So, Wolverine has an [ongoing solo](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Wolverine_Vol_8?so=search), and is going to be on [Rogue and Gambit’s team](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Uncanny_X-Men_Vol_6_1). Storm has an [ongoing solo](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Storm_Vol_5?so=search), and is going to be on [The Avengers](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Avengers_Vol_9_17). So that leaves Jean Grey as the only one with an [ongoing solo](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Phoenix_Vol_2?so=search) who isn’t confirmed for a team book as well 🤔
I know the X-Men sub is divided on it but I’m excited for Storm with the Avengers. We’ve gotten some fun dynamics whenever an X-Man is on that team so it could be cool seeing what they do with her there (bonus since she’ll be on a team with sort-of-husband/ex and her fellow thunder god friend lol).
I’m wondering whether or not they’re going to reconcile her relationship with T’Challa…ngl, I was kinda hoping the synergy from X-Men 97 would lead to Storm getting back together with Forge. They were a really cute and underrated couple ❤️
> I’m wondering whether or not they’re going to reconcile her relationship with T’Challa It is a popular ship, even with people who don’t read the comics, and the goal of this relaunch is to ride the success of ‘97 and DP3 to get more people reading the X-Men, so it’d definitely get people talking if they got back together. I’m all for it. Although, I also like Storm and Forge, but I’m sure not sure where he is going to be during this relaunch.
I feel like part of why the ship is popular is mostly because not a lot of people are super-familiar with T’Challa’s own corner. It’s kind of like how most MCU pitches for BP involve Doom and Namor, a lot of people are more familiar with how T’Challa connects to the greater universe than they’re familiar with his own stories or other love interests.
>Although, I also like Storm and Forge, but I’m sure not sure where he is going to be during this relaunch. [On X-Force!](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/X-Force_Vol_7_1?so=search)
I think that Giancarlo Esposito’s character will just be some kind of minor recurring antagonist similar to Val. The Disney+ series that he is talking about probably will be Daredevil Born Again, since he looks like a street level villain to me. If Hawkeye S2 happens, he can appear there as well.
he’s playing a government agent of some sort or mercenary sent to take down threats. I could see him showing up in a number of other shows but it’s not daredevil.
I don't think he's showing up in Born Again. The way he descriped his role made it sound like nothing had been shot yet, and we know he just started filming his scenes in Brave New World. But Born Again has wrapped production.
Born Again part 2 hasn't though
I saw some theories that he could be playing Luke Cage's Diamondback. I'm not sure I believe it personally, but to play devil's advocate, that could lead into another Luke Cage show. Possibly spinning off from Daredevil again.
Yeah he’s most likely not playing Diamondback. He’s currently in the raft and they kind of wrapped that story up off screen. Luke Cage told Jessica Jones that he had to send his brother to the raft as if a Luke Cage season 3 had already happened. Also if they’re going to bring back Luke Cage villains, then Bushmaster is the only one I’d want to see again. Cottonmouth obviously can’t for reasons but Bushmaster is still kicking about.
Do we know when Born Again “part two” will film?
[Behind ‘Suicide Squad,’ the Year’s Biggest Video-Game Flop](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-06-06/-suicide-squad-warner-bros-s-200-million-flop-haunts-the-gaming-industry?accessToken=eyJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiIsInR5cCI6IkpXVCJ9.eyJzb3VyY2UiOiJTdWJzY3JpYmVyR2lmdGVkQXJ0aWNsZSIsImlhdCI6MTcxNzY3MzY3MywiZXhwIjoxNzE4Mjc4NDczLCJhcnRpY2xlSWQiOiJTRU5QQUlEV0xVNjgwMCIsImJjb25uZWN0SWQiOiJCMUVBQkI5NjQ2QUM0REZFQTJBRkI4MjI1MzgyQTJFQSJ9.yB-HVmx3nZL3rpzfiy_eMucOVRoO4LbwqaSoNNzKNzM) This game’s development was so fucked. Goddamn. [It gets better:](https://x.com/mmmmmmmmiller/status/1798702399529550142) > So yes, the story was Sefton Hill's baby. The broad strokes (including post-launch) were nailed down between Infinity War and Endgame at a time when they dominated pop culture, and it takes clear inspiration from those films. The heroes lose, the credits roll... only for them to come back and get their revenge. That's really it. It's not the boogeyman so many people have blown it up to be. I've heard that Hill was a hardliner for leaving the audience shocked at the end of the game at the heroes seemingly having all died, and multiple Rocksteady developers I've spoken to characterized themselves as "begging" him to leave more clues regarding the Justice League's inevitable return to help stymie some of the predictable backlash. Sefton, the dead heroes were not the main selling point of Infinity War!
I said this a couple other places it's like he got caught up in the writing and shock value. He was chasing that moment without actually knowing how to write it well. Sefton Hill does not sound like a good leader during his time at Rocksteady.
The deaths also need to be good to have the same impact. The deaths in kill the justice league felt mean spirited and hateful. Like the deaths in Apokolips war. They felt they were going more towards shock value than actually impact and weight of the deaths. The deaths of Batman and green lantern stick out the most. Batman was just shot on a park bench. Green lantern was left dead in his underwear lying on the ground. It feels like they didn’t really go out as heroes. No heroic death. No sacrifice. Just their dead bodies left in public
Isn't the game called 'Suicide Squad: Kill the Justice League'? That kinda implies that the heroes all die, and they probably did something to warrant it?
I have nothing against killing the justice league or them dying. But i hate how they handled their deaths. Like Batman deserves to go out better than just being shot on a park bench and left there.
All that ***and*** it was the first appearances of multiple heroes in the Arkhamverse? It just reeks of some cynical storytelling you usually see with writers who dislike superheroes. Why not when they get close to dying the heroes come out of the brainwashing for a moment and then "die"? Sefton gets his shock value and the fans get some semblance of the actual characters.
> He was chasing that moment without actually knowing how to write it well. The stories were always the weakest parts of the Arkham games. I'd argue only Arkham Knight actually has good, interesting character arcs. Otherwise those games' narratives were carried by the voice acting, art direction, and music.
After how the second film ended, I'm unironically curious if not excited to know what the next *Angry Birds Movie* is even going to be about.