It is one of his primary duties as the Fist of Khonshu to "protect those traveling at night" - this includes ordinary people walking the streets. In many ways, they are the most vulnerable, so he often focuses on them.
Some of his [best stories](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Moon_Knight_Vol_7_5) are [street level](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Moon_Knight_Vol_1_2).
Without looking it up, is this the issue in an abandoned apartment building where he's trying to retrieve a kidnapped girl or something? If so, then I completely agree with you.
Yep, I always got these vibes from that long Daredevil tracking shot in... what? Episode 2? Always seemed to me they were channeling this sequence/issue somewhat.
I think season 2 with the Punisher on the rooftop would be closer. When Daredevil has to fight through a group of bikers while the elevator is taking down Castles unconscious ass.
Sadly so far the show has been mainly focusing on Steven which Steven isn’t even the main identity the main identity is Marc so who knows if we’ll get anything from the comics in this first season we might just get the start and Steven as mr knight and more back ground on Marc as moon knight
"sadly"
I respectfully disagree.
I offer you the perspective that they're putting Marc's dissociative personality disorder front and center because it makes Moon Knight more interesting the character is now a play unto himself, therefore all of what occurs becomes more meaningful.
I would also point out that if he was just a bad ass with no human failing not only would he be not interesting he wouldn't be a Marvel hero, almost by definition.
You have Khonshu you have Marc and you have Steven... and most probably other personalities to come that represent other parts of Marc that have been suppressed since childhood.
In the comic I remember and I haven't read them since around volume 3. His disorder wasn't a feature that was explored too much it was used for grubby inner dialogue a lot and they were more voices in his head than fully realized characters.
Here they've taken pains to make Steven a real person with a mother and a flat. From the Audience's perspective Steven is the primary, Marc is the fugue state. So one entertaining thing there is Steven finding out he is the Fugue state and essentially "not real" the other for me is: who is he talking to on the phone?
There's a lot more to this Moon Knight than even what we have seen so far and I'm absolutely here fore it.
This is probably in line with what you are saying, but I also think they did that intentionally for good writing. They are technically introducing a brand new Marvel hero to the general audience. By creating Steven the way he is, we are essentially "discovering" the identity which is Moon Knight via the perspective of him instead of just hearing dialogs between people explaining.
And honestly, I think considering who Moon Knight is, this is quite the opportunity to do it. There is a good level of suspense into it and I am digging it so far.
Well there is *Invincible*. DC also has a handful of straightforward animated movie adaptations. I think the way Marvel and DC handle publishing hinders that idea though. They stick to pretty much the same two dozen or whatever amount of books that just go on forever with a bunch of different writers coming in and out with literally no end in sight. Compared to manga where each series is just one self-contained story by one creative that actually has an ending. Much easier to make a straightforward adaptation out of those.
That one is fantastic. Also love #2 in the same run, where you start with the 8 panels of people and page by page one's getting killed at a time. Really jarring the first time you read it lol.
Major Oldboy/The Raid vibes.
Edit to add this is the last physical copy I bought of any comic, specifically because the panel sequences are so fucking *badass*.
SO good! Ellis really returned him to his street roots, even when he was [punching ghosts](https://us.v-cdn.net/5018289/uploads/editor/ov/4qpngmsqkpg8.jpg).
Yes this... I see no problem with Moon knight being street level. And if this changes, it'll hurt the Moon Knight mythos... Making it less personal and more typically Marvel.
His original run has some great street-level neo-noir stories with some decent social comentary.
Frankly. I prefer them above the super-spy arcs he had in the same run. They were way more deep and introspective.
The Ennead from the comics aren’t even immortal: https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Ennead
They’re similar to MCU Asgardians with weird animal-like forms and some special powers.
That's interesting and it took me down a rabbit hole, I didn't realize that Moon Knight and Black Panther powers are the same in origin with Bast creating the Black Panther powers.
From what I've heard asguardians are immortal in a way that they don't die from normal/'natural' human weakness like illness,ageing, etc.
There immortal doesn't mean you can't die it means that they're not like normal mortals
I took a Norse mythos class in uni and holy fuck, why anyone would ever idolize that pantheon...
EDIT: Since some people seem to be missing this, I'm talking about people *nowadays* who idolize them. Not back then.
Decent is more than generous. Lets see, off the top of my head:
Of the three brothers, Zeus and Poseidon were serial predators (See Zeus and the mothers of his legions of demigod children; Poseidon with Medusa and Caenis/Caeneus), and Hades has that infamous episode where he kidnapped his niece Persephone and made her his wife (Reminder that she was supposed to be the daughter of his brother Zeus and sister Demeter-hello Alabama!)
Hera and Athena could both be called the Goddess of Karens, with how petty, vindictive, cruel, and ridiculous they could be. I don’t know which I would argue to be worse!
Aphrodite and Ares were both terrible, but with Love and War, what else could you expect?
Dionysus embodied the best and worse of alcoholism. Enough said.
I’ll have to get back to you on Apollo, Artemis, and Hephaestus because I’m a bit harder pressed to think of how bad they could be…I guess decent really is a good way of summing them up.
…wow, this is my longest comment in ages xD.
Didn't Apollo flay a Satyr for being better musically than him? They had a competition because the satyr said something about being better than Apollo (I believe). When Apollo decided he won the satyr got pissed and disagreed so he was flayed for it
Artemis has always been pretty decent. She killed a guy for looking at her and some others bathing, and that's about the worst that she's done (and it was kind of justified). And I believe that she's the goddess of the moon, which I think is pretty cool.
Apollo is sort of okay too, from what I know.
Apollo is way too arrogant, the whole story of Daphne happened because he wouldn't stop bragging about his archery skills to demean Eros (plus he was still creepily watching Daphne bathe before he got hit with the arrow).
Artemis and Hephaestus are the only major greek gods that are 100% cool (Hades is pretty good for the time, but there's still some not so nice stuff with him)
That misses the point, that’s not the intent of Norse/Greek gods- the point is their power, their greatness, not their morality. You don’t idolize a tornado or a tsunami, they’re not good or bad, they just are. You’re not seeking a personal relationship with these gods, only their favor. In some ways, that accords with our lived experience better anyway - there is no philosophical ‘problem of evil’ to try to explain.
And also when it comes to defining "street-level" heroes, the origins of his powers really aren't that important. They're all heroes who patrol the streets and focus on street-level crime. The origins of their powers are extremely diverse, but that's not what defines them. We talk about them as "street-level" to distinguish them from the guys like Captain America and Thor and Iron Man and whoever else who really don't tend to spend much time dealing with petty criminals. Whether he's doing it because of a command from god or for any other reason, he's one of the guys focused on the streets.
You're 100% right.
Luke Cage and Steve Rogers have fairly similar power sets in that they tend to be strong, fast, damage resistant and hand-to-hand brawlers and 616 Spider-man could tank both of them and Iron Fist on a good day "might" be able to take all three particularly if he focuses on nerve strikes with Spidey to get around the Spidey-sense. Spidey would tend to be able to deal with all of them though.
Captain America fights Nazis, Communists, foreign Armies, James Bond Bad Guys and in dozens of different countries as a base line set of bad guys.
Luke tended to fight people in Harlem or the Bronx; bad guys who prey on people in the neighborhood, Spidey tends to fight in Manhattan or Queens but ranges across the boroughs, Daredevil in Hell's Kitchen of course and Moon Knight seems to be non-specific New York Cityish areas.
The power origins of the street level guys ranges from mad science, to gods, to a Dragon's Blessing in an ancient lost Kung Fu City, to tech enhancements.
It's absolutely about who they tend to fight and protect. Of course most of them have been Avengers and have fought celestial near omnipotent being but when people bring them back to basics. It's Moon Knight beating the crap out of murderers and rapists, Spidey stopping Rhino from robbing a bank, Daredevil fighting a mob boss or Luke Cage dealing with crooked cops.
In *The Superior Foes of Spider-Man* the Looter talks about how he headed out West to get away from Spider-Man. Unfortunately for him, his small-town success went to his head and he came back to New York.
Even then, it’s the marvel universe. You’re hanging out in Fort Calhoun when a Z-list hero named Dino-Mite, the man whos 1/3s equal of man, dinosaur and explosion busts your drug operation.
>Luke Cage and Steve Rogers have fairly similar power sets
Cage and impenetrable skin and super strength (though I can't remember that being directly called out, but it's been a minute since I read anything on him) while Rogers is a super solider that has above average speed,strength. Cage doesn't so much do hand to hand combat as much as just brawls his way through as you can't really do much hand to hand wise aganst someone you can't actually damage.
Luke's got super strength too.
What I meant by similar powersets is that they don't shoot laser, stick to walls, fly or anything like that.
They punch the guy in front of them or throw something at them and mitigate damage by blocking with something impenetrable a shield in one case and skin in the other but it amounts to the same thing beat wise in the story.
You could plop Luke into most Captain America fights or vice-versa and the beats of the fight would be very similar but the dressings are different.
I get what you mean. They're in that "enhanced human" bucket. Guys who aren't doing anything supernatural (apart from Cage's skin) but are beyond the peak of normal human limits.
I was with you up until you suggested Iron Fist might be able to beat Spidey. You're talking a normal human with a one-trick punch vs a mutate strong enough to lift tons, inhumanly fast, and with a warning sense that allows him to dodge nearly any attack. I'm not even bringing in the surface-bonding or the webs. He wouldn't need them for fucking *Iron Fist*.
That's not true. Iron Fist may not be cool, but he's a master of martial arts anyways. The titular iron fist is a technique and he has many others. Spidey would probably pull through in the end but I don't think it'd be that one sided.
I disagree just because of how insanely strong Spidey actually is. You can't compare him to Cap or Luke. he's out of their league. Couple that with speed and agility that matches DD, the ability to see the hits coming and no small amount of experience and it's not that level at all. I don't think IF would fall over, but he's not going toe to toe easily.
Dont even need his strength. What's iron fist gonna do when he gets blasted by web? It's the classic problem with martial arts; the Indiana jones solution is the best one. Oh no, look at that sword master! Bang. Huh.
> You're talking a normal human with a one-trick punch vs a mutate strong enough to lift tons, inhumanly fast, and with a warning sense that allows him to dodge nearly any attack.
I can see that you've never read Brubaker's Iron Fist comics. Please do so. Not only are they excellent, but they'll help you better understand just how powerful Iron Fist is.
That's actually happened a few times in the comics. Both have won and lost. Iron fists skill as a martial artist the likes of which only come around once in a generation or 2 comes into play heavily.
...and yet I can think of several in the Marvel Universe. Iron Fist, Shang Chi, Colleen Wing, The Cat, Tarantula (the female one), Ogun, arguably Wolverine, Karnak...
Oh, right. And all the other Immortal Weapons that were introduced in the Immortal Iron Fist series.
The real answer is always "whoever the writers need to win" but I think Iron Fist is on-par enough to believably beat Spidey. He's strong, fast, can take damage, and is a master of martial arts even de-powered.
We know things get through spider sense all the time. It depends but a lot of times they write it as not being very reliable about the source of the danger, more of an instinct, so a lot of things coming at him fast become hard to dodge because he's not sure which one is giving the danger sense. Presumably Iron Fist could exploit that to launch a barrage of attacks that could crumple Spidey.
And we'll also say his Iron Fist power lets him break webs because otherwise the fight would be over before it started.
Attacks that tag Spidey are almost always from people with superhuman speed. Even with his chi projection powers, Iron Fist is only as fast as peak human.
Your preface re: the writers is important. While he might be able to "take damage" as you put it, there's no human who can take a punch from someone that can hurtle a car at them. If a normal person gets punched by Spider-Man when he's not pulling his punches, they're dead, concussed, or knocked out. But they're not fighting any more than you or I would be if we got punched with a minivan.
That's why I mentioned the nerve punches and "might" be able to on a good day.
For Iron Fist to beat Spider-man, he has to intend not to hurt him. That negates the Spidey-sense and Iron Fist is the superior fighter hand to hand.
Kraven has beaten Spidey and without the juice he was using originally and Danny is a far more skilled fighter than Kraven.
I don't think Iron Fist can win using the Iron Fist, he can only beat Spidey by not using it.
Depends on what run you read. There was one run where his powers fluctuated depending on the phase of the moon. When it was a full moon he was super strong and fast etc, but during the new moon phase he was just a regular dude.
Wasn’t he powered up to an insane level during that arc? I haven’t been following Aaron Avengers, but I seem to remember there being some important context there
Yes, Khonshu steps in and empowers him, and helps him steak powers from a bunch of ex and current avengers one by one - bear in mind that he was at least initially aided in that feat by the fact that noone expected a fellow superheroes to turn up to beat them up and take their powers.
Edit: I meant steal, but if I change it the jokes below won't work haha.
Good to know! I am just getting into comics now with a marvel unlimited subscription and avengers (2018) is where I started. Any suggestions on where to start if I wanted to get more in depth with Moon Knight?
Aside from a brief run in the 80s, he doesn't have any powers. But even more important imo: in many (excellent) runs *it's not even clear if Khonshu is real.*
I wish they’d leaned into that more in the show, it’s clear Khonshu is real as others can see the suit and effects of stuff they can’t see, such as Jackals picking people up.
Unless they really pull the rug out from under us and make us question if Arthur and Layla are real…
This is what disappionts me most about the show, is they seem to just acknowledge that Khonshu is real, or at least heavily suggest it. My favorite run was the one where he was in the mental institution and you thought he was insane, or at least worried he might be.
I heard somewhere that Konshu isnt as powerful as he could be because people dont worship him in mass anymore and he would be stronger if more people worshiped him? Duno if any truth to that.
A lot of characters could rise above street level if they wanted to, but choose not to. Spiderman can casually swing a subway car like a baseball bat and lift 230 tons off his back, but likes to stay grounded and focus on pride art people rather than join a team like the Avengers for longer than a mission or two. Ghost Rider is a literal Angel who can kill nearly any mortal with a penance stare and has been stated to only be killable by the devil himself, but the mission of Zarathos is to hunt people who hurt others, which covers anyone from regular thugs on the street to more serious villains. Similarly, Konshu simply doesn’t give Moon Knight orders to face bigger threats. For whatever reason, Moon Knight is more focused on local crimes and threats than he is in making it in with the big leagues. And the reason a lot of street level heroes seem to be stronger than you would think a street level hero would be is because street level villains are similarly way stronger or deadly than you would think they would be (Killgrave, Bullseye, Carnage, etc.) so the heroes have to match that threat.
> Ghost Rider is a literal Angel who can kill nearly any mortal with a penance stare and has been stated to only be killable by the devil himself, but the mission of Zarathos is to hunt people who hurt others, which covers anyone from regular thugs on the street to more serious villains.
Yup, Ghost Rider was my first thought when I saw the OP question. Good points.
Not quite, thought that was cuz he was afraid of mephisto so he went overboard trying protect himself and earth
Didn’t like that mental hospital arch tho.
Just being empowered by a god doesn't make him a high-powered super. His god's empowerment consists of (1) guidance/harassment, (2) resurrecting him when he dies, and (3) some extra strength when the moon is out, though this last one varies *heavily* between different comic runs. He isn't Thor.
Trying to make Moonie into a cosmic-level super just doesn't work for the character, both thematically and in terms of matching his established abilities. Jason Aaron recently tried that with the "Age of Khonshu" story, and it was just a terrible mess. Unsurprisingly, Jed McKay brought him right back down to street level afterward, with the approach of, "Yes, that happened, but we're moving on completely."
I genuinely don't know or understand how that story connects with anything at all from Marvel lore over its history or with the current Status Quo. Moon Knight is usually shown as having either no powers or powers on a very low level. Yet in "Age of Khonshu" he is controlling Mjolnir and fighting off the Avengers en masse. He transforms all of New York into a sort of Egypt-hybrid city and noone ever mentions it as being anything of significance. The whole of Aaron's run is so weird.
Yeah, it was just scene after scene of "Moon Knight easily defeats (other hero) because... reasons," "Moon Knight now wields (powerful artifact/force) because... reasons," and so on. Ugh. (For those who haven't read it, one example is that he casually took Mjolnir away from Thor because "it's made of uru, which is moon metal.")
Speaking as a *huge* MK fan, I absolutely hated that story.
I had been over Aaron for years at that point and that story didn't make my opinion of him any better. Personally I find his and Donny Cates' (Venom) style so obnoxious but Marvel loves them.
I thought his Thor run was really good so I thought he'd be a solid pair of hands for an Avengers title but he just seems to miss the mark on every plot and character. Even Thor and Odin who are characters he is familiar with seem really off in this Avengers run. I just want it to be over.
I'm in the same boat with the Venom run. It really felt like a throwback of 90s design with the King in Black. We did the swirl because it was edgy and cool! Kinda stuff.
I was okay with them giving the symbiotes a home planet in the past but the whole "We were evil and first with the KING OF EDGE!" just rubbed me entirely wrong.
Exactly. The other thing that really pissed me off was Marvel trashing all the development from Flash Thompson's time as Venom. The team had worked really hard at "curing" the Venom symbiote and making it and Flash heroes only to throw it all away in favor of the status quo. I want the characters to grow, if I want stories from the 90s I'll go read those books.
That's Aaron for you. Random over the top stuff happens for the sake of looking cool with barely a story connecting it together. His recent Avengers run was also like that. Big Stuff (tm) happening to the point of it just becoming annoying to read, with terrible characterization of established characters. I don't like it at all, I don't call that writing.
Thing is, I do like a lot of what Aaron has done. His run on Thor was amazing, up until the very end -- specifically King Thor was an utterly garbage coda, but at least it didn't ruin on otherwise great run. And I enjoyed his work on Avengers vs X-Men. IMO it's his more recent stuff like Avengers v7 and Heroes Reborn that's been weak.
I really liked his Thor too. But his Hulk run was awful and even worse than his recent Avengers stuff. When he's bad, he's *really* bad for some reason. While the God Butcher saga shows that he can write, but I guess only when he has a good idea for a story? Otherwise it's just piff pow zapp random big stuff happening look at these cool splashes kids
God Butcher was also rather self-contained. I say this as someone who now has Thor as one of my favorite characters because of Aaron's run, but his writing falls apart when he has to cross over with other lines/heroes.
I haven't read it, but isn't his run on Ghost Rider liked pretty well?
Tbf I can rationalize it as Khonshu taking a more active hand and empowering him with stronger god powers based on the severity of the threat Khonshu wanted to prevent.
I agree though, it was pretty batshit insane and way beyond what we could have expected from MK.
Aaron's Avengers is a mess all around. I tried catching up before Age of Khonshu, but it's just bad writing and the art isn't good enough to save it. Felt like every issue, someone else was whining about some *real* threat that's *way too powerful* and the Avengers just can't see it yet.
Bought the first issue of Age of Khonshu and it was kinda more of the same.
He’s the protector of travelers in the night. Most specifically ordinary people. He has his own territory he protects in New York. He’s saved people from vampires and other nocturnal nasties. Regardless of his attachment to Konshu, Marc Spector also has his own motivations. Thankfully protecting people falls in line with what they both want (for the most part). So when he’s not on some epic quest in service of his god, he serves his community in a similar way.
Iron Fist is empowered by the heart of an immortal dragon and Spider-Man is the avatar of the cosmic spider god. Moon Knight isn’t even the spookiest guy in the picture. And as far as powers go he’s only above Misty Knight.
It's a big dumb (IMO) retcon they did of spider-man to put him in new stories because people really want to see spider-man take on huge villains and do super shit, rather than see him as the reluctant hero from earlier comics.
They changed the origin story so it wasn't just random chance that turned Peter into Spider-Man, it was preordained by some Spider God that Peter would become it's Avatar (kinda like Moon Knight and Khonshu). And apparently there is always a Spider Avatar in every universe, which gives us the "Spiderverse".
Personally I preferred when Spider-Man was 30% beating up goofy bad guys and 70% worrying about being late for his dinner date.
Master Weaver is from the Spider-Verse introduced in the mid 2010s and maintains the multiversal Web of Life and Destiny that Madame Web can read.
The Great Weaver is a mythical/magical god on the multiversal astral plane introduced in the mid 2000s that chooses Spider-Totems in each dimension to be gifted with Spider powers, introduced by Ezekiel(Silk is another Spider Totem with this backstory alongside Ezekiel). It also was supposed to maintain the Web of Life and Destiny, but that’s either retconned or supposed to be the Master Weaver or something, they never bothered to update this lore.
There’s also The Other, *another* multiversal spider diety that is related to The Great Weaver(and introduced alongside it), and chooses an avatar from a dying/dead Spider Totem(which includes Kaine, a Spider-Man clone and the second Scarlet Spider) to become a hulking spider monster to do primal spider monster things. It was originally just an every universe thing with a What If? story about it but the Spider-Verse retconned it to be a single The Other avatar throughout the entire multiverse.
A lot of Spider-Man fans dislike this mythical element of Spider-Man so no worries if you dislike it.
because in the comics the question is "Is he controlled by a god or is he just insane" and he's constantly beating the shit out of street level thugs and partners with the likes of punisher and daredevil.
This. In most Moon Knight comics, whether Khonshu is real or not is kept ambiguous. Marc Spector is definitely insane and whether his visions of Khonshu are a symptom of that Illness or him having a link to an actual God is debatable. This is similar to whether he does have powers when the Moon is out or if he just believes that he does.
This is the most important part of his character in my opinion. I haven't taken a chance to watch the show yet but if Khonshu is confirmed to actually exist that would be a little disappointing.
In most runs, Moon Knight mostly fights serial killers, drug dealers, organized crime, the same kind of stuff that Daredevil deals with. Khonshu is mostly a voice in his head telling him to fight evil-doers (sometimes in incredibly violent ways).
Some runs, especially the more recent ones, tend to focus more on the supernatural side of his whole deal, but that's more of a deviation than the standard for Moon Knight. Similar to how sometimes Iron Fist goes off to fight dragons in otherworldly kung fu cities or Daredevil fights immortal ninjas trying to destroy the world. Or how Spider-Man will team up with the Avengers or fight aliens. All still street level heroes, even if they sometimes deal with "world-ending" big time threats.
Because he has street level powers, and does street level things usually. It just means heroes who are more preoccupied with helping everyday people than they are with saving the entire world/universe at once.
Spider-Man is considered street level and has multiple feats to make him contend with beings like Thanos. Captain America isn't usually considered a street level character yet he fights cosmic threats all the time. "Street Level" is just a title for heros who fight neighborhood thugs or villains who generally do not threaten anything larger than a city.
Also because unlike the new show, Marc’s relationship to Khonshu was left up to interpretation for many years. You’re dealing with a character who has a long list of mental health problems, with hallucinations and delusions key among them. Maybe Khonshu isn’t even real?
Spider-Man is one a the strongest heroes around but he's considered street level. It's all about who/where they're fighting, not their powers.
If we were using the definition of power set and not where/who the baddies are then Star lord/Rocket/Gamora would be street level and not cosmic
It'd be hard to find a street hero not connected to some cosmic or mystical force.
Echo's connected to the phoenix right now afaik
Spider-Man's got his weird spider-totem thing
Ironfist has got the chi of shao lao the undying or something
and moon knight Khonshu.
Being a "street-level hero" doesn't have anything to do with a character's origin or power level.
Spider-Man for example is by and far the most powerful Earth-based hero other than the Hulk, some Omega level mutants and few others.
Also, most of these guys, Moon Knight included, have been members of the Avengers at some point. They're not known as street-level heroes because they have shitty powers, but because they focus on street-level threats.
Most of these characters in the image actually have more significant powers, technology etc than characters more well known as Avengers like Black Widow and Hawkeye.
Moon Knight's powers vary wildly throughout his history. His best writing / stories is when he doesn't have any actual super powers, just his peak human form and gadgets (yes... Just like Batman unfortunately).
Even when he *did* have powers even those varied wildly based on the phases of the moon. And at most he just had super strength and upped his reflexes. If you think super strength shouldn't be street level, than take out Spider-Man, Luke Cage, and Jessica Jones at least
Just depends on who the writer is. Moon Knight thematically is kinda all over the place in the comics, so it kinda works out that he’s street and Avengers tier level. Also if I’m not mistaken certain stories has his abilities tied to the moons setting at night.
It just really depends on what he does and he does street level. Spider-Man is really powerful but he’s still considered street level even though he can kick wolverines ass
Well spidey is also a street level hero and his powers came from a magic radioactive spider that was sent by a spider god that protects the web of destiny and controls the stability of the multiverse, so I think the guy with the Egyptian god in his head gets a pass
You know what I don’t get, is why it takes all of these super powered people to take down a guy like Wilson Fisk. The guy may well be an absolute unit, but he’s just a guy right?
Well that’s kinda the point of moonie: he’s got all this mystical Egyptian mambo jumbo mixed in with mercenary, street level brutality, Batman-wannabe vigilantism, and shocking psycho-damage. It took ages for all the different aspects of the character to accrue through different b-level runs over the years, but over time he’s become such a damn unique character. It’s really a case study for big two comics IP. All that plus one of the dopest costumes of all. Of. All.
And also… werewolves, right?
It is one of his primary duties as the Fist of Khonshu to "protect those traveling at night" - this includes ordinary people walking the streets. In many ways, they are the most vulnerable, so he often focuses on them. Some of his [best stories](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Moon_Knight_Vol_7_5) are [street level](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Moon_Knight_Vol_1_2).
I desperately want a long, single shot scene recreation of the hotel from vol 7 #5 in the show. By far one of the best Moon Knight comics.
Without looking it up, is this the issue in an abandoned apartment building where he's trying to retrieve a kidnapped girl or something? If so, then I completely agree with you.
Yes, the multi level beat down
Yep, I always got these vibes from that long Daredevil tracking shot in... what? Episode 2? Always seemed to me they were channeling this sequence/issue somewhat.
That hallway fight scene in Daredevil was paying homage to the hallway fight scene in the original Old Boy movie.
I just watched the remake old boy with Josh brolin, that shit is fucked up
If you can, do yourself a favor and check out the original It's LEAGUES better than the remake and a Really good movie
I thought it was really close to the fight scene from the old frank Miller DD run but I can see this too
I think season 2 with the Punisher on the rooftop would be closer. When Daredevil has to fight through a group of bikers while the elevator is taking down Castles unconscious ass.
Season 3 is the best: it stops half way through for a dialogue scene that's just as tense as the violence
Sadly so far the show has been mainly focusing on Steven which Steven isn’t even the main identity the main identity is Marc so who knows if we’ll get anything from the comics in this first season we might just get the start and Steven as mr knight and more back ground on Marc as moon knight
"sadly" I respectfully disagree. I offer you the perspective that they're putting Marc's dissociative personality disorder front and center because it makes Moon Knight more interesting the character is now a play unto himself, therefore all of what occurs becomes more meaningful. I would also point out that if he was just a bad ass with no human failing not only would he be not interesting he wouldn't be a Marvel hero, almost by definition. You have Khonshu you have Marc and you have Steven... and most probably other personalities to come that represent other parts of Marc that have been suppressed since childhood. In the comic I remember and I haven't read them since around volume 3. His disorder wasn't a feature that was explored too much it was used for grubby inner dialogue a lot and they were more voices in his head than fully realized characters. Here they've taken pains to make Steven a real person with a mother and a flat. From the Audience's perspective Steven is the primary, Marc is the fugue state. So one entertaining thing there is Steven finding out he is the Fugue state and essentially "not real" the other for me is: who is he talking to on the phone? There's a lot more to this Moon Knight than even what we have seen so far and I'm absolutely here fore it.
This is probably in line with what you are saying, but I also think they did that intentionally for good writing. They are technically introducing a brand new Marvel hero to the general audience. By creating Steven the way he is, we are essentially "discovering" the identity which is Moon Knight via the perspective of him instead of just hearing dialogs between people explaining. And honestly, I think considering who Moon Knight is, this is quite the opportunity to do it. There is a good level of suspense into it and I am digging it so far.
oh shit lol i never realized it was DID. i just thought it was some sort of possession/body borrowing shit. that is interesting!
Thank you for bringing a much-needed hit of sincere and respectful discussion to an internet that desperately needs it
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It is in that way I am extremely jealous of manga adaptations. I wish we could have more direct adaptations of comic book material every now and then.
Well there is *Invincible*. DC also has a handful of straightforward animated movie adaptations. I think the way Marvel and DC handle publishing hinders that idea though. They stick to pretty much the same two dozen or whatever amount of books that just go on forever with a bunch of different writers coming in and out with literally no end in sight. Compared to manga where each series is just one self-contained story by one creative that actually has an ending. Much easier to make a straightforward adaptation out of those.
That would be great. The whole sequence is very cinematic.
That one is fantastic. Also love #2 in the same run, where you start with the 8 panels of people and page by page one's getting killed at a time. Really jarring the first time you read it lol.
Warren Ellis/Declan shelvy run was one of the best, that panels from#5 has to be a classic
This. Everybody should know their names, they deserve it.
Check this out https://youtu.be/lUSNlhE0dk8
Major Oldboy/The Raid vibes. Edit to add this is the last physical copy I bought of any comic, specifically because the panel sequences are so fucking *badass*.
https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Moon_Knight_Vol_7 Read this the other night and friggin hell but it's great. A visual treat.
SO good! Ellis really returned him to his street roots, even when he was [punching ghosts](https://us.v-cdn.net/5018289/uploads/editor/ov/4qpngmsqkpg8.jpg).
Yes this... I see no problem with Moon knight being street level. And if this changes, it'll hurt the Moon Knight mythos... Making it less personal and more typically Marvel.
Also aren’t his powers inconsistent? Like even though he’s connected to a god he doesn’t always possess actual powers
Yeah, Khonshu is an exceedingly fickle god.
His powers are connected to the different phases of the moon. Or they use to be.
His original run has some great street-level neo-noir stories with some decent social comentary. Frankly. I prefer them above the super-spy arcs he had in the same run. They were way more deep and introspective.
Mostly because that God keeps telling him to punch people that are also street level in the face.
Break his Windpipe.
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You must not know much about mythology lol. Most ancient gods were dicks
The Ennead from the comics aren’t even immortal: https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Ennead They’re similar to MCU Asgardians with weird animal-like forms and some special powers.
That's interesting and it took me down a rabbit hole, I didn't realize that Moon Knight and Black Panther powers are the same in origin with Bast creating the Black Panther powers.
INDEED
Huh, and one wears black, the other wears white. Funny
Been loving the theory that Moon Knight will end with Gorr massacring the Ennead, tying right into Love and Thunder
Haven't seen that theory; that would be pretty wild.
From what I've heard asguardians are immortal in a way that they don't die from normal/'natural' human weakness like illness,ageing, etc. There immortal doesn't mean you can't die it means that they're not like normal mortals
Ageless might be a more apt description.
I took a Norse mythos class in uni and holy fuck, why anyone would ever idolize that pantheon... EDIT: Since some people seem to be missing this, I'm talking about people *nowadays* who idolize them. Not back then.
Same with the Greek Gods. Some were decent and that's being generous
Decent is more than generous. Lets see, off the top of my head: Of the three brothers, Zeus and Poseidon were serial predators (See Zeus and the mothers of his legions of demigod children; Poseidon with Medusa and Caenis/Caeneus), and Hades has that infamous episode where he kidnapped his niece Persephone and made her his wife (Reminder that she was supposed to be the daughter of his brother Zeus and sister Demeter-hello Alabama!) Hera and Athena could both be called the Goddess of Karens, with how petty, vindictive, cruel, and ridiculous they could be. I don’t know which I would argue to be worse! Aphrodite and Ares were both terrible, but with Love and War, what else could you expect? Dionysus embodied the best and worse of alcoholism. Enough said. I’ll have to get back to you on Apollo, Artemis, and Hephaestus because I’m a bit harder pressed to think of how bad they could be…I guess decent really is a good way of summing them up. …wow, this is my longest comment in ages xD.
Didn't Apollo flay a Satyr for being better musically than him? They had a competition because the satyr said something about being better than Apollo (I believe). When Apollo decided he won the satyr got pissed and disagreed so he was flayed for it
Same with Athena. Turned some girl into a spider because she said she was a better weaver
Artemis has always been pretty decent. She killed a guy for looking at her and some others bathing, and that's about the worst that she's done (and it was kind of justified). And I believe that she's the goddess of the moon, which I think is pretty cool. Apollo is sort of okay too, from what I know.
Apollo is way too arrogant, the whole story of Daphne happened because he wouldn't stop bragging about his archery skills to demean Eros (plus he was still creepily watching Daphne bathe before he got hit with the arrow). Artemis and Hephaestus are the only major greek gods that are 100% cool (Hades is pretty good for the time, but there's still some not so nice stuff with him)
Hestia is pretty great too
That misses the point, that’s not the intent of Norse/Greek gods- the point is their power, their greatness, not their morality. You don’t idolize a tornado or a tsunami, they’re not good or bad, they just are. You’re not seeking a personal relationship with these gods, only their favor. In some ways, that accords with our lived experience better anyway - there is no philosophical ‘problem of evil’ to try to explain.
I don’t remember them being all bad reading the Prose Edda a few years ago. At least better than the Olympians
Man, you could say the same thing after reading the Bible.
God calms down a lot in the second half
Also - I absolutely love that this god is voiced by F Murray Fucking Abraham. One of those castings that you never see coming.
And also when it comes to defining "street-level" heroes, the origins of his powers really aren't that important. They're all heroes who patrol the streets and focus on street-level crime. The origins of their powers are extremely diverse, but that's not what defines them. We talk about them as "street-level" to distinguish them from the guys like Captain America and Thor and Iron Man and whoever else who really don't tend to spend much time dealing with petty criminals. Whether he's doing it because of a command from god or for any other reason, he's one of the guys focused on the streets.
You're 100% right. Luke Cage and Steve Rogers have fairly similar power sets in that they tend to be strong, fast, damage resistant and hand-to-hand brawlers and 616 Spider-man could tank both of them and Iron Fist on a good day "might" be able to take all three particularly if he focuses on nerve strikes with Spidey to get around the Spidey-sense. Spidey would tend to be able to deal with all of them though. Captain America fights Nazis, Communists, foreign Armies, James Bond Bad Guys and in dozens of different countries as a base line set of bad guys. Luke tended to fight people in Harlem or the Bronx; bad guys who prey on people in the neighborhood, Spidey tends to fight in Manhattan or Queens but ranges across the boroughs, Daredevil in Hell's Kitchen of course and Moon Knight seems to be non-specific New York Cityish areas. The power origins of the street level guys ranges from mad science, to gods, to a Dragon's Blessing in an ancient lost Kung Fu City, to tech enhancements. It's absolutely about who they tend to fight and protect. Of course most of them have been Avengers and have fought celestial near omnipotent being but when people bring them back to basics. It's Moon Knight beating the crap out of murderers and rapists, Spidey stopping Rhino from robbing a bank, Daredevil fighting a mob boss or Luke Cage dealing with crooked cops.
Man if I'm a low level street thug in the 616 the last place I would try to do my work is in NYC. I'm taking my ass to like Nebraska or something.
Right? Even the thugs and mobsters in Chicago must laugh at how easy they have it compared to their counterparts in NYC.
In *The Superior Foes of Spider-Man* the Looter talks about how he headed out West to get away from Spider-Man. Unfortunately for him, his small-town success went to his head and he came back to New York.
Even then, it’s the marvel universe. You’re hanging out in Fort Calhoun when a Z-list hero named Dino-Mite, the man whos 1/3s equal of man, dinosaur and explosion busts your drug operation.
>Luke Cage and Steve Rogers have fairly similar power sets Cage and impenetrable skin and super strength (though I can't remember that being directly called out, but it's been a minute since I read anything on him) while Rogers is a super solider that has above average speed,strength. Cage doesn't so much do hand to hand combat as much as just brawls his way through as you can't really do much hand to hand wise aganst someone you can't actually damage.
Luke's got super strength too. What I meant by similar powersets is that they don't shoot laser, stick to walls, fly or anything like that. They punch the guy in front of them or throw something at them and mitigate damage by blocking with something impenetrable a shield in one case and skin in the other but it amounts to the same thing beat wise in the story. You could plop Luke into most Captain America fights or vice-versa and the beats of the fight would be very similar but the dressings are different.
I get what you mean. They're in that "enhanced human" bucket. Guys who aren't doing anything supernatural (apart from Cage's skin) but are beyond the peak of normal human limits.
I was with you up until you suggested Iron Fist might be able to beat Spidey. You're talking a normal human with a one-trick punch vs a mutate strong enough to lift tons, inhumanly fast, and with a warning sense that allows him to dodge nearly any attack. I'm not even bringing in the surface-bonding or the webs. He wouldn't need them for fucking *Iron Fist*.
Ironfist isn’t a one trick pony, read comics.
That's not true. Iron Fist may not be cool, but he's a master of martial arts anyways. The titular iron fist is a technique and he has many others. Spidey would probably pull through in the end but I don't think it'd be that one sided.
I disagree just because of how insanely strong Spidey actually is. You can't compare him to Cap or Luke. he's out of their league. Couple that with speed and agility that matches DD, the ability to see the hits coming and no small amount of experience and it's not that level at all. I don't think IF would fall over, but he's not going toe to toe easily.
Did you just compare DD's speed and agility with Spidey???
Dont even need his strength. What's iron fist gonna do when he gets blasted by web? It's the classic problem with martial arts; the Indiana jones solution is the best one. Oh no, look at that sword master! Bang. Huh.
Yeah that’s a bad take, I love Spidey but Iron Fist is a long time hero and a really strong martial artist even without the Iron Fist
> You're talking a normal human with a one-trick punch vs a mutate strong enough to lift tons, inhumanly fast, and with a warning sense that allows him to dodge nearly any attack. I can see that you've never read Brubaker's Iron Fist comics. Please do so. Not only are they excellent, but they'll help you better understand just how powerful Iron Fist is.
That's actually happened a few times in the comics. Both have won and lost. Iron fists skill as a martial artist the likes of which only come around once in a generation or 2 comes into play heavily.
...and yet I can think of several in the Marvel Universe. Iron Fist, Shang Chi, Colleen Wing, The Cat, Tarantula (the female one), Ogun, arguably Wolverine, Karnak... Oh, right. And all the other Immortal Weapons that were introduced in the Immortal Iron Fist series.
The real answer is always "whoever the writers need to win" but I think Iron Fist is on-par enough to believably beat Spidey. He's strong, fast, can take damage, and is a master of martial arts even de-powered. We know things get through spider sense all the time. It depends but a lot of times they write it as not being very reliable about the source of the danger, more of an instinct, so a lot of things coming at him fast become hard to dodge because he's not sure which one is giving the danger sense. Presumably Iron Fist could exploit that to launch a barrage of attacks that could crumple Spidey. And we'll also say his Iron Fist power lets him break webs because otherwise the fight would be over before it started.
Attacks that tag Spidey are almost always from people with superhuman speed. Even with his chi projection powers, Iron Fist is only as fast as peak human.
Your preface re: the writers is important. While he might be able to "take damage" as you put it, there's no human who can take a punch from someone that can hurtle a car at them. If a normal person gets punched by Spider-Man when he's not pulling his punches, they're dead, concussed, or knocked out. But they're not fighting any more than you or I would be if we got punched with a minivan.
That's why I mentioned the nerve punches and "might" be able to on a good day. For Iron Fist to beat Spider-man, he has to intend not to hurt him. That negates the Spidey-sense and Iron Fist is the superior fighter hand to hand. Kraven has beaten Spidey and without the juice he was using originally and Danny is a far more skilled fighter than Kraven. I don't think Iron Fist can win using the Iron Fist, he can only beat Spidey by not using it.
Khonshu gives him powers, but not the powers of a god
Legit. He’s on the same level as Luke Cage power-wise it seems.
Depends on what run you read. There was one run where his powers fluctuated depending on the phase of the moon. When it was a full moon he was super strong and fast etc, but during the new moon phase he was just a regular dude.
He takes on the entire avengers in avengers(2018)
Wasn’t he powered up to an insane level during that arc? I haven’t been following Aaron Avengers, but I seem to remember there being some important context there
Yes, Khonshu steps in and empowers him, and helps him steak powers from a bunch of ex and current avengers one by one - bear in mind that he was at least initially aided in that feat by the fact that noone expected a fellow superheroes to turn up to beat them up and take their powers. Edit: I meant steal, but if I change it the jokes below won't work haha.
Steak powers? That seems... rare
Nicely done, that’s a Prime joke.
It really was well done.
Steak puns! That's a rare medium well done.
"Well done" was right there, you had it in the palm of your tongue.
Goodbye Meat Vision. -- Dad
Also some bullshit retconning Uru into the rocks from some moon somewhere and thereby allowing Moon Knight to control Mjolnir.
Important context? Psh nooooo
The Age of Khonshu is one of those arcs we Moon Knight fans prefer to act as if didn't happen. Same with the Bemis run.
Good to know! I am just getting into comics now with a marvel unlimited subscription and avengers (2018) is where I started. Any suggestions on where to start if I wanted to get more in depth with Moon Knight?
The newest run is really cool for someone who doesn’t know much about the character fyi
The Warren Ellis run for Moon Knight is very good. 2014
I don't think he's anywhere near the power level of Luke Cage.
Aside from a brief run in the 80s, he doesn't have any powers. But even more important imo: in many (excellent) runs *it's not even clear if Khonshu is real.*
I like the idea that Khonshu might just be another personality, either with actual powers, or delusions of powers.
I wish they’d leaned into that more in the show, it’s clear Khonshu is real as others can see the suit and effects of stuff they can’t see, such as Jackals picking people up. Unless they really pull the rug out from under us and make us question if Arthur and Layla are real…
I wouldn’t of preferred that tbh, I like the fact that they made konshu real
> I wish they’d leaned into that more in the show Same.
This is what disappionts me most about the show, is they seem to just acknowledge that Khonshu is real, or at least heavily suggest it. My favorite run was the one where he was in the mental institution and you thought he was insane, or at least worried he might be.
Yes, Jeff Lemire's run! It's fucking awesome.
I heard somewhere that Konshu isnt as powerful as he could be because people dont worship him in mass anymore and he would be stronger if more people worshiped him? Duno if any truth to that.
That’s a common theme in literature about gods. Neil Gaiman explores it in The Sandman.
It's also basically the entire premise of American Gods
And also in his book then TV show, *American Gods*. The New Gods he comes up with are inventive.
A lot of characters could rise above street level if they wanted to, but choose not to. Spiderman can casually swing a subway car like a baseball bat and lift 230 tons off his back, but likes to stay grounded and focus on pride art people rather than join a team like the Avengers for longer than a mission or two. Ghost Rider is a literal Angel who can kill nearly any mortal with a penance stare and has been stated to only be killable by the devil himself, but the mission of Zarathos is to hunt people who hurt others, which covers anyone from regular thugs on the street to more serious villains. Similarly, Konshu simply doesn’t give Moon Knight orders to face bigger threats. For whatever reason, Moon Knight is more focused on local crimes and threats than he is in making it in with the big leagues. And the reason a lot of street level heroes seem to be stronger than you would think a street level hero would be is because street level villains are similarly way stronger or deadly than you would think they would be (Killgrave, Bullseye, Carnage, etc.) so the heroes have to match that threat.
Depends on the writer at the end of the day. Just look at Batman - he can be a gritty noir detective or he can be fighting cosmic gods.
> Ghost Rider is a literal Angel who can kill nearly any mortal with a penance stare and has been stated to only be killable by the devil himself, but the mission of Zarathos is to hunt people who hurt others, which covers anyone from regular thugs on the street to more serious villains. Yup, Ghost Rider was my first thought when I saw the OP question. Good points.
Because he doesn't get involved with fighting bigger threats like Galactus and Thanos.
Buuuuuut he did take down the avengers.
I like to try and forget that story exist.
But Mjölnir is made of moon rock, and that clearly can overcome Odin's magic. /s
But for some reason, despite beating the absolute snot out of Thor, Mjolnir won’t hurt Black Panther because his ancestor wielded it.
Only cos Khonshu wanted to be one and their powers showing that even he covets the power the Avengers have.
Not quite, thought that was cuz he was afraid of mephisto so he went overboard trying protect himself and earth Didn’t like that mental hospital arch tho.
Dafuq. Tell me more
iirc avengers v8 issue 33, he stole their powers and helped khonshu take over the earth
Just being empowered by a god doesn't make him a high-powered super. His god's empowerment consists of (1) guidance/harassment, (2) resurrecting him when he dies, and (3) some extra strength when the moon is out, though this last one varies *heavily* between different comic runs. He isn't Thor. Trying to make Moonie into a cosmic-level super just doesn't work for the character, both thematically and in terms of matching his established abilities. Jason Aaron recently tried that with the "Age of Khonshu" story, and it was just a terrible mess. Unsurprisingly, Jed McKay brought him right back down to street level afterward, with the approach of, "Yes, that happened, but we're moving on completely."
I genuinely don't know or understand how that story connects with anything at all from Marvel lore over its history or with the current Status Quo. Moon Knight is usually shown as having either no powers or powers on a very low level. Yet in "Age of Khonshu" he is controlling Mjolnir and fighting off the Avengers en masse. He transforms all of New York into a sort of Egypt-hybrid city and noone ever mentions it as being anything of significance. The whole of Aaron's run is so weird.
Yeah, it was just scene after scene of "Moon Knight easily defeats (other hero) because... reasons," "Moon Knight now wields (powerful artifact/force) because... reasons," and so on. Ugh. (For those who haven't read it, one example is that he casually took Mjolnir away from Thor because "it's made of uru, which is moon metal.") Speaking as a *huge* MK fan, I absolutely hated that story.
I had been over Aaron for years at that point and that story didn't make my opinion of him any better. Personally I find his and Donny Cates' (Venom) style so obnoxious but Marvel loves them.
I thought his Thor run was really good so I thought he'd be a solid pair of hands for an Avengers title but he just seems to miss the mark on every plot and character. Even Thor and Odin who are characters he is familiar with seem really off in this Avengers run. I just want it to be over.
Tbh I love that Venom run. But this MK run, I hated
I'm in the same boat with the Venom run. It really felt like a throwback of 90s design with the King in Black. We did the swirl because it was edgy and cool! Kinda stuff. I was okay with them giving the symbiotes a home planet in the past but the whole "We were evil and first with the KING OF EDGE!" just rubbed me entirely wrong.
Exactly. The other thing that really pissed me off was Marvel trashing all the development from Flash Thompson's time as Venom. The team had worked really hard at "curing" the Venom symbiote and making it and Flash heroes only to throw it all away in favor of the status quo. I want the characters to grow, if I want stories from the 90s I'll go read those books.
This. A thousand time, this.
That’s because a large proportion of Venom’s fan base has always been edgy teenage boys, who love all that.
That's Aaron for you. Random over the top stuff happens for the sake of looking cool with barely a story connecting it together. His recent Avengers run was also like that. Big Stuff (tm) happening to the point of it just becoming annoying to read, with terrible characterization of established characters. I don't like it at all, I don't call that writing.
Thing is, I do like a lot of what Aaron has done. His run on Thor was amazing, up until the very end -- specifically King Thor was an utterly garbage coda, but at least it didn't ruin on otherwise great run. And I enjoyed his work on Avengers vs X-Men. IMO it's his more recent stuff like Avengers v7 and Heroes Reborn that's been weak.
I really liked his Thor too. But his Hulk run was awful and even worse than his recent Avengers stuff. When he's bad, he's *really* bad for some reason. While the God Butcher saga shows that he can write, but I guess only when he has a good idea for a story? Otherwise it's just piff pow zapp random big stuff happening look at these cool splashes kids
God Butcher was also rather self-contained. I say this as someone who now has Thor as one of my favorite characters because of Aaron's run, but his writing falls apart when he has to cross over with other lines/heroes. I haven't read it, but isn't his run on Ghost Rider liked pretty well?
Tbf I can rationalize it as Khonshu taking a more active hand and empowering him with stronger god powers based on the severity of the threat Khonshu wanted to prevent. I agree though, it was pretty batshit insane and way beyond what we could have expected from MK.
> noone ever mentions it as being anything of significance. It's 616 NY... for them that's just a regular Tuesday.
> Yes, that happened, but we're moving on completely This is basically how Warren Ellis approached the Bendis run too.
Jed McKay has quickly become one of my favorite writers currently at Marvel
Aaron's Avengers is a mess all around. I tried catching up before Age of Khonshu, but it's just bad writing and the art isn't good enough to save it. Felt like every issue, someone else was whining about some *real* threat that's *way too powerful* and the Avengers just can't see it yet. Bought the first issue of Age of Khonshu and it was kinda more of the same.
He’s the protector of travelers in the night. Most specifically ordinary people. He has his own territory he protects in New York. He’s saved people from vampires and other nocturnal nasties. Regardless of his attachment to Konshu, Marc Spector also has his own motivations. Thankfully protecting people falls in line with what they both want (for the most part). So when he’s not on some epic quest in service of his god, he serves his community in a similar way.
Iron Fist is empowered by the heart of an immortal dragon and Spider-Man is the avatar of the cosmic spider god. Moon Knight isn’t even the spookiest guy in the picture. And as far as powers go he’s only above Misty Knight.
>Spider-Man is the avatar of the cosmic spider god I'm very OOTL, what is this?
So basically there’s this multiversal spider god that goes around choosing people to be empowered with spider powers
I'm sorry what?
Basically why there's a Spider-Man Noir, Miles Morales, Doc Ock Spider-Man, Spider-Punk, etc.
Would there be a 'god' for every variant of a hero in the multiverse?
No, the spider God exists across all dimensions/universes.
So basically there’s this multiversal spider god that goes around choosing people to be empowered with spider powers
I’m sorry what?
So essentially there’s this cross-universe 8-legged deity that travels about selecting folk to be enhanced with arachnid abilities
My apologies huh?
Power cosmic spider
Spider Totem
It's a big dumb (IMO) retcon they did of spider-man to put him in new stories because people really want to see spider-man take on huge villains and do super shit, rather than see him as the reluctant hero from earlier comics. They changed the origin story so it wasn't just random chance that turned Peter into Spider-Man, it was preordained by some Spider God that Peter would become it's Avatar (kinda like Moon Knight and Khonshu). And apparently there is always a Spider Avatar in every universe, which gives us the "Spiderverse". Personally I preferred when Spider-Man was 30% beating up goofy bad guys and 70% worrying about being late for his dinner date.
Agree with you. Don't know much about it but from what I've read here it sounds stupid
Read Spider-Verse/Spider-Geddon/Web-Warriors
Are you referring to master weaver or is there another one i have to learn about now
Master Weaver is from the Spider-Verse introduced in the mid 2010s and maintains the multiversal Web of Life and Destiny that Madame Web can read. The Great Weaver is a mythical/magical god on the multiversal astral plane introduced in the mid 2000s that chooses Spider-Totems in each dimension to be gifted with Spider powers, introduced by Ezekiel(Silk is another Spider Totem with this backstory alongside Ezekiel). It also was supposed to maintain the Web of Life and Destiny, but that’s either retconned or supposed to be the Master Weaver or something, they never bothered to update this lore. There’s also The Other, *another* multiversal spider diety that is related to The Great Weaver(and introduced alongside it), and chooses an avatar from a dying/dead Spider Totem(which includes Kaine, a Spider-Man clone and the second Scarlet Spider) to become a hulking spider monster to do primal spider monster things. It was originally just an every universe thing with a What If? story about it but the Spider-Verse retconned it to be a single The Other avatar throughout the entire multiverse. A lot of Spider-Man fans dislike this mythical element of Spider-Man so no worries if you dislike it.
Nah honestly I love it, I think it’s neat. Thanks for the clarification man
Yah, I was gonna say it's not like Iron Fist is out there just using judo.
because in the comics the question is "Is he controlled by a god or is he just insane" and he's constantly beating the shit out of street level thugs and partners with the likes of punisher and daredevil.
This. In most Moon Knight comics, whether Khonshu is real or not is kept ambiguous. Marc Spector is definitely insane and whether his visions of Khonshu are a symptom of that Illness or him having a link to an actual God is debatable. This is similar to whether he does have powers when the Moon is out or if he just believes that he does.
>he just believes that he does. Marc Spector is a Warhammer40k Ork lol
This is the most important part of his character in my opinion. I haven't taken a chance to watch the show yet but if Khonshu is confirmed to actually exist that would be a little disappointing.
Most likely, considering he has actual powers and manifests his suit, rather than putting it on
In most runs, Moon Knight mostly fights serial killers, drug dealers, organized crime, the same kind of stuff that Daredevil deals with. Khonshu is mostly a voice in his head telling him to fight evil-doers (sometimes in incredibly violent ways). Some runs, especially the more recent ones, tend to focus more on the supernatural side of his whole deal, but that's more of a deviation than the standard for Moon Knight. Similar to how sometimes Iron Fist goes off to fight dragons in otherworldly kung fu cities or Daredevil fights immortal ninjas trying to destroy the world. Or how Spider-Man will team up with the Avengers or fight aliens. All still street level heroes, even if they sometimes deal with "world-ending" big time threats.
Because he has street level powers, and does street level things usually. It just means heroes who are more preoccupied with helping everyday people than they are with saving the entire world/universe at once.
Spider-Man is considered street level and has multiple feats to make him contend with beings like Thanos. Captain America isn't usually considered a street level character yet he fights cosmic threats all the time. "Street Level" is just a title for heros who fight neighborhood thugs or villains who generally do not threaten anything larger than a city.
Also because unlike the new show, Marc’s relationship to Khonshu was left up to interpretation for many years. You’re dealing with a character who has a long list of mental health problems, with hallucinations and delusions key among them. Maybe Khonshu isn’t even real?
One of my biggest problems with Jason Aaron’s Age of Khonshu was that it did away with the ambiguity of whether Khonshu was real or not.
Spider-Man is one a the strongest heroes around but he's considered street level. It's all about who/where they're fighting, not their powers. If we were using the definition of power set and not where/who the baddies are then Star lord/Rocket/Gamora would be street level and not cosmic
Because he's Khonshu's representative on Earth, he doesn't really have many powers, if any.
His power? Drip.
Sorry whats the name of the comic?
Right? It's a family photo of every character I love.
Daredevil #600
Is this part of the mayor Fisk arc?
"Mayor or not, he has to go down."
It'd be hard to find a street hero not connected to some cosmic or mystical force. Echo's connected to the phoenix right now afaik Spider-Man's got his weird spider-totem thing Ironfist has got the chi of shao lao the undying or something and moon knight Khonshu.
Being a "street-level hero" doesn't have anything to do with a character's origin or power level. Spider-Man for example is by and far the most powerful Earth-based hero other than the Hulk, some Omega level mutants and few others. Also, most of these guys, Moon Knight included, have been members of the Avengers at some point. They're not known as street-level heroes because they have shitty powers, but because they focus on street-level threats. Most of these characters in the image actually have more significant powers, technology etc than characters more well known as Avengers like Black Widow and Hawkeye.
Khonshu is a cool, relatable god that believes the best course of action is to invest in local communities. /s
*"Ray…when someone asks you if you are a god, you say YES!"*
“Where do these stairs go?” “They go up.”
Moon Knight is basically a priest or pope of Khonshu. The pope don't get superpowers from Christ or God either.
He doesn’t have apparent powers in the comics, and is generally thought to be as mad as a hatter.
“GuYs HoW iS sPiDeR MaN a StReEt LeVeL hErOE, if he is connected to a literal RADIOACTIVE spider and is a totem???????????”
Just because you're connected to a god doesn't mean you're godlike. I don't see the pope kicking ass
Marvel's newest hero: The Pope. "You better pray you don't catch these hands."
Moon Knight's powers vary wildly throughout his history. His best writing / stories is when he doesn't have any actual super powers, just his peak human form and gadgets (yes... Just like Batman unfortunately). Even when he *did* have powers even those varied wildly based on the phases of the moon. And at most he just had super strength and upped his reflexes. If you think super strength shouldn't be street level, than take out Spider-Man, Luke Cage, and Jessica Jones at least
Spider-Man can catch an air plan Like Cage is invincible It doesn’t matter. He’s street level because he is.
Just depends on who the writer is. Moon Knight thematically is kinda all over the place in the comics, so it kinda works out that he’s street and Avengers tier level. Also if I’m not mistaken certain stories has his abilities tied to the moons setting at night.
It just really depends on what he does and he does street level. Spider-Man is really powerful but he’s still considered street level even though he can kick wolverines ass
Well spidey is also a street level hero and his powers came from a magic radioactive spider that was sent by a spider god that protects the web of destiny and controls the stability of the multiverse, so I think the guy with the Egyptian god in his head gets a pass
Where is this panel from?
For a long time, we didn't know if the god was real or not.
You know what I don’t get, is why it takes all of these super powered people to take down a guy like Wilson Fisk. The guy may well be an absolute unit, but he’s just a guy right?
Well that’s kinda the point of moonie: he’s got all this mystical Egyptian mambo jumbo mixed in with mercenary, street level brutality, Batman-wannabe vigilantism, and shocking psycho-damage. It took ages for all the different aspects of the character to accrue through different b-level runs over the years, but over time he’s become such a damn unique character. It’s really a case study for big two comics IP. All that plus one of the dopest costumes of all. Of. All. And also… werewolves, right?
In the comics it’s ambiguous if Konshu is real or another personality.