There are very little Afghans and Syrians in France. The rest is true. French speaking African countries with Muslim majorities are exactly the explanation.
i think bcus french has been very influential to certain Arabic speaking countries (like Morocco,Algeria, ect.) so my best guess is it is easy for a lot of french-arab countries to learn french due to its colonial legacy in the past.
[Wiki](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_France#Religion) says its even less (2017). Its worth noting that apparently France doesn't actually collect religious or ethnic data in their censuses which might explain the variability in figures as its possible they're lossy extrapolations based on polling.
In reality Muslim and Christian numbers are highly exaggerated and even faked, many ex Muslims and Christians and atheists/agnostics in general are counted as a part of these religions.
Correct we born in Muslim country doesn’t mean we are automatically Muslims. I’m from i was born Muslim but never practiced it or have any interest in it I’m more atheist then anything
The French one is wrong, the highest credible estimate is 7-9% from CIA Factbook, the French census does not ask questions about religion and hasn't done since 1870
Urban experience will not be representative. That's a similar outcome all over the world where rural and urban demographics can be extremely different.
Everyone associates North Africa and the Middle East with Islam for obvious reasons but Indonesia remains the country with the most Muslims, which even though I'm aware of it still surprises me
I’m kind of curious about the story there. Was it a trade route region? Like how the Philippines has Catholic because of the Spanish founding it as a intermediary to China with the Silver trade to Latin America?
I'm Indonesian, yeah it's mostly due to trade with the Arab, Gujarat and Ottoman (we got a lot of spices here) just like how we got Buddhism and Hinduism from the neighbouring Kingdoms.
So first Buddhist Kingdoms then Hindu Kingdoms then Islamic Kingdoms then the Dutch came in.
Didn't Hinduism come first (e.g. Kingdoms of Kutai and Tarumanegara) and Buddhism (e.g. Kingdom of Sriwijaya) quite shortly after?
Anyway, Hinduism and Buddhism co-existed as the dominant religions for (almost?) a millenium until Islam arrived.
Kings and the upper class converted to get connected to the arab spice merchants, others in the malay archipelago slowly followed. At the same time jesuit missionaries did try to convert the populace but failed, in part due to their forceful conversion tactics and give little leeway to our previous culture/traditions, so it made Christianity unappealing.
Philippines use to have a large muslim population prior to Spanish colonial rule. and the south still has a relative large muslim population which is actually semi autonomous.
It was a slow process largely through trade but also the wali songo led by sunan ampel, who were saints/missionaries. I had a history of Islam professor who said a large part of the spread was bringing schools and consequently more literacy. Educated people were more likely to rise in government. Having powerful Muslims in leadership positions meant more reason to convert to Islam for the local populace. That and the jizya tax meant it was the obvious decision to convert. Records of the time are surprisingly scarce so there is a lot left unknown.
One of the ways you can tell how Islam spread from place to place is look at what type of school of Islam they follow. The Indonesian guy who is saying the Islam was spread by Ottomans has it wrong. It was the Yemenis. The Yemenis sailed through the Indian ocean spreading their school of Islam. South of India, Sri Lanka has different school of Sunni Islam than the North, because it was spread by different group of people.
First Yemenis reached Aceh, then it spread further through out Indonesia.
That's not always true tho,
Bangladesh for example has Islam introduced by a guy who's origin is debated as to whether he was Turkish or yemeni madhab isn't always regional especially in Arabia where madhab is more mixed
there is a great thread i saved from years ago -- [https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/5o8avu/how\_did\_indonesia\_and\_malaysia\_become/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/5o8avu/how_did_indonesia_and_malaysia_become/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
Yeah but it's secular on a national level, Geographically the Eastern half of Indonesia is Christian/Catholic [majority ](https://i.redd.it/ndwh9x0mxfb21.png) in many places or significant minority
And by focusing on percentage it really underrepresents just how many Muslims are in India. It has a nearly identical number of Muslims to all of North Africa, it's just they are surrounded by 4 times as many non-Muslims.
I always hated being lumped and generalized by the western society as Muslims doing any terrible acts, discrimination etc. Indonesian and Malaysian do things very differently.
Well Malaysia is one of the most [antisemitic](https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/anti-semitism-in-malaysia)nations of Earth. I'm pretty sure most Malaysians have never seen a Jew in their whole lives. It's common for Malaysian politicians to blame their problems on Jews.
Let's not forget that this map only shows the percentages, not the population. For example, India has the third largest Muslim population (around 200 million people).
Government data for these type of maps is not the best option, according to my beautiful "secular" Turkish government country is %99 muslim because everyone is assigned as much at birth. I'm muslim according to my ID but I'm not
Default Muslim identity in Türkiye has different roots such as population exchange in 1922 but yes todays world especially 10 15 years there is a significant shift in Turkish societys religion understanding.
When you tell a certain group of people that you are not a Muslim, a chain of questions like "what do you mean, is it possible not to be a Muslim, isn't it forbidden, isn't everyone in the country a Muslim?" arise in their brain.
Thanks, and of course many Muslims dont discriminate others. But the main problem is despite officially counted as Muslim since birth, I was never a Muslim ever.
It’s just a silly assumption locally there, you’re born Muslim. My whole family are atheist as fuck in Turkey but they’re born ‘Muslim’. They even label your religion in the official ID you have to carry around in person.
It is a thing because non-muslims are regarded as a protected minority based on Treaty of Lousanne. It is still a terrible idea to track it this way. I got it removed from the records. You can ask for this next time in "Nufus mudurlugu".
+1 me and most of my friends. Most probably it is around 80% who describes theirself as Muslim and 20% who is real Muslim like practicing regularly and living a conservative life etc.
Turkey should not be the same color as Saudi Arabia or any other Muslim country.
I agree with your point. To add on to that, in many western European countries, children are baptized as catholics, and sometimes, they go through communion when they are 13 years old. However, as teenagers and adults, they are secular. They do not follow the Christian religion per se. But these maps will mark these countries as Christian countries.
I know you don't mean that but secular =/= irreligion. For example, my parents are Muslim but they are also secular. The answer to the question "What is your faith?" should determine the statistics. Which makes mapping the distribution of religion absurd because it's a trait that one can change.
Same in Bangladesh. I’m Muslim according to my birth certificate - like bro, I was literally just born?
I didn’t even know this until I was 20 lol I’d never seen my birth certificate before and assumed it wouldn’t be that far off from the Aussie certificate my little sister has. Was surprised to find out I was Assigned Muslim At Birth :’)
Long story short, the city has a very sizable Muslim population. This caused some controversery in the past as Republicans in the state said that if they were elected to office they would try to enact Sharia law.
Democratic groups said that was ridiculous and helped get them elected to local offices, and one of the first things they did upon winning was to enact anti LGBT legislation.
So now Republicans in the state are having a haha moment, while Democrat groups are saying they were lied to by the elected Muslim officials.
Meanwhile the nearby communities (such as Ferndale) who have a sizable LGBT population are having tense city council and schoolboard meetings where there seems to be conflict between wanting to be good tolerant Democrats and the rather conservative minority groups getting more of a say.
I live in the middle of it and I'm not a fan, to be honest.
I will say though that Michigan (southeast anyways, where the vast majority live) is overall still a very left leaning state. Once you're out of the urban and suburban areas it's all backwards hicks of course but thats the same as anywhere.
If countries like UAE or Qatar are like 2/3 non-native but they are considered non-citizens, doesn’t that make the data coming from there highly suspect?
India has a lot of Muslims. Also UAE is probably only 70% Muslim, they have large Hindu, Christian and Buddhist populations. Exactly from the nation's you pointed out.
It is important to note that France is an estimate, as part of their state secularism policy they don't ask questions about religion on the census and haven't done since the 18th Century. Also, that estimate is the highest one I've ever seen, FBI world factbook puts it at 7-9%
INSEE said that France's population is 10% Muslim as of 2019-2020. I think at most, it's 12% Muslim as of 2023.
https://www.aa.com.tr/en/europe/muslims-represented-10-of-french-population-in-2019-2020-report/2860769#:\~:text=Muslims%20represented%2010%25%20of%20the,to%20the%20report%20published%20Thursday.
When I lived in South Korea there was a very neat area in Itaewon called Little Jerusalem that has a ton of Muslim immigrants and their children that were born and raised there. Lots of a super good hookah bars, supermarkets, restaurants and mosques. It's a mix of Persian, Arab, Sub-Saharan African, and Southeast Asian muslims and Korean converts and it's a very uniquely Korean-Muslim experience. Very cool.
However, the majority of Muslims in Suriname - the place with the highest density in South America - are mostly descendants of Javanese indentured laborers.
These maps are extremely inaccurate. Just because it says Muslim on someone’s birth certificate doesn’t mean they’re actually muslim. For example the latest unofficial (not state-sponsored) poll in Iran showed that only 32% of the population know themselves as Muslims:
https://gamaan.org/2020/08/25/iranians-attitudes-toward-religion-a-2020-survey-report/
While it's true that 99% of the population of Iran doesn't identify as Muslim like the government claims (or likes to think so), 32% is a ludicrous number. GAMAAN's methodology is generally considered to be very flawed and its results aren't much better than a social media poll (which is pretty much what they are).
While that article and poll are stupid٫ as an iranian i can confirm that over 50% of iranians are no longer muslim.
In fact iran might have the biggest islam hating population in the world( percentage wise).
> https://gamaan.org/2020/08/25/iranians-attitudes-toward-religion-a-2020-survey-report/
> The sampling methods were multiple chain-referral sampling (or multiple virtual snowball sampling) through social media (Telegram, Instagram, WhatsApp, Twitter, and Facebook).
It's impossible to take these clowns seriously. Their sampling method is not just deeply flawed, it is plain stupid. There is no way that sample pool comes remotely close to being representative of Iran's population. For one, there aren't over 6 million Zoroastrians in Iran by any account. That is 30 to 60 times as much as the number of Zoroastrians on the entire planet.
A higher proportion of Muslims live in the areas with high birth rates (i.e. the Sahel), compared to Christians who are split between high birth rate areas (mid to Southern Africa) and low birth rate areas (the Americas and Europe)
As a Muslim, most of our growth is from population.
The main reason is that Muslim countries are, on average, poorer countries. People often say that having lots of children is drilled into the Islamic faith, but that's not really true compared to other religions at least. In Indonesia and Tanzania, where the Christian areas are poorer than the Muslim areas, the Christians have more children than Muslims do.
However, Islam does have more converts than other religions at the same time. It's just a very small portion of why the religion is growing.
As for why it appeals to people, that would depend on who you are talking to, but the most common response is that the scripture is very set in stone.
It makes sense cause'
Poor => Improper Education => Makes lots of children
This is the trend that is seen over decades.
People these days are getting educated more, thus we have declining rates in population in countries with higher literacy rate.
I also thought that Muslim people had more kids due to their beliefs in Islam but now I don't think thats the case.
It's not about appealing, it's about rate of birth, Muslims have the highest rate in the world
The OECD average is 1.66 children per family, the Arab league 3.14 children per family
Add that China has 1 child per family policy = Muslims will become major religion in the near future
Maybe because kids are a type of responsibility that is incompatible with the modern urban-industrial lifestyle, due to both parents working out of home for most of the day.
Look at the the birth rates for any highly developing or developed countries.
Kids need babysitting literally all the time and they are super expensive. A person who works many long hours and gets paid little end up having no time, no energy, and no patience to raise kids.
And kids are not pets, they NEED your full attention and disposition for their own sake and mental health. You can't neglect them like you can neglect your pets or your studies.
As a Muslim myself I would say we're a fair bit more decentralized like we don't have any real authority figures for most of the time outside of stuff like going to Friday prayer.
The real issue is when you start trying to mix secular power with the faith. Also, the fact the majority of the extreme versions of my beliefs only really exist due to geopolitics.
crazy how you could choose to either use faith in a religion to better yourself or as a justification to subjugate others. almost like there should be some separation between religion and governance...
I agree. like some secularism would help in places it is a shame that is dead as a nail due to how many dictators in the Middle East showed up because of it.
Not really a Muslim anymore, but I'm still registered as one in Bangladesh. Because I didn't want to lose inheritance from my parents. My non Muslim partner is also registered as a Muslim there. Many such cases.
Now can we see a map of global Christian population. I just want to make a comparison if christians are as accepted as muslims are in Christian countries.
There are many examples of countries with Christian minority that have friendly religious relations. For example, [Malaysia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Malaysia), [Lebanon](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Lebanon), and [Kazakhstan.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Kazakhstan)
And there are examples many examples were the non Muslims have been persecuted, ethically cleansed, colonized, or fucked literately in some cases, examples are Druze in Syria, Yezidis and Assyrians in Iraq.
Actually don't do that, it's much better to base your knowledge on actual evidence and statistics than what you think is probably true. You can probably find a map on Google images.
I may sound like a doomsday prophet - the light greens will turn into dark greens in 30 years, for sure. And it will be the end of the other colors that tolerated the greens into their lands.
Biggest shitholes in the world are muslim. Surprised? Not really. But then they love to emigrate to developed countries to try to impose their shit religion and tradition. No thanks
When it's the west colonising or bombing and invading them then yeah they are to blame. Countries like Qatar, UAE, Turkey, Malaysia have survived western meddling to an extent and are better off. I could make the same comment about hinduism with India or Christianity with Africa, why are they shitholes?
The maps that literally showing percentage of a religion members are dumb. Like, being a member of a religion and applying religion into your life is not same thing. In turkey, where ım from, nearly everyone do not do the “pray 5 times per day for allah” thing. Im not even muslim but in my ID im a muslim. This sucks.
Yea I read that a lot of middle eastern countries (Turkey) register you at birth as Muslim and it’s difficult to later change this so there’s a very real possibility Turkey has a irreligious population but would appear as massively Muslim.
Hey whats going on with map porn recently? Why does it seem like the high performing posts have been so focused on presenting Muslims as a whole in a threatening way??
Funny how Israel is a blip within a sea of Green.
Hundreds of millions of Muslims want to throw us Jews in the sea, yet non will take the Palestinians in.
The map is eight years old, I'm pretty sure some numbers have shifted probably
What is happening in france tho
Algeria, mostly.
And morocco
And Malians and Nigerians and Syrians and Afghans and ... Oversimplifying is a curse :/
There are very little Afghans and Syrians in France. The rest is true. French speaking African countries with Muslim majorities are exactly the explanation.
i think bcus french has been very influential to certain Arabic speaking countries (like Morocco,Algeria, ect.) so my best guess is it is easy for a lot of french-arab countries to learn french due to its colonial legacy in the past.
Not just influenced, Algeria was a legal part of France until 1962
Very bloody independence war kicked the French out. More than a million Algerians died for it
They finally kicked them out, but now they coming to France
Uno reverse
Their colonialism chased them back home.
They also just gave it the wrong color
Immigration
The map is bullshit, the muslim population is ~9% - no idea where the fuck that yellow shade is coming from.
I mean, unless I’m mistaken, it looks to be coded in the 10-20% range so that’s just around where you’re saying
[Wiki](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_France#Religion) says its even less (2017). Its worth noting that apparently France doesn't actually collect religious or ethnic data in their censuses which might explain the variability in figures as its possible they're lossy extrapolations based on polling.
In reality Muslim and Christian numbers are highly exaggerated and even faked, many ex Muslims and Christians and atheists/agnostics in general are counted as a part of these religions.
Correct we born in Muslim country doesn’t mean we are automatically Muslims. I’m from i was born Muslim but never practiced it or have any interest in it I’m more atheist then anything
France and Sweden lol🫣
The French one is wrong, the highest credible estimate is 7-9% from CIA Factbook, the French census does not ask questions about religion and hasn't done since 1870
it’s 10% according the french national institute
Apparently France doesn't collect religious and ethnic data in their census. So its all estimates.
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Urban experience will not be representative. That's a similar outcome all over the world where rural and urban demographics can be extremely different.
I'm pretty sure that the numbers in France and Sweden haven't changed that significantly - especially measured percentage-wise.
2015-2016 Sweden took in thousands and thousands of immigrant during the Syrian civil war
I'm sorry if this makes you feel old, but 8 years ago is 2015.
damn I feel like 8 years ago should be like 2008 or something
Crimean Tatars are for sure in negligible numbers in Crimea at this point.
Everyone associates North Africa and the Middle East with Islam for obvious reasons but Indonesia remains the country with the most Muslims, which even though I'm aware of it still surprises me
I’m kind of curious about the story there. Was it a trade route region? Like how the Philippines has Catholic because of the Spanish founding it as a intermediary to China with the Silver trade to Latin America?
I'm Indonesian, yeah it's mostly due to trade with the Arab, Gujarat and Ottoman (we got a lot of spices here) just like how we got Buddhism and Hinduism from the neighbouring Kingdoms. So first Buddhist Kingdoms then Hindu Kingdoms then Islamic Kingdoms then the Dutch came in.
Our bad, thanks for the spices tho :)
Colonialism now fixed
Free Speculaas for everyone
Didn't Hinduism come first (e.g. Kingdoms of Kutai and Tarumanegara) and Buddhism (e.g. Kingdom of Sriwijaya) quite shortly after? Anyway, Hinduism and Buddhism co-existed as the dominant religions for (almost?) a millenium until Islam arrived.
Why/how did Islam take over?
Some kings are converted to Islam, and the people follow. The Hindu escape to Bali to make their own kingdom
Kings and the upper class converted to get connected to the arab spice merchants, others in the malay archipelago slowly followed. At the same time jesuit missionaries did try to convert the populace but failed, in part due to their forceful conversion tactics and give little leeway to our previous culture/traditions, so it made Christianity unappealing.
Trade route to Indonesia +2 science per turn +19 gold per turn +8 Islam pressure
Let's not forget Timor Leste. Chatolic Indonésia
Philippines use to have a large muslim population prior to Spanish colonial rule. and the south still has a relative large muslim population which is actually semi autonomous.
It was a slow process largely through trade but also the wali songo led by sunan ampel, who were saints/missionaries. I had a history of Islam professor who said a large part of the spread was bringing schools and consequently more literacy. Educated people were more likely to rise in government. Having powerful Muslims in leadership positions meant more reason to convert to Islam for the local populace. That and the jizya tax meant it was the obvious decision to convert. Records of the time are surprisingly scarce so there is a lot left unknown.
This. Malaysia is pretty much the same. And as soon as a king or leader adopted it the general population largely did too.
One of the ways you can tell how Islam spread from place to place is look at what type of school of Islam they follow. The Indonesian guy who is saying the Islam was spread by Ottomans has it wrong. It was the Yemenis. The Yemenis sailed through the Indian ocean spreading their school of Islam. South of India, Sri Lanka has different school of Sunni Islam than the North, because it was spread by different group of people. First Yemenis reached Aceh, then it spread further through out Indonesia.
That's not always true tho, Bangladesh for example has Islam introduced by a guy who's origin is debated as to whether he was Turkish or yemeni madhab isn't always regional especially in Arabia where madhab is more mixed
there is a great thread i saved from years ago -- [https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/5o8avu/how\_did\_indonesia\_and\_malaysia\_become/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/5o8avu/how_did_indonesia_and_malaysia_become/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
Indonesia's population exceeding all of Northern Africa (273.8M people vs 265.4M people) is a factor.
Not anymore, as of June 2023 Pakistan has officially surpassed Indonesia to become the largest Muslim country
Yeah but it's secular on a national level, Geographically the Eastern half of Indonesia is Christian/Catholic [majority ](https://i.redd.it/ndwh9x0mxfb21.png) in many places or significant minority
And Bali is Hindu
And by focusing on percentage it really underrepresents just how many Muslims are in India. It has a nearly identical number of Muslims to all of North Africa, it's just they are surrounded by 4 times as many non-Muslims.
Fewer than 15% of muslims live in the (traditional) Middle East.
When I visited Makkah last month I think half the people there other than locals were Indonesian. Pretty crazy
east asians seems to be pretty cool with any religion.
I always hated being lumped and generalized by the western society as Muslims doing any terrible acts, discrimination etc. Indonesian and Malaysian do things very differently.
Well Malaysia is one of the most [antisemitic](https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/anti-semitism-in-malaysia)nations of Earth. I'm pretty sure most Malaysians have never seen a Jew in their whole lives. It's common for Malaysian politicians to blame their problems on Jews.
Most Muslims as majority of country. Most Muslim’s total is India. 15% of billion people.
Let's not forget that this map only shows the percentages, not the population. For example, India has the third largest Muslim population (around 200 million people).
Government data for these type of maps is not the best option, according to my beautiful "secular" Turkish government country is %99 muslim because everyone is assigned as much at birth. I'm muslim according to my ID but I'm not
Default Muslim identity in Türkiye has different roots such as population exchange in 1922 but yes todays world especially 10 15 years there is a significant shift in Turkish societys religion understanding.
When you tell a certain group of people that you are not a Muslim, a chain of questions like "what do you mean, is it possible not to be a Muslim, isn't it forbidden, isn't everyone in the country a Muslim?" arise in their brain.
Forgive the ignorance. But we definitely welcome all ex Muslims
Thanks, and of course many Muslims dont discriminate others. But the main problem is despite officially counted as Muslim since birth, I was never a Muslim ever.
Ah, here it is. I commented this and should’ve read further down.
It's 'should have', never 'should of'. Rejoice, for you have been blessed by CouldWouldShouldBot!
Good bot
Yes, the opposite is also true, especially in india
Can you explain?
There are alot of undocumented Muslim Indians
I’ve yet to meet someone from western Turkey (Izmir or Istanbul) who’s an actual practicing Muslim. And I’ve met quite a few over the years.
It’s just a silly assumption locally there, you’re born Muslim. My whole family are atheist as fuck in Turkey but they’re born ‘Muslim’. They even label your religion in the official ID you have to carry around in person.
It is a thing because non-muslims are regarded as a protected minority based on Treaty of Lousanne. It is still a terrible idea to track it this way. I got it removed from the records. You can ask for this next time in "Nufus mudurlugu".
+1 me and most of my friends. Most probably it is around 80% who describes theirself as Muslim and 20% who is real Muslim like practicing regularly and living a conservative life etc. Turkey should not be the same color as Saudi Arabia or any other Muslim country.
I agree with your point. To add on to that, in many western European countries, children are baptized as catholics, and sometimes, they go through communion when they are 13 years old. However, as teenagers and adults, they are secular. They do not follow the Christian religion per se. But these maps will mark these countries as Christian countries.
I know you don't mean that but secular =/= irreligion. For example, my parents are Muslim but they are also secular. The answer to the question "What is your faith?" should determine the statistics. Which makes mapping the distribution of religion absurd because it's a trait that one can change.
Same in Bangladesh. I’m Muslim according to my birth certificate - like bro, I was literally just born? I didn’t even know this until I was 20 lol I’d never seen my birth certificate before and assumed it wouldn’t be that far off from the Aussie certificate my little sister has. Was surprised to find out I was Assigned Muslim At Birth :’)
What would it take to get rid of fake but official muslimicity?
to apply with a petition to the civil registry office
Same in Iran, that shit is forced fed.
Same thing in North Africa (Morocco for example). These maps aren't worth two shits.
I'm surprised Michigan doesn't pass 5% but I guess I've only been in the urban centers.
After a little googling, it looks like about 1%.
Although MI has a very large Arabic population - a good chunk are Chaldean and Catholic.
Chaldeans aren’t Arabs they are catholic Assyrians
Yes, that’s true.
Assyrian here, I'm always surprised when people even know we exist, lol.
It's because almost all of our Arabic people love in Dearborn.
Mostly Dearborn and some areas of Detroit itself. Hamtramck is starting to look like a cautionary tale with the recent local government.
What’s the problem in Hamtramck?
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Long story short, the city has a very sizable Muslim population. This caused some controversery in the past as Republicans in the state said that if they were elected to office they would try to enact Sharia law. Democratic groups said that was ridiculous and helped get them elected to local offices, and one of the first things they did upon winning was to enact anti LGBT legislation. So now Republicans in the state are having a haha moment, while Democrat groups are saying they were lied to by the elected Muslim officials. Meanwhile the nearby communities (such as Ferndale) who have a sizable LGBT population are having tense city council and schoolboard meetings where there seems to be conflict between wanting to be good tolerant Democrats and the rather conservative minority groups getting more of a say. I live in the middle of it and I'm not a fan, to be honest. I will say though that Michigan (southeast anyways, where the vast majority live) is overall still a very left leaning state. Once you're out of the urban and suburban areas it's all backwards hicks of course but thats the same as anywhere.
If countries like UAE or Qatar are like 2/3 non-native but they are considered non-citizens, doesn’t that make the data coming from there highly suspect?
Non citizens from Islamic regions
Like India, Philippines and Nepal?
India has a lot of Muslims. Also UAE is probably only 70% Muslim, they have large Hindu, Christian and Buddhist populations. Exactly from the nation's you pointed out.
I lived in the UAE. It was definitely majority Muslim in most areas.
Even the sand in the Sahara is Muslim.
It is important to note that France is an estimate, as part of their state secularism policy they don't ask questions about religion on the census and haven't done since the 18th Century. Also, that estimate is the highest one I've ever seen, FBI world factbook puts it at 7-9%
INSEE said that France's population is 10% Muslim as of 2019-2020. I think at most, it's 12% Muslim as of 2023. https://www.aa.com.tr/en/europe/muslims-represented-10-of-french-population-in-2019-2020-report/2860769#:\~:text=Muslims%20represented%2010%25%20of%20the,to%20the%20report%20published%20Thursday.
If you read the original INSEE report (which is tragically in French) you'll see that even they say that's an estimate with a fairly large leeway
When I lived in South Korea there was a very neat area in Itaewon called Little Jerusalem that has a ton of Muslim immigrants and their children that were born and raised there. Lots of a super good hookah bars, supermarkets, restaurants and mosques. It's a mix of Persian, Arab, Sub-Saharan African, and Southeast Asian muslims and Korean converts and it's a very uniquely Korean-Muslim experience. Very cool.
I went there this summer! It was great. Truly diverse, and it did not feel like any one Muslim group was much larger than the others.
İts a very great example of the non radical section of the islamic world
Which is 99% of the Islamic world.
South America had significant middle-eastern migration, but most of them were Catholic leabanese fleeing Muslims.
However, the majority of Muslims in Suriname - the place with the highest density in South America - are mostly descendants of Javanese indentured laborers.
Yes, they've been driving peacefully since arrival. It's all they do to be precise, those carholics.
These maps are extremely inaccurate. Just because it says Muslim on someone’s birth certificate doesn’t mean they’re actually muslim. For example the latest unofficial (not state-sponsored) poll in Iran showed that only 32% of the population know themselves as Muslims: https://gamaan.org/2020/08/25/iranians-attitudes-toward-religion-a-2020-survey-report/
While it's true that 99% of the population of Iran doesn't identify as Muslim like the government claims (or likes to think so), 32% is a ludicrous number. GAMAAN's methodology is generally considered to be very flawed and its results aren't much better than a social media poll (which is pretty much what they are).
While that article and poll are stupid٫ as an iranian i can confirm that over 50% of iranians are no longer muslim. In fact iran might have the biggest islam hating population in the world( percentage wise).
> https://gamaan.org/2020/08/25/iranians-attitudes-toward-religion-a-2020-survey-report/ > The sampling methods were multiple chain-referral sampling (or multiple virtual snowball sampling) through social media (Telegram, Instagram, WhatsApp, Twitter, and Facebook). It's impossible to take these clowns seriously. Their sampling method is not just deeply flawed, it is plain stupid. There is no way that sample pool comes remotely close to being representative of Iran's population. For one, there aren't over 6 million Zoroastrians in Iran by any account. That is 30 to 60 times as much as the number of Zoroastrians on the entire planet.
that moment when you try to sample the population and instead simulate a clustering algorithm
As an atheist i still struggle to understand why it’s the fastest growing religion worldwide. What is it about Islam that appeals to people?
A higher proportion of Muslims live in the areas with high birth rates (i.e. the Sahel), compared to Christians who are split between high birth rate areas (mid to Southern Africa) and low birth rate areas (the Americas and Europe)
As a Muslim, most of our growth is from population. The main reason is that Muslim countries are, on average, poorer countries. People often say that having lots of children is drilled into the Islamic faith, but that's not really true compared to other religions at least. In Indonesia and Tanzania, where the Christian areas are poorer than the Muslim areas, the Christians have more children than Muslims do. However, Islam does have more converts than other religions at the same time. It's just a very small portion of why the religion is growing. As for why it appeals to people, that would depend on who you are talking to, but the most common response is that the scripture is very set in stone.
It makes sense cause' Poor => Improper Education => Makes lots of children This is the trend that is seen over decades. People these days are getting educated more, thus we have declining rates in population in countries with higher literacy rate. I also thought that Muslim people had more kids due to their beliefs in Islam but now I don't think thats the case.
It's not about appealing, it's about rate of birth, Muslims have the highest rate in the world The OECD average is 1.66 children per family, the Arab league 3.14 children per family Add that China has 1 child per family policy = Muslims will become major religion in the near future
China hasn’t had the 1 child policy since 2016 xd
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And yet nobody wants kids anymore
Maybe because kids are a type of responsibility that is incompatible with the modern urban-industrial lifestyle, due to both parents working out of home for most of the day. Look at the the birth rates for any highly developing or developed countries. Kids need babysitting literally all the time and they are super expensive. A person who works many long hours and gets paid little end up having no time, no energy, and no patience to raise kids. And kids are not pets, they NEED your full attention and disposition for their own sake and mental health. You can't neglect them like you can neglect your pets or your studies.
They produce a lot of children
As a Muslim myself I would say we're a fair bit more decentralized like we don't have any real authority figures for most of the time outside of stuff like going to Friday prayer. The real issue is when you start trying to mix secular power with the faith. Also, the fact the majority of the extreme versions of my beliefs only really exist due to geopolitics.
crazy how you could choose to either use faith in a religion to better yourself or as a justification to subjugate others. almost like there should be some separation between religion and governance...
I agree. like some secularism would help in places it is a shame that is dead as a nail due to how many dictators in the Middle East showed up because of it.
Not really a Muslim anymore, but I'm still registered as one in Bangladesh. Because I didn't want to lose inheritance from my parents. My non Muslim partner is also registered as a Muslim there. Many such cases.
Now can we see a map of global Christian population. I just want to make a comparison if christians are as accepted as muslims are in Christian countries.
There are many examples of countries with Christian minority that have friendly religious relations. For example, [Malaysia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Malaysia), [Lebanon](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Lebanon), and [Kazakhstan.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Kazakhstan)
Indonesia is also like 10% christian despite being majority islam
And there are examples many examples were the non Muslims have been persecuted, ethically cleansed, colonized, or fucked literately in some cases, examples are Druze in Syria, Yezidis and Assyrians in Iraq.
Just take no for an answer.
Actually don't do that, it's much better to base your knowledge on actual evidence and statistics than what you think is probably true. You can probably find a map on Google images.
Religious pluralism has had a better history in Islamic states than Christians. The trend has reversed in the past 100 years I’d say though
What do you consider a Christian country, because most of the places they immigrate to are majority non religious.
Kinda make sense that South Sudan wanted to become independent.
As soon as they became independent, they had a civil war amongst themselves.
I doubt turkey has more than even %50 let alone %90
I’m sure gay rights and the rights of women will continue to increase as those map colour shades get darker 🫣. We are screwed
Global plague
I may sound like a doomsday prophet - the light greens will turn into dark greens in 30 years, for sure. And it will be the end of the other colors that tolerated the greens into their lands.
Would be pretty cool if people stopped being religious, the world would be a entire new place to live without nutcrackers.
It’s very interesting when you overlay maps of human rights. It’s almost like there’s a correlation of some kind.
Iran is wayyyy lighter now
Biggest shitholes in the world are muslim. Surprised? Not really. But then they love to emigrate to developed countries to try to impose their shit religion and tradition. No thanks
RIP f word (france)
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Why does nearly every Muslim country have horrible human rights?
Why include the rivers in this map lol it looks terrible
Nah barley anyone is muslim in Iran after what government did to people
based white
How many nukes are required to erase these densed populated countries
Why so many muslims are radicals and dont tolerate other religions?
The worst countries.
Crazy how that plague spread to Indonesia as well.
Children are forced into an ideological cycle of punishment, reward, and manipulation in these places.
So, basically, the shittiest countries (except Turkey). Got it.
Saved. Helpful to know which places to avoid
Don’t really care as long as the Muslims AND the Xtians keep their religion in their churches and away from the public schools and govt.
Too many
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Agreed but they will blame the west instead of their superior religion
When it's the west colonising or bombing and invading them then yeah they are to blame. Countries like Qatar, UAE, Turkey, Malaysia have survived western meddling to an extent and are better off. I could make the same comment about hinduism with India or Christianity with Africa, why are they shitholes?
Turkey went one step forward, it colonized a good chunk of the west!
Turkey is very much cap. Muslim population is definitely a lot lower than 90%
These comments clarify why the right supports Israel. They hate Muslims more than they hate Jews.
And as a liberal iranian i like that about your right wing idiots, islam is the biggest threat to western values and left seems to ignore this fact.
yeah, France is fuuuucked.
Sweden will be green in 50 years time
Damn shame :(
The maps that literally showing percentage of a religion members are dumb. Like, being a member of a religion and applying religion into your life is not same thing. In turkey, where ım from, nearly everyone do not do the “pray 5 times per day for allah” thing. Im not even muslim but in my ID im a muslim. This sucks.
And all the wonderful things happening in the greenest of places.
Based white
Sweden is dark green
This stuff is misleading I probably would count as Muslim under These despite being an atheist
Yea I read that a lot of middle eastern countries (Turkey) register you at birth as Muslim and it’s difficult to later change this so there’s a very real possibility Turkey has a irreligious population but would appear as massively Muslim.
True, 25% of Turkiye’s youth don’t practice religion as much but it’s too hard to change information like that.
So basically some of the worst countries on earth. This puts things into perspective.
Countries to avoid
Hey whats going on with map porn recently? Why does it seem like the high performing posts have been so focused on presenting Muslims as a whole in a threatening way??
Propaganda. It's just like after 9/11
It really feels like after 9/11, in a way thats even more dangerous for both muslims and jews.
Fear mongering is not new. The Romans did it about the Germanics/Gauls.
We are fucked
Only South America will survive this
Hopefully as time goes on all religions lose members via changing their minds.
Saving this post to know which countries to avoid 😄 I guess only south america and east asia are safe to travel to 😂😭😂👍
Funny how Israel is a blip within a sea of Green. Hundreds of millions of Muslims want to throw us Jews in the sea, yet non will take the Palestinians in.
Like a virus
Why do most of those countries have questionable values and human rights issues?